wolvernova: Avatar is just awesome. Where are those people that said it would bomb?

It, uh, has bombed. I hope they made hundreds of millions selling the worldwide distribution rights because the domestic take ain't doing it.

Also, the movie is shallow and forgettable. It's pretty. The end.

Great film. Well deserved acclaim. Most amazing experience I've had in a theater in years.

IAmNotRickMoranis: It's just like any other geek property: the side that likes it feels the need to be overly defensive about it, while the side that doesn't feels the need to mercilessly attack it. It's just a movie, for God's sakes, but who ever said the internet was made for calm and reasonable discussion? Cameron's probably sitting in a billion-dollar chair made of diamonds and gold bars reading all the message board whining and laughing his ass off.

Not laughing their asses off:

Since when is $212 million in slightly more than a week considered a failure?

Link (to reality)

bingethinker: Since when is $212 million in slightly more than a week considered a failure?

Link (to reality)

Which is close to recouping half of their investment. It's not like the same profit margin as a film made for $50,000 and seeing a $4M opening, but then again, for Cameron, this is also a big huge billboard for the techniques that this film brought to fruition, that WILL be sold and profited from as well.

You line up the merch profits along with everything else, it's doing pretty well. It will recoup its costs in foreign ticket sales, and I suspect pull ahead in profits with merch and DVD sales. And certainly with the profits that Cameron will make on the technology that he built for this film.

hubiestubert: bingethinker: Since when is $212 million in slightly more than a week considered a failure?

Link (to reality)

Which is close to recouping half of their investment. It's not like the same profit margin as a film made for $50,000 and seeing a $4M opening, but then again, for Cameron, this is also a big huge billboard for the techniques that this film brought to fruition, that WILL be sold and profited from as well.

You line up the merch profits along with everything else, it's doing pretty well. It will recoup its costs in foreign ticket sales, and I suspect pull ahead in profits with merch and DVD sales. And certainly with the profits that Cameron will make on the technology that he built for this film.

All of this. They will eventually profit on the movie, but don't pretend that they are breaking even on ticket sales alone. Also, the theaters get a fair chunk of that haul.

I am not a science fiction fan (shock for a Farker, I know) but I thought it was a pretty movie. The storyline was sort of predictable, but the special effects were neato.

I saw the 3D version at an IMAX theater and felt sort of woozy afterward and had a bit of a headache. Is that normal?

Also, why did the wheelchair-bound hero not ever mention the rock stuff that the military was after to the blue people? Maybe they would have given it to the military. I thought that rock/mineral/whatever was the loose end in the story that made me irritated about the storyline.

SomeBrunette: Also, why did the wheelchair-bound hero not ever mention the rock stuff that the military was after to the blue people? Maybe they would have given it to the military. I thought that rock/mineral/whatever was the loose end in the story that made me irritated about the storyline.

You can read more about the rock here.

hubiestubert: this is also a big huge billboard for the techniques that this film brought to fruition, that WILL be sold and profited from as well.

I didn't care for Avatar, other than the effects, but I did come out of the theater looking forward to seeing more movies made with this 3D process. I'd love a 3D travelogue of Pandora without the rest of the nonsense--like a "Blue Planet" or "Planet Earth". Heck, Sigourney Weaver could narrate.

Dallymo: hubiestubert: this is also a big huge billboard for the techniques that this film brought to fruition, that WILL be sold and profited from as well.

I didn't care for Avatar, other than the effects, but I did come out of the theater looking forward to seeing more movies made with this 3D process. I'd love a 3D travelogue of Pandora without the rest of the nonsense--like a "Blue Planet" or "Planet Earth". Heck, Sigourney Weaver could narrate.

We are going to see a lot of folks hopping on the 3D bandwagon, and it will result in a push back against these techniques.

That folks are in the rumor mill that EVERY movie WILL BE IN FABULOUS 3D is a sign that Hollywood producers are going to latch onto this as a gimmick, as opposed to a way to tell a story.

In the case of Avatar it IS a part of that immersion into the setting, but looking at even the new Shrek trailer, this is a trend that is going to get old, fast.

Dallymo: I didn't care for Avatar, other than the effects, but I did come out of the theater looking forward to seeing more movies made with this 3D process. I'd love a 3D travelogue of Pandora without the rest of the nonsense--like a "Blue Planet" or "Planet Earth". Heck, Sigourney Weaver could narrate.

I credit the creation of Pandora with top-notch production design. What really struck me is that we may finally be out of the uncanny valley when it comes to rendering realistic computer-generated humanoid characters in close-up. I'm not positive we're there, but the fact that I couldn't say one way or another if we WERE in it while I was in the theater makes me lean toward "we're out."

Fark It: FishyFred: wolvernova: Avatar is just awesome. Where are those people that said it would bomb?

It, uh, has bombed. I hope they made hundreds of millions selling the worldwide distribution rights because the domestic take ain't doing it.

Also, the movie is shallow and forgettable. It's pretty. The end.

They did. Also, the movie hasn't done as well as they'd hoped, and from what I hear from the critics and people I know who've seen it, it's pretty and pretty retarded. There are two types of filmgoers: people who see films as primarily art, and people who are intimidated and get upset with people who see films primarily as art (GI Joe/Transformers were good mindless popcorn fun, derp derp, stop being so snobby/elitist!!).

You're really comparing the mindlessness of GI Joe/Transformers with the classic plot used in Avatar? It seems like you haven't even seen it.

I'll rent it when it comes out.

Oh, that makes more sense.

Richard Gere is also why Zhu-Zhu Pets were so hard to find this year.

chemical_angel: Fark It: There are two types of filmgoers: people who see films as primarily art, and people who are intimidated and get upset with people who see films primarily as art

This is seriously one of the most stupid things I've read around here. Why can't people just see a movie for what it is and enjoy it or not enjoy it on it's own merit? Only a complete jackass went to see Transformers or 2012 or Avatar expecting Fellini. You should take off the turtleneck once in awhile and get over yourself.

Some people like to put people they don't like into categories. Makes it easier to judge them.

SomeBrunette: Also, why did the wheelchair-bound hero not ever mention the rock stuff that the military was after to the blue people? Maybe they would have given it to the military. I thought that rock/mineral/whatever was the loose end in the story that made me irritated about the storyline.

At the beginning of the movie, you see a human strip mine. That was the only way to get to it, which is why the tree had to come down. They were basically going to reduce the entire landscape to rubble.

Frankly, I think the ads for Avatar make the CGI look really bad. That might largely be because of the difference between TV and a movie screen, but I don't expect to see it in the theater anyway.

The reviews suggest that the story is basically a 1965 SF story . . . which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it doesn't fill me with excitement, either. Hollywood is usually 20-30 years behind the times when it comes to SF, which, again, is not always a bad thing.

According to Box Office Mojo, Avatar is making about twice as much overseas as it is domestically, so that its current take is well over $600 million in box office. It's doing fine.

Besides, NOTHING fails to turn a profit once it hits DVD. Nothing. Pluto Nash probably turned a profit once it reached Best Buy. People will buy anything.

SomeBrunette: Also, why did the wheelchair-bound hero not ever mention the rock stuff that the military was after to the blue people? Maybe they would have given it to the military. I thought that rock/mineral/whatever was the loose end in the story that made me irritated about the storyline.


Maybe you missed the part where the Na'vi don't want any sort of technology/help and their entire planet is interconnected from the soil to the animals.

RandomAxe: According to Box Office Mojo, Avatar is making about twice as much overseas as it is domestically, so that its current take is well over $600 million in box office. It's doing fine.

The studio sees a lot less money per overseas ticket than they do per domestic ticket.

RandomAxe: Besides, NOTHING fails to turn a profit once it hits DVD. Nothing. Pluto Nash probably turned a profit once it reached Best Buy. People will buy anything.

Not if they're in the red by a significant amount, which they may very well be. $20 x 1 million DVDs is only $20 million.

Well, OK, Pluto Nash, kind of an extreme example, might be too far in the red. I used to get DVD industry numbers, though, and you wouldn't believe what the studios make back. Although they try to minimize it any way they can, to reduce how much they have to pay directors and talent who took points.

I realize that studio $$$ from ticket sales is less in some venues than others, and that it decreases as the weeks go by regardless of overall ticket sales, but $600 million in about ten days is more than OK. The most seemingly reputable numbers I've heard put total studio cost, including publicity, at about $300 million, and of course box office isn't the only way they recoup their costs.

Lots of people are calling the film a financial disaster, which I think is a tad hyperbolic. Personally, I would never have greenlit its production budget -- you can spend an endless amount of money on CGI and funky camera technology, but there are definite points of sharply diminishing returns. But that's a separate issue.

Whoever is saying it still isn't profitable hasn't noticed that it's made 600 Million dollars so far. In less than 2 weeks.

Like I said in another thread, waiting for home video is like watching a concert DVD instead of going to the show.

/Cameron took 12 years to recreate what made Titanic a success. Repeat viewers.
//Saw it twice.

Msol: Whoever is saying it still isn't profitable hasn't noticed that it's made 600 Million dollars so far. In less than 2 weeks.

Like I said in another thread, waiting for home video is like watching a concert DVD instead of going to the show.

/Cameron took 12 years to recreate what made Titanic a success. Repeat viewers.
//Saw it twice.

Er, 600. Anyways, it also lost a whopping 2.6% week-to-week. That's absolutely insane.

Msol: Er, 600. Anyways, it also lost a whopping 2.6% week-to-week. That's absolutely insane.

Not for a holiday weekend.

Also, worldwide means very little. Domestic ticket sales are where it's at. I repeat: This movie has yet to break even. It will eventually break even, but only once they start licensing the technology for other productions.

So FishyFred, what does it prove if the movie breaks even domestically? If it breaks even domestically without licensing the tech? If it makes a huge profit domestically? If it makes a huge profit worldwide? Etc.

I guess you can put me down as an Avatar hater. Sorry, I just don't like the idea of a movie being sold with a campaign of, "screw plot, we've got AMAZING special effects!" I'd rather watch 12 Angry Men again than see a 40 minute battle scene full of things I'm not emotionally invested in. I might watch it when it comes out on cable, but I'm not going to drop $12 to watch it in a theater.

Palmer Eldritch: I guess you can put me down as an Avatar hater. Sorry, I just don't like the idea of a movie being sold with a campaign of, "screw plot, we've got AMAZING special effects!" I'd rather watch 12 Angry Men again than see a 40 minute battle scene full of things I'm not emotionally invested in. I might watch it when it comes out on cable, but I'm not going to drop $12 to watch it in a theater.

See, I thought the characters were fine. I found myself drawn into the world, and liked the characters. Don't want to see it, fine. I didn't see Titanic because I just wasn't interested in it. Still haven't seen it, but I can't hate on folks who did like it.

Palmer Eldritch: I guess you can put me down as an Avatar hater. Sorry, I just don't like the idea of a movie being sold with a campaign of, "screw plot, we've got AMAZING special effects!" I'd rather watch 12 Angry Men again than see a 40 minute battle scene full of things I'm not emotionally invested in. I might watch it when it comes out on cable, but I'm not going to drop $12 to watch it in a theater.

So you haven't actually seen it? Oh well. Youre missing out.

hubiestubert: See, I thought the characters were fine. I found myself drawn into the world, and liked the characters. Don't want to see it, fine. I didn't see Titanic because I just wasn't interested in it. Still haven't seen it, but I can't hate on folks who did like it.

Bingo.

Fano: Zulu_as_Kono: "Unobtainium"? Really?

Yep. it's the applied phlebotinum that drives the MacGuffin engine

It was great when they were playing Duke Nukem forever while in transit.

Zulu_as_Kono: "Unobtainium"? Really?

The phrase has been used several times in fiction and movies to describe a mineral. Bit of a scientist joke.

Bartowski: hubiestubert: bingethinker: Since when is $212 million in slightly more than a week considered a failure?

Link (to reality)

Which is close to recouping half of their investment. It's not like the same profit margin as a film made for $50,000 and seeing a $4M opening, but then again, for Cameron, this is also a big huge billboard for the techniques that this film brought to fruition, that WILL be sold and profited from as well.

You line up the merch profits along with everything else, it's doing pretty well. It will recoup its costs in foreign ticket sales, and I suspect pull ahead in profits with merch and DVD sales. And certainly with the profits that Cameron will make on the technology that he built for this film.

this is at 600 million world wide.
IN 10 DAYS.
That is not a failure.
It's predicted to sail past 400 million in the US. Over 700 million overseas. I would say this is a success.

So long is it recoups the $500M investment and the cost of the promotional campaign, it'll do fine.