Millennium: Mrs. Chomsky: when did it become en vogue to prounounce having disorders like they're farking character traits? AARGH.

Not long after it became en vogue to describe character traits as having disorders.

In all seriousness, ODD is a real thing, though like many "school-age disorders" it is horribly overdiagnosed. This doesn't mean it's not dangerous. Someone with a genuine case of ODD needs accommodations and facilities that, to be perfectly frank, a normal school environment cannot provide, nor should it be expected to given the bona fide danger such students present to faculty, staff, and the other students.

THIS. The last thing this asshole kid needs is media attention. The smug look on his face is telling. His mother should be ashamed that she is such a failure and has no control over the boy. Boot camp or something similiar is the only option for someone that is a menace to society.

ElPresidente: Beating is not always the answer. I have a much more obvious way - stop rewarding bad behaviour, and let them punish themselves. Example:

My son tried his first temper tantrum at age three. Wouldn't take his nap, even though he was exhausted. My wife tried to get him to do it, but he screamed and screamed until they were both angry and upset. She came downstairs, and upstairs I went to take over.

Son: SCREAM!!!

Me: OK, you have a choice. You can either take a nap, or this toy (picking up one at random, but in reality one that should have been thrown away anyway) goes into the trash can forever. It's all your choice. What will it be?

Son: SCREAM!!!

Me: OK. (Toy goes into bin.) That's your choice!

Son: DOUBLE SCREAM!!!

Me: Don't yell at me, that was your choice. OK, now you have another choice. You can either take a nap, or another toy goes into the trash can forever. It's your choice. What will it be?

Son: SCREAM!!!

Me: OK. (Another toy goes into bin.) That's your choice!

Son: TRIPLE SCREAM!!!

Me: Like I said, it was your choice. OK, you have another choice. You can either take a nap, or yet another toy goes into the trash can forever. It's your choice. What will it be?

Son goes to sleep for two hours, never repeats episode again. And yes, the toys did get thrown away forever. But he learned that his actions, both good and bad, had consequences. That's what this brat needed from the start.

Sonny's jobless single mother Nadine West, 38, who has three other children, said: 'I have done everything in my power to rein him in, but he just does not listen to me.'

That's because he has no respect for you, because you're a farking useless parent who's leeching off the state, you obviously can't keep your legs together, and you probably compensate by trying to buy your children's love using taxpayers' money, you tattooed twunt. How much did the Daily Fail pay you to advertise how farking useless you are as a parent? And your little toe rag just got rewarded for his rotten behaviour by being famous. Good job, mum. Go EABOD and take your little terror with you.

WIN!!

kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. His mother buys into the ADHD he was diagnosed with when he was 12, and has been shoving pills down his throat ever since.

Since no one else is gonna say it, I will.

Why stay? Kick him and his mom to the curb. If the daughter is yours, keep her and bag the rest.

I am sorry if this is touchy, but no matter how much i loved someone, I would have either put a stop to this immediately or (and I have dated women with children previously, so i understand how this could be) when the mother refused to allow me to intervene even once, I would have been done. Once a boy like that sees running to mommy works, then you authority is gonna be hella hard to get back. Why stay with a woman who was weak enough to raise this boy?

Yeah, I know this is Fark and some of the snark is pretty funnay, but . . .

For those of you that think it is a matter of parental lack, DIAF. A disorder diagnosis is very over-used so when it really is what is wrong too many people dismiss it.

My 16yo son is ODD. Since he was 7 or 8 I have been begging and pleading for help from anyone I could find. He has been to 4 dfifferent psychologists, a psychiatrist, various ADD drugs and anti-psychotics, 1 year of all boys military boarding school, and now he is in juvenile lock up. So don't give my that shait that I'm a bad parent and just need to smack him into compliance. I did that too, didn't work either and now he is bigger than me.

Part of ODD is not having any ability to forsee the consequences. I have done all that I can think of from spanking, time outs, taking away privileges, emptying his room, sending him away, you name it, I've tried.

It is real and is like living in a war zone. Now, since he is in juvi, all he is learning is how to be a better criminal. Hopefully I can help him stay out of trouble long enough to get him into the military.

On the flip side, my 14yo daughter is a straigt "A" student whom I would never hesitate to trust. She is very responsible and certainly has a great idea of what consequences are. Same parents, same house, same rules. Just not f'ed up in the brain wiring department.

buffalosoldier: kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. His mother buys into the ADHD he was diagnosed with when he was 12, and has been shoving pills down his throat ever since.

Since no one else is gonna say it, I will.

Why stay? Kick him and his mom to the curb. If the daughter is yours, keep her and bag the rest.

I am sorry if this is touchy, but no matter how much i loved someone, I would have either put a stop to this immediately or (and I have dated women with children previously, so i understand how this could be) when the mother refused to allow me to intervene even once, I would have been done. Once a boy like that sees running to mommy works, then you authority is gonna be hella hard to get back. Why stay with a woman who was weak enough to raise this boy?

well said

mabel: Yeah, I know this is Fark and some of the snark is pretty funnay, but . . .

For those of you that think it is a matter of parental lack, DIAF. A disorder diagnosis is very over-used so when it really is what is wrong too many people dismiss it.

My 16yo son is ODD. Since he was 7 or 8 I have been begging and pleading for help from anyone I could find. He has been to 4 dfifferent psychologists, a psychiatrist, various ADD drugs and anti-psychotics, 1 year of all boys military boarding school, and now he is in juvenile lock up. So don't give my that shait that I'm a bad parent and just need to smack him into compliance. I did that too, didn't work either and now he is bigger than me.

Part of ODD is not having any ability to forsee the consequences. I have done all that I can think of from spanking, time outs, taking away privileges, emptying his room, sending him away, you name it, I've tried.

It is real and is like living in a war zone. Now, since he is in juvi, all he is learning is how to be a better criminal. Hopefully I can help him stay out of trouble long enough to get him into the military.

On the flip side, my 14yo daughter is a straigt "A" student whom I would never hesitate to trust. She is very responsible and certainly has a great idea of what consequences are. Same parents, same house, same rules. Just not f'ed up in the brain wiring department.

Occasionally, yes, there are some who are just messed up from day one.

These two however, are chav-tacular. This sprog was doomed for a very different reason.

Sonny's jobless single mother Nadine West, 38, who has three other children, said: 'I have done everything in my power to rein him in, but he just does not listen to me.'

GAH! Dr. Darwin says to take 5 of these and call me when the gene pool has been chlorinated.

/Is teh hot.

ElPresidente: One more thing: If you decide to beat your kids (I'm not judging anyone here), be careful when they get to be adults. My 18-year-old son over 6' and athletic, and frankly, if he wanted to, could probably kill me - slowly and painfully. Glad now I didn't beat him when he was a kid, and that we have such a good relationship. Just sayin' today's thrashed toddlers are tomorrow's incredible hulks. Sleep well, everyone.

The thing is if you apply spankings properly (not beatings, that is an attempt to demonize people who do not agree) by the time the kid is an adult they will realize that they actually were doing something to deserve it. I was a bit of a handful as a kid, very smart and bored, fascinated with fire too. At the time when my ass was sore I hated my mom and what not, but as an adult I realize that it was either that or let me burn everything down.

/One time I set the cat on fire. It ran under my mom's bed and set that on fire.
//Better believe I got spanked for that!
///Kitty was OK.

The Butcher Boy? (new window)

ha. homely little bastard.

Jormungandr: ElPresidente: One more thing: If you decide to beat your kids (I'm not judging anyone here), be careful when they get to be adults. My 18-year-old son over 6' and athletic, and frankly, if he wanted to, could probably kill me - slowly and painfully. Glad now I didn't beat him when he was a kid, and that we have such a good relationship. Just sayin' today's thrashed toddlers are tomorrow's incredible hulks. Sleep well, everyone.

The thing is if you apply spankings properly (not beatings, that is an attempt to demonize people who do not agree) by the time the kid is an adult they will realize that they actually were doing something to deserve it. I was a bit of a handful as a kid, very smart and bored, fascinated with fire too. At the time when my ass was sore I hated my mom and what not, but as an adult I realize that it was either that or let me burn everything down.

/One time I set the cat on fire. It ran under my mom's bed and set that on fire.
//Better believe I got spanked for that!
///Kitty was OK.

Now, the proper disciplinary method here, would be to set you on fire.

//Seriously, you're lucky I ain't your daddy
//WTF were you thinking?!

buffalosoldier: kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. His mother buys into the ADHD he was diagnosed with when he was 12, and has been shoving pills down his throat ever since.

Since no one else is gonna say it, I will.

Why stay? Kick him and his mom to the curb. If the daughter is yours, keep her and bag the rest.

I am sorry if this is touchy, but no matter how much i loved someone, I would have either put a stop to this immediately or (and I have dated women with children previously, so i understand how this could be) when the mother refused to allow me to intervene even once, I would have been done. Once a boy like that sees running to mommy works, then you authority is gonna be hella hard to get back. Why stay with a woman who was weak enough to raise this boy?

I'm not going to make excuses, or get into a pissing contest, because believe me, those thoughts are on my mind.

As I'm sure you are aware, life isn't always "that simple".

I can't speak for her when she had her son, but she isn't weak, at least not now.

We are both doing what we can in this situation. Her responsibility is to raise her children, mine is to protect the house we all share.

I'm sure taking the easy way out seems very appealing, but isn't that really part of the problem? His response to his issues are to run away, talk back, or play the blame game.

If I were do the same thing (run away or blame his mother), what kind of a message would that send? Wouldn't that just justify his behavior.

She has offered to move out, so it's not like this isn't clear to both of us as far as what is going on.

As I said, 4 months to adulthood, then we'll see.

It's respect basically.

Hit them when they do something bad?
You are powerful and deserve respect.
Hit them when you are angry?
You are cruel and do not deserve respect.

Put them into time outs for the full duration?
You are resolute and deserve respect.
Let them out when you get tired of putting them back in their place?
You are weak and do not deserve respect.

Take away privileges and do not return them until the requirements are met?
You are unwavering and deserve respect.
Let them have it back after they apologize or the full term hasn't passed?
You can be manipulated and are not worthy of respect.

If your children do not respect you they will not listen to you. No child is the same so some methods will not properly work on everyone but anyway you look at it your goal as a parent is to teach your children respect by any means necessary.

Two situations result from improper rearing. Children will grow up and openly disobey you doing what they want instead. They do not respect you or your rules. Or Children will learn what makes you angry and ensure you don't find out about it.

I learned to respect my parents rules. Stealing, drinking, sex weren't bad because my parents said it was. They were bad because I understood why my parents did not want me to do them. Regardless of what I do out of their care while I lived with them I understood and respected their rules

There is a big difference between knowing the rules and respecting them

//This yob in TFA wouldn't know a rule if it came flying out of his mothers gaping twut and stole his snickers bar

kevljo:
Vendor please?

Did you just call him the v-word?

Littledogg: The world needs henchmen too.

You win. That was funny.

gothelder: That kid aint got nothing an ass whopping wont cure.

My girlfriends 13 year old has Oppositional Defiance Disorder, Attention Defesit Disorder and is transgendered....(I.E. She was born a male, but always knew she was "wrong").

First time (At the time "he") got into my stuff after being told not to, "he" got an ass whopping and has not touched my stuff again in 6 years without asking permission.

/ Oh and she has the WORST fashion sense and personal hygiene I have ever seen.
// That would be the daughter, not the girlfriend.

Um, you sure you want to be dating somebody whose DNA resulted in that monstrosity?

Really?

tuxedobob: Damn Farkers must be blind...

He tends to sleep for only two hours a night and has tablets to sedate him in the evening.

I'm all for calling someone a failure too, but two hours a night? That's not normal. Without the tablets, would he simply never sleep?

aagrajag: Jormungandr: ElPresidente: One more thing: If you decide to beat your kids (I'm not judging anyone here), be careful when they get to be adults. My 18-year-old son over 6' and athletic, and frankly, if he wanted to, could probably kill me - slowly and painfully. Glad now I didn't beat him when he was a kid, and that we have such a good relationship. Just sayin' today's thrashed toddlers are tomorrow's incredible hulks. Sleep well, everyone.

The thing is if you apply spankings properly (not beatings, that is an attempt to demonize people who do not agree) by the time the kid is an adult they will realize that they actually were doing something to deserve it. I was a bit of a handful as a kid, very smart and bored, fascinated with fire too. At the time when my ass was sore I hated my mom and what not, but as an adult I realize that it was either that or let me burn everything down.

/One time I set the cat on fire. It ran under my mom's bed and set that on fire.
//Better believe I got spanked for that!
///Kitty was OK.

Now, the proper disciplinary method here, would be to set you on fire.

//Seriously, you're lucky I ain't your daddy
//WTF were you thinking?!

I guess my mom didn't think setting me on fire would work as I sorta did that myself by accident.

As to what I was thinking -- Honestly? "Ooooo, fire pretty. This thing burns with a yellow flame. This thing burns really smokey... I wonder what the cat's tail looks like on fire. Oh no stupid cat come back! I gotta put your tail out!" The child version of me was as captivated by fire as most adult males are by a really nice set of tits on a gorgeous woman. The spanking did work and I never set the cat on fire again... Or any other living thing.

scarchin: another girl: I'm a therapist who works with kids with ODD, so I'm really getting a kick, etc...

Most of the work I end up doing is on parenting skills. I'm just sayin'.

Exactly!
I'm sick of sitting around a table with a bunch of teachers, the kid, and his parents and talking around the issue.
A lot of the time the parents a clearly whackjobs - usually involved in a bitter divorce or alcohol/drugs or BOTH - and everyone's pretending not to notice.We then all decide what the TEACHERS are going to do differently.
EPIC FAIL - rinse, repeat year after year

as a future HS teacher, I agree. The school system pretty much sucks as it is, but one look at a kid's parents immediately answers the question, "why is the little farker like this?"

Jormungandr: tuxedobob: Damn Farkers must be blind...

He tends to sleep for only two hours a night and has tablets to sedate him in the evening.

I'm all for calling someone a failure too, but two hours a night? That's not normal. Without the tablets, would he simply never sleep?

aagrajag: Jormungandr: ElPresidente: One more thing: If you decide to beat your kids (I'm not judging anyone here), be careful when they get to be adults. My 18-year-old son over 6' and athletic, and frankly, if he wanted to, could probably kill me - slowly and painfully. Glad now I didn't beat him when he was a kid, and that we have such a good relationship. Just sayin' today's thrashed toddlers are tomorrow's incredible hulks. Sleep well, everyone.

The thing is if you apply spankings properly (not beatings, that is an attempt to demonize people who do not agree) by the time the kid is an adult they will realize that they actually were doing something to deserve it. I was a bit of a handful as a kid, very smart and bored, fascinated with fire too. At the time when my ass was sore I hated my mom and what not, but as an adult I realize that it was either that or let me burn everything down.

/One time I set the cat on fire. It ran under my mom's bed and set that on fire.
//Better believe I got spanked for that!
///Kitty was OK.

Now, the proper disciplinary method here, would be to set you on fire.

//Seriously, you're lucky I ain't your daddy
//WTF were you thinking?!

I guess my mom didn't think setting me on fire would work as I sorta did that myself by accident.

As to what I was thinking -- Honestly? "Ooooo, fire pretty. This thing burns with a yellow flame. This thing burns really smokey... I wonder what the cat's tail looks like on fire. Oh no stupid cat come back! I gotta put your tail out!" The child version of me was as captivated by fire as most adult males are by a really nice set of tits on a gorgeous woman. The spanking did work and I never set the cat on fire again... Or any other living thing.

Good...that's...good...

I too spent quite a bit of time as a kid having lots of fun with lighters, hairspray, firecrackers... somehow the cat just never got involved.

Zed-ex: This yob in TFA wouldn't know a rule if it came flying out of his mothers gaping twut and stole his snickers bar

Is that where rules come from in your household? I... think we might be using a different definition of the word "rule". See, where I'm from, a "rule" is a verbal set of standing instructions informing people what is and is not permitted. Where you're from, a "rule" is apparently some kind of miniature, food-stealing, airborne twunt-goblin.

Where are you from? I want to avoid it.

/with all due :)

bad parenting is bad parenting.

Since I complain a lot about the "disorders" listed in the DSM, I figured I might as well scope out what they say on wiki about it:

Cautions

The DSM-IV-TR states, because it is produced for the completion of Federal legislative mandates, its use by people without clinical training can lead to inappropriate application of its contents. Appropriate use of the diagnostic criteria is said to require extensive clinical training, and its contents "cannot simply be applied in a cookbook fashion". The APA notes diagnostic labels are primarily for use as a "convenient shorthand" among professionals. The DSM advises laypersons should consult the DSM only to obtain information, not to make diagnoses, and people who may have a mental disorder should be referred to psychological counseling or treatment. Further, a shared diagnosis/label may have different etiologies (causes) or require different treatments; the DSM contains no information regarding treatment or cause for this reason. The range of the DSM represents an extensive scope of psychiatric and psychological issues or conditions, and it is not exclusive to what may be considered "illnesses".

(second boldface mine)

/but it sure does help you find research topics for "Pile-Higher-and-Deeper" advanced study!

technofiend: scottywotty: Beating the kids ass is not the answer.
As demonstrated above, there are better ways to correct a childs behaviour.
Resorting to physical punishment basically says you have surrendered to stupidity and have been intellectually defeated by a child.

Or that it's in your spectrum of punishments available. Should it go from 12 years of coddling the little bastard to daily beatings? No. But it should be possible to escalate to the point where that's an option. Children aren't tiny adults that can be reasoned with: they need structure, form and consequences.

They need rules they can understand even if they don't understand or agree with the reasons. Talking to a child and reasoning with them treats them as an equal. They are not.

Thank YOU!!!

kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. yadda yadda story yadda yadda

Dude. I have no idea what the 17 year old is doing that makes you feel like you're not safe in your house.

He's obviously an idiot if he dropped out of school and got caught with weed, but why don't you just send him to delinquent school in Haiti? My aunt did that to my cousin. She had to stay until graduation even though she turned 18, because the age laws aren't the same down there.

I think you'd be much happier.

In all honesty, I have no idea how I DIDN'T end up like this kid.

I mean, taking a look back at my childhood, there wasn't much stability in my life. First off, my mother was diagnosed with Lupus when I was 6 and was hospital-bound for the next four years until her death. I got to see her for maybe 4 hours every other day or so. Her illness and death hit my brother and dad pretty hard and they never saw eye to eye with each other. I remember a lot of late night shouting matches between them. Eventually it was too much for my brother and he left the house never to return. I only now see him occasionally - ie: once a year at Christmas. My father hit the bottle pretty badly leading up to and after my mom died and was the epitome of a working alcoholic. The guy could polish off a bottle of Golden Wedding over the course of the afternoon and report to work later on in the evening. And when he wasn't drinking he worked. Night and day. Usually 6 days a week. For the most part, my life revolved around waking up, getting breakfast, going to school, and coming home to make my own dinner - ALONE. That all continued for about 6 years until I was well into High School and my dad started seeing his new girlfriend (now his second wife). In all that time there was no such thing as family vacations for me. No days out to the ball game or even birthday celebrations. Just myself growing up with friends and their parents taking the place of my own family.

But with all that heartache and all that conflict within my home, not once have I ever felt the need to steal a car. Not once have I ever desired to smash a neighbours window. Not once had I been compelled to join a gang and terrorize the people living in the community around me.

And that's why I can't stand all these punkass biatches today who think they can get away with the blame game of doing all those things and more and arguing that their homelife is responsible for their behaviour. No - YOU are responsible for your behaviour. YOU can make the choice for yourself to do the right thing and that choice has a lot more to do with your strength of character than anything else.

notauniquesnowflake: kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. yadda yadda story yadda yadda

Dude. I have no idea what the 17 year old is doing that makes you feel like you're not safe in your house.

He's obviously an idiot if he dropped out of school and got caught with weed, but why don't you just send him to delinquent school in Haiti? My aunt did that to my cousin. She had to stay until graduation even though she turned 18, because the age laws aren't the same down there.

I think you'd be much happier.

You must enjoy getting no sleep and having strange cars pull in and out of your driveway at unsocial hours?

And, dude, I won't be sending him anywhere, he is not my son.

kevljo: notauniquesnowflake: kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. yadda yadda story yadda yadda

Dude. I have no idea what the 17 year old is doing that makes you feel like you're not safe in your house.

He's obviously an idiot if he dropped out of school and got caught with weed, but why don't you just send him to delinquent school in Haiti? My aunt did that to my cousin. She had to stay until graduation even though she turned 18, because the age laws aren't the same down there.

I think you'd be much happier.

You must enjoy getting no sleep and having strange cars pull in and out of your driveway at unsocial hours?

And, dude, I won't be sending him anywhere, he is not my son.

Well, they're in your driveway, not your house.

And, ok, semantics, have the girlfriend send him to Haiti. My aunt doesn't have all that much money, and she was able to afford it.

insertcutename: No - YOU are responsible for your behaviour. YOU can make the choice for yourself to do the right thing and that choice has a lot more to do with your strength of character than anything else.

Replace lupus with cancer and it sounds like our childhoods had a lot in common. The school of hard knocks tends to straighten out those nascent flaws we develop early on, unless of course someone mollycoddles the poor brat and gets reinforcement in the blame game from misguided "professionals".

notauniquesnowflake: kevljo: notauniquesnowflake: kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. yadda yadda story yadda yadda

Dude. I have no idea what the 17 year old is doing that makes you feel like you're not safe in your house.

He's obviously an idiot if he dropped out of school and got caught with weed, but why don't you just send him to delinquent school in Haiti? My aunt did that to my cousin. She had to stay until graduation even though she turned 18, because the age laws aren't the same down there.

I think you'd be much happier.

You must enjoy getting no sleep and having strange cars pull in and out of your driveway at unsocial hours?

And, dude, I won't be sending him anywhere, he is not my son.

Well, they're in your driveway, not your house.

And, ok, semantics, have the girlfriend send him to Haiti. My aunt doesn't have all that much money, and she was able to afford it.

Ok, appreciate the comments, will discuss it with committee.

I'm still for sending him to basic training, so even if the gf changes her mind, we'll still be at odds.

"Oppositional Defiant Disorder" is nothing that a good dose of "Fist-Related Teeth Disorder" can't counterbalance.

ElPresidente: Son goes to sleep for two hours, never repeats episode again. And yes, the toys did get thrown away forever. But he learned that his actions, both good and bad, had consequences. That's what this brat needed from the start.

Works fine if your goddamn wife doesn't fish them out of the trash, clean them off, and hand them back surreptitiously later.

TypoFlyspray: ElPresidente: Son goes to sleep for two hours, never repeats episode again. And yes, the toys did get thrown away forever. But he learned that his actions, both good and bad, had consequences. That's what this brat needed from the start.

Works fine if your goddamn wife doesn't fish them out of the trash, clean them off, and hand them back surreptitiously later.

I have a selection of words and phrases that will help you:
Trash compactor
fire
dumpster
hammer
discussion with wife
divorce

amanogowa: TypoFlyspray: ElPresidente: Son goes to sleep for two hours, never repeats episode again. And yes, the toys did get thrown away forever. But he learned that his actions, both good and bad, had consequences. That's what this brat needed from the start.

Works fine if your goddamn wife doesn't fish them out of the trash, clean them off, and hand them back surreptitiously later.

I have a selection of words and phrases that will help you:
Trash compactor
fire
dumpster
hammer
discussion with wife
divorce

Yes but a divorce will really fark the kids up. Nothing quite like knowing you can play mommy and daddy against each other like a couple of pawns.

/not to mention all the guilt presents you get
//wish my dad had dumped the biatch sooner
///and fought for custody of me

notauniquesnowflake: amanogowa: TypoFlyspray: ElPresidente: Son goes to sleep for two hours, never repeats episode again. And yes, the toys did get thrown away forever. But he learned that his actions, both good and bad, had consequences. That's what this brat needed from the start.

Works fine if your goddamn wife doesn't fish them out of the trash, clean them off, and hand them back surreptitiously later.

I have a selection of words and phrases that will help you:
Trash compactor
fire
dumpster
hammer
discussion with wife
divorce

Yes but a divorce will really fark the kids up. Nothing quite like knowing you can play mommy and daddy against each other like a couple of pawns.

/not to mention all the guilt presents you get
//wish my dad had dumped the biatch sooner
///and fought for custody of me

I agree -- but it appears the kids are already farked up, and playing the parents off each other in this case. If mommy cannot decide she wants to be a parent, then ditch her.

So, the consensus is in, the votes are counted...

Dear "ODD" parents:

Beat the piss out of your kid and make them mind.

Just a shiat head kid without a father. If his dad was around and beating him into submission you wouldn't have this problem.

insertcutename: In all honesty, I have no idea how I DIDN'T end up like this kid.

I mean, taking a look back at my childhood, there wasn't much stability in my life. First off, my mother was diagnosed with Lupus when I was 6 and was hospital-bound for the next four years until her death. I got to see her for maybe 4 hours every other day or so. Her illness and death hit my brother and dad pretty hard and they never saw eye to eye with each other. I remember a lot of late night shouting matches between them. Eventually it was too much for my brother and he left the house never to return. I only now see him occasionally - ie: once a year at Christmas. My father hit the bottle pretty badly leading up to and after my mom died and was the epitome of a working alcoholic. The guy could polish off a bottle of Golden Wedding over the course of the afternoon and report to work later on in the evening. And when he wasn't drinking he worked. Night and day. Usually 6 days a week. For the most part, my life revolved around waking up, getting breakfast, going to school, and coming home to make my own dinner - ALONE. That all continued for about 6 years until I was well into High School and my dad started seeing his new girlfriend (now his second wife). In all that time there was no such thing as family vacations for me. No days out to the ball game or even birthday celebrations. Just myself growing up with friends and their parents taking the place of my own family.

But with all that heartache and all that conflict within my home, not once have I ever felt the need to steal a car. Not once have I ever desired to smash a neighbours window. Not once had I been compelled to join a gang and terrorize the people living in the community around me.

And that's why I can't stand all these punkass biatches today who think they can get away with the blame game of doing all those things and more and arguing that their homelife is responsible for their behaviour. No - YOU are responsible for your behaviour. YOU can make the choice for yourself to do the right thing and that choice has a lot more to do with your strength of character than anything else.


Actually, as rough as it was, it also sounds like responsibility was forced on you at a rather young age. Unfortunately, this little turd (and his mother) don't know what responsiblity is.

And Mrs. Chomsky you will learn, when you begin talking with the older teachers, that ADHD was something that used to be cured with a paddle. It's really funny how AD(H)D is really only an issue in schools that ban corporal punishment.

mabel: Yeah, I know this is Fark and some of the snark is pretty funnay, but . . .

For those of you that think it is a matter of parental lack, DIAF. A disorder diagnosis is very over-used so when it really is what is wrong too many people dismiss it.

My 16yo son is ODD. Since he was 7 or 8 I have been begging and pleading for help from anyone I could find. He has been to 4 dfifferent psychologists, a psychiatrist, various ADD drugs and anti-psychotics, 1 year of all boys military boarding school, and now he is in juvenile lock up. So don't give my that shait that I'm a bad parent and just need to smack him into compliance. I did that too, didn't work either and now he is bigger than me.

Part of ODD is not having any ability to forsee the consequences. I have done all that I can think of from spanking, time outs, taking away privileges, emptying his room, sending him away, you name it, I've tried.

It is real and is like living in a war zone. Now, since he is in juvi, all he is learning is how to be a better criminal. Hopefully I can help him stay out of trouble long enough to get him into the military.

On the flip side, my 14yo daughter is a straigt "A" student whom I would never hesitate to trust. She is very responsible and certainly has a great idea of what consequences are. Same parents, same house, same rules. Just not f'ed up in the brain wiring department.

You DIAF. Your 16yo and the ugly sumbiatch in TFA are NOT the same person.

And if corporal punishment, medications, yelling, begging, whatever the hell you tried to do to put him in line didn't work....why should the military fare any better? They can't even hit recruits without risking lawsuits, and all they do is yell and force runs, pushups, etc. for non-compliance. He'll be kicked out once they're sick of dealing with his shiat, probably within 4 weeks, if that.

Just because your son is a legit case of ODD doesn't mean that there isn't at least one case of a prick child raised by prick parents that needs his ass whipped til he calls himself Toby.

kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. His mother buys into the ADHD he was diagnosed with when he was 12, and has been shoving pills down his throat ever since.

He recently dropped out of school, hangs out with the wrong crowd, refuses to accept responsibility for his actions, won't contribute, constanly back talks and argues, and was recently brought home by the cops at 4am because of the weed in his pocket (not to mention being a minor out at that time of night, while his poor mother thought he was home in bed, safe and sound).

We gave him enough rope to hang himself (so to speak) and this past weekend was the last straw for me. Obviously, I can't discipline him, but I can do what I need to do to make my house liveable and safe.

His mother (finally) took his cell phone away (consequences of his actions), and I'm probably going to sell my Xbox that brings him so much joy.

Last night, the sneaking around and plotting started again, so I mandated the 10pm bedtime.

For the second night in the last four days, a strange car pulled up in front of my house at 11pm. Being that I knew this was going to happen, I took a picture of it with a camera that has a really bright flashbulb. Of course, it took off.

Since I knew I wasn't going to get any sleep (again), I grabbed my 6 iron and went downstairs to guard the front door.

About 5 minutes later, he comes stumbling down the stairs and greets me with a very shocked WTF??

His mother comes out of our room and says to me, "What are you doing?" really loudly to me, so I respond really loudly to her, "Who are you talking to?", so she says, "You", and I say, "I'm sitting on my couch, it's my house, I have the right".

He fumbles about with some excuse for something or other, then starts playing video games (asks me if I want to play, like nothing is going on, unhuh).

We sat there silently (except for the game, and my farking) for a good hour or so, then I went back upstairs to man the camera again.

His mother couldn't sleep, so she went to sleep in his sister's room, where she could keep a better eye on him in my opinion.

Tonight, I'm going to come home with a motion detecting porch light, and a security camera system.

Because these items are expensive, and we are in a recession, this means that we will have no food in the house this month.

He firmly believes that what he is doing is not affecting anyone else in the house.

I'm waiting to see how he feels about things when we only feed his little sister for the next month or two or three.

I'm also going to make friendly with the PD tonight, let them know I'm on their side, and ready to help anyway I can.

4 months from now, I'm praying, when he turns 18, that he does the right thing, and kicks his own ass out, so he can finally understand that nothing is free, and we all need to take responsibilities, even if we don't want them.

His mother is trying to talk him out of joining the military, which I don't agree with being a military man myself.

I lost plenty of sleep in the military, so this is old hat to me, and I know based on his refusal to talk to me, or more importantly, apologize, that he has a weak mind, and will crack first.

I never thought I'd turn into a "get of my lawn" old man, but as usual, I'm getting a much different perspective on life based on my own experiences.

Next is the police scanner is going to take the place of the plasma TV as the family entertainment. We'll save lots of money with no HBO to pay for. If I could figure out how to keep the fridge cold, I would shut off and lock out the main power feed every night at 10, but then no porch light, so I guess I can't do that.

I'm probably going to sell my couch and comfy chair too. If I'm going to be uncomfortable in my own house, everyone is going to be uncomforable.

Maybe I could shut the gas feed off too, no more hot showers. I've taken a few cold showers while in the field, they don't hurt much.

I told his mother to stop doing his laundry, we'll see if she complies.

No more soda pop, gatorade, or lemonade, is just plain water from ...

He may be a bad kid, but you're crazy and overreacting.

Security cameras? Are you kidding? You don't even know what a bad kid is. The cops brought him home because of pot in his pocket? OMG! Even assuming you actually care that he smokes pot, definitely sounds like that's the only thing the police ever stopped him for (or you would've said otherwise in that tirade).

Your kid ever join a large group of other kids and beat up younger kids? He ever brought a gun to school? How about doing smack in the bathroom?

Get some goddamn perspective you crotchety stepdad.

One off the 4-in-ten children that were fathered by the state. Quality product through and through.

'Of', not 'off'. Eh, fark it.

kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. His mother buys into the ADHD he was diagnosed with when he was 12, and has been shoving pills down his throat ever since.

He recently dropped out of school, hangs out with the wrong crowd, refuses to accept responsibility for his actions, won't contribute, constanly back talks and argues, and was recently brought home by the cops at 4am because of the weed in his pocket (not to mention being a minor out at that time of night, while his poor mother thought he was home in bed, safe and sound).

We gave him enough rope to hang himself (so to speak) and this past weekend was the last straw for me. Obviously, I can't discipline him, but I can do what I need to do to make my house liveable and safe.

His mother (finally) took his cell phone away (consequences of his actions), and I'm probably going to sell my Xbox that brings him so much joy.

Last night, the sneaking around and plotting started again, so I mandated the 10pm bedtime.

For the second night in the last four days, a strange car pulled up in front of my house at 11pm. Being that I knew this was going to happen, I took a picture of it with a camera that has a really bright flashbulb. Of course, it took off.

Since I knew I wasn't going to get any sleep (again), I grabbed my 6 iron and went downstairs to guard the front door.

About 5 minutes later, he comes stumbling down the stairs and greets me with a very shocked WTF??

His mother comes out of our room and says to me, "What are you doing?" really loudly to me, so I respond really loudly to her, "Who are you talking to?", so she says, "You", and I say, "I'm sitting on my couch, it's my house, I have the right".

He fumbles about with some excuse for something or other, then starts playing video games (asks me if I want to play, like nothing is going on, unhuh).

We sat there silently (except for the game, and my farking) for a good hour or so, then I went back upstairs to man the camera again.

His mother couldn't sleep, so she went to sleep in his sister's room, where she could keep a better eye on him in my opinion.

Tonight, I'm going to come home with a motion detecting porch light, and a security camera system.

Because these items are expensive, and we are in a recession, this means that we will have no food in the house this month.

He firmly believes that what he is doing is not affecting anyone else in the house.

I'm waiting to see how he feels about things when we only feed his little sister for the next month or two or three.

I'm also going to make friendly with the PD tonight, let them know I'm on their side, and ready to help anyway I can.

4 months from now, I'm praying, when he turns 18, that he does the right thing, and kicks his own ass out, so he can finally understand that nothing is free, and we all need to take responsibilities, even if we don't want them.

His mother is trying to talk him out of joining the military, which I don't agree with being a military man myself.

I lost plenty of sleep in the military, so this is old hat to me, and I know based on his refusal to talk to me, or more importantly, apologize, that he has a weak mind, and will crack first.

I never thought I'd turn into a "get of my lawn" old man, but as usual, I'm getting a much different perspective on life based on my own experiences.

Next is the police scanner is going to take the place of the plasma TV as the family entertainment. We'll save lots of money with no HBO to pay for. If I could figure out how to keep the fridge cold, I would shut off and lock out the main power feed every night at 10, but then no porch light, so I guess I can't do that.

I'm probably going to sell my couch and comfy chair too. If I'm going to be uncomfortable in my own house, everyone is going to be uncomforable.

Maybe I could shut the gas feed off too, no more hot showers. I've taken a few cold showers while in the field, they don't hurt much.

I told his mother to stop doing his laundry, we'll see if she complies.

No more soda pop, gatorade, or lemonade, is just plain water from ...

Yeah...you see the minute you show that kind of "discipline" to the boy, that's the minute you see the wrong end of a 2x4, or a twelve-gauge, or divorce papers.

/I'm just sayin'...

You down with ODD?
Yeah, you know me.

kevljo: buffalosoldier: kevljo: We have a 17 year old that is going on 11. His mother buys into the ADHD he was diagnosed with when he was 12, and has been shoving pills down his throat ever since.

Since no one else is gonna say it, I will.

Why stay? Kick him and his mom to the curb. If the daughter is yours, keep her and bag the rest.

I am sorry if this is touchy, but no matter how much i loved someone, I would have either put a stop to this immediately or (and I have dated women with children previously, so i understand how this could be) when the mother refused to allow me to intervene even once, I would have been done. Once a boy like that sees running to mommy works, then you authority is gonna be hella hard to get back. Why stay with a woman who was weak enough to raise this boy?

I'm not going to make excuses, or get into a pissing contest, because believe me, those thoughts are on my mind.

As I'm sure you are aware, life isn't always "that simple".

I can't speak for her when she had her son, but she isn't weak, at least not now.

We are both doing what we can in this situation. Her responsibility is to raise her children, mine is to protect the house we all share.

I'm sure taking the easy way out seems very appealing, but isn't that really part of the problem? His response to his issues are to run away, talk back, or play the blame game.

If I were do the same thing (run away or blame his mother), what kind of a message would that send? Wouldn't that just justify his behavior.

She has offered to move out, so it's not like this isn't clear to both of us as far as what is going on.

As I said, 4 months to adulthood, then we'll see.


Dude,

I wish to re iterate that I ain't being a jerk (internet lacks tone) or at least not purposefully. But this kid, the one you manned up and took responsibility for (admirable) won't care about consequences... so it is just you and the girl suffering for no reason. I know you wanna be a good example but at some point, with certain psycho issues or addiction, you gotta stop throwing good time and money after bad, cut your losses and walk away. If thiskid could learn from examples, he woulda learned from the example of an honest hard working male role model already.

Best of luck.

B4LE: GCU-Arbitrary: ElPresidente: Beating is not always the answer. I have a much more obvious way - stop rewarding bad behaviour, and let them punish themselves. Example:

My son tried his first temper tantrum at age three. Wouldn't take his nap, even though he was exhausted. My wife tried to get him to do it, but he screamed and screamed until they were both angry and upset. She came downstairs, and upstairs I went to take over.

Son: SCREAM!!!

Me: OK, you have a choice. You can either take a nap, or this toy (picking up one at random, but in reality one that should have been thrown away anyway) goes into the trash can forever. It's all your choice. What will it be?

Son: SCREAM!!!

Me: OK. (Toy goes into bin.) That's your choice!

Son: DOUBLE SCREAM!!!

Me: Don't yell at me, that was your choice. OK, now you have another choice. You can either take a nap, or another toy goes into the trash can forever. It's your choice. What will it be?

Son: SCREAM!!!

Me: OK. (Another toy goes into bin.) That's your choice!

Son: TRIPLE SCREAM!!!

Me: Like I said, it was your choice. OK, you have another choice. You can either take a nap, or yet another toy goes into the trash can forever. It's your choice. What will it be?

Son goes to sleep for two hours, never repeats episode again. And yes, the toys did get thrown away forever. But he learned that his actions, both good and bad, had consequences. That's what this brat needed from the start.


This. Worked just fine on me as a kid, works like a charm on my kids as well. Deleting favourite shows from the DVR is very effective as well, and is slightly more cost-efficient.

Doesn't take the loss of too many favourite toys/shows before they start to behave.

Something like this happened to my older brother when he was 8 and I was 4. He treated our mother crappy for days, just out of control screaming and yelling, backtalk, and namecalling.

My father stripped the whole room down to nothing. Took virtually EVERYTHING. Left his bed, a sheet, a pillow, and a blanket. Five pairs of jeans, t-shirts, socks, underwear. One book: The Call of The Wild. My father said, "You keep this crap up, I'm going to put you where Buck is now." Then he said, "If you're good for a month, you can have something back."

A month later, my father gave him back a blue rubber ball.

Thirty five years later, my brother said it was the longest three years of his life trying to earn that useless crap back.


I cannot believe it took until 3 years for your son to have a tantrum.

<b><a target="_blank" href="http://www.fark.com/cgi/comments.pl?IDLink=4469392&IDComment=52220512#c522 20512">tuxedobob</a>:</b> <i>Damn Farkers must be blind...

He tends to sleep for only two hours a night and has tablets to sedate him in the evening.

I'm all for calling someone a failure too, but two hours a night? That's not normal. Without the tablets, would he simply never sleep?</i>

That's pretty much what stuck out to me. I get that the kid can just be a misbehaving little shiat and as hate overdiagnosis of random crap as some syndrome or other... but two hours of sleep?

If this kid's only getting two hours of sleep a night and then only when hit with horse tranquilizers it's likely there really IS something seriously farked up in his head. I wouldn't be suprised if he starts talking to the things with three eyes that live under the paint pretty soon.

It is a defective unit. Destroy it.

Mrs. Chomsky:

as a future HS teacher, I agree. The school system pretty much sucks as it is, but one look at a kid's parents immediately answers the question, "why is the little farker like this?"

One look? You sound like a complete asshole. Could you please explain what a "good" parent looks like? Is it the way they dress? What kind of car they drive?

After viewing your profile I now know with one look what a condescending douche canoe looks like.

And "kid's parents".......At least I know you'll never be teaching HS english. Of course I highly doubt someone with your amazing ability to judge another with a single glance should settle with simply being a teacher. Your gifts are far to advanced to be wasted on our youth. What a d'bag.

Shaddup: Mrs. Chomsky:

as a future HS teacher, I agree. The school system pretty much sucks as it is, but one look at a kid's parents immediately answers the question, "why is the little farker like this?"

One look? You sound like a complete asshole. Could you please explain what a "good" parent looks like? Is it the way they dress? What kind of car they drive?

After viewing your profile I now know with one look what a condescending douche canoe looks like.

And "kid's parents".......At least I know you'll never be teaching HS english. Of course I highly doubt someone with your amazing ability to judge another with a single glance should settle with simply being a teacher. Your gifts are far to advanced to be wasted on our youth. What a d'bag.