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(My San Antonio)   HOA is about to foreclose 84 homes in one neighborhood for not paying dues. One home that was about to be foreclosed on had a fine less than $300 dollars   (mysanantonio.com) divider line 256
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14605 clicks; posted to Main » on 16 Mar 2009 at 10:19 AM (5 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2009-03-16 09:00:12 AM
Why would you have to take the whole house? Surely you could just seize other assets like the plasma TV or a car or other stuff to recoup the cost. I'm not American but this just seems WAAAY over the top to foreclose on a house over $700.
 
2009-03-16 09:02:56 AM
How in the fark does an HOA "foreclose" on a home?

They have nothing to do with the loan between the bank and the homeowner.

They can put a lien on the home, sure. But, foreclosure? How in the fark is that even possible?
 
2009-03-16 09:11:27 AM
SchlingFocker: How in the fark does an HOA "foreclose" on a home?

I wondered the same thing. Seems like a lien on the property would have been the remedy. Then I read this:



Most communities have covenants that give a homeowners association the right to sue property owners, assess penalty fees and even foreclose if dues aren't paid.

and it seems like the homeowners may have given the HOA that power when they purchased property in that development. They probably signed a HOA contract without reading it.
 
2009-03-16 09:12:03 AM
Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.
 
2009-03-16 09:18:48 AM
SchlingFocker: How in the fark does an HOA "foreclose" on a home?

They have nothing to do with the loan between the bank and the homeowner.

They can put a lien on the home, sure. But, foreclosure? How in the fark is that even possible?


A lien doesn't do any good if someone isn't going to sell their house, so HOAs foreclose all the time.
 
2009-03-16 09:19:16 AM
FredaDeStilleto: SchlingFocker: How in the fark does an HOA "foreclose" on a home?

I wondered the same thing. Seems like a lien on the property would have been the remedy. Then I read this:



Most communities have covenants that give a homeowners association the right to sue property owners, assess penalty fees and even foreclose if dues aren't paid.

and it seems like the homeowners may have given the HOA that power when they purchased property in that development. They probably signed a HOA contract without reading it.


Given that it's Florida, I'm really not surprised.
 
2009-03-16 09:32:53 AM
I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".
 
2009-03-16 09:36:49 AM
If they have 20% of the community, you'd think they could have organized and ran for the board by now...

// Although it sounds like it may be a stalled development, maybe the developer still runs the HOA...
 
2009-03-16 09:46:45 AM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

Because in the "land of the free" the individuals are "free" to enter contracts and thus be bound by the terms of those contracts. Those who are in an HOA "freely" chose to be in one. And clearly such "free" individuals would not feel the need to create such organizations if it weren't for bubba down the road parking his car on his lawn while building a make-shift carport out of twigs and black plastic while leaving the moldy plastic toys for his ten children out on the lawn.

HOAs do some stupid shiat and make some stupid rules. That's what happens when you let a bunch of whiney, anal-retentive people get ahold of power. But HOAs are not necessarily a bad thing all the time in every circumstance where only complete idiots ever get into one because they didn't read their contracts.
 
2009-03-16 09:55:53 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

Comparing the Irish to animals? Even for you that's pretty low. I mean what did animals ever do to you to deserve such an insult?
 
2009-03-16 10:01:01 AM
HOA's are evil incarnate and are filled with jack-booted thugs. I would NEVER live in an area covered by an HOA.

HOA's are freely joined and people should be free to live in a house covered by an HOA.


Did I miss anything?
 
2009-03-16 10:04:50 AM
Clearly the solution is to simply move out and burn the house to the ground following the time honored biblical instruction that "If I can't have it, nobody can."
 
2009-03-16 10:11:59 AM
Knew a guy once that was in a wheelchair. He owned his house and 1 other lot in a subdivision. HOA came to him and threatened him for not paying dues. He pointed out that there were no wheelchair accessible ramps or rest rooms at the clubhouse(which he never used). The HOA backed off real quick.
 
2009-03-16 10:17:41 AM
Whoatherebabie: Why would you have to take the whole house? Surely you could just seize other assets like the plasma TV or a car or other stuff to recoup the cost. I'm not American but this just seems WAAAY over the top to foreclose on a house over $700.

HOA are granted nearly automatic liens on houses if the HOA dues are not paid. They are not granted liens on the furnishings, or car, etc...

Maybe the owners could sell their big screen tvs and pay off the dues and therefore save their house?

Dumbasses.
 
2009-03-16 10:24:17 AM
NightOwl2255: HOA's are evil incarnate and are filled with jack-booted thugs. I would NEVER live in an area covered by an HOA.

HOA's are freely joined and people should be free to live in a house covered by an HOA.


Did I miss anything?


and thus we see that when people are free to choose, they choose evil
 
2009-03-16 10:25:34 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

I'll give that a 3/10

/just didn't feel sincere
 
2009-03-16 10:26:54 AM
And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...
 
2009-03-16 10:28:04 AM
"$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"
 
2009-03-16 10:29:03 AM
drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"


Three hundred double dollars
 
2009-03-16 10:29:04 AM
Is anyone else tired of seeing people write "$300 dollars"?

/no, Pants full of macaroni!!, just you
//don't care, it's redundant
 
2009-03-16 10:29:27 AM
I_C_Weener: Whoatherebabie: Why would you have to take the whole house? Surely you could just seize other assets like the plasma TV or a car or other stuff to recoup the cost. I'm not American but this just seems WAAAY over the top to foreclose on a house over $700.

HOA are granted nearly automatic liens on houses if the HOA dues are not paid. They are not granted liens on the furnishings, or car, etc...

Maybe the owners could sell their big screen tvs and pay off the dues and therefore save their house?

Dumbasses.


It's funny, most of us would sell our flat-screens to pay a fine to save our home. But would you sell it to pay unpaid parking tickets? 9/10 people won't. I mean, what are they going to take away? Morals? Sh*t, they're obviously already shot.
 
2009-03-16 10:29:41 AM
Why in the hell would you move somewhere with a HOA? I mean, it's bad enough living somewhere with oppressive zoning laws, but damn. You're actually signing something. On purpose. Dumbasses.
 
2009-03-16 10:29:47 AM
My HOA fees are $3.25 per year. They have the streets swept a couple times a year and maintain the sub-division sign. That's about it. I like it that way.
 
2009-03-16 10:29:52 AM
I just don't understand why anyone would buy a house with a HOA.
 
2009-03-16 10:30:01 AM
Aaaaaand now I look like an idiot.

/'salright, I'm used to it
 
2009-03-16 10:30:06 AM
drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"


That's what you get from the ATM machine after you enter your PIN number.
 
2009-03-16 10:30:51 AM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

How dare private citizens/organizations create self governing organizations, they should demand the state do it for them.
 
2009-03-16 10:30:56 AM
mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.
 
2009-03-16 10:31:02 AM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

So is it your suggestion that people should not be free to enter into a binding contract?
 
2009-03-16 10:31:06 AM
FTFA:

"That's 21 percent of the roughly 400 homes in the community, based on data from RexReport.com. The 84 are set to go on the auction block April 7 at the Bexar County Courthouse - an event that would devastate the neighborhood's property values, experts say.

Judith Gray, an attorney hired as the auction trustee, said the association is foreclosing because many homeowners have not paid dues for several years, and the multiyear loss of those dues is making it difficult for the association to function and to provide services required by the city."

I damn near facepalmed. HOAs exist, in part, to maintain property values. Evict 21% of your homeowners, those properties go to shiat and drop property values. Do they really think they're going to get more idiots to sign on to overpriced cookie-cutter homes in yet another jackbooted HOA in a neighborhood that isn't even fully developed?

Seems like they're shooting themselves in the foot.
 
2009-03-16 10:31:34 AM
Sticky Hands: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

Three hundred double dollars


Don't worry, I can get my $300 dollars from the ATM machine.
 
2009-03-16 10:31:41 AM
Talon: eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

Because in the "land of the free" the individuals are "free" to enter contracts and thus be bound by the terms of those contracts. Those who are in an HOA "freely" chose to be in one. And clearly such "free" individuals would not feel the need to create such organizations if it weren't for bubba down the road parking his car on his lawn while building a make-shift carport out of twigs and black plastic while leaving the moldy plastic toys for his ten children out on the lawn.

HOAs do some stupid shiat and make some stupid rules. That's what happens when you let a bunch of whiney, anal-retentive people get ahold of power. But HOAs are not necessarily a bad thing all the time in every circumstance where only complete idiots ever get into one because they didn't read their contracts.


Dude, the glut of empty houses on the market caused by rampant foreclosures is a far greater threat to the value of your home than some bubba down the street who doesn't mow his lawn twice a day.

/God bless the city, no HOA bullshiat here
 
2009-03-16 10:32:27 AM
I've gotta start searching Google News daily for stories mentioning "HOA". Maybe then I'll be able to get that elusive second greenlight.
 
2009-03-16 10:32:46 AM
No, they're not shooting themselves in the foot. They obviously exist for the purpose of generating revenue, under the PRETENSE of improving property values. The returns on foreclosing on all those homes, even if they sell for much lower values, is going to be GREAT!!!
 
2009-03-16 10:32:58 AM
Raging Thespian: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

That's what you get from the ATM machine after you enter your PIN number.


Dammit, I should refresh before I snark.
 
2009-03-16 10:33:17 AM
mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

He hits us because he loves us
 
2009-03-16 10:33:38 AM
HAHA. YOU CHOSE TO LIVE IN A HOA AND THEY HAVE NO HEARTS. YOU LOSE.
 
2009-03-16 10:33:59 AM
84 foreclosed and soon to be empty homes? Sweet, I'll let some squatters know.
 
2009-03-16 10:34:12 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

Part of me agrees with this and the other part of me sees this HOA as just digging a hole for its grave. Who is going to want to move into a neighborhood with 84 foreclosed homes?
 
2009-03-16 10:35:29 AM
lilplatinum: eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

How dare private citizens/organizations create self governing organizations, they should demand the state do it for them.



So it's legal for people to sell themselves into slavery? Whatever happened to inalienable rights?
 
2009-03-16 10:35:50 AM
Because several people in my area did not pay their dues, we were unable to complete repairs on a community fence and hire a competent trash service. Sometimes legal action with the threat of foreclosure is the only way to get people to pay their small, annual dues they agreed to when they signed the deed to their home.
 
2009-03-16 10:36:01 AM
NightOwl2255: 40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

Comparing the Irish to animals? Even for you that's pretty low. I mean what did animals ever do to you to deserve such an insult?


No no no. He means "Rules, and the Irish, are what separate us from the animals." On account of so many Irish being cops and clergy and Wall Street traders and such. Begob they're the very backbone of civilization. The backbone I tells yer.
 
2009-03-16 10:36:12 AM
This would fall under the "cutting off your nose to spite your face" category.

It'll be hilarious to see the look on the HOA directors' faces once they're saddled with 84 properties they can't even begin to hope to sell.

Bwahahahahahahaha. THE CIRCLE OF LIFE.
 
KIA
2009-03-16 10:36:55 AM
It is a self-defeating proposition for most HOAs to foreclose because 99% of the time, they will take the property subject to a first trust or mortgage which is still entitled to priority over their HOA lien. The HOA's best case if the homeowner tells them to fark the frakkin' fark off is they take back an empty property, generate no HOA fees from themselves, have to pay their attorneys, then have to pay the mortgage themselves or the bank forecloses. Now the HOA has absolutely zero intention of paying the bank's loan, so at the end of the day a HOA foreclosure is a pressure tactic intended solely to get banks to foreclose. Banks, however, are on to this tactic and are letting deadbeat owners stay for months on end without paying anybody because the bank doesn't want any more houses and they can get all of the federal aid they please or write off the losses for tax purposes.

It's a farkin' mess.
 
2009-03-16 10:37:39 AM
Sticky Hands: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

Three hundred double dollars


So thats $600?
 
2009-03-16 10:37:43 AM
you signed the contract - just pay the farking dues - find another way to protest the HOA - dumb bastards
 
2009-03-16 10:38:22 AM
idrow: I just don't understand why anyone would buy a house with a HOA.

Both of my houses have HoAs, when I was looking for both of them (they are new) I never saw a neighborhood without an HoA. This is in a span of the last 6 years.

Mine are pretty tame, I pay them late all the time with no fees.
 
2009-03-16 10:39:40 AM
bush:

Seems like they're shooting themselves in the foot.


HOA President
www.gossipish.com
 
2009-03-16 10:40:06 AM
Right now I'm happy to live in an old home that predates this abominable practice. Plus, it's in a civilized city where we have municipal garbage collection.

/needs to fix his own damned fence, though.
 
2009-03-16 10:40:08 AM
drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"


I tried to withdrawl $300 dollars from the ATM machine but I forgot my PIN number.

/HOA can be bad but they can be good too.
 
2009-03-16 10:40:23 AM
84 foreclosed and soon to be empty homes? Sweet, I'll let some squatters know.

What an excellent plan! It should do wonders for the neighborhood when the gangs take their pick of the 80 plus houses. BRILLIANT!!!
 
2009-03-16 10:40:40 AM
Your average HOA is run by would be Nazis, mental patients, and shrill housewives with no life.
 
2009-03-16 10:40:58 AM
Why in the hell would you move somewhere with a HOA?

They keep the blacks and most of the Jews away.
 
2009-03-16 10:42:23 AM
40below: And the Irish

I'll bet you'll let in the n***s and the chinks, too...
 
2009-03-16 10:42:35 AM
FredaDeStilleto: and it seems like the homeowners may have given the HOA that power when they purchased property in that development. They probably signed a HOA contract without reading it.

I wonder what bank makes loans knowing they could have the collateral for their loan yanked away from them....

Either way, it seems like they're using a howitzer to take out a housefly. Last I checked, a court can garnish wages to pay judgments.
 
2009-03-16 10:43:13 AM
There's nothing stopping the OWNERS from selling their plasma TV either and paying their HOA dues. My sympathy meter is running very low.
 
2009-03-16 10:43:23 AM
spacechicken170am: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

I tried to withdrawl $300 dollars from the ATM machine but I forgot my PIN number.

/HOA can be bad but they can be good too.


Screwing a 17-year-old can be can, but it can be good too.
 
2009-03-16 10:43:27 AM
I still don't get how an outside party can foreclose on your home, even if you sign a piece of paper saying they can.
 
2009-03-16 10:44:06 AM
Don't think that HOAs are voluntary. Local governments use all sorts of subtle tricks to get HOAs formed with every last bit of residential zoned land, because HOAs can mean less work for the local government. If you want to buy a home where there is no HOA, good luck. A lot of cities are 100% HOA residential, except for low income housing. And once they are formed, there is almost no way to break them up.

To make matters worse, the courts are now recognizing HOAs as "para-government organizations". Sons of biatches can change the rules after the contract is signed. You now owe us hundreds of dollars. Pay up or we foreclose.
 
2009-03-16 10:44:12 AM
Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.


yes.
 
2009-03-16 10:45:15 AM
mikefinch: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.

yes.


Maybe?
 
2009-03-16 10:45:29 AM
12349876: 40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

Part of me agrees with this and the other part of me sees this HOA as just digging a hole for its grave. Who is going to want to move into a neighborhood with 84 foreclosed homes?


That, and who wants to move into a neighborhood run by a bunch of incompetent Scheiße-Kopfs
 
2009-03-16 10:45:49 AM
godxam: you signed the contract - just pay the farking dues - find another way to protest the HOA - dumb bastards

If the HOA isn't holding up their end of the contract by providing the services you contracted for, why should you pay for services you're not receiving?
 
2009-03-16 10:45:51 AM
HOA's are evil cults. The tools of the devil.
 
2009-03-16 10:46:31 AM
therealpope: Because several people in my area did not pay their dues, we were unable to complete repairs on a community fence and hire a competent trash service. Sometimes legal action with the threat of foreclosure is the only way to get people to pay their small, annual dues they agreed to when they signed the deed to their home.

Waaahh. People can hire their own trash service. That's how it works out here in the real, unsheltered world. It may not be the most efficient way, but the competition keeps the prices down. As for the fence? Tear it down, why does the community need a fence?
 
2009-03-16 10:47:27 AM
renstar: therealpope: Because several people in my area did not pay their dues, we were unable to complete repairs on a community fence and hire a competent trash service. Sometimes legal action with the threat of foreclosure is the only way to get people to pay their small, annual dues they agreed to when they signed the deed to their home.

Waaahh. People can hire their own trash service. That's how it works out here in the real, unsheltered world. It may not be the most efficient way, but the competition keeps the prices down. As for the fence? Tear it down, why does the community need a fence?


To keep out the pleebs of course.
 
2009-03-16 10:47:51 AM
bemis23:
Don't worry, I can get my $300 dollars from the ATM machine.


The Automatic ATM machine.

So the alternative to dealing with this HOA idiocy is to not buy a house in an HOA-infected community. What are we supposed to when all of the available communities have this disease?
 
2009-03-16 10:47:51 AM
I have no experience with HOAs (thankfully), so this may be a stupid question, but why wouldn't the banks get involved? If I were the bank and I had loaned Citizen X $500,000 to buy a house and then some local non-governmental "agency" tried to forclose on it and probably sell it for less than what is owed against it, I would be a little upset about that. Is the HOA responsible for covering the difference? My guess is "no" or they wouldn't be doing it. The whole thing seems very distasteful and, frankly, illegal to me. Yes, I understand that they signed a contract willingly and I can see the HOA suing to get their fees. At least that way the homeowners have their day in court and can explain why they did not feel the need to pay the fees. Kicking someone out of their home and selling it out from under them seems like an unlawful seizure to me, especially when it is probably a several-hundred-thousand dollar asset being sold to pay for a couple of hundred in fees. I can't believe this is legal and, if it is, it shouldn't be.
 
2009-03-16 10:48:35 AM
Fish in a Barrel: My HOA fees are $3.25 per year. They have the streets swept a couple times a year and maintain the sub-division sign. That's about it. I like it that way.

Off topic a bit. There is a subdivision near here named Morning Woods. Has a nice bricked entrance with the name mounted on the bricks. Only thing is, someone has stolen the "s" off "Woods". It's been that way for awhile now.
 
2009-03-16 10:48:43 AM
40below: ple need to learn to live

Yeah but who's rules. Who makes the damned rules? From what I see most rules and laws are there to benefit only a few at the top of the food chain by collecting all these "fines". I agree that there should be firm but minimal laws. Only keep the ones that are common sense..... wait a minute..... I forgot that to function in todays society it is better that you dont learn of this most valuable trait for it is not in "their" best interests.

/going to watch american idol while eating a big mac
//dumbing down, dumbing down
 
2009-03-16 10:50:18 AM
My home falls under a HOA, and for the life of me I don't know wtf they do with my $260 annual dues. It certainly feels mafioso, since there literally seems to be NOTHING that benefits me that comes from the HOA, unless you count controlling what my neighbors can and can't do to their homes and yards, which I honestly don't give a damn about what they do anyway.

Supposedly they do stuff with the money, but it seems like it all goes to the slightly nicer new neighborhood around the block from me than in my own.
 
2009-03-16 10:51:30 AM
mikefinch: yes.

God got over that whole smiting thing with his hippie-love-fest that was Jesus and the New Testament.

The bad things happening to us are solely the result of human causes, and more specifically of the American breed, which is awesome because breed rhymes with greed, and greed is the problem.

/believer, though not in Jesus just yet
//gotta give a recovering agnostic some time, k?
 
2009-03-16 10:51:40 AM
Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.

yes.

Maybe?


I don't know, can you repeat the question?
 
2009-03-16 10:52:04 AM
Oh yeah, and I recently refinanced for a lower interest rate and yeah, I had to sign something that said the HOA can foreclose on my home if I don't pay the dues. So, I'm aware I don't have a choice, yet I live there anyway.

I just home someday it'll make sense.
 
2009-03-16 10:52:18 AM
bush: I damn near facepalmed. HOAs exist, in part, to maintain property values.

Actually, the real intent of HOAs is to maintain communal property.

Some may have mutated into these things that just maintain property values, and those are the ones that need to go away, for the most part.

/you only ever hear about bad HOAs
/bad HOA == bad neighbors.
 
2009-03-16 10:53:31 AM
Comic Book Guy: Given that it's Florida, I'm really not surprised.

What article did you read? The one I saw was in San Antonio TX.
 
2009-03-16 10:54:01 AM
Raging Thespian: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

That's what you get from the ATM machine after you enter your PIN number.


You need to pay it in cash? My HOA association accepts CC cards.
 
2009-03-16 10:54:21 AM
FTFA: Homeowners such as Cynthia Carrillo say they have deliberately stopped paying their $130 in yearly dues in response to being ignored.

$130 YEARLY? Holy fark, I'm on the HOA's side in this case. Pay up. If you have a problem with how the HOA is being run, run for the board, or sue them, have the money put into escrow until that suit is resolved.
 
2009-03-16 10:54:42 AM
Hetfield: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.

yes.

Maybe?

I don't know, can you repeat the question?


Ummm, maybe?
 
2009-03-16 10:56:21 AM
I was going to move into a place that had HOA and you think $200 a year was bad, they wanted $115 a month I laughed my butt off and walked out of the place.

The realtor thought that it was a good price.
 
2009-03-16 10:56:22 AM
Hetfield: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.

yes.

Maybe?

I don't know, can you repeat the question?


YOU'RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME!!!!
 
2009-03-16 10:57:17 AM
I hate HOAs.
 
2009-03-16 10:58:11 AM
For some reason, I was under the impression that the purpose of an HOA was to keep black people out of your neighborhood...

Since you can't do that anymore, we don't need HOAs anymore. And yet, they still exist.
 
2009-03-16 10:59:21 AM
You're assed out into an HOA in some parts of the country. It's either HOA-ran jackoff neighborhood, or a house with bullet holes in the siding in a ghetto next to public housing

Can't wait to get the fark out of NV.
 
2009-03-16 10:59:55 AM
...further evidence that HOA's bring out the worst in people and are by nature evil.
 
2009-03-16 11:00:16 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

damm dirty potatoe eaters
 
2009-03-16 11:01:51 AM
Anti_illuminati: spacechicken170am: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

I tried to withdrawl $300 dollars from the ATM machine but I forgot my PIN number.

/HOA can be bad but they can be good too.

Screwing a 17-year-old can be great, but it can be good too.



FTFY

/wheres your little sister ?
 
2009-03-16 11:02:20 AM
If the HOA doesn't honor its end of the contract, can the homeowners foreclose on HOA property?
 
2009-03-16 11:02:45 AM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

You do realize that "land of the free" only refers to the people, right?

It doesn't mean the "land" is "free" or that any other material item of any value is "free"

You are "free" to enter into a contract. You don't "have" to join a HOA. It's not government-appointed housing, or something. If you would like someone else to mow your lawn and trim the verge in exchange for losing some rights to what you can or can't do with your property, join a HOA. Remember, it's some of those very rules that attract some condo people (ie. you don't have to worry about your neighbor hanging an unsightly Dallas Cowboys flag or leaving a jalopy out front).

If you would prefer not to enter into a HOA, buy your own freestanding home (or non-HOA condo) and hire a handyman. In that way, yes, it is a "free country." Nice try, though, Trolly Mctrollster
 
2009-03-16 11:03:17 AM
Partly at issue is a community park that one of Mission Creek's builders, Sivage Homes, and homeowners say the association has been promising to develop for several years. Currently, the park site comprises grass and trees.

I dunno, an open space with trees and grass sounds like a park to me. I won't live in an HOA neighbourhood, but that sounds like a silly reason to not pay your fees.
 
2009-03-16 11:06:59 AM
HOAs are supposed to increase your property value correct? How is publicly acting like jerks and then having 84 houses up for sale simultaneously going to INCREASE property value? FAIL.
 
2009-03-16 11:07:27 AM
The worst part of an HOA, so far, has not been the $150 a month they charge for doing who knows what, it's that they've allowed Cox Communications exclusive access. Cable is included in HOA fees whether I want it or not. From time to time, Cox shuts down my internet access cause someone keeps hacking my wireless network and downloads
all sorts of stuff. I keep threatening to switch to Quest if the keep shutting it down, but the reality is I couldn't because Cox has exclusive access to the community. Cox doesn't seem to realize this cause threatening to switch to Quest works every time.

The fact that Cox has exclusive access to the community at all is a travesty.
 
2009-03-16 11:08:15 AM
Why someone would buy a house in a HOA is beyond me.
Why someone would make the mistake of buying in a HOA, and then not pay the fees is also beyond me.
 
2009-03-16 11:09:34 AM
Well, I can see how all those empty home will really improve the neighborhood. That is the HOAs job after all.


Morans!!!
 
2009-03-16 11:10:17 AM
wyldkard: Hetfield: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: Anti_illuminati: mikefinch: And people wonder why god keeps smiting America...

No.

yes.

Maybe?

I don't know, can you repeat the question?

YOU'RE NOT THE BOSS OF ME!!!!


Life is unfair.
 
2009-03-16 11:10:24 AM
ace in your face: HOAs are supposed to increase your property value correct? How is publicly acting like jerks and then having 84 houses up for sale simultaneously going to INCREASE property value? FAIL.

No rotting cars in the front yard, lawns are kept reasonable, facilities are maintained, stuff like that.

The nsome soccer mom becomes a jackbooted thug because stay at home moms are losers and have no clue about the world outside their door.
 
2009-03-16 11:13:04 AM
bush: I damn near facepalmed. HOAs exist, in part, to maintain property values. Evict 21% of your homeowners, those properties go to shiat and drop property values. Do they really think they're going to get more idiots to sign on to overpriced cookie-cutter homes in yet another jackbooted HOA in a neighborhood that isn't even fully developed?

Seems like they're shooting themselves in the foot.


Sometimes you have to shoot yourself in the foot to save yourself.
If the delinquent fees are keeping the HOA from meeting the legally required maintenance requirements, then without any consequences for the delinquent homeowners, other dues-paying homeowners will stop.

I'm sure the HOA would rather garnish wages, lock the owners out of the house or some other less radical option than a foreclosure, but that's the only tool they have to work with.
 
2009-03-16 11:14:09 AM
maybe they should've thought hard about joining an HOA that required dues they could not pay. just saying.
 
2009-03-16 11:16:32 AM
Yada yada yada HOA suck

You bought a home that is part of a HOA...you are an idiot...idiots tend to do stupid things like that...idiots also don't like to read complicated things...things like contracts...contracts that spell out that they face foreclosure if they don't pay HOA fees...yea, my heart, it bleeds for these people.
 
2009-03-16 11:16:45 AM
turtleking: Anti_illuminati: spacechicken170am: drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"

I tried to withdrawl $300 dollars from the ATM machine but I forgot my PIN number.

/HOA can be bad but they can be good too.

Screwing a 17-year-old can be great, but it can be good too.


FTFY

/wheres your little sister ?


Just finishing up his her sex change. Would you like his her number?
 
2009-03-16 11:17:54 AM
"One home that was about to be foreclosed on had a fine less than $300 dollars"

Then F%^&%@! pay it...
 
2009-03-16 11:19:11 AM
asmodeus224: Yada yada yada HOA suck

You bought a home that is part of a HOA...you are an idiot...idiots tend to do stupid things like that...idiots also don't like to read complicated things...things like contracts...contracts that spell out that they face foreclosure if they don't pay HOA fees...yea, my heart, it bleeds for these people.


Go fark yourself. I have a solution for those people, pay your dues or if you can't afford to pay dues, don't purchase a home that is a part of a HOA.
 
2009-03-16 11:19:34 AM
I live in a townhouse community with an HOA. I've never heard from them about anything, and the only contact we've had is when I called to complain about a skunk that was tearing up our garbage weekly(animal control wouldn't help w/no rabies, and the private company needed HOA approval to put traps on properties other than ours). They were pleasant.

They keep our streets plowed in the winter, maintain the pool and tennis courts, arrange trash pickup. I've got no complaints. We let our grass grow too long sometimes, never get flak for it. My HOA is just peachy.
 
2009-03-16 11:20:14 AM
Step 1. Stop paying dues to your HOA on your $750,000 2 bed, 1 bath McMansion.

Step 2. HOA forcloses, then sells your home at auction to a someone who is working for you or yourself for $50,000.

Step 3. Profit?
 
2009-03-16 11:20:24 AM
idrow: I just don't understand why anyone would buy a house with a HOA.

Because it pretty much guarantees that my neighbors can't suck, even if they want to suck. They can't paint their house cotton-candy pink. They can't leave their crappy plastic toys in the yard. They have to mow their grass. They can't build that 4-story water tower structure in the backyard. Etc etc, you get the picture.

People need to stop thinking of it as Us versus Them. I can't promise it's the same everywhere, but in my neighborhood, we homeowners ARE the HOA. Home Owner's Association - get it? I am a part of "they", and I vote and have a voice on all issues. I can get as involved as I want, or just pay my dues and let the board take care of things. Our HOA is very cool and does a good job. I understand that HOAs aren't for everyone, but that's your choice. Just understand that some of us prefer it that way, and there's nothing wrong with that.
 
2009-03-16 11:21:47 AM
SchlingFocker: How in the fark does an HOA "foreclose" on a home?

They have nothing to do with the loan between the bank and the homeowner.

They can put a lien on the home, sure. But, foreclosure? How in the fark is that even possible?


Foreclosure is the way to enforce the lien. There's no point in having a lien without the threat of foreclosure to back it up.

SchlingFocker: FredaDeStilleto: and it seems like the homeowners may have given the HOA that power when they purchased property in that development. They probably signed a HOA contract without reading it.

I wonder what bank makes loans knowing they could have the collateral for their loan yanked away from them....

Either way, it seems like they're using a howitzer to take out a housefly. Last I checked, a court can garnish wages to pay judgments.


Not in Texas - no wage garnishment except for child support. And most likely none of these homeowners have any non-exempt property under the Texas Constitution that would satisfy the liens.
 
2009-03-16 11:22:11 AM
I meant to add - having said that, I think that THIS particular HOA is doing their homeowners a great disservice by threatening to foreclose on so many homes. It is their job to maintain property values (that is the whole point, in fact), and foreclosing on homeowners who sound like they have some legitimate gripes about how the HOA is doing their job is cutting off their nose to spite their face. If I were a homeowner there, I'd be pretty pissed, and I'd do whatever I could to change the way things were being handled, including running for the board myself.
 
2009-03-16 11:23:01 AM
The HOA is in a Catch 22, they are responsible to the other property owners. If a HOA is "insolvent" or carrying too large a bad debt line in thier account no one in that HOA can sell their home. We have a 52 unit complex in my town that no one can get financing on right now because of the financial problems of the HOA. The have rules too and if they don't follow them , everyone loses.
 
2009-03-16 11:26:07 AM
I understand that if your home is part of a HOA and you want to sell, you're contractually obliged to pass on HOA membership to the new owner. What would happen if you refused to do that, if the new contract made no mention of any HOA whatsoever?
 
2009-03-16 11:26:12 AM
Sun Worshiping Dog Launcher: Off topic a bit. There is a subdivision near here named Morning Woods. Has a nice bricked entrance with the name mounted on the bricks. Only thing is, someone has stolen the "s" off "Woods". It's been that way for awhile now.

I live near a road called Haven Drive. I wondered where that extra S on the sign had come from. Now I know.
 
2009-03-16 11:27:08 AM
logieal: Step 1. Stop paying dues to your HOA on your $750,000 2 bed, 1 bath McMansion.

Step 2. HOA forcloses, then sells your home at auction to a someone who is working for you or yourself for $50,000.

Step 3. Profit?



Step 1 1/2. Someone else sees bigger profits and wins your former house at the auction.

Step 2. THEY profit

Step 3. YOU LOSE.
 
2009-03-16 11:30:47 AM
Komplex: Sometimes you have to shoot yourself in the foot to save yourself.
If the delinquent fees are keeping the HOA from meeting the legally required maintenance requirements, then without any consequences for the delinquent homeowners, other dues-paying homeowners will stop.

I'm sure the HOA would rather garnish wages, lock the owners out of the house or some other less radical option than a foreclosure, but that's the only tool they have to work with.


How about a lawsuit? Suing the people and forcing them to pay seems far less extreme (and oh so American!). You should NOT be able to take someone's home away from them over a few hundred dollars in unpaid fees. I would normally join the chorus of people saying that stupid people should not sign contracts they don't understand and then whine when it goes bad, but this is just wrong. A group of petty, unregulated, self-important neighbors, accountable to nobody, should absolutely NOT have the power to take your home.
 
2009-03-16 11:32:03 AM
bumfuzzled: Foreclosure is the way to enforce the lien. There's no point in having a lien without the threat of foreclosure to back it up.

Lots of HOAs don't have the ability to foreclose. They can put liens in place for nonpayment. This seems to work elsewhere.

Again, what bank gives loans knowing another entity can yank their collateral?


Not in Texas - no wage garnishment except for child support. And most likely none of these homeowners have any non-exempt property under the Texas Constitution that would satisfy the liens.


Didn't know that. Thanks :)

Aside from all this, when an HOA has 80+ families refusing to pay dues because the HOA isn't honoring their end of the contract, there is a serious problem with the HOA.

This needs to go to court so all the facts can be brought out.
 
2009-03-16 11:32:18 AM
Damn I love not living in an HOA community. I will *never* move into one. My brother lives in Celebration, Florida, and they are the Nazis of HOA's.

I enjoy being able to build a shop behind my house. I enjoy being able to park not only one, but even two cars in my front driveway. I can paint my house any color I want (yellow w/ white trim). I can put up any light fixture I want. I can work on my motorcycle in the morning and leave the garage door open. I can have a backyard party with my friends and not be bothered for parking too many cars in the neighborhood. And of course, if my wife wants a pair of yard flamingos up front, no one cares.

www.steveallwine.com

I live in a weird little 12-house neighborhood that is in the unincorporated county, completely surrounded by protected daffodil farmland in every direction. There's a county BMX park up the road, next to the river. It's an awesome place to live. Most of the folks have lived there for decades and we're all quite close. Most everyone keeps their homes/yards immaculate, but no one cares if one of us didn't mow their lawn for over a week, or if someone's house needs a new paint job. It's their business.

Unfortunately development is creeping in around the area, and now I get to look at a boring, uninspiring HOA community on the hilltops. Bleh. At least the farmland is protected.

www.steveallwine.com
My view.
 
2009-03-16 11:34:37 AM
84 properties? That's not a default. That's a de facto revolt.
 
2009-03-16 11:37:16 AM
I'll never understand how we as a nation have gotten here, how HOAs have been allowed by people and the courts to have so much power and legal force. I can understand how an HOA is useful and valuable to some home owners, but how an HOA can become so empowered as to forclose on homes for unpaid fees... ? Well, it's dispicable and wrong, but these days what isn't so utterly fuzzed up when it comes to the government and legal system.

/ oiled and slippery slope
// steep, steep slope indeed
/// sliding faster into the abyss is the US
 
2009-03-16 11:38:27 AM
karmachameleon: idrow: I just don't understand why anyone would buy a house with a HOA.

Because it pretty much guarantees that my neighbors can't suck, even if they want to suck. They can't paint their house cotton-candy pink. They can't leave their crappy plastic toys in the yard. They have to mow their grass. They can't build that 4-story water tower structure in the backyard. Etc etc, you get the picture.

People need to stop thinking of it as Us versus Them. I can't promise it's the same everywhere, but in my neighborhood, we homeowners ARE the HOA. Home Owner's Association - get it? I am a part of "they", and I vote and have a voice on all issues. I can get as involved as I want, or just pay my dues and let the board take care of things. Our HOA is very cool and does a good job. I understand that HOAs aren't for everyone, but that's your choice. Just understand that some of us prefer it that way, and there's nothing wrong with that.


I totally agree with you. The HOA and their threats of fines are what keep my neighbors from letting their weeds get out of control and if that's what it takes for them to maintain their yard then I am all for it.
 
2009-03-16 11:38:36 AM
mod3072: How about a lawsuit? Suing the people and forcing them to pay seems far less extreme (and oh so American!). You should NOT be able to take someone's home away from them over a few hundred dollars in unpaid fees. I would normally join the chorus of people saying that stupid people should not sign contracts they don't understand and then whine when it goes bad, but this is just wrong. A group of petty, unregulated, self-important neighbors, accountable to nobody, should absolutely NOT have the power to take your home.

Even if you went to small claims court, the process is not particularly helpful. First, you serve the person, which may or may not be difficult. Second, you take them to court. In the best case scenario, they don't show up and you win by default. Third, they don't pay, because they haven't paid yet so why would they now? Fourth, you go back to court and ask to attach assets. The court will probably agree, and attach the house. If, thereafter, the person doesn't pony up money quickly, you seize the house, which is substantially the same as foreclosure.

You end where you begin.
 
2009-03-16 11:41:30 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish New Yorkers.

FTFY
 
2009-03-16 11:43:30 AM
Cocktail party.

Molotovs for everyone.
 
2009-03-16 11:45:00 AM
We live in a neighborhood with a HOA. We all share a community pool, common area and bathrooms. Our dues are 250.00 a year. Inside our neighborhood it is pretty nice with everyone keeping up their property. Outside our neighborhood it's redneck Bubba and his trailer and prized possessions around it. Picture National Lampoon's Christmas Vacation. I'm sure somewhere around the corner the shiatter's full. I could take some pics, but I don't want you to be scarred for life.
 
2009-03-16 11:45:02 AM
drunkjournal: "$300" is pronounced "three hundred dollars"
"$300 dollars" is pronounced "three hundred dollars dollars"


So that means they're $600 behind, right?
 
2009-03-16 11:46:15 AM
idrow: I just don't understand why anyone would buy a house with a HOA.

I live in Atlanta and I'm looking to buy a townhome. It seems all condos and townhomes have HOAs attached to them. I'd rather not have anything to do with HOAs, but I'm willing to do so if the HOA fees are really low.

I just don't want to buy a house right now and that seems the only way to not end up with an HOA.

but this is good info to know. I'll definitely be asking questions like if I get behind on my HOA fees, can the HOA foreclose my home. It's about asking the right questions and reading the fine print before you sign. Look, buying a house is time consuming, so why in the hell would you not read what you are signing. A few extra minutes can save you a headache later on.
 
2009-03-16 11:48:05 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

So close to St. Patrick's Day too...
 
2009-03-16 11:51:22 AM
I would never want to live in a neighborhood like that but I can see why busybody douchebags would, it's good that there is somewhere that they can go to live...
 
2009-03-16 11:53:20 AM
karmachameleon: Because it pretty much guarantees that my neighbors can't suck, even if they want to suck. They can't paint their house cotton-candy pink. They can't leave their crappy plastic toys in the yard. They have to mow their grass. They can't build that 4-story water tower structure in the backyard. Etc etc, you get the picture.

Which is a great thing, except their getting to be more and more like the government. They claim to be there for the people, but they seem to be more intent on screwing people over when the chance arises and if you want to speak with someone, well, give up all hope on that.

I've lived in a reasonable HOA neighborhood, but it seems that there are more and more "Just fork over the money and STFU because my watch says 7:02 and the trash cans are supposed to be in by 7:00 p.m." types who are more interested in making money wherever they can as opposed to creating a pleasant neighborhood.
 
2009-03-16 11:54:40 AM
Hetfield: I understand that if your home is part of a HOA and you want to sell, you're contractually obliged to pass on HOA membership to the new owner. What would happen if you refused to do that, if the new contract made no mention of any HOA whatsoever?

Probably the property contract would be invalid and when the buyer's title-search company looked up the records they would find that the proposed sale was invalid. The buyer would then be able to sue the seller for breach of contract and recover any damages allowed under the contract or simply accept a revised contract with the HOA clause and some consideration.


As to why people buy houses/condos with HOAs, it is either to take care of communal property (pool, clubhouse, lawns, roads, in this case a park and flowers) or so that they can tell other people what they can do on their property (color, style, maintenance, fixtures, etc.) in order to 'maintain property values.' In some cases, people don't have a lot of choice as a lot of places have HOAs. It appears that this HOA was still run by the developer. Too bad for those homeowners.

I don't personally need a community pool, etc. or have much interest in what other people do with their homes, so no HOA for me. Fortunately a friendly neighbor has a pool, there is a town rec. center with a pool right down the street, and people in the area generally appear to take care of their property, so it is all good.
 
2009-03-16 11:55:11 AM
This is why you buy a gun and scream "GET OFF MY LAWN".
 
2009-03-16 11:57:06 AM
Nuuu: Even if you went to small claims court, the process is not particularly helpful. First, you serve the person, which may or may not be difficult. Second, you take them to court. In the best case scenario, they don't show up and you win by default. Third, they don't pay, because they haven't paid yet so why would they now? Fourth, you go back to court and ask to attach assets. The court will probably agree, and attach the house. If, thereafter, the person doesn't pony up money quickly, you seize the house, which is substantially the same as foreclosure.

You end where you begin.


I see your point, but it still seems like there should be a better way to reclaim those fees than foreclosure. Maybe there currently isn't, but there should be. The idea of giving that kind of authority to a few homeowners arbitrarily elected to a local board gives me the willies. Even the evil credit card companies won't take your home if you don't pay. Maybe they could just trash your credit and have someone make annoying phone calls to your house and work every 10 minutes until you cough it up?
 
2009-03-16 12:01:19 PM
I will have no part of this HOA cocksuckery.
 
2009-03-16 12:03:41 PM
Wow! It made it past the filters. I think we have a new catchphrase.
 
2009-03-16 12:08:02 PM
$130 a year and people are not paying? More power to the HOA then. Stupid homeowners.
 
2009-03-16 12:09:25 PM
HOA's are pure, unadulterated evil.
 
2009-03-16 12:09:32 PM
SchlingFocker: bumfuzzled: Foreclosure is the way to enforce the lien. There's no point in having a lien without the threat of foreclosure to back it up.

Lots of HOAs don't have the ability to foreclose. They can put liens in place for nonpayment. This seems to work elsewhere.

Again, what bank gives loans knowing another entity can yank their collateral?


Your comment started me thinking about what's going on in this situation. What bank gives loans like these? All of them - the bank's lien has a higher priority, which means that they have to be notified in the event of foreclosure so there's very little risk in making these loans. That also means that the banks will most likely be paying off these liens to keep the bank's security interest in place.

I think what's happening is that the HOA is trying to get the banks to pay the owners' fees, and the banks will turn around and capitalize the fees they paid. After all, why wouldn't the bank pay a few hundred dollars to keep the many thousands they lent safe?
 
2009-03-16 12:12:25 PM
Foreclosing vs. going to small-claims court is silly.

People do need to realize though, that paying HOA or condo fees is not optional. It isn't conditional on you getting whatever services, etc. you might dispute, or anything else. If you own the property, you HAVE to pay the fee.

FEES ARE NOT CONDITIONAL upon anything. You own it, you pay it. period.
 
2009-03-16 12:15:28 PM
It's just amazing how so many Americans happily embrace small-scale fascism.
 
2009-03-16 12:18:29 PM
LMark: It's just amazing how so many Americans happily embrace small-scale fascism.

Grow up. They signed a contract, their own choice, dumbass.
 
2009-03-16 12:19:50 PM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

Same reason these work:

compulsory education of your children
credit unions
contracts of all sorts

and these are just exampels startign with "c"

"social contract"
 
2009-03-16 12:21:31 PM
"Most communities have covenants that give a homeowners association the right to sue property owners, assess penalty fees and even foreclose if dues aren't paid."

Why would anyone even sign one of these things? HOAs are NOT legal entities, they cannot pass laws and they cannot MAKE a homeowner do anything. They have no legal authourity if you don't sign the damn piece of paper.

Look, if I decide to buy a house somewhere, I'm just going to buy it. Then when the local HOA comes to me and says "you have to sign this agreement or you can't live here", I tell them no thank you, I'll coordinate with the city myself for services. When they press the issue, I tell them to fark off. When they press the issue even further, I sue the crap out of THEM!. Trust me, this works in many places, as I've already done it three times and won. It is not difficult at all to take the tactics of an HOA that literally force people through intimidation and coersion to sign an agreement, and paint that organization as a racketeering front to a jury, not unlike the Mafia . Like I said, I've done it three times.

This is America, and here a person has domain over their own land. As long as you refust to sign up with an HOA and you handle your city cervices yourself, they absolutely CANNOT tell you what to do with or on your own land.

And for all of you pussies who say "well you HAVE to sign with them in order to live in the neighborhood" are spineless idiots who don't have the guts to stand up for your own rights. You'd rather just pay them a little blood money each month than make them understand what individual freedom means.
 
2009-03-16 12:24:07 PM
logieal: Step 1. Stop paying dues to your HOA on your $750,000 2 bed, 1 bath McMansion.

Step 2. HOA forcloses, then sells your home at auction to a someone who is working for you or yourself for $50,000.

Step 3. Profit?


Nope. the $750k loan doesn't go away. Just means that you're paying an additional $50k for your house.
 
2009-03-16 12:24:25 PM
lisarenee3505: "Most communities have covenants that give a homeowners association the right to sue property owners, assess penalty fees and even foreclose if dues aren't paid."

Why would anyone even sign one of these things? HOAs are NOT legal entities, they cannot pass laws and they cannot MAKE a homeowner do anything. They have no legal authourity if you don't sign the damn piece of paper.

Look, if I decide to buy a house somewhere, I'm just going to buy it. Then when the local HOA comes to me and says "you have to sign this agreement or you can't live here", I tell them no thank you, I'll coordinate with the city myself for services. When they press the issue, I tell them to fark off. When they press the issue even further, I sue the crap out of THEM!. Trust me, this works in many places, as I've already done it three times and won. It is not difficult at all to take the tactics of an HOA that literally force people through intimidation and coersion to sign an agreement, and paint that organization as a racketeering front to a jury, not unlike the Mafia . Like I said, I've done it three times.

This is America, and here a person has domain over their own land. As long as you refust to sign up with an HOA and you handle your city cervices yourself, they absolutely CANNOT tell you what to do with or on your own land.

And for all of you pussies who say "well you HAVE to sign with them in order to live in the neighborhood" are spineless idiots who don't have the guts to stand up for your own rights. You'd rather just pay them a little blood money each month than make them understand what individual freedom means.


This is all well and good, but entering the HOA was a condition of home purchase. As is the case in every other instance I have ever heard of.
 
2009-03-16 12:28:37 PM
At the point where it's virtually impossible to purchase a house without an HOA, buy software without accepting terms, doing any meaningful business activity without signing away your rights - there is no freedom. Freedom is slowly being outsourced to the hands of those more "able" to determine what's right for you.
 
2009-03-16 12:29:36 PM
jbrooks544: Foreclosing vs. going to small-claims court is silly.

People do need to realize though, that paying HOA or condo fees is not optional. It isn't conditional on you getting whatever services, etc. you might dispute, or anything else. If you own the property, you HAVE to pay the fee.

FEES ARE NOT CONDITIONAL upon anything. You own it, you pay it. period.


Oh please... if you own the property you don't have to pay shiat because guess what, YOU OWN THE PROPERTY! Its yours and no one can force you to pay extra for something you already own, just as no one can take that property away from you because you refused to let them extort money from you.
 
2009-03-16 12:31:59 PM
My sister-in-law just bought a house in an HOA. She did read the contract, but she said it made no sense, contradicting itself in several places. IMHO, HOA's totally suck. That's what you need, like the government doesn't control enough of your life, cede still more control to your HOA.
 
2009-03-16 12:34:10 PM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

Hold thy tongue, swine, lest it be severed from thy mouth.
 
2009-03-16 12:34:46 PM
Dear Submitter:

I am sorry to learn of your recent brain injury. After you learn how to walk and speak again, perhaps you should review the law of contracts. An agreement between a homeowner and the HOA is one of these (contracts), which was entered into willingly and knowingly by both parties.

TA
 
2009-03-16 12:34:56 PM
flashfry:This is all well and good, but entering the HOA was a condition of home purchase. As is the case in every other instance I have ever heard of.

See and that's where you are wrong. That is one of the underhanded tricks they use that is COMPLETELY ILLEGAL, but they count on most people not being aware of that. When they come across someone who wants to fight them, someone who demonstrates real knowledge of the law, they back down very quickly.

Like I said, Ive done thig three times. I'll be damned if some group of strangers is going to tell me what I can and cannot do with my own property.
 
2009-03-16 12:36:34 PM
lisarenee3505: jbrooks544: Foreclosing vs. going to small-claims court is silly.

People do need to realize though, that paying HOA or condo fees is not optional. It isn't conditional on you getting whatever services, etc. you might dispute, or anything else. If you own the property, you HAVE to pay the fee.

FEES ARE NOT CONDITIONAL upon anything. You own it, you pay it. period.

Oh please... if you own the property you don't have to pay shiat because guess what, YOU OWN THE PROPERTY! Its yours and no one can force you to pay extra for something you already own, just as no one can take that property away from you because you refused to let them extort money from you.


Property taxes
 
2009-03-16 12:36:44 PM
Liliac_Hill: My sister-in-law just bought a house in an HOA. She did read the contract, but she said it made no sense, contradicting itself in several places.

She's a bright one, isn't she?
 
2009-03-16 12:36:48 PM
lisarenee3505: "Most communities have covenants that give a homeowners association the right to sue property owners, assess penalty fees and even foreclose if dues aren't paid."

Why would anyone even sign one of these things? HOAs are NOT legal entities, they cannot pass laws and they cannot MAKE a homeowner do anything. They have no legal authourity if you don't sign the damn piece of paper.

Look, if I decide to buy a house somewhere, I'm just going to buy it. Then when the local HOA comes to me and says "you have to sign this agreement or you can't live here", I tell them no thank you, I'll coordinate with the city myself for services. When they press the issue, I tell them to fark off. When they press the issue even further, I sue the crap out of THEM!. Trust me, this works in many places, as I've already done it three times and won. It is not difficult at all to take the tactics of an HOA that literally force people through intimidation and coersion to sign an agreement, and paint that organization as a racketeering front to a jury, not unlike the Mafia . Like I said, I've done it three times.

This is America, and here a person has domain over their own land. As long as you refust to sign up with an HOA and you handle your city cervices yourself, they absolutely CANNOT tell you what to do with or on your own land.

And for all of you pussies who say "well you HAVE to sign with them in order to live in the neighborhood" are spineless idiots who don't have the guts to stand up for your own rights. You'd rather just pay them a little blood money each month than make them understand what individual freedom means.


I don't think it's that easy. From what I heard the HOA contract is written into the deed. The person you are buying from is the HOA, they own the home and you buy it from them.
 
2009-03-16 12:37:12 PM
HotWingConspiracy: I still don't get how an outside party can foreclose on your home, even if you sign a piece of paper saying they can.

In some states, quasi-governmental bodies have permission to enforce rules. For example, in my home state, HOAs coming under a certain classification are authorized by law to levy fines and take foreclosure action.

Kevin5280: I've lived in a reasonable HOA neighborhood, but it seems that there are more and more "Just fork over the money and STFU because my watch says 7:02 and the trash cans are supposed to be in by 7:00 p.m." types who are more interested in making money wherever they can as opposed to creating a pleasant neighborhood.

My pal lives in an evil place. His HOA is run by the developer, who requires an 80% weighted (unsold homes count 20 for 1) vote for any rule change. So the developer holds and rents 6% of the houses to control the HOA forever.

This developer raised the fees and fines to crazy rates to pay himself. My pal managed to get elected president of the owner board, and forced the books open. He found around $800,000 in 2007 diverted from the HOA account to other developer accounts without reason. The local DA was uninterested in following up on any charges of wrongdoing.

Everyone in that development is screwed. Buyers learn the score pretty quickly from the comps, so houses there don't sell.
 
2009-03-16 12:37:55 PM
therealpope: we were unable to complete repairs on a community fence and hire a competent trash service.

This is something I don't understand about HOA areas. We don't have them around here and my only contact with them is in fark threads.

Does the city not provide water, sewer, waste pickup, lighting, and maintenance of public areas (parks, paths, etc)? I pay city taxes that fund this. Do HOA residents not pay city taxes and instead hire 3rd party companies for this stuff?

The city bylaws also cover 90% of the basic rules people are frightened into signing into an HOA for as well. I just can't see point of HOAs other than groupthink.
 
2009-03-16 12:39:16 PM
HOA corruption or any small scale quasigovernment organizations for that matter

1. Build a small collection of tight nit old folks. The elderly have the spare time to organize like no other group and are always able to make meetings and vote.

2. Promise exceptions to certain rules or additional communal projects strategically placed near supporters domiciles. Also, authorize no-bid contracts to supporters or your own lawncare services.

3. When running HOA meetings host them at the most inconvenient times for people who actually work. Do not allow dissenters to speak. Yes, this is actually allowed.

4. You win. HOAs are democracy in action.
 
2009-03-16 12:39:40 PM
Sure, sure. Because nothing increases a home's value like being surrounded by a bunch of empty houses.

HOAs must be run by people too dumb to get government jobs.
 
2009-03-16 12:39:42 PM
Liliac_Hill: My sister-in-law just bought a house in an HOA. She did read the contract, but she said it made no sense, contradicting itself in several places. IMHO, HOA's totally suck. That's what you need, like the government doesn't control enough of your life, cede still more control to your HOA.

I personally would probably NOT buy a house in a neighborhood unless an HOA had some control. I don't want some jackass neighbor painting their house pink with purple spots at about the time I'm getting ready to sell.
 
2009-03-16 12:40:48 PM
Nuke these god damn cartels. They're fundamentally anti-American.
 
2009-03-16 12:43:42 PM
MrSteve007:

Simply gorgeous.

RocketCarHead: I will have no part of this HOA cocksuckery.
Nice. Surprised it got through the filters.

jbrooks544: Foreclosing vs. going to small-claims court is silly.

People do need to realize though, that paying HOA or condo fees is not optional. It isn't conditional on you getting whatever services, etc. you might dispute, or anything else. If you own the property, you HAVE to pay the fee.

FEES ARE NOT CONDITIONAL upon anything. You own it, you pay it. period.


This has me thinking. I know this isn't unique to Baltimore, but in Baltimore if you're landlord isn't holding up his end of the contract (through unsafe living conditions, not making repairs etc.), there's a way for for the renter to go to city government/courts and have an escrow account set up that the rent is then paid to. This way the renter is still paying rent and cannot be evicted. But the landlord doesn't get the rent until the issues are resolved.

If this were a legitimate case of the HOA not fulfilling its side of the contract (which is what the article claimed and wouldn't surprise me because I have too many friends who've moved into HOA's that get nasty about dues but don't fulfill their end of the agreement), I think this kind of an option should be available. Paying dues is required but the homeowner should have some recourse.

/Doesn't actually know if there's other recourse available to homeowners like suing the HOA?
 
2009-03-16 12:44:29 PM
They will not foreclose on those homes! If they foreclose on them then the HOA becomes responsible for the mortgage payment on those homes. They do not have the $$ for that!
 
2009-03-16 12:44:55 PM
/my grammar sux today
//sorry
 
2009-03-16 12:48:15 PM
lisarenee3505: I'll be damned if some group of strangers is going to tell me what I can and cannot do with my own property.

Joining an HOA is more than a contract. When you join an HOA, you are giving this organization a part-ownership interest in your property.

The HOA can foreclose because they own part of your house.

When you buy a house that is already part of an HOA, then the seller does not own 100% of the house to sell to you. You can only buy the part that the HOA does not already own.
 
2009-03-16 12:48:30 PM
Sticky Hands: lisarenee3505: jbrooks544: Foreclosing vs. going to small-claims court is silly.

Property taxes


Yeah, what about them? That is not a case of someone telling me that I can't paint my house a particular color or fly the American flag on my front lawn. Property taxes go toward supporting the community as a whole, providing police, fire, sewer, and garbage services, among other things. I have no problem with that. HOAs come in and want you to pay again for those things. Its a racket and if people would simply stand up to them and take action, rather than being passive and just refusing to pay then rolling over when they try to foreclose, then we homeowners could finally really take back our homes.

Well, the rest of you can, I've already done it.
 
2009-03-16 12:48:41 PM
hovsm: lisarenee3505: "Most communities have covenants that give a homeowners association the right to sue property owners, assess penalty fees and even foreclose if dues aren't paid."

Why would anyone even sign one of these things? HOAs are NOT legal entities, they cannot pass laws and they cannot MAKE a homeowner do anything. They have no legal authourity if you don't sign the damn piece of paper.

Look, if I decide to buy a house somewhere, I'm just going to buy it. Then when the local HOA comes to me and says "you have to sign this agreement or you can't live here", I tell them no thank you, I'll coordinate with the city myself for services. When they press the issue, I tell them to fark off. When they press the issue even further, I sue the crap out of THEM!. Trust me, this works in many places, as I've already done it three times and won. It is not difficult at all to take the tactics of an HOA that literally force people through intimidation and coersion to sign an agreement, and paint that organization as a racketeering front to a jury, not unlike the Mafia . Like I said, I've done it three times.

This is America, and here a person has domain over their own land. As long as you refust to sign up with an HOA and you handle your city cervices yourself, they absolutely CANNOT tell you what to do with or on your own land.

And for all of you pussies who say "well you HAVE to sign with them in order to live in the neighborhood" are spineless idiots who don't have the guts to stand up for your own rights. You'd rather just pay them a little blood money each month than make them understand what individual freedom means.

I don't think it's that easy. From what I heard the HOA contract is written into the deed. The person you are buying from is the HOA, they own the home and you buy it from them.


When I purchased a home it was neither the above. The HOA contract is a mandatory addendum to the sales contract. You would not be able to put in an offer on a house without agreeing in writing to mandatory membership into the HOA. For the few hundred dollars a year most people (like myself) see it as a necessary evil. (I have never seen a neighborhood in the DFW area without an HOA)

It is not a matter of ignoring the HOA when they come by and ask you to sign a piece of paper, your HOA is going about it bass-ackwards.
 
2009-03-16 12:50:32 PM
Well, the rest of you can, I've already done it.

Surely you aren't suggesting that your anectdote regarding your experience with a particular HOA is indicative of the legal status of HOAs as a whole?

Wait, I think you are.
 
2009-03-16 12:51:25 PM
Liliac_Hill: My sister-in-law just bought a house in an HOA. She did read the contract, but she said it made no sense, contradicting itself in several places. IMHO, HOA's totally suck. That's what you need, like the government doesn't control enough of your life, cede still more control to your HOA.

THIS
 
2009-03-16 12:51:32 PM
clancifer: I personally would probably NOT buy a house in a neighborhood unless an HOA had some control. I don't want some jackass neighbor painting their house pink with purple spots at about the time I'm getting ready to sell.

Likelihood your HOA prevents your neighbor from doing something that would affect the value of your home: 0.000000001%
Likelihood you pay thousands of dollars a year to your HOA: 100%
 
2009-03-16 12:54:06 PM
this HOA has apparently just commandeered the entire neighborhood. what an awesome HOA to live for. "We protect your property values, then take your house."
 
2009-03-16 12:54:59 PM
Phinn: lisarenee3505: I'll be damned if some group of strangers is going to tell me what I can and cannot do with my own property.

Joining an HOA is more than a contract. When you join an HOA, you are giving this organization a part-ownership interest in your property.

The HOA can foreclose because they own part of your house.

When you buy a house that is already part of an HOA, then the seller does not own 100% of the house to sell to you. You can only buy the part that the HOA does not already own.


Sounds to me like you are chosing the wrong people to buy from then, my friend. Are you going to buy a car from someone who doesn't actually own the transmission? I think not, so why would you put yourself in the same situation with a home?

Believe it or not, when you own your home, YOU own it. When that deed has your name on it, it is yours lock, stock, and barrel, and no HOA can tell you what to do with it or how you can sell it. I would love to see some HOA try to tell me that they actually own a part of my home. They would get backed off my property with a shotgun stuck in their mug pretty quickly, and guess what! It is LEGAL to protect your own property from tresspassers in such a manner (well in my state, anyway).
 
2009-03-16 12:56:37 PM
I'm on the board of our local HOA.

We maintain a nice recreation area. Lots of residents volunteer their labor.

When somebody complains to us about their neighbor's boat parked in the yard we say: "Sorry, we're not that kind of HOA. Call the county."

I think we do a pretty good job. Dues were recently raised from $50 to $75. Per year. Voluntary. 75% pay their dues.

The secret? Beer. We have regular parties. It keeps folks happy and promotes a sense of community.
 
2009-03-16 12:57:24 PM
Why do HOA's hate our freedom?
 
2009-03-16 12:58:27 PM
Liliac_Hill: My sister-in-law just bought a house in an HOA. She did read the contract, but she said it made no sense, contradicting itself in several places. IMHO, HOA's totally suck. That's what you need, like the government doesn't control enough of your life, cede still more control to your HOA.

As much as they suck ass, at least the HOA is a legitimate, voluntary organization. No one is part of an HOA that did not either (a) join it, (b) buy the property from someone who joined it, or (c) buy the property with the express contractual agreement to join it.

In contrast, the government's claim that it has the authority to control your property and/or force you to pay for the privilege of keeping it is totally involuntary, and therefore totally illegitimate and indefensible.
 
2009-03-16 12:59:36 PM
Arnold T Pants: clancifer: I personally would probably NOT buy a house in a neighborhood unless an HOA had some control. I don't want some jackass neighbor painting their house pink with purple spots at about the time I'm getting ready to sell.

Oh okay, so you would rather infringe on the rights of another homeowner simply for a percieved protection to your profit? You would tell another person what to do with their own property just so you can maybe make a few extra bucks?

Sounds like you and people like the AIG execs and the Bernie Madoff's of the world would get along really well.

People like you are what make me want to shoot my neighbors in the crotch with a bean-bag gun... over and over and over again..
 
2009-03-16 01:01:30 PM
lisarenee3505: Believe it or not, when you own your home, YOU own it. When that deed has your name on it, it is yours lock, stock, and barrel, and no HOA can tell you what to do with it or how you can sell it. I would love to see some HOA try to tell me that they actually own a part of my home. They would get backed off my property with a shotgun stuck in their mug pretty quickly, and guess what! It is LEGAL to protect your own property from tresspassers in such a manner (well in my state, anyway).

For someone who OPENLY claims to be smarter than others, you are PAINFULLY ignorant on the subject of covenants that run with the land. You should research that topic, Mrs. Lock, Stock and Barrel.
 
2009-03-16 01:01:44 PM
DSEILXYC: I'm on the board of our local HOA.

We maintain a nice recreation area. Lots of residents volunteer their labor.

When somebody complains to us about their neighbor's boat parked in the yard we say: "Sorry, we're not that kind of HOA. Call the county."

I think we do a pretty good job. Dues were recently raised from $50 to $75. Per year. Voluntary. 75% pay their dues.

The secret? Beer. We have regular parties. It keeps folks happy and promotes a sense of community.


I have to admit, you guys sound like you're doing right. This is what HOAs are supposed to do.
 
2009-03-16 01:04:08 PM
My HOA (basic coverage, $200 a year for mulch and signs) has a clause prohibiting firearm discharge on or in the property.

since NJ considers a BBGun as a Firearm, I'll be breaking the rules if I target practive in the basement or in the backyard.

OR if I have to shoot an intruder with a real gun. There are no exceptions.

So I mentioned this at a annual meeting to get it fixed (for the intruder part) You would have thought I fingerbanged all their daughters in front of them.

NO one comes to my house anymore. it is a wonderful side affect.
 
2009-03-16 01:08:31 PM
clancifer: I personally would probably NOT buy a house in a neighborhood unless an HOA had some control. I don't want some jackass neighbor painting their house pink with purple spots at about the time I'm getting ready to sell.

That's your choice to have that kind of control of surrounding properties. Hopefully your neighbors share this same love of homogeneity.

It's my opinion that if you fork out hundreds of thousands of dollars to own a piece of the American dream, then you should be able to do whatever the Hell you want to your property so long as it doesn't violate any health regulations, doesn't go over your property line and is not obscene (and by obscene, I mean like painting the word "FARK" in big yellow letters on the side of your house). I personally wouldn't paint my house pink with purple spots, but if I really got the itch to do so, it should be my right for freedom of expression on MY property.

HOAs can be downright oppressive. Well, to each his own...
 
2009-03-16 01:09:17 PM
trueaustinite>: For someone who OPENLY claims to be smarter than others, you are PAINFULLY ignorant on the subject of covenants that run with the land. You should research that topic, Mrs. Lock, Stock and Barrel.

Oh I have. You see that is why I have no problem ranting about this, because it comes from a position of authourity. If you are unaware of the loopholes and realities of the laws, perhaps it is you who should do some more research. I've done mine.
 
2009-03-16 01:11:56 PM
weathermanfsu: They will not foreclose on those homes! If they foreclose on them then the HOA becomes responsible for the mortgage payment on those homes. They do not have the $$ for that!

Not true. The HOA will sell the homes as part of the foreclosure process - the buyer at the foreclosure sale will be responsible for paying the mortgage off (and it will most likely have to be lump sum, so the bids at the foreclosure sale will be very low). The HOA will take their fees out of the foreclosure purchase price and pass the rest (if any) back to the former owner.

As I said earlier, I think the HOA is doing this so that the banks will pay the fees, not the residents. This is the only process that guarantees the HOA will get every dime it is owed.
 
2009-03-16 01:12:01 PM
You know what I love about people who think the easiest way to avoid a HOA is to not move into one? Well, I have news for you. HOAs are notorious for harrasing homeowners who own property adjacent to a HOA neighborhood.

It happened to me when a new housing development went in across the road from my house. When construction was complete on the first dozen or so houses, the developer set up an HOA, and tried to force the existing nearby homeowners to comply with their rules (even though we were not members of the HOA).

I was one of the owners who refused to comply. As a result, their HOA manager began lodging complaints with the township, claiming my property was in violation of township ordinances. Every other week, there was an inspector from the township on my property. They found NO violations.

However, because they received so many complaints, my property was labeled a "nuisance", and they started charging me each time an inspector had to be sent out to my property. I initially refused to pay, insisting they should be going after the person(s) filing all those false complaints. After all, the township had not found a single violation, so it was obvious there was no legit reason for the complaints.

I was wrong. It cost me 6 months of aggrivation and over $3000 in costs and fines before I gave in. But, rather than join the HOA, I moved. Let someone else deal with the HOA control freaks.
 
2009-03-16 01:12:08 PM
If you are unaware of the loopholes and realities of the laws, perhaps it is you who should do some more research. I've done mine.

Which states are you licensed to practice law in?
 
2009-03-16 01:14:14 PM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

Because one of the important freedoms in the "land of the free" is the freedom to contract. It's not the founders' or government's fault when someone agrees to a dumb contract.

/Unless that group is AIG, in which case their stupidity takes down the world's banking system.
 
2009-03-16 01:15:40 PM
mod3072: I see your point, but it still seems like there should be a better way to reclaim those fees than foreclosure. Maybe there currently isn't, but there should be. The idea of giving that kind of authority to a few homeowners arbitrarily elected to a local board gives me the willies. Even the evil credit card companies won't take your home if you don't pay. Maybe they could just trash your credit and have someone make annoying phone calls to your house and work every 10 minutes until you cough it up?

Well, they can technically do that. If you owe the HOA a debt they could probably just sell that debt to a debt collector (at a deep discount of course) or just attempt to collect the debt themselves as a debt collector would. In this case, they may have already done some of the harassing phone call biz. They've certainly sent several "nastygrams" to the homeowners demanding that they pay up.

The problem with this is that the tools of coercion that a debt collector has are the exact same tools that the original holder of the debt has: If they don't pay, sue them, if you win and they still don't pay, seize their property.

Much like with the lawsuit route, you end where you begin. And much like the lawsuit route, the only difference is you pad the process with more time and costs to collect the money.
 
2009-03-16 01:16:45 PM
VTCMart: hovsm: I don't think it's that easy. From what I heard the HOA contract is written into the deed. The person you are buying from is the HOA, they own the home and you buy it from them.

When I purchased a home it was neither the above. The HOA contract is a mandatory addendum to the sales contract. You would not be able to put in an offer on a house without agreeing in writing to mandatory membership into the HOA. For the few hundred dollars a year most people (like myself) see it as a necessary evil. (I have never seen a neighborhood in the DFW area without an HOA)

It is not a matter of ignoring the HOA when they come by and ask you to sign a piece of paper, your HOA is going about it bass-ackwards.


GRRRRR!!! How many times do I have to say it... there is NOTHING mandatory about joining an HOA simply to purchase a home. You just have to know that law and have to courage to stand up to people. You tear that addendum out, explain to the seller that you do not wish to join the HOA, then present the legal documentation that proves that it is illegal for any entity to demand that you agree to paid membership as a condition of purchase of real property.

Yes you might have to wait a few days while their lawyers go over it, but in the end they will fold because they know there is nothing they can do.
 
2009-03-16 01:17:31 PM
Loreweaver: You know what I love about people who think the easiest way to avoid a HOA is to not move into one? Well, I have news for you. HOAs are notorious for harrasing homeowners who own property adjacent to a HOA neighborhood.

It happened to me when a new housing development went in across the road from my house. When construction was complete on the first dozen or so houses, the developer set up an HOA, and tried to force the existing nearby homeowners to comply with their rules (even though we were not members of the HOA).

I was one of the owners who refused to comply. As a result, their HOA manager began lodging complaints with the township, claiming my property was in violation of township ordinances. Every other week, there was an inspector from the township on my property. They found NO violations.

However, because they received so many complaints, my property was labeled a "nuisance", and they started charging me each time an inspector had to be sent out to my property. I initially refused to pay, insisting they should be going after the person(s) filing all those false complaints. After all, the township had not found a single violation, so it was obvious there was no legit reason for the complaints.

I was wrong. It cost me 6 months of aggrivation and over $3000 in costs and fines before I gave in. But, rather than join the HOA, I moved. Let someone else deal with the HOA control freaks.


Your real problem is the harassment you suffered at the hands of this mafia-style gang you call a "township" that presumes to have the right to (a) force you to comply with rules and regulations you did not voluntarily agree to abide by, and (b) charge you for complaints made by other people.

The problem is not HOAs. It's this hideous, destructive fiction called the state.
 
2009-03-16 01:18:42 PM
Bestbank Tiger : If the HOA doesn't honor its end of the contract, can the homeowners foreclose on HOA property?

1) HOA stands for Homeowners Association. So if there are 100 houses, the 100 owners of those houses ARE THE HOA.

2) The HOA itself doesn't really own any property. Each of the homeowners owns their own home. There might be some pieces of property that are communally "owned", but what that really means is that each of the 100 hypothetical homeowners I mentioned above, each own 1/100th of that communal property.

3) Thus, suing the HOA is an abstract way of suing all 100 homeowners (yes, including yourself). And foreclosing on "HOA property" is like trying to foreclose on all 100 homeowners (each owning 1/100th of said communal property) once again, including yourself.

4) In most states, there are strict laws regarding what an HOA can and can not do. In my state, for example, rules are created/destroyed via voting. It requires a majority vote to get rules created or destroyed.

At the end of the day, if you have shiatty neighbors, you will have a shiatty HOA, and in that case, even if there wasn't an HOA, you would still have shiatty neighbors.

OTOH, if you have decent neighbors, then you will have a decent HOA.

The problem isn't HOAs, the problem is the HO's :D
 
2009-03-16 01:18:47 PM
lisarenee3505: GRRRRR!!! How many times do I have to say it... there is NOTHING mandatory about joining an HOA simply to purchase a home. You just have to know that law and have to courage to stand up to people. You tear that addendum out, explain to the seller that you do not wish to join the HOA, then present the legal documentation that proves that it is illegal for any entity to demand that you agree to paid membership as a condition of purchase of real property.

Yes you might have to wait a few days while their lawyers go over it, but in the end they will fold because they know there is nothing they can do.


I am not arguing that this is not correct. I am saying that one may not, sans possible legal consequences, ignore the restrictions that one willingly contracted to abide by.
 
2009-03-16 01:20:46 PM
trueaustinite: If you are unaware of the loopholes and realities of the laws, perhaps it is you who should do some more research. I've done mine.

Which states are you licensed to practice law in?


None, and you don't have to be licensed to practice law to understand the law and how it can be used to one's benefit. You just have to be willing to get out there and find the information for yourself.
 
2009-03-16 01:21:30 PM
LarryDan43: 84 foreclosed and soon to be empty homes? Sweet, I'll let some squatters know.

Shane, Jackson and Marla seen fleeing the scene.
 
2009-03-16 01:22:08 PM
trueaustinite: I am not arguing that this is not correct. I am saying that one may not, sans possible legal consequences, ignore the restrictions that one willingly contracted to abide by.

That's why I say don't enter into the agreement in the first place.
 
2009-03-16 01:22:46 PM
So it's legal for people to sell themselves into slavery? Whatever happened to inalienable rights?

It's entirely legal to give away your rights -- just look how many voted to do the same when they elected The Obamessiah.
 
2009-03-16 01:25:26 PM
Dr.Khron: For some reason, I was under the impression that the purpose of an HOA was to keep black people out of your neighborhood...

Since you can't do that anymore, we don't need HOAs anymore. And yet, they still exist.


Mostly they're to keep county taxes low, or at least county expenditures low. Most cities are built out so a lot of new building is city-like building that takes place in unincorporated areas of a county. However, counties aren't cities, and they don't offer city like services (because that would be expensive across the whole county). So usually rather than take over streets/garbage/water/sewer/septic systems built by a developer, and operate them, counties require the developer to create an HOA to maintain those common systems as a part of the agreement that will allow the rezoning or subdivision that enables residential houses to be built.
 
2009-03-16 01:25:30 PM
Why would anyone buy a house that is covered by a HOA? You get what you ask for. Stop your biatching.
 
2009-03-16 01:27:47 PM
lisarenee3505: trueaustinite: I am not arguing that this is not correct. I am saying that one may not, sans possible legal consequences, ignore the restrictions that one willingly contracted to abide by.

That's why I say don't enter into the agreement in the first place.


If you don't enter the agreement, you lose your bid to buy the house. Unless you can somehow finagle the law in your favor (which is nigh impossible here in PA), you don't buy the house.

What state do you live in?
 
2009-03-16 01:28:54 PM
lisarenee3505: flashfry:This is all well and good, but entering the HOA was a condition of home purchase. As is the case in every other instance I have ever heard of.

See and that's where you are wrong. That is one of the underhanded tricks they use that is COMPLETELY ILLEGAL, but they count on most people not being aware of that. When they come across someone who wants to fight them, someone who demonstrates real knowledge of the law, they back down very quickly.

Like I said, Ive done thig three times. I'll be damned if some group of strangers is going to tell me what I can and cannot do with my own property.


Give me one piece of real property where you have successfully done this, troll. Don't give me the specific home, just a random home in that association. I want the name of the association you gracefully bowed out of. And I will call the assessor to tear apart your BS story.

You are so full of shiat you can only be a troll. And not a very good one.
 
2009-03-16 01:32:29 PM
BrendaK: So it's legal for people to sell themselves into slavery? Whatever happened to inalienable rights?

It's entirely legal to give away your rights -- just look how many voted to do the same when they elected The Obamessiah.


Okay you can go DIAF after being raped repetedly by Armenians wearing glass-lined condoms. You DO NOT talk shiat about the President unless you can provide some evidence of Bush doing a better job.. or any job other than destroying the economy and dragging us into an illegal war. Until then, you need to STFU and learn your place, which as an obvious Rethuglican is down in the gutter. You people are FINISHED, don't you get it?!? YOU PEOPLE have come very close to destroying this country and now you want to talk shiat about the man who is going to pull us back from the brink?

Such arrogance! Such audacity!! It is my sincerest hope that some group of concerned REAL Americans will get together and start removing Rethugs from society by any means necessary.
 
2009-03-16 01:33:31 PM
antique1960: Why would anyone buy a house that is covered by a HOA? You get what you ask for. Stop your biatching.

The original intent of HOAs was to maintain community property. That would be parks, fences, gates, pools, clubhouses, golf courses, signage, etc etc.

Some HOAs, however, went too far and started restricting things like the colors you can paint your house, etc. Those, IMO are the bad ones, and are the ones that you hear about on fark all the time.

What it comes down to is that HOAs that have those kinds of rules, are filled with people who want said rules. Otherwise, if the majority of people in the HOA didn't care about house colors, they would start a vote and have that rule tossed.

So, I put HOAs into the following categories.

Condo HOAs : required, simply due to the amount of communal property.

House HOAs (with communal property) : required, due to the amount of communal property.

Hose HOAs (without communal property) : not required (no communal property). These are the HOAs where you get all of the busybodies and bad neighbor action.
 
2009-03-16 01:37:07 PM
lisarenee3505: GRRRRR!!! How many times do I have to say it... there is NOTHING mandatory about joining an HOA simply to purchase a home. You just have to know that law and have to courage to stand up to people. You tear that addendum out, explain to the seller that you do not wish to join the HOA, then present the legal documentation that proves that it is illegal for any entity to demand that you agree to paid membership as a condition of purchase of real property.

Okay, since you've done your homework and done this 3 times apparently, please provide a link to that law. And since your opinion seems to apply universally, that damn well better be a federal law.

/pretty sure you've got jack and shiat.
 
2009-03-16 01:39:27 PM
lisarenee3505: trueaustinite: I am not arguing that this is not correct. I am saying that one may not, sans possible legal consequences, ignore the restrictions that one willingly contracted to abide by.

That's why I say don't enter into the agreement in the first place.


Whether you decide to become a dues-paying member of the HOA or not, how does that affect the covenants on the land? Don't you agree to those covenants not by joining the HOA, but by buying the real property in the first place?
In other words, doesn't the transfer deed itself says "the HOA can restrict some things"?
 
2009-03-16 01:40:29 PM
HOAs foreclosing? Yea, nothing brings up property values like a bunch of foreclosures in the neighborhood. Excellent HOA work!

Sounds like some housewife-Hitler is really into the whole "cut off your nose to spite your face" mentality.

/Godwin like you mean it!
 
2009-03-16 01:42:26 PM
flashfry: Give me one piece of real property where you have successfully done this, troll. Don't give me the specific home, just a random home in that association. I want the name of the association you gracefully bowed out of. And I will call the assessor to tear apart your BS story.

You are so full of shiat you can only be a troll. And not a very good one.

So you want one piece of property, yet you don't want a specific home? Well seeing as that I'm probably the ONLY person in the neighborhood who has done this, giving you a random house address wouldn't do you much good would it?

And what assessor is going to divulge information about a unique legal situation that, if that information became public knowledge, would severely threaten their ability to continue to extort money from homeowners.

You're not very good at this logic thing, are you?
 
2009-03-16 01:45:20 PM
lisarenee3505

Well come on, if it's the law of the land, it should be easy for you to just provide the law you used. Hell, you'd be helping a lot of farkers out by just sharing the knowledge.

/if you weren't full of shiat
//which of course you are.
///which is why I have marked you to be put on ignore next time I see you spout stupidity
 
2009-03-16 01:47:31 PM
JanusofZeal: Okay, since you've done your homework and done this 3 times apparently, please provide a link to that law. And since your opinion seems to apply universally, that damn well better be a federal law.

/pretty sure you've got jack and shiat.



I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.
 
2009-03-16 01:49:56 PM
I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Well, now see that would be practicing law without a license (which you have clearly offered to do here in a public forum).

But I'm sure you've beaten that fairly universally-accepted prohibition as well.

LOL.
 
2009-03-16 01:50:35 PM
lisarenee3505: I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Hahaha. Yea, right. Do you tell kids "fark you, go get a book to learn math." Of course not. You can't provide ANYTHING, because you're 100% full of shiat. You have ZERO to back up anything you say.

Well, I want to warn you. I saw a yeti walking across your lawn today. I won't provide proof though, you'll just have to go look for yourself.

Welcome to my ignore list, raving psychotic liar #2741.
 
2009-03-16 01:52:26 PM
GEEK FIGHT!!!
 
2009-03-16 01:52:45 PM
trueaustinite: I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Well, now see that would be practicing law without a license (which you have clearly offered to do here in a public forum).

But I'm sure you've beaten that fairly universally-accepted prohibition as well.

LOL.


The FAIL TRAIN is pulling into the station for ya... it's not practicing law w/o a license. If that were so then every online legal library would be shut down.
 
2009-03-16 01:54:00 PM
MrHappyRotter: GEEK FIGHT!!!

GUY JERKING OFF TO A GEEK FIGHT!!!
 
2009-03-16 01:54:04 PM
lisarenee3505

You seriously need to cut down on the caffeine -- and take a good look at the real world around you. You'll be on the breadline soon enough.

Also, the accepted spelling is 'valuable.' Good thing you got that incredible education!
 
2009-03-16 01:54:52 PM
lisarenee3505: Okay you can go DIAF after being raped repetedly by Armenians wearing glass-lined condoms. You DO NOT talk shiat about the President unless you can provide some evidence of Bush doing a better job.. or any job other than destroying the economy and dragging us into an illegal war. Until then, you need to STFU and learn your place, which as an obvious Rethuglican is down in the gutter. You people are FINISHED, don't you get it?!? YOU PEOPLE have come very close to destroying this country and now you want to talk shiat about the man who is going to pull us back from the brink?

Such arrogance! Such audacity!! It is my sincerest hope that some group of concerned REAL Americans will get together and start removing Rethugs from society by any means necessary.


Real or parody?
 
2009-03-16 01:55:10 PM
JanusofZeal: Welcome to my ignore list, raving psychotic liar #2741.

Is ignoring people really so difficult that we need to invoke computer software to accomplish it? How childish...

/feel free to "ignore" me too if you please
//even if you were in the right in that particular argument, nothing says maturity like walling oneself off in a little pocket of protected reality
 
2009-03-16 01:55:39 PM
lisarenee3505: The FAIL TRAIN is pulling into the station for ya... it's not practicing law w/o a license. If that were so then every online legal library would be shut down.

Holding out YOUR legal services to others for pay without a license is you twat.
 
2009-03-16 01:57:46 PM
If you're stupid enough to live where there's an HOA, you deserve whatever happens.
 
2009-03-16 02:00:25 PM
I'm in the market to buy a house right now, and the HoA thing is a big deal to me - I refuse to pay more than $150 a year for a HoA. If I find a house I want that requires more than that annually for HoA dues, I'll either alter the contract or skip the home. It really is that simple to me, as I've read too many horror stories regarding HoAs and the pricks that run them.
 
2009-03-16 02:03:09 PM
lisarenee3505: I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Again, explain this to me... I'll break it down in the steps to buy a house here in PA, ok?

1) Have interest in house
2) Offer bid on house
3) Offer is accepted, contingent on various approvals
4) HOA is part of that contingency
4a) You do not agree to be a part of the HOA
4a1)You lose your bid on the house, end of story.
4a2)You change your mind if the house is that important to you, see 4b
4b) You become a part of the HOA, and the house is yours.

There are no ifs, ands, or buts about it. If the HOA is part of the deed, then you have to either accept the deed AS IS and become a part of the HOA, or you walk and find some other place that doesn't have a HOA.

There is no universal law like you purport. We'd been house-shopping for a while, and there was no way around the associations (I've had two different lawyers look into it for me, and no dice). So I'm going to have to side with the others here and say you're full of shiat. Completely and totally.
 
2009-03-16 02:04:22 PM
jshine: Is ignoring people really so difficult that we need to invoke computer software to accomplish it? How childish...

/feel free to "ignore" me too if you please
//even if you were in the right in that particular argument, nothing says maturity like walling oneself off in a little pocket of protected reality


I do need the computer software to remember who to ignore for me. It is amazing how much nicer fark is when you don't even have the chance to read the ramblings of trolls. It's just a matter of a nice simple way to bypass all that stupidity. Also, I don't see anything wrong with using technology to help me in every facet of life, including ignoring people.

/will not be ignoring you
//only ignores people who are blatant trolls or idiots
 
2009-03-16 02:06:19 PM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

You're free not to buy the house.

I am part of an HOA. I pay about $150 a year for some beds to be maintained. The HOA rules are basically "don't be white trash" which I'm all in favor of. My previous home was a little townhouse condo which also had an HOA. Dues paid were a lot but included utilities, building insurance, all landscaping, etc so it was cool. The rules there were "don't be white trash and only X% of units can be rentals" which again I was totally in favor of.

Maybe I've just never run into crazy people but HOAs to me seem like a good thing (cue Martha voice).
 
2009-03-16 02:23:27 PM
lisarenee3505: trueaustinite: I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Well, now see that would be practicing law without a license (which you have clearly offered to do here in a public forum).

But I'm sure you've beaten that fairly universally-accepted prohibition as well.

LOL.

The FAIL TRAIN is pulling into the station for ya... it's not practicing law w/o a license. If that were so then every online legal library would be shut down.


I don't get to say this very often, but you are absolutely WRONG. Completely and utterly incorrect. The rules of a HOA are part of the DEED. When you close, the deed will be noted to reflect that the land and house are covered by an a HOA. You are legally required to abide by the rules, or the HOA can and will sue you and win. And then they will either place a lien against your property or foreclose.

Please do not argue any of these points. It will just make you look like a bigger fool than you already do, if that is possible.
 
2009-03-16 02:33:53 PM
I'm in the market for a house right now, and while I would try to avoid buying a house with HOA dues, it doesn't matter-the ones with the dues are out of my price range anyways. Haha-being only slightly not poor works in my favor for a change!
 
2009-03-16 02:37:48 PM
NightOwl2255: lisarenee3505: trueaustinite: I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Well, now see that would be practicing law without a license (which you have clearly offered to do here in a public forum).

But I'm sure you've beaten that fairly universally-accepted prohibition as well.

LOL.

The FAIL TRAIN is pulling into the station for ya... it's not practicing law w/o a license. If that were so then every online legal library would be shut down.

I don't get to say this very often, but you are absolutely WRONG. Completely and utterly incorrect. The rules of a HOA are part of the DEED. When you close, the deed will be noted to reflect that the land and house are covered by an a HOA. You are legally required to abide by the rules, or the HOA can and will sue you and win. And then they will either place a lien against your property or foreclose.

Please do not argue any of these points. It will just make you look like a bigger fool than you already do, if that is possible.


Someone should tell her about mineral rights and how purchasing a house doesn't give her the rights to what's beneath the soil. Her head might asplode.
 
2009-03-16 02:52:24 PM
LarryDan43: NightOwl2255: lisarenee3505: trueaustinite: I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Well, now see that would be practicing law without a license (which you have clearly offered to do here in a public forum).

But I'm sure you've beaten that fairly universally-accepted prohibition as well.

LOL.

The FAIL TRAIN is pulling into the station for ya... it's not practicing law w/o a license. If that were so then every online legal library would be shut down.

I don't get to say this very often, but you are absolutely WRONG. Completely and utterly incorrect. The rules of a HOA are part of the DEED. When you close, the deed will be noted to reflect that the land and house are covered by an a HOA. You are legally required to abide by the rules, or the HOA can and will sue you and win. And then they will either place a lien against your property or foreclose.

Please do not argue any of these points. It will just make you look like a bigger fool than you already do, if that is possible.

Someone should tell her about mineral rights and how purchasing a house doesn't give her the rights to what's beneath the soil. Her head might asplode.


If it did, it would not be much of an explosion.
 
2009-03-16 02:56:36 PM
eddyatwork: I never understood why a HOA can even exist in the so called "land of the free".

Because freedom means being free to be stupid.
 
2009-03-16 02:58:53 PM
Was working at a customer's home as a cabinet maker a long time ago. HOA biatch Cindy comes by and informs homeowner that work truck is leaking oil (quarter sized drop!) and cites owner for 100.00!

I covered it by backing it out of my invoice.

Found out where Cindy lived.

Finally figured out what to do with years worth of used oil in 5 gallon buckets.
 
2009-03-16 03:04:20 PM
HOAs should be limited by state laws. Sure people sign on voluntarily, but the law doesn't allow for people to voluntarily submit to slavery, Wal-Mart employment excepted.
 
2009-03-16 03:10:27 PM
NeoKast: My home falls under a HOA, and for the life of me I don't know wtf they do with my $260 annual dues. It certainly feels mafioso, since there literally seems to be NOTHING that benefits me that comes from the HOA, unless you count controlling what my neighbors can and can't do to their homes and yards, which I honestly don't give a damn about what they do anyway.

Supposedly they do stuff with the money, but it seems like it all goes to the slightly nicer new neighborhood around the block from me than in my own.


It looks to me like you do know what they do with your money.
 
2009-03-16 03:16:56 PM
What good would this do?

The yard nazis foreclose on the homes, some bargain-hunters purchase them at auction, the yard nazis collect their dues, then the new owners turn around and rent the damned houses out and "forget" to pay their dues, too.
 
2009-03-16 03:24:52 PM
icanhazstapler: Nuke these god damn cartels. They're fundamentally anti-American.

Making agreements and then seizing property is anti-American? Someone better get back to the 13 colonies and tell them to stop HOAing the natives to death.
 
2009-03-16 03:34:48 PM
Roommate almost got a lien on his house because of the HOA. I guess you really do need to pay those $40.00 HOA noise violations.


/It totally worth it though...epic party
 
2009-03-16 03:35:38 PM
lisarenee3505: JanusofZeal: Okay, since you've done your homework and done this 3 times apparently, please provide a link to that law. And since your opinion seems to apply universally, that damn well better be a federal law.

/pretty sure you've got jack and shiat.


I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.


Obvious Troll is......impressed with this young one.
 
2009-03-16 03:38:43 PM
ramblemn: My HOA (basic coverage, $200 a year for mulch and signs) has a clause prohibiting firearm discharge on or in the property.

since NJ considers a BBGun as a Firearm, I'll be breaking the rules if I target practive in the basement or in the backyard.

OR if I have to shoot an intruder with a real gun. There are no exceptions.

So I mentioned this at a annual meeting to get it fixed (for the intruder part) You would have thought I fingerbanged all their daughters in front of them.

NO one comes to my house anymore. it is a wonderful side affect.


So a local HOA legally has more power than the Federal Government in regards to your right of self defense?

Sorry man, that sounds kinda b.sish to me. If that truly is in their clause - that you can not maintain a weapon or discharge a weapon in self defense in order for the preservation of life, please contact me privately. I would LOVE to chat with you. But right now..im thinking you are worked up because in general HOA suck and you are adding fuel to the flames. I dont blame you though..they do suck.

Also...people please stop feeding the troll. Ms sue 3 times and win has reeled you in hook, line and sinker.

10/10 perfection. Subtle but with just enough crazy that people fell for it.
 
2009-03-16 03:47:45 PM
incrdbil: lisarenee3505: JanusofZeal: Okay, since you've done your homework and done this 3 times apparently, please provide a link to that law. And since your opinion seems to apply universally, that damn well better be a federal law.

/pretty sure you've got jack and shiat.


I'll tell you what, when you agree to pay me for the hundreds of hours of time and energy I devoted to studying the laws and finding out the truth FOR MYSELF, then I'll share this very valueable info. Until then, take your ass to your local library and do your own damn research.

Obvious Troll is......impressed with this young one.


Seriously...i just did some looking...this may be the real deal. Full on crazy fark out.

Lisa.. Lisa.. Lisa.. Would your Featherstone friends approve of this?

Well you let me know if you are FSU Lisa. If so..lets talk geology sometime. Just please take your meds prior.
 
2009-03-16 03:48:30 PM
lisarenee3505: BrendaK: So it's legal for people to sell themselves into slavery? Whatever happened to inalienable rights?

It's entirely legal to give away your rights -- just look how many voted to do the same when they elected The Obamessiah.

Okay you can go DIAF after being raped repetedly by Armenians wearing glass-lined condoms. You DO NOT talk shiat about the President unless you can provide some evidence of Bush doing a better job.. or any job other than destroying the economy and dragging us into an illegal war. Until then, you need to STFU and learn your place, which as an obvious Rethuglican is down in the gutter. You people are FINISHED, don't you get it?!? YOU PEOPLE have come very close to destroying this country and now you want to talk shiat about the man who is going to pull us back from the brink?

Such arrogance! Such audacity!! It is my sincerest hope that some group of concerned REAL Americans will get together and start removing Rethugs from society by any means necessary.


*yawn*

You do realize that the economy didn't go into the shiatter until AFTER Obama was elected, right?

Can't keep placing blame on Bush now.

Oh, and btw...

img.photobucket.com
 
2009-03-16 04:28:23 PM
Apik0r0s: HOAs should be limited by state laws. Sure people sign on voluntarily, but the law doesn't allow for people to voluntarily submit to slavery, Wal-Mart employment excepted.

It's adverse ignorance of what an HOA is that is the heart of the problem.
An HOA is a legal entity. The only was for a developer to build an addition is to take on certain legal responsibilities. The only way to relinquish those responsibilities is to pass them on to the homeowners through an HOA. How the HOA is run is up to the homeowners. Many people think that an HOA is just a group of homeowners telling other homeowners to cut their grass and move their cars out of the street. That image is just flat out wrong.
There might a few HOA's that have been turned into that, but the homeowners can vote to change any covenants they want.
Many people, myself included, want to be in an area covered by an HOA. Before we built our house we got a copy of the HOA CC&Rs. There were a couple of covenants I could live without, but over all we agreed with them.
I'm glad I have the freedom to buy into an area where I know what to expect, and can be fairly sure that the value of my house won't be reduced by a neighbor painting his house hot pink and raising chickens in his front yard.
Don't like HOA's, don't buy into one. But don't buy into one, and then biatch about it.
 
2009-03-16 04:32:22 PM
"You do realize that the economy didn't go into the shiatter until AFTER Obama was elected, right?"

That must have been the LONGEST 7 weeks in history.......
 
2009-03-16 04:50:24 PM
Nonesuch: "You do realize that the economy didn't go into the shiatter until AFTER Obama was elected, right?"

That must have been the LONGEST 7 weeks in history.......


That's what she said.

/and isn't the rule that you can reply to a troll WITH a troll with no ill effects?
 
2009-03-16 04:54:08 PM
Wait. $130/year in dues? So the "association" is some dude with a riding mower and a pool skimmer? Surely that's supposed to be $130/month.
 
2009-03-16 05:02:59 PM
BrendaK: lisarenee3505

You seriously need to cut down on the caffeine -- and take a good look at the real world around you. You'll be on the breadline soon enough.

Also, the accepted spelling is 'valuable.' Good thing you got that incredible education!


Umm, I'm sorry, you neo-con rethuglican jack-boot-loving fascist, but a response from you was neither requested nor warranted. If you hate our President so much then how about you renounce your citizenship and pass all of your state and/or federal IDs forward to be shredded, because you are DISMISSED!
 
2009-03-16 05:21:55 PM
Inibrius: lisarenee3505: BrendaK: So it's legal for people to sell themselves into slavery? Whatever happened to inalienable rights?

It's entirely legal to give away your rights -- just look how many voted to do the same when they elected The Obamessiah.

Okay you can go DIAF after being raped repetedly by Armenians wearing glass-lined condoms. You DO NOT talk shiat about the President unless you can provide some evidence of Bush doing a better job.. or any job other than destroying the economy and dragging us into an illegal war. Until then, you need to STFU and learn your place, which as an obvious Rethuglican is down in the gutter. You people are FINISHED, don't you get it?!? YOU PEOPLE have come very close to destroying this country and now you want to talk shiat about the man who is going to pull us back from the brink?

Such arrogance! Such audacity!! It is my sincerest hope that some group of concerned REAL Americans will get together and start removing Rethugs from society by any means necessary.

*yawn*

You do realize that the economy didn't go into the shiatter until AFTER Obama was elected, right?

Can't keep placing blame on Bush now.

Oh, and btw...


Yet another neo-con revisionist who just can't see the forest for the trees. Do you REALLY think that Obama caused all of this in just the few weeks he's been in office? Seriously? I mean really, how stupid are you? Do you have to remind yourself to breathe every few seconds? How can you not realize that the economic policies and deregulation that caused this meltdown were put in place BY BUSH. Let me say that again, just incase it didn't get through all the shiat that has replaced the majority of your brains... the economic policies and deregulation that caused this meltdown were put in place BY BUSH. BY BUSH! BY BUSH!!!!

Jeezus I am so sick and tired of all these so-called "conservatives" making statements that fly in the face of actual reality. I mean, I realize that you guys all live in your own limited little fantasy world where unchecked capitalism works and there's a magical sky-fairy to watch over you, but sooner or later you dense-headed R-tards are going to have to either stand and face the horror that your hero G-Dubya has wrought, or fall by the wayside and let the adults get some work done.

Step up or step aside, you farking inbred, slack-jawed, dopey-eyed mouth-breathers!
 
2009-03-16 05:27:28 PM
and can be fairly sure that the value of my house won't be reduced by a neighbor painting his house hot pink and raising chickens in his front yard.

Where do hell do you live that local government allows people to raise livestock in their front yard? Y'all are familiar with the concept of "ordinances" right?
 
2009-03-16 05:29:46 PM
lisarenee3505: Umm, I'm sorry, you neo-con rethuglican jack-boot-loving fascist, but a response from you was neither requested nor warranted. If you hate our President so much then how about you renounce your citizenship and pass all of your state and/or federal IDs forward to be shredded, because you are DISMISSED!

Gee, for someone who so hotly resents her neighbors telling her what to do, you really get excited when you defend the power of the government to tell everyone what to do.
 
2009-03-16 05:35:19 PM
lisarenee3505: Umm, I'm sorry, you neo-con rethuglican jack-boot-loving fascist, but a response from you was neither requested nor warranted. If you hate our President so much then how about you renounce your citizenship and pass all of your state and/or federal IDs forward to be shredded, because you are DISMISSED!

Ooooooo, ikle-boo got her widdle fweewings hurt. Maybe Barney Frank can give you a great, big 'everything's FINE with Fanny Mae' hug and it'll all be better. Oh, and President Obamessiah can send you a nice unicorn! Unicorn magic will certainly fix the market, now that he's managed to destroy a huge chunk of America's wealth. Pissing off our best allies and empowering the worst jackass terrorists in the world was just a secondary goal, and look how well he did there!

Like I said, better take a look at the real world. You're going to want to understand how those breadline things work, soon-to-be-unemployed/never-been-employed gurrrl.
 
2009-03-16 05:36:52 PM
DFWPhotoGuy: Also...people please stop feeding the troll. Ms sue 3 times and win has reeled you in hook, line and sinker.

10/10 perfection. Subtle but with just enough crazy that people fell for it.


Hehe, FINALLY someone gives me some credit for what was, in my opinion anyway, a pretty good performance. Thanks :)
 
2009-03-16 05:44:31 PM
BrendaK: Ooooooo, ikle-boo got her widdle fweewings hurt. Maybe Barney Frank can give you a great, big 'everything's FINE with Fanny Mae' hug and it'll all be better. Oh, and President Obamessiah can send you a nice unicorn! Unicorn magic will certainly fix the market, now that he's managed to destroy a huge chunk of America's wealth. Pissing off our best allies and empowering the worst jackass terrorists in the world was just a secondary goal, and look how well he did there!

Like I said, better take a look at the real world. You're going to want to understand how those breadline things work, soon-to-be-unemployed/never-been-employed gurrrl.


Yet again, you are replying where none was warranted. What part of YOU ARE DISMISSED do you not get? I mean all you are doing here is proving the inherent stupidity of your average neo-con. "Ooo, lets talk shiat about the new Prez and blame everything on him! Its so much easier than admitting that we FARKED UP BIG-TIME by electing that scat-throwing monkey-eared redneck to the White House twice."

Seriously, how can you live with yourself knowing what your brainless hero has done to this country and the world? And then you go and try to blame it all on Obama?!?

Let these words be my last address to you, as I no longer wish to waste my time banging your head against the wall of Truth...

The whole of human communication lacks the language to describe just how vulgarly stupid you and your neo-con pals are.
 
2009-03-16 05:46:05 PM
Phinn:

Gee, for someone who so hotly resents her neighbors telling her what to do, you really get excited when you defend the power of the government to tell everyone what to do.


When I get to elect my neighbors, then I'll defend their power to tell me what to do.
 
2009-03-16 05:56:23 PM
Inibrius: You do realize that the economy didn't go into the shiatter until AFTER Obama was elected, right?

I know you're a troll, but just to further shut you down:
Dow Jones on Google Finance

The Dow dropped from a high in Oct. 2007 of around 14,000 to just below 8,000 on inauguration day. 6,000 points, before Obama was even sworn in.
 
2009-03-16 06:01:18 PM
lisarenee3505: Phinn:

Gee, for someone who so hotly resents her neighbors telling her what to do, you really get excited when you defend the power of the government to tell everyone what to do.

When I get to elect my neighbors, then I'll defend their power to tell me what to do.


Good to see that you feel it is governments' appropriate business to tell you what to do. I'm sure life is much easier for you, what with never having to think or act for yourself. How's that government cheese working out for you? I've heard it causes constipation in some people.

BTW, you can always elect to ignore me. You do know that, right? Oh, wait, the government didn't tell you what to do in this situation. Poor thing.

In any case, I'm off for my weekly NRJFoA meeting (Neo-con Rethuglican Jackboot Wearing Fascists of America).

Toodles, loon!
 
2009-03-16 06:05:28 PM
BrendaK: lisarenee3505: Phinn:

Gee, for someone who so hotly resents her neighbors telling her what to do, you really get excited when you defend the power of the government to tell everyone what to do.

When I get to elect my neighbors, then I'll defend their power to tell me what to do.

Good to see that you feel it is governments' appropriate business to tell you what to do. I'm sure life is much easier for you, what with never having to think or act for yourself. How's that government cheese working out for you? I've heard it causes constipation in some people.

BTW, you can always elect to ignore me. You do know that, right? Oh, wait, the government didn't tell you what to do in this situation. Poor thing.

In any case, I'm off for my weekly NRJFoA meeting (Neo-con Rethuglican Jackboot Wearing Fascists of America).

Toodles, loon!


I had to give up my NRJFoA card. Couldn't find any decent looking Jackboots in my size.
semiskimmed.net
 
2009-03-16 06:11:04 PM
lisarenee3505: DFWPhotoGuy: Also...people please stop feeding the troll. Ms sue 3 times and win has reeled you in hook, line and sinker.

10/10 perfection. Subtle but with just enough crazy that people fell for it.

Hehe, FINALLY someone gives me some credit for what was, in my opinion anyway, a pretty good performance. Thanks :)


BTW...you didn't answer me earlier question - did you go to FSU? If so my fiance and I would love to chat....you are cute.
 
2009-03-16 06:57:49 PM
Some HOAs are genuinely voluntary, rather than implemented through restrictive covenants.

So, for those, going "No, I'm not joining - screw you" works fine. They will whine and complain, but that's about it.

For most HOAs, it's a restrictive covenant - it's applied to the deed. You buy the house, generally speaking, you get the HOA. There are some things that can be done, which vary from state to state and can be as extreme as dissolving and/or neutering the HOA.
 
2009-03-16 07:33:18 PM
Retards.... Read before you sign. Well, HOA's are for retards.
 
2009-03-16 09:56:02 PM
lisarenee3505: Phinn:

Gee, for someone who so hotly resents her neighbors telling her what to do, you really get excited when you defend the power of the government to tell everyone what to do.

When I get to elect my neighbors, then I'll defend their power to tell me what to do.


You have far more influence over the actions of an HOA than you do over the government. You'd have anywhere from a couple dozen to a couple hundred HOA households, with one vote each. There's a couple hundred million voters in the US. So, you'd have around 1-10 million times more influence in how an HOA is run.

Then, there's the part where mega-corporations basically control everything the US government does, which reduces any particular voter's influence from from almost zero (one-200-millionth of a choice from a slate of pre-selected candidates every four years) to truly zero.

Plus, you can move away from an HOA more easily than you can move way from the US government. It claims to control a lot more territory than your average HOA does, and asserts a broader scope of powers over everyone in that territory compared to an HOA.
 
2009-03-16 10:01:02 PM
I am so farking glad my first home purchase was nowhere near a subdivision or other HOA-infested area. My lone residential neighbor has a privacy fence between our properties and after living here two months I have yet to even see or hear of them. My only other neighbors are a church and its cemetery. Unless there is a zombie uprising, I doubt I'll have any neighbor issues.
 
2009-03-16 11:56:27 PM
I still don't understand what the problem is? If you don't like HOAs then go move somewhere without an HOA. There are plenty of places you can move that don't have HOAs.

If you are too stupid to read the home owner's association contract that you sign, then you deserve to get your home sold. You have no business signing a real estate contract to begin with.

This is a huge freedom issue. I have a right to freely enter into contracts with my neighbors and then use the courts and foreclosure on them when they don't live up to their end of the bargain. That's why we have a nice pretty neighborhood with high property values instead of a collection of purple and yellow and black checkerboard painted homes with upside down cars in the front yard and a salvage yard in the side yard and a 50 foot tall flashing billboard of the American flag on it.

There are people that prefer the freedom of owning property where they don't have to enter into such contracts. Luckily there are plenty of places for them to live. Why do they always seem to insist on being able to sign a contract and then ignore it?
 
2009-03-17 01:33:38 AM
40below: Good. People need to learn to live by the rules. Rules are what separate us from animals. And the Irish.

I thought weaseling out of things was what separated us from the animals. Except the weasel.
 
2009-03-17 01:41:02 AM
mod3072: I have no experience with HOAs (thankfully), so this may be a stupid question, but why wouldn't the banks get involved? If I were the bank and I had loaned Citizen X $500,000 to buy a house and then some local non-governmental "agency" tried to forclose on it and probably sell it for less than what is owed against it, I would be a little upset about that. Is the HOA responsible for covering the difference? My guess is "no" or they wouldn't be doing it. The whole thing seems very distasteful and, frankly, illegal to me. Yes, I understand that they signed a contract willingly and I can see the HOA suing to get their fees. At least that way the homeowners have their day in court and can explain why they did not feel the need to pay the fees. Kicking someone out of their home and selling it out from under them seems like an unlawful seizure to me, especially when it is probably a several-hundred-thousand dollar asset being sold to pay for a couple of hundred in fees. I can't believe this is legal and, if it is, it shouldn't be.

The fun thing is, if the HOA takes your house, you still owe the bank for your mortgage. Of course, it wouldn't be secured any more, and most people would probably stop paying it. Then you'd take another hit to your credit rating.

After that happens, good luck getting a credit card, renting a place to live or even getting a decent new job.
 
2009-03-17 05:20:25 PM
If thats your home kill the president of the HOA.
They get the idea very quickly.
 
2009-03-19 01:54:13 PM
lisarenee3505: DFWPhotoGuy: Also...people please stop feeding the troll. Ms sue 3 times and win has reeled you in hook, line and sinker.

10/10 perfection. Subtle but with just enough crazy that people fell for it.

Hehe, FINALLY someone gives me some credit for what was, in my opinion anyway, a pretty good performance. Thanks :)


Terrible and obvious performance to anyone with a brain. Some of us tried to help the dumber among the fark community and fialed. Ah well.
 
2009-03-19 03:40:30 PM
That's the problem with our country today...a total lack of common sense and insatiable greed!!
 
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