Durr, I quit right after Alliances was released, had every blue card in the game, all the Moxes and a Black Lotus, and sold them in random packs for $5 at a local card shop. Made $1450, which was enough to buy myself a snowboard and bank some cash for college.

Not too bad for a tenth-grader.

If you're on Fark calling Magic players nerds, you're probably a pretty big loser yourself. Grow up.

no shiat Byrd you nailed it man. Kai Budde and a few other players have banked over 200k for playing a game. Show me one person on here that doesnt want to get paid 25k a pop for playing a game they like. Talk about the farking pot calling the kettle black.

I just don't see the issue. There are people who do something that they enjoy a great deal, and they make money doing it.

Obviously they must be shunned and ridiculed! Clearly, if they had any self-respect, they'd get a job selling furniture, or something, and thus would "have" a "life", which is far, far more valuable than actually enjoying your life.

If you are drunk, anything can be fun.

I don't know what they do in their spare time, but having sex is obviously NOT the answer.

Davenmak - I don't know, There must be SOME geeks out there having sex, otherwise any 'geek genes' wouldn't have made it past the first generation.

As a regular Farker, and a regular Magic player, I think that most of you have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

You're assuming so much about who the Professional Magic players are, what they are like in their personal life, etc. Most of your comments are just idiotic. Stereotyping any group based on some individuals is never a good idea.

Winning a Pro Tour event gets you $30,000. Second place wins $20,000. The top player on the Pro Tour currently is a student in Germany. In just a few years he's won over $150,000 dollars while attending college.

Very few professional players are purely professional players. They have jobs, go to school, etc. They are normal people. They have girlfriends, wives, etc.

Admitedly, there are quite a few nerds in this group, that can't talk to women. They have found a game where they can interact with others that are like them and be social.

Bah, I'm done.

Observation: From this thread, I've learned that about 50 percent of Farkers are "Magic the Gathering" players.

Note to self: If I'm ever at a fark party, never make fun of "Magic the Gathering" players unless heavily armed or drunk.

Note to self II: Make alliance with D&D nerds for backup because I will undoubtedly be drunk. To allign with D&D nerds, offers lies like "Oh yeah, I've dungeoned many dragons. Sure."

Fark vs Magic: Yeah, but you can kill kittens while playing Magic? Please don't say yes.

Internet arguments....Special Olympics....everyone's retarded....everyone's heard that cliche before.

Magic players tend to run the whole spectrum of geekiness, but the "pros" seem to be more level headed than most. It can still be really scary when you sit across from an uber geek who hasn't showered in what seems like a month. Those types of people are not in the majority from what I've seen though.

Gondorf Gremulon!

"Professional" Magic players sounds so wrong.

My girlfriend played on what they called the "Pro tour" for quite a long time - she occasionally got a few grand (yes, you can get quite a pretty penny for playing Magic if you manage to play one of the 6 Major Decks Anyone Plays) for doing it, but she did it mainly because she was getting bored with playing us all the time.

my girlfriend knows brian kibler pretty well. he's kinda cool.

<3 <3 <3

WHOA! that picture was MUCH MUCH MUCH smaller on the sideboard. sorry guys, mods please delete previous post.

Here's a list of all the people who have made over $20,000 playing Magic. I'm not even a pro at the game and I've made a few thousand myself. There are really 3 types of players and you can judge them however you like, but you don't know them so you're judging blindly, no?
1) The pro. Check the list, it's worth it. Travel to 6 different continents, make money, have an extended family that gives you recognizable faces in Kuala Lampur, it's not so bad after all.
2) The 'PTQer'. This is where I fit in. We make some money, but not tens of thousands. Usually more civilized than what you would expect from geeks.
3) The scrub. These are the guys you think we ALL are. Some dudes just don't care about what you think and will not shower and wear an X-Men t-shirt out to dinner, etc... They're not someone everybody can deal with, but they're not every MTG player either. Magic goes far beyond the store on the corner in Podunk, Utah so your limited POV is worthless.
In closing, I know a lot of players are nerds who are prolly virgins and that isn't looking to change soon, but that really is a different type of person than what you'll see on the money list or at an event of 100+ ppl. I have a girl, work my 40, and don't live at my mom's and neither a lot of other geeks. Idiots play this game, but I'd bet whatever it is you do (aside from the yuppies who eat their wive's dinner and watch Frasier or Mad About You or whatever whities do) has scrubs among it's ranks too.

the list: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=sideboard/facts/winnings

What use is the internet if we can't make snap judgements, live by stereotypes, and find even more reasons to be disgusted with fellow human beings? Yeesh--next thing you know someone will be saying we should all be kind and respect each other.

Like that's ever going to happen.

Macman37: I'm more mad at M:TG for killing great RPGs.

Get in line behind the grognards that are still pissed at D&D for killing great wargames. When was the last time you played a rousing game of Squad Leader? ;)

Times change. We all get older, every day.

Old and Busted: "Your" cool

New Hotness: "Their" cool

So it goes.

Burritto: Two problems with this list:

a) It doesn't break down to average/year, which would be a truer indication of "making a living" at it. If you've been in the pro-tour for 3 years and made a total of $40,000 in prize money, that ain't much of a living from where I'm standing.

b) That's gross, doesn't take into account expenses - cards, travel, lodging, et all.

I think you could be a $200,000 total prize winner and still be eating Mac&Cheese two days out of a week in a crappy apartment.

Doctechnical: You disagree with me, but one of your points is pretty close to accurate. I don't favor the Mac & Cheese but I don't care if I won $6437376843760, I would be chillin in my ghetto paradise and eating Ramen Noodles like WHUT! I'm hood rich for life anyway...

Furthermore, that is only the money handed out by Hasbro. It wasn't provided as evidence that all of those people live exclusively off of the income reported on the list. There is a ton of money to be made in reselling cards, playing for money, etc...

Also, I am aware other expenses aren't reflected on the list. Again, I'm just showing that many people who play MTG don't like goblins and shiznit, read my description of what a pro player does and think again.

In closing, you are gross too!

I mean, hell - have you guys talked to John Finkel? He's admittedly a geek, but you wouldnt know he's a Magic player unless you see him play, or ask him what hobbies he does.

Burritto - didn't mean to offend, if offense was taken. My point is there's a difference from "Pro" as in "Wins Pro-Tour Tourneys" and "Pro" as in "Lives an independant life soley on the money won from playing Magic".

I'd love to have a number on the latter. WAG, I'd say it's less than two dozen. But I can't imagine we could find out in any case.

Fark it. I play MtG for fun. Money taints it AFIAK.

No offense, dawg. Actually, you're pretty much correct. There are a small number of people who make a full-time living playing cahdz, some do, but few. When it comes down to it, we all play for fun. Just trying to get across to those who diss MTG whilst knowing nothing-to-little about it. Have fun, man.

Burritto: Just trying to get across to those who diss MTG whilst knowing nothing-to-little about it.

Bang on. Any chance you'll be at Orgins in June? I'll buy ya a beer.

03-06-03 02:52:22 PM Quickdart
Davenmak - I don't know, There must be SOME geeks out there having sex, otherwise any 'geek genes' wouldn't have made it past the first generation.

Not necessarily. This hypothetical "geek gene" of yours could be recessive.

Wait, why am I bothering to argue about this?

shiate, JP Meyer posts on Fark. Who would have known!

Yes, the players make asstons of money by playing a card game. Prizes at some of the bigger tourneys are around $30,000 and many of the pros go to and win as many as they can in a year.

Farkers are just biatching because their best nerd insults can't get them 30 grand.

Okay, let's see here..

Drunk guys get together to play Poker, a game that is completely based on luck and requires little or no skill.

They are not geeks.

Drunk women get together to play Bridge or Spades.

They are not geeks.

Men and women of various ages get together to play trading card game that requires more skill and intelligence than Poker or Spades.

They are geeks.

But here's the best one.

20 to 30 something males spend hours at one website, posting comments every minute, while ogling pictures of naked women they'll never meet, laughing at completely stupid inside jokes and cliches.

What are they, somneone guess, if you do, I'll send you a free CD. Hint: four words.

But as for other comments, what is so bad about X Men shirts? Look at "fashionable" clothes from retailers like Express, Abercrombie and Fitch, and GAP/Old Navy. A very very typical item is the T shirt with a number [like 88 or 45, etc] for no reason whatsoever. Another one, is the "vintage" type T shirt, with something like "Ms. Pac Man" or "Atari" on it. More common is the sports team T shirt. What is the difference between someone going out in their X Men [or Evangelion, Star Trek, Yugioh, whatever you like] T shirt, and the example above? At least the person wearing their "fan shirt" wears it for a reason, and one or two people out in the street can probably strike up a conversaiton with them.

"Geeks" , "outcasts', are more social than you think. Coming from a high school point of view, the typical jock is mostly alone, except for the once a week party and ball game. And the most popular girls usually spend time together in cliques of 3 or 4, and pretty much dismiss anyone else. Without a "date", they are left at home alone doing nothing. For the "geek" or "outcast', it is much different. Lots of "geek" activities are things that are better to be done with other people [card playing, LAN parties, role playing, video games, conventions, shopping, etc] And "outcasts" can find a whole lot to do alone, probably lead much more interesting lives at that.

I don't know, but social drinking, hitting the clubs, and locking yourself up in a room having sex with someone you don't know sounds just as geeky as going to an anime convention. Except that if you have the right friends and a sweet girl you're in love with, an anime convention can be a whole lot more wilder and fun than the night of a person with a "life"

Oh yeah, and that too. Anyone who plays competitive perfect attack DDR, who has a good diet, and a decent frame can beat the living out of any of you who brag about your fitness routines and or exercise programs. Add a little weight lifting to it, some cardio off the DDR pad, and you're more fit than most people who aren't pro sportsmen.

Freestyle DDR makes DDR look bad.

Then again, I'm willing to say most of those people are too nice or too intelligent to randomly beat up people.

Old and Busted: "Your" cool

New Hotness: "Their" cool

I use to be with it. Then they changed what it was. Now what I'm with isn't it... and what's it scares me.

/AD&D, Magic, Simpsons, Fark geek.

Withlovesarareku:Oh yeah, and that too. Anyone who plays competitive perfect attack DDR, who has a good diet, and a decent frame can beat the living out of any of you who brag about your fitness routines and or exercise programs. Add a little weight lifting to it, some cardio off the DDR pad, and you're more fit than most people who aren't pro sportsmen.

Freestyle DDR makes DDR look bad.

Right, I forgot to add DDR geek to the end of my post... and I agreed with you entirely (I perfect attack myself, and pretty well, but not enough to win competitions) until the freestyling makes it look bad part. I hope you were being sarcastic, cause freestyling is just as impressive as tech (when done well). Sure, you get the occasional people who poke fun at the "idiots dancing on the stupid arcade game." But you also get those same slack-jawed yokel types posting on internet message boards bashing card gamers.

Withlovesarareku
But as for other comments, what is so bad about X Men shirts? Look at "fashionable" clothes from retailers like Express, Abercrombie and Fitch, and GAP/Old Navy. A very very typical item is the T shirt with a number [like 88 or 45, etc] for no reason whatsoever. Another one, is the "vintage" type T shirt, with something like "Ms. Pac Man" or "Atari" on it. More common is the sports team T shirt. What is the difference between someone going out in their X Men [or Evangelion, Star Trek, Yugioh, whatever you like] T shirt, and the example above? At least the person wearing their "fan shirt" wears it for a reason, and one or two people out in the street can probably strike up a conversaiton with them.

"Geeks" , "outcasts', are more social than you think. Coming from a high school point of view, the typical jock is mostly alone, except for the once a week party and ball game. And the most popular girls usually spend time together in cliques of 3 or 4, and pretty much dismiss anyone else. Without a "date", they are left at home alone doing nothing. For the "geek" or "outcast', it is much different. Lots of "geek" activities are things that are better to be done with other people [card playing, LAN parties, role playing, video games, conventions, shopping, etc] And "outcasts" can find a whole lot to do alone, probably lead much more interesting lives at that.

I don't know, but social drinking, hitting the clubs, and locking yourself up in a room having sex with someone you don't know sounds just as geeky as going to an anime convention. Except that if you have the right friends and a sweet girl you're in love with, an anime convention can be a whole lot more wilder and fun than the night of a person with a "life"

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.......
BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA...HAHA...HA...
HAHAHAHA...

DOOFUS...HAHAHAHA

So you are telling me that if I go to a club, have some drinks, and hook up with a chick that I am more of a dork than the guy that goes to a Japanese cartoon convention and then goes to his room to play pokemon cards with his friends and his "girl"? That is hee-lar-ee-us.

If thats true I must be the BIGGEST dofus in the world. If you include all of the drinking, partying, and hooking up that I've done during the last week or two alone (what with Mardi Gras and all) then I must have logged in more geek hours than 13 Star Trek Conventions, 12 "Magic" tournaments, and 34 Lambda Lambda Lambda rush mixers.

Hey Doctechnical If you're still tuning in...

I agree with you... although my impression was that the great strategy board games (Avalon Hill, I have several) and RPGs got along for a while. I know I used to play both often (as often as I could get my brothers to play 'em, anyway...). I loved the rules systems in those games almost as much as the games themselves.

Twilight:2000 had the most elegant combat system I've played, followed closely by Starfleet Battles.

/acknowledged geek

Withlovesarareku,

Since when is poker about luck?

Doctechnical: I don't Origins because I have pro points so I can't play in the big tourney there. I'll take an IOU on the beer. Peace

Iceberg, what does any of that mean. What does partying do to make you feel better and give yourself a challenge, what does seeing some drunk girl's tits do for you as a person? Games enrich our lives in a way that Jager will never do. All that "partying" does is turn you into an old man fast whose stories all start with "one time when I was drunk" or "back in the day".

No amoubnt of skill or expertise will save you in a Poker game if all you have is two pairs. Unless the others have REALLY bad hands..

But wait, I play MtG but don't use the Internet or Internet message boards.... *stops and thinks for a bit* My head hurts....

Chess: no luck here..

Poker: How to turn lack of luck into victory with skill.

MtG: How to turn lack of luck into victory with skill and money.

That is all.

RedDragon says:

Iceberg, what does any of that mean. What does partying do to make you feel better and give yourself a challenge, what does seeing some drunk girl's tits do for you as a person? Games enrich our lives in a way that Jager will never do. All that "partying" does is turn you into an old man fast whose stories all start with "one time when I was drunk" or "back in the day".

Um, as both a part time partier and a part time Magic player, I can tell you there's a LOT of enriching potential in Jagermeister (although I prefer tequila), hooking up, hooking up, getting women to flash you, and meeting people. There's also something enriching about game playing, be it Magic, Poker (which I also enjoy), Darts, Pool, whatever, for those who enjoy it, obviously it's a quality that's unexplainable to a lot of people but who cares? There's also an enrichment to working out, playing sports, whatever. The only thing I *don't* consider enriching is sitting in front of the TV eating Cheesy Poofs or whatever and letting your mind rot.

Richard Garfield (Phd) created magic as his college thesis. As a major in combination mathematics he set out to create a game that would addict players WITH mathematics. The fantasy orientation was added later as a sales gimmick. Much like chess can be played with sticks n stones. But the common "theme" is rooted in medieval pieces. (knights, kings, queens). So by all means call us dorks! But don't associate all of us with the silly fantasy aspect. Although most of us can still appreciate the professional artwork.

Most "pro" magic players make their money by playing magic. Not just tournaments though, there is ALOT of gambling and card reselling.

As a response to everyone who says "get a life". You do realize that alot of "pro" magic players get to travel all over the world? Japan, Italy, Germany, Canada. (Not that I know anyone who would want to goto Canada) Can you say that about your Job/Hobbies? Are you traveling to every major US city, and flying to far off distant countries to play a game with hundreds of other players, who then sit down and gamble/drink for hours BEFORE hitting the nightclubs?

Chide them all you want, they wont care. While you work your 9-5 in one little town. These (obscenity) are flying all over the world making a living (or atleast trying to) playing a game,shacking up in nice hotels with lobbies FULL of drinking and gambling buddies!!!

Admit it your jealous. Enjoy your 9-5.