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(Lancaster Eagle-Gazette)   Public schools forbidden from expelling special ed students, even if they try to kill the teacher   (lancastereaglegazette.com) divider line 160
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9145 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Mar 2003 at 6:06 PM (11 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2003-03-03 11:49:38 AM  
Just a bit different than private and parochial schools, huh? School vouchers, anyone?
But it is stupid. They can kick a regular elementary school kid out for drawing a picture of a gun or just about anything with "zero-tolerance" rules. Yet a sped student who actually gets violent gets everything but kicked out.
 
2003-03-03 12:12:32 PM  
My next door neighbor is a special ed high school teacher. Her stories are frightening. She is pregnant and due any day, but I think she plans on going back after the baby is born. Dedicated or insane, I haven't decided which.

We don't pay teachers enough.
 
2003-03-03 12:15:54 PM  
I shall burn for reading tardblog....
 
2003-03-03 12:33:40 PM  
This, folks, is a great example of how screwed we are as a culture. My gifted daughter gets one day per week in a gifted program, but if the special ed kid who gets 5 days per week tries to kill the teacher, he comes back tomorrow.

Yep. We've gone past regression toward the mean, straight toward the bottom of the bell curve. And people wonder how we got this way.

It's because you can only rant about this sort of thing in the forums of a fun website. If you do so in "real life", you're some sort of bigot.
 
2003-03-03 12:42:03 PM  
The Federal Gov't still doesn't realize that it can't legislate personal responsibilty. Let's all thank the overly tolerant liberals for making all public endeavors sink to the lowest common denominator to be "all-inclusive". We wouldn't want to hurt the feelings of behaviorally disturbed individuals as they victimize teachers and other students.
 
2003-03-03 02:04:48 PM  
Let's all thank the overly tolerant liberals for making all public endeavors sink to the lowest common denominator to be "all-inclusive".

As opposed to the good-ole days when we just locked them up in a sanitarium?

Zenmaster-I know exactly what you are talking about.
 
2003-03-03 02:34:13 PM  
Well surely there's a happy medium where people are neither swept under the rug nor allowed to run rough-shod all over the teachers, Johnc98.
 
2003-03-03 02:54:07 PM  
Well, I'll just start this out by saying that my sister is one of those 'special ed' type students. Her handicap is that she is blind, mentally retarded, and requires round the clock care. She will always require this care, although she does not have homicidal tendencies that I know of. The worst is when I have to pick her up at 'camp'. Compared to some of those kids she is pretty well off, and it is always depressing to me seeing what those counselors and teachers go through every day.

To the many who will no doubt post 'tard jokes, pictures, and special olympics I'll just say this as I said in the Strong Bad thread:

Not everyone dies from their injuries.

Now don't take this as any kind of threat or ominous "oh crap we offended Weaps" kind of thing. I enjoy the occasional 'tard joke myself taking it with a sense of humor that one needs to deal with those who ride the short bus. But remember that while most of us are 'with it' and will continue to be 'with it', you never know when some accident will render you a vegetable, brain damaged, or otherwise. I've seen enough accident victims where maybe the EMT's shouldn't have spent so much time saving their life and doing them the favor of leaving them alive, but in a condition in which they will never be the same.

We now return to our regularly schedule 'tard joke fest.
 
2003-03-03 03:29:25 PM  
Weaps I doubt anyone could be terribly glib about your sisters situation - or any disability, after that post. Your point is well taken - I've often wondered how some very seriously injured people deal with it (especially burn victims - I've heard that is the worse pain imaginable.) I saw a burn victim thingie on one of those learning channel programs - the doctor is chatting about skin grafting techniques while going over this guy with a potato peeler; just scraping the layers of twisted skin off this guy.... damn. That's got to be the worse pain...
 
2003-03-03 03:41:53 PM  
Weaps, just wanted you to know for the record, my comments were referring to those students who are a product of their home environment, otherwise known as the emotionally disabled. These are the kids that if their parents actually gave a damn, they wouldn't be in these programs in the first place. These are the students that typically display the behavioral problems to which the article is referring.

I don't think that your sister would fall into this category as she is both mentally and physically disabled and deserves every extra helping hand she can get.

Keep that in mind when this hits the main page. :)
 
2003-03-03 04:43:05 PM  
Yes, I realize that this is a wider issue: Special education for both mentally handicapped and emotionally disturbed in the public schools. I have no problems with what anyone has said; I know that in the greater world most people don't have to deal with the handicapped, emotionally or otherwise. I also have pretty thick skin when it comes to joking about retarded people.

Oh, and Sudie my sister isn't always that deserving all the time. Sometimes she can be complete uber-biatch. ;)
 
2003-03-03 06:10:08 PM  
Attention shoppers, outside today we have cripple fight...cripple fight outside.




 
2003-03-03 06:14:12 PM  
Newspapers always act like it's so freakish to have to take care of disabled kids. This kind of thing is really the exception.

The norm throughout the country is that thousands of them get expelled every year, fail, lose all self-respect and become criminals.
 
2003-03-03 06:14:44 PM  
People in special ed (teachers, that is) have been complaining for years that this is a natural consequence of IDEA. No on listens.
 
2003-03-03 06:15:48 PM  
The only people I hate worse than the poor, are the stupid. Except for the stupid poor. I really hate them.
 
2003-03-03 06:16:42 PM  
Not too surprising. Most school districts live in fear of being sued by parents or investigated by their state education agency for not crossing "t's" and dotting "i's" when it comes to these special children.
 
2003-03-03 06:20:36 PM  
What people need to realize is that not everyone is suited to go through 13 years of school.

Some people would benefit MUCH more from being placed in a vo-tech program and learning to do some manual labor type of job.

I can't see any point, given how underfunded our education system is, to spending so much money on people who are going to get so little out of it.
 
2003-03-03 06:23:48 PM  
Tadpole :
The Federal Gov't still doesn't realize that it can't legislate personal responsibilty. Let's all thank the overly tolerant liberals for making all public endeavors sink to the lowest common denominator to be "all-inclusive".


We should just do everything the conservative Nazi-fascist way and shoot them in the backs of the head.
/knee-jerk idiocy right back atcha
 
2003-03-03 06:23:50 PM  
I dont understand the point of educating the mentally retarded. I dont see what society gains from the millions, no, billions of dollars spent on it.

However, education of gifted children is extremely beneficial. We get scientists that find cures to diseases, CEOs, artists, great writers, etc. But the money dedicated for gifted students is probably an order of magnitude less than that for retarded kids.

I'm not sure what we can do about it, I'm just saying that it seems like we as a society have some pretty farked up priorities.
 
2003-03-03 06:23:52 PM  
I'm not entirely sure they're just talking about QUOTE tards ENDQUOTE. I know of schools where "special ed" isn't just for the truly mentally or physically handicapped kids. A lot of the time they just stick the stupid, mean kids in with the disadvantaged ones. Those are the ones that are problems. And they should recieve electro-shock treatments until they are brain dead vegetable matter and then they should be used as live training dummies for med students and toys for the truly handicapped kids.
 
2003-03-03 06:24:18 PM  
Johnc98: Just donate a bit from the page, if it make you feel better.

Everytime I read the TargBlog and see the name Augusta, I know it's going to be funny...
 
2003-03-03 06:25:17 PM  
6YearOldGirl :
I'm not sure what we can do about it, I'm just saying that it seems like we as a society have some pretty farked up priorities.


Being 100% logical and being a good human do not always go hand-in-hand. There's a gray area.
 
2003-03-03 06:25:27 PM  
On one hand, we as a society have a mandate to take care of some of these kids 'cause it's really a case where if we don't do it now we'll have to deal with it later, with the kids becoming criminals in some cases.

On the other hand, it really makes you wonder what the demographic breakdown is on these kids, and whether or not it's indicative of a symptom of a different social issue.

On the other other hand, it just might be time to bring back corporal punishment as one of the 'tools' available to educators.
 
2003-03-03 06:26:19 PM  
Ladies and gentlemen, I present to you a poem I read in my childhood. True then, truer now. Especially with all the groveling to Special Ed, No Child Left Behind, and here in Hawaii, the Felix Consent Decree.

The Lament of the Normal Child
 
2003-03-03 06:26:30 PM  
Instead of expelling them, why don't they just make them start a little earlier at the DMV?

<rimshot/>
 
2003-03-03 06:26:36 PM  
Sudie I congratulate your neighbor. A dear friend of mine works with special ed because she believes she can make a difference in their lives. In the fall a ten year old hit her with a chair, breaking her arm. All that was done was to take the boy off recess for a week.
 
2003-03-03 06:27:01 PM  
Teachers and public schools suck ass anyway. I grew up in Texas, and the quality of teachers down there was absurd. I wound up dropping out of high school, they were so bad, and school policies so ridiculous. I moved to a foriegn country and supported myself, AND learned a new language. I then returned to the States and graduated Texas A&M a year before any of my classmates who stayed in high school would have finished college. Should I ever have children they will NOT be allowed into public schools for their education. So, in my opinion, torturous teaches and public schools get what they deserve. Just my spiel.
 
2003-03-03 06:27:30 PM  
I have to agree that if a student is a blatant physical threat to others, they should be expelled.

However, I do think a little more leniency is in order relative to other students. They're in special-ed for a reason.
 
2003-03-03 06:27:46 PM  
Some special ed. kids really need the extra help, but usually they are very lazy, and have grown accustomed to having things really dumbed-down for them, so they never learned how to think and problem-solve for themselves.

A lot of special ed. students' biggest problem, and impediment to receiving an education, is their asshat, ignorant breeders, I mean parents.
 
2003-03-03 06:27:48 PM  
Special Olympics
By Stephen Lynch


Watch them run.
Watch them fall.
Watch them try to catch a ball.
Olympics.

Spe-cial O-lym-pics.

Watch them laugh.
Watch them drool.
Watch them fall into the pool.
That's... diving...

At the Special O-lym-pics.

And I know...
Full well...
That I will bur-hurn in Hell...
But those guys playingwheelchairbasketball'vegottabeaboutthefunniestfriggan'thingI've ever seen in my li-hife

At the Special O-lympics.


Verse Two.


Kid with Downs,
Wins the race,
Even though he stood in place,
Olympics.

Spe-cial O-lym-pics.

'Round his neck,
Gold medals hung,
Resting on his giant tongue.
Olympics.

Spe-cial O-lym-pics.

But I kid...
When I sing!
Cause these games are a beautiful thing...
OkayreallyI'mjustavoidingkarma'causeIknowmyownkidsaregonnabeborncrippledandbli ndandthenduringmyretirementI'm gonna have to spend all my ti-hime

At the Special... Olympics.



I feel so terrible right now...
 
2003-03-03 06:29:12 PM  
if i can get expelled, they can get expelled. i only tried to beat an asshat fellow student into unconsciousness.
 
2003-03-03 06:29:34 PM  
Johnc98

OMG that is the funniest thing i have read in a long time
 
2003-03-03 06:30:09 PM  
There is a kid in my ten year olds fifth grade class. This kid has two full time aides (one just suctions snot out of him all day long). This kid's parents insist he gets "a regular education" and the liberal bastards on the school board won't do anything about it. The kid has an IQ of a turnip, yet he manages to pass every year (in no small part due to the teachers wanting to get his ass out of their classroom)

The sad part is that 25 other kids have to suffer in order to accommodate this retard. I'd go on.... but I'm getting pissed just thinking about it.
 
2003-03-03 06:30:28 PM  
the other thing is, why won't Vegas give me odds on the Special Olympics?
 
2003-03-03 06:30:35 PM  
Robotninja

i have to change my underwear now.

that was funny.
 
2003-03-03 06:32:42 PM  
ah yes that special olympics song is great. Stephen Lynch kicks ass. You should see his comedy routine if you get a chance.
 
2003-03-03 06:32:57 PM  
Not too surprising. Most school districts live in fear of being sued by parents or investigated by their state education agency for not crossing "t's" and dotting "i's" when it comes to these special children.

...yeah, that's true too.

Also, there's a big difference between simply mentally slow or physically handicapped, and having total antisocial tendencies.
 
2003-03-03 06:33:06 PM  
Full inclusion sounded like a good idea until the population of special ed kids started becoming a disruptive influence on classes rather than an asset.

I went to school where we had a mentally retarded kid in the class. I feel it helped the rest of us learn about mental handicaps, how to get along with those who are different or disabled, etc.

However, my wife had to teach a class where almost half of her kids could have been diagnosed with autism, learning disabilites and/or behavior disorders. The administration didn't want them tested since special ed classes are expensive, the parents were in denial, and the law says you can't boot them.

Before you rip on the public schools, keep in mind all the shiat they have to put up with because parents can't seem to realize when their children become a burden on the education of the rest of the class.
 
2003-03-03 06:34:34 PM  
I think I speak for all special ed students when I say, "Nah nah nah naaaah naha na"
 
2003-03-03 06:34:34 PM  
"We have found a number of effective tools to work with the students here," Ferbrache said. "Are there more tools needed? Well, I'd be very foolish to turn down more tools."

What a- Nah, too easy.
 
2003-03-03 06:34:38 PM  
I think it should be noted that the majority of special ed kids in school systems have no real problems, public \schools get more money the more special kids they have so they will put kids in there that are normal for having things like ADD.
 
2003-03-03 06:34:56 PM  
Anybody remember the story approx. a year back, about the 14 year old kid with a 6 month-old's mental capacity and a tendency for violent outbursts, that the Washington state public school system had to pay something like $400,000 a year to, so he could go to a special-happy-school in Texas?
And that was just one kid.

It seriously pisses me off that we're pouring huge gobs of money--money that could go a LONG ways towards WORTHWHILE things, like reducing poverty or fighting AIDS--into cuddley-fying the lives of people that are born with, and will die with, a single-digit IQ, and who are basically social black holes.

They're not going to do anything to even partially recoup all those dollars spent on them. They won't invent a better light bulb, write a Pulitzer Prize winning novel, cure cancer, bring peace to Israel and Palestine, or anything else. They're gonna sit there for their entire life drooling and playing with blocks, and forcing someone else to sit there and take care of them.

People who suffer brain damage or something else like that are different--they weren't like that to start with, and for at least some amount of time, they contributed something to society. They deserve whatever care we can give for them after they're injured.

But 40-year olds who can't learn to talk and have needed someone else to change their diapers their entire life...

I'll pass.

And yes, I have my own little two-bed, two-bath suite already reserved in Hell. Wetbar, DSL and everything. No morons allowed.
 
2003-03-03 06:35:29 PM  
6YearOldGirl We spend $ educating mentally and physically handicapped people so they can have the best life possible. Some may never be able to function in society, some can.

I have seen many handicapped people become members of society. Maybe they end up as maids or janitors or working at the car wash, but they have pride in being able to work.

Our company hires mentally handicapped people for low end jobs, and traditionally they take more pride in their work than others in the same position.

For all the millions you mention, we help a life. The bonus is a bit less drain on the 'safty net'.
 
2003-03-03 06:37:44 PM  
Tadpole :
The Federal Gov't still doesn't realize that it can't legislate personal responsibilty.


No, no, no. The government does not try to legislate personal responsibility. It attempts to remove personal choice, and the personal responsibility that goes with it.
You can't expel tards. You must wear seatbelts. You must label your products this way. Everywhere you look the government is mandating and limiting our personal freedom. And if things go wrong? The government should do something! There ought to be a law! We as so used to the government assuming responsibility for us that we now look to the government to solve all our problems.
 
2003-03-03 06:38:01 PM  
"Special ed" is not normally a designation for physically handicapped or retarded children, although they would an example of children who really need the classroom modifications.

Today, special ed is any student who scores low on particular standardized test.
 
2003-03-03 06:39:50 PM  
OK, I just saw somebody rip into public schools. As long as you don't rip the teachers, I'll leave you be.

Private school: pay tuition, get decently paid teachers and adequate supplies for that money. Plus, all students have to test IN: idiots not allowed. Since the parents also sent the kid there, they tend to be in tune with the school as well.

Public school: Paid for by the government, thus most of it disappears into admin's pockets. That's if any money gets there at all, because all politicans LOVE saying "I will make our education system the best, think about the children", then take the money and porkbarrel it. Have to deal with cases like this all day. Then there's the parents, who want to treat school like a babysitting service, and feel the teachers are incompetent if, out of a class of 25, their little baby does not get 1-on-1 attention.
 
2003-03-03 06:39:51 PM  
Based on the grammar and spelling in my previous post, I'd be special ed.
 
2003-03-03 06:39:56 PM  
Robotninja:
Steven Lynch = Funniest.Motherfarker.Ever.

On second thought, maybe not, but he IS funny as hell.
 
2003-03-03 06:40:28 PM  
I was attacked 2-3 times just by walking by a guy that was mentally retarded in high school. He just went crazy at random and tried to hit me and usually ended up whacking a metal pole. It had to hurt like mad. Funny thing that he was listed as a senior for three years in a row. I don't want to say it was his day care, but.........
 
2003-03-03 06:40:28 PM  
 
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