My Christmas shopping for Grandma is going to be real easy this year. I'm buying her a tank of heating oil.

50mm: He claims he'll need it to protect himself when the republicans burn up another four years and plunge us further into recession.

That democratic congressional majority we got last year sure did change the world, eh? The budget is nice and lean, no new taxes have been proposed, spending is down, and we're practically out of Iraq!

I'm not a republican by any stretch, but you have to put the blame on both camps.

Choclate rations are at an all time high.

If it makes you feel any better, gas prices will soon fall

I watched this press conference today....Paulson seems like a nice guy who is completely, totally out of his depth. As he was speaking, I had my computer up and was watching market prices go down the drain. Almost nothing he said seemed to make sense to me. And judging from the lack of response from the market, nobody ELSE was believing him either.

Occam's Chainsaw: GaryPDX: Who wanted poor people in their own homes and who got the most $$ contributions from Fannie/Freddie? Take a wild guess.

Aww, that's so cute. You think that the letter after your name matters if you're corrupt.

while you two are trading insults, the market is busy collapsing. that's like....a microcosm of what's going on out there right now.

50mm: Hank Rearden:
It doesn't matter if its Democrats or Republicans in power, I still can't believe people think there is a difference...

Supreme Court justices. Roe Vs. Wade. Difference.

while you (well not you specifically) were voting for pro-life/pro-choice assholes, the market imploded.

morons.

Weaver95: while you two are trading insults, the market is busy collapsing. that's like....a microcosm of what's going on out there right now.


This comment right here is why Weaver95 is on my favorites list and was one of first people to be on my Farky list too :)

GaryPDX: 50mm: No, I do not. I blame the Bush Doctrine and all his corrupt, warmongering automatons. The democrats are just too spineless to stand up to them. Yay for crooked liars, and invertebrate pussies.

You're in for a very rude awakening if the Dems get into power.

Yet who turned America into the Land of Huge-scale Socialism last week?

GaryPDX: There really isn't much difference. I hate "factions" (Parties) and so did George Washington.

For someone that continually talks about how bad parties are for the country, you sure do sound like a partisan hack much of the time.

The only sign we're missing is GDP contraction.

50mm: Weaver95:
while you (well not you specifically) were voting for pro-life/pro-choice assholes, the market imploded.

morons.

That was one example of a concrete difference, as it is so fashionable to be cynical and say "they're all the same." Economic policy is an entire other subject.

um, they ARE all the same. While everyone was out there judging candidates on their pro-life/pro-choice stance, nobody was asking if they were good at their jobs. Were they going to provide solid leadership? what was their stance on the economy? could they be trusted to do their jobs in a timely and professional manner?

instead it was 'are they for or against abortion? ok, then imma vote for 'em!'

Morons.

filth: The only sign we're missing is GDP contraction.

we're not done collapsing yet.

GaryPDX: One party can be worse than the other..:) They're still "factions" and generally a bad idea.

So, with Phil Gramm pushing for the deregulation of two pretty important sectors of the American economy, and with him being an economic advisor to McCain...you think people are in for a rude awakening of the dems take the white house?

On what planet does that logic make sense?

The only way to get back in line is to shrink the Federal behemoth and free up capital for the public to make a recovery.

You know what would be a good way to do that - invade a foreign country at enormous expense.

GaryPDX: Okay..why didn't Nancy Pelosi see this coming and do something a year ago?

If you notice which players were the solution, you would answer your own question. Stop giving powers to Congress they don't have.

GaryPDX: Okay..why didn't Nancy Pelosi see this coming and do something a year ago?

You honestly think Pelosi has some sort of magic powers? That's the silliest thing I've ever seen you type.

It was much much too late a year ago or even two years ago to fix this farking mess and you know it. I saw this coming in farking 2005 and I'm just design houses for a living.

Quit saying this stupid shiat and show some compassion for a change. People (including me) are suffering badly because of this corruption clusterfark and its going to get worse. Man up and stop playing the idiot troll.

madmann: Repeat this stupid Fark Independent™ talking point again when you can figure out how many votes it takes to get something past an antagonistic president.

We did pretty well during the Clinton years. In general, I think we do better if the legislative and executive branches are held by a majority from differing parties (regardless of what they are). It seems to me in those cases things trend toward the middle, which is where they ought to be anyway.

But so far this new congress has done exactly nothing they said they were going to do, and it's pissing me off. Pelosi, in particular, is a joke. I never had much faith in democrats, and never had any in republicans. Both are too entrenched to do any good and too much harm. But watching this last congress is just sad.

And my thoughts on these matters predate fark by, oh, 20 years or so. My voting history bears that out. I'd say it's more than a talking point on a web site, but you go ahead and keep on thinking what you like about people you don't even know.

Hank Rearden: It doesn't matter if its Democrats or Republicans in power...

This is where I'm at. They're two sides of the same coin. Sometimes one has better rhetoric than the other, but generally both are self-serving, and, at best, inept. This latest batch has actually been doing a pretty good job at killing people and generally making the rest of the world hate us. Both parties are responsible.

Everyone thinks their "side" will save them from the evils perpetrated by the other side. Instead you just get a new brand of largess and pandering.

PC LOAD LETTER: GaryPDX: Okay..why didn't Nancy Pelosi see this coming and do something a year ago?

If you notice which players were the solution, you would answer your own question. Stop giving powers to Congress they don't have.

this entire situation also represents a huge failure of our regulatory agencies. Why didn't they see this coming? Or did they see it, and not act? or worse - were they not permitted to act? Add to that inquiry the usual insanity and finger pointing of a hotly contested presidential election race (and one VERY desperate Republican party) and I don't think we'll ever get an answer on those questions.

And the democrat solution will be even worse. 'oh, regulation failed? how about we make MORE regulation then! muahahaha!' never mind the fact that they won't bother to figure out what caused the issue in the first place. In fact, politically speaking it's better to just suggest that it's all Bush's fault and ride the backlash into power. In depth analysis takes time, and it might not point fingers at a politically useful target.

Meanwhile, our financial system continues to blow large holes in itself, the credit crunch deepens and unemployment rises. All while major fortune 500 companies bleed jobs out of the US and local governments have to maintain infrastructure pretty much on their own.

EZ1923: GaryPDX: The part I don't like is the Dems think they can tax our way out of this.

It's going to have to happen eventually. There will be no way to scale back government enough to pay for the ever-increasing debt, assuming that it's politically feasible to scale back much at all. The question is, do you want us to pay for it, or our children? Seeing as how money is worth more today than tomorrow, I'd say we should get on it ASAP.

we won't have a choice - we will be FORCED to cut spending AND cut taxes. we might even have to cut spending and keep taxes high.

our credit is pretty much GONE.

Weaver95: And the democrat solution will be even worse. 'oh, regulation failed? how about we make MORE regulation then! muahahaha!'

You are making a whole bunch of assumptions here. They (the powers that be) are already working on reregulating the lending industry only they are doing it specifically to benefit the big guys. They are not interested in protecting you and me. It has nothing to do with party alliances. Get past the binary thinking. It limits you're vision.

Weaver95: And the democrat solution will be even worse. 'oh, regulation failed? how about we make MORE regulation then! muahahaha!' never mind the fact that they won't bother to figure out what caused the issue in the first place.

You don't think the deregulation of the energy market and the deregulation of the subprime mortgage market played any part in this?

Phil Gramm pushed hard for deregulation while everybody was busy figuring out how to fix the 1930s regulatory structure.

He was more concerned with deregulation than he was with building a better structure for our future.

If anything, this has shown that the deregulation of those two markets was incredibly stupid.

I wonder how Señor Cardgage Mortgage is doing these days?

quickdraw: Weaver95: And the democrat solution will be even worse. 'oh, regulation failed? how about we make MORE regulation then! muahahaha!'

You are making a whole bunch of assumptions here. They (the powers that be) are already working on reregulating the lending industry only they are doing it specifically to benefit the big guys. They are not interested in protecting you and me. It has nothing to do with party alliances. Get past the binary thinking. It limits you're vision.

No, i'm telling you what's going to happen. eventually, once all the petty political bullshiat gets sorted out, our 'leaders' will blame someone for causing the mess (it won't be themselves of course) and then they'll say that more and more regulation is the answer. They won't bother trying to find out what the real problem was or how to prevent it in the future, because this is an election year. facts are irrelevant. actually, facts are an anathema. this is important only insofar as it can be used to gain political favor(s) with the electorate or big name donors.

The rest of us basically get screwed and life goes on inside the beltway. Not that anyone down at our level will care....they're still voting for people based on 'pro-life/pro-choice' qualifications.