Umm, sex0r..tight ends and running backs are just a little different. Very few teams use their tight ends as much as the Giants use Shockey, that's why his numbers are high. Because he's used more. That's all I'm saying, so chill out man.

Bleek -

he's used more because he can put up the numbers.

a team doesn't go 9-7 by throwing 400 passes to its TE hoping he catches 70 of them.

Consider than his average per catch is over 10 yards, and he had catches over 20 yards in 11 games this year.

He's a good TE. He's one of the top 5 in the league right now. and he had the best season for a TE in 2002.

that's why he's playing in the Pro Bowl.

So chill out.

I root for the Pat's first, Colt's second. Now that's all farked to hell, and I absolutely loathe the Giants and the Jets. I can't stand the Steelers because Bill Cowher gives me the creeps. Fark the Raiders, too.

Go 49's.

I'm not doubting his talent. I'm just saying that because his numbers are high doesn't mean he's as good as local commentators and fans make him out to be. For whatever the reason he's used, he's used more than other TE's. Don't automatically attribute that to superior talent. As someone already mentioned, Shockey got more passes because the other Giants WRs were injured. We can't assume that if other TEs were asked to step up to fill the place of a receiver, they wouldn't have similar numbers.

MORAL: Higher numbers do not mean better players.

Jeff Garcia's gay right? Anyone?

I went to see the Cowboys play the 49ers in Texas Stadium last season, whenever Jeff Garcia would get sacked some guy near us would yell "get up faggot!"

I love Texas

Bleek: At least statistically, I assume you understand Shockey is one of the better if not the best TE in the league. It's really difficult debating how good a player is otherwise.

74 catches for a TE DOES mean he's a good player.

it's pretty simple.

And since you admitted you have no clue how he was used, pipe down. His stats before Hilliard was hurt are remarkably similar to those after the injury.

and actually, you are doubting his talent: other tight end would post those numbers if they got the same opportunities as this asshat does.

what a great game, couldn't have asked for a better ending. doesn't really matter, because neither giants nor niners would beat the bucs next weekend. still even that doesn't matter. it's not even summer, and already FOX is scheduling re-runs. playoff game in january. bucs v. eagles, at the vet. everyone knows how that turns out.

Bleek...I am an Eagles fan and hate Shockey--but do you actually watch the games or what? The dude is a cack but he is an awesome talent and was still in his rookie season. Did you see some of the hits he takes and doesn't drop the ball? Yes, he dropped the easy one in the end zone but I watch alot of football and all the best (TO, harrison, etc.) do it once in a while.

incomplete82--nice comeback for the Steelers but don't lose sight of the fact they were at home against the mediocre Browns...and had the game handed to them at the end (Northcut let the ball go right through his hands for a 1st down, the missed INT by Clev. DB before that...you know what I mean?)

Also, when Shockey supposedly "sought out" Peterson (heading into endzone)...the person that pointed out that it was a stupid comment was right. What is he supposed to do, a quarterback slide in between the defenders?

That being said, nice choke job by the Giants...

TLBreer : What's your favorite band? just wondering..

/We Want A Rock plays in the bg

Yay They Might Be Giants!! My favorite band!! w00t!

If anyone got the magic passed on from the Pats, I think it's the Jets. That said, I hate the Jets. Not as much as I hate the Steelers, though. Bill Cowher looks like Boromir from FotR, with his goatee.

missed the game. i was watching slamball on the new tnn.

I caught a bit of the game on my break: Giants, like a man with erectile dysfunction, couldn't keep it up when it counted most. Their defensive line was WORN OUT in the last quarter. Every time they'd zoom in on a guy he was gasping for air like a fish out of water and hunched over.

I don't particularly care for foolsballs and only checked the headline to see the final score. It was a good game.

And I want a rock to wind a string around.

To all who are still doubting the steelers: You needed to have watched the game. The officiating in this game was horrible, for the Steelers only and they still pulled it off. I counted at least 4 times when the Browns should've been flagged on a delay of game but weren't. On a punt, the browns hit the return man randell el before he could grab the ball and nothing was done. They called a roughing the passer penalty on what was a textbook tackle. Hit him in the chest, wrapped him up, and drove him into the ground. It was just stupid. Yes anything can happen in any game, but anything did happen and the steelers have the talent to overcome anything. Yes their pass coverage has suffered, but our best is out hurt, and they went down to the fourth man for the cornerback position, and they still couldn't win

EVILMONKEY BOY: The reason the packers lost is because they thought they couldn't lose. Look at the odds, they took that game for granted and now they are paying for it. Steelers came in ready, but the Browns had nothing to lose and knew where our weak spots were. Also, the odds were against the steelers because this is the third meeting between these division rivals and the numbers say that it's not likely that they beat one team three times in one season. The Browns tried their best but still failed to win.

DENTON428: Nobody catches every pass, and the steelers too had several missed int's that would've changed the game.

I should have captioned my Jeff Garcia picture with a big fat: "NOT THAT THERE'S ANYTHING WRONG WITH THAT!!"

On a punt, the browns hit the return man randell el before he could grab the ball and nothing was done.

wrong. He touched the ball and was drilled. He shoulda called a fair catch. His screwup, not the official's.

They called a roughing the passer penalty on what was a textbook tackle. Hit him in the chest, wrapped him up, and drove him into the ground. It was just stupid.

No, the textbook clearly says you are not allowed to hit a guy first with your helmet - which they did.


I've actually been following the Steelers a while now - I had Maddox and Burress on my fantasy team, so I had to pay closer attention. They were a lot worse today than they have been lately, and will have to put in a much better effort or their season's gonna be over next week. 30 minutes of football won't be enough.

Guess 24 point leads aren't as safe as they used to be.

At least Shockey won't be around anymore. Great talent, unpleasant person.

Also, I'm convinced Fox had a Shockey-cam going throughout the game. They zoomed in on him roughly about 468 times during the broadcast. If you hate Shockey now, wait until next year-he'll get more exposure than he did this year, and your hatred will grow by leaps and/or bounds.

01-05-03 08:56:40 PM TLBreer
TMBG = worst band ever (and yes they ARE worse than Winger).

Well gee TL, that's a highly valid and important point you make, and I'll certainly take your input into considera...DELETED!

Kerouac: No, the textbook clearly says you are not allowed to hit a guy first with your helmet - which they did.

Well that wasn't the call, it was a helmet to helmet call which again was ify. How can you not lead with your helmet. I played football for years and it's helmet to chest, then wrap and drive.

The situation with Burress is not his ability, well it is, he has been double and tripled teamed tremendously. I attended the Steeler vs. Raven game on Dec. 29, and they had three men on him. As soon as they changed their defense, he made a play. That's why Ward has more catches, everyone is concentrating on Burress.

incomplete82, yes I also noticed the no-calls on delay of game. Those situations can be attributed to the game being in Pittsburgh. Now the Steelers go on the road for the rest of the way. (unless Jets and Pit win next week)

That was Kelly Holcombe out there shredding the D today...
Steelers better figure out secondary problems or they won't be so fortunate against Gannon/Pennington (if they get past Tenn.)

Conveniently, Incomplete82 fails to mention the B.S. calls shiattsburgh got on their second to last call...phantom holding and illegal contact penalties. Types of penalties that werent called all day, but just like in the previous two games, the refs give the calls to shiattsburgh near the end of the game.

No matter. The Squeelers will get smacked around by the Titans, and Kendred Bell, or however he spells his name, will still be looking for the rest of his knee.

The player was hit before catching the punt? What do you think this is, the CFL? If he doesn't call for the fair catch, he's fair game to anyone who wants to tackle him, and if the ball is anywhere near the collision, it's perfectly legal to hit him.

Just to clarify, in the CFL, there are no fair catches, but you have to give the catcher about 5 yards to make the catch, especially when you consider that he HAS to make the catch because unlike the NFL where the punting team downs it by touching it first, a punt is totally up for grabs by either team.

That said, Als in 2003.

Sorry, but it's a pirate party this year and birdies aren't invited. This years Chucky's team beats last years Chucky's team.

Uh, perhaps this year's Bucs are better than last years Bucs, but neither team comes even close to the Eagles, who have beaten the Bucs four (or is it five?) consecutive times.

American football is stupid. I feel I must point this out in every thread related to the subject.

Judasdiomedes...

You're a true Eagles homer if ever there was one. Hopefully you little birds will actually make it to the Super Bowl where we'll all get to see a replay of Super Bowl XV. The Eagles still have yet to prove they can win the big one, so until then, I'd be a little more humble if I were you. Remember they still have to get past Atlanta (who is playing extremely well right now).

GO RAIDERS!!!

Being a diehard Steelers fan, though I hated the Raiders, I had a general respect for their fans, that is until I found out that they don't even sell out their games. If Raiders fans were so diehard, maybe they should actually go to the game....
I second a Steagle Bowl in 2003! Because PA is more old skool than you

all y'all talking smack about TO are just playa hatas. the Sharpie incident? that was FUNNY.

when he grabbed the pompoms and started dancing? FUNNY.

that juggling catch at the back of the end zone in the Dallas game? BRILLIANT.

oh, and you guys think the Bucs are all that, with bad-back-Brad Johnson at QB? okay.

Old thread, but Brad Johnson is having a career year and deserved to make the pro bowl, especially on an offense like the Bucs.