Little.Alex: I am just old enough to remember the previous 2 Global Weather Hoaxes, and the beginning of the AIDS hoax. Falling for stupid lies is a young man's game.

...

about 1978 to 1984: Acid Rain Panic!!! Only higher taxes and a massive expansion of Government can save us!!!


Acid rain was a hoax? All the efforts we spent to fix it were also a hoax? Huh - go figure. I guess sulphur levels just levelized/dropped off on their own, just conveniently in line with predictions after preventative action.

I love how folks bring up acid rain as "yet another environmentalist hoax" or "why don't we hear about acid rain anymore, huh?" As it turns out, acid rain may be one of the greatest environmental triumphs of mankind. The industrialized nations acted more or less together, and the very measurable results saved countless eco-systems. And then everybody hugged.

But this is somehow proof that climate change folks are hoaxers? I don't get it.

A Tout Le Monde: Are there any politically liberal people who think that global warming is a farce? It seems like the vast majority of scientists believe it is real. And the the people who say it isn't are related to the Republican party and/or involved corporations, yet they hold the minority of scientist views.

Just like in "Supersize Me", there were a small percentage of dieticians that said McDonalds was good for you. I don't think we can rely on the minority perspective.

I'm a liberal and I can honestly say that yes, we might be causing an impact but not as great of an impact as the media portrays. We simply don't have enough data to categorize global climate change in relation to how old the earth is. It is naive to think that a few hundred years of records, of which probably only 50 years are accurate, in relation to a few million years can create a pattern.

There are many reasons to be enviro conscious but it shouldn't all be for global warminng...errr i mean climate change.

Thats Not Right: LouDobbsAwaaaay

dhudd: Warm air holds more moister...

Please stop right there. Both sides of this issue are missing the main point:

A single weather event does not a climate trend make.

ACC Deniers: Please stop telling me that every blip in the data is proof that ACC isn't real. You're making an idiot out of yourself.

ACC Advocates: Please stop telling me that every blip in the data is proof hat ACC is real. You're making an idiot out of yourself.

Facepalms all around.

This. A thousand times this.

/can I get a subscription to your newsletter?

I'll give you a free pass to the Morans Club - you earned it.

soy_bomb: Yea the polar bear thing is a hoax (new window). Nice job being suckered.


That article proves the picture was bullshiat. Polar bears are on their way out however (^). Why bother debating a factual point you can be proved wrong on? Why not just say "who farking cares" and argue that point? Do just not understand how to think for yourself and are just terrified to engage in a real, honest debate?

I guess it would be foolish of me to note that odd weather patterns are one expected effect of global warming, and that it strikes not as a lot of unusually hot days, but as an overall higher average.

Yeah, I thought so.

Spanky_McFarksalot: Changing it from global warming to global climate change is the ultimate in global CYA.

It's perfect and covers anything that happens anywhere.

Yes. And since the climate has been changing long before man walked the face of the earth we cannot be blamed for it. This is a win win situation here. Global Warming people can save face and get to continue in their theories & we don't have to hear them biatch about how it is "up to us" to change it.

It's AVERAGE temperature people. Screwed up local weather neither confirms nor denies global warming.

No legitimate climatologist doubts global warming anymore. Why do laymen who refuse to believe in global warming keep bringing it up? Do they like it up the butt or are they just trolling?

Little.Alex: LukeCage: ummmmmm....global warming does NOT exist?

Very slight and inconsistent GW does exist. The question is wether man caused it. Socialists want to pretend it's man-made, as a pretext for destroying property rights and extending Government.

Good job, my friend. You did an outstanding job of hitting several important conservative talking points in a very succinct post. Pat yourself on the back and congratulate yourself for being so insightful and for demonstrating such a high degree of independent thinking.

Little.Alex: (1) why did it start in 1820?
(2) why does the warming follow CO2 increases, insted of following them?

Not a scientist, not ideologically bound to climate change, however point one kinda screams

Industrial Revolution (new window)

I think you have a typo in point two.

Jesus built my hybrid: Global warming theorists in 2003 one of the hottest years on record

See, see we are all going to die from the global warmings.

Global warming theorists in 2008 one of the coldest years on record.

You cannot deny Global Warming based upon a single year.

Global warming fanboys in 2003 one of the hottest years on record
Global warming theorists in 2003 one datapoint in a model trending to an increase of 0.9C in average global climate over the next 50 years.

coma: Little.Alex: And that 'thousands of scientist' is bullshiat. Al Gore flunked out of Bible College. Surveys of people who actually study this don't find any consensus on the data.


1) Back up that statement.
2) Find me a scientific paper that says the increase in overall temperature of the planet isn't being caused humans. The extent is up for debate but you are outright denying it is happening completely.

You can't do either of these so there is no point in arguing with you.

In the mean time, back yours up too with an unbiased source. Also, I've done years of clinical research so don't try to fly me no bullshiat.

Savage Belief: coma

31,000 scientists disagree. (new window)

From your article:

"Michael Nobel, executive director for Fresh Energy, a St. Paul-based policy think tank that focuses on energy solutions, said the petition holds little merit to those who study global warming.

"It's a sad and odd little voice shouting that there is no global warming," he said of the institute. "Many people have apparently fallen for it."

Nobel said among those who study global warming, most agree that it is a human-driven phenomenon.

"It's a curious little cultural artifact," he said of the petition. "It's like people talk about Sasquatch or alien abductions."

The scientific community mostly agrees on climate issues, Nobel said.

"That's what's most ridiculous about this petition," he said. "It alleges that there's a broad disagreement about the climate." "

I don't think you understand the difference between someone calling himself a "scientist" and then putting his name on a scrap of people, and a Ph.D doing actual research on the subject.

slipperyrockdawg: Little.Alex: (and while I'm here; 1983 to about 2000: AIDS Panic!!! 30% to 40% of Africa and Asia has HIV. -but after 25 years of such a high infection rate, their population hasn't dropped -Oops! Sorry for all the lies! We only lie to you when we're fund raising... )

It takes a special kind of stupid to assume that AIDS isn't having an impact on Africa's population (not as big as malaria/starvation of course) but to assume that a high death rate can't be negated by a wildly out of control birth rate is ... well it's just dumb.
/bless the ignore list

Well, dumbace, I'm an actuary. I study life expectancy for a living. And 1% is a big decrement. Very big. A 100% fatal disease with a 4 or 5 year queue to mortality would be a 20% to 25% decrement. No human population could survive that. If the AIDS hoax were true, Africa and Asia would be completely depopulated about 15 years ago.

And coma>/b> there is not AIDS vaccine. So I'm guessing you're wrong about that. And if you think the Global Ice Age hoax never happened, you didn't go to school in the 1970s. Go read TIME Magazine from ... April 1975 if I recall.

PirateKing
OK. I'll come clean. The other 11 1/4 inches wouldn't fit in her ear.

Pencil dick?

mrmaster: A Tout Le Monde: Are there any politically liberal people who think that global warming is a farce? It seems like the vast majority of scientists believe it is real. And the the people who say it isn't are related to the Republican party and/or involved corporations, yet they hold the minority of scientist views.

Just like in "Supersize Me", there were a small percentage of dieticians that said McDonalds was good for you. I don't think we can rely on the minority perspective.

I'm a liberal and I can honestly say that yes, we might be causing an impact but not as great of an impact as the media portrays. We simply don't have enough data to categorize global climate change in relation to how old the earth is. It is naive to think that a few hundred years of records, of which probably only 50 years are accurate, in relation to a few million years can create a pattern.

There are many reasons to be enviro conscious but it shouldn't all be for global warminng...errr i mean climate change.

BINGO!

WE HAVE A WINNAR!
+1

hitlersbrain: It's AVERAGE temperature people. Screwed up local weather neither confirms nor denies global warming.

No legitimate climatologist doubts global warming anymore. Why do laymen who refuse to believe in global warming keep bringing it up? Do they like it up the butt or are they just trolling?

Because nobody trusts climatologist. Honestly, why should we?

Kludge: So what if we invest a few more million on studying climate change?

The worst that can happen is we have a better understanding of our climate and ecosystem.

and that we've wasted a few more million dollars.

Predictive models' failure to accurately anticipate global climate change is caused by global climate change.

See how that works?

This same incident of Global Warming killed a climber on Rainier yesterday... In all seriousness, moisture is attracted to the mountains in the Pacific NW like a fat kid to cake and it can snow 365 days a year there. This doesn't disprove global warming but it sure does make for some interesting climbing.

/leaves for Rainier in 12 hours
//bringing snowshoes

GoldSpider: Predictive models' failure to accurately anticipate global climate change is caused by global climate change.

See how that works?

Oh snap, now I get it. RUN FOR THE HILLS

Savage Belief: coma

31,000 scientists disagree. (new window)


Well thank you for that. However, that is a petition not a list of papers refuting the facts which is worth precisely dick in a scientific discussion especially considering the vast majority of those "scientists" have done exactly ZERO research on ACC.

Huh huh... huh huh... Mount.

heeh heeee hehehehhh... Hood.

d'art: "Michael Nobel, executive director for Fresh Energy, a St. Paul-based policy think tank that focuses on energy solutions, said the petition holds little merit to those who study global warming.

I didn't read the cited article, but that paragraph was actually mind-boggling.

Here you have the executive director of a POLICY THINK TANK commenting on climate change, and we're supposed to dismiss the dissenting SCIENTISTS???

-Sigh-

The main message behind GLOBAL CLIMATE CHANGE is that some places will get hotter (like the south), some colder (like WA's record colds this week), some more dry (like CA record drought) and some with more rain/snow (like OR), but the overall trend is for warming.

Climate is different from local weather conditions. You have to look at areas that are immune from day-to-day changes. One of the best are glaciers. If the overall temperature and precipitation was not changing, our glaciers would be staying about the same in size over the decades. That however is not happening. Several of the glaciers in the Pacific Northwest have disappeared over the past couple decades, and if *current* trends of melting continue, a majority will be permanently melted within 2-3 decades.

Read that again: at the current rate of melt, most of the glaciers in the lower 48 will have permanently melted in our lifetime.

That means massive reductions in irrigation & hydroelectric power (like New Zealand is currently facing (pops), forget about water supplies for 10s of millions of people across the West Coast, and forget about eating salmon.

You may not give a shait about polar bears or sea levels, but imagine what will happen to our country if our glaciers melt.

Mt. Hood, summer glaciers - tell me if you see a difference:


To just a couple years ago:

CapitolG

I care about the snow. Can you believe the season we had this year? Those bluebird powder spring days were epic.

Oh ya to all of you tf'ers we do have year round sking in Mt. Hood so snow in June is suprising but not out of the question.

It's the end of the humans time on earth. The earth is trying to get rid of it's human virus, global warming is actually the earth running a fever.

I am a Republican that thinks we should cut back on pollution because I do not like smog. We do not know conclusively why the planet changes temperatures, all we know is that it does. It has for eons and it will for eons. In the 1970s it was global cooling, now its global warming. How about we don't want to live in a cesspool of smog and filth? I guess that would not work for most people.

hitlersbrain:
No legitimate climatologist doubts global warming anymore. Why do laymen who refuse to believe in global warming keep bringing it up? Do they like it up the butt or are they just trolling?

And you found time to ask them all!!! well if a fark poster did his homework and asked EVERY "Legitimate Climatologist" and verified that they all believe in "global warming" (and by that i assume you mean man made global warming)
Sure we are fokiering up many of our ecosystems, damaging the seas and air as well as the very dirt beneath our feet, but the Al Gore Global warming seems fishy to me, specially since my old roommate claims that ice core samples show very similar trends time and time again in our history(CO2 levels and all), Now he could be full of crap, but it is what he dose for a living.

LouDobbsAwaaaay: dhudd: Except, dodo, this is not a "single event". It snows there in the summer regularly. Go ahead and pretend this is a blip in the data. I'm not here making claims about global warming, I'm here making comments about global climate change. I happen to believe that there is every likelihood that melting the ice caps will immediately lead to an ice age. You probably got a C in 11th grade when you took Earth Science.

So it's a regular irregularity in the weather? Do you even listen to yourself?

You can't take every heat wave, every cold snap, every spring snowstorm, every summer orographic snow event, every windy day, every suspiciously sunny afternoon, and every high-risk hay-fever day and classify it as "bizarre weather due to global climate change". You can't say that global climate change is, from now on, going to be responsible for every event where the weather inches away from the mean, without having some explanation for all of these events happening before the onset of ACC. Climatologists don't do this because it is bad science.

Hey Badger, is all this rain proof of climate change or what?

/Studenting a couple blocks away

drrrrrrr, Arrehenius? Sounds like onea them hoity toity libtards.
What the hells infared anyway? Sounds like a damned communist plan of subversion!

drrrr...increased precipitation can't possibly be a result of more water in the atmosphere. Water don't, like, evaporate or nuthin' drrrrrrrrrr

And mountains don't drrrr, cool off weather systems that pass over it... in fact mountains is a liberal myth too, and so are weather systems for that matter... drrrrrrrr

If we have to be divided into camps, is there room for a third camp for people like me?

The earth's climate has always been in a state of change. By the very nature of our existence, we have an affect on the world around us. This statement is true for all creatures. Climate will never be a static system. Our money would be better spent on activities that contributed to our ability to respond to changes in our climate than to try and prevent change. My mind is open enough to accept the possibility that some human activities may have enough of an impact to affect the rate of global climate change to a measurable amount. However that doesn't affect my other belief that prevention of change is a money sink.

Little.Alex: And if you think the Global Ice Age hoax never happened, you didn't go to school in the 1970s. Go read TIME Magazine from ... April 1975 if I recall.

TIME Magazine is a scientific journal now?

I'm pretty sure that TIME has published articles about the magnet wonder cure as well. Doesn't make it real.

Actual climatologists were never in consensus about global cooling. It was an hypothesis under consideration.

The funny thing is EVENTUALLY the Global Warming people will be right...just not in our lifetimes! Because at some point in the future (just like MANY times in the past BILLION or so years has occurred), the earth WILL heat up, whether or not it affects life on this planet remains to be determined, but eventually it will cool down...again...shocking, I know.

By the way, WHO decided that the "optimal" temperature for civilization occurred a few decades ago? Shortsighted much?

Do these alarmists understand the concept of a cycle?

Do they also realize that if the United States all of a sudden ceased to exist (along with all of our "crazy" emissions, pollution, and wastefulness of the Earth's finite resources, that it will not change a thing? India and China will continue to produce more pollution than we ever could! Why are THOSE countries allowed to do whatever they please, but in the USA you get fined if your toss an empty soda can in a "general waste" trash can?!

So many things to ponder...(snark)

hojohnjo: It's the end of the humans time on earth. The earth is trying to get rid of it's human virus, global warming is actually the earth running a fever.

And volcanos are when the earth has pimples.

And when it takes a shiat, it makes a New Jersey.

Little.Alex: I am just old enough to remember the previous 2 Global Weather Hoaxes, and the beginning of the AIDS hoax. Falling for stupid lies is a young man's game.

Apparently actual stupidity is an old, or, at least, middle aged, man's game.

1972 to 1981: Global Ice Age Panic!!! Only higher taxes and a massive expansion of Government can save us!!!

I'd give you that one, were it not for the fact that industrially driven anthropogenic global warming was raised at the AAAS annual conference 39 years ago, and that impending global cooling was, at best, a minority opinion.

about 1978 to 1984: Acid Rain Panic!!! Only higher taxes and a massive expansion of Government can save us!!!

So you're using as justification for the ostrich position a demonstrable phenomenon that was remedied by a mixture of emissions control and de-industrialisation ? I don't think you've thought this all the way through.

1981 to present: Global Warming Panic!!! Only higher taxes and a massive expansion of Government can save us!!!

Massive expansion of government hasn't been a popular solution anywhere, and there's an increasing desire to seek a trade model for CO2 reduction - so called 'carbon credits'. A far softer target for your ire would be people, Al Gore included, making money from the trading model.

while I'm here; 1983 to about 2000: AIDS Panic!!! 30% to 40% of Africa and Asia has HIV. -but after 25 years of such a high infection rate, their population hasn't dropped -Oops! Sorry for all the lies! We only lie to you when we're fund raising...

Presumably you're unaware that investment in healthcare has greatly increased the number of people living with, rather than dying from, HIV infection worldwide and that there's been a reduction in rates of infection in many areas ? Your claim that there's an African 'lie' where AIDS is concerned is a nonsense.

I think this man made global warming stuff is the height of arrogance. We did it...we can fix it. People, get a grip, the world is bigger than you are. The weather/climate is going to do what it is going to do and we get to roll with the punches. Oh no, coastal cities are going to flood...I mean..that never happened before. We don't have an entire branch of archeology dedicated to offshore exploration of sunken cities and campsites or anything like that. I know that was different, it was from the wayback time when unicorns fixed it when we screwed it up, but still.

My daughter was doing a report on global warming in high school and I cautioned her on strongly taking one side over the other.

What if there is global warming, it is hotter in some parts of the world causing more evaporated moisture to be sucked up into the sky, moved via the jet stream and slammed head on into a cold front which = tons of snow and bad weather in the less temperate climates..

OR is this what the Earth does every so often and maybe it is a 5,000 year cycle and all of our combined pollution really does not even register on the global scale?

The world may never know

/3 licks.

Little.Alex: Damn you SUV drivers on Mars!!! You've heated up Marvin Marsian!

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html

If pollution is causing our climate change:
(1) why did it start in 1820?
(2) why does the warming follow CO2 increases, insted of following them?
(3) why is it happening on Mars and Jupiter too?

(1) It is well established that there are solar forces at work that have helped us to recover from the LIA. However, they cannot explain the majority of the 20th century warming, and cannot explain almost any of the post-1980 warming.
(2) Oddly stated, but you are getting at the CO2 lag issue. Prior warmings in the ice core record were caused by orbital forcings first and then compounded by CO2 increases. However, now we are starting the loop CO2 first.
(3) The media did a huge disservice on the Jupiter story, totally ignoring the part where solar forcing is only 4% of the forcing on Jupiter, and internal reactions are the cause of warming and cooling. The Mars story has been debunked over and over. Face it, it isn't the sun.

coma: considering the vast majority of those "scientists" have done exactly ZERO research on ACC.

So Al Gore did scientific research? Show me the scientific research that says that man is causing the climate to change. In the last eight years the temperature has not risen. Where were the SUVs when the ice age ended? The temperature fluctuates but liberals need some exciting cause to feel better about themselves to battle against. Why not just say "Give a hoot don't polute!"

The headline submitter might not have realized it, as he was likely mocking, but that is EXACTLY true. Global warming causes erratic and unpredictable weather.

Like
Snow in June.

The melting of polar ice caps will inevitably affects the temperature of the Atlantic, Gulf Stream, and Pacific, creating a cooling effect (another ICE AGE) if you will. Water temperature affects land climate, anyone who lives on a coast vs. inland know this. If you'd like to make an informed opinion about the subject, refer to Thom Hartman's 2004 article about the next ice age.

Many logical, non-scientist types believe there is climate change and there always has been. Whether humans are to take a huge percentage of the fall for it is what's up for debate.

Not face-palming, not flame-baiting, it's up for debate and study. Like science should be. We should be able to question Global Cooling/Global Warming/Climate Change, especially when the terms change to fit the argument!

zappadog: The headline submitter might not have realized it, as he was likely mocking, but that is EXACTLY true. Global warming causes erratic and unpredictable weather.

Like
Snow in June.

I just want someone to explain to me what that is supposed to mean. The theory predicts unpredictable weather? Doesn't that suggest an issue with the theory?

perryjo:

Totally agree with your point.

Little.Alex: there is not AIDS vaccine. So I'm guessing you're wrong about that.

To deny that medicines preventing HIV from becoming AIDS don't exist is just profoundly ignorant.

And if you think the Global Ice Age hoax never happened, you didn't go to school in the 1970s. Go read TIME Magazine from ... April 1975 if I recall.

You obviously didn't bother to read the link I posted. Thank you for admitting that your only proof for the "global cooling" scare is 1 article from the 70s that someone told you about. Awesome. Don't think I'll bother with you anymore.

RapCat: Yet....the level of liquid in the glass stays the same. COASTAL FLOODING IS A MYTH! THE LIBTARD MEDIA ARE LED BY THE ZIONIST REGIME OF CRAB PEOPLE......I

Um... I thought coastal flooding had to do with the Pacific dumping into the Atlantic?