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(Wall Street Journal)   When journalism stops making sense. No, it's not Fark - it's Peggy Noonan   (online.wsj.com) divider line 196
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2796 clicks; posted to Politics » on 08 Aug 2009 at 12:40 PM (4 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2009-08-08 08:40:57 AM
img.wonkette.com
We have entered uncharted territory in the fight over national health care. There's a new tone in the debate, and it's ugly. At the moment the Democrats are looking like something they haven't looked like in years, and that is: desperate.
 
2009-08-08 09:10:57 AM
That biatch is just trying to make up with the conservatives for basically stating that Palin is a dumbass.
 
2009-08-08 09:13:47 AM
coco ebert: That biatch is just trying to make up with the conservatives for basically stating that Palin is a dumbass.

She's been doing that ever since it issued from her lips; she has some good points in the article but does slip into Wharrgarbl speak now and again. Claiming this as some sort of master plot by Hillary, for example, as well as the whole "We're terrified by what you're doing." both examples of pure Wharrgarbl.

The Dem's did over play their hand and misinterpret the '06 and '08 elections though. They came to power because the Republicans farked up royally, not because the country suddenly wanted to embrace the Liberal Wish List; they are slowly and painfully learning this lesson though. Let's hope they return from Vacation a little more moderate.
 
2009-08-08 09:32:46 AM
I bet, with only very minor editing, I could pass this article off as something Goebbels would have written.
 
2009-08-08 09:48:12 AM
CanisNoir: The Dem's did over play their hand and misinterpret the '06 and '08 elections though. They came to power because the Republicans farked up royally, not because the country suddenly wanted to embrace the Liberal Wish List; they are slowly and painfully learning this lesson though. Let's hope they return from Vacation a little more moderate.

Doubt it. They'll just see how conservatives are acting like petulant little children, and in the words of one Democrat, remain more committed than ever. You guys have got to learn that opposing something that 71% of Americans support is not mainstream America.
 
2009-08-08 10:33:49 AM
CanisNoir: The Dem's did over play their hand and misinterpret the '06 and '08 elections though. They came to power because the Republicans farked up royally, not because the country suddenly wanted to embrace the Liberal Wish List; they are slowly and painfully learning this lesson though. Let's hope they return from Vacation a little more moderate.

I don't think the Dems overplayed anything. Healthcare reform should not be any big surprise for anyone who was paying attention to Obama during the latter half of 2008 and all of 2009. He's been beating this drum for a long, long time.

The real issue here ISN'T healthcare, though. "Obamacare" is just one of dozens of new rallying cries for the 22% that is the Republican base. I've been following some of the vitriol over on Twitter that the Republicans are spewing and, frankly, it's downright scary. I'm sure it's 90% ITG, esp. the talk of coups & going to town halls armed, but the other 10% is comprised of enough hatred and bile on there to really give one pause.

When you get right down to it, this was never about healthcare, bailouts, tea parties, birth certificates, or stimulus packages. All the WHARRGARBL is simply because we have a black president. And I absolutely HATE invoking the race card, but that's what it all is in a nutshell. I've had the unfortunate experience of talking to far too many of them and they all have that one quality in common.
 
2009-08-08 10:54:27 AM
She really needs to change her prescription.
 
2009-08-08 11:58:19 AM
noonan...noonan!

miss it...miss it!

she never fails to remind me that she represents everything that is wrong with the world.

she must have blown the right cock, once.
 
2009-08-08 12:05:58 PM
we have become so polarized as a nation...that this is as good as it's ever going to get.

-9/11 changed everything.

9/11!

'nevar forgit' why we hate each other!!!

the republican base votes...and they're not going anywhere.

the democratic base votes...and they're not going anywhere.

-you think that's air you're breathing?
 
2009-08-08 12:44:02 PM
Bauer: she must have blown the right cock, once.

She blows the rotting raygun corpse just about everyday.

She was an raygun facilitator so she's a waste of flesh and bone.
 
2009-08-08 12:44:28 PM
CanisNoir: The Dem's did over play their hand and misinterpret the '06 and '08 elections though. They came to power because the Republicans farked up royally, not because the country suddenly wanted to embrace the Liberal Wish List; they are slowly and painfully learning this lesson though. Let's hope they return from Vacation a little more moderate.

Obama won because he was perceived as the steady hand. The idea of hothead McCain or airhead Palin at the wheel was just too terrifying, and the Republicans have done nothing to change that perception. The fact that they are not just rocking the boat but seem intent on capsizing it certainly won't help them against Obama in 2012.
 
2009-08-08 12:44:52 PM
Bauer: -you think that's air you're breathing?

Yes.
 
2009-08-08 12:46:27 PM
From the article: "leftosphere"
The other day I saw: "leftopathic"

seriously guys, work on your neologisms.
 
2009-08-08 12:48:16 PM
She's practically rooting for the murder of the sitting President. How is this not treason?
 
2009-08-08 12:48:24 PM
Abraham Frohman: From the article: "leftosphere"
The other day I saw: "leftopathic"

seriously guys, work on your neologisms.


Leftosphere: just one part of the evil blogocube on the interododecahedron
 
2009-08-08 12:48:35 PM
There is something very wrong about conservative women. I mean there is something very wrong with conservative men too but with women it's different.

A woman that has had her compassion removed is a strange creature indeed.
 
2009-08-08 12:49:11 PM
brigid_fitch: When you get right down to it, this was never about healthcare, bailouts, tea parties, birth certificates, or stimulus packages. All the WHARRGARBL is simply because we have a black president. And I absolutely HATE invoking the race card, but that's what it all is in a nutshell. I've had the unfortunate experience of talking to far too many of them and they all have that one quality in common.

so if I object to Obamacare because i'm a libertarian who sees NOTHING good in massive government programs....i'm now a racist in your eyes?
 
2009-08-08 12:49:59 PM
Lost Thought 00: She's practically rooting for the murder of the sitting President. How is this not treason?

FTFA: "It's going to be a long August, isn't it? Let's hope the uncharted territory we're in doesn't turn dark."

hello implicit threat. how are you?
 
2009-08-08 12:50:31 PM
Oh Peggy Noonan. She is hilarious. I still remember a column that she did for the WSJ back in 2003 when she basically went Tom Clancy and wrote a fantasy account of the US Army capturing Osama Bin Laden in Baghdad.
 
2009-08-08 12:52:19 PM
alostpacket: Leftosphere: just one part of the evil blogocube on the interododecahedron

Please. Nobody uses the d12. Everybody knows the internet is actually a d20.
 
2009-08-08 12:53:04 PM
Weaver95: so if I object to Obamacare because i'm a libertarian who sees NOTHING good in massive government programs....i'm now a racist in your eyes?

No but that libertarian whack job shiat sure ain't helpin ya.

Those farkers are out to lunch.
 
2009-08-08 12:53:05 PM
alostpacket: Abraham Frohman: From the article: "leftosphere"
The other day I saw: "leftopathic"

seriously guys, work on your neologisms.

Leftosphere: just one part of the evil blogocube on the interododecahedron


As opposed to the rightomobius strip of circular logic.
 
2009-08-08 12:53:27 PM
Bob16: There is something very wrong about conservative women. I mean there is something very wrong with conservative men too but with women it's different.

A woman that has had her compassion removed is a strange creature indeed.


You're right. They're much much scarier than conservative men. The men seem pre-occupied with the whole macho thing and trying to fit into some strange Hollywood mold of a tough guy. The women seem like bloodthirsty animals.
 
2009-08-08 12:53:55 PM
Mentat: Obama won because he was perceived as the steady hand.

No. wrong. Stop doing this! that election had NOTHING to do with Obama! The only person who couldn't have won that election was Hillary. The Democrats could have run a ham sandwich against McCain and still won (they'd have even gotten the jewish vote). So long as Hillary wasn't in the driver seat, that race was in the bag.

The Republicans were (and continue to be) extremely weak. THAT is why the Democrats are on top of the dogpile right now. Not because they've got wonderful ideas, but because we've got a two party system, and one of the two parties hasn't shown up to the fight. By default, that means it all goes to the Democrats.

Stop thinking that Obama was a great guy who walked on water. McCain was just such a horrible opponent that he had no choice but to make Obama look great in comparison.
 
2009-08-08 12:53:58 PM
We know you have healthcare Weaver95 so you're against it.

/We know you're not a racist.
//Do you see anything good in that massive govenment program called the US Army?
 
2009-08-08 12:54:57 PM
Paschal: We know you have healthcare Weaver95 so you're against it.

/We know you're not a racist.
//Do you see anything good in that massive govenment program called the US Army?


Good? no. Necessary? yes.
 
2009-08-08 12:56:21 PM
Bob16: Weaver95: so if I object to Obamacare because i'm a libertarian who sees NOTHING good in massive government programs....i'm now a racist in your eyes?

No but that libertarian whack job shiat sure ain't helpin ya.

Those farkers are out to lunch.


Yeah, I know - the ideals of freedom, lower taxes/lower spending and/or letting people do their own thing is SOOOO dangerous!
 
2009-08-08 12:56:27 PM
CanisNoir: The Dem's did over play their hand and misinterpret the '06 and '08 elections though. They came to power because the Republicans farked up royally, not because the country suddenly wanted to embrace the Liberal Wish List; they are slowly and painfully learning this lesson though. Let's hope they return from Vacation a little more moderate.


This kind of rational thought is unwelcome in the politics section. You need to see your way over to the geek threads. Only trolling is allowed here.
 
2009-08-08 12:57:21 PM
Abraham Frohman: alostpacket: Abraham Frohman: From the article: "leftosphere"
The other day I saw: "leftopathic"

seriously guys, work on your neologisms.

Leftosphere: just one part of the evil blogocube on the interododecahedron

As opposed to the rightomobius strip of circular logic.


There is this theory of the mobius. A twist in the fabric of space where wharargbl becomes a loop.



where wharargbl becomes a loop.


where wharargbl becomes a loop.


where wharargbl becomes a loop.


where wharargbl becomes a loop.
 
2009-08-08 12:57:23 PM
Abraham Frohman: FTFA: "It's going to be a long August, isn't it? Let's hope the uncharted territory we're in doesn't turn dark."

hello implicit threat. how are you?


I heard the death threats against Obama are just off the charts when you compare them to the number that Shrub got. (There's no hate like liberal hate. Sure.)

Still i don't go for any kind of censorship.
 
2009-08-08 12:59:39 PM
Weaver95: Yeah, I know - the ideals of freedom, lower taxes/lower spending and/or letting people do their own thing is SOOOO dangerous!

You know what I'm talkin about.

"We don't need no stinking social programs".

Yeah thats what i call pure genius.
 
2009-08-08 12:59:50 PM
alostpacket: Leftosphere: just one part of the evil blogocube on the interododecahedron

that is amazingly funny. Now if I could just figure out a way to work in some sort of non-Euclidean geometry reference, we'd have a *perfect* fark thread.
 
2009-08-08 01:00:22 PM
Abraham Frohman: Lost Thought 00: She's practically rooting for the murder of the sitting President. How is this not treason?

FTFA: "It's going to be a long August, isn't it? Let's hope the uncharted territory we're in doesn't turn dark."

hello implicit threat. how are you?


Too vague and implicit to be credible - much like the rest of the article, actually.

I'm curious - a vocal, rabble-rousing minority of folks guided by interests unable to make direct headway is somehow grounds to "back off?" Have we become a nation of cowards?

Ms. Noonan, with all due respect, you knuckle under far too readily. Sometimes, before a brilliant person can do something great, they must first look foolish to the crowd. This is, indeed, one of those times, and to cravenly turn tail & run would signal that this "strategy" is somehow appropriate, that inane caterwauling by easily-led fools is just the way to end discourse on contentious issues.

Sometimes, you just have to stand up to morons and do what's right even if it scares them.
 
2009-08-08 01:00:22 PM
Is it necessary because Saddam is worse than Hitler or because he's going to invade us? The Cold War is over. We spend more than four times what China spends on their military, which is the next largest military budget. How about we cut back on that a bit and give healthcare to the 59 million people in the US that don't have any? It seems like a rational idea.
 
2009-08-08 01:00:38 PM
When you are a bloodthirsty greedy Republican who is subsidized by the health care industry, I can see how someone receiving the life saving medical treatments they need, instead of the CEO pocketing an extra $100k could seem like a "terrifying" ordeal.
 
2009-08-08 01:02:52 PM
Bob16: Weaver95: Yeah, I know - the ideals of freedom, lower taxes/lower spending and/or letting people do their own thing is SOOOO dangerous!

You know what I'm talkin about.

"We don't need no stinking social programs".

Yeah thats what i call pure genius.


A lot of them should be phased out, yes. But the core of the libertarian belief system is that government is a 'necessary evil'. Individuals are the ones who can best decide what is right for themselves. That's everything from gay marriage to lower spending/tax cuts.

The real reason that so many people hate/fear the libertarians and their ideas is because everyone is afraid that if we let go of government control that someone will make the 'wrong' decision about how to live their lives. Right wing and left wing alike are terrified that one day the country will wake up and realize nobody needs them anymore.
 
2009-08-08 01:03:26 PM
yelmrog: You're right. They're much much scarier than conservative men. The men seem pre-occupied with the whole macho thing and trying to fit into some strange Hollywood mold of a tough guy. The women seem like bloodthirsty animals.

Thats not quite what i had in mind.

What i was refering to was the whole contradiction of the nurturing/compassion gender role of women and the lack of said characteristics in cons.
 
2009-08-08 01:04:11 PM
Weaver95: Mentat: Obama won because he was perceived as the steady hand.

No. wrong. Stop doing this! that election had NOTHING to do with Obama! The only person who couldn't have won that election was Hillary. The Democrats could have run a ham sandwich against McCain and still won (they'd have even gotten the jewish vote). So long as Hillary wasn't in the driver seat, that race was in the bag.

The Republicans were (and continue to be) extremely weak. THAT is why the Democrats are on top of the dogpile right now. Not because they've got wonderful ideas, but because we've got a two party system, and one of the two parties hasn't shown up to the fight. By default, that means it all goes to the Democrats.

Stop thinking that Obama was a great guy who walked on water. McCain was just such a horrible opponent that he had no choice but to make Obama look great in comparison.


Maybe, just maybe.... just gonna throw this out there... just possibly Obama won for more reasons than just a few sentences that either of you wrote. Maybe, just maybe, you're both right, and both wrong.
 
2009-08-08 01:06:07 PM
Weaver95: alostpacket: Leftosphere: just one part of the evil blogocube on the interododecahedron

that is amazingly funny. Now if I could just figure out a way to work in some sort of non-Euclidean geometry reference, we'd have a *perfect* fark thread.


perfect nerds, we are :D
 
2009-08-08 01:06:55 PM
Weaver95: A lot of them should be phased out, yes.

Strange talk in the middle of the second great republican depression.

If anything capitalism demonstrates more and more everyday that it doesn't have enough of a safety net but the libertarians are a clueless lot.
 
2009-08-08 01:08:07 PM
Weaver95, I agree with a lot of the libertarian ideals, but they are a pipedream, much like my belief that we should stop supplying the world with arms, so we don't have to attack them periodically to take them away. If only . . .
 
2009-08-08 01:08:20 PM
So the new meme is 'Democrats are a-scared because we real Amurricans are a winning!' Because we all know that paid spokespeople for the insurance companies threatening Democratic congresspeople is what Real America does when they don't get their way: resorts to the same terrorism that they claim to hate.

Peggy Noonan, suck my cock, you pathetic sack of dogshiat.
 
2009-08-08 01:09:23 PM
alostpacket: Maybe, just maybe.... just gonna throw this out there... just possibly Obama won for more reasons than just a few sentences that either of you wrote. Maybe, just maybe, you're both right, and both wrong.

we have a two party system. In a key election under that system, one guy brought his A game. He was prepared, he was juiced up. He *wanted* to win! The other guy showed up 15 minute late, wearing a rumpled suit and looked like he'd gotten maybe 2 hours of sleep the night before the election started. He did not bring his A game. In fact he brought NO game. He was not prepared.

This was no 'clash of the Titans'. The end result was inevitable. But claiming that Obama won the election because he was 'better' is intellectually dishonest - he did not face an opponent of equal skill.
 
2009-08-08 01:11:32 PM
Weaver95: Good? no. Necessary? yes.

As soon as you open the door to social programs like the military then you admit that social programs are needed.

After that it just becomes a matter of opinion as to which social programs are needed and which aren't.

And anybodys opinion has the same value as anybody elses opinion.
 
2009-08-08 01:12:16 PM
Weaver95: alostpacket: Maybe, just maybe.... just gonna throw this out there... just possibly Obama won for more reasons than just a few sentences that either of you wrote. Maybe, just maybe, you're both right, and both wrong.

we have a two party system. In a key election under that system, one guy brought his A game. He was prepared, he was juiced up. He *wanted* to win! The other guy showed up 15 minute late, wearing a rumpled suit and looked like he'd gotten maybe 2 hours of sleep the night before the election started. He did not bring his A game. In fact he brought NO game. He was not prepared.

This was no 'clash of the Titans'. The end result was inevitable. But claiming that Obama won the election because he was 'better' is intellectually dishonest - he did not face an opponent of equal skill.


Mentant never said better though, he said perceived as a steady hand.

Seems accurate enough an opinion, as yours does also.
 
2009-08-08 01:12:25 PM
Bob16: yelmrog: You're right. They're much much scarier than conservative men. The men seem pre-occupied with the whole macho thing and trying to fit into some strange Hollywood mold of a tough guy. The women seem like bloodthirsty animals.

Thats not quite what i had in mind.

What i was refering to was the whole contradiction of the nurturing/compassion gender role of women and the lack of said characteristics in cons.


I stand by my statement. Ultra-Conservative women are insane. Possibly because it's more of a paradoxical leap for them.
 
2009-08-08 01:13:03 PM
Bob16: Strange talk in the middle of the second great republican depression.

Eventually the money is going to run out. I'd like to have something left after we finish bailout out wall street and paying out everyone's unemployment AND health care coverage!

I'd like to wean everyone off government programs. From private individuals to major corporations - no more handouts! But that's not likely to happen while everyone is lining up to get their share of government funding.
 
2009-08-08 01:13:48 PM
Bob16: As soon as you open the door to social programs like the military then you admit that social programs are needed..

you really don't have a clue, do you?
 
2009-08-08 01:14:01 PM
Weaver95: Stop thinking that Obama was a great guy who walked on water. McCain was just such a horrible opponent that he had no choice but to make Obama look great in comparison.

That's a big leap from "Obama is the steady hand" to "Obama is the Messiah". Obama gained a reputation during the campaign as cool under fire. He never let the Clintons get under his skin, he handled the Ayers and Wright controversies smoothly and, when the economy collapsed, he was perceived as the calm rational leader while McCain was running around like a chicken with his head cut off. It's not far-fetched to suggest that that played a role in his victory and polls at the time would seem to support that.
 
2009-08-08 01:14:31 PM
Weaver95: Eventually the money is going to run out. I'd like to have something left after we finish bailout out wall street and paying out everyone's unemployment AND health care coverage!

I'd like to wean everyone off government programs. From private individuals to major corporations - no more handouts! But that's not likely to happen while everyone is lining up to get their share of government funding.


As someone who recently lost their job and is now on unemployment, I'm really getting a kick...
 
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