and nary a word from so-called 'feminists'- they are ok with the so-called "two tiered sisterhood": don't say jack about repression of women in Arab or African countries because of "cultural differences" Hell, Western feminists don't give a good God-damn about women in the world who are actually suffering under repression: they are too busy complaining about this month's Vogue cover, and how it demeans women. American feminists got it tough, boy, I'll tell ya.

Gish21:

Al Qaeda didn't exist when we were fighting the commies. And our 'aid' to Saddam was minor, some military intelligence when it looked like Iran was about to overrun them. Our policy was to let them bleed themselves dry against each other. Which is when we invaded, we were facing T-72s and migs instead of M60s and F-5s.

Still shouldn't have invaded Iraq though, we shoulda made a deal with him instead.

"our 'aid' to Saddam was minor"

The United States invaded Iraq over some of that 'minor aid' the US provided Saddam Hussein. Including:


"chemical warfare-agent precursors, chemical warfare-agent production facility plans and technical drawings, chemical warfare filling equipment, biological warfare-related materials, missile fabrication equipment and missile system guidance equipment"

Source: The Riegle Report, U.S. Chemical and Biological Warfare-Related Dual Use Exports to Iraq and their Possible Impact on the Health Consequences of the Gulf War, A Report of Chairman Donald W. Riegle, Jr. and Ranking Member Alfonse M. D'Amato of the Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs with Respect to Export Administration, United States Senate, 103d Congress, 2d Session, May 25, 1994.

Yea, why not make a deal with Saddam. We did after all give him a bio and chemical weapon program.

/would you like to know more???

goethe-helen-hunt:
Well, let the men teach in remote areas, then.

Not if there are girls in the class. They don't want men in mixed company. You silly thing.

docweasel: and nary a word from so-called 'feminists'- they are ok with the so-called "two tiered sisterhood": don't say jack about repression of women in Arab or African countries because of "cultural differences" Hell, Western feminists don't give a good God-damn about women in the world who are actually suffering under repression: they are too busy complaining about this month's Vogue cover, and how it demeans women. American feminists got it tough, boy, I'll tell ya.

Feminists were the first people to complain about genital mutilation, back in the 70s, when nobody cared. They have complained about forced marriage, harassment of young women in Muslim neighborhoods in Europe, and honor killings for years. Try getting your news somewhere other than freerepublic.

//Troll or ignoramous? 'Fess up. We promise not to laugh.

why is this such a surprise? I mean how can you even see to drive when you're wearing a burka?

Well here's an idea... TAKE YOUR BURQA OFF SO YOU CAN SEE!!

Bullcrap. American feminists main agenda is protecting the right to kill unborn babies and to sue men for perceived "harassment"- unless its a Democrat politician, like Bill Clinton, in which case they will defend even the right, not only to grope, but to rape.

Here:
http://www.now.org/
where is there any mention of anything but typical radical left issues?

Here's what late feminist Pamela Bone (who died this week)had to say about you and your ilk, "feminists":
LET it be recorded that in the last decade of the 20th century the brave and great movement of Western feminism ended, not with a bang but with a whimper... I don't hold much hope on this International Women's Day of seeing big protests in Australian cities against female genital mutilation; or against honour killings, stonings, child marriages, forced seclusion or any of the other persecutions to which women are still subjected. The fire of Western feminism has quietly died away, first as a victim of its success, lately as a victim of cultural relativism, of anti-Americanism and reluctance to be seen to be condemning the enemies of the enemy.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21342722-7583,00.html

O.K. Now we know you're a troll. You blew off links proving you were talking trash and you threw in stuff about Bill Clinton and unborn babies. I give ya a 8/10.

How about you, Whoatherebabie? Gimme your score on the troll.

docweasel: Here:
http://www.now.org/
where is there any mention of anything but typical radical left issues?



How 'bout this from the NOW website:
Link (new window)
See? Actual searching can be your friend.

ciocia: O.K. Now we know you're a troll. You blew off links proving you were talking trash and you threw in stuff about Bill Clinton and unborn babies. I give ya a 8/10.

How about you, Whoatherebabie? Gimme your score on the troll.

I'm not Whoatherebabie, but I play one on T.V. I give docweasel only 6/10. trying too hard, not varying intensity from somewhat angry to sounding reasonable loses at least three points.

Meantime, CARNAGE ON THE SAUDI HIGHWAYS!

http://youtube.com/watch?v=7_XpObaKeOw
(rolling, but not the Rick kind!)

EdNortonsTwin:
"our 'aid' to Saddam was minor"

The United States invaded Iraq over some of that 'minor aid' the US provided Saddam Hussein. Including:


"chemical warfare-agent precursors, chemical warfare-agent production facility plans and technical drawings, chemical warfare filling equipment, biological warfare-related materials, missile fabrication equipment and missile system guidance equipment"

Source: The Riegle Report, U.S. Chemical and Biological Warfare-Related Dual Use Exports to Iraq and their Possible Impact on the Health Consequences of the Gulf War, A Report of Chairman Donald W. Riegle, Jr. and Ranking Member Alfonse M. D'Amato of the Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs with Respect to Export Administration, United States Senate, 103d Congress, 2d Session, May 25, 1994.

Yea, why not make a deal with Saddam. We did after all give him a bio and chemical weapon program.

/would you like to know more???

Thanks for the Starship Troopers reference. The biological weapons 'aid' given to Iraq consisted of little more than some petri dishes sent by a private American company for livestock uses, it was not a state action and probably wasn't that useful. The chemical weapons used by Iraq in the war had been widely known since the first world war. The US policy was to let Iran and Iraq kill each other, and when Iran began to win, satellite pictures were given to Iraq. Perhaps not the wisest plan, but the idea that we 'armed' Iraq is fiction. Just take a look at their military inventory, it's almost entirely Soviet, and what wasn't Soviet, was French.

onomatopoeon:
On quite a few occasions, the U.S. has supplied surplus Soviet weapons to various countries and groups, for the reasons that the AK series is more familiar to them, ammo is plentiful and cheap, and most importantly for the U.S., it allows deniability. As in "Who, us? Teehee."

Therefore, I believe you have earned this prize for ignorance:

Really? Where exactly does the US get these thousands T-72 we apparently supplied the Iraqis with from? Or Mig-21s? Or BMPs? We build them ourselves in some secret undergroud factory? Secret raids in to the Soviet Union to steal them? Do tell.

Oh, and please, post some more pictures, and write your responses in bold again. I didn't quite get it the first time.

The second I see the word "burka" in any post about the middle east I immediately stop reading because it tells me two things.
1) The person doing the writing hasn't actually done any research; not only do they misspell "burqa" but 99.999% of the time they're referring to the chador, niqab, abbaya, or some other garment. Not everything Muslim women wear is a burqa, just like not everything Americans eat is a cheeseburger. Little side note? There is NOT ONE regime anymore that mandates the usage of the burqa; the Taliban was the last one.
2) The person is going to ignore the real issue and make it all about the fact that "Arab women dress funny." Obviously, they must be terribly repressive and cruel and everything they touch is tainted by their dirty Arab evil.

Saudi Arabia has some hardcore wahhabism shiat going on which does not make it a nice place to live, for anyone. They have shiatty roads, corrupt leadership, and a badly unbalanced economy. I agree with that. But for God's sake, don't make this another thread about the evil of people from the Middle East. Recognize that Saudi Arabia does not represent the Middle East just as much as rural Georgia doesn't represent the United States.

FTA: The roads are dangerous.

With no women drivers, how bad could it possibly be?

Gish21:

Thanks for the Starship Troopers reference. The biological weapons 'aid' given to Iraq consisted of little more than some petri dishes sent by a private American company for livestock uses, it was not a state action and probably wasn't that useful. The chemical weapons used by Iraq in the war had been widely known since the first world war. The US policy was to let Iran and Iraq kill each other, and when Iran began to win, satellite pictures were given to Iraq. Perhaps not the wisest plan, but the idea that we 'armed' Iraq is fiction. Just take a look at their military inventory, it's almost entirely Soviet, and what wasn't Soviet, was French.

Did you miss this part?

"chemical warfare-agent precursors, chemical warfare-agent production facility plans and technical drawings, chemical warfare filling equipment, biological warfare-related materials, missile fabrication equipment and missile system guidance equipment"



The real victims of this fiasco are the US soldiers; Today, and from the first gulf war who down wind from the chemical facilities that we destroyed throughout Iraq. Gulf War Syndrome anyone?

I suggest you get a copy of the report by Chairman Donald W. Riegle, Jr. and Ranking Member Alfonse M. D'Amato of the Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs with Respect to Export Administration, United States Senate, 103d Congress, 2d Session, May 25, 1994.

Unfarkingbelievable.

But yea, those Saudis' can't drive for shiat - type some keywords on youtube - crazy farkers.

EdNortonsTwin: Gish21:

Thanks for the Starship Troopers reference. The biological weapons 'aid' given to Iraq consisted of little more than some petri dishes sent by a private American company for livestock uses, it was not a state action and probably wasn't that useful. The chemical weapons used by Iraq in the war had been widely known since the first world war. The US policy was to let Iran and Iraq kill each other, and when Iran began to win, satellite pictures were given to Iraq. Perhaps not the wisest plan, but the idea that we 'armed' Iraq is fiction. Just take a look at their military inventory, it's almost entirely Soviet, and what wasn't Soviet, was French.

Did you miss this part?


"chemical warfare-agent precursors, chemical warfare-agent production facility plans and technical drawings, chemical warfare filling equipment, biological warfare-related materials, missile fabrication equipment and missile system guidance equipment"
The real victims of this fiasco are the US soldiers; Today, and from the first gulf war who down wind from the chemical facilities that we destroyed throughout Iraq. Gulf War Syndrome anyone?

I suggest you get a copy of the report by Chairman Donald W. Riegle, Jr. and Ranking Member Alfonse M. D'Amato of the Committee on Banking, Housing and Urban Affairs with Respect to Export Administration, United States Senate, 103d Congress, 2d Session, May 25, 1994.

Unfarkingbelievable.

But yea, those Saudis' can't drive for shiat - type some keywords on youtube - crazy farkers.

ive just been to youtube.......holy crap!

i especially like the saudi road skating (sliding on sandals outside car doing 60 with no driver)

America's Partners in Peace.

Impudent Domain: well time to sum up the fark comments,

Strange Saudi activities are brought to our attention, according to Fark its

1) Bush's fault
2) Christians fault (or they are JUST as bad)
3) USA fault (or we are JUST as bad)
4) conservatives and republicans faults, collectively
5) we just don't understand
6) only thing missing so far is blaming the Jews. I am sure it's coming.

lol, victim complex.

Well here's an idea... TAKE YOUR BURQA OFF SO YOU CAN SEE!!

RTFA. They're not the ones driving. It's forbidden.

/New fuel sources, now.
//If only to tell the Saudi government where to stick their oil.

I'd love to see an article detailing exactly how we made Iraq's chemical weapons, rather than just your quotes from a former senator. Gimme the link. According to wiki's article, it's exactly as I said, the US sold biological cultures to Iraq for non weapons purposes. While it is likely we made some bad decisions regarding Iraq in the past, Iraq was not out 'ally' nor were they armed with conventional nor chemical, or biological weapons by the US. They armed themselves with chemical weapons, which are very easy to make, and armed themselves with conventional weapons from the Soviet Union.

-1 Subby for the "headline"

I'm getting sick of this quote-a-paragraph approach to Fark headlines lately. Bring back the creativity!

Whoatherebabie [TotalFark]
Just trying to hard now.

"too", not "to", hun ;)

I note you didn't address the real issue, that so-called "feminists" get more pissed off at what they consider sexist jokes than they do at real oppression. Most have never seen it, therefore they don't recognize it where it exists.

The bad roads may contribute to the problem, but Holy Christ, do people in the Middle East drive like brainless maniacs. It's insane.

"Go fill up your Chrysler Toyota again, yessss,
yessss......"

Those Tundras and Previas get mighty thirsty........

docweasel

You've already been outed as a troll, now stop attention whoring.

docweasel: Whoatherebabie [TotalFark]
Just trying to hard now.

"too", not "to", hun ;)

I note you didn't address the real issue, that so-called "feminists" get more pissed off at what they consider sexist jokes than they do at real oppression. Most have never seen it, therefore they don't recognize it where it exists.

You're a complete turd-wizard. All of the feminists I know are very knowledgable about the kind of shait that goes on overseas but are not in positions to solve all of the world's problems. You are making a fundimental mistake in thinking that America's feminists are the ones who have to go and save these poor foreign women from their evil foreign men. There are women's groups in Africa and the Middle East who are working towards their own problems too. Feminists in America and Europe shouldn't always be running the show, in cases where the problems aren't in their countries they should be available for support and access to resources behind the scenes, not taking leadership positions.

Go build your strawmen elsewhere tard monster.

That's one country where we definitely need to install a regime change.

shorter krymore: anyone who disagrees with the far-left's line is a troll. Its easier to call someone a troll instead of refuting my Pam Bone quote. Because, as a TRUE life-long feminist, she is completely correct. The feminists of the West are cowards when it comes to real, life and death oppression. They'd rather protest over family leave and sexist jokes in the workplace instead of girls being honor-killed for having the sin of allowing themselves to be raped. Which is the greater oppression? I really don't think the members of NOW know.

Yeah, all the feminists you know, earwax, just not the ones anyone else knows. Where was the feminist outrage over the Taliban before we liberated Afghanistan? Where was the feminist outrage of Saddam's sons and officers freely raping any woman who fell under their eye, even at their own weddings? All I've heard since is how evil the US was to liberate both, since, coming from the left.

wh0mprat: naris: dryknife: This thread needs pictures of hot Saudi school teachers.

Oooh, here's one. Teachers on the right.

Cripes. Imagine learning phonics from a farking Nazgul.

"B isss for Baggggiiinnnssss."

Sygerrik: The second I see the word "burka" in any post about the middle east I immediately stop reading because it tells me two things.
1) The person doing the writing hasn't actually done any research; not only do they misspell "burqa" but 99.999% of the time they're referring to the chador, niqab, abbaya, or some other garment. Not everything Muslim women wear is a burqa, just like not everything Americans eat is a cheeseburger. Little side note? There is NOT ONE regime anymore that mandates the usage of the burqa; the Taliban was the last one.
2) The person is going to ignore the real issue and make it all about the fact that "Arab women dress funny." Obviously, they must be terribly repressive and cruel and everything they touch is tainted by their dirty Arab evil.

Saudi Arabia has some hardcore wahhabism shiat going on which does not make it a nice place to live, for anyone. They have shiatty roads, corrupt leadership, and a badly unbalanced economy. I agree with that. But for God's sake, don't make this another thread about the evil of people from the Middle East. Recognize that Saudi Arabia does not represent the Middle East just as much as rural Georgia doesn't represent the United States.

You're wrong, your info is bad and you should feel bad. Burka being an eastern word involves a different alphabet and all translation is funky with transliteration and phonemes.

As for not being forced to wear a burqa. Like it or not the enforced dress code of "hide the filthy wimmenz" is an effective "quick'n'punchy" example of the overall sexism in Saudi Arabia which is, in turn, an example of the various evils of their repressive fundy culture.

I mean, shiat, it's not like they even get their own religion right. Mohammed said pretty clearly "Don't draw my face because you shouldn't worship any idols, like me, rather than God." So they freak out when he's drawn or referenced unflatteringly and effectively worship him. Great job Islam! Keepin' that faith extra pure*.

*Pure FAIL that is.

Don't take my word for it, argue with her:
Was it before or after September 11 that thinkers of the Left - for feminism was a movement of the Left - decided that racism was a far more serious crime than sexism? When did cultural sensitivity trump women's rights? Was it about the time that Australian feminist Germaine Greer defended the practice of female genital mutilation because, as she pointed out, Western women put studs through their nipples and labia?

Consider this: a struggling, screaming little girl is held down by several people (usually women) while another woman cuts through her clitoris and inner labia, with the intention of ensuring this girl will never experience sexual pleasure; and the world's most famous feminist, to whom much is owed, I don't deny, can compare this practice to adult women choosing, for whatever silly reason, to decorate their sexual parts with metal. The UN estimates that three million girls are mutilated every year. It has lately been warning against the medicalisation of the practice: as societies develop, it is being carried out by health professionals, which doesn't make it less of an abuse.

I don't hold much hope on this International Women's Day of seeing big protests in Australian cities against female genital mutilation; or against honour killings, stonings, child marriages, forced seclusion or any of the other persecutions to which women are still subjected. The fire of Western feminism has quietly died away, first as a victim of its success, lately as a victim of cultural relativism, of anti-Americanism and reluctance to be seen to be condemning the enemies of the enemy.

Yet as Western women take their rights for granted, other women are just beginning to demand theirs. There will be marches in Europe this International Women's Day, organised by Muslim (or ex-Muslim) women reformers. They will march through Germany and France to present a grievance to the European Parliament in Brussels, saying that the veil is "a manifestation of political Islam and a symbol of the oppression of women".

In Pakistan, the Prevention of Anti-Women Practices Bill, which would ban forced marriages and give women rights over property, is before the national assembly. In Syria, the murder of a 16-year-old girl by her brother, at her family's request, has prompted a national debate about the leniency shown to perpetrators of honour killings.

In Saudi Arabia, Bill Gates, addressing a recent business seminar, told the segregated audience - women, their faces and bodies shrouded in black, behind a large partition - that the country would not achieve its ambition to become an economic power while it failed to use the talents of half the population. "One side of the audience loved it," he quipped later.

Change is happening. It would be nice to think the women pushing for change had support. Maybe they do and I just don't hear about it. There are organisations, such as the International Women's Development Agency, that work tirelessly for women in poor countries. They'll be getting a donation from me this International Women's Day.

Maybe my report on the death of Western feminism is greatly exaggerated. I hope so. "Don't be so polite, girls!" the old feminists used to sing. "Show a little fight, girls, show a little fight!" And amid the confusion, hold on to what was won in Vienna. Human rights are universal. And women's rights are human rights.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,21342722-7583,00.html

docweasel: shorter krymore: anyone who disagrees with the far-left's line is a troll. Its easier to call someone a troll instead of refuting my Pam Bone quote. Because, as a TRUE life-long feminist, she is completely correct. The feminists of the West are cowards when it comes to real, life and death oppression. They'd rather protest over family leave and sexist jokes in the workplace instead of girls being honor-killed for having the sin of allowing themselves to be raped. Which is the greater oppression? I really don't think the members of NOW know.

Yeah, all the feminists you know, earwax, just not the ones anyone else knows. Where was the feminist outrage over the Taliban before we liberated Afghanistan? Where was the feminist outrage of Saddam's sons and officers freely raping any woman who fell under their eye, even at their own weddings? All I've heard since is how evil the US was to liberate both, since, coming from the left.

FAR left you say? you mean the FAR left of the RIGHT quadrant?

docweasel: shorter krymore: anyone who disagrees with the far-left's line is a troll. Its easier to call someone a troll instead of refuting my Pam Bone quote. Because, as a TRUE life-long feminist, she is completely correct. The feminists of the West are cowards when it comes to real, life and death oppression. They'd rather protest over family leave and sexist jokes in the workplace instead of girls being honor-killed for having the sin of allowing themselves to be raped. Which is the greater oppression? I really don't think the members of NOW know.


Ok, I'll bite...

Have you ever met a feminist, short of perhaps some melodramatic, ranting, 18-yo college student, who would actually claim with a straight face that honour killings in the Middle East are absolutely qualitatively equivalent to unfair treatment of women in the workforce in the West?

It comes down to whether your group is local or international, and what things you can realistically do to help those in other societies - without potentially causing a backlash and even making things worse for them.

Would you say that a group that fights against neo-Nazi racist movements in Europe has lost the plot because there are much greater racially-based atrocities happening around the World right now? Would you say that an anti-police corruption organisation in Australia has lost the plot because police corruption is much higher in many other parts of the World? Would you say that we should stop fighting street crime in the West and send our police overseas to focus on the many poorer Third World countries that are much more crime-ridden than ours?

I don't think you'll find any non-batshiat crazy feminists who won't agree that things are much better for Western women now than they were 60 years ago. This still doesn't mean that they can't focus on remaining issues that are still problems in the West.

The second part of this is, what can you realistically do? Cultural relativism doesn't excuse abuse of women, but it does explain it, and people have come to realise that no amount of foot stomping or tantrum throwing on the streets of the West is going to change anything in lawless villages in the horn of Africa, Afghanistan or Pakistan. These are war-torn shiatholes that are stuck in the stone age, and things like the status of women in their societies is not something we can fix by waving a magic wand.

As for Pamela Bone's quote - I feel no need to refute it. She does make a very good point. A point that some in feminist circles definitely need to take heed of. But one must think of her point in light of the things I mentioned - ie what can people do? And why blame people for not expending huge amounts of effort over things they have no control over? As I said, it's like expecting Australian anti-police-corruption groups to make noise about police corruption in Brazil.

Paulistinian: I blame this on the homosexuals.

The Sodomites!

/or Sodomaybe

Melgania: docweasel: shorter krymore: anyone who disagrees with the far-left's line is a troll. Its easier to call someone a troll instead of refuting my Pam Bone quote. Because, as a TRUE life-long feminist, she is completely correct. The feminists of the West are cowards when it comes to real, life and death oppression. They'd rather protest over family leave and sexist jokes in the workplace instead of girls being honor-killed for having the sin of allowing themselves to be raped. Which is the greater oppression? I really don't think the members of NOW know.


Ok, I'll bite...

Have you ever met a feminist, short of perhaps some melodramatic, ranting, 18-yo college student, who would actually claim with a straight face that honour killings in the Middle East are absolutely qualitatively equivalent to unfair treatment of women in the workforce in the West?

It comes down to whether your group is local or international, and what things you can realistically do to help those in other societies - without potentially causing a backlash and even making things worse for them.

Would you say that a group that fights against neo-Nazi racist movements in Europe has lost the plot because there are much greater racially-based atrocities happening around the World right now? Would you say that an anti-police corruption organisation in Australia has lost the plot because police corruption is much higher in many other parts of the World? Would you say that we should stop fighting street crime in the West and send our police overseas to focus on the many poorer Third World countries that are much more crime-ridden than ours?

I don't think you'll find any non-batshiat crazy feminists who won't agree that things are much better for Western women now than they were 60 years ago. This still doesn't mean that they can't focus on remaining issues that are still problems in the West.

The second part of this is, what can you realistically do? Cultural relativism doesn't excuse abuse of women, but it does explain it, and people have come to realise that no amount of foot stomping or tantrum throwing on the streets of the West is going to change anything in lawless villages in the horn of Africa, Afghanistan or Pakistan. These are war-torn shiatholes that are stuck in the stone age, and things like the status of women in their societies is not something we can fix by waving a magic wand.

As for Pamela Bone's quote - I feel no need to refute it. She does make a very good point. A point that some in feminist circles definitely need to take heed of. But one must think of her point in light of the things I mentioned - ie what can people do? And why blame people for not expending huge amounts of effort over things they have no control over? As I said, it's like expecting Australian anti-police-corruption groups to make noise about police corruption in Brazil.

Quoted for Truthery

docweasel: Pamela Bone...

Thanks for pointing her out. Just read a few of her articles, and I agree completely. RIP.

You can actually see much of what she discusses at the "top tier feminist blogs", the Pandagons, the Feministings, the Feministes, the Broadsheets.

When Amanda Marcotte can still declare the Duke students guilty, even after the AG made the very unusual statement they were innocent of anything, and when she can blast white men as rapists, and ignore any other detail, and almost no one in the liberal blogosphere will call her out on it, then left has switched places with right.

Same too with issues of the burka which are at many feminist sites seen as liberating.

Same too with issues involving gray rape in which no female has to take responsibility for their drinking, and men have to take all the responsibility for both parties drinking.

It's a very strange feminist world these days. At feministing they will talk about shaving their pubes off and how they like to do it, and in the next minute curse out men for oppressing them. It's much more like Church Ladies and Sewing Circles than it is about equality.



And yet, this is what modern feminists do every time they rail against men belonging to some patriarchy in america. Most men, most women in American live lives of desperation. Very few have any actual power. And very few are rapists. And yet they are blamed all of the time just because they have a penis and hence, they must be oppressors.

I've been a feminist since the early 70s and I still believe in removing cultural and legal barriers to both sexes. But modern feminism in America has very little to do with equality.

re: Whoatherebabe

Do you know, I _have_ attempted to join women's rights groups. My politics are right of center, but I believe we, as Americans, have the responsibility to push for democracy and liberty throughout the world, and that includes women's liberty. Women surely are persecuted throughout the world, there is no bloody doubt about that. But our meetings would become bogged down in talking up the next protest or petition or blog post about the evils of the EEEVILLL BOOOSH admin and how President Bush was oppressing women and the terrible repression and evil and hate that American women had to face, oh, its bloody awful, innit?

Not being a moonbat liberal, I wanted to focus on pressuring the State Dept. to pressure Arab countries who are under our influence to free women condemned to death for breaking Islamic law, to try and get the U.N. to sanction countries who look the other way at honor killings, forced marriages, bride killings over dowries, neo-natricide of female babies, general lack of women's rights to vote their own consciences, to own property, to teach school, to drive a car, to appear in public, to have a farking LIFE.

And don't give me that bullshiat about 'well, there's nothing we can do about it anyway so why try" it certainly doesn't stop them from protesting wars, both foreign and domestic, and what effect has that had? And conversely, protesting outside of South Africa DID have an influence on that foreign country, so why not try?

You know why? Because they are COWARDS, that's why. They are afraid of backlash or even violence done upon them because violence is done, and very very often in this world, against those who would protest against certain groups. And so they pretend to speak truth to power, when every milksop, pantywaisted nancy in Hollywood trips over themselves to criticize the President, knowing there is no risk.

I gave up on those groups because they no longer exist to fight for women's rights. I am too young to know for sure, but I suspect things changed when they had to co-opt their principles to excuse Bill Clinton. Since then, they exist for 2 things: to protect unfettered abortion through the 9th month, and to attack Republicans on all levels. That has been my experience in 3 different "feminist" groups. I was also somewhat put off because 2 of them were run by cliques of militant lesbians who constantly preached hate at men, and being the daughter of one and the sister of 2 others who didn't fit their description of serial rapists and sexist thugs, I took issue and had the temerity to disagree, upon which I was threatened with violence once and thrown out of the association twice. The third I quit in disgust when we never seemed to do anything but sit around and biatch, well, we are women, I'm sure you farkers will say, go for your strengths!

So kindly direct me to an association that does address real injustice, and I will happily join, blog, canvass, petition, vote, or just sit down in the mud and sulk, whatever helps.

Oh, and I forgot to mention their disdain and loud disgust and ridicule of all religion, their assumption that all Catholics are homophobes and bigots, (we are not, and I'm sure I'm going to take some junk over homosexual priests, easy shots there guys, take them as you will) and that we don't believe in evolution (we do, in fact the Catholic religion is very realist and liberal on matters of science, Da Vinci and Galileo notwithstanding) and I took constant abuse, nasty cracks and outright insults over being a "Christer" and constant stupid and insulting questions meant to offend me or catch me up in a contradiction or what they would consider a stupid, laughable point of catechism, as well as vulgar and blasphemous remarks childishly meant to bait me. There was little 'sisterhood' going on while I was there, and not one woman, even those who might have sympathized with me as being unfairly called out when I came there to help, ever spoke up or said one word in defence. I admit to being flustered and red-faced on occasion, but I never lost my temper and never gave back hate for hate "a kind word turneth away wrath" and you can disarm people by refusing to get angry back, but the bullshiat never stopped as long as I continued to go to gatherings, either big ones at hotel convention rooms nor small ones held at members' houses. It was ugly and mean spirited, and I learned a lot about what the feminist and lesbian left thinks of religious people, and its not good.

docweasel: re: Whoatherebabe

Do you know, I _have_ attempted to join women's rights groups. My politics are right of center, but I believe we, as Americans, have the responsibility to push for democracy and liberty throughout the world, and that includes women's liberty.

Translation: I am a right-winger, but tried to weasel into women's groups to push my right-wing agenda, which is to stop sexism in the Muslim world and ignore it everywhere else.

Not being a moonbat liberal, I wanted to focus on pressuring the State Dept. to pressure Arab countries who are under our influence to free women condemned to death for breaking Islamic law, to try and get the U.N. to sanction countries who look the other way at honor killings, forced marriages, bride killings over dowries, neo-natricide of female babies, general lack of women's rights to vote their own consciences, to own property, to teach school, to drive a car, to appear in public, to have a farking LIFE.

More of the same.


I gave up on those groups because they no longer exist to fight for women's rights. I am too young to know for sure, but I suspect things changed when they had to co-opt their principles to excuse Bill Clinton. Since then, they exist for 2 things: to protect unfettered abortion through the 9th month, and to attack Republicans on all levels. That has been my experience in 3 different "feminist" groups. I was also somewhat put off because 2 of them were run by cliques of militant lesbians who constantly preached hate at men, and being the daughter of one and the sister of 2 others who didn't fit their description of serial rapists and sexist thugs, I took issue and had the temerity to disagree, upon which I was threatened with violence once and thrown out of the association twice. The third I quit in disgust when we never seemed to do anything but sit around and biatch, well, we are women, I'm sure you farkers will say, go for your strengths!

So kindly direct me to an association that does address real injustice, and I will happily join, blog, canvass, petition, vote, or just sit down in the mud and sulk, whatever helps.

O.K. nobody bit on your desire to infiltrate feminist groups and stuff down your own agenda. Feminists are on record--for a long time--as opposed to the oppression of women in Muslim countries (see the link above, that you have assiduously ignored Link (new window)and this one Link (new window)and this one Link (new window).

P.S.--If you are going to troll whole political groups, in person, like you did when you tried to join feminist groups, as least pretend you actually give a damn about the rest of their agenda.

yes cloaca, you have me pegged, I joined them because I thought I could force my agenda upon them. That certainly would be constructive and well worth my time,and would probably be quite effective.

You know, when you want to troll or bait someone, at least have a plausible set of hypotheticals on which to base it. I joined because I wanted to help women, period. I really don't care if you want to try to impugn me or not. I'm pro gay marriage. I'm pro VERY liberal and fair immigration laws, in fact I'm pro-amnesty. I'm not a radical anti-abortionist. So don't label me with your bigotry.

PS, and you are wrong. And leading feminist writers awoke to this fact and wrote about it, chastising and condemning them for it. See my comments for links. That's exactly what I'm on about. I could put up with the crap if they actually DID anything. I wasn't going to put up with the crap AND just sit around and talk about how evil men are and how stupid George Bush is. I wanted to DO something to help women.

Oh, DocWeasel, as long as you are hot to trot for women in other Arab countries, can you please speak about what is happening to women in Iraq under the new regime created by the U.S.?

The War Against Iraqi Women
Link
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