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(Jerusalem Post)   Israel ranks 32nd in the latest global corruption index behind New Zealand, Denmark and Singapore and ahead of Iran, Somalia and Egypt. Hoping that if they win out they can still get a BCS Bowl   (jpost.com) divider line 102
    More: Interesting  
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4554 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Nov 2009 at 3:35 AM (5 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2009-11-18 07:04:18 AM  
I banged a Jew chick and a Muslim one
/THAT IS ALL
 
2009-11-18 07:08:00 AM  
I have a working hypothesis. You want to know how corrupt a society is? Just look at the way people drive there. Basic stuff: do drivers stay in their lane and signal changes, obey traffic signals and signs, carefully watch for pedestrians, generally do things in an orderly way? Or is it barely-controlled chaos where the more daring has the right of way? If it's like that on the roads then it's probably like that elsewhere, and visa versa.
 
2009-11-18 07:11:15 AM  
Nick Nostril: deadsanta: Top 20 list (out of 180)



I reiterate: List is horseshiat with the US at 19. Someone isn't looking hard enough, or in the case of the US, at all.


What? All I ever read on Fark is how much you guys are afraid of your evil, corrupt Government. But that's OK because you got your pop guns and revolution will be happening any day now. My only surprise is you rated so highly (if FARK is to be believed).
 
2009-11-18 07:20:11 AM  
It's perceptions of corruption, not corruption on an absolute standard. Thing is, Israel is rather religious, so what passes for corruption there might be normal somewhere else. It also has a large Arab / Muslim population, and the Muslim religion specifically allows lying and cheating to get your own way vs non-Muslims.

Basically, the ranking means very little. When's the last time you heard about people being beheaded or flogged to death in Israel? Any ranking that shows Israel being around as bad as Somalia is obviously bogus.
 
2009-11-18 07:31:18 AM  
j0ndas: It's perceptions of corruption, not corruption on an absolute standard. Thing is, Israel is rather religious, so what passes for corruption there might be normal somewhere else. It also has a large Arab / Muslim population, and the Muslim religion specifically allows lying and cheating to get your own way vs non-Muslims.

Basically, the ranking means very little. When's the last time you heard about people being beheaded or flogged to death in Israel? Any ranking that shows Israel being around as bad as Somalia is obviously bogus.


Israel at #32 and Somalia at #180. Dang they are almost the same on the list. Almost side by side. Or perhaps you aint so good at reading a list.
 
2009-11-18 07:36:31 AM  
drjekel_mrhyde: I banged a JewJewish chick and a Muslim one
/THAT IS ALL


FTFY.

/ At the same time?
 
2009-11-18 07:38:35 AM  
j0ndas: Thing is, Israel is rather religious, so what passes for corruption there might be normal somewhere else.

Sorry, can you clarify that with an example - not being snarky, just don't get what you mean.

It also has a large Arab / Muslim population, and the Muslim religion specifically allows lying and cheating to get your own way vs non-Muslims.

Oh right... that's why they've got such a fantastic standard of living compared to those poor Jews in that fine country. Wow. Yeah, that one was snark.
 
2009-11-18 07:40:30 AM  
skodabunny: j0ndas: Thing is, Israel is rather religious, so what passes for corruption there might be normal somewhere else.

Sorry, can you clarify that with an example - not being snarky, just don't get what you mean.

It also has a large Arab / Muslim population, and the Muslim religion specifically allows lying and cheating to get your own way vs non-Muslims.

Oh right... that's why they've got such a fantastic standard of living compared to those poor Jews in that fine country. Wow. Yeah, that one was snark.


As a matter of fact, Israel's Christian Arabs are far better off socioeconomically than the nation's Muslim Arabs.
 
2009-11-18 07:41:32 AM  
gund: Mr. Right: Over 40 posts and nobody has pointed out that the list was compiled by a couple of NGOs? The report is based on perceptions of purely subjective criteria. Are we to take this seriously? Seriously?

I suppose it is like most news these days. Take a poll of what people are feeling and report it as news.

Taking polls of what people feel about something makes the news all the time...

Most news articles have a quote or two of a person's feelings to whatever the article is talking about.

/facepalm


You're really going to defend opinion polls as news? I thought news was supposed to be objective reporting of the facts. This group made up criteria, didn't tell us how they arrived at them, applied them in an unsubstantiated manner and then passed this off as received wisdom that some countries are more corrupt.

Do you understand the difference between objective news and subjective opinion?
 
2009-11-18 07:46:53 AM  
While the article uses general metrics of corruption it doesn't mention that Israel has high quality corruption - is it a mecca for international organized crime.

It is very hard to have large amounts of organized crime without segments of the government being corrupt and bribeable to look the other way.
 
2009-11-18 07:48:12 AM  
Nogale: As a matter of fact, Israel's Christian Arabs are far better off socioeconomically than the nation's Muslim Arabs.

Birthrate and education have their effect.
 
2009-11-18 07:48:30 AM  
Flissss: If New York state was a country, it'd be pretty farking low on the list.fark Albany.

So much this. I moved to Albany from Los Angeles, and it was like moving into a Mafia movie.
 
2009-11-18 07:55:14 AM  
If the corruption were ranked on dollar amount alone, the United States should be much higher up on that list, as in the top three.

How much bailout money was given to banks just this last year that is still unaccounted for? When was the last time the Federal Reserve (a private group of bankers) was audited, and why is it being given more power?
 
2009-11-18 07:56:25 AM  
Mr. Right: Over 40 posts and nobody has pointed out that the list was compiled by a couple of NGOs? The report is based on perceptions of purely subjective criteria. Are we to take this seriously? Seriously?

I suppose it is like most news these days. Take a poll of what people are feeling and report it as news.


You have an objective metric for determining rate of corruption?
 
2009-11-18 08:00:08 AM  
Nogale: I can't for the life of me figure out whether the move "up" is a positive or a negative thing.

FTA:
At the top of the list stands New Zealand, with a CPI score of 9.4, and at the bottom lies Somalia, with a score of 1.1.

You must have some genetic defect that prevents you from reading in context.
 
2009-11-18 08:16:33 AM  
If this was taken aearra: Interesting. Apparently Canada is well ahead of the US in more than health care.

Canada's score would have probable been a lot lower if this was taken in the 1980s when Brian Mulroney was our PM.

Everybody just KNEW the SOB was "on the take"; I mean he just LOOKED so slimy with his mannerisms and what appeared to be "back-room deals" with lobbyists.

The Canadian government has since wasted untold taxes trying to pin something on him but the guy is just sooo slippery nothing sticks.

Well that, and he got elected TWICE (just like other scum like Tony Blair and Dubya). People are idiots.
 
2009-11-18 08:17:45 AM  
Israel, the greatest country that Yahweh has ever given Jews on the face of the earth.
 
2009-11-18 08:26:10 AM  
Mr. Right: gund: Mr. Right: Over 40 posts and nobody has pointed out that the list was compiled by a couple of NGOs? The report is based on perceptions of purely subjective criteria. Are we to take this seriously? Seriously?

I suppose it is like most news these days. Take a poll of what people are feeling and report it as news.

Taking polls of what people feel about something makes the news all the time...

Most news articles have a quote or two of a person's feelings to whatever the article is talking about.

/facepalm

You're really going to defend opinion polls as news? I thought news was supposed to be objective reporting of the facts. This group made up criteria, didn't tell us how they arrived at them, applied them in an unsubstantiated manner and then passed this off as received wisdom that some countries are more corrupt.

Do you understand the difference between objective news and subjective opinion?


Do you understand the difference between objective news and news?

Actually, do you understand there is no such thing as objective news?

Finally, the existence of a difference neither supports or denies the eligibility of subjective opinion as news.

Are you really so dense as to be unable to comprehend how opinion polls are relevant to social, economic, or political decision making? Or that they may just be interesting to some news readers, thus justifying placing in a news article.
 
2009-11-18 08:30:05 AM  
Mr. Right: Over 40 posts and nobody has pointed out that the list was compiled by a couple of NGOs? The report is based on perceptions of purely subjective criteria. Are we to take this seriously? Seriously?

If it matches what we want to believe, not only will we take it seriously, but we will ram it down everyone's throats at every single opportunity.

/welcome to the new dark age
//same as the last dark age, but with nukes
 
2009-11-18 08:49:08 AM  
The Irish are at 14? Good, they're not bowl eligible.

/join a conference, nancies
 
2009-11-18 08:51:48 AM  
The Jerusalem Post has an "Iranian Threat" section?

I wonder what people would think of a newspaper that had a "Jew Threat" section.
 
2009-11-18 08:55:56 AM  
Hilary T. N. Seuss: ravenspore: How can Hong Kong be so far away from China on that list. i thought Britain gave it back?

One country, two systems. Well, actually three systems if you count Macau, but nobody ever does.


Macau is known for Gambling, Prostitution, and Drugs. Guess where it would rank.

It used to be known for cheap textiles as well but that has moved to the mainland.
 
2009-11-18 08:57:23 AM  
rabidferret: You must have some genetic defect that prevents you from reading in context.

Yeah, but usually "top of the [corruption] list" would mean "most corrupt", here #1 means "least corrupt" in spite of the list being called a "Corruption List". This list doesn't rank countries by perceived corruption, it ranks by lack of perceived corruption.

That's like making a list entitled "Fattest People I Know" and putting the thinnest person at #1.
 
2009-11-18 09:01:57 AM  
Wow, 32nd? That's really worthy of a greenlight. It's not like FARK would shamelessly spam itself with Sarah Palin, Israel, and birther threads to make an easy buck off the ensuing flame wars.
 
2009-11-18 09:23:47 AM  
USA at 19th?

The list is corrupt!
 
2009-11-18 09:37:22 AM  
I swear to god if Finland sneaks into the title game and sh*ts the bed again this year I'm gonna drink paint thinner.
 
2009-11-18 09:51:38 AM  
Nogale: OK - full disclosure time. Until September, I worked for this newspaper. I know both the author and the contributing author. And I can't for the life of me figure out whether the move "up" is a positive or a negative thing.

Nor is it at all clear from the article whether being "ahead" of Egypt and Somalia means we're purportedly more or less corrupt than they are.


Yeah, the article is pretty badly written. Really the way I finally figured out that the list has clean countries on top and the corrupt ones on the BOTTOM (so this isn't a slight on Europe, eas81) is that SOMALIA is on the bottom.

/wonders where Illinois would be if it were a country
 
2009-11-18 09:58:49 AM  
mrexcess: I have a working hypothesis. You want to know how corrupt a society is? Just look at the way people drive there. Basic stuff: do drivers stay in their lane and signal changes, obey traffic signals and signs, carefully watch for pedestrians, generally do things in an orderly way? Or is it barely-controlled chaos where the more daring has the right of way? If it's like that on the roads then it's probably like that elsewhere, and visa versa.

Dunno about driving but I've heard that the general culture in Israel is pretty blunt and pushy, you have to to get what you want done. But everyone expects it, so it's normal.

Never been there myself (though I'd like to visit), but hearing lots of stories from New Yorkers who moved there and found the pushiness a bit of culture shock to get used to, for THEM, kinda says something :)

I heard a different report of this list on the radio (NPR) and what I found interesting is that Afghanistan is so corrupt, on that list. All the election scandals of this past year, Karzai pretty much being laughed at as merely the "mayor of Kabul" and all of it, I can see where it comes from but considering all the effort to put in that government, kinda sobering news.
 
2009-11-18 10:03:47 AM  
This whole list is ridiculous. Its the perceived corruption of the government by its population, not by the actual corruption levels. This leads the truly corrupt states run by dictators to be ranked lower simply because of the fear of repercussions in the populace of speaking their minds. Whereas in other nations they can claim their government is corrupt freely and will often do so without regard for if that statement is truthful. Clearly we need to implement a playoff system and take this public perceptions out of it.
 
2009-11-18 10:05:02 AM  
Anyone have a list of the degree of corruption amongst listmakers?
 
2009-11-18 10:06:41 AM  
itazurakko: mrexcess: I have a working hypothesis. You want to know how corrupt a society is? Just look at the way people drive there. Basic stuff: do drivers stay in their lane and signal changes, obey traffic signals and signs, carefully watch for pedestrians, generally do things in an orderly way? Or is it barely-controlled chaos where the more daring has the right of way? If it's like that on the roads then it's probably like that elsewhere, and visa versa.

Dunno about driving but I've heard that the general culture in Israel is pretty blunt and pushy, you have to to get what you want done. But everyone expects it, so it's normal.

Never been there myself (though I'd like to visit), but hearing lots of stories from New Yorkers who moved there and found the pushiness a bit of culture shock to get used to, for THEM, kinda says something :)


Come visit. I'll give you a tour!
 
2009-11-18 10:42:09 AM  
jimbodahobo: This whole list is ridiculous. Its the perceived corruption of the government by its population, not by the actual corruption levels. This leads the truly corrupt states run by dictators to be ranked lower simply because of the fear of repercussions in the populace of speaking their minds. Whereas in other nations they can claim their government is corrupt freely and will often do so without regard for if that statement is truthful. Clearly we need to implement a playoff system and take this public perceptions out of it.

Nice BCS reference

This also helps explain the whole Iran thing. They may not be all that structurally corrupt, but they're illegitimate in the eyes of a huge portion of their population, so they're going to get slapped with the corrupt label
 
2009-11-18 10:43:11 AM  
I can compare Israel to the University Notre Dame and their Fighting Irish football team. Jesus went to both of those places.

Now for the United States, I can compare it to The Ohio State University and Great Britain the University of Michigan.
 
2009-11-18 10:58:02 AM  
unyon: I thought it was interesting that Iran was hanging around with Haiti near the bottom of that list, and in fact may be the lowest-ranking country that doesn't have significant civil strife at the moment.

Any Persian farkers wanna chuck in their two cents on the matter? Is the ranking justified? If so, what is it about the culture, power structures, or environment that makes that so?


Where you in a cave this summer? Iran is undergoing a huge military crackdown over fraudulent elections.
 
2009-11-18 11:01:36 AM  
Rik01: Well, I guess this proves it. Every political body human being is corrupt.



ftfy

/Original Sin
//giggity
 
2009-11-18 11:03:54 AM  
Who gives a rat's ass about some country in the middle of the list? Talk about what makes New Zealand good or Somalia horrible.
 
2009-11-18 11:57:19 AM  
Jim_Callahan:

They're not war-mongering, they haven't started a single war yet.

I can think of three wars they started, one very recently too.

Are you that ignorant, or am I being trolled?
 
2009-11-18 12:22:29 PM  
Well in the Gorgor Tribune I'm better than Antarctica.
Farking penguins with their corrupt beady eyes.
 
2009-11-18 12:50:57 PM  
spawn73: I can think of three wars they started, one very recently too.

Are you that ignorant, or am I being trolled?


I think it's more along the lines of a disagreement of what constitutes an act of war, and what doesn't. Callahan seems to think that shooting missiles at another country and armed invasion are acts of war, while you seem to think these are only considered acts of war when Israel or the US does them.
 
2009-11-18 12:55:48 PM  
Tatterdemalian: spawn73: I can think of three wars they started, one very recently too.

Are you that ignorant, or am I being trolled?

I think it's more along the lines of a disagreement of what constitutes an act of war, and what doesn't.


True.
When the Chosen People slaughter every man, woman and child it's because God commanded it.
When Hitler does it, they call it genocide.
 
2009-11-18 01:01:22 PM  
gorgor: True.
When the Chosen People slaughter every man, woman and child it's because God commanded it.
When Hitler does it, they call it genocide.


gorgor not only making sense, but making two posts in a single thread without some NSFL pic? These really are the End Times.
 
2009-11-18 01:22:22 PM  
deadsanta: Top 20 list (out of 180)
<SNIP>


3 Singapore
3 (tie) Sweden


Somehoe the image of tying a Sweedish girl and a Singaporean girl with the intent of corrupting them has a great appeal.
 
2009-11-18 01:26:43 PM  
Tatterdemalian: These really are the End Times.

NEIN!
http://tinyurl.com/ygp5fnn
(copy and paste, NSFW)
 
2009-11-18 01:32:21 PM  
www.inquisitr.com
 
2009-11-18 02:22:52 PM  
Why is this greenlit?

There are probably loads of countries with media that published some article on how their country did in the CPI rankings. There's nothing particularly interesting in the article to the general public.

Upcoming greenlight:
"Israeli man gets up, eats breakfast, goes to work!"
 
2009-11-18 05:15:03 PM  
Fortunately, the list makers accepted bribes to drop names down the list for the right price.
 
2009-11-18 11:07:44 PM  
Wendy's Chili: Threat

That would be because the president of Iran has repeatedly called for the destruction of the state of Israel. In other words, he threatened Israel. A lot. You following my thought process here kiddo?
 
2009-11-19 04:05:08 AM  
gorgor: When the Chosen People slaughter every man, woman and child it's because God commanded it.
When Hitler does it, they call it genocide.


When exactly did "the chosen people" slaughtered every man, woman and child ?
 
2009-11-19 10:10:40 AM  
TappingTheVein: When exactly did "the chosen people" slaughtered every man, woman and child ?

I'm guessing he's referring to the Dark Ages, probably the battle where Amaury famously gave the order "Slay them all! God will know his own."
 
2009-11-19 03:01:11 PM  
TappingTheVein: gorgor: When the Chosen People slaughter every man, woman and child it's because God commanded it.
When Hitler does it, they call it genocide.

When exactly did "the chosen people" slaughtered every man, woman and child ?


Ever read the Old Testament?
Moses was a dick.
 
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