Maybe her children haven't gotten a disease because every other farking kid has been vaccinated.

TFA: "Sending your children to school with a healthy lunch is very important. They need fresh vegetables. They need lots of fresh water."

I'm sure people ate fresh vegetables and fresh water for a long time and still died of polio.

Was with her on breast-feeding and a healthy diet. But lost it with homeopathy and not having an MMR vaccine.

In any event I imagine this thread, once on front page, will spark rational discussion on the pros and cons of vaccinating (or not) your children.

Hmm. Shame there isn't a photo, since the sketch suggests that she's taken the 'healthy' option of becoming significantly obese.

She does homeopathy

Of course she does.

The Icelander: TFA: "Sending your children to school with a healthy lunch is very important. They need fresh vegetables. They need lots of fresh water."

I'm sure people ate fresh vegetables and fresh water for a long time and still died of polio.

WTF is "fresh water"?

If you are going to shoot yourself of children full of poisons you should at least make an informed choice and know what poisons you're in-taking. Don't just deny, deny, deny.

http://www.informedchoice.info/cocktail.html

Her underlying theories are sound - you do need to dress and feed your children properly, you should pay attention to them, et cetera.

To throw her own 'logic' back at her, though - what good is all the healthy food and warm clothing in the world if your kid dies of an easily prevented, vicious disease?

Anti-vaxers need to be charged with attempted murder.

That is all.

ZipSplat: The Icelander: TFA: "Sending your children to school with a healthy lunch is very important. They need fresh vegetables. They need lots of fresh water."

I'm sure people ate fresh vegetables and fresh water for a long time and still died of polio.

WTF is "fresh water"?

It's water that's just been harvested, probably available to her at a waterer's market. Not canned with heavy syrup or a bunch of sodium added. You know, never frozen etc...

Not getting the Polio shot is farking stupid.

She's mixing up vaccines with antibiotics, as most dumbass health-crazy newbies do. My parents were crazy careful about food when I was a kid, but they also did the whole vaccination thing. The two don't have to be mutually exclusive.

Homeopathy?

Yet another crazy.

The Icelander: I'm sure people ate fresh vegetables and fresh water for a long time and still died of polio.

Also this.

eddyatwork: Maybe her children haven't gotten a disease because every other farking kid has been vaccinated.

you only have to get polio once for it to be a serious freakin problem, irrespective of if theoretically "Everyone" has been vaccinated.

EvilEgg

But not getting polio is awfully nice too.

How about not getting cancer from the polio vaccine? Not to mention that the vaccine didn't actually stop polio, they just renamed it meningitis.

Makes perfect sense. Just like how I don't need to wear a seat belt because I always signal my turns.

Refusing to vaccinate children is a form of child neglect. Her children should be taken from her and vaccinated by the Department of Public Health. She should be charged criminally and fined.

Unvaccinated children are potential incubators for all kinds of disease that endanger themselves and people who are immuno-compromised.

http://www.wired.com/magazine/2009/10/ff_waronscience

Mija: If you are going to shoot yourself of children full of poisons you should at least make an informed choice and know what poisons you're in-taking. Don't just deny, deny, deny.

http://www.informedchoice.info/cocktail.html



You know your body naturally produces formaldehyde, acetone, and all sorts of unsavory chemicals, right? They're produced as a result of biological processes. They're in your food. They're in your air. They're in far higher concentrations in your every day working environment.

Ankle deep in science isn't deep enough.

the_patman: Her underlying theories are sound - you do need to dress and feed your children properly, you should pay attention to them, et cetera.

To throw her own 'logic' back at her, though - what good is all the healthy food and warm clothing in the world if your kid dies of an easily prevented, vicious disease?

You're not in the anti-vaxer mindset. To an anti-vaxer, healthy food and warm clothing is all you need to prevent every disease ever; if you get a disease, you weren't wearing warm enough clothes, or ate the wrong kind of food. Or, if you're a fundie as well, it's punishment from God.

Mustaf Herod Upyur Poupr: Anti-vaxers need to be charged with attempted murder.

That is all.

I wouldn't go as far as 'murder'. Criminal neglect would be a better fit.

These are the kind of people who scare the shiat out of me. In general she's not batshiat insane. She talks about the importance of good nutrition, not some wacky raw food diet. If her kids get sick, she says upfront that she would have made the wrong decision. She doesn't think so now obviously, but (at least claims) that she could be wrong. Her husband openly disagrees with her, so she's capable of dealing with dissenting opinions. etc. etc.
She probably seems completely normal at first glance. She's smart enough to make a good argument for her batshiat insane beliefs. One good enough to potentially convince other people. That's what scares me. It's not the Jack Thompson's and Fred Phels' who are dangerous. It's people like her, who don't set off the 'danger/idiot' alarm.

/all that was said much better in some book I read
//Maybe Hitchhiker's Guide?

smeegle: Not getting the Polio shot is farking stupid.

Well, if she never leaves the US and doesn't meet with any better-travelled people who maybe have been to countries with lots of polio, it's probably one of the harder ones to pick up here, isn't it? The herd immunity thing, plus lack of contact with virus?

Not that you'll find me risking it, mind you.

MMR and the rest, those diseases are still pretty easy to get.

forditude: EvilEgg

But not getting polio is awfully nice too.

How about not getting cancer from the polio vaccine? Not to mention that the vaccine didn't actually stop polio, they just renamed it meningitis.

Then what stopped the Polio?

amyone here remember seeing the arm scar from the first vaccines?
I do.
It was a dime sized tan mark on your arm If you had it.

itazurakko: Not that you'll find me risking it, mind you.

Agreed,, why take the risk?

Mija: If you are going to shoot yourself of children full of poisons you should at least make an informed choice and know what poisons you're in-taking. Don't just deny, deny, deny.

http://www.informedchoice.info/cocktail.html

POISONS! So many poisons I don't know why there aren't mass deaths from the vaccinations! I mean think about all the children who get required vaccinations for school... You'd think they'd be dropping like flies!

Hopefully all her supporters will show up at the funerals and tell her what a great choice she made.

Either that, or the first time the kids get a real illness she'll be running to the ER and demand to be first in line because her little babies are gonna die.

I have to tell you, I can appreciate the idea of not getting kids vaccinated for H1N1 or the seasonal flu, but if you don't do MMR and polio, you're a retarded asshole who is recklessly endangering not only your children, but everyone with whom they come in contact.

forditude: How about not getting cancer from the polio vaccine? Not to mention that the vaccine didn't actually stop polio, they just renamed it meningitis.

Is that true?

hippydippy: Refusing to vaccinate children is a form of child neglect. Her children should be taken from her and vaccinated by the Department of Public Health. She should be charged criminally and fined.

Unvaccinated children are potential incubators for all kinds of disease that endanger themselves and people who are immuno-compromised.

http://www.wired.com/magazine/2009/10/ff_waronscience

Thing is, the US has long given religious exemptions for parents who didn't want to vaccinate. I don't necessarily agree with it (why only for religion?) but it was more or less manageable since it was a pretty small niche thing.

These days it's becoming a problem as it's a fad to not vaccinate kids (just look on any of the big parenting sites, you'll find heaps of the crazy) and so everyone is claiming the exemption or just not taking their kids in, and so there really are starting to be enough unvaccinated kids spread around to start spreading disease.

Weird thing is, it's the affluent parents who are doing it. Measles rates and like are going up in rich areas - where people consume a lot of woo.

LordJiro: You're not in the anti-vaxer mindset. To an anti-vaxer, healthy food and warm clothing is all you need to prevent every disease ever; if you get a disease, you weren't wearing warm enough clothes, or ate the wrong kind of food. Or, if you're a fundie as well, it's punishment from God.

This.

vudukungfu: It was a dime sized tan mark on your arm If you had it

For which vaccine? I had one like that for the smallpox vaccine (got it before visiting Panama in the early 70's).

unlikely: This here is the problem with the Health Care Bill. It still covers people like this.

So, you're complaining that it doesn't go far enough in making decisions for people?

Terrx: What does she have against VAXen?

Came in here for this.

\fondly recalls writing COBOL on the college VAX

forditude: EvilEgg

But not getting polio is awfully nice too.

How about not getting cancer from the polio vaccine? Not to mention that the vaccine didn't actually stop polio, they just renamed it meningitis.

I'm not going to read your link, because you're obviously retarded. But I wanted to tell you, specifically, that you're an idiot.

Or you're a great troll. 10/10

Bulls_Eye01: From the article:

What a mom and daughter might look like:

AND NOTHING OF VALUE WAS LOST.

I have an 8 year old daughter and she has received all her vaccinations. That being said, every time there is a vaccination thread I'm amazed at the Farkers for their "hang the anti-vaccination people". Farkers, for the most part, are staunch freedom lovers. Yet they are so quick to want to include the gubrment in health decisions, even going so far as to force vaccinations. I'm pretty sure the men who founded this country would shiat themselves at that thought.

Well, if she never leaves the US and doesn't meet with any better-travelled people who maybe have been to countries with lots of polio, it's probably one of the harder ones to pick up here, isn't it?

Just stay away from the Amish (new window). And don't let them join the military.

itazurakko: For which vaccine? I had one like that for the smallpox vaccine (got it before visiting Panama in the early 70's).

According to my parents and their siblings, that was the polio vaccine. They were all born in the 50s. I was born in the 70s and don't have a scar from it, so either they improved it or I'm about to go all FDR.

smeegle: How about not getting cancer from the polio vaccine? Not to mention that the vaccine didn't actually stop polio, they just renamed it meningitis.

Then what stopped the Polio?

smeegle: You don't understand, it's part of a conspiracy! The doctors want you to think they "cured" Polio, so they collectively renamed it meningitis. You see, some of the symptoms are the same, therefore it is so.

See? It's the greatest conspiracy of our generation.

/Sigh. People are farking retarded.

kuaq: Was with her on breast-feeding and a healthy diet. But lost it with homeopathy and not having an MMR vaccine.

Yeah, I'm not really into homeopathy, and most of the people that I personally know who are into it are among the flakiest folks I know... At any rate, she's an extremist... I wish more people (as in, pretty much everyone) would get on the good health wagon in terms of food and exercise, especially for kids, but I also wish that the people who were on the good health wagon would accept that modern medicine really does have something to offer...


In any event I imagine this thread, once on front page, will spark rational discussion on the pros and cons of vaccinating (or not) your children.

Yeah, now that us liters are here it should get all flamey.

/would get popcorn, but I have to go catch the 2nd half of Cheslea/ManU and then go to work.