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(Philly.com) Video Video of the 21,000-pound bomb dropped in Florida   (philly.com) divider line 970
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35414 clicks; posted to Main » on 12 Mar 2003 at 2:20 AM (11 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2003-03-12 03:28:56 PM
Big Al, that article has nothing to do with the United States.

"The three countries are laying great importance on the project as it could provide much needed boost to their economies."

and none of those countries is the USA. it's other middle eastern countries doing it for their own benefit.

Again, would you mind telling us how much oil the USA got from Somalia and Afghanistan?
 
2003-03-12 03:29:20 PM
03-12-03 03:26:59 PM LogicsFist
Big Al

Afghanistan has to have something to boost its economy except opium poppies, this may be its only chance to get started. This was a trilaterial agreement, the US is not getting unilaterial control or anything even close to it. However, I congragulate you on the posted article.


Yes, I understand their economy is in difficult times... but the problem I see with it, is how interesting the timelines fit together. Taliban refuses pipeline, taliban ousted, new friendly unocal exec put into power, pipeline deal signed, american troops out of region.

A little fishy, no?
 
2003-03-12 03:29:32 PM
Chipaku:

now regarding Iraq, we have already tried diplomacy, and to this very minute are still trying diplomacy. but we cant do that forever. if Sadaam doesnt cooperate, we will have to biatch slap his ass. why is that hard to understand?

Did you really just say "biatch slap his ass" in reference to dealing with Saddam and Iraq??? Can you clearly explain the impetus for going to war right now? I can't and I should be able to considering how critical the Bush administration seems to think it is. This "it's been 12 years, why wait another day" BS is amazingly stupid and illogical. It could just as easily be said that it's been 12 years, so why not wait another 12 years?
 
2003-03-12 03:29:48 PM
Big Al:

I guess i am oblivious to reality. I see what you mean.... We should definately have spent billions against Afghanistan, in return for a 3.2 Billion dollar pipeline.
 
2003-03-12 03:32:05 PM
"Are you just oblivious to reality?"

Are you oblivious to any website that doesn't try to turn everything from face value to a massive conspiracy theory?

Heres the truth, we need to rebuild the WTC, we will need glass! You need sand to make glass! Iraq has SAND!!!!

Listen up people its right in front of you!
 
2003-03-12 03:32:21 PM
03-12-03 03:28:56 PM Chipaku
Big Al, that article has nothing to do with the United States.


Who the HELL do you think is going to build the damn pipelines and use the oil coming out of it you blind ignorant fool? DID YOU NOT SEE THE US PIPELINE TITLE OF THE ARTICLE? My god.


and none of those countries is the USA. it's other middle eastern countries doing it for their own benefit.


Again, just please stop while your brain is in denial.

Again, would you mind telling us how much oil the USA got from Somalia and Afghanistan?


What does that matter? I don't have time to look it up. The point is, the US gets less oil from that region because it is so hard to get the oil. Now that the pipeline will be built, they will be able to get MORE oil from the same location, and bring more of it to the US market. Clueless you are.
 
2003-03-12 03:33:13 PM
Big Al

Are you seriously contending that the war in Afghanistan was simply about the pipeline? That 9/11 Osama bin Laden was some sort of enormous escapegoat for Big Oil? The money spent waging the war FAR outclasses the benefit of one pipeline. The money spent in peacetime troop placement and fundamental nation building? This does not compute.
 
2003-03-12 03:33:27 PM
03-12-03 03:32:05 PM Shut........UP
"Are you just oblivious to reality?"

Are you oblivious to any website that doesn't try to turn everything from face value to a massive conspiracy theory?


Conspiracy? No ones saying the US knew about 9-11 or anything, they just jumped on the opportunity to use Afghanistan as a poor excuse to make Americans feel like they were fighting the "good fight."

A sad disgrace to anyone who lost their life, if you ask me.
 
2003-03-12 03:34:30 PM
Anyone who is not clear on the whole pipeline issue in Afghanistan needs to go here and do some serious reading:

http://www.cooperativeresearch.org/completetimeline/index.htm

The only site I've of it's kind I've ever seen which is completely source-referenced out the ass. Very impressive. Lot's of words though. Might be tough for some of you. :)

/cheap shot
 
2003-03-12 03:35:49 PM
so the fact that afghanistan was a refuge for al-quida had nothing to do with our going in?

riiiiiiiiiiight.......
 
2003-03-12 03:36:07 PM
03-12-03 03:29:48 PM Blainux
Big Al:

I guess i am oblivious to reality. I see what you mean.... We should definately have spent billions against Afghanistan, in return for a 3.2 Billion dollar pipeline.


*smacks head* You can't be serious, can you?

Lets go over this nice and slow...

Money spent to deploy and support troops = paid for by taxpayers

profits from oil pipeline = go to oil companies

Where don't you see the logic? Why would Bush and Cheney who have millions in stock, and are paid off and will get exec jobs when they are out of office, really care about how much military wise the war costs? They just give the bill to you.
 
2003-03-12 03:37:12 PM
Big Al

You seem to be intent on turning anything happening recently into some sort of worldwide company comspiracy...that is ludricous! You are assuming that all US actions are driven by big business...that we went to war in Afganistan simply to put in a pipeline, in Somolia for oil...I suppose you assume that Korea was about new markets and that WWII was about selling military hardware? WWI about promoting our new shiny trench knives?
 
2003-03-12 03:37:33 PM
George_W_Snatch

Thank you for the comic relief, and comic indeed it was.

Re: Patriot II - I like the part where as a non-citizen I could be locked up without notification going to my family or anyone else for the simple crime of criticising the government.

Yay for the land of the free.
 
2003-03-12 03:37:38 PM
03-12-03 03:35:49 PM Shut........UP
so the fact that afghanistan was a refuge for al-quida had nothing to do with our going in?


Want to know what other countries are training places for al-quida? Saudi Arabia, Iran, Phillepines, etc.

Picking and choosing your battles is obviously for a reason.
 
2003-03-12 03:38:30 PM
People were having fun in here, and then perpetual political attention whores

Harmonia
and
Tadlette

came and ruined everything. Thanks guys, hope you got your adrenalin fix.
 
2003-03-12 03:38:39 PM
Big Al... you funny
 
2003-03-12 03:40:39 PM
From their Phiosophy section: (cooperativeresearch.org)

The Revolution is at hand
"Tyranny, in both the state and corporate form, is dependent on the existence of systems of production and distribution that are capital intensive in nature. For example, when it takes millions of dollars of capital investment to build the necessary means of production for energy, it logically follows that the owners of that means of production will wield tremendous power."


Nope, no political agenda with those people at all. Marx called he wants his philosophy back.

But since they are a .org they must be a reliable unbiased sourse.
 
2003-03-12 03:40:40 PM
misguided and sad, and still funny
 
2003-03-12 03:41:33 PM
03-12-03 03:37:12 PM LogicsFist
Big Al

You seem to be intent on turning anything happening recently into some sort of worldwide company comspiracy...


Whats so hard to understand?

that is ludricous! You are assuming that all US actions are driven by big business...


LOL! Funniest thing ever... they're not? Big business doesn't decide who goes to war over what, and what policies to put in place? You think Microsoft just got "lucky" with their court case? Give me a damn break, stop being a blind fool, You're better than that.


that we went to war in Afganistan simply to put in a pipeline, in Somolia for oil...


Sure, why not. America didn't get so powerful going around the world helping out other causes unless they saw some profit. I wonder why they got involved in Venezuela, for example. Because they felt bad for the people? LOL again!

I suppose you assume that Korea was about new markets and that WWII was about selling military hardware? WWI about promoting our new shiny trench knives?


Korea and Vietnam were exepctions because they were part of the red scare. I can say that it was also an excuse to keep the buildup of defence going, and Korea was really a proxy war vs Russia.

WWII was the last actual "real" war that was fought for a good cause. Its just too bad it took the US so damn long to get invovled to begin with.
 
2003-03-12 03:42:59 PM
Big Al

Want to know what other countries are training places for al-quida? Saudi Arabia, Iran, Phillepines, etc.

Picking and choosing your battles is obviously for a reason.


Saudi Arabia is not currently viable as a target, due to the fact that they have over a trillion dollars invested in the US economy at the moment, and if they took it out, instant recession/depression. We are currently involved in helping the Phillipines, but their constitution forbids foreign military involvement. Iran is not cooperating for obvious reasons.
 
2003-03-12 03:43:47 PM
03-12-03 03:40:40 PM Fink
misguided and sad, and still funny


Right, but theres no way you could be misguided right? Because you KNEW about the oil pipelines deal, and you knew that Saudi Arabia was the biggest financers of the 9-11 terrorists, and you KNEW that Bin Laden is currently in Pakistan, and the US government isn't pulling an Afghanistan invasion by going in and getting him.

I am misguided though, right? Because I form my own opinions and figure out things for myself without a news agency telling me? If you say so, keep living in your sheltered world buddy.
 
2003-03-12 03:45:07 PM
03-12-03 03:42:59 PM LogicsFist

Saudi Arabia is not currently viable as a target, due to the fact that they have over a trillion dollars invested in the US economy at the moment, and if they took it out, instant recession/depression. We are currently involved in helping the Phillipines, but their constitution forbids foreign military involvement. Iran is not cooperating for obvious reasons.


But I thought the US never does things for economic reasons? You'd rather sit there and let Saudi Arabia get away with it, because "we have too much money invested in them." Nice excuse. Hopefully youll say the same thing after the next terrorist attack financed by them.

ANd how about Pakistan? Bin Laden is there, why not go in with troops and take it out?
 
2003-03-12 03:45:19 PM
Big Al:

Perhaps misguided is the wrong word, but you are definately ignorant in your pursuit to form your own opinions.
 
2003-03-12 03:47:07 PM
Big Al

I'm sorry, but you're the one living the sheltered life buddy. Consiracies only work either in repressive societies where information is held at gunpoint, or in VERY small groups...companies need not apply. IF the democrats could get ahold of this supposed information...good bye Bush, hello impeachment. And I would support it...IF it were true. But this is so far off the beaten path that is is beyond reason with you anymore. You are willing to assume anything and everything to support your conclusion. Reality Check.
 
2003-03-12 03:47:49 PM
"Picking and choosing your battles is obviously for a reason."

Ya because those and other countries can (possibly) be handled in non-military ways.

Did saddam marry the daughter of the head of the philipines governemtn and no one reported it? Does Iran openly have al-queda training camps operating?

as for saudi arabia, we can start bombing anytime.
 
2003-03-12 03:48:25 PM
Big Al:

Conspiracy? No ones saying the US knew about 9-11 or anything, they just jumped on the opportunity to use Afghanistan as a poor excuse to make Americans feel like they were fighting the "good fight."

What ever are you talking about? The hijackers were employed by the CIA to carry out a covert strike guaranteed to set this whole ball in motion. I think that there is little dispute on this issue any longer. The CIA are also responsible for telling all the Jewish workers that they should be sick that day. Of course the CIA didn't know that every Jew at the WTC was actually a Mossad operative and well aware of the attack already. Oh yes! The truth is out there! No conspiracy? BLAH BLAH BLAH!
 
2003-03-12 03:48:50 PM
opps, that should be bin laden not saddam
 
2003-03-12 03:50:14 PM
Hey its all right. You don't have to believe politicians do things for their own personal gain.

03-12-03 03:47:07 PM LogicsFist
IF the democrats could get ahold of this supposed information...


The democrats are just as guilty, if they call anyone on it, then all hell would break loose.
 
2003-03-12 03:50:43 PM
Shut....UP:

so the fact that afghanistan was a refuge for al-quida had nothing to do with our going in?
riiiiiiiiiiight.......


I think Afghanistan was more of a "two birds, one stone" case.
 
2003-03-12 03:50:53 PM
paranoia paranoia.................
 
2003-03-12 03:51:26 PM
I don't know where you people got the idea that because oil companies wanted to go into Afghanistan, thats the same as saying the US knew or carried out the 9-11 attacks... but I guess when you get destroyed with facts, you resort to idiotic remarks.
 
2003-03-12 03:51:47 PM
"Because I form my own opinions and figure out things for myself without a news agency telling me? If you say so, keep living in your sheltered world buddy."

unless you have the ability to gather all information without external help, you rely on new organizations for information. You just pick the ones who give out tin foil hats with a paid subscription.
 
2003-03-12 03:53:06 PM
Big Al

Wow! you figured all that out for yourself?

Congratulations for parroting things I see nightly on the news. Yeah, that's right Pipelines, Saudi funding, Pakistan... all on the news. Of course you have to have cable or a satellite to see it. Again, kudos for "figuring things out for yourself"... buddy
 
2003-03-12 03:53:16 PM
Shut........UP:
if you want to inform yourself on what some of the geopolitical reasons for the U.S. to pursue the war are then look at this.

***WARNING: Long read and lots of words over 3 syllables***

http://ist-socrates.berkeley.edu/~pdscott/iraq.html


Note the .edu in there. It should help alleviate that TLD bigotry you seem to have for .org sites. =)

__Syo
 
2003-03-12 03:53:18 PM
Vrax: "This "it's been 12 years, why wait another day" BS is amazingly stupid and illogical. It could just as easily be said that it's been 12 years, so why not wait another 12 years?"

the difference is that the USA has been attacked by terrorists, and therefore our priorities have changed. we will no longer appease those who wish to destroy us.

now, I am not claiming that Al-Qaida is financed by Sadaam Hussein. but it is plainly obvious that Hussein is a psycho. Al-Qaida are pyschos. Sadaam hates America. Al-Qaida hates America. Sadaam will do anything he can to hurt the USA. Al-Qaida will do anything they can to hurt the USA. Hussein is very shady when it comes to his weapons, he isnt cooperating with inspectors, he has not accounted for chem and bio weapons that we know he used to have (therefore the only logical assumption is that he still has them hidden). He has been trying to build nuclear weapons.

now, substitute Al-Qaida for "any terrorist group" now it's not hard to see a potential threat. after 9/11, the new philosophy is "better safe than sorry."

now of course there are other important reasons for this. we need a strong presence in the middle east, and Iraq is a good place. that will put the US in slapping distance of all other terrorist supporting regimes in the region.
 
2003-03-12 03:53:27 PM
Big Al:

I think the 9/11 conspiracy remarks were parodying you.
 
2003-03-12 03:55:27 PM
BBC Business - Afghanistan plans gas pipeline

Maybe read this article then the other one I linked. The US backed out after the Taliban was in power. Now Unocal, the company that the President was on the board of, is now going to build it! how nice
 
2003-03-12 03:56:55 PM
Well Harmonia and Tadlette are pretty much expected in threads like this. They just like to biatch and serve no real purpose other than to be against US policy. The US government is damned if they do and damned if they don't in their book. Hey no problem. Just don't expect them to own up to any responsibility or come up with any solutions to the problems we face day to day. That would actually make them hold a firm stance on an issue which is something I have never seen them do in all their endless posting.
 
2003-03-12 03:57:14 PM
france surrenders
 
2003-03-12 03:57:31 PM
03-12-03 03:53:18 PM Chipaku

the difference is that the USA has been attacked by terrorists, and therefore our priorities have changed. we will no longer appease those who wish to destroy us.


So basically throw any rules out the window because Dubyah wants to get anyone he pleases! Please inform the intelligent people on here why you consider Saddam a "threat" and North Korea as nothing important to worry about now.

Then tell me how Saddam is supposed to attack the US, and how you can prove Al-Queda has links to his organization. You can't? Don't worry, neither can the US.
 
2003-03-12 03:58:59 PM
Syowr...


try coming up with a logical argument to what I said.

But first you want to actually try ready what I said. I said because its a .org it does not make it an unbiased sight. I have not bigotry against .orgs, but since they are not regulated by any body like non-profit organizations are, anyone can register a .org.

.edu is governed and has to meet certain criteria to recieve one (I believe a 2 or 4 year acreditied college).

The fact that its from berkley is what would give me pause. no political agenda at berkley, nope none.....
 
2003-03-12 03:59:14 PM
03-12-03 03:53:27 PM Blainux
Big Al:

I think the 9/11 conspiracy remarks were parodying you.


I see, so to make fun of someone and their views based on facts that I posted you will talk about something with absolutely ZERO facts and pretend like its my argument. [sarcasm]makes sense to me![/sarcasm]
 
2003-03-12 03:59:19 PM
Cubicle-slave

Agreed. Though I have occasionally on very rare occasions (when its a blue moon and being eclipsed by the earth and all planets are in perfect alignment...) that Tadette will make a semblance of a logical argument.
 
2003-03-12 03:59:57 PM
hey, good times.
 
2003-03-12 04:00:42 PM
wow. major spell nazi ammo in that last post.

oh well.
 
2003-03-12 04:01:00 PM
Big Al:

Show me where US policy said "north korea is nothing to worry about".

Saddam doesnt have to attack the US, doesnt have to have Al-Qaeda links. Saddam has to oblige the conditions which ended the Gulf War.
 
2003-03-12 04:02:25 PM
Big Al

the answers to all your questions are in this thread. Or did you just shoot to the bottom and start biatching?
 
2003-03-12 04:03:55 PM
Syowr one more thing.

your arrogance on your post to me really comes out, that you you are so condescending to anyone who doesn't agree with what you say you make yourself feel better my accusing them of being uneducated illiterate boobs.

your post says more about your nature then I ever could
 
2003-03-12 04:04:10 PM
Chipaku:

Last things first:

now of course there are other important reasons for this. we need a strong presence in the middle east, and Iraq is a good place. that will put the US in slapping distance of all other terrorist supporting regimes in the region.

This is exactly the type of situation which is going to make the region go completely bonkers. Really, really bad idea!

the new philosophy is "better safe than sorry."

Yeah, this is my philosophy too. In fact, I just shot all my neighbors in the head because I was thinking that some of them were going to steal my Sunday paper again real soon. I don't understand why the cops are making such a big deal about it. I mean, I was just trying to protect myself and my property before having to protect myself and my property. It was a pre-emptive ass whoopin'! Serves 'em right!
 
2003-03-12 04:07:30 PM
03-12-03 04:01:00 PM Blainux

Saddam doesnt have to attack the US, doesnt have to have Al-Qaeda links. Saddam has to oblige the conditions which ended the Gulf War.


I'm talking about the sad excuse Chipaku gave for war. If you want to pretend like the US enforces every binding UN Resolution that the UN doesn't want to enforce yet then you are sorely mistaken.

UN enforces the rules they set, if the US doens't agree with them, then too damn bad.
 
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