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(AP)   Whirlpool suspends 39 workers who lied about smoking. Who didn't see this coming?   (hosted.ap.org) divider line 337
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15973 clicks; posted to Main » on 23 Apr 2008 at 10:47 AM (6 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2008-04-23 11:13:22 AM
Dear employer,

I am writing this letter to express my intentions regarding your policy of Total Information Awareness with regard to every aspect of my personal being, to include, but not limited to, my excretory fluids and DNA.

I am a proponent of open information sharing, and therefore fully support the company being aware of the function of my kidneys from one month to the next. Of course, I expect this to be reciprocated. You will provide me with complete and accurate information on the following:

- Complete financials for the company, including those not yet published, subject to direct inspection at any time and without warning.

- The salaries of all corporate officers, again, subject to direct inspection at any time and without warning.

- Any and all information regarding corporate level decision making, to include any planned downsizing, ownership changes, or outsourcing, in realtime as such matters are being considered.

Pursuant to the above goals, the following measures will be implemented to ensure compliance:

An independent team of accountants and attorneys shall be retained, answerable solely to the employees of the company, in order that any unannounced inspections of company records can take place.

The communication of all corporate officers is to be monitored at all times, including wiretapping personal phones, recording devices in all offices and conference rooms, etc. These records will be available for immediate, unannounced review at any time by any employee.

I am excited to move forward into this brave new age of total information awareness. My people will be at your home in 5 minutes to review your income tax records.
 
2008-04-23 11:13:31 AM
Wow you have got to be pretty desperate for money to receive national news attention and still fire 39 people. I wouldn't want to be working at Whirlpool, smoking or not.
 
2008-04-23 11:13:34 AM
cryinoutloud: So I can be a cubicle dweller like you guys? No thank you.

Ah, yes.

Anyone who manages to get health insurance and good working conditions is a "cubicle dweller".

If you want to biatch about how unfair it is that you don't have any benefits, then get a new job.

If you can't get a new job, get smarter.

If you don't want a new job, quit your biatching.
 
2008-04-23 11:14:04 AM
I remember an insurance application some years back (life insurance?) with questions about skydiving, motorcycle riding/racing, other hazardous activities that could affect my insurability. I didn't have any problem answering them honestly. I also don't think my rate should be the same as Super Dave Osborn.

Also, I don't smoke, but I hear it takes a year for the nicotine to work its way out of your system. ONE cigarette in the past year qualifies you as a smoker.

/How long before they ask how many hours you spend online gaming?
 
2008-04-23 11:14:11 AM
Sofa King Smart: But about that government that takes in taxes and those hospitals that take care of all the smokers with their health problems... cancer and such... seems like i've been paying higher premiums to cover those smoker only ailments for a lot of smokers for many years... seems like the extra premiums for smokers is the part that makes it 'more fair'!

Actually smokers die earlier and in fact tend to consume less resources due to those shortened lifespans. On top of this they pay far more in taxes than they consume in any extra resources.
 
2008-04-23 11:14:26 AM
moof: I wonder what the hell chewing tobacco has to do with anything though. No smoke, no lung cancer, right?


Are you serious?

 
2008-04-23 11:15:08 AM
Non-smoker. Works in insurance. Knows people in the company who smoke and tick 'non-smoker' box every year. Hates that. Means I pay more to subsidize your lying ass.

I think Whirlpool are being very generous providing an area for smokers to smoke and not work. If you smoke and want employer-based health insurance, tell the truth. You tick the 'non-smoker' box for one reason: you won't have to pay the surcharge that you're well aware would otherwise be included in your premium and that you should be paying. Whirlpool aren't forcing you to take their insurance but, if you choose to, they'd like you to tell the truth, please.

/Underwriting Manager
 
2008-04-23 11:15:12 AM
debug: What if they weren't smokers at the time they filled out the forms and picked up the habit after?

I smoked for awhile then quit, Then smoked for awhile then quit again. I always check the 'Non Smoker' box on my insurance forms.
 
2008-04-23 11:15:50 AM
nobodys_goose: I wonder how big an uprising there would be if every company in America fired every person who didn't have a "healthy lifestyle".

Well, it would initially be huge, but would quickly collapse is a wheezing mass of quivering flab after about 5 or 10 steps.
 
2008-04-23 11:16:29 AM
More than likely, sales have slipped and some bean counter said. Hey, I know a way to easily get rid of of some the workforce, and not have to pay them severance.
 
2008-04-23 11:16:35 AM
Sybarite: Those insurance forms can be pretty confusing. Maybe they all accidentally checked the NO box and thought they were checking the NONE OF YOUR GODDAMN BUSINESS box.

Privatized health insurance: ain't it a biatch?
 
2008-04-23 11:16:41 AM
Spongebob Plaid Pants: Also, I don't smoke, but I hear it takes a year for the nicotine to work its way out of your system. ONE cigarette in the past year qualifies you as a smoker.

You hear wrong, the half-life of nicotine in a human is about 2 hours.
 
2008-04-23 11:16:50 AM
moof: I wonder what the hell chewing tobacco has to do with anything though. No smoke, no lung cancer, right?

Right. sort of.
nom nom nom nom (new window- SFW, but not at all pleasant)
 
2008-04-23 11:18:07 AM
After RTFA, the company didn't suspend them for smoking. They were suspended for claiming the $500 for not smoking. If they hadn't lied, they wouldn't be in trouble. Pretty farkin' stupid to be sparkin' up at work...
 
2008-04-23 11:18:33 AM
stellarossa: Non-smoker. Works in insurance. Knows people in the company who smoke and tick 'non-smoker' box every year. Hates that. Means I pay more to subsidize your lying ass.

I think Whirlpool are being very generous providing an area for smokers to smoke and not work. If you smoke and want employer-based health insurance, tell the truth. You tick the 'non-smoker' box for one reason: you won't have to pay the surcharge that you're well aware would otherwise be included in your premium and that you should be paying. Whirlpool aren't forcing you to take their insurance but, if you choose to, they'd like you to tell the truth, please.

/Underwriting Manager


Any idea what the point of insurance is? SPREAD RISK, if you limit the group you sure as hell are spreading less risk.

Any idea what they were first intended to do?

An insurance company should pay out 100%+ of every dime it collects, its method of making money should be investing the float.
 
2008-04-23 11:18:51 AM
I thought smokers died earlier and therefore cost LESS overall for the health system.

but the insurance companies charge more for them.
 
2008-04-23 11:19:03 AM
If only there was a suitable and ironic name for a company that would do this... say, an insidious and destructive force that sucks things into it. If only...
 
2008-04-23 11:19:05 AM
Ha Ha ! Live by the socialist medicine sword, DIAF by the socialist medicine sword.
 
2008-04-23 11:19:16 AM
What if they were suspended for... Lying?
 
2008-04-23 11:19:25 AM
toonz
Still not drug testing congress or the CEO's, I see.


What's that black SUV doing in your driveway?
 
2008-04-23 11:19:27 AM
downtownkid:

Duke_Phillips: Fark is so helpful, I've learned that the most persecuted people on the planet are white male Christians who smoke. Poor guys

Not one single comment in this thread claims anyone is being
persecuted, nor does the headline, nor does the article.


satchel13:

question_dj:
If the employee opts out of their employers insurance program, why should they be held to the policy if it's only being implemented to save on the employers medical costs?

Because the only way to improve productivity is to eliminate all autonomy in the working class. If you allow the workers to have personal responsibility and freedom of their actions we will have complete chaos. The only way to make sure that everyone can live the American dream is to strip away all personal freedoms and trust in Government.

/Hillary '08
//Obama '08


bigbottom:

Ever read 1984? Big Brother IS watching you! Your personal Liberty is goin' down the tubes. I suggest everybody just quit smoking, then the Government will have to look elsewhere to get all of that tax money, perhaps the money could come equally from all of us instead of just from us smokers, seems more fair to me.

MDGeist:

Yea another "I hate Smokers" Fark thread!

It's amusing to see the same people that post pictures of little under age girls in their underwear try to come down on others for their bad habits.


FTFA: "We shouldn't have to give employers complete control over our private life so they can save a few dollars on medical care,"


Sorry, you're right, the word "persecuted" isn't used once. I'm clearly mistaken that smokers aren't coming in here talking about "Oh whoa is us" when the issue at hand isn't about smoking, it's about lying. Although in the interest of fairness some of the others may be more "just plain paranoid about the big, bad government" posts.

Lighten up Francis, or light up if it helps take the edge off.
 
2008-04-23 11:20:00 AM
RiverKing: maybe they started smoking after they signed it.

Came in here to say the same thing. I guess they're suppose to update their forms or something? Maybe they were just trying it out (heh).
 
2008-04-23 11:20:01 AM
isn't "cubicle dweller" usually the slur used by unemployed liberal arts majors, lib arts majors working as baristas at starbucks, and the section of the workforce called manual laborers ?
 
2008-04-23 11:20:01 AM
boobsrgood: toonz
Still not drug testing congress or the CEO's, I see.

What's that black SUV doing in your driveway?


damn, I wanted to go on the helicopter!
 
2008-04-23 11:20:11 AM
Whaaaaaa! They were nice enough not to fire me on the spot for lying and flaunting it on their property in front of their faces! My act of fraud and unwillingness to take responsibility for my addiction should garner sympathy!
 
2008-04-23 11:20:13 AM
As a service to HR departments everywhere, I will provide a short list of application questions for your interview process:

1. Has anybody in your family died of cancer in the last 20 years?
[]Yes []No

1a. Did the cancer treatment take a long time and cost a lot of money?
[]Yes []No

2. Do you take medication for one of the new, "fake diseases" like "restless leg syndrome"?
[]Yes [] No

3. Do you eat at fast food restaurants?
[]Yes [] No

3a. Do you "super size"?
[]Yes [] No

4. Do you use toxic chemicals to make your lawn green and plush?
[]Yes [] No

5. Do you at any time drive above the posted speed limit?
[]Yes [] No

6. Do you engage in unprotected sex with your significant other?
[]Yes [] No

6a. Do you engage in any "high risk" sexual activities -- buttsecks, oral sex, analingus, roman showers, yellow discipline, s&m, ass-to-mouth, or any other non-missionary sexual position?
[]Yes [] No

7. Do you drink coffee?
[]Yes [] No

8. Do you have well-tapered, firm and regular bowel movements?
[]Yes [] No

9. Are you allergic to anything?
[]Yes [] No

10. Does anybody in your family have heart disease?
[]Yes [] No

Answering "Yes" to any of these questions would eliminate the perspective employee from being hired.
 
2008-04-23 11:20:17 AM
stellarossa: Non-smoker. Works in insurance. Knows people in the company who smoke and tick 'non-smoker' box every year. Hates that. Means I pay more to subsidize your lying ass.

I think Whirlpool are being very generous providing an area for smokers to smoke and not work. If you smoke and want employer-based health insurance, tell the truth. You tick the 'non-smoker' box for one reason: you won't have to pay the surcharge that you're well aware would otherwise be included in your premium and that you should be paying. Whirlpool aren't forcing you to take their insurance but, if you choose to, they'd like you to tell the truth, please.

/Underwriting Manager


Also a smoker who gets lung cancer is not going to be getting a hip replacement on the company dime. Smokers actually consume less healthcare resources over the course of their lives, dieing sooner makes a big difference.
 
2008-04-23 11:20:49 AM
Nestea Plunge: Do I ask you what position your wife like to fark in? No. Now STFU.

Heh. This, of course, reminded me of one of my favorite "Mr. Show" quotes:

"I don't go to where you work and slap the dick out of your mouth."

/*jazz hands*
 
2008-04-23 11:20:51 AM
Duke_Phillips: Fark is so helpful, I've learned that the most persecuted people on the planet are white male Christians who smoke. Poor guys

I love when people make it seem like if you even do any sort of criticizing or complaining, it automatically means you're trying to say you're the most persecuted person on the planet.

You know, you don't need to locked in a gas chamber, suffering from testicular cancer, watching - as you slowly die - your family get raped to actually complain. People DO actually have the right to question and complain about little stuff even if their home mailing address isn't Genocide Way, Darfur.

In other words, no one is accusing you of wrongly naming yourself Biggest Victim In The World just 'cos you're complaining about Fark comments.

/I'm just accusing you of being an asshole.
 
2008-04-23 11:21:23 AM
THEIR HOUSE (insurance company)


www.skyscraperpicture.com



Your house

www.horizonsunlimited.com
 
2008-04-23 11:21:30 AM
justanotherfarkinfarker: I'm torn on this. I'm a non smoker, but I couldn't give a shiat if you smoke. Many people I know do. I do a lot of stupid shiat that puts me in high risk for insurance: Sleep with easy girls, mt bike, snowboard, drink a lot, roll on saturdays, drive like a crazy person, run long distance, smoke crack, hike in the middle of no place in all sorts of bad weather... and so on.
shiat in all likelihood I'll die younger and get hurt more than most smokers who just sit around like lazy bastards. Insurance is so absurdly expensive anyway. shiat I think my work pays $500 a month, before I chip in a few bucks. That isn't due only to smokers, I mean sure part of it is but for the most part it is due to the industry making insane profit.
But you shouldn't lie on a form like that when they could figure out the truth.

I think I had a point in there someplace.


I cannot believe that you participate in dangerous activities with such wanton disregard for your safety. Good God man, at least sleep with some not-so-easy girls.
 
2008-04-23 11:21:32 AM
Boo hoo, the big corporation is out to get me.

Michael Moore is fat!
 
2008-04-23 11:21:53 AM
I smoke. I check yes in the box. I pay more. These people got caught trying to cheat, and got fired for it.

Good.
 
2008-04-23 11:22:11 AM
Reminds me of that clip of Snoop Dogg where a reporter is saying to him, "I thought you quit smoking pot." And he's sitting there smoking a joint, going, "yeah. I did. Why?"
"But you're smoking a joint right now."
"No I'm not."


In any event... All those people have to do, (and this will stand up in court), is bring up the exact wording of the question on the form.
"Do you use tobacco?"
"No."

They could be telling the truth, if they quit smoking that morning. And that's all they should have to say.
It wasn't specific enough. It should have said something like, "Have you, used tobacco products in the past 30 days?"
 
2008-04-23 11:22:21 AM
farm1.static.flickr.com

You shouldn't smoke in a whirlpool. j/k

So how at risk are you from second hand smoke? I take some friends out to dinner on Sunday and when we get back to their place they all smoke, kind bud too. It irritates my contacts, but that's about it. Hope I don't die soon.

/got nothin
 
2008-04-23 11:22:51 AM
I just came here to say my Whirlpool Dryer has broken no less than 3 times since we got it 6 months ago.
 
2008-04-23 11:23:07 AM
satchel13: question_dj:
If the employee opts out of their employers insurance program, why should they be held to the policy if it's only being implemented to save on the employers medical costs?

Because the only way to improve productivity is to eliminate all autonomy in the working class. If you allow the workers to have personal responsibility and freedom of their actions we will have complete chaos. The only way to make sure that everyone can live the American dream is to strip away all personal freedoms and trust in Government.

/Hillary '08
//Obama '08

Well??

Which one did you vote for?
 
2008-04-23 11:23:15 AM
Thus, every year more than $3400, costs for health insurance coverage and lost productivity for every smoker. Naturally, this gears up the unexpected rise in the health insurance cost.


As a non smoker I pay almost 7K a year in health insurance alone (direct and indirect). You add in all my other insurance (life car house) and you are talking some big bucks. I rarely file a claim, yet do get hurt or sick now and then (on avg probably less than the cost of one month of insurance). If smoking didn't exist something tells me that would still be about the same.

Uncle Karl: arkansas: When somebody else pays for your life they can sort of call its shots.

Only if you think such a thing is ok. We should make that illegal. The entire point of insurance is to spread risk, instead it has turned into limiting risk and making obscene profits.


this.
 
2008-04-23 11:23:19 AM
Sofajockey: As a service to HR departments everywhere, I will provide a short list of application questions for your interview process:

1. Has anybody in your family died of cancer in the last 20 years?
[]Yes []No

1a. Did the cancer treatment take a long time and cost a lot of money?
[]Yes []No

2. Do you take medication for one of the new, "fake diseases" like "restless leg syndrome"?
[]Yes [] No

3. Do you eat at fast food restaurants?
[]Yes [] No

3a. Do you "super size"?
[]Yes [] No

4. Do you use toxic chemicals to make your lawn green and plush?
[]Yes [] No

5. Do you at any time drive above the posted speed limit?
[]Yes [] No

6. Do you engage in unprotected sex with your significant other?
[]Yes [] No

6a. Do you engage in any "high risk" sexual activities -- buttsecks, oral sex, analingus, roman showers, yellow discipline, s&m, ass-to-mouth, or any other non-missionary sexual position?
[]Yes [] No

7. Do you drink coffee?
[]Yes [] No

8. Do you have well-tapered, firm and regular bowel movements?
[]Yes [] No

9. Are you allergic to anything?
[]Yes [] No

10. Does anybody in your family have heart disease?
[]Yes [] No

Answering "Yes" to any of these questions would eliminate the perspective employee from being hired.


"Have you ever tried sugar... or PCP?"
[] Yes [] No

/RIP, Mitch Hedberg
 
2008-04-23 11:23:25 AM
mister aj: See, this is what happens when you have nanny state socialised healthcare ... wait, what?

At least with private healthcare you have a free market! After all, you're free to be unemployed.


I know your kidding but that argument always makes me think that person is a fool. Countries that have some sort of state involved healthcare have much higher rates of smoking and on top of which people can change jobs freely without worry about a 90 day no insurance period.
 
2008-04-23 11:23:33 AM
wage0048: FTFA: "We shouldn't have to give employers complete control over our private life so they can save a few dollars on medical care," he said.

If you choose to smoke, you can pay the extra premiums the insurance company charges to insure smokers. The company is not telling you not to smoke, they're asking you a question that has a direct impact on the premiums they (and you) will have to pay to insure you. If you lie on the form, you're essentially commiting insurance fraud.


I agree with you, and apparently so does the person you're quoting. Also FTFA: Lewis Maltby, president of the National Workrights Institute... sees no problem with employers trying to curb smoking. But he worries that the trend of cracking down on employees' unhealthy behavior is extending beyond tobacco use."

And there lies the rub for some smokers. They see the position (healthy workforce, decreased medical costs) as hypocritical when the standards are applied unevenly. This guy, a supposed advocate for employee rights, admits it outright.
 
2008-04-23 11:23:39 AM
the commodification of "health" is one of the greatest boondoggles of the last century and this one.

why? our notions of productivity, on which many of these claims rest, are based on the industrial metaphors of the second industrial revolution (and now the technological revolution). they are dependent on the notion that the average worker (not even the optimal worker) is one who is a machine, a perpetual motion machine, and that profit and production have only one valence: increase. these are inhuman processes, in that human beings are susceptible not only to sickness but death. another valence: regression, recession, termination. that human beings get sick and die is misconstrued, in this context, as both a commercial and industrial deficiency. said differently, we mis-take a human loss as a cost.

until we accept this notion, and accept it confidently as a fact of our humanity, we will be caught in the same arguments ad infinitum.
 
2008-04-23 11:23:55 AM
Duke_Phillips: Fark is so helpful, I've learned that the most persecuted people on the planet are white male Christians who smoke. Poor guys

Coffee, while delicious when ingested properly, is not so pleasant when it comes out your nose.

Well played sir.
 
2008-04-23 11:24:23 AM
What if they didn't smoke when they did the paperwork, but started after that?
 
2008-04-23 11:24:23 AM
Do you:

[ ] smoke cigarettes
[ ] smoke marijuana
[ ] drink alcohol
[ ] sky dive
[ ] rock climb
[ ] drink more than 2 cups of coffee a day
[ ] drink more than 2 cans of soda a day
[ ] exercise regularly
[ ] eat under cooked meat
[ ] eat fast food
[ ] ingest illicit substances
[ ] drive over the speed limit
[ ] jay walk
[ ] roll through stop signs
[ ] talk on cell phone while driving
[ ] always use your turn signals
[ ] put on make up while driving
[ ] travel more than 5 miles per week
[ ] travel more than 10 miles via highway or interstate per week
[ ] not wear a seat belt
[ ] ride a motorcycle
[ ] ride a motorcycle without a helmet
[ ] mountain bike
[ ] mountain bike without a helmet
[ ] own a pit bull
[ ] live near a pit bull
[ ] own any dangerous or exotic animal(s)
[ ] have unprotected sex
[ ] have anal sex
[ ] participate in group sex
[ ] use any other positions besides missionary
[ ] sleep less than 8 hours a night
[ ] sleep more than 8 hours a night
[ ] sun bathe with sunscreen (at least 15 spf)
[ ] fake bake with out sunscreen
[ ] go outside regularly
[ ] swim
[ ] use high dive
[ ] watch more than 10 hours of TV per week
[ ] surf internet porn
[ ] watch porn
[ ] participate in porn
[ ] Fark at work
[ ] utilize public transportation
[ ] fly often
[ ] travel
[ ] floss
[ ] brush teeth regularly
[ ] bathe and wash hands thoroughly
[ ] have good posture
[ ] have healthy self-esteem
[ ] have healthy self-respect
[ ] think for yourself
[ ] live near a large body of water
[ ] live near a large factory
[ ] wear comfortable shoes
[ ] do any other activities that we should know about
 
2008-04-23 11:24:42 AM
Harvey Birdman: isn't "cubicle dweller" usually the slur used by unemployed liberal arts majors, lib arts majors working as baristas customer service at starbucks, and the section of the workforce called manual laborers ?

Fixed that for ya.

/I refuse to acknowledge the fancy names people adopt for their jobs in an effort to sound better
//You're a trashman, not a sanitation engineer.
 
2008-04-23 11:24:50 AM
My employer has a similar policy. While I don't like the higher premium, I don't feel others should have to pay for my addiction.
 
2008-04-23 11:24:51 AM
if they ever check the bathrooms here for ejaculate, I am screwed.
 
2008-04-23 11:24:59 AM
Shakespeare's Monkey: So how at risk are you from second hand smoke? I take some friends out to dinner on Sunday and when we get back to their place they all smoke, kind bud too. It irritates my contacts, but that's about it. Hope I don't die soon.

There's no risk from occasional second hand smoke.
 
2008-04-23 11:25:25 AM
ThatGuyGreg: question_dj: So this raises the question of whether or not the employee would be allowed to smoke if they buy their own insurance policy and don't rely on the company to provide it.

No, no it doesn't raise that question at all. If you don't see the relevance of asking if you smoke on a health insurance form, please remove yourself from society now. I hear Wyoming is nice.


You're a moron. Nobody questioned the relevance.
 
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