If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Wired)   Electric El Camino can hit 85 mph, goes 130 miles on a charge, and costs a penny a mile to operate. Suck it Prius   (wired.com) divider line 74
    More: Cool, wind turbines, electric cars, race cars, solar panels, throw in, grid, Prius, pickup trucks  
•       •       •

6522 clicks; posted to Geek » on 03 Sep 2009 at 11:19 PM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



74 Comments   (+0 »)
   

Archived thread

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all
 
2009-09-03 08:23:26 PM
FTFA: Of all the cars he could have picked to convert, why did Leitschuh choose the mongrel offspring of a Chevrolet Caprice and a pickup truck?

Malibu. Not Caprice. Newborn Laotian orphans know that. Malibu.
 
2009-09-03 08:46:04 PM
Cool stuff. Be sure to check the links, he's getting all his electrical power from solar arrays and a wind turbine.
 
2009-09-03 10:08:39 PM
upload.wikimedia.org
HOW ABOUT NO
 
2009-09-03 10:27:38 PM
The radio only play "Low Ri-Der is a little High-er"
 
2009-09-03 10:48:59 PM
timujin: Cool stuff. Be sure to check the links, he's getting all his electrical power from solar arrays and a wind turbine.

Quoted to preempt the "electric is all coal anyway" WHARRGARBL
 
2009-09-03 11:00:55 PM
Jon Snow: Quoted to preempt the "electric is all coal anyway" WHARRGARBL

What about teh nuke-you-lar?
 
2009-09-03 11:08:31 PM
Electric El Camino

Good band name.
 
2009-09-03 11:22:58 PM
Cost of vehicle (upgrade): $30,000
Fuel savings: ~$2.75 per gallon, depending on location, fluctuations

The cost of building this car is the same as putting 10,900 gallons of fuel into a vehicle, not counting expenses such as maintenance, insurance, replacement cost, etc. One could drive a vehicle that gets 25mpg 270,000 miles and still not spend $30,000 on fuel. Analysis: Don't buy this (or any hybrid) car just because it'll "save" you money on gas. Drive the one you have.

The previous does not consider the environmental impact, which is significant if they can mass-produce a true zero-emissions vehicle. Kudos to this guy for figuring a way to make it work on his own, then fueling it with his own electron farm.

/runs and hides, that'll probably touch off a flamewar.
 
2009-09-03 11:28:34 PM
130 miles on a charge?

That might get me 1/3 of the way to my parents' home.

No thanks.
 
2009-09-03 11:29:37 PM
the_be_sharps: The cost of building this car is the same as putting 10,900 gallons of fuel into a vehicle, not counting expenses such as maintenance, insurance, replacement cost, etc. One could drive a vehicle that gets 25mpg 270,000 miles and still not spend $30,000 on fuel. Analysis: Don't buy this (or any hybrid) car just because it'll "save" you money on gas. Drive the one you have.

Wouldn't a new car cost 20-30 thousand and have the same or similar insurance and maintenance costs? But this one is way cheaper to drive around
 
2009-09-03 11:31:07 PM
the_be_sharps: Cost of vehicle (upgrade): $30,000
Fuel savings: ~$2.75 per gallon, depending on location, fluctuations

The cost of building this car is the same as putting 10,900 gallons of fuel into a vehicle, not counting expenses such as maintenance, insurance, replacement cost, etc. One could drive a vehicle that gets 25mpg 270,000 miles and still not spend $30,000 on fuel. Analysis: Don't buy this (or any hybrid) car just because it'll "save" you money on gas. Drive the one you have.

The previous does not consider the environmental impact, which is significant if they can mass-produce a true zero-emissions vehicle. Kudos to this guy for figuring a way to make it work on his own, then fueling it with his own electron farm.

/runs and hides, that'll probably touch off a flamewar.


The guy built a very inefficient electric vehicle. I'd consider this project similar to any other auto hobbyist who restores or modifies their car to go faster - it's a matter of doing it just because he can, not for any financial payback.

It's a pretty unique ride, and pretty cool to see the engineering involved.

If he wanted to go further, faster and for cheaper, he'd use a lighter mule - like a VW Golf.
 
2009-09-03 11:33:41 PM
A penny a mile? I think they're lying.

In fact... 130 miles on one charge, and a charge takes 10 hours. I think a 10 hour period spent charging 46 lithium batteries is more than $1.30 in electricity.

Or this way: He says it store 33 kilowatt-hours. The average cost of electricity is about .12 per kw-h, so it takes $4 to charge (assuming 100% efficiency). Probably closer to $8-$10 dollars.

That's $8 for 130 miles, or about 6 cents per mile. A car that gets 30 miles to the gallon, with $3.00 per gallon, costs 10 cents per mile. So, it's a significant but not miraculous savings. As the_be_sharps pointed out, probably not worth the investment, if you're purely concerned with the economic aspect.
 
2009-09-03 11:34:08 PM
That is an electric car I would buy.
 
2009-09-03 11:44:42 PM
Wow, I'll just run down to my GM dealer and get one. I can't? Well, suck it, subby.
 
2009-09-03 11:47:39 PM
El Camino's rock. had a friend turn one into an offroad monster. roll cage and everything. the only vestige of an el camino was the body.
 
2009-09-03 11:54:11 PM
the_be_sharps: What about teh nuke-you-lar?

I'm for 4h gen nukes, but they require massive gubmint welfare and are pretty water intensive when water is going to be in short supply. It's not a silver bullet, but damned if it can't make up part of the silver buckshot.
 
2009-09-03 11:56:42 PM
Ranchero please.
 
2009-09-03 11:57:11 PM
FTA:

$30,000, which included the cost of the car and a transmission rebuild. The lion's share of the bill went to the 46 lithium-ferrite phosphate batteries that cost him $18,000.

That is NOT win!
 
2009-09-03 11:58:19 PM
El Caminos are the ugliest vehicles ever made. There, I said it. They are only cool in trailer parks and might actually be what god is aiming for when he wipes them out with tornadoes.
 
2009-09-04 12:01:07 AM
130 miles on one charge, and a charge takes 10 hours?

Completely useless to me, as I commute between Albany and NYC quite a few times a month, and it's 140 miles each way.

It would turn a 5 hour round trip into a probable 26 hour trip, involving lodging expenses.

ROAD TRIP!
Not likely.
A 130 mile range is pretty useless, even for local travel, and the back of a tow truck is going to become this car's natural habitat.
 
2009-09-04 12:02:14 AM
Check the fauxhawk he's rockin, lol
 
2009-09-04 12:03:18 AM
HoratioGates: El Caminos are the ugliest vehicles ever made. There, I said it. They are only cool in trailer parks

Did you actually mean that, or did you mean to say that they're only cool if you're from a trailer park? If the latter, how do you know?
 
2009-09-04 12:03:51 AM
Toonol: A penny a mile? I think they're lying.

In fact... 130 miles on one charge, and a charge takes 10 hours. I think a 10 hour period spent charging 46 lithium batteries is more than $1.30 in electricity.

Or this way: He says it store 33 kilowatt-hours. The average cost of electricity is about .12 per kw-h, so it takes $4 to charge (assuming 100% efficiency). Probably closer to $8-$10 dollars.

That's $8 for 130 miles, or about 6 cents per mile. A car that gets 30 miles to the gallon, with $3.00 per gallon, costs 10 cents per mile. So, it's a significant but not miraculous savings. As the_be_sharps pointed out, probably not worth the investment, if you're purely concerned with the economic aspect.


*points and laughs
 
2009-09-04 12:09:20 AM
TommyymmoT: 130 miles on one charge, and a charge takes 10 hours?

Completely useless to me, as I commute between Albany and NYC quite a few times a month, and it's 140 miles each way.

It would turn a 5 hour round trip into a probable 26 hour trip, involving lodging expenses.

ROAD TRIP!
Not likely.
A 130 mile range is pretty useless, even for local travel, and the back of a tow truck is going to become this car's natural habitat.


Then don't get one. But probably 90 percent of two-car households could have an EV as their second car without problem, taking their gas car on road trips. And that would be a huge step for reducing gas consumption.
 
2009-09-04 12:09:52 AM
Toonol: A penny a mile? I think they're lying.

In fact... 130 miles on one charge, and a charge takes 10 hours. I think a 10 hour period spent charging 46 lithium batteries is more than $1.30 in electricity.

Or this way: He says it store 33 kilowatt-hours. The average cost of electricity is about .12 per kw-h, so it takes $4 to charge (assuming 100% efficiency). Probably closer to $8-$10 dollars.

That's $8 for 130 miles, or about 6 cents per mile. A car that gets 30 miles to the gallon, with $3.00 per gallon, costs 10 cents per mile. So, it's a significant but not miraculous savings. As the_be_sharps pointed out, probably not worth the investment, if you're purely concerned with the economic aspect.


He has his own wind turbine and solar array I would think when he's not charging his car he's selling power back to the grid
 
2009-09-04 12:12:02 AM
TommyymmoT: Electric El Camino

Good band name.


It reminded me of Electric Aunt Jemima.

Link (new window)
 
2009-09-04 12:13:43 AM
TommyymmoT: Completely useless to me, as I commute between Albany and NYC quite a few times a month, and it's 140 miles each way.

JFC, why not Amtrak it? Or at least drive to Poo-kipsy and take the commuter line in?

My buddy in Troy has to go down to Manhattan a few times a month and he just Amtraks it and grabs a hotel room. Less frustrating and he just expenses it out.
 
2009-09-04 12:15:10 AM
Not too bad, but after a year of steady everyday driving, tell me how far it goes on a single charge. Also, how much it costs to keep that battery up and running.

...I'm just saying.
 
2009-09-04 12:16:04 AM
1st car I ever bought was a '69 El Camino (Used. 1980)
Drove it for 6 years, sold it to a buddy that drove it for 7 more.
/Would buy again. (The '69 model)
 
2009-09-04 12:17:38 AM
HoratioGates: El Caminos are the ugliest vehicles ever made. There, I said it. They are only cool in trailer parks and might actually be what god is aiming for when he wipes them out with tornadoes.

Bravo, I'm stealing that line.

Seriously, an El Camino is little more than a station wagon convertible.
If you want a pickup, get a pickup.
There are some very seriously nice ones out there.
 
2009-09-04 12:25:10 AM
Link to his project page. (new window)

He used a smaller motor to drive the power steering and brake booster. It looks like he tossed out a V-6 with a variable-venturi carb (he should be given a medal for that).

The Camino is a good choice, decent aerodynamics, not too heavy, lots of space for batteries.
 
2009-09-04 12:27:19 AM
King Something: HOW ABOUT NO

That's not an El Camino.
 
2009-09-04 12:28:08 AM
T-Luv: Wouldn't a new car cost 20-30 thousand and have the same or similar insurance and maintenance costs? But this one is way cheaper to drive around

Doubtful. I'd expect just about any gasoline automobile made in the past 15 years to run 250,000+ miles with proper maintenance and respectful driving. My Cadillac Seville is a '95 and just hit 127k today. I've driven 63k in the 3 years that I've owned it. If you expect the battery systems and engines in an EV to last that long, I've got a nice bridge to sell you. Also consider the vast amounts of cheap new and used parts that can be used to repair a conventional vehicle. The break-even on fuel savings still means astronomical (no pun intended) driving distances to justify the initial cost.

And I'll amend my post to say, "It doesn't make sense to spend that kind of money ANY new or used vehicle (hybrid or not), just because you'll "save money" on gas. It is particularly a bad idea (COUGHCOUGH CASHFORCLUNKERS) to go buy (and most likely finance) a new car that will lose in the neighborhood of 60% of its value over the next 5 years. Yes, even at zero percent interest (if you qualify) it's still a really bad idea.
 
2009-09-04 12:31:55 AM
Fluff Girl: FTFA: Of all the cars he could have picked to convert, why did Leitschuh choose the mongrel offspring of a Chevrolet Caprice and a pickup truck?

Malibu. Not Caprice. Newborn Laotian orphans know that. Malibu.


Well, if you're going to go around correcting people at least get it right. The Malibu was only a trim line for the Chevelle. The original El Camino was derived from a Brookwood, but subsequently from the Chevelle, which was renamed the Malibu long after after El Camino was in existence.

/loves me some 72's
//wish GM wouldn't have canceled the Holden Ute here in the US
 
2009-09-04 12:35:16 AM
soze: TommyymmoT: Completely useless to me, as I commute between Albany and NYC quite a few times a month, and it's 140 miles each way.

JFC, why not Amtrak it? Or at least drive to Poo-kipsy and take the commuter line in?

My buddy in Troy has to go down to Manhattan a few times a month and he just Amtraks it and grabs a hotel room. Less frustrating and he just expenses it out.

============
I don't have a problem with what I'm currently doing.
You know this area. I live in Niskayuna, so I would have to take a bus to the Albany train station that is actually across the Hudson, in Rensselaer.

That alone, on the best of days, is an extra hour and a half, each way, not to mention I have to pay for cab fare in the city.

Also, (and this is the main thing) I'm usually carrying tools (audio racks) that weigh much more than myself, but are no big deal to throw in the back seat of a car.

I'm an independant contractor, so I can't really "expense" stuff out, unless I include it in the bid, and if my bid includes an extra $400 in travel expenses, it either comes out of my pocket, or makes me less competitive.

Nice hearing from you again though. How's the bike?

/for those that don't know...
//nice bike!
///and she knows how to use it.
 
2009-09-04 12:42:36 AM
El Caminos are simply awesome, and this guy is awesome for converting one to electricity.
Fark needs two things:
1) an awesome tag
2) the haters to suck it
 
2009-09-04 12:43:40 AM
It's the parking garage attendant from Ferris Bueller's Day Off !
 
2009-09-04 12:47:30 AM
Top speed of 85 MPH? Sounds like my old '85 LeBaron
 
2009-09-04 12:49:26 AM
mud_shark: TommyymmoT: Electric El Camino

Good band name.

It reminded me of Electric Aunt Jemima.

Link (new window)

========
I didn't miss a single Zappa reference.
My first album ever, for my ninth birthday, was "Weasels Ripped My Flesh".

I'm in a store with my mother, and mom says, "what do you want for your birthday?"

"I want an album."

"Which one?"

"THIS ONE! Look, he's shaving with a rat!"

Mom rolls eyes, purchases album, and the rest is hystery.

Hmmm. "hystery", I think I just invented a new word.
 
2009-09-04 12:49:41 AM
I'm not sure if this has been pointed out but a Prius will hit about 99 mph... not a ferrari for sure but it beats 85 lol
 
2009-09-04 01:04:21 AM
southparkk420: I'm not sure if this has been pointed out but a Prius will hit about 99 mph... not a ferrari for sure but it beats 85 lol
=========
Zero to 30 in under twenty minutes!
Who could argue with eyelid jarring specs like that?
 
2009-09-04 01:28:11 AM
TommyymmoT: HoratioGates: El Caminos are the ugliest vehicles ever made. There, I said it. They are only cool in trailer parks and might actually be what god is aiming for when he wipes them out with tornadoes.

Bravo, I'm stealing that line.

Seriously, an El Camino is little more than a station wagon convertible.
If you want a pickup, get a pickup.
There are some very seriously nice ones out there.


Agreement.
 
2009-09-04 01:30:18 AM
TommyymmoT: I don't have a problem with what I'm currently doing.
You know this area. I live in Niskayuna, so I would have to take a bus to the Albany train station that is actually across the Hudson, in Rensselaer.


Niskayuna? Then you are my sworn enemy, for I am from Guilderland! Hahaha. There will be blood in the Suburban Council tonight! (Sorry, I get a little fired up at the start of the school year. And really the sworn enemy of Guilderland should be Florinland.
 
2009-09-04 01:41:34 AM
I'm holding out for an atomic powered vehicle - cause I really like that nuke-car smell.
 
2009-09-04 01:43:27 AM
image.guardian.co.uk


Unimpressed
 
2009-09-04 02:01:35 AM
I don't get the transmission deal. He says that he took out the clutch so now he does clutchless shifts. I thought electric cars needed a total of one gear. I don't know much about electric cars as it might be apparent. I do know how to do a clutchless shift though which is cool since most people in America are clueless about how to drive a manual transmission car at all.
 
2009-09-04 02:20:42 AM
selrah: Unimpressed

www.sneeko.net
 
2009-09-04 02:20:51 AM
its gonna be great when the batteries start to provide less power after 3 years or so, like they do...i'm gonna guess he'll be able to travel 80 miles on the charge by that time, prolly top out at 70 mph

the batteries on the market today just aren't up for that kind of day to day usage...wait a couple years for the stuff MIT is developing to hit the market for high loads
 
2009-09-04 02:27:35 AM
Good Behavior Day: Link to his project page. (new window)

He used a smaller motor to drive the power steering and brake booster. It looks like he tossed out a V-6 with a variable-venturi carb (he should be given a medal for that).

The Camino is a good choice, decent aerodynamics, not too heavy, lots of space for batteries.


Good find
 
2009-09-04 02:56:28 AM
SeamusFerrell: I thought electric cars needed a total of one gear.

Not necessarily.

There are two reasons why EVs need fewer gears than ICE vehicles:

First, electric motors can revv significantly higher than ICEs. Most gasoline cars redline at 6,000ish rpms - most EVs can go well north of 10k.

Second, electric motors have almost 100% of torque available for almost the entire revv range, whereas ICEs only have usable torque for a specific range, and maximum torque for a narrow "power band."

Combine these two, and you get a Tesla Roadster (for instance) that has 100% torque from 0-13,000 rpm, and most every ICE car that gets 90%+ torque from, say, 4,000-6,000 rpm. That means you need six gears in a gasoline car to get similar results as you get from the single-gear Tesla.

But that doesn't mean that every EV therefore only has a single gear. The prototype Tesla, for instance, didn't revv as high, and had two gears. The production model has a single gear because they had trouble getting the transmission to work, but they had to tweak the motor to go with the 1-speed.

A better way to state would be that EVs usually have the OPTION of going single gear, and if you have the option you should take it, since transmission are complicated and break a lot.
 
Displayed 50 of 74 comments

First | « | 1 | 2 | » | Last | Show all



This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »






Report