Lakeland is bulls--t, I got nailed once by the red light cameras, which they say I must do less then 2 MPH or come to a stop before the line, I was literally on the line in the turning lane, stopped completely for 12 seconds then turned - all on camera and I was issued a ticket. this was however the only time I was in my private vehicle, I work for the city in waste management and made the same turn dozens of times without being issued a ticket.

/conspiracy

More people need to shoot those damn things like that guy back east did a year or two back.

Misconduc: Lakeland is bulls--t, I got nailed once by the red light cameras, which they say I must do less then 2 MPH or come to a stop before the line, I was literally on the line in the turning lane, stopped completely for 12 seconds then turned - all on camera and I was issued a ticket. this was however the only time I was in my private vehicle, I work for the city in waste management and made the same turn dozens of times without being issued a ticket.

/conspiracy

I like how the city shortened the yellow light by one second. I'm sure that was for safety as well....

My understanding is that red-light cameras are designed not to trigger when one makes a right on red (which is legal unless otherwise posted). The sensor doesn't cover the right-turn lane, but rather only the main driving lanes.

The fact that numerous vehicles made legal right turns on red and didn't set off the red light cameras is not only completely unnewsworthy (I know, it's Not News...), but the system was specifically designed to allow such turns.

brap: licdonocpwihu

I don't get it.

BlippityBleep: More people need to shoot those damn things like that guy back east did a year or two back.

The ones here are bulletproof.
Someone overseas figured a way around that.
Apparently a burning tire does the trick.

Yeah subby, they're called police cars.

newton: The ones here are bulletproof.

There's bulletproof and then there's bulletproof. Good luck stopping .30 caliber rifle rounds.

A more subtle, and likely less-illegal and unsafe, method of disabling the cameras is to spray the lens cover with cooking oil or smear it with vaseline. People driving by are unlikely to notice (unlike, say, a man with a rifle or a burning camera), and it's causes no permanent damage.

heypete: My understanding is that red-light cameras are designed not to trigger when one makes a right on red (which is legal unless otherwise posted). The sensor doesn't cover the right-turn lane, but rather only the main driving lanes.

I'd go further to say that I thought the cameras only recorded cars running the red light when the light changed, and then only for a few moments. I wouldn't think the cameras captured the entire red-green light sequence for both directions 24/7.

A burning camera?

heypete: My understanding is that red-light cameras are designed not to trigger when one makes a right on red (which is legal unless otherwise posted). The sensor doesn't cover the right-turn lane, but rather only the main driving lanes.

The fact that numerous vehicles made legal right turns on red and didn't set off the red light cameras is not only completely unnewsworthy (I know, it's Not News...), but the system was specifically designed to allow such turns.

They do in Lakeland. One of the first outcries about the cameras were from people that would slow to a crawl when turning right on red, but not completely stopping, and then getting a ticket for the right turn on red.....every day for weeks. The ticket takes three or four weeks to be mailed out so people were getting one every day and only got the first one a month later, followed by another one the next day, and then another...

neilnole: Misconduc: Lakeland is bulls--t, I got nailed once by the red light cameras, which they say I must do less then 2 MPH or come to a stop before the line, I was literally on the line in the turning lane, stopped completely for 12 seconds then turned - all on camera and I was issued a ticket. this was however the only time I was in my private vehicle, I work for the city in waste management and made the same turn dozens of times without being issued a ticket.

/conspiracy

I like how the city shortened the yellow light by one second. I'm sure that was for safety as well....

Knowing polk county, they are pretty much competing with maricopa county for the title of worst place to live. Both Sheriff's are idiots, both camera fodders and both don't give a fark about anyone but their wallet size.

The sort of programmers that write the software for these things are far from the best and brightest.

The primary example in the article was a case of a failure to stop when making a right turn. To properly catch this they'd have to incorporate complicated logic to analyze and determine what a "proper stop" is. Instead they probably just leave out the corner of the intersection and keep it down to a simple "if (light==red && car > line) takePicture();"

Being an hourly employee means nothing. I'm a plumber and get paid by the hour. I do take my time. I do not take toll roads. I have no problem sitting in traffic. I have coworkers are are completely opposite. Toll tags, biatching about traffic, biatching about a long drive to a call, one guy even got biatchy that his van was governed down to 88mph.

heypete: My understanding is that red-light cameras are designed not to trigger when one makes a right on red (which is legal unless otherwise posted). The sensor doesn't cover the right-turn lane, but rather only the main driving lanes.

The fact that numerous vehicles made legal right turns on red and didn't set off the red light cameras is not only completely unnewsworthy (I know, it's Not News...), but the system was specifically designed to allow such turns.

On Aug. 4, a Ledger reporter saw a Lakeland police car and a Lakeland Electric vehicle turn right on red without stopping at the same intersection about 12:30 p.m.
FLORIDA STATE UNIFORM TRAFFIC CONTROL

It wasn't a legal turn...

316.075 Traffic control signal devices.--

(1) Except for automatic warning signal lights installed or to be installed at railroad crossings, whenever traffic, including municipal traffic, is controlled by traffic control signals exhibiting different colored lights, or colored lighted arrows, successively one at a time or in combination, only the colors green, red, and yellow shall be used, except for special pedestrian signals carrying a word legend, and the lights shall indicate and apply to drivers of vehicles and pedestrians as follows:


(c) Steady red indication.--

1. Vehicular traffic facing a steady red signal shall stop before entering the crosswalk on the near side of the intersection or, if none, then before entering the intersection and shall remain standing until a green indication is shown; however:

a. The driver of a vehicle which is stopped at a clearly marked stop line, but if none, before entering the crosswalk on the near side of the intersection, or, if none then at the point nearest the intersecting roadway where the driver has a view of approaching traffic on the intersecting roadway before entering the intersection in obedience to a steady red signal may make a right turn, but shall yield the right-of-way to pedestrians and other traffic proceeding as directed by the signal at the intersection, except that municipal and county authorities may prohibit any such right turn against a steady red signal at any intersection, which prohibition shall be effective when a sign giving notice thereof is erected in a location visible to traffic approaching the intersection.

LongDistanceOperator

one guy even got biatchy that his van was governed down to 88mph.


Great Scott!


Let's see if these b*stards can do 90...

Uh isn't the van turning right on red? Of course it's inching up to pull out in traffic when it's clear. No violation that I see.

Misconduc: neilnole: Misconduc: Lakeland is bulls--t, I got nailed once by the red light cameras, which they say I must do less then 2 MPH or come to a stop before the line, I was literally on the line in the turning lane, stopped completely for 12 seconds then turned - all on camera and I was issued a ticket. this was however the only time I was in my private vehicle, I work for the city in waste management and made the same turn dozens of times without being issued a ticket.

/conspiracy

I like how the city shortened the yellow light by one second. I'm sure that was for safety as well....

Knowing polk county, they are pretty much competing with maricopa county for the title of worst place to live. Both Sheriff's are idiots, both camera fodders and both don't give a fark about anyone but their wallet size.


The cameras are something started by the city. I'm not sure Grady would try this if he could, these have created a lot of negative feelings towards the the city, and I think he's a bit smarter than that.

These things are nothing but a revenue generator. They put a camera at the intersection of Edgewood and Cleveland Hights. In the seven years I've been going through that intersection on the way to work I've never seen an accident or even a close call. It's a very 'polite' intersection. Yet this location somehow needed a camera for "safety".

Weaver95: Cook said he doesn't think the two citations issued to city vehicles - far less than 1 percent of the total - is suspicious.

actually, i'd be willing to believe that one. city employees are on the clock, no reason for 'em to rush anywhere. the fact that they take their time while out on a job is something that I'd be willing to believe.

You haven't been on many police ride alongs I take it. Those guys ignore traffic laws completely. And if there's not much traffic, that includes things like lanes.

I love the red light cameras.

It used to be so frustrating watching vehicles constantly run red lights with impunity. Now, it's so much fun to watch the cameras flash as a person runs a red light and to know that they're going to be held accountable for their action.

fasahd: It wasn't a legal turn...

Granted, but failing to come to a complete stop before making a right turn on red is an entirely different offense than "running" a red light, and not something the cameras are designed to detect.

ZAZ: heypete

Early cameras ignored turns on red. Modern cameras make about half of their money from right turns on red. One set of cameras makes 98% of its money from turning violations.

Interesting. Here in Arizona, they have a big red line painted in the intersection indicating the extent of the sensor, beyond which one will get a picture taken. The bar does not extend to the right-turn lane, and pictures are not taken of anyone making a right turn on red.

farkityfarker: I love the red light cameras.

It used to be so frustrating watching vehicles constantly run red lights with impunity. Now, it's so much fun to watch the cameras flash as a person runs a red light and to know that they're going to be held accountable for their action.

...a few weeks later, by getting a ticket in the mail. A ticket which, I must note, does not stop them from running red lights now.

Sure, it's nice to cite violators of the law, but red light running is a major safety issue, and if someone is running reds, they should be stopped by the police now so the risk can be stopped rather than simply getting a ticket several weeks later.

I think people should burn/shoot/tear them down.

I'm all for traffic enforcement - but having a 3rd party company manage and given the power to screw people out of money? No.

Red light cameras operate on the same buzzword logic that parents use that force them to buy every "safety" item out there.

If you really wanted to improve safety, states would stop giving out licenses to 90 year old people, illegal aliens, the illiterate, and people that cant pass a regular test.

I don't run red lights because I know how dangerous it is for everyone involved. Hitting my pocketbook for making a legal right on red, just so you can afford a new office furniture set, and calling it "safety" is a slap in the face to the people of the city.

The fact that city employees seem to get out for free just shows how corrupt and wrong the system is. Pretty much like every other government run entity out there.

I swear I'm going to spray paint over the lenses in the cameras around Lakeland one of these says. And maybe "1984" on the signs.

heypete: Sure, it's nice to cite violators of the law, but red light running is a major safety issue, and if someone is running reds, they should be stopped by the police now so the risk can be stopped rather than simply getting a ticket several weeks later.

I agree that the police should be catching as many violators as possible at the time of the violation. But let's face it, that's logistically impossible, and many people would probably not be happy if there were a police car stationed at every intersection 24/7.

At least now, if the police don't catch them the camera will. Before they got away scot free and felt empowered to run red lights as there was minimal risk of getting caught. A slight chance of getting a ticket does not have the deterrence power of a guaranteed ticket.

neilnole: heypete: My understanding is that red-light cameras are designed not to trigger when one makes a right on red (which is legal unless otherwise posted). The sensor doesn't cover the right-turn lane, but rather only the main driving lanes.

The fact that numerous vehicles made legal right turns on red and didn't set off the red light cameras is not only completely unnewsworthy (I know, it's Not News...), but the system was specifically designed to allow such turns.

They do in Lakeland. One of the first outcries about the cameras were from people that would slow to a crawl when turning right on red, but not completely stopping, and then getting a ticket for the right turn on red.....every day for weeks. The ticket takes three or four weeks to be mailed out so people were getting one every day and only got the first one a month later, followed by another one the next day, and then another...

But it is highly dangerous to make a rolling stop! How on earth could so many people make 'Jersey stops' every day without getting in an accident? Rolling stops are illegal an therefore dangerous and bad right? Illegal = wrong! NO MATTER WHAT! Thank god those cameras were there.

accelerus: I don't run red lights because I know how dangerous it is for everyone involved.

Unfortunately, there are some people in our society who don't hold to this ethic.

accelerus: Hitting my pocketbook for making a legal right on red,

Can't a person fight such a ticket in traffic court? Has anyone tried?

Your doing it wrong

All vehicles are invisible to red light cameras. You've just got to be going fast enough when you run the red light. I've found 40mph to be sufficient in most cases.

if not invisible, at least blurry!

I've been nailed by only a 2 to 3 seconds violation variance. If I had only waited a little longer it would have been a legal right on red... $100 ticket, no contest with video.... frackers..

From my perspective they've caused more traffic paranoia and sudden rushed stops that lead to near rear endings.. (which have probably happened, just not when I'm around.)

/Hates the cameras...

I've been honked at for stopping at red lights. Not green lights, not yellow lights, but RED lights. (It happened just a short while ago, and it has happened before.)

Red light cameras would be a godsend around here.

"I agree that the police should be catching as many violators as possible at the time of the violation."

Oh yeah, catch every possible violation no matter how slight, next thing you know we'll all be under arrest.
/and paying

ChicagoFarker: sudden rushed stops that lead to near rear endings..

Even so, if I had the choice I'd prefer to be hit in the rear end stopping for a red light over being t-boned on my door by a driver speeding through a red light. I consider it a desirable result of the cameras if they instill the mindset that one should slow down and stop when approaching a light that's about to or has just turned red, rather than speeding up in such a situation.

Some solutions to red light/speed cameras as government isn't going to listen to us tell them not to install them:

Buy a motorcycle: The rear plate can be conveniently and temporarily covered by a fanny pack that "just happened to slip down the sissy bar, officer" if you ever get pulled over. Be sure to wear a full sized helmet that covers your face with a tinted face shield for photographic mis-identification as well.

Paintball gun at 3am: Quick, quiet and non-lethal. Takes a while to fix/clean for the city. They lose revenue. The city STILL has to pay the francise/extortation fee no matter if it works or not. If they lose money, they will remove them.

A 30.06 or .22 magnum rifle at 3am can work, too, just be sure to use a bolt or lever action and don't reload until you are sure to not drop the cartridge. Also, wipe the rounds with a cloth for fingerprints and wear a glove when loading in case you do want to fire multiple times. No fingerprints, pay with cash, keep quiet about it. One doesn't broadcast their civil disobedience. That goes for the other parts of this post as well.

Aforementioned tire fires work if the tire cannot be traced to you. Pack the inside of the tire with newspaper, soak with used oil/gasoline. Make a timer. Get a tire size that doesn't match the tires on your car from a junkyard, tell them you're making a tire swing or planter. Wear gloves as well here.

SomeCity cars are literally invisible to red light cameras

BasqueBastard: A 30.06 or .22 magnum rifle at 3am can work, too, just be sure to use a bolt or lever action and don't reload until you are sure to not drop the cartridge. Also, wipe the rounds with a cloth for fingerprints and wear a glove when loading in case you do want to fire multiple times. No fingerprints, pay with cash, keep quiet about it. One doesn't broadcast their civil disobedience. That goes for the other parts of this post as well.

Shooting cameras out isn't civil disobedience, it's vandalism. Anybody who destroys property like that deserves to go to prison and get f*cked up the ass every day for the next couple of years.

Or, you could simply stop at the goddamned light. Then you wouldn't have to worry about the camera.

AntiNorm: BasqueBastard:

Or, you could simply stop at the goddamned light. Then you wouldn't have to worry about the camera.

Just sew on the goddamn star. Then you won't have to worry about the jackboots beating you up.

/finally

I don't like the red light cameras for a multitude of reasons but I found press video slanted to the extreme. It can have no validly until they place their camera at the same height and angle. Other than tires I don't know what I was looking at.

farkityfarker: I love the red light cameras.

It used to be so frustrating watching vehicles constantly run red lights with impunity. Now, it's so much fun to watch the cameras flash as a person runs a red light and to know that they're going to be held accountable for their action.

I'm on the fence. On the one hand I think that a lot of cities put these and speeding cameras up in order to make money. Its weird that they spy on you- everyone makes mistakes, etc.

I think a lot of people accidentally run a red light- thinking they could make the yellow and just missing it, or coming to a complete stop and going before its green (this happens to me- I guess I accidentally think its a stop SIGN and after looking and seeing no other cars I just go- accident- doesn't happen often)

On the other hand there are all of these crazy people who like to gun it and roar through the intersection as fast as they can in order to 'beat' the cars that are starting to cross. gah don't get me started on people who can't wait 2 minutes.

AntiNorm: Shooting cameras out isn't civil disobedience, it's vandalism.

It's far worse than that. It's endangering the public safety by shooting off bullets that could end up hitting anybody.

But I guess the public safety isn't really a concern to him anyway, as he's advocating firing bullets all over the place to defend his god-given right to endanger the public safety by running red lights.

Bullets? Tire fires? Come on guys why so low tech?

These are digital cameras we are talking about, a good size laser will fry the light sensor no problem, and no evidence.