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(Financial Times)   Michigan ponders selling entire state to China in exchange for cash, the way it once sold Toledo to Ohio in exchange for Upper Penninsula   (ft.com) divider line 48
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2760 clicks; posted to Business » on 10 Jan 2009 at 2:34 PM (5 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
 
2009-01-10 02:48:19 PM  
Fark that; just give the state to Canada.
 
2009-01-10 02:49:26 PM  
Maybe the Chinese could turn it into a nature preserve. See the soon to be extinct 'American Worker' in its natural habitat.
 
2009-01-10 03:04:42 PM  
Michigan just needs to go green - screw manufacturing, since it's failed us so many times - let's farm. Recent article (new window) talks about the possibility of urban farming in Detroit. More generally, Michigan has lots of agricultural potential, and huge fresh water resources.

Look at the states with the lowest unemployment rates - they're all agricultural/ranching states...
 
2009-01-10 03:24:29 PM  
Zappagirl: Michigan just needs to go green - screw manufacturing, since it's failed us so many times - let's farm. Recent article (new window) talks about the possibility of urban farming in Detroit. More generally, Michigan has lots of agricultural potential, and huge fresh water resources.

Look at the states with the lowest unemployment rates - they're all agricultural/ranching states...



Most of that "fresh" water in Michigan is polluted, especially in the southern regions.
 
2009-01-10 03:29:33 PM  
Zappagirl: Look at the states with the lowest unemployment rates - they're all agricultural/ranching states...

Thats because farmworkers aren't counted in unemployment stats.
 
2009-01-10 03:33:28 PM  
nicksteel: Most of that "fresh" water in Michigan is polluted

It's polluted, sure, but so is most fresh water globally - on the whole, it's not that badly polluted and totally usable. And at least in the north, the pollution is more thanks to the Canucks than to Michigan industry.
 
2009-01-10 03:33:52 PM  
I have been suggesting the sale of Alabama or Louisiana in my fark posts for a while.
 
2009-01-10 03:34:40 PM  
Zappagirl: Michigan just needs to go green - screw manufacturing, since it's failed us so many times - let's farm. Recent article (new window) talks about the possibility of urban farming in Detroit. More generally, Michigan has lots of agricultural potential, and huge fresh water resources.

Look at the states with the lowest unemployment rates - they're all agricultural/ranching states...


Farming won't help actually making any money. Agriculutre in america is underneath all the obfucation just a net loss. Farmers are dependent on subsidies and tarifs to survive finanicially. They also dependent on infrasturcture and most impoartantly water and irigation provided by the government. Farmers are only able to make a profit in the fist world today at the expense of the environment, first world consumers and the people of the third world.

You might as well just give the detroit automakers a chunk of taxpayer money for every car they produce and tax foreign cars outrageously. It would work out about the same.
 
2009-01-10 03:39:10 PM  
Loki-L: Farming won't help actually making any money.

I wasn't suggesting farming in order to make money. I was suggesting it (semi-facetiously) as a means of surviving. If the official unemployment rate in MI is around 10%, highest in the country, then the actual unemployment rate must be somewhere closer to 20% if not higher. I honestly know almost no family in Michigan that hasn't been affected by unemployment recently, whether white collar professionals or blue collar workers.

Things are really bad. At least agriculture, even on a small, non-commercial level, would provide people with food.
 
2009-01-10 03:45:41 PM  
Zappagirl: nicksteel: Most of that "fresh" water in Michigan is polluted

It's polluted, sure, but so is most fresh water globally - on the whole, it's not that badly polluted and totally usable. And at least in the north, the pollution is more thanks to the Canucks than to Michigan industry.


Great Lakes water rights are a pretty big deal. It would be good fun to watch the slopes fark with that. Didn't the Great Lakes Water Resources Compact come about because the snow-monkeys wanted to ship water to Asia?
 
2009-01-10 03:46:22 PM  
The next person to use the phrase "go green" as a nebulous non-statement loses their reproductive rights.
 
2009-01-10 03:48:31 PM  
are the humans included in the sale?

rotsa ruck teach'n them mandarin
 
2009-01-10 04:00:49 PM  
Loki-L: You might as well just give the detroit automakers a chunk of taxpayer money for every car they produce and tax foreign cars outrageously.

Someone finally has the right idea. Michigan IS manufacturing and the easiest transition will come if they don't have to transition at all. $40 billion is a start but if we are really serious about keeping Michigan alive, Obama needs to give a good chunk of his $1 trillion stimulus to them. I think $200 billion or more to the auto industry would be a great start.
 
2009-01-10 04:24:19 PM  
Noirceuil: Maybe the Chinese could turn it into a nature preserve. See the soon to be extinct 'American Worker' UAW member in its natural habitat.


FTFY since sitting in a job bank demanding to get paid for doing nothing is hardly work and not very American.
 
2009-01-10 04:27:19 PM  
Not to be a kill joy, but it would have to be the US government selling Michigan to the Chinese, not the state selling itself in order for it to be legal. Although, selling Michigan to China would be good retaliation for all the crap they have sent to this country.
 
2009-01-10 04:29:01 PM  
Remove all Republicans: Loki-L: You might as well just give the detroit automakers a chunk of taxpayer money for every car they produce and tax foreign cars outrageously.

Someone finally has the right idea. Michigan IS manufacturing and the easiest transition will come if they don't have to transition at all. $40 billion is a start but if we are really serious about keeping Michigan alive, Obama needs to give a good chunk of his $1 trillion stimulus to them. I think $200 billion or more to the auto industry would be a great start.


Giving it to the industry would be a waste, it would just be gobbled up by greedy corporate pigs. The money should be given directly to the workers.
 
2009-01-10 04:40:04 PM  
Convict All Conservatives: Giving it to the industry would be a waste, it would just be gobbled up by greedy corporate pigs. The money should be given directly to the workers.

Well, yeah. They should have given the money directly to the union's strike fund. Give them the power to strike and get real change at the Big Three.
 
2009-01-10 04:43:57 PM  
Then once the monopoly of the Big Three is broken, the workers will finally be free.
 
2009-01-10 04:51:26 PM  
How about img1.fark.net?

Instead of selling Michigan, how about we get rid of that embarrassment called Florida? How much could we get for Florida?
 
2009-01-10 04:56:45 PM  
I hate to break it to everybody, but we do have a lot of farmland down in the Southern part of the Lower Peninsula. It tapers off a little when you move North but pretty much everything that isn't Metro Detroit or forest is being used for growing corn, soy, and various other.
 
2009-01-10 05:12:07 PM  
Loki-L: You might as well just give the detroit automakers a chunk of taxpayer money for every car they produce and tax foreign cars outrageously. It would work out about the same.

You've described something that was known as the "American School of Economics" (as opposed to Adam Smith-style free-trading, which Americans like Hamilton and Lincoln strongly rejected) from 1790 to roughly 1971. With such protectionism, we went from a muddy colonial backwater to the most broadly-prosperous nation in history, even reaching off the planet.
 
2009-01-10 05:19:49 PM  
How is farming a "green" activity anyway?

It's water intensive, petroleum intensive, and depletes the soil of nutrients.
 
2009-01-10 05:36:36 PM  
the blue bloods who own this country and its government have been selling pieces of it off for 30 years.

what's the difference?
 
2009-01-10 05:37:13 PM  
ilambiquated: I have been suggesting the sale of Alabama or Louisiana in my fark posts for a while.

Hell Yea! i second that one.
 
2009-01-10 05:40:09 PM  
Lemon-Lime Malthus: How is farming a "green" activity anyway?

It's water intensive, petroleum intensive, and depletes the soil of nutrients.


nutrients? not if u rotate
 
2009-01-10 05:41:15 PM  
Noirceuil: Maybe the Chinese could turn it into a nature preserve. See the soon to be extinct 'American Worker' in its natural habitat.

man, they should pay you for that one. good writing and hilarious.
 
2009-01-10 07:35:07 PM  
ow about we just tell them to STFU and stop whining. Detroit has been in a decline for 30 years now, and no one has even tried to do jack shiat about it except cry about foreign competition and the government to fix their problems. No one has gone out and innovated. No one has taken advantage of dirt cheap land and COL to start new businesses or recondition outdated industrial infrastructure. No one bothered to go to college because there were plenty of jobs available that paid better than most professional positions. No one bothered to think of what they might do besides building cars. No one cared what might happen down the line. The entire state decided the best way to deal with change was to stick their heads firmly up their asses and pretend the 60's and 70's would never end.

Well, they're over. Tough shiat. You farked yourselves over, you get nothing.
 
2009-01-10 08:35:25 PM  
Lusiphur: ow about we just tell them to STFU and stop whining. Detroit has been in a decline for 30 years now, and no one has even tried to do jack shiat about it except cry about foreign competition and the government to fix their problems. No one has gone out and innovated. No one has taken advantage of dirt cheap land and COL to start new businesses or recondition outdated industrial infrastructure. No one bothered to go to college because there were plenty of jobs available that paid better than most professional positions. No one bothered to think of what they might do besides building cars. No one cared what might happen down the line. The entire state decided the best way to deal with change was to stick their heads firmly up their asses and pretend the 60's and 70's would never end.

Well, they're over. Tough shiat. You farked yourselves over, you get nothing.


This.

As a resident of Michigan this post sums up a problem that I don't see anybody talking about: the fact that we are addicted to the idea of one single industry coming in and solving all of our problems. The vague hope that if we just grab at one big brass ring that we can go back to being a more expensive version of the rust belt states complete with a segregated city or two and keep driving American-made cars that break down but help us live lives of quiet desperation.

The sad truth is that right now Michigan is still trying to find that big brass ring and so far they've turned out to be crud: Ann Arbor sold out part of the University of Michigan campus to Google only to find that the jobs made are simply temp jobs that rely on the workers sucking off the unemployment tit for six months out of the year. An attempt to bring moviemakers into the state as resulted in two films that haven't employed anybody at all except a few amateur filmmakers which does not make an industry. And now the buzz is that health care is going to be the next Big Thing that'll only result in a lot of people spending a lot of time and money to get nursing degrees, only to have to face moving anyway due to an overabundance of nursing students. Essentially, they would be better off moving out of the state to begin with which is the only solution to a very misguided state which no real future left.

The solution was to viciously diversify the state's economy. But the time for that is too late and now the state, even if the auto industry is saved, still faces the same problem as before. We are a one industry state that can't break free of it. The time between dumping the auto industry and moving on is going to be one full of heartbreak and a lot of bitter changes, but it is going to happen. Passing a few 'stimulus packages' isn't going to mean much when the newcomers to the auto industry are making less than me as a college student working a part-time job. The days of fabulously paid union jobs is gone and Michigan is going to have to adjust accordingly. They might as well start now and so far they're just sticking their heads in the sand.

This is not a state that sees the future, it's a state that has its claws into a very romanticized version of the past.
 
2009-01-10 08:37:02 PM  
LeroyB: How about ?

Instead of selling Michigan, how about we get rid of that embarrassment called Florida? How much could we get for Florida?


We would have to pay China to take it for us.
 
2009-01-10 09:09:56 PM  
Convict All Conservatives: Remove all Republicans: Loki-L: You might as well just give the detroit automakers a chunk of taxpayer money for every car they produce and tax foreign cars outrageously.

Someone finally has the right idea. Michigan IS manufacturing and the easiest transition will come if they don't have to transition at all. $40 billion is a start but if we are really serious about keeping Michigan alive, Obama needs to give a good chunk of his $1 trillion stimulus to them. I think $200 billion or more to the auto industry would be a great start.Giving it to the industry would be a waste, it would just be gobbled up by greedy corporate pigs. The money should be given directly to the workers.



Giving it to the workers would accomplish exactly what? They are part of the problem, they woul probably spend it through their Union on some golf resort.

Giving it to the manufacturing industry with the expectation that it would create jobs would also be waste.

Technology and automation are the main reason for the loss of manufacturing jobs, not outsourcing. If your job skills consist of the ability to put together parts on an assembly line, such as putting hub caps on a car, you can and will be replaced by a machine/robot. Unless of course your industry is dominated by a Luddite labor union with contract demands that stifle your industries competitiveness by undermining any advantage to modernize.
 
2009-01-10 09:35:34 PM  
hasty ambush: If your job skills consist of the ability to put together parts on an assembly line, such as putting hub caps on a car, you can and will be replaced by a machine/robot.

It doesn't have to be that way. We can control and regulate things so that the transition is more orderly. We don't have to make it a one-time mess left to the "free" market.

Instead of technology working to replace jobs, why not focus our technology to figuring out ways to make more labor necessary? Why not multiple checks on machines, each so simple that a high school dropout could review it? You know, a bunch of machines with green and red lights, and when the light turns red, they push another button which signals someone and that person signals someone with a college degree to fix the problem.
 
2009-01-10 09:59:18 PM  
SpartacusHobbs
Fark that; just give the state to Canada.


No thanks. We'd gladly take one of the gulf states off your hands, but we have our own rust belt already, thanks.
 
2009-01-10 09:59:51 PM  
But, are they after the ginseng or the industrial capacity?
 
2009-01-10 10:02:34 PM  
Zappagirl
nicksteel: Most of that "fresh" water in Michigan is polluted
It's polluted, sure, but so is most fresh water globally - on the whole, it's not that badly polluted and totally usable. And at least in the north, the pollution is more thanks to the Canucks than to Michigan industry.


Bullshiat. Look at a map. The great lake to the west of Michigan is entirely inside the US and the other one barely has any Canadian towns on it. Most Canadian industry is around Lake Ontario, which Canada shares with New York State.
 
2009-01-10 10:58:20 PM  
I had no idea that Michigan traded Toledo for the UP and I lived there 20+ years. Learn something new every day, I guess.
 
2009-01-10 11:07:45 PM  
wilde_at_heart: Zappagirl
nicksteel: Most of that "fresh" water in Michigan is polluted
It's polluted, sure, but so is most fresh water globally - on the whole, it's not that badly polluted and totally usable. And at least in the north, the pollution is more thanks to the Canucks than to Michigan industry.

Bullshiat. Look at a map. The great lake to the west of Michigan is entirely inside the US and the other one barely has any Canadian towns on it. Most Canadian industry is around Lake Ontario, which Canada shares with New York State.


Lake Michigan is owned entirely by the United States, but that has Chicago and Milwaukee throwing their junk into it. Lake Huron and Superior are also shared by Canada and Huron (and Lake St. Clair) are farked by Detroit and whatever came out of Flint and Saginaw. And when you get past the thumb, you get into the climate change where winters come sooner and are colder than the southern part of the Lower Peninsula. And if you really want to farm in the UP where it's cold even in the summers, I wish you luck.

Pertifly: I had no idea that Michigan traded Toledo for the UP and I lived there 20+ years. Learn something new every day, I guess.

That's why the Lower Peninsula's border with Ohio is so weird. In hindsight, Michigan won out with that. Ohio? Just has Jamie Farr and some really miserable looking flatland.
 
2009-01-10 11:19:58 PM  
Guntram Shatterhand not sure why you had me highlighted - someone saying all the pollution around Michigan was caused by Canada. A look on any map will show that's pretty much impossible.

jonterry4
LeroyB: How about ?
Instead of selling Michigan, how about we get rid of that embarrassment called Florida? How much could we get for Florida?
We would have to pay China to take it for us.

Linux_Yes
ilambiquated: I have been suggesting the sale of Alabama or Louisiana in my fark posts for a while.
Hell Yea! i second that one.


Canada will take them. It's cold here and we need somewhere warm. That doesn't include the people though. You can keep them. We just want the land.
 
2009-01-11 12:29:19 AM  
Guntram Shatterhand: wilde_at_heart: Zappagirl
nicksteel: Most of that "fresh" water in Michigan is polluted
It's polluted, sure, but so is most fresh water globally - on the whole, it's not that badly polluted and totally usable. And at least in the north, the pollution is more thanks to the Canucks than to Michigan industry.

Bullshiat. Look at a map. The great lake to the west of Michigan is entirely inside the US and the other one barely has any Canadian towns on it. Most Canadian industry is around Lake Ontario, which Canada shares with New York State.

Lake Michigan is owned entirely by the United States, but that has Chicago and Milwaukee throwing their junk into it. Lake Huron and Superior are also shared by Canada and Huron (and Lake St. Clair) are farked by Detroit and whatever came out of Flint and Saginaw. And when you get past the thumb, you get into the climate change where winters come sooner and are colder than the southern part of the Lower Peninsula. And if you really want to farm in the UP where it's cold even in the summers, I wish you luck.

Pertifly: I had no idea that Michigan traded Toledo for the UP and I lived there 20+ years. Learn something new every day, I guess.

That's why the Lower Peninsula's border with Ohio is so weird. In hindsight, Michigan won out with that. Ohio? Just has Jamie Farr and some really miserable looking flatland.


Toledo has always been something of a "Baja Detroit" anyways.
 
2009-01-11 12:44:52 AM  
wilde_at_heart: Guntram Shatterhand not sure why you had me highlighted - someone saying all the pollution around Michigan was caused by Canada. A look on any map will show that's pretty much impossible.

jonterry4
LeroyB: How about ?
Instead of selling Michigan, how about we get rid of that embarrassment called Florida? How much could we get for Florida?
We would have to pay China to take it for us.

Linux_Yes
ilambiquated: I have been suggesting the sale of Alabama or Louisiana in my fark posts for a while.
Hell Yea! i second that one.

Canada will take them. It's cold here and we need somewhere warm. That doesn't include the people though. You can keep them. We just want the land.


The people sure don't keep you guys out of Arizona during the winter.
 
2009-01-11 01:41:20 AM  
I thought Ohio stole Toledo from Michigan because it was a good piece or real estate in michigan which at the time was only a territory?
 
2009-01-11 01:41:20 AM  
Remove all Republicans: hasty ambush: If your job skills consist of the ability to put together parts on an assembly line, such as putting hub caps on a car, you can and will be replaced by a machine/robot.

It doesn't have to be that way. We can control and regulate things so that the transition is more orderly. We don't have to make it a one-time mess left to the "free" market.

Instead of technology working to replace jobs, why not focus our technology to figuring out ways to make more labor necessary? Why not multiple checks on machines, each so simple that a high school dropout could review it? You know, a bunch of machines with green and red lights, and when the light turns red, they push another button which signals someone and that person signals someone with a college degree to fix the problem.


Because that's inefficient and stupid. An employee is supposed to create or add value to a company in some way. Some retard checking and rechecking a light doesn't add shiat to anything when it can be fully automated.

Technology doesn't destroy jobs. It actually creates them. I'd explain this to you, but you won't pay any attention to it anyway and call me a free-market neo-con or whatever new buzzword you're using.

Why doesn't that high school dropout get a GED and go to night school and try to get into a college to better himself, anyway?
 
2009-01-11 02:03:03 AM  
Ohio wanted the disputed 'Toledo strip' due to the possibility of a canal being built on the Maumee river. Michigan was just a territory at the time. Michigan and Ohio fought a 'war' both sent troops to the border who couldn't find each other. Not much fighting happened. The compromise for the loss of Toledo to Michigan was the WESTERN portion of the upper peninsula, as a small portion of the eastern part of the upper peninsula was always Michigan territory.

The Great Lakes are cleaner than they've been in years due to efforts to minimize pollution, and ironically due to invasive species such as zebra and quagga mussels reproducing massively in both the great and inland lakes. Billions of these things filter up to a liter of water a day through their bodies removing just about everything in it concentrating pollutants like PCBs and dioxins in their shells that now cover the bottom in many places. The intake for the Detroit water system in Lake Huron draws in water that is pure and fresh enough to pipe directly into the system without any treatment, but it is chlorinated to meet federal drinking water standards.

The lakes are clean enough now that massive numbers of fish flies invade costal areas annually, the cleaner the water the easier it is for the flies to reproduce.

Come visit, and drink the water. Though you might consider running it through a PUR filter to remove the chlorine taste first.
 
2009-01-11 03:53:29 AM  
Remove all Republicans: hasty ambush: If your job skills consist of the ability to put together parts on an assembly line, such as putting hub caps on a car, you can and will be replaced by a machine/robot.

It doesn't have to be that way. We can control and regulate things so that the transition is more orderly. We don't have to make it a one-time mess left to the "free" market.

Instead of technology working to replace jobs, why not focus our technology to figuring out ways to make more labor necessary? Why not multiple checks on machines, each so simple that a high school dropout could review it? You know, a bunch of machines with green and red lights, and when the light turns red, they push another button which signals someone and that person signals someone with a college degree to fix the problem.


Hydra: Remove all Republicans: hasty ambush: If your job skills consist of the ability to put together parts on an assembly line, such as putting hub caps on a car, you can and will be replaced by a machine/robot.

It doesn't have to be that way. We can control and regulate things so that the transition is more orderly. We don't have to make it a one-time mess left to the "free" market.

Instead of technology working to replace jobs, why not focus our technology to figuring out ways to make more labor necessary? Why not multiple checks on machines, each so simple that a high school dropout could review it? You know, a bunch of machines with green and red lights, and when the light turns red, they push another button which signals someone and that person signals someone with a college degree to fix the problem.

Because that's inefficient and stupid. An employee is supposed to create or add value to a company in some way. Some retard checking and rechecking a light doesn't add shiat to anything when it can be fully automated.

Technology doesn't destroy jobs. It actually creates them. I'd explain this to you, but you won't pay any attention to it anyway and call me a free-market neo-con or whatever new buzzword you're using.

Why doesn't that high school dropout get a GED and go to night school and try to get into a college to better himself, anyway?


I think he was being sarcastic.
 
2009-01-11 04:32:20 AM  
VlagimarPutin: I think he was being sarcastic.

No, I was not. We need to think about our fellow humans, not just machines. That's the reason why there is no manufacturing in this country, and the only one that exists needs massive bailouts to survive. We need to find new ways to make people useful once again.

Hydra: Because that's inefficient and stupid. An employee is supposed to create or add value to a company in some way. Some retard checking and rechecking a light doesn't add shiat to anything when it can be fully automated.

It adds a job. And the dollars paid to that person is used by then at the train station to get home. And the income from the train conductor is used to pay for his registration at the DMV when he needs his license renewed. And the income for the DMV worker is used ....

And my good sir that is the circle of life. It is how money flows in the system. That is the theory that has sustained this country since FDR proposed it in 1933. It is what got us out of (and kept us away from) the Great Depression.
 
2009-01-11 09:14:11 AM  
Remove all Republicans: VlagimarPutin: I think he was being sarcastic.

No, I was not. We need to think about our fellow humans, not just machines. That's the reason why there is no manufacturing in this country, and the only one that exists needs massive bailouts to survive. We need to find new ways to make people useful once again.

Hydra: Because that's inefficient and stupid. An employee is supposed to create or add value to a company in some way. Some retard checking and rechecking a light doesn't add shiat to anything when it can be fully automated.

It adds a job. And the dollars paid to that person is used by then at the train station to get home. And the income from the train conductor is used to pay for his registration at the DMV when he needs his license renewed. And the income for the DMV worker is used ....

And my good sir that is the circle of life. It is how money flows in the system. That is the theory that has sustained this country since FDR proposed it in 1933. It is what got us out of (and kept us away from) the Great Depression.


It is a big shame you are not more familiar with your history. The unemployment rate at the start of WWII was still at 17% to 18% despite FDRS New Deal and it did nothing to prevent a 1937 recession.
It is not how successful economic systems work. The work preformed has to meet a specific demand fill a need not just supply work.
Under your concept farmers would never have been able to reduce their payrolls because despite having harvesters and combines they would still be required to employ farmhands who had no real job to do-just like the UAW job banks now.
The UK tried this make work approach and ended up needing a bailout from the IMF a few decades back. It is part of what is killing the US auto industry now. The automakers could make a modern auto assembly plant that would enable them to build a higher quality product at a competitive price but their UAW contracts fix is so they end up with the same labor costs because they cannot reduce payroll-job banks if you will. It no longer takes 4 guys on an assembly line put on hub caps but one to push a button for a machine to do it.

It is also what is killing the US steel industry. Modern "mini' steels mills can make more steel at least cost with fewer people than the older, bigger more labor intensive ones but try getting that past the Luddite Unions.
Your Luddite approach is what killed India's textile industry and it is just now really starting to modernize.
The most modern auto assembly plants in the US are not run by the big three but by Honda and Toyota. Look at video footage of their assembly lines. You hardly see any people. They can make more cars with fewer people. What people they do employ have greater job security. Look at e lay off history of Toyota vs. the big three.

Union member s would be better served if the UAW would stop using their money (that they do not spend on golf resorts) for campaign contributions in attempts to preserve 19th Century and early 20th century jobs and provided training for their members in more modern and marketable skills to meet the demands of the 21st century. That is correct, I said they should use their Union money not tax payer money.
 
2009-01-11 11:29:01 AM  
hasty ambush,

What you are describing is the reason why the world itself will come apart very soon. As the technology gets better, automated factories will make things so cheaply, it wouldn't even be worth it to throw "slave labor" at it.

The fact is what do we do when 1/5th then 1/10th of the population is actually needed to produce for the rest of the people? Where do they get the money to buy products and goods? Government?
 
2009-01-11 12:40:37 PM  
That's right! It's a multi family residence to settle down in with wonderfully crisp winters and pleasant summers. Conveniently located on lake front, this property contains many amazing features you need to see to believe. It does however contain slight fire damage in the lower unit, but buyer gets a spacious 62 million acre property. Property is being sold as is including appliances (if any). Attn agents: Please be careful during showings.


(Buyer must sign Affidavit of Compliance Responsibility. Purchaser is responsible for any tax leins. Location close to a school does not guarantee attendance)

/Yes I know Detroit is not Michigan.
 
2009-01-11 06:46:21 PM  
Noirceuil: hasty ambush,

What you are describing is the reason why the world itself will come apart very soon. As the technology gets better, automated factories will make things so cheaply, it wouldn't even be worth it to throw "slave labor" at it.

The fact is what do we do when 1/5th then 1/10th of the population is actually needed to produce for the rest of the people? Where do they get the money to buy products and goods? Government?




Actually manufacturing has not been that big a part of the US economy to begin with. Manufacturing's share of the US economy, as measured by real GDP, has been stable since the 1940s. During this entire time, the ratio of manufacturing output to GDP has ranged from 16 to 19%. As of 2002, it was 16%.


As manyufacturing becomes more automated the population will transitioned into different jobs demanding different skill sets. The same thing happened when we transitioned from a largely agrarian economy to an industrial one. People moved from jobs picking corn to assembly line work. Now we are transitioning to a technology based economy that requires different job skills.

The difference being technology based job skills are more difficult to acquire compared to moving from a job picking corn to one putting on hub caps.

Contrary to what Unions and others may tell ( I work in the Biz) we do have a shortage of high tech labor in this country. All you have to do is look at the colleges and see how many American kids are enrolled in engineering and hard science courses compared to foreign kids (the Asian kids really wreck the grade curve). You do not see many foreign kids majoring in Music, German literature or Poly sci.

This would be an opportunity for Unions to make some gains in the high tech industry by training an supplying the employees. They can go to industry and Congress and say you do not need more high tech visas because we will pay for the training a fill the demand with American labor.
 
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