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(Cleveland Plain Dealer)   Cleveland RB Josh Cribbs ends game with possible concussion when Browns fail to score 17 points on last-second hook-and-ladder play   (cleveland.com) divider line 120
    More: Stupid, Josh Cribbs, Browns, Cleveland, Ravens, concussions, Brady Quinn, Eric Mangini, offensive lineman  
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1871 clicks; posted to Sports » on 17 Nov 2009 at 8:27 AM (5 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



120 Comments   (+0 »)
   

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2009-11-17 07:47:50 AM  
What imbecile would call a hook-and-ladder play at the end of a game when you're down by 16 points??? Oh, yeah... Eric Mangenius.
 
2009-11-17 08:26:37 AM  
The ending of the game last night was one of the more pathetic things I've seen in a while. Down 16, 2 hail mary's go out of bounds and then you run a hook and ladder? What the hell?
 
2009-11-17 08:33:29 AM  
Should they have run 3 fullback dives instead, subquitter?

Obviously they knew they couldn't win. They were trying to maintain a little dignity. Being the Browns, of course, they failed miserably
 
2009-11-17 08:33:49 AM  
Good thing Pryce and Price both agree that it was stupid.
 
2009-11-17 08:36:57 AM  
How is this news?
 
2009-11-17 08:38:49 AM  
static.nfl.com
 
2009-11-17 08:41:56 AM  
sckonkh: How is this news?

img.fark.net
 
2009-11-17 08:42:17 AM  
Firing Mangini will not take care of the actual problem: Lerner. At this point the team needs to be sold to someone who would do right by the Browns. Only someone looking for a way to break into the coaching ranks would take a job under Lerner. Same thing for the Raiders.
 
2009-11-17 08:44:49 AM  
You know the game is bad when ESPN didn't even have it up on their main page at midnight...NCAA basketball was the top story and the MNF info was found only on the NFL tab.

\Quinn showed remarkable courage though in making the Browns look even more inept than usual.
 
2009-11-17 08:45:54 AM  
I used to like the old Browns.. and I hate the Ravens and these Browns need to just go away.

I did some quick math and if you separate the old browns and new browns as 2 teams, the old browns would have the best winning pct in NFL history and the old would be the worst.. of the current teams.
 
2009-11-17 08:57:01 AM  
The Bill Belichick coaching tree bears rotten fruit.
 
2009-11-17 09:06:34 AM  
skinink: Only someone looking for a way to break into the coaching ranks would take a job under Lerner.

I hear there's a coach at Notre Dame who may be interested.
 
2009-11-17 09:09:49 AM  
It doesn't matter who QBs the Browns, if they don't fix the O-Line, they won't be effective.

That being said, Quinn was not good last night.
 
2009-11-17 09:10:50 AM  
germ78: The Bill Belichick coaching tree bears rotten fruit.

I don't know if it's because we're seeing teams hire so many former Belichick assistants at head coach that it seems like they're failing at a higher rate than other hires, but it damn sure looks like Bill isn't exactly preparing anyone for success outside of him.
 
2009-11-17 09:12:34 AM  
germ78: The Bill Belichick coaching tree bears rotten fruit.

Well, someone did try to prune the branches back a bit, but unfortunately, all they got were the sleeves on his hoodie.
 
2009-11-17 09:14:07 AM  
Let's go Flacco!

/oh yeah!!!!
 
2009-11-17 09:20:19 AM  
It gets even better!

As it turns out, the Stanford-band play that ended Monday night's game with Browns receiver Josh Cribbs being carted off the field should have never happened.

Not just because the play shouldn't have been called, but because the Browns never should have been in position to call the play. In fact, the Browns never should have gotten the ball back at the end of the game.

The Browns never should have gotten the ball back because they took -- and were awarded -- a fourth time out during the second half.

A league source tipped us off to the glitch, and we've gone back and confirmed it via DVR and the official play-by-play at NFL.com.

Cleveland took an initial time out with 3:24 to play in the third quarter. The Browns took their second time out with 3:35 to play in the game. And the third time out was used with 3:29 to go.

So when the Ravens had a first down at the Cleveland 39 with two minutes to play, Baltimore should have been able to kill the remaining time with only three snaps (barring an incomplete pass or a run out of bounds).

But the Browns called time out again after the first play following the two-minute warning. As a result, the Ravens turned the ball over on downs with 20 seconds to play, giving the Browns a chance to run three more plays -- including the one that sent Cribbs to the hospital.
 
2009-11-17 09:27:27 AM  
HaywoodJablonski: Should they have run 3 fullback dives instead, subquitter?

Obviously they knew they couldn't win. They were trying to maintain a little dignity. Being the Browns, of course, they failed miserably


Running a hook-and-ladder play doe not preserve dignity. It gets you on SportsCenter with Chris Berman making fun of you going "WHOOP! WHOOP!" every time you lateral the ball and it gets you on the the NFL Football Follies video.

It's only dignified if a) you have a chance to win, and b) you win.
 
2009-11-17 09:29:58 AM  
HaywoodJablonski: Should they have run 3 fullback dives instead, subquitter?

Given the score and the clock, yes. You make the call that minimizes your chance of injury, and thus maximizes your chance of winning next week. Next question?
 
2009-11-17 09:30:09 AM  
Are you trying to say the officials blew yet another thing during a game? Say it isn't so. ;)
 
2009-11-17 09:32:43 AM  
Larry Mahnken: It gets even better!

As it turns out, the Stanford-band play that ended Monday night's game with Browns receiver Josh Cribbs being carted off the field should have never happened.

Not just because the play shouldn't have been called, but because the Browns never should have been in position to call the play. In fact, the Browns never should have gotten the ball back at the end of the game.

The Browns never should have gotten the ball back because they took -- and were awarded -- a fourth time out during the second half.

A league source tipped us off to the glitch, and we've gone back and confirmed it via DVR and the official play-by-play at NFL.com.

Cleveland took an initial time out with 3:24 to play in the third quarter. The Browns took their second time out with 3:35 to play in the game. And the third time out was used with 3:29 to go.

So when the Ravens had a first down at the Cleveland 39 with two minutes to play, Baltimore should have been able to kill the remaining time with only three snaps (barring an incomplete pass or a run out of bounds).

But the Browns called time out again after the first play following the two-minute warning. As a result, the Ravens turned the ball over on downs with 20 seconds to play, giving the Browns a chance to run three more plays -- including the one that sent Cribbs to the hospital.


I see some NFL.com shenanigans with the box score (new window) now:

# Baltimore Ravens at 03:45
# 1-10-BAL 39 (3:45) 27-R.Rice right guard to BLT 40 for 1 yard (90-K.Coleman).
# Timeout #2 by CLV at 03:35.
# 2-9-BAL 40 (3:35) 27-R.Rice right guard to BLT 45 for 5 yards (90-K.Coleman).
# Timeout #3 by CLV at 03:29.
# 3-4-BAL 45 (3:29) (Shotgun) 27-R.Rice left guard to CLV 49 for 6 yards (58-M.Benard).
# 1-10-CLE 49 (2:51) 23-W.McGahee left guard to CLV 45 for 4 yards (71-A.Rubin).
# 2-6-CLE 45 (2:12) 23-W.McGahee right guard to CLV 39 for 6 yards (90-K.Coleman, 56-K.Maiava).
# Two-Minute Warning
# 1-10-CLE 39 (2:00) 23-W.McGahee right guard to CLV 37 for 2 yards (96-D.Bowens).
# 2-8-CLE 37 (1:55) 23-W.McGahee right guard to CLV 35 for 2 yards (56-K.Maiava).
# 3-6-CLE 35 (1:12) 23-W.McGahee left tackle to CLV 37 for -2 yards (93-J.Trusnik).
# 4-8-CLE 37 (:26) 23-W.McGahee left guard to CLV 35 for 2 yards (21-B.Pool).
 
2009-11-17 09:34:00 AM  
skinink: Firing Mangini will not take care of the actual problem: Lerner

*DING*

This team hasn't won a sausage since the Lerners have been in charge.

Baltimore (which were the Cleveland Browns) won a Superbowl 4 years after leaving town.

Having lived in Ohio my whole life I've seen the progression:

"Let's get to the Superbowl!"
"Let's get to the playoffs!"
"Can we have a winning season?"
"Please, at least be above .500"
"Oh, god, don't embarrass us"
"The Browns are still playing? Who knew? What channel are the Cavs on?"
 
2009-11-17 09:39:39 AM  
PowerSlacker: I see some NFL.com shenanigans with the box score (new window) now

The software might be smarter than the refs there-- I bet if you try to input a fourth timeout you get an error message.
 
2009-11-17 09:47:25 AM  
1st and 10: Screen pass
2nd and 10: Screen pass
3rd and 8: 3 yrd pass over the middle to Lewis

hmmm, that didn't work, let's try this instead

1st and 10: Screen pass
2nd and 10: Screen pass
3rd and 10: Screen pass

hmmm, that didn't work, let's try this instead

1st and 10: Screen pass
2nd and 15: run up the middle
3rd and 18: Screen pass

Dammit, what the hell are we doing wrong?

/I know many of those quick passes to the flat weren't designed screens
 
2009-11-17 09:47:58 AM  
skinink:

Firing Mangini will not take care of the actual problem: Lerner.

i.dailymail.co.uk


/ THIS.
// Randy is wearing his true colors here :(
 
2009-11-17 09:49:36 AM  
This is pretty sucky for the Browns. As a Ravens fan there were a few guys on that team I wouldn't mind picking up and Cribbs was one of them.

Browns also have a really nice cover CB I wouldnt mind having since the Ravens secondary is relatively crap.

Also should point out, a Raven left the game on the first play, so it makes sense a Brown would leave on the last.

/Haruki Nakamura
 
2009-11-17 09:50:38 AM  
... and the crying shame is that this injury came to the only guy that looked like he ws even trying on offense.

/Hook and Ladder is a fire truck
//Hook and Lateral is a football play.
///Pet Peeve.
 
2009-11-17 09:51:44 AM  
After the 10 men on the field for the first Baltimore TD,

Then the pathetic play calling after a bye week,

Then the stupid hook and ladder play,

It's time for Mangini to go. Today. Don't wait.

Sorry, I tried to avoid this conclusion as long as possible.
 
2009-11-17 09:53:48 AM  
Oh, and Randy needs to make one hire.

VP for Football Operations. Let him hire the GM and THEN the coach.

Hands off Randy. We want your money, we want you to hold up the trophy when we finally win. But you're not an American Football guy. You're not Jerry Jones.

You're not your dad.
 
2009-11-17 09:56:47 AM  
Kygz: /Hook and Ladder is a fire truck
//Hook and Lateral is a football play.
///Pet Peeve.



No, a Hook and Ladder is more of a shuffle pass.
 
2009-11-17 09:59:27 AM  
Browns off season checklist:
1. Fire Mangini
2. Use good draft slot to get Clausen
3. Hire Herm Edwards as the savior
4. Continued FAIL
 
2009-11-17 10:05:02 AM  
What were the Browns doing on MNF anyway???
 
2009-11-17 10:08:58 AM  
Cool story bro time:

There was a game about, I wanna say 6-8 years ago. Pretty sure it was a Fins v Browns Sunday night game. Most terrible and depressing game I've ever watched.

The game last night was worse. The injury to Cribbs at the end was what made the icing on the cake.

I love the criticisms of Quinn's throwing style when:

A:) The O Line falls apart on a three man rush
B:) They got rid of all of their best receivers.

Can anyone who is a non Browns fan even NAME their next starting receiver without looking it up? I can't, and I spend entirely too much time reading about football.
 
2009-11-17 10:10:39 AM  
chimp_ninja: PowerSlacker: I see some NFL.com shenanigans with the box score (new window) now

The software might be smarter than the refs there-- I bet if you try to input a fourth timeout you get an error message.


Possibly. I work for MLBAM, inputting the pitch-by-pitch play-by-play data for MLB.com's Gameday, and the system doesn't allow five balls, four strikes, or a strikeout on two pitches or a walk on three pitches.
 
2009-11-17 10:11:51 AM  
InferiousX: Cool story bro time:

There was a game about, I wanna say 6-8 years ago. Pretty sure it was a Fins v Browns Sunday night game. Most terrible and depressing game I've ever watched.


I'm pretty sure you're talking about the Steelers-Dolphins game from Miami's 1-15 season that was played in the rain.
 
2009-11-17 10:13:54 AM  
InferiousX: Can anyone who is a non Browns fan even NAME their next starting receiver without looking it up? I can't, and I spend entirely too much time reading about football.

Dawan Landry
 
2009-11-17 10:17:39 AM  
InferiousX

Furrey and Massaquai sp?
 
2009-11-17 10:18:43 AM  
1. Mangini should probably go, but Lerner and the O-coordinator need to go before him. Even if it's holding the door while they all go, they need to go first.

2. Quinn is just horrible. His entire list of qualifications seem to be "from Ohio" and "grew up a Browns fan." If that's all it takes, hell, I could take snaps, hand to Jamal and throw wild ugly incompletions.

3. Even if 1 and 2 get resolved, that still leaves us with a shaky O line and no real threats/weapons. Yet still, somewhere, Jeff Garcia and Marvin Harrison are jobless.
 
2009-11-17 10:18:51 AM  
I Said: Dawan Landry

For you (new window)
Larry Mahnken: InferiousX: Cool story bro time:

There was a game about, I wanna say 6-8 years ago. Pretty sure it was a Fins v Browns Sunday night game. Most terrible and depressing game I've ever watched.

I'm pretty sure you're talking about the Steelers-Dolphins game from Miami's 1-15 season that was played in the rain.


That was pretty bad too. I'm thinking of a game that was played sometime around when the Patriots were within the first few years of being good again.

All I remember for sure, is that it was scoreless for like 3 quarters, finally someone got within FG range, kicks the ball, hits the top of the upright and makes a huge *GONG* sound followed by a huge outburst of laughter from the crowd.
 
2009-11-17 10:21:33 AM  
Farkin A: InferiousX

Furrey and Massaquai sp?


Furrey, that's right. I remember seeing him last night and being like "He's on the Browns now?" I had no clue.

Man that guy left the Lions and was probably like "Man, ANYTHING'S better than Detroit."

How sadly wrong he was proven.
 
2009-11-17 10:25:34 AM  
HaywoodJablonski: Should they have run 3 fullback dives instead, subquitter?

Yes.

HaywoodJablonski: Obviously they knew they couldn't win.

Hey, you answered your own question. Cool.
 
2009-11-17 10:26:54 AM  
Furrey has shown flashes of competence. Massaquoi has probably been the most consistent target. Robiskie hasn't done anything, from preseason forward, but they're both rookies. Stuckey hasn't done anything notable. Then at tight end, Heiden is good but getting old, Royal is a grinder whose "career year" was in 2007 with Buffalo...25 catches for 248 yards and three touchdowns.
 
2009-11-17 10:27:59 AM  
Oh and previous to this game, I was a defender of Quinn. I don't know if I can do that anymore.

The big thing for me, is that when he finally unleashes the DARGON in garbage time play, he couldn't even land the ball in bounds. That's some Jamarcus levels of fail right there.
 
2009-11-17 10:28:29 AM  
We have 11 draft picks next year. I say load up on O-linemen and receivers, and then try to find a veteran free-agent quarterback.
 
2009-11-17 10:39:57 AM  
Dreadstar: We have 11 draft picks next year. I say load up on O-linemen and receivers, and then try to find a veteran free-agent quarterback.

That would be the smart move. It's hard to evaluate a QB on a bad team. When you surround him in crap he's going to smell like crap. You need a good line to see if he can get through his read progressions in a timely manner. Is he getting sacked and checking down too much or is not getting enough time? Is he inaccurate or doesn't he have a pocket to step into? You need good receivers to ensure that they are where they are supposed to be. Without good receivers you can't guage the QBs accuracy. Is Quinn throwing badly or are the receivers missing the spot? How about the play calling and play design? Are you sending your receivers into the same space so they are too easily covered? Does the defense know what play you are running before you do? These are all things that make me wary of calling QBs on bad teams busts. All too often you get situations where guys leave a bad team and go to a good team and become the next Drew Breesus.
 
2009-11-17 10:43:08 AM  
InferiousX: Oh and previous to this game, I was a defender of Quinn. I don't know if I can do that anymore.

The big thing for me, is that when he finally unleashes the DARGON in garbage time play, he couldn't even land the ball in bounds. That's some Jamarcus levels of fail right there.


This is the first time I've seen my Brownies play this year, and OMG is he horrible. I kept asking, "Why the happy feet? Why is he just blindly launching the ball to the line of scrimmage as quickly as he possibly can, even when there's no pressure on him?"

And then, in garbage time, he unleashed the dragon. To the trainer. Multiple times.

The defense was actually not too bad, but that offense is a sandwich of suck.
 
2009-11-17 10:43:13 AM  
Lateral (new window)
 
2009-11-17 10:43:41 AM  
astrnomr: What imbecile would call a hook-and-ladder play at the end of a game when you're down by 16 points??? Oh, yeah... Eric Mangenius.

For that game, it was almost worth it. The Browns weren't trying to win - they just wanted to score some points.

The Ravens played terribly in the first half of the game, and yet they still beat the Browns 16-0. It was a travesty to watch.
 
2009-11-17 10:43:50 AM  
10 men on the field points to the real problem, the coaching staff's complete inability to comprehend and react to the game in front of them. I can't imagine their weekly game planning is any more solid.
 
2009-11-17 10:44:46 AM  
You just cannot criticize Quinn for last night. He did much better than DA for starters. Also, if you actually watched the game, he was able to get back in the pocket and set his feet maybe four plays the entire game. As the announcers said: "It wouldn't matter if it was Peyton Manning or Tom Brady playing QB, behind that offensive line they're going to stink".
 
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