Hmm, I thought the conservatives were trumpeting that no one was using it and it was humiliating for Obama?

Guess not.

I guess that just proves that nobody was going to use it, it was too complicated to understand, and all that gibberish that the GOP spewed. I guess it should have been increased in money. You know, government helping it's people. No wonder the GOP fought so hard against it.

Gwendolyn: car not care. I think I have a brain tumor or something

I hope you're insured!

I was thinking about this for awhile, i knew it was going to happen(myself and some friends that work as car sales people saw this coming). It's crazy to think about, but at the highest payout(4500), and a budget of 950mil, it equals out to about 210k sales. I know, that's only ballparking it, but when you realize that that's a bit less than 10% of some of the larger auto maker's yearly sales, and about on par with their monthly ones, it's fairly glaring that they were going to run broke pretty damn quick.


/I'm still for it
//But yeah, didn't work out too well, did it?
///and it might screw recyclers in the end, too

BlackCat23: didn't work out too well, did it?

Umm, if they sold 210k vehicles in a week and got rid of the same number of jalopies I'd say it worked out exactly as intended.

I predict these threads will be pretty empty of Fark Independents until Rush and Malkin issue the talking points either late tomorrow or Monday. Though I can't imagine how they will spin this as failure... it's possible they'll wait a week or two and then refer to it as 'having failed' until it gets more funding, and which time they will just stop mentioning it.

feckingmorons: I pick it up Friday afternoon.

What happened to your brave positions against government handouts? You oppose them all the time, hell I think you opposed this one. But you go and use it yourself? What a strong stand for your positions.

7of7: BlackCat23: didn't work out too well, did it?

Umm, if they sold 210k vehicles in a week and got rid of the same number of jalopies I'd say it worked out exactly as intended.

DId you miss the part where that's less than 10% of a single auto makers yearly sales? Drop in the bucket. I don't forsee this making any large dents in anything but wallets at this rate. Yes, yes, it did sell ~210k cars, that's all well and good. But many of those "jalopies" are in fact, not. Many of them also have perfectly usable parts on them, which could be used by salvage yards, but in this case can't because the feds call for the destruction of important parts, such as drivetrains, leaving another industry to suffer(though in reality, it's a drop in their bucket, as well; if the numbers overall stay this small, salvage likely won't be effected that much).

I don't see this as a success. Congrats. You outsold.... lemme see here... Acura, audi, various "Boutique" makers(rolls, bently, etc) hummer, Cadillac, and obiously more. But it all comes to less than 2% of total sales numbers. ~13.5 MILLION cars were sold in this country in 2008, yes, a 35 or so % dropoff from the year before, but the point still stands.

A great idea? A popular idea? One that we know people want and will use? Yes. Properly executed? Likely not. I can't tell you how to fix it, but it's pretty obvious that it didn't work quiet the way it was expected, or wanted to, that's all.

feckingmorons: Sweet. At lunch time I took my 13 year old Suburban we used to haul the boat about 3 times a year and got a new Mercedes SLK 3.0L Roadster for $36409. The sticker price was 44 dollars less than the 45K cut off for the program.

Careful. You have to remember all of this bullshiat.

BlackCat23: Did you miss the part where that's less than 10% of a single auto makers yearly sales? Drop in the bucket. I don't forsee this making any large dents in anything but wallets at this rate. Yes, yes, it did sell ~210k cars, that's all well and good. But many of those "jalopies" are in fact, not. Many of them also have perfectly usable parts on them, which could be used by salvage yards,

Who cares if it's 10% of yearly sales? Do you think a company is a failure if it has a sale in a week which accounts for 10% of its yearly sales? Those parts are only perfectly usable in jalopies. One of the goals was to get jalopies off the road so having spare parts for them sitting around would be directly counter to that goal.

BlackCat23: it's pretty obvious that it didn't work quiet the way it was expected, or wanted to, that's all.

You never explained how it has been a failure. Sales are sales whether or not you think so and getting shiatty cars off the road is a good thing.

7of7: BlackCat23: Did you miss the part where that's less than 10% of a single auto makers yearly sales? Drop in the bucket. I don't forsee this making any large dents in anything but wallets at this rate. Yes, yes, it did sell ~210k cars, that's all well and good. But many of those "jalopies" are in fact, not. Many of them also have perfectly usable parts on them, which could be used by salvage yards,

Who cares if it's 10% of yearly sales? Do you think a company is a failure if it has a sale in a week which accounts for 10% of its yearly sales? Those parts are only perfectly usable in jalopies. One of the goals was to get jalopies off the road so having spare parts for them sitting around would be directly counter to that goal.

I'd like to note that in this two way convo, you're the only one saying "failure". I never said it was, i said i didn't see it as a huge, clean working, success.

These are not intertwined. And when i said 10% of sales, that was for ONE auto maker, just toyota. ALL The CfC sales amount to less than 10% of JUST toyota's sales. As for parts only usable in "jalopies", man, that was enough to make me think "U'S TROLLIN'", but i can't get the idea out of my mind that you actually believe that.

The average US car owner keeps their car anywhere from 6-10 years. You're going to tell me that a perfectly good, running, 1999 acura is a jalopie? How about a 2000 Audi A6? Or maybe an '02 Buick Rendezvous? No? Uhm... yk2 catara? it's a decent little car... Still garbage to you? 01 Eldarado? No? '02 crown vic? you see a pattern here? At this rate, they may as well just suck it up, and do what Japan and parts of the EU have been doing for years, and tax engine displacement.

BlackCat23: it's pretty obvious that it didn't work quiet the way it was expected, or wanted to, that's all.

You never explained how it has been a failure. Sales are sales whether or not you think so and getting shiatty cars off the road is a good thing.


Again, you're the only one saying "failure". I said I didn't see it as a success, maybe i should have been more clear. I don't see it as a success in that the program worked quite as intended. It's also been a paperwork nightmare for dealers. Someone mentioned it could be considered a successful PILOT program. This i can agree with, but there's work to be done. It'd be nice to see this continue, but 1)set the infestructure BEFORE going striaght into the program. and 2)get the actual polluting cars off the road. Gas milage does not a polluter make. There's plenty of cars out there(such as the audis)that get not-so-good gas milage, but aren't nessicarily spewing emissions at the rate of say, an 81 pinto. Also: nix the "nothing over 25 years old" clause. They may be a minority in the car world, but they are some of the worst offenders, as well.

feckingmorons: So I am not supposed to take money from programs I opposed but that passed anyway. I took Bush's three hundred dollar check 8 years ago and I thought that as stupid too.

Seems like that goes against your own positions to speak out so much against wasteful spending and then go enforce said wasteful spending. But I guess if you decide that what you say and what you do only have a passing connection to each other, well then I guess that's fine.

feckingmorons: I didn't enforce it, I have no ability to enforce it I just participated in the misguided give away of our tax money.

If it is free it is for me!

Just seems like if you're going to oppose a program you shouldn't use it. Principles and all. Just tells me what kind of person you are.

feckingmorons: Mercedes SLK 3.0L Roadster

Wait, how did you get a trade in for this when a Google says that car only gets 26 MPG Highway? Is that right? If it is, you didn't just use a program you opposed, you abused it with wasteful government spending.

Gwendolyn: I'm guessing an old ass Suburban gets like 9 miles to the gallon. lol You only need to get 10 mpg more for the money.

Edwards puts a 1996 Suburban at 14 MPG. Yeah it qualified for the program, but using it to buy a shiatty mileage Mercedes wasn't the farking point. It was designed to buy high MPG vehicles. What kind of person talks big about stopping wasteful government spending and then goes out and engages in it?

GAT_00: Edwards

Edmunds, dammit. Can we please get an edit option for like 5 minutes after posts?

feckingmorons: I oppsed it because it was a waste of tax money.

Tax money you were happy to waste yourself. You personally made a something you consider a problem worse, and you have no problem with that? So much more for moral principles.

Yes, yes I did. The government says a 93 4WD Suburban gets 13 miles per gallon. My new car gets 21 according to the government, it it got 23 I would have score a extra 1 large.

I guess following the spirit of the bill was also something you missed, which I guess makes sense because you were too busy denouncing something you used yourself.

The problem with this program is anyone who wants to trade in a car less than 25 years old and the new car gets at least 10 miles more a gallon.

I wanted to use this to get a new Yaris or Focus, and trade in my Chrysler Sebring; however it gets a combined 21 MPG. I could probably sell it for 6K, its a really nice one.

Gwendolyn: car not care. I think I have a brain tumor or something

Most farkers have a good sense of tumour.

So, ummm, we spent nearly a billion dollars in a week and all we got is like 200,000 older cars off the road. Thats like Everyone is St. Paul, MN suddenly getting a few more MPG. Wow, I can feel mother earth healing herself right now.
Then there is the fiscal side - wow the dealers were bustling - for a WEEK.
Not money well spent IMHO

BlackCat23: 1999 acura is a jalopie? How about a 2000 Audi A6? Or maybe an '02 Buick Rendezvous? No? Uhm... yk2 catara? it's a decent little car... Still garbage to you? 01 Eldarado? No? '02 crown vic?

Only a complete and utter moron would 'trash' one of those cars (assuming they were running well) to get 4500 off a new, higher MPG car. If that's what ended up happening, it will be taken into account and you probably won't see this program again. I wouldn't bet on that being the case -- Americans are pretty farking stupid, but not that stupid.

well that was a fun article. too bad they didnt check the facts on it.

http://www.cars.gov/

$779M Estimated funds remaining for all vehicles except for CAT3 Trucks.

$75M Estimated funds remaining for CAT3 Trucks.

Last update 7/30/2009 at 10am eastern time.

Another problem solved! Is there anything government can't do?

The money isn't exhausted...the government has suddenly decided they're not going to give it to you.

I had really bad feeling that this was going to happen. Oh well...

Just picked up my new car today. Dropped off the 10 year old suv. Ten minutes later, driving home in the new car, I heard about this on the radio.