I used to work in a bank. We had a couple people that would go to different nursing homes on different days and let them withdraw small amounts or make small deposits or help them with their finances or whatever. Because of this, I saw a lot of children and nephews and whatnot that came in and managed their parents' accounts.

No one who understands what it takes to keep someone in a nursing home in this country would possibly post something as asinine as this.

that just means more ladies for me...

Well I had no idea this was happening, I wonder if our government even does. I wrote my MP/P.

Be nice if maybe there was some data on separations/divorces amongst seniors attached to the article.

orth: Be nice if maybe there was some data on separations/divorces amongst seniors attached to the article.

Canadian Government Divorce Statistics (new window)

orth: Well I had no idea this was happening, I wonder if our government even does. I wrote my MP/P.

Be nice if maybe there was some data on separations/divorces amongst seniors attached to the article.

It is pretty nasty. I wonder if this is a recent development; I'd be interested to see if the stats have changed. It certainly needs addressing. This is not part of our philosophy; something is f*cked up and it should be fixed. I'd also like to see actual numbers and I'd like to know how MacKenzie's portion was assessed as something isn't adding up there.

I don't believe anything run like the American health care industry would produce a better result for these people. If anything, it would be far worse. But to each his own.

I've had two uncles that had to do this in NJ. One had a wife w/ primary progressive MS and the other's wife had ALS.

Click-trolling headlines like this make me go read Digg.

"Canadian healthcare still better than U.S."

[Citation Needed]

texastag: "Canadian healthcare still better than U.S."

[Citation Needed]

How many lives does the "Canadian system" financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How many lives does the "American Market" (We do not have s system, we have a FREE Market) financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

My parents almost had to due this after 50 plus years of marriage but dad passed. Yeah Obama care not going/wouldn't have help

We are in for a disaster

-Massive multi-year deficit
-Baby boomers retiring with underfunded government pension liability and private sector pensions going kaput (taxpayer bailout?)
-massive increases in health care costs
-decrease in the size of the taxbase/workforce
-seniors/baby boomers more likely to vote

Get ready to bend over, young people of Canada!

texastag: "Canadian healthcare still better than U.S."

[Citation Needed]

He told me...
/Please don't be obscure..Please don't be obscure..Please don't be obscure..

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

Link

I would ask that people interested in health care watch this Frontline special. Its real journalism. It presents the pros and Cons to five other world systems. The ups and downs.

The major point that it makes is that there are a lot of choices and systems out there that work very well, and that none are perfect. But they are not destroying the countries they are based in.

The Democrats are going about this ALL wrong, and the Republicans refuse to even acknowledge that there is a problem.

My favorite is Taiwan, its near the end of the special. Taiwan studied all of the other major nations, and took the best ideas that worked, and tossed the ones that did not. They have a modern, safe and prosperous Health care system.

but but America bigger... There is nothing here that we could not implement... nothing... I know America Big, but stats small.. start of the state levels and work up to a integrated national whole.

Anyway, please just check out the special. Like I said, its just an investigative and fair look at other nations health care, showing the pros and cons of each.

WE HAVE CHOICES!

/If you watched it, let me know what you think.. Ive show it to both my republican and democrat friends, and each group liked it, and felt that it was a fair look.

A few things need to be pointed out here:

a) This isn't indicative of "Canadian Healthcare" on the whole in anyway. Each province runs its own separate single-payer insurance system, the story here is specific to New Brunswick.

b) This actually doesn't have anything to do with New Brunswick's health care system. This is a problem with their "Social Development" ministry, which (presumably from the article) pays for some nursing home coverage.

c) At least here in Ontario, nursing homes come in both public (run, as far as I'm aware, by municipalities) and private varieties. You pay-out-of-pocket, but social assistance is available .

Raharu:
How many lives does the "Canadian system" financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How many lives does the "American Market" (We do not have s system, we have a FREE Market) financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How much higher are the survival rates in the U.S.? How much shorter is the wait time for procedures? I'd rather be bankrupt and breathing than have extra money for my funeral. I'd rather go into debt than live in pain waiting for my turn on the list for sub-standard care.

The Democrats are going about this ALL wrong, and the Republicans refuse to even acknowledge that there is a problem.

You are half right. The Republicans do acknowledge there is a problem and have presented several pieces of legislation. All of them have been ignored by the "bi-partisan" democrats.

Raharu: we have a FREE Market)

HAHAHAhahahahahahahh
*pant* *gasp*
HAhHahahahahahahah
*wheeze* *cough*

You're my new favorite troll ever.

texastag: Raharu:
How many lives does the "Canadian system" financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How many lives does the "American Market" (We do not have s system, we have a FREE Market) financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How much higher are the survival rates in the U.S.? How much shorter is the wait time for procedures? I'd rather be bankrupt and breathing than have extra money for my funeral. I'd rather go into debt than live in pain waiting for my turn on the list for sub-standard care.

The Democrats are going about this ALL wrong, and the Republicans refuse to even acknowledge that there is a problem.

You are half right. The Republicans do acknowledge there is a problem and have presented several pieces of legislation. All of them have been ignored by the "bi-partisan" democrats.

Well, going off the most basic data, Canada has a lower mortality rate than us and a three year longer average life expectancy. So in America, you're dead and broke. In Canada you're alive and somewhat less broke.

Wikipedia on Death Rate (new window)
CIA Factbook of life expectancy (new window)

As opposed to the US system which requires one to be a penniless pauper before nursing home care is covered. And by socialist healthcare too, no less.

Panicky headline: "Seniors separate 'on a regular basis!!11!"

Actual story: One couple divorced and one "seniors advocate" says "It is happening I would say on a regular basis".

Nice reporting there, CBC.

As a Brit that complains about waiting a week for a check up and noisy waiting rooms in ER etc, I find it amazing to think that Americns think they are better off paying more for less, and being screwed over at the time when they need it most. My dad has multiple Myeloma (a form of cancer), and the NHS has paid for Stem Cell transplant treatment, 2 sessions of Chemotherapy and is now on Revlamid. In a nutshell, he'd be dead if we lived in America. Stephen Hawking would be dead too. These drug companies, doctors and insurance companies are making billions from people suffering, how is that a good thing ? Even a badly run Health System won't waste as much as they currently profit.

SphericalTime: Gee willikers. If that was the worst problem with American health care if would be great.

/just got farked by my insurance company and get to pay double the price for a doctors visit while the insurance company pays a lovely $7.50. Fark them.

Or my insurance company several years ago, who decided that having three impacted molars (one so bad that it had cracked into several pieces) surgically removed was a "cosmetic" procedure.

WTF?

I had to borrow money from my family to pay the dentist off, and it took me a good while before I could pay the family back.

From my own experience, all I can say is that 'free' market healthcare is pretty damned expensive. On paper, I just lost a house this year.

Considering that a great deal of this was likely preventable with proper, available healthcare that I could not otherwise afford, that it reduces my immediate and lifetime earning and production capacity, and that a pool of 300 million would deliver unprecedented savings through economies of scale (remember that, fiscal conservatives? the basis for the argument that there should be no limitations on vertical consolidation?), I'd be much happier to have been paying into a single-payer system years ago.

It doesn't matter who runs health care, it's going to be filled with example after example of problems created by the system. Proponents of one form of health care are always quick to point out the problems with another form but are equally as quick to either ignore or make excuses for any problem that arises from the system they endorse.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

Link



Please Folks, just sit down for an hour and Watch this.
Its very informative, and interesting. Pros and Cons.
Ups and Downs of 5 other First World Health care systems.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/countries/

Link

Im not pushing an Agenda, I do not like how either the Democrats or Republicans are handling this problem. I think we need to look outside of our own parties to find a solution!

The Canadian health care system is so much better that Canadians come to the US for health care that they can not receive in Canada. Also, all the Canadians, that I have met in the US, say that the US health care system is much better than the Canadian system.

jayrman123: The Canadian health care system is so much better that Canadians come to the US for health care that they can not receive in Canada. Also, all the Canadians, that I have met in the US, say that the US health care system is much better than the Canadian system.

Question, when a Canadian is abroad, say in the US or in the UK, and they need medical attention. Does the Canadian Government still cover the bill?

texastag:
The Republicans do acknowledge there is a problem and have presented several pieces of legislation that would actually make the problem worse while benefiting insurers even more. All of them have been ignored by the "bi-partisan" democrats.

jayrman123:
The Canadian health care system is so much better that Canadians who can afford it come to the US for health care that they can not receive in Canada are not willing to receive on equal footing with the working proles. Also, all the Canadians, that I have met in the US, say that the US health care system is much better than the Canadian system, in other news, 100% of people interviewed at a baseball game say they like baseball.

A little FTFY for you guys.

Raharu:
Question, when a Canadian is abroad, say in the US or in the UK, and they need medical attention. Does the Canadian Government still cover the bill?

We buy short-term private travel health insurance. It is sold by travel agents and costs the same no matter what your medical history is. It usually covers flying your corpse home if you get shot by drug dealers in Mexico, too.

zulius: texastag: "Canadian healthcare still better than U.S."

[Citation Needed]

He told me...
/Please don't be obscure..Please don't be obscure..Please don't be obscure..

No Lizzie, Canada is not getting rid of the queen.

Holy fark Douchemitter, that's terrible. I think our system is #1 too. You know what's so amazing about it.....I supposedly have "top tier" medical insurance through my company and I need an MRI for my back. WITH medical insurance, I only have to pay $1,900 out of pocket for a $3,000 procedure. It's incredible. Fark national health insurance.....I get to make a decision to either care for my back or pay my rent so I don't get thrown out of my apartment, and I HAVE medical insurance

Tell you what Subby, I would like you to have an MRI performed.......with a metal chain wrapped around your neck.

Raharu: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

Link

I would ask that people interested in health care watch this Frontline special. Its real journalism. It presents the pros and Cons to five other world systems. The ups and downs.

The major point that it makes is that there are a lot of choices and systems out there that work very well, and that none are perfect. But they are not destroying the countries they are based in.

The Democrats are going about this ALL wrong, and the Republicans refuse to even acknowledge that there is a problem.

My favorite is Taiwan, its near the end of the special. Taiwan studied all of the other major nations, and took the best ideas that worked, and tossed the ones that did not. They have a modern, safe and prosperous Health care system.

but but America bigger... There is nothing here that we could not implement... nothing... I know America Big, but stats small.. start of the state levels and work up to a integrated national whole.

Anyway, please just check out the special. Like I said, its just an investigative and fair look at other nations health care, showing the pros and cons of each.

WE HAVE CHOICES!

/If you watched it, let me know what you think.. Ive show it to both my republican and democrat friends, and each group liked it, and felt that it was a fair look.

It's not about acknowledging there is a problem. It's the bribes, kickbacks etc outweight them caring about everyone else. Throw enough money at someone and they will go your way. Look at how much all those insurance companies and pharms are throwing at them. We will never have change, the "important" people already have the best coverage possible so not one of them will ever die or what not to cause change.

DubyaHater: Holy fark Douchemitter, that's terrible. I think our system is #1 too. You know what's so amazing about it.....I supposedly have "top tier" medical insurance through my company and I need an MRI for my back. WITH medical insurance, I only have to pay $1,900 out of pocket for a $3,000 procedure. It's incredible. Fark national health insurance.....I get to make a decision to either care for my back or pay my rent so I don't get thrown out of my apartment, and I HAVE medical insurance

Tell you what Subby, I would like you to have an MRI performed.......with a metal chain wrapped around your neck.

You know how much an MRI will cost you in Japan, in USDs. I believe it was 91$ and its covered by your national insurance there.

Japan is the 2nd Nation they cover in Sick Around the World

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/

Link

How many lives does the "American Market" (We do not have s system, we have a FREE Market) financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

We don't have a free market. Can I buy health insurance out of state? Can I buy insurance that just covers cancer? Can a hospital refuse service? I suggest we have a mixed market with some of the worst qualities of capitalism and socialism.

The Democrats are going about this ALL wrong, and the Republicans refuse to even acknowledge that there is a problem.

Yeah, it's amazing Republicans haven't authored any competing bills or anything. Oh wait...they have.

and the NHS has paid for Stem Cell transplant treatment

Imagine I forced you to pay me $100 a month for 12 months for a food allowance. Then in July I bought you a steak dinner with your money. I'm such a nice guy, I just bought you a FREE meal (with your money)! If you lived in the US, you'd have to buy that dinner all by yourself (and pay the $100/month anyway...sadly).

These drug companies, doctors and insurance companies are making billions from people suffering, how is that a good thing?

Without profits, those expensive medicines, techniques, and surgeries may not be available. Why strive to invent something new without a profit? Profits force companies to be efficient so that they can keep as much money as possible. Profits allow companies to expand into new lines of business. Profits signal other companies to enter the market and drive down prices for the consumer.

Profits have provided fantastic arrays of goods and services in various industries (how many types of peanut butter are available at a grocery store? 100?), but when it comes to health insurance, oh no, we can't have profits there, no, that's crazy talk!

randomjsa: It doesn't matter who runs health care, it's going to be filled with example after example of problems created by the system. Proponents of one form of health care are always quick to point out the problems with another form but are equally as quick to either ignore or make excuses for any problem that arises from the system they endorse.

Yes. There will be extreme horror cases in any system. This is medicine. People die.

That's why it's important to step back and look at aggregate numbers. Mortality. Life expectancy. Recovery rates. Prevention rates. Overall cost per capita. Number of bankruptcies. And, if you're a freaking commie, some degree of access/equality/health-centered-GINI-score.

On the aggregate numbers, America's system sucks very badly.

Blacksmithking:

Without profits, those expensive medicines, techniques, and surgeries may not be available. Why strive to invent something new without a profit? Profits force companies to be efficient so that they can keep as much money as possible. Profits allow companies to expand into new lines of business. Profits signal other companies to enter the market and drive down prices for the consumer.

Profits have provided fantastic arrays of goods and services in various industries (how many types of peanut butter are available at a grocery store? 100?), but when it comes to health insurance, oh no, we can't have profits there, no, that's crazy talk!

This is a falsehood.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/
Link

On the one hand I hate Fark because we have dumbasses who would rather troll the other partisan groups out of hate than have a reasonable discussion about anything, mostly because they know they can't defend their position. Not that its indefensible, rather they're ill equipped to do so.

On the other hand the trolling is what makes this place so much fun to visit.

DubyaHater: Holy fark Douchemitter, that's terrible. I think our system is #1 too. You know what's so amazing about it.....I supposedly have "top tier" medical insurance through my company and I need an MRI for my back. WITH medical insurance, I only have to pay $1,900 out of pocket for a $3,000 procedure. It's incredible. Fark national health insurance.....I get to make a decision to either care for my back or pay my rent so I don't get thrown out of my apartment, and I HAVE medical insurance

Tell you what Subby, I would like you to have an MRI performed.......with a metal chain wrapped around your neck.



hence why your system blows ass. Same health problem here. I paid $0 and thus paid rent.

Subby is a useful idiot who does not understand statistical picking for political outcomes.

There are too many farking morons in our country allowed to vote.

TXL

texastag: Raharu:
How many lives does the "Canadian system" financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How many lives does the "American Market" (We do not have s system, we have a FREE Market) financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How much higher are the survival rates in the U.S.? How much shorter is the wait time for procedures? I'd rather be bankrupt and breathing than have extra money for my funeral. I'd rather go into debt than live in pain waiting for my turn on the list for sub-standard care.

The Democrats are going about this ALL wrong, and the Republicans refuse to even acknowledge that there is a problem.

You are half right. The Republicans do acknowledge there is a problem and have presented several pieces of legislation. All of them have been ignored by the "bi-partisan" democrats.

and the "unbiased" media.

txlewis: Subby is a useful idiot who does not understand statistical picking for political outcomes.

Not even statistical picking, just a single anecdotal couple.

The story cited exactly one case of a couple getting divorced.

Nemo's Brother: The Republicans do acknowledge there is a problem and have presented several pieces of legislation

How dare the Democrats not enforce the GOP agenda! Scoundrels!

Raharu: texastag: "Canadian healthcare still better than U.S."

[Citation Needed]

How many lives does the "Canadian system" financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?

How many lives does the "American Market" (We do not have s system, we have a FREE Market) financially bankrupt over the course of 1 month?
Anyone who thinks our current system is free market needs to just take another hit and pass it on.

I have a better idea, look at the waiting times for surgery and specialist visits. So the real question is "How many people does the Canadian system kill in one month from lack of care?"

Stop biatching about this being a free market, we don't have one and probably never will.

jayrman123: The Canadian health care system is so much better that Canadians come to the US for health care that they can not receive in Canada. Also, all the Canadians, that I have met in the US, say that the US health care system is much better than the Canadian system.

Are those Canadians you've met in the US there to purchase medical treatments? Because that might bias their perspectives a bit. From what I can tell, the people who cross the border to buy treatments are usually doing so to access experimental treatments that are not yet approved/available in Canada. And then they spend years biatching and suing to try to get Canada to pay for it.

AnonymousOne: I have a better idea, look at the waiting times for surgery and specialist visits. So the real question is "How many people does the Canadian system kill in one month from lack of care?"

[Citation Needed]