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(Fox News)   Remember that boy who fled chemotherapy due to his religious beliefs? He's now free of cancer. Thank God. Or modern medicine, in this case   (foxnews.com) divider line 245
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23189 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Nov 2009 at 5:05 PM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2009-11-08 07:41:52 PM  
That Darned Commie: I'm still kind of surprised he wasn't taken away from his parents

/Or was he?
//Too lazy to check


Many/most states have some kind of pesky clause in the child-welfare and abuse laws that partially exempt parents who refuse medical treatment in favor of prayer or religious treatment. Not totally, obviously, but they're not as harsh as they are with parents who beat or starve their kids.
 
2009-11-08 07:42:30 PM  
HMS_Blinkin: Manny Calavera: jeblis: [citation needed]

The key history of religious traditions becoming more "scientific" and less "superstitious", though focused in the late Middle Ages and into the early Renaissance, is David Thomas' Religion and the Decline of Magic. A long book, but fascinating as regards popular practice, witchcraft, Church attitudes, and so on.

/historian

I have that book on my bookshelf, and it's by Keith Thomas.


Well, damn. I was going by memory, and it's been quite some time since I read it. But it's an important work and that mistake is all the more awkward with a confident "/historian" attached.

At least an honest mistake is proof that I didn't Google it!

Kirkenhegelstein:
I'm not a historian per se, but I find that whole era right around and after Aquinas fascinating: the fall of monasticism, the rise of the city as a meaningful political entity, secularization of political authority, the shift from a quasi-Platonic philosophical preoccupation to an Aristotelian system, and so on. All of these seem to be necessary precursors to the Renaissance, but I'm willing to be agnostic that any one thing was *the* cause of the Renaissance as long as a multi-factorial reason is asserted.

Agreed completely. I think it's the complexity of transition in thought, with its shift through cultural layers, and the complexity of religious thought itself (which is often focused on secular matters as it is otherwise) which is what makes a polar relationship between "religion" and "science", as eternal arch-rivals, so implausible.

And yes, I couldn't resist logging in for one last look.
 
2009-11-08 07:43:42 PM  
samardzic77: IKillBugs: Im_Gumby: Rumpleforskin: I don't think he did nothing what he done. C'mon, someones rolling back ball on him, something.

WTF is this supposed to mean?

It was an actual quote from another story earlier this week.

I thought that quote sounded familiar. What story was that?


Pricipal . Caught sayof burglarizing woman's apartment. Is He dead or not. CNN Says yes. St. Pete Times Looking for chads -OR- "hello, I am write single to salute and wearing leather pants"
 
2009-11-08 07:44:53 PM  
cynicalbastard:

Ah, the good old days. And people say reactionaries are addicted to a fantastical dream. . . .

.
 
2009-11-08 07:45:18 PM  
PCFX: Yay, my first greenlight!

congrats, and +1 intertubes for your headline.
 
2009-11-08 07:46:19 PM  
Having gone through hard-core chemo and radiation I'd have to say, G-d or no G-d, I'd run like hell too. Chemo sucks. Radiation sucks. Having cancer sucks and sometimes you start to wonder if dying would suck less than having cancer. I'm coming up on 2 years post treatment and all's well so far but if I had to do it again knowing what I know now I'd have a hard time justifying it to myself. I'd *do* it because my boy needs a father but I'd have to force myself.
 
2009-11-08 07:52:31 PM  
Bootsy: Having gone through hard-core chemo and radiation I'd have to say, G-d or no G-d, I'd run like hell too. Chemo sucks. Radiation sucks. Having cancer sucks and sometimes you start to wonder if dying would suck less than having cancer. I'm coming up on 2 years post treatment and all's well so far but if I had to do it again knowing what I know now I'd have a hard time justifying it to myself. I'd *do* it because my boy needs a father but I'd have to force myself.

Just kill yourself already if you detest life so much.

Would be better for your kid than having a father who resents him so much.
 
2009-11-08 07:57:05 PM  
thesegoto11.files.wordpress.com

Maybe Satan just wanted him to live a little longer so he could screw up again and prove that he didn't belong in heaven.

/hot
 
2009-11-08 08:00:06 PM  
Bootsy: Having gone through hard-core chemo and radiation I'd have to say, G-d or no G-d, I'd run like hell too. Chemo sucks. Radiation sucks. Having cancer sucks and sometimes you start to wonder if dying would suck less than having cancer. I'm coming up on 2 years post treatment and all's well so far but if I had to do it again knowing what I know now I'd have a hard time justifying it to myself. I'd *do* it because my boy needs a father but I'd have to force myself.

+1 for brutal honesty.

Kierkegaard's Pseudonym: Bootsy: Having gone through hard-core chemo and radiation I'd have to say, G-d or no G-d, I'd run like hell too. Chemo sucks. Radiation sucks. Having cancer sucks and sometimes you start to wonder if dying would suck less than having cancer. I'm coming up on 2 years post treatment and all's well so far but if I had to do it again knowing what I know now I'd have a hard time justifying it to myself. I'd *do* it because my boy needs a father but I'd have to force myself.

Just kill yourself already if you detest life so much.

Would be better for your kid than having a father who resents him so much.


Go farkin fark yourself s^&thead trool douchebag.
 
2009-11-08 08:00:21 PM  
JimmyCarter'sSecondTerm: As Obama forces everybody to buy healthcare at gunpoint, I have a feeling that we will see more and more of this. Who is to say when or when not to go to the doctor? Obviously the answer is Obama and Nancy Pelosi now.

Wow - Just... Wow.

You do know the bill basically just says you're required to buy medical insurance, no different than the requirement to buy auto insurance?

You can have the insurance and decide to not go to the doc if you want but that's your call.

It's like comparing forcing people to pay for car damages 'at gunpoint.'

/ BTW, at what point did guns get into play here, o nutjobby one?
 
2009-11-08 08:01:23 PM  
Somaticasual: Why is it so hard to reconcile science and religion? If god's in charge, god gave us medicine and the technology to sustain life. If not, natural innovation did.

Winner! It's like the idiotic debate over evolution. Why is it so hard to think that maybe the reason the way things work in the physical world is because God set it up that way? This way, you can believe in a higher power and still yearn to learn how that higher power operates.
 
2009-11-08 08:15:07 PM  
beakerscorner: Why is it so hard to think that maybe the reason the way things work in the physical world is because God set it up that way? This way, you can believe in a higher power and still yearn to learn how that higher power operates.

Because if God is the way that he's most usually described, setting up a 14 billion year long science experiment seems a bit redundant.
 
2009-11-08 08:15:13 PM  
CrispFlows: Wow - Just... Wow.

You do know the bill basically just says you're required to buy medical insurance, no different than the requirement to buy auto insurance?


That is, on of the most unintelligent statements I've ever seen, even for one of these Fark threads. That's on par with the idiocy you see in YouTube comments.

States require you to carry automotive liability insurance in the event that you injure someone else or damage their property. For the privilege of driving on public roads, you make the concession to carry that insurance.

Living, breathing and living your life is not a privilege. You have an inalienable right to your life. The two have nothing in common. Moreover, government has no business dictating "self protection" and there is no justification for the government forcing me (or you) at gunpoint to have insurance. Add to this the atrocity of using the IRS as the enforcement mechanism for this - and we've got insult on top of injury.
 
2009-11-08 08:22:03 PM  
You know, as if religion itself isn't bad enough, these morans make up more weird shiat and add it on. Nowhere in the Bible, the Torahs, the Qu'ran, the Bahavad Ghita - nowhere in any of the holy writings of any of the majors does it say hardly any of the crap that your common religious loon comes up with.
What's the MATTER with these people?!?!?
 
2009-11-08 08:26:58 PM  
louiedog: Ghastly: louiedog:


That requires much more power. The jump would have brought the DEA into our basement in a week looking for a grow operation. Dad always said he would have loved to see their faces when they saw the true threat society should be dealing with. He then laughed maniacally. I didn't inherit the laugh, so it doesn't have the same effect when I repeat it.

You jest, but my Grandfather worked on the first lasers, my dad hacked traffic light controllers to play show tunes, one Uncle was in nuclear demolition, another designs nuclear weapons, my brother sells the Army missiles, and I blow up Naval ships for a living.

The maniacal laugh is a family tradition that is passed on from one generation to another. The key is to remember that it's not all in the throat. A good evil laugh starts at the diaphragm, and reverberates through the tip of your nose...

 
2009-11-08 08:28:11 PM  
jso2897: You know, as if religion itself isn't bad enough, these morans make up more weird shiat and add it on. Nowhere in the Bible, the Torahs, the Qu'ran, the Bahavad Ghita - nowhere in any of the holy writings of any of the majors does it say hardly any of the crap that your common religious loon comes up with.
What's the MATTER with these people?!?!?


I guess it starts with being human...
 
2009-11-08 08:31:59 PM  
Why has God never cured an amputee, but he fixes up the cancerboys all the time? He must really hate them with their ugly stumps and all.
 
2009-11-08 08:32:27 PM  
Bootsy: Having gone through hard-core chemo and radiation I'd have to say, G-d or no G-d, I'd run like hell too. Chemo sucks. Radiation sucks. Having cancer sucks and sometimes you start to wonder if dying would suck less than having cancer. I'm coming up on 2 years post treatment and all's well so far but if I had to do it again knowing what I know now I'd have a hard time justifying it to myself. I'd *do* it because my boy needs a father but I'd have to force myself.

First you have to consider in this case the kid is 13 years old. So curing the cancer in him just gave him 60-70 years of life (Hodgkins has a very high cure success rate).

Then you have to consider the alternative, it's not like he's living a happy joyous life, he's surviving with hodgkin's disease which will slowly (or quickly) overtake him and all the problems associated.

It's not a particularly tough choice.
 
2009-11-08 08:33:10 PM  
Oddly enough, I find myself strangely absent from this thread, so I'll just leave this here and move on.

i10.photobucket.com
Everybody lighten up or the skipper gets it!
 
2009-11-08 08:33:54 PM  
Magorn:

I'm sure the boy and his parents are thrilled and this will end well.

Look, they've already brought his travel robe.
 
2009-11-08 08:43:09 PM  
If a small-time cult kills someone by filling their head with nonsense and getting them to act suicidal, investigations are started and charges are brought (e.g. the idiots who died in the sweat-lodge incident a few weeks ago).

But since this particular cult is not small, and goes by the name "Christianity", we instead elect all of our leaders from that cult and allow it to continue its rampage through society while the rest of us save what few we can with constant exercise of reason.
 
2009-11-08 08:50:44 PM  
endosymbiont: Rumpleforskin: I don't think he did nothing what he done. C'mon, someones rolling back ball on him, something.

That was all lulzy the first time I dun read it, now its gone git be a fark meme. A+


Agreed. A++, Rumpleforskin. Would read comment again.
 
2009-11-08 08:54:56 PM  
whatshisname: beakerscorner: Why is it so hard to think that maybe the reason the way things work in the physical world is because God set it up that way? This way, you can believe in a higher power and still yearn to learn how that higher power operates.

Because if God is the way that he's most usually described, setting up a 14 billion year long science experiment seems a bit redundant.


It's only 14 billion years from our current perspective of time. Time dilation makes a major difference.
 
2009-11-08 09:00:12 PM  
Bestbank Tiger: whatshisname: beakerscorner: Why is it so hard to think that maybe the reason the way things work in the physical world is because God set it up that way? This way, you can believe in a higher power and still yearn to learn how that higher power operates.

Because if God is the way that he's most usually described, setting up a 14 billion year long science experiment seems a bit redundant.

It's only 14 billion years from our current perspective of time. Time dilation makes a major difference.


Yeah, I forgot. God experiences an eon like we experience a day.
What ARE you talking about?
 
2009-11-08 09:06:45 PM  
RealFarknMcCoy2: Yeah, definitely. He actually *likes* catnip (loves it, in fact), while he's not so hot on MJ (which I gave to him by disguising it inside frozen yoghurt "drops", specially made for him - by me). :-) The MJ got him stoned, but more importantly, it took away his nausea (which every single anti-nausea medication we tried -- and we tried 'em ALL -- failed to do. And it increased his appetite, which was crucial, since he was down to skin and bones and could not even begin chemo until I got him to eat and gain some weight. So, yay marijuana! I am so grateful for it. And f*ck anyone who thinks it should remain illegal. :-)

Ah, you fed it to him?

I've never tried that, but we had a cat (since died of old age, he was a great guy though) who loved to have MJ fumes blown in his ears or for him to breathe in, and yeah, it'd get him stoned and increase his appetite. If someone was smoking, he would come up there and wait for it.

He liked regular catnip too for the usual catnipness, no sense restricting to one substance :)
 
2009-11-08 09:08:43 PM  
The headline jogged memory of a older story.
A Utah lad fled to Idaho a few years back because he didn't want chemotherapy. He didn't want to become sterilized by the radiation. The stunt involved child welfare, two Governors, major media attention and a lot of chest thumping.

It turned out in the end that the boy never actually had cancer.


Science opens many doors, however the people governing the type of science at any given time, may or may not have honorable intentions, based on their own values or a lack there of. They maybe funding or studying the science disease eradication or maybe the science of population extermination. That is a matter of politics, everyone has their own version, be they religious or not.
 
2009-11-08 09:13:20 PM  
rlv.zcache.com
 
2009-11-08 09:21:20 PM  
once again proving the adage: "on fark, nothing is obscure"

Well played.
 
2009-11-08 09:51:13 PM  
Magorn: once again proving the adage: "on fark, nothing is obscure"

Well played.


Who are you talking to? Or, I guess I should ask, To whom are you talking?
 
2009-11-08 10:07:55 PM  
I look at it this way - chemo is farking hell. No, seriously. If you have not had it (or had a close relative or friend that had it), then you need to shut the fark up about forcing it on someone, because you have absolutely no idea of what you're talking about.

I wouldn't force someone to have chemo any more than i'd force them through one of Saw's traps.
 
2009-11-08 10:31:22 PM  
While I believe in science and medical treatments, I do have a problem with any court, the State, or Federal government forcing treatment on anyone. People say things like "this is a slippery slope" and this is coated with Teflon. "You have too many kids,or you might die if you have another child , you must submit to this medical procedure so you cannot have any more children" Yea yea yea....that would never happen, there is now a legal precedent for the courts to force a medical procedure on anyone in THIS country. How very sad for us.

D
 
2009-11-08 10:39:48 PM  
Prank Call of Cthulhu: Science: 4,345,721,321
Religion: 0


Religion DEFINITELY has more kills than that.
 
2009-11-08 10:54:36 PM  
Loneagwolf: I do have a problem with any court, the State, or Federal government forcing treatment on anyone.

Even if they're a minor and their parents are insane?
 
2009-11-08 10:57:09 PM  
Fluorescent Testicle: snocone: Big Pharma is only too happy to sell you something you use every day. Now, innoculate you once in your life and never have caries, not so much.

...Seriously?

1. Even I know that innoculisation doesn't work that way.
2. Explain childhood immunisations and the near-complete wiping out of many diseases.


You mean that stuff that was done before Pharma as we now enjoy it existed? You want to include near eradication of smallpox, thank the Rotary International, not Pharma.
next
 
2009-11-08 11:41:51 PM  
snocone: You mean that stuff that was done before Pharma as we now enjoy it existed? You want to include near eradication of smallpox, thank the Rotary International, not Pharma.
next


Citation needed. Doubly so in your case, because when people start railing against "Big (industry_name)", they're usually peddling weapons-grade wharrgarbl.
 
2009-11-09 12:40:19 AM  
beakerscorner: Somaticasual: Why is it so hard to reconcile science and religion? If god's in charge, god gave us medicine and the technology to sustain life. If not, natural innovation did.

Winner! It's like the idiotic debate over evolution. Why is it so hard to think that maybe the reason the way things work in the physical world is because God set it up that way? This way, you can believe in a higher power and still yearn to learn how that higher power operates.


I always just snapped back at imbeciles like that "Hey dummy, don't you think maybe God told people they ought to become doctors?"

Anyone who thinks it was Satan's idea to have physicians is probably so far gone, we ought to just tie big rocks around their necks and sink them to the bottom of the Pacific.
 
2009-11-09 01:59:14 AM  
TsukasaK: when people start railing against "Big (industry_name)", they're usually peddling weapons-grade wharrgarbl.

Been smoking the corporate cawk, eh?
 
2009-11-09 06:42:54 AM  
www.northernsun.com
 
2009-11-09 06:46:53 AM  
 
2009-11-09 06:50:11 AM  
Loneagwolf: While I believe in science and medical treatments, I do have a problem with any court, the State, or Federal government forcing treatment on anyone. People say things like "this is a slippery slope" and this is coated with Teflon. "You have too many kids,or you might die if you have another child , you must submit to this medical procedure so you cannot have any more children" Yea yea yea....that would never happen, there is now a legal precedent for the courts to force a medical procedure on anyone in THIS country. How very sad for us.

D


The main reason they were able to do this is because he was a minor and they decided he wasn't capable of deciding to refuse life saving treatment at that age. It'd be a large jump for them to force treatment of any kind on a competent adult, and the case wouldn't do much to help them.
They have done similar things for minors for quite a while.
 
2009-11-09 07:50:42 AM  
Fengen: Do they ever do tests before chemo is finished to see if the cancer is still there?

When my dad had Pancreatic Cancer he had blood tests every tuesday before his treatment on Wednesday. Each week they would tell him how much his "T-Makers" had dropped and therefore how well his body was fighting the cancer. Started at somewhere near 850 and ended at 4.5 which is normal for a healthy person.

I don't lnow if the same could be done with this kids cancer.
 
2009-11-09 08:27:11 AM  
whatshisname: Bestbank Tiger: whatshisname: beakerscorner: Why is it so hard to think that maybe the reason the way things work in the physical world is because God set it up that way? This way, you can believe in a higher power and still yearn to learn how that higher power operates.

Because if God is the way that he's most usually described, setting up a 14 billion year long science experiment seems a bit redundant.

It's only 14 billion years from our current perspective of time. Time dilation makes a major difference.

Yeah, I forgot. God experiences an eon like we experience a day.
What ARE you talking about?


I'm talking about the theory of relativity. That's secular and scientific concept. Basically time is not a constant--factors like speed and gravity affect it.
 
2009-11-09 11:28:13 AM  
TheWizard: King Arthur Fonzarelli: Prank Call of Cthulhu: Science: 4,345,721,321
Religion: 0

I'd give Religion a few points for the same reason I'd give placebos a few points.

Might want to give Religion a bit for the whole holding together human civilization for a long enough time period for us to actually get science going in the first place.




Religion brought us the dark ages, and was fighting off science tooth and nail, the only good to come out of religion is that it shows us who the mentally weak people in the world are.
 
2009-11-09 12:12:06 PM  
Magorn: Obscure?

I'd already beat you to the reference earlier in thread.
 
2009-11-09 11:26:58 PM  
MemeSlave: fracas: What a perfect metaphor for the current health care debate. Note to Teabaggers: Liberty-denying socialist health care reform will still fix what ails ya. You're welcome.

/That should do it.

2/10
Too obvious, too soon.


/the slashy gloat was also premature
//I think they have a pill for that
 
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