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(CBS News)   Super Tuesday II discussion thread, part IV   (cbsnews.com) divider line 717
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6127 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Mar 2008 at 11:56 PM (6 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



717 Comments   (+0 »)
   

Archived thread
 
2008-03-05 12:06:37 AM  
Oh nm here is the new thread.
 
2008-03-05 12:07:18 AM  
WOOT

Numero quatro
 
2008-03-05 12:07:19 AM  
Second Boobies
 
2008-03-05 12:07:41 AM  
img410.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:07:47 AM  
I am sooo pissed right now. I was hoping Obama would have been able to get one of them...perhaps he'll still get Texas
 
2008-03-05 12:07:50 AM  
Why do they keep closing threads?
 
2008-03-05 12:07:51 AM  
I've never seen anything that went on to a fourth discussion thread before.
 
2008-03-05 12:07:57 AM  
Bah, make that third boobies.

/Still disappointed in Ohio.
 
2008-03-05 12:08:03 AM  
Shaggy_C: Just saying that some people really are too dumb to be CEOs. Some are too dumb to really do anything we consider white-collar today. Rather than say 'well, they should work at McDonalds', I say they get into a trade where they BUILD things, and help our overall economy by making us not a country of consumers but one of makers too. But...Maybe you'd rather we continue to turn soft and weak and send all of our important industry abroad, security risk be damned. I mean, shiat man...if we go to war in a major way, what the hell are we going to do when we have to depend on China to make our tanks for us?

Pay American laborers inflated wages for the same product sold in America. Who's wallet does that hurt genius? The 10,000 workers with fabricated jobs, or the millions of Americans that pay to subsidize jobs that the market doesn't want? And how easy will it to be to export said product if its cost is inflated.

You fail at economics. This is freaking basic and you fail.

Oh, but the fraudulent national security rhetoric was a nice touch.

However, that point also fails because you fail to realize that China cannot continue to thrive economically and drive its middle class without the social reforms that they will inevitably demand.

When was the last time we went to war with a liberal democracy.

Give it up Shaggy, you're simply outclassed here.

I guess Supply Side Jesus didn't cover that in his sermons.

Patience. I'm sure you'll have your chance to gas the Christians someday.
 
2008-03-05 12:08:13 AM  
Listening to rehashed McCain speech...

If Clinton wins the Nom... I def voting for him.
 
2008-03-05 12:08:13 AM  
testes
 
2008-03-05 12:08:19 AM  
MATT DAMON
 
2008-03-05 12:08:22 AM  
Murkanen: Why do they keep closing threads?

Stress on the server. Smaller thread, happier server
 
2008-03-05 12:08:34 AM  
Hmm maybe I'll ask here about this...

I don't know if this means anything or not, but when I look at the map on CNN it appears as though most of the Clinton strongholds are tapping out (other than Webb and El Paso) in terms of precincts reporting while ones where Obama has a major lead appear to have a ways to go, including the major population centres (where he appears to have a rather substantial lead). I don't quite understand why Harris is hanging at 14% for so long, though.

Still, she looks to be pulling ahead.
 
2008-03-05 12:08:34 AM  
Steals those second place boobies like Hillary is trying to steal the Democratic nomination.

MY TURN!111!
 
2008-03-05 12:08:40 AM  
Anyone hear Russert list the Obama memo?

Interesting.
 
2008-03-05 12:08:52 AM  
Well, this is even more epic that Super Duper Tuesday
 
2008-03-05 12:09:11 AM  
Matt Damon: MATT DAMON

Okay, I lol'd

Thanks for lightening the mood.
 
2008-03-05 12:09:26 AM  
At this point, my only fear is the perception that Obama lost tonight, when, in reality, he did everything he could, and will come out tomorrow with a substantial delegate lead. On that count, Hillary failed, miserably. However, looking at the front page of CNN, it sure doesn't look like that.
 
2008-03-05 12:09:33 AM  
Alright... here's the question for the Democratic Party. This race has split the party almost exactly in half. The question is, do you want the half that is primarily people born before 1960? Or do you want the half born after 1960? Consider what that means in 2012. In 2016. In 2020. Also, consider how many life-long Democrats become Republicans right about the time they get their AARP card. Think about it. Come up with a good answer before Denver.
 
2008-03-05 12:10:11 AM  
As far as Ohio, I just want Obama to get within 10% of Clinton. No double digit leads. I don't want anyone (other than Clinton, because she will) turning this into a mandate.
 
2008-03-05 12:10:13 AM  
Obama will win Texas.
 
2008-03-05 12:10:21 AM  
Darth_Lukecash:

I am sooo pissed right now. I was hoping Obama would have been able to get one of them...perhaps he'll still get Texas

He's winning in the giant metro areas while Clinton is winning in the fly-over part of Texas. Plus there is the caucus which is where he does his best.

/2 of the largest counties in OH still need to get their votes in as well, so that gap will only shrink
 
2008-03-05 12:10:39 AM  
Four? Wow. It's like some sort of record.


/Damn you Ohio!
//We still have Texas. I hope...
 
2008-03-05 12:10:45 AM  
Curious Hussein.
 
2008-03-05 12:10:55 AM  
C'mon, Texas, get your act together. My buds told me you were cool.
 
2008-03-05 12:11:09 AM  
Richardson and Edwards better get off their asses and make up their minds about who they are going to endorse. If they keep waiting it will only make them look like they are waiting for a victor to make a stand.
 
2008-03-05 12:11:29 AM  
Comeon Texas! Obama needs you!
 
2008-03-05 12:11:35 AM  
Let's not forget that Ohio was responsible for "re-electing" Bush. Yup, a state full of winners there...
 
2008-03-05 12:11:38 AM  
locopolitico, you are the first person to use an image of mine in a thread!

/Tried to post in the last thread, got shutout
 
2008-03-05 12:11:38 AM  
Ohio: Most of the rural bumfark Clinton counties that count their votes on their fingers and toes (or in some cases an abacus, if the total exceeds 17) have fully reported. The cities, where they count the votes on a 1974 Texas Instruments pocket calculator supplemented with a chalkboard are still only half-counted. Watching the results over the past couple hours, the margin's been narrowing, and I expect it'll end up closer to the pre-primary polls.

Fark Ohio anyway.

Especially Cuyahoga County, the map of which appears in the dictionary next to "Corruption". Chicago electoral politics? Phfffft. Please.

Texas: No caucus results reported yet.
 
2008-03-05 12:11:59 AM  
1000 Hurts: At this point, my only fear is the perception that Obama lost tonight, when, in reality, he did everything he could, and will come out tomorrow with a substantial delegate lead. On that count, Hillary failed, miserably. However, looking at the front page of CNN, it sure doesn't look like that.

you expected something different from the clinton news network?
 
2008-03-05 12:12:16 AM  
Shame on you Ohio!, shame on you!
 
2008-03-05 12:12:27 AM  
This will end up being the first brokered convention in my lifetime. I'll be watching that with great interest.
 
2008-03-05 12:12:29 AM  
barcaboy: Obama will win Texas.

I agree. Once Dallas and Austin start coming in Clinton's 1-3 point lead will disappear in a heartbeat.
 
2008-03-05 12:12:30 AM  
Obama for CHangE...
 
2008-03-05 12:12:36 AM  
Hillary is growing her lead in TX. We're farked.
 
2008-03-05 12:12:39 AM  
1000 Hurts: At this point, my only fear is the perception that Obama lost tonight, when, in reality, he did everything he could, and will come out tomorrow with a substantial delegate lead. On that count, Hillary failed, miserably. However, looking at the front page of CNN, it sure doesn't look like that.

It won't, but the truth is still there, she will need 65% of all the remaining contests to win this, and tonight just made it harder for her, small wins and ties are bad for her, she needed to win this big.

If the story about the 50 delegates getting ready to endorse Obama is true, he'll steal her media coverage, too.
 
2008-03-05 12:12:44 AM  
Hillary is up in Texas by 2% on cnn's count.

I bet republicans were voting for Hillary to prolong the race.
 
2008-03-05 12:13:00 AM  
Obama will squeak by in the popular vote in TX

But all signs seem to indicate he will stomp her on the delegate count.

It is very possible that Obama will be able to claim that he has widened his delegate lead against Clinton, that's all he'll need to start brining some Supers on board.
 
2008-03-05 12:13:09 AM  
Anyone know when the Texas caucus results start coming in?
 
2008-03-05 12:13:15 AM  
Echoic: Anyone hear Russert list the Obama memo?

Interesting.


Explain.
 
2008-03-05 12:13:16 AM  
All right, so what's left it this plays out all the way?
Here's my gut calls (haven't checked polls, just going on gut)
North Carolina -- Obama
Mississippi -- Obama
Pennsylvania -- Edge: Clinton
Indiana -- Obama
S Dakota -- Haven't a clue
Kentucky -- Edge: Obama
Oregon -- Obama

Agree? Disagree?
 
2008-03-05 12:13:28 AM  
krunvisaurus: Shame on you Ohio!, shame on you!

Screw you Hippie. We delivered our County, and did it well.

Blame the rest of the state. We did our part
 
2008-03-05 12:13:46 AM  
Adolf Oliver Nipples: This will end up being the first brokered convention in my lifetime. I'll be watching that with great interest.

There will be no brokered convention. It's basically impossible. There are only two candidates to vote for - one of them will get over 50% on the first ballot. A brokered convention means no one gets to 50% on the first ballot, and that requires more than 2 nominees. I really don't think John Edwards 26 delegates will make the difference.
 
2008-03-05 12:13:48 AM  
Palmer Eldritch: I've never seen anything that went on to a fourth discussion thread before.

In the good ole days, the thread used to just keep going. I think the top thread has 4k+ comments.
 
2008-03-05 12:13:50 AM  
IAmAGodWarrior: Your entire post is full of fail. If you complete the scenario you depicted above, blue collar wokrewrs have more money in their pockets, genius. china cant contain its growth? watch it. regulation of currency and boom in manufacturing jobs.

Weak rebuttal. You didn't read what I wrote and/or you can't do the math.

10,000 workers with more money in their pockets doesn't offset the millions paying more for the inflated cost of product X, and the opportunity cost of failed trade overseas due to inflated cost. Math is your friend.

china cant contain its growth?

Never wrote this. You missed the point entirely.
 
2008-03-05 12:13:52 AM  
img510.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:14:03 AM  
Digeratus: Anyone know when the Texas caucus results start coming in?

June/July

(Seriously)
 
2008-03-05 12:14:05 AM  
DamnYankees: Hillary is growing her lead in TX. We're farked.

Really? CNN just had her lead go from 51-48 to 50-48, 64% reporting.
 
2008-03-05 12:14:26 AM  
USP .45: Shaggy_C: Just saying that some people really are too dumb to be CEOs. Some are too dumb to really do anything we consider white-collar today. Rather than say 'well, they should work at McDonalds', I say they get into a trade where they BUILD things, and help our overall economy by making us not a country of consumers but one of makers too. But...Maybe you'd rather we continue to turn soft and weak and send all of our important industry abroad, security risk be damned. I mean, shiat man...if we go to war in a major way, what the hell are we going to do when we have to depend on China to make our tanks for us?

Pay American laborers inflated wages for the same product sold in America. Who's wallet does that hurt genius? The 10,000 workers with fabricated jobs, or the millions of Americans that pay to subsidize jobs that the market doesn't want? And how easy will it to be to export said product if its cost is inflated.

You fail at economics. This is freaking basic and you fail.

Oh, but the fraudulent national security rhetoric was a nice touch.

However, that point also fails because you fail to realize that China cannot continue to thrive economically and drive its middle class without the social reforms that they will inevitably demand.

When was the last time we went to war with a liberal democracy.

Give it up Shaggy, you're simply outclassed here.

I guess Supply Side Jesus didn't cover that in his sermons.

Patience. I'm sure you'll have your chance to gas the Christians someday.


This post is filled with a rather large amount of fail.

Much like stock portfolios, or any such investment..it is very, VERY important not to put your eggs in one baskets economic wise. If one fails, then the other can help keep the economies running.
 
2008-03-05 12:14:28 AM  
There are SOOOOO many precincts still not counted. It ain't over yet, folks.

Even Ohio isn't actually done counting. Wouldn't it be funny if ... ;)
 
2008-03-05 12:14:32 AM  
The US Postal Service has issued a recall of a stamp they created with a picture of Hillary Clinton to honor her achievements while serving as the First Lady of our nation. The problem was discovered when claims had been made that the stamp was not sticking to envelopes, and that mail which had been sent using the "Hillary" postage was not being delivered. Senator Clinton demanded a full investigation into the allegations. A special Postal Service Investigation team was formed and after several months and many dollars spent, made the following findings:
1.The stamp was manufactured properly.
2.There was nothing wrong with the adhesive.
3. People were just spitting on the wrong side
 
2008-03-05 12:14:36 AM  
About to imbibe in my beverage of choice.
www.evanwilliams.com
 
2008-03-05 12:14:38 AM  
mddawso: Hillary is up in Texas by 2% on cnn's count.

I bet republicans were voting for Hillary to prolong the race.


I think they actually were the difference. Rush succeeded. Ridiculous.

quisqueyano: S Dakota -- Haven't a clue

Obama easily.
 
2008-03-05 12:14:40 AM  
I should have bought more beer tonight.
 
2008-03-05 12:14:55 AM  
quisqueyano: All right, so what's left it this plays out all the way?
Here's my gut calls (haven't checked polls, just going on gut)
North Carolina -- Obama
Mississippi -- Obama
Pennsylvania -- Edge: Clinton
Indiana -- Obama
S Dakota -- Haven't a clueObama
Kentucky -- Edge: Obama
Oregon -- Obama

Agree? Disagree?


Now I agree
 
2008-03-05 12:14:56 AM  
images.jupiterimages.com
 
2008-03-05 12:15:32 AM  
Pew Research on Obama Lead Problems (new window)

I still stand by my opinion.

If Clinton wins the nom, the Obama voters either vote Democrat, stay home, or go 3rd party.

If Obama wins the nom, the Clinton voters are going to vote McCain.

Either way, Obama doesn't win the general election.

I have no idea who wins a Clinton v. McCain battle, btw.
 
2008-03-05 12:15:36 AM  
Pretty amazing there are 4 threads for this. This political season is pretty amazing.
 
2008-03-05 12:15:55 AM  
ValisIV: If the story about the 50 delegates getting ready to endorse Obama is true, he'll steal her media coverage, too.

I really can't see many Obama delegates jumping ship to the Clinton campaign. However, I can see people ditching Clinton after her gutter politics get old. Which takes about 10 minutes of listening to Bill's chicanery.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:03 AM  
Darth_Lukecash: This post is filled with a rather large amount of fail.

Much like stock portfolios, or any such investment..it is very, VERY important not to put your eggs in one baskets economic wise. If one fails, then the other can help keep the economies running.


So you're saying our economy currently isn't diverse enough? Yeah, you got it.

Counterfail.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:04 AM  
I also want to add that I utterly hate CNN's coverage of this election, but their map is cooler than hell.

/I wish they'd stop sucking off Hillary every chance they get
//it's creepy as she isn't supposed to have a penis
 
2008-03-05 12:16:08 AM  
i245.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 12:16:10 AM  
SpinStopper: There are SOOOOO many precincts still not counted. It ain't over yet, folks.

Even Ohio isn't actually done counting. Wouldn't it be funny if ... ;)


I doubt it will happen, but if it does, that would be a laugh riot.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:11 AM  
Shadow Blasko: Digeratus: Anyone know when the Texas caucus results start coming in?

June/July

(Seriously)


WHA? Olberman said "Friday".
 
2008-03-05 12:16:13 AM  
img182.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:16:23 AM  
scoughlin: you expected something different from the clinton news network?

holy shiat i haven't heard CNN called that in years.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:24 AM  
Well, it looks like my brother needs to switch parties to vote in North Carolina.

/is there anything about Ohio that doesn't suck
//Their football team certainly does
 
2008-03-05 12:16:29 AM  
And last I heard, -none- of the TX caucus numbers were in yet.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:30 AM  
robsul82: Explain.

They had a 'bootleg' memo from the Obama campaign laying out predictions for tonight and every state until Denver. The memo said they'd lose Ohio and Texas and RI and win Vermont (and pretty much exactly by what the margins are looking to be) and have been historically right in all the past primaries in the previous memos. The memo laid out their expectations for all the next states up to Denver and according to their estimates, the pledged delegate lead will still rest strongly with Obama by Denver.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:32 AM  
Okay. I guess I'll have to be the one to say it. Old people and those who live in rural areas shouldn't have the right to vote.

/Sadness is for POOR people
 
2008-03-05 12:16:43 AM  
Seems like the question here is "Can Houston (and to a lesser extent the rest of Austin and Dallas) beat San Antonio and El Paso?"
 
2008-03-05 12:16:46 AM  
DulceEtDecorumEst: 1.The stamp was manufactured properly.
2.There was nothing wrong with the adhesive.
3. People were just spitting on the wrong side


Do they make stamps you have to lick anymore?
 
2008-03-05 12:16:53 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: And last I heard, -none- of the TX caucus numbers were in yet.

Correct. The Texas numbers are entirely of the primary.
 
2008-03-05 12:16:59 AM  
Somewhere, Al Gore is snickering. Brockered convention, indeed.
 
2008-03-05 12:17:31 AM  
img508.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:17:44 AM  
Echoic: robsul82: Explain.

They had a 'bootleg' memo from the Obama campaign laying out predictions for tonight and every state until Denver. The memo said they'd lose Ohio and Texas and RI and win Vermont (and pretty much exactly by what the margins are looking to be) and have been historically right in all the past primaries in the previous memos. The memo laid out their expectations for all the next states up to Denver and according to their estimates, the pledged delegate lead will still rest strongly with Obama by Denver.


Ah, cool stuff.

Next, explain how a scary monster head put over Obama's head infers someone being "overrated" to that Farker who just got PS.
 
2008-03-05 12:17:45 AM  
Echoic: robsul82: Explain.

They had a 'bootleg' memo from the Obama campaign laying out predictions for tonight and every state until Denver. The memo said they'd lose Ohio and Texas and RI and win Vermont (and pretty much exactly by what the margins are looking to be) and have been historically right in all the past primaries in the previous memos. The memo laid out their expectations for all the next states up to Denver and according to their estimates, the pledged delegate lead will still rest strongly with Obama by Denver.


Their super tuesday memo actually undersold them - they did better than their internal numbers said.
 
2008-03-05 12:18:01 AM  
Palmer Eldritch:

I've never seen anything that went on to a fourth discussion thread before.

The only thing that I've ever seen like this were the California Wildfire threads. IIRC, they went to six, maybe even seven threads.

Come on, Texas...please, make us look better :)
 
2008-03-05 12:18:05 AM  
(Brokered convention, even.)

Also, here's a question: Do you think of the Dem. candidates are going to break the cardinal rule of not announcing a running mate before clinching?
 
2008-03-05 12:18:06 AM  
photos.imageevent.com
 
2008-03-05 12:18:17 AM  
Digeratus: Anyone know when the Texas caucus results start coming in?

There are still parts of Texas that are actually still caucusing, so no clue here.
 
2008-03-05 12:18:20 AM  
This was probably asked three threads ago, but why does Texas have this nutty system of primaries AND caucuses? And how does deleate allocation work with it?

I've been watching for the last hour and it seems like it's been stuck at 50-CLinton and 48-Obama in Texas
 
2008-03-05 12:18:31 AM  
Tweets Pie: About to imbibe in my beverage of choice.

switch it JAck and I'll join you.
Not very pleased at the moment.
 
2008-03-05 12:18:46 AM  
What grieves me the most though is that if Clinton wins the nomination it will set back the Democratic Party and the United States for decades. We have seen millions of new voter registrations, millions of new voters, voting Democratic. Millions of people who had never voted before or hadn't voted for years started to believe in the political process again. New turnout records being set in nearly every single primary and caucus, many states doubling and even tripling normal. Where turnout was highest, Obama won and often won by landslides.

If Clinton does "win" the nomination using Rove/Bush tactics what do you think all of those millions will do? If Change is defeated and suppressed by trickery, dishonesty, and Old Politics, why should any of those millions stay engaged in politics. Some will, to be sure, but not many. I suspect that for most of those people who got excited about politics, started to believe that people could make a difference, if Clinton's Rove/Bush tactics prove triumphant, they will turn off and tune out. I doubt they will return any time soon.
 
2008-03-05 12:18:47 AM  
farm3.static.flickr.com
 
2008-03-05 12:19:02 AM  
franjime: Pew Research on Obama Lead Problems (new window)

I still stand by my opinion.

If Clinton wins the nom, the Obama voters either vote Democrat, stay home, or go 3rd party.

If Obama wins the nom, the Clinton voters are going to vote McCain.

Either way, Obama doesn't win the general election.

I have no idea who wins a Clinton v. McCain battle, btw.


Problem is this: Hillary can win the nom only through deceit and tricky and dirty deeds. I mean, the maths dont add up in her favor. It will look like, and it will be like, she stole the nom -- she can't win it without some serious behind the scenes bullshiat.

Hillary would be a disaster. You think Bush farked things up? OMFG, Hillary's administration will be a complete clusterfark.
 
2008-03-05 12:19:02 AM  
Hillary was finishing up a day as Senator for New York when the Devil suddenly appeared in her office and made her an offer...
"I am here to offer you a deal," the Devil said. "I will give you unlimited wealth, even more power, and a media that will pander to your every whim.

In return, all I ask for is your soul, the souls of every member of your family, and the souls of all your constituents."

Hillary pondered for a moment and then asked, "Unlimited wealth and power?"

"Absolutely unlimited," the Devil asserted.

"A pandering media?" she asked.

"They'll fall over themselves to support you, no matter what you say or do," the Devil assured.

"And you want my soul, my family's souls, and the souls of my constituents?" she asked.

"Yes. All of them," the Devil answered.

Hillary was deep in thought for a moment, then finally spoke:

"So...what's the catch?"
 
2008-03-05 12:19:06 AM  
GreenPlastik: Also, here's a question: Do you think of the Dem. candidates are going to break the cardinal rule of not announcing a running mate before clinching?

Hell no. If someone backed the losing side it would effectively kill any future ambitions they had.
 
2008-03-05 12:19:06 AM  
i257.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 12:19:12 AM  
robsul82:
Next, explain how a scary monster head put over Obama's head infers someone being "overrated" to that Farker who just got PS.


Because black people are demons?
 
2008-03-05 12:19:15 AM  
Staying up past my bedtime in hopes I can see the polls figure out who won in Texas.. still have to retire soon though.

In the mean time everyone!
img401.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:19:28 AM  
img182.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:20:04 AM  
keck314:

Seems like the question here is "Can Houston (and to a lesser extent the rest of Austin and Dallas) beat San Antonio and El Paso?"


I sure hope we can...
 
2008-03-05 12:20:09 AM  
poohneat: i257.photobucket.com

No .. no we dont
 
2008-03-05 12:20:10 AM  
OBAMA!!!

PLEASE BUST OUT THAT LIST OF 50 SUPERDELEGATES TONIGHT!!!

STEAL HILLARY'S THUNDER!!!

PLEASE!!!
 
2008-03-05 12:20:15 AM  
Flying Lasagna Monster

That made me giggle.
 
2008-03-05 12:20:16 AM  
IAmAGodWarrior: USP .45:

10,000 workers with only an extra $10 in thewir pocket is 1 mil. (more than $10 = your math is terrible).

obviously you have no clue how economy works, and thats OK. in a couple of years, when youre a bit older, youll get it.

good talk, kiddo.


Really? Then I suggest you go whine to every economist that understands the following graph:

jerryslezak.net
 
2008-03-05 12:20:22 AM  
Chuck Todd on MSNBC. He's always good.
 
2008-03-05 12:20:22 AM  
I really hope this doesn't fark Obama up. He's run his entire campaign almost completely clean without having to attack anyone, play scare tactics, any of that shiat, and I really don't wanna see him pushed into playing smear politics to regain lost momentum against the Hillabeast.
 
2008-03-05 12:20:27 AM  
GreenPlastik: Somewhere, Al Gore is snickering. Brockered convention, indeed.

I don't understand what is meant by a brokered convention - is the idea that the difference in delegates will be smaller than the number John Edwards has? Otherwise, the "brokering" will just be how the superdelegates go, right?
 
2008-03-05 12:20:27 AM  
ginger_fretelli: Tweets Pie: About to imbibe in my beverage of choice.

switch it JAck and I'll join you.
Not very pleased at the moment.


Cheers on Jack!
 
2008-03-05 12:20:35 AM  
Ringshadow: Staying up past my bedtime in hopes I can see the polls figure out who won in Texas.. still have to retire soon though.

In the mean time everyone!

CORGIS!


Ringshadow, you rock. Seriously. Corgis make everything better.
 
2008-03-05 12:20:42 AM  
USP .45: Shaggy_C: Just saying that some people really are too dumb to be CEOs. Some are too dumb to really do anything we consider white-collar today. Rather than say 'well, they should work at McDonalds', I say they get into a trade where they BUILD things, and help our overall economy by making us not a country of consumers but one of makers too. But...Maybe you'd rather we continue to turn soft and weak and send all of our important industry abroad, security risk be damned. I mean, shiat man...if we go to war in a major way, what the hell are we going to do when we have to depend on China to make our tanks for us?

Pay American laborers inflated wages for the same product sold in America. Who's wallet does that hurt genius? The 10,000 workers with fabricated jobs, or the millions of Americans that pay to subsidize jobs that the market doesn't want? And how easy will it to be to export said product if its cost is inflated.

You fail at economics. This is freaking basic and you fail.

Oh, but the fraudulent national security rhetoric was a nice touch.

However, that point also fails because you fail to realize that China cannot continue to thrive economically and drive its middle class without the social reforms that they will inevitably demand.

When was the last time we went to war with a liberal democracy.

Give it up Shaggy, you're simply outclassed here.

I guess Supply Side Jesus didn't cover that in his sermons.

Patience. I'm sure you'll have your chance to gas the Christians someday.


You'd have a point if what you say has any relation to anything that happens in the real world. You laissez faire capitalists are no better than communists when it comes to realizing that your ideas look pretty on paper but utterly fail to take into account human nature. We lose manufacturing and other jobs that support the working class and middle class because we're not willing to enforce our standard on our trading partners and we DO get cheaper products to buy. . .at the cost of having proportionally even less to spend on them. Basically we reward other countries for having crappy labor practices.
 
2008-03-05 12:21:03 AM  
Someone tell Lou Dobbs he doesn't know WTF he's talking about when he says that Obama's delegate lead is "not insurmountable."
 
2008-03-05 12:21:06 AM  
Hillary will gain 5-9 Ohio; that's really not that many. Obama can easily make that up in the Texas caucuses.
 
2008-03-05 12:21:39 AM  
http://www.fightliberals.com/

Your Conservative Breed: Anti-government Gunslinger

You are an Anti-government Gunslinger, also known as a libertarian conservative. You believe in smaller government, states' rights, gun rights, and that, as Reagan once said, "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"

---

http://www.fightconservatives.com/

Your Liberal Breed: Peace Patroller

You are a Peace Patroller, also known as an anti-war liberal or neo-hippie. You believe in putting an end to American imperial conquest, stopping wars that have already been lost, and supporting our troops by bringing them home.

---

Hah, both those quizzes are pretty funny.
 
2008-03-05 12:21:46 AM  
Number41: GreenPlastik: Somewhere, Al Gore is snickering. Brockered convention, indeed.

I don't understand what is meant by a brokered convention - is the idea that the difference in delegates will be smaller than the number John Edwards has? Otherwise, the "brokering" will just be how the superdelegates go, right?


Correct. The term brokered convention is wrong. There is almost 0 chance of a brokered convention for the Dems.
 
2008-03-05 12:21:52 AM  
DamnYankees: Chuck Todd on MSNBC. He's always good.

Yeah, that crazy Chuck Todd, who believes in silly things like math, probability, and logic, refusing to get on the HILLARY COMEBACK OMGWTFBBQ!!!!11 train. Farking weirdo.
 
2008-03-05 12:21:58 AM  
USP .45: Darth_Lukecash: This post is filled with a rather large amount of fail.

Much like stock portfolios, or any such investment..it is very, VERY important not to put your eggs in one baskets economic wise. If one fails, then the other can help keep the economies running.

So you're saying our economy currently isn't diverse enough? Yeah, you got it.

Counterfail.


Because turing our economy into a predominantly service-based one while farming out the entire manufacturing base will never come back to haunt us.

FAIL.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:13 AM  
WOOOOHHHOOOO.....thread number 8 biatches!

Ross Perot for vice president....his motto was change also.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:14 AM  
popstop: This was probably asked three threads ago, but why does Texas have this nutty system of primaries AND caucuses? And how does deleate allocation work with it?

I've been watching for the last hour and it seems like it's been stuck at 50-CLinton and 48-Obama in Texas


It's funny, because one of the resolutions we introduced tonight was to do away with the caucus system in Texas. People cheered wildly at the thought.

The other was a resolution to end the Israeli-Palestinian conflict. By a resolution. So...yeah. Texas is gonna sort that shiat out real quick.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:19 AM  
Wow. I almost never watch TV news any more.

But tonight I turned on CNN for some hot, sweaty speechifyin'.

CNN just played a "Tell the House of Representatives to pass the TERRORIST SURVEILLANCE BILL and KEEP US ALL SAFE!!!!11|one!NINE!ELEVENTY!!!!" ad that I sincerely thought was a parody, until I realized it was coming not from YouTube, but out of the TV during the news.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:27 AM  
DamnYankees: Hillary will gain 5-9 Ohio; that's really not that many. Obama can easily make that up in the Texas caucuses.

yeah, it might end up being closer than it looks. I like how npr is holding out on calling it.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:28 AM  
Chuck Todd saying its actually really likely Obama gains delegates tonight, even if he loses OH and TX primaries.

He has still *never* lost a delegate race on any individual day.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:31 AM  
Hey, USP .45, catch.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:31 AM  
DamnYankees: Pretty amazing there are 4 threads for this. This political season is pretty amazing.

Yeah, it's been very entertaining. I've thoroughly enjoyed it, especially the conversations I've been having within the family. You guys are pretty entertaining, as well.

It's easy for me to sit back and enjoy it because my guy is already in, and it's just a waiting game to see what the Dems are going to do with all this mess.

Do any of you think he should go Independent if he doesn't make the primary?
 
2008-03-05 12:22:43 AM  
Calvin Coolidge: Someone tell Lou Dobbs he doesn't know WTF he's talking about when he says that Obama's delegate lead is "not insurmountable."

He knows exactly what he's talking about. He's talking about the fact that a contested and ongoing Democratic primary means higher ratings. Note how everyone is daring Obama to go negative on her and saying that he has to "hit back" and that they are shushing anyone who reminds us of the fact that in the end, the party really can't go against the delegate leader (likely, Obama).
 
2008-03-05 12:22:47 AM  
Woo! Where's thread #5!
 
2008-03-05 12:22:49 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: Ringshadow: Staying up past my bedtime in hopes I can see the polls figure out who won in Texas.. still have to retire soon though.

In the mean time everyone!

CORGIS!

Ringshadow, you rock. Seriously. Corgis make everything better.


yes, that was funny.

But if i had the skill, I'd go an put Obama faces on all of the puppies. Or I'd take that scary thing on Obama's face and put them on all the puppies. Or Hillary's face and put them on all the puppies. Different captions.

Hillary's would have something to do with biatches though.
 
2008-03-05 12:22:54 AM  
franjime: If Obama wins the nom, the Clinton voters are going to vote McCain.

I tried to respond to this massive amount of Fail in the last thread, but I'll try again here.

Clinton voters are the Party-before-principle folks who will vote for whoever has a D next to their name when election day rolls around. Obama's supporters are primarily the independent thinkers and young voters who would rather vote for someone that best supports their ideology, or not vote at all, than they are to vote for someone they disagree with (if not outright hate).

Pissing off independents is how you lose elections, and Hillary has been pissing them off for almost 2 decades.
 
2008-03-05 12:23:33 AM  
USP .45: 10,000 workers with more money in their pockets doesn't offset the millions paying more for the inflated cost of product X, and the opportunity cost of failed trade overseas due to inflated cost. Math is your friend.

Labor is only a fraction of the cost of a product. Math IS your friend. Look at real world math. Look at what actually happens rather than your incomplete, poorly understood and ultimately discredited theories.
 
2008-03-05 12:23:36 AM  
Bhasayate: Hillary would be a disaster. You think Bush farked things up? OMFG, Hillary's administration will be a complete clusterfark.

Hillary could walk around stinking drunk all day and do better than Bush has done the last few years.

Having said that, I always thought the real brains of the Clinton pair was wearing the pantsuits anyway.
 
2008-03-05 12:23:37 AM  
You laissez faire capitalists are no better than communists when it comes to realizing that your ideas look pretty on paper but utterly fail to take into account human nature. We lose manufacturing and other jobs that support the working class and middle class because we're not willing to enforce our standard on our trading partners and we DO get cheaper products to buy. . .at the cost of having proportionally even less to spend on them. Basically we reward other countries for having crappy labor practices.

www.fallacyfiles.org
 
2008-03-05 12:23:46 AM  
img216.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:23:51 AM  
Republicans might just have a chance!

img239.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:24:26 AM  
So how does it feel to do Rush Limbaugh's bidding, Ohio?

Rush knows exactly what he's doing. Clinton will be a lot easier to beat in November.
 
2008-03-05 12:24:30 AM  
Texas Caucuses in:

Obama 56%
Clinton 43%

5% reporting
 
2008-03-05 12:24:31 AM  
Shadow Blasko: krunvisaurus: Shame on you Ohio!, shame on you!

Screw you Hippie. We delivered our County, and did it well.

Blame the rest of the state. We did our part


Nice try ass munch, at least my state, MD, delivered.

Is there any way your county can break away from the shiathole that is ohio and join our fair state?
 
2008-03-05 12:25:09 AM  
56-44 Obama, 5%, Texas Caucus, CNN
 
2008-03-05 12:25:15 AM  
img239.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:25:19 AM  
CNN is starting to report Texas caucus results. Gobama.
 
2008-03-05 12:25:22 AM  
Wow, finally Joe Scarborough and Robertson are gone - the panel is now good.
 
2008-03-05 12:25:24 AM  
tomwilson: Hey, USP .45, catch.

Now apply that to China.
 
2008-03-05 12:25:42 AM  
popstop: This was probably asked three threads ago, but why does Texas have this nutty system of primaries AND caucuses? And how does deleate allocation work with it?

I've been watching for the last hour and it seems like it's been stuck at 50-CLinton and 48-Obama in Texas


Two thirds of delegates in TX are determined by the primary. One third comes from the result of the caucus. Different congressional districts have different numbers of delegates. Those numbers are based on the number of people who voted Dem in the last presidential election. Hence why the Austin/Travis country area has so many delegates.

As for why -- I have no farking clue.
 
2008-03-05 12:25:51 AM  
BuckTurgidson: Wow. I almost never watch TV news any more.

But tonight I turned on CNN for some hot, sweaty speechifyin'.

CNN just played a "Tell the House of Representatives to pass the TERRORIST SURVEILLANCE BILL and KEEP US ALL SAFE!!!!11|one!NINE!ELEVENTY!!!!" ad that I sincerely thought was a parody, until I realized it was coming not from YouTube, but out of the TV during the news.


Did you also notice that the picture is now in color?
 
2008-03-05 12:26:02 AM  
cmartine: Republicans might just have a chance!


She'd be loose to mccain? So is she that big, or is he that small?
 
2008-03-05 12:26:02 AM  
DELEGATES TO THE RESCUE =)

TX (C) 5%

Obama 56%
Clinton 44%

TX (P) 66%
Clinton 50%
Obama 48%
 
2008-03-05 12:26:09 AM  
Though for the record, I still think it very unlikely that Clinton will make a big enough comeback to get the nomination. Rush will do his best to help her though.
 
2008-03-05 12:26:27 AM  
Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?
 
2008-03-05 12:26:44 AM  
If it's close, or even if Obama loses Texas population-wise, he'll likely still get more delegates from Texas. This is because Texas weights delegates to regions that voted Democrat in the last general election. Since Hillary is relying, in part, on Hispanics and ditto-heads, she's getting poorly weighted votes relative to Obama.

But, the fact that she'll probably stay in until Pennsylvania or beyond due to the moral boost still sucks.
 
2008-03-05 12:27:08 AM  
franjime: Bhasayate: Hillary would be a disaster. You think Bush farked things up? OMFG, Hillary's administration will be a complete clusterfark.

Hillary could walk around stinking drunk all day and do better than Bush has done the last few years.

Having said that, I always thought the real brains of the Clinton pair was wearing the pantsuits anyway.


No, I doubt that. Not given the campaign she's running. And the resistance to her would be immense. And she'd not handle it well. She's spaz out and freak out and be a moran, of course of a different sort. She'd be a total control freak spazo. She'd get the "doesn't play well with others" award. Her mere presence in the White House would really be extremely problematic, I think.

And I'm just sick of Bushes and Clintons, too.
 
2008-03-05 12:27:18 AM  
i266.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 12:27:30 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: Two thirds of delegates in TX are determined by the primary. One third comes from the result of the caucus. Different congressional districts have different numbers of delegates. Those numbers are based on the number of people who voted Dem in the last presidential election. Hence why the Austin/Travis country area has so many delegates.

Vote early! Vote often!
 
2008-03-05 12:27:36 AM  
Texas - don't fail like Ohio.. please...
 
2008-03-05 12:28:01 AM  
The interesting thing about Obama is that he's selling his entire pointo of view on "change". Brilliant from a marketing perspective, yet hollow. Of course, most people want change. What they don't realize yet, if ever, is that the change that Obama wants, isn't necessarily the change that they would want.

"Do something; anything!" is a strategy of a failed thinker. "Anything" can quite often turn out to be something you don't agree with, even if you think you wanted someone to change something.


Learn the issues, educate yourself, and THEN vote. If you're too stupid/lazy to understand WHAT you are voting for, please seriosly consider not voting, because quite honestly, you aren't qualified to have an opinion.

No, really. Stay home unless you educate yourself.
 
2008-03-05 12:28:07 AM  
quisqueyano: All right, so what's left it this plays out all the way?
Here's my gut calls (haven't checked polls, just going on gut)
North Carolina -- Obama
Mississippi -- Obama
Pennsylvania -- Edge: Clinton
Indiana -- Obama
S Dakota -- Haven't a clue
Kentucky -- Edge: Obama
Oregon -- Obama

Agree? Disagree?


Wyoming, Montana, and Oregon: big-time Obama wins

Mississippi: pretty likely for Obama, but not by much, particularly if there is GOP tactical voting for Hillary.

Indiana, Kentucky, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, W.Va: Ties for Obama at best. Could lose all by 5%. Maybe he takes NC due to Research Triangle area? But, I think Virginia was the outlier in the mid-Atlantic. Lower education levels seem to be key, so expect Hillary to do a lot of the same things she did in Ohio.

South Dakota: in the middle of a bunch of Obama states. The wild card is that a *big* chunk of the Democratic vote in SD are Native Americans, both on and off reservation. Not sure how they will tend, but suspect Obama takes the state.

Guam? Puerto Rico? No idea at all.

No way Clinton gains more than a 25 point spread in pledged delegates from here, and the rest of the primary season could well be exactly 50/50, so Obama's margin now is his margin in Denver.

Gore, Edwards, and Richardson? It's your baby now....
 
2008-03-05 12:28:11 AM  
First Texas caucus results in...5% reporting, 56-44 Obama.
 
2008-03-05 12:28:11 AM  
1000 Hurts: At this point, my only fear is the perception that Obama lost tonight, when, in reality, he did everything he could, and will come out tomorrow with a substantial delegate lead. On that count, Hillary failed, miserably. However, looking at the front page of CNN, it sure doesn't look like that.

Obama worshiping media my ass
 
2008-03-05 12:28:13 AM  
patrick767: Though for the record, I still think it very unlikely that Clinton will make a big enough comeback to get the nomination. Rush will do his best to help her though.

Do you really think that Rush influenced many people to vote for Hillary? That's a farking joke man. Get off it.
 
2008-03-05 12:28:13 AM  
Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire
 
2008-03-05 12:28:21 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: Ringshadow, you rock. Seriously. Corgis make everything better.

GLEE!
Here you go.

img216.imageshack.us
img117.imageshack.us
img225.imageshack.us

Positive waves, everyone. Positive waves.
 
2008-03-05 12:28:24 AM  
Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

Probably in the 5% range.

Of course, having the most stressful job in the world isn't going to do him much good. But the old folks will feel good about him, and that's what's important.
 
2008-03-05 12:28:39 AM  
patrick767: ThisIsNotSubtle: Two thirds of delegates in TX are determined by the primary. One third comes from the result of the caucus. Different congressional districts have different numbers of delegates. Those numbers are based on the number of people who voted Dem in the last presidential election. Hence why the Austin/Travis country area has so many delegates.

Vote early! Vote often!


*snicker* And since Texas also has early voting -- yeah, that's been the theme.
 
2008-03-05 12:28:44 AM  
img341.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 12:28:59 AM  
Psychohazard: If it's close, or even if Obama loses Texas population-wise, he'll likely still get more delegates from Texas. This is because Texas weights delegates to regions that voted Democrat in the last general election. Since Hillary is relying, in part, on Hispanics and ditto-heads, she's getting poorly weighted votes relative to Obama.

But, the fact that she'll probably stay in until Pennsylvania or beyond due to the moral boost still sucks.


That is seriously eff'd up. Like grading a class on a curve derived from the last class. Why don't we just burn the candidates at the stake to see if they are truly worthy?
 
2008-03-05 12:29:12 AM  
Ringshadow: Staying up past my bedtime in hopes I can see the polls figure out who won in Texas.. still have to retire soon though.

In the mean time everyone!


Yay! I loves me some corgis!
 
2008-03-05 12:29:19 AM  
d976: BuckTurgidson: Wow. I almost never watch TV news any more.

But tonight I turned on CNN for some hot, sweaty speechifyin'.

CNN just played a "Tell the House of Representatives to pass the TERRORIST SURVEILLANCE BILL and KEEP US ALL SAFE!!!!11|one!NINE!ELEVENTY!!!!" ad that I sincerely thought was a parody, until I realized it was coming not from YouTube, but out of the TV during the news.

Did you also notice that the picture is now in color?


It was just like being there in REAL LIFE! I had to jump out of the way during the car ad.

Then I did something rather rude all over Karen Hanretty's face.

/but she didn't seem to notice :(
 
2008-03-05 12:29:34 AM  
GreenPlastik: Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire


I'm not a democrat, but I'd go there and riot, probably. Stupid democrats -- IF they go an give Hillary the nom.
 
2008-03-05 12:29:44 AM  
cmartine, I believe its called "ideology"
 
2008-03-05 12:29:45 AM  
There's a small dark blue patch in West Texas on the CNN map for Loving county. I thought how did Obama win a county out there?

12 votes/ 7 for Obama and 5 for Hillary. 100% reporting.
 
2008-03-05 12:30:10 AM  
sjbiars: DELEGATES TO THE RESCUE =)

TX (C) 5%
Obama 56%
Clinton 44%

TX (P) 66%
Clinton 50%
Obama 48%


good news for everyone. This was going to be the night that could give Hillary a boost, but I'm glad to see that the margins are still well in Obama's favour, despite his winning streak being broken.

However, because she has won RI and Ohio and Texas being so close she's going to stay in the campaign for the long-haul...
 
2008-03-05 12:30:13 AM  
gilgamesh23: barcaboy: Obama will win Texas.

I agree. Once Dallas and Austin start coming in Clinton's 1-3 point lead will disappear in a heartbeat.


Don't forget the caucus vote too. The caucus I was at near Lakeway (outside Austin) was ridiculously pro-Obama. I think the motivation and excitement people in the Dem party for Obama is really pulling people out for that 2nd vote.

Also, if you look a precints not reported on CNN, you'll notice its mostly areas with strong Obama support. The turnout was phenominal where I was in Austin, the caucus had 2 rows of tables to sit at, they probably needed about 8-10.
 
2008-03-05 12:30:19 AM  
quisqueyano: All right, so what's left it this plays out all the way?
Here's my gut calls (haven't checked polls, just going on gut)
North Carolina -- Obama
Mississippi -- Obama
Pennsylvania -- Edge: Clinton
Indiana -- Obama
S Dakota -- Haven't a clue
Kentucky -- Edge: Obama
Oregon -- Obama

Agree? Disagree?


I think Kentucky will probably go to Clinton narrowly. I think S Dakota will probably be Obama. But I think you're right overall.
 
2008-03-05 12:30:20 AM  
Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

50-50... his family appears to be a pretty long lived... but his father died at 70, his grandfather 61, and he is currently 71.
 
2008-03-05 12:30:20 AM  
GreenPlastik: Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire


There won't be riots. Just an Obama/Bloomberg ticket.
 
2008-03-05 12:30:34 AM  
USP .45: stupid picture attempting to suggest a logical fallacy the USP .45 clearly doesn't understand.

FTFY
 
2008-03-05 12:30:35 AM  
krunvisaurus: Is there any way your county can break away from the shiathole that is ohio and join our fair state?

Long as you change the Maryland Ren Faire from Fall to Spring so it does not overlap ours... sure.
 
2008-03-05 12:30:43 AM  
Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

Social Security Actuarial Life Table (new window)

Average 71-year old (McCain's age when he would become President) has a life expectancy of 12+ years.
 
2008-03-05 12:31:00 AM  
There have been few if any candidates who have inspired so much hate...
thats why we have mega threads on this contest..
even our pets want to vote the clitclown away..
 
2008-03-05 12:31:28 AM  
Obama was doing horrible with latinos, now he seems to be doing ok. Anything that is not a beatdown in texas for obama is a win.

/And why is ohio always a political wildcard????
//He is holding his own, however h. clinton seems to be learning.
 
2008-03-05 12:31:32 AM  
pmccall: GreenPlastik: Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire

There won't be riots. Just an Obama/Bloomberg ticket.


But riots would be kind of entertaining.
 
2008-03-05 12:31:33 AM  
 
2008-03-05 12:31:36 AM  
Darth_Lukecash: I am sooo pissed right now. I was hoping Obama would have been able to get one of them...perhaps he'll still get Texas

He'll still get Texas. Mark my words.
 
2008-03-05 12:31:56 AM  
hillbillypharmacist: Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

Probably in the 5% range.

Of course, having the most stressful job in the world isn't going to do him much good. But the old folks will feel good about him, and that's what's important.


Speaking of which, what happens when a candidate dies prior to election? Would Huckabee be made the candidate? McCain's VP? Whoever the GOP wants?
 
2008-03-05 12:32:11 AM  
franjime: Average 71-year old (McCain's age when he would become President) has a life expectancy of 12+ years.

How about if the guy has been tortured for 5 years and has been under incredible stress?
 
2008-03-05 12:32:25 AM  
IAmAGodWarrior: USP .45

maybe no one ever told you about how 'keeping the ,koney withing thew country helps the economy.' selling ourselves to china (which you obviously favor) got us here in the first place.

farking moron.


So let's apply your logic, O Fark economic advisor.

We would keep more money in the country by inflating the cost of our products by subsidizing a more costly domestic work force?

No, domestically produced products would be artificially more expensive, and people would have an incentive to buy foreign goods. Money leaves. Your logc fails. Life goes on.

We would keep more money in the country by ONLY spending domestically and inflating the cost of goods sold in the US?

No, eventually that system would collapse and/or people would demand to have the freedom to spend their money where they like.

/poor
 
2008-03-05 12:33:03 AM  
BuckTurgidson: Wow. I almost never watch TV news any more.

But tonight I turned on CNN for some hot, sweaty speechifyin'.

CNN just played a "Tell the House of Representatives to pass the TERRORIST SURVEILLANCE BILL and KEEP US ALL SAFE!!!!11|one!NINE!ELEVENTY!!!!" ad that I sincerely thought was a parody, until I realized it was coming not from YouTube, but out of the TV during the news.


heh... I got lucky and actually caught something interesting on C-Span as I was flipping through channels. US Representative Dana Rohrabacher from California was absolutely reaming the Bush administration on the floor of the House for a long pattern of stonewalling Congressional investigations, treating Congressmen with disdain and contempt, and being far too secretive.

The kicker is that Rohrabacher is a Republican.
 
2008-03-05 12:33:06 AM  
Code_Archeologist: Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

50-50... his family appears to be a pretty long lived... but his father died at 70, his grandfather 61, and he is currently 71.


His mother's 347, though.
 
2008-03-05 12:33:16 AM  
DrMcNinja: Speaking of which, what happens when a candidate dies prior to election? Would Huckabee be made the candidate? McCain's VP? Whoever the GOP wants?

Dude, you're blowing my mind.

/I'm betting the VP, but the party heads might have to okay it
 
2008-03-05 12:33:19 AM  
It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.
 
2008-03-05 12:34:21 AM  
All I know is that when John McCain wakes up in the morning, he's surprised.

That shiat isn't right for a president.
 
2008-03-05 12:34:31 AM  
hillbillypharmacist: DrMcNinja: Speaking of which, what happens when a candidate dies prior to election? Would Huckabee be made the candidate? McCain's VP? Whoever the GOP wants?

Dude, you're blowing my mind.

/I'm betting the VP, but the party heads might have to okay it


Prior to the election? Or the convention? If its prior to the election, you have to vote on the ticket anyway. The VP would become pres, and he would have to appoint a new VP to be confirmed by the Senate.

I assume for the convention, it would become brokered.
 
2008-03-05 12:34:37 AM  
DrMcNinja: Speaking of which, what happens when a candidate dies prior to election? Would Huckabee be made the candidate? McCain's VP? Whoever the GOP wants?

Zombie Reagan 08!!
 
2008-03-05 12:34:53 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.


Losen up.
 
2008-03-05 12:34:58 AM  
I don't know if it's been said yet, but I think sometimes quoting Ichiro is the best thing to do.

"To tell the truth, I'm not excited to go to Cleveland, but we have to," Ichiro said through an interpreter. "If I ever saw myself saying I'm excited going to Cleveland, I'd punch myself in the face, because I'm lying."
 
2008-03-05 12:35:06 AM  
cmartine

Can't speak for my fellows, but I'm sure as hell not loyal to the democratic party.

/republican
//as far as registration goes, anyway
 
2008-03-05 12:35:11 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.
 
2008-03-05 12:35:12 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.


OMG! This is the internet, get the fark over it
 
2008-03-05 12:35:14 AM  
Code_Archeologist: Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

50-50... his family appears to be a pretty long lived... but his father died at 70, his grandfather 61, and he is currently 71.


I thought that's what Huckabee was waiting around for. Or did he simply suspend like Romney?
 
2008-03-05 12:35:24 AM  
DrMcNinja: hillbillypharmacist: Dear Jerk: Is there an actuary in the house? What are the chances McCain will die of natural causes before the election?

Probably in the 5% range.

Of course, having the most stressful job in the world isn't going to do him much good. But the old folks will feel good about him, and that's what's important.

Speaking of which, what happens when a candidate dies prior to election? Would Huckabee be made the candidate? McCain's VP? Whoever the GOP wants?


Well, if it's before the convention, it goes to last man standing.

You know what that means.

Ron Paul Revolution!
 
2008-03-05 12:35:38 AM  
robsul82: His mother's 347, though.

Yeah, Methuselah's mother just refuses to farking die.
 
2008-03-05 12:35:39 AM  
robsul82: All I know is that when John McCain wakes up in the morning, he's surprised.

You will be going on my Wall O' Truthiness, sir. Well done.
 
2008-03-05 12:35:45 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.


Technical question: Is it wise to use the morans meme while being a grammar nazi?
 
2008-03-05 12:35:46 AM  
DamnYankees: franjime: Average 71-year old (McCain's age when he would become President) has a life expectancy of 12+ years.

How about if the guy has been tortured for 5 years and has been under incredible stress?


OK, make that 13+ years.

/Senator have free healthcare FTW!
 
2008-03-05 12:36:01 AM  
The opposite of Obama's "Change" message is Bush's "Stay the Course" BS where you keep following clearly failed policies because admitting you were wrong is unacceptable.
 
2008-03-05 12:36:37 AM  
daveydave: Do you really think that Rush influenced many people to vote for Hillary? That's a farking joke man. Get off it.

No. Actually I was just poking fun at the Ohio voters.
 
2008-03-05 12:36:39 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions oponions.


/pet peeve
 
2008-03-05 12:36:39 AM  
daveydave: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.

Losen up.


Yeah, don't be such a literacy looser.
 
2008-03-05 12:36:49 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.


Your Farky tag is now "Grammar Nazi." You will be judged in any future thread accordingly.
 
2008-03-05 12:36:51 AM  
img126.imageshack.us


need to stay strong for obama
 
2008-03-05 12:36:58 AM  
I think m'man needed a little help tonight. Instead of another donation like I made after SC (for the first time in my life to any candidate - and, yes, I'm old enough to be hated by all you young Farkers) I bought me a snazzy new T-shirt from the Obama store!

I can already imagine its rich cottony goodness!

/hope it gets here soon enough to let me wear it before it's too hot!
 
2008-03-05 12:37:04 AM  
Ringshadow: Staying up past my bedtime in hopes I can see the polls figure out who won in Texas.. still have to retire soon though.

In the mean time everyone!


God bless you for that picture.

/want a corgi.
 
2008-03-05 12:37:08 AM  
Now that I have a total fark subscription, I'd like everyone to know that:

1. There are a lot of posts up there with no replies

2. There is a lot more porn stuff, and a lot more weener tags

3. There are a lot of funny stuffs up there on total fark

4. I'm kind of tired, so I haven't really had time to explore total farkitude yet

5. There is NO hate like Hillary hate
 
2008-03-05 12:37:23 AM  
Kinetocracy: People who can't can neither read nor write shouldn't oughtn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.
 
2008-03-05 12:37:28 AM  
tendervittles: I don't know if it's been said yet, but I think sometimes quoting Ichiro is the best thing to do.

Ichiro is one zen motherfarker.
 
2008-03-05 12:37:29 AM  
This just in, guys:

TX (C) 5%
Obama 4%
Clinton 6%
Cute pictures of Corgis 90%
 
2008-03-05 12:37:32 AM  
Jeebus, who is this asshat pro-hillary idiot on CNN?
 
2008-03-05 12:37:35 AM  
sjbiars: I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.


You must be new here.
 
2008-03-05 12:37:39 AM  
oburt
OMG! This is the internet, get the fark over it SERIOUS BUSINESS

Fixed
 
2008-03-05 12:37:55 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People who can't read or write shouldn't be allowed to express their (worthless) opinions.


You do realize that Shakespeare spelled even his own name in any number of ways. If you honestly think that form wins over function in something such as language which is merely the vehicle for communicating a certain set of verbal content, then I must disagree.
 
2008-03-05 12:38:33 AM  
sjbiars: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.


Legendary fail!
 
2008-03-05 12:38:35 AM  
patrick767: sjbiars: I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.

You must be new here.


LOT at teh noob
 
2008-03-05 12:38:46 AM  
Bhasayate: GreenPlastik: Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire

I'm not a democrat, but I'd go there and riot, probably. Stupid democrats -- IF they go an give Hillary the nom.


if this happens, this democrat in boston will riot here as well as where he's actually registered to vote.
 
2008-03-05 12:38:47 AM  
Texas Caucus results are starting to come in. Currently only 5% are in. They want you to give your name, email, and address, and then expressly acknowledge that these results are unofficial. It's retarded, so I'm gonna give you this link to go direct to the results as they show up:

http://precinctconventionresults.txdemocrats.org/election08district

In case anyone is wondering, running results from the primaries are available here:
Texas
Ohio
Vermont (from USA Today)

Rhode Island's results are ALL in. Clinton hit 58.3% in CD-1, so she picks up profit there. Thus we have the final results from Rhode Island, unless there is a HUGE change in provisionals, etc. Clinton 13, Obama 8.
 
2008-03-05 12:38:55 AM  
Bhasayate: Now that I have a total fark subscription, I'd like everyone to know that:

1. There are a lot of posts up there with no replies

2. There is a lot more porn stuff, and a lot more weener tags

3. There are a lot of funny stuffs up there on total fark

4. I'm kind of tired, so I haven't really had time to explore total farkitude yet

5. There is NO hate like Hillary hate


I'm not a TFer so I didn't get a kick so much out of your reply.
 
2008-03-05 12:39:09 AM  
sjbiars: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.


I'm sure Kenitocracy knows that, s/he's using this meme:

fizisist.web.cern.ch

/Still think it's bad form to call that meme in a grammar nazi rant.
 
2008-03-05 12:39:22 AM  
pmccall: Technical question: Is it wise to use the morans meme while being a grammar nazi?

If you want to be ironic.

Oh crap, now the Irony Goons are going to be all over me.
 
2008-03-05 12:40:11 AM  
Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.


It's "lose", like your girlfriend to lesbianism.

It's "loose", like yo mamma.

Let's get this straight, folks.
 
2008-03-05 12:40:37 AM  
z.about.com

www.fightconservatives.comMy Liberal Identity:

You are a New Left Hipster, also known as a MoveOn.org liberal, a Netroots activist, or a Daily Show fanatic. You believe that if we really want to defend American values, conservatives must be exposed, mocked, and assailed for every fanatical, puritanical, warmongering, Constitution-shredding ideal for which they stand.

Take the quiz at www.FightConservatives.com

 
2008-03-05 12:40:50 AM  
Kenitocracy voted for Clinton.
 
2008-03-05 12:41:07 AM  
Please start the next thread on foobies.com
 
2008-03-05 12:41:09 AM  
if obama wins i don't vote, if hillary wins, i vote mccain.
 
2008-03-05 12:41:12 AM  
chard: Bhasayate: GreenPlastik: Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire

I'm not a democrat, but I'd go there and riot, probably. Stupid democrats -- IF they go an give Hillary the nom.

if this happens, this democrat in boston will riot here as well as where he's actually registered to vote.


By "there" I meant where the DNC is being held. I'm registered independent, btw, in Indiana.
 
2008-03-05 12:41:24 AM  
Blues_X: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.


It's "lose", like your girlfriend to lesbianism.

It's "loose", like yo mamma.

Let's get this straight, folks.


+1
 
2008-03-05 12:41:39 AM  
sjbiars: I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.


I believe the word you are looking for is n00b.

Welcome to fark this ^is what is called a cliche'

/we were all n00bs once.
 
2008-03-05 12:41:48 AM  
Incontinent_dog_and_monkey_rodeo: The opposite of Obama's "Change" message is Bush's "Stay the Course" BS where you keep following clearly failed policies because admitting you were wrong is unacceptable.

And the opposite of "hope" isn't "pragmatism" no matter what Hillary Clinton thinks.
 
2008-03-05 12:42:03 AM  
cmartine Obama voters are only loyal to Obama.

Damn skippy. Fifth presidential election here, and right now is the first time I've been a registered Democrat (I re-registered at the the caucus door to vote for Obama). Voted Perot. Voted Dole, because Clinton was a lying scumbag against a decent honorable man. I'll go back to Green or Libertarian if the Greens don't get ballot access this year. Deal with it.
 
2008-03-05 12:42:32 AM  
GreenPlastik: Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire

Not really. But Democrats could go Whig on us. Could end up with Green - 30%, Dem - 30%, Rep - 40% into the far future. Depending on how blatant they are about it and what actual numbers Obama has when they screw him.
 
2008-03-05 12:42:57 AM  
rga184:

Jeebus, who is this asshat pro-hillary idiot on CNN?

You're going to have to be more specific...
 
2008-03-05 12:42:59 AM  
DamnYankees 2008-03-05 12:32:11 AM
franjime: Average 71-year old (McCain's age when he would become President) has a life expectancy of 12+ years.

How about if the guy has been tortured for 5 years and has been under incredible stress?""


// that jus means he is too mean to die [yet]
being edgy, or angry, or just interested emotionally will increase a person's lifespan.
most folks age early because theyre too relaxed, go soft, stay soft, and soon lose interest in breathing..

the angrier he gets the longer he will live..
until he's nothing but vinegar crystals.

Beware the vinegar voters!
 
2008-03-05 12:43:04 AM  
USP .45 - good point. I'm enough of a closet optimist, though, that I think it COULD happen, even someplace like that... It'd certainly be in their best interests, long term.
 
2008-03-05 12:43:10 AM  
3ntropy: if obama wins i don't vote, if hillary wins, i vote mccain.

OMG!!! RON PAUL REVOLUTION!!!!
 
2008-03-05 12:43:58 AM  
The Ohio margin is down to 12.
 
2008-03-05 12:44:18 AM  
3ntropy: if obama wins i don't vote, if hillary wins, i vote mccain.

There aren't enough of you. Most will stay home.
 
2008-03-05 12:44:34 AM  
March_Hare: This just in, guys:

TX (C) 5%
Obama 4%
Clinton 6%
Cute pictures of Corgis 90%


Which just goes to show that we can all agree on one thing.
images.icanhascheezburger.com

/Yeah, cheap excuse to post a picture of my dog.
 
2008-03-05 12:44:34 AM  
Ohio's link is weird and got chucked out by the server. Here's another try: Ohio

/I really like Drew Carey and I'd love to see the Rock'n'Roll Hall of Fame.
 
2008-03-05 12:44:36 AM  
pmccall: sjbiars: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

I believe the word you're looking for is "morons".

/epic fail.

I'm sure Kenitocracy knows that, s/he's using this meme:



/Still think it's bad form to call that meme in a grammar nazi rant.


unless you're using the "moran" meme to evoke the "pet peev" meme in your grammar nazi post.

/the internet is a confusing place
 
2008-03-05 12:44:36 AM  
arkansas: GreenPlastik: Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire

Not really. But Democrats could go Whig on us. Could end up with Green - 30%, Dem - 30%, Rep - 40% into the far future. Depending on how blatant they are about it and what actual numbers Obama has when they screw him.


I for one believe we should bring the Whig party back.
 
2008-03-05 12:44:51 AM  
What I want to know is... what the fark is wrong with people from Ohio and RI. I don't understand what it is they like about Clinton?

Actually I'm perpetually confused by anyone who supports her.
 
2008-03-05 12:45:26 AM  
Anyone care to comment on how in the hell CNN is reporting caucus results for Texas? Just got back from caucusing (if anyone asks you to chair a convention, say NO), and our results aren't even due at party headquarters until Friday.

/suburban Houston
// 73% Obama, 27% Clinton
 
2008-03-05 12:45:45 AM  
My Mom is caucusing in Harris county and they haven't started yet!!! She said it's crazy.

Pissed. Pissed all the way around!!
 
2008-03-05 12:45:49 AM  
3ntropy: if obama wins i don't vote, if hillary wins, i vote mccain.

Ugh. As awful as Hillary is, McCain is even worse. If it really comes down to those two (which is a long shot), it'll be worse than Kerry/Bush in terms of no one wanting either.
 
2008-03-05 12:46:11 AM  
57453, and increasing. Despite the impression you may get on Fark, a lot of people like the Clintons and think that Hillary will do a fine job. It's not over yet.
 
2008-03-05 12:46:23 AM  
Shadow Blasko: krunvisaurus: Is there any way your county can break away from the shiathole that is ohio and join our fair state?

Long as you change the Maryland Ren Faire from Fall to Spring so it does not overlap ours... sure.


Deal.

Being a cold bitter dirty hippy, at this moment, I have put on my fuzzy green sweater, have contemplated my harsh words, to my fellow Obamaniac, and I offer you a small apology, sorry, I think he will still make it though, my brother...

and as soon as he does, President Obama's first order of business should be to Nuke Ohio from orbit, just saying....

you'll be safe,

your county will be with the good guys...

Piece
 
2008-03-05 12:46:27 AM  
Daddakamabb: I for one believe we should bring the Whig party back.

Only if we bring back shoes with buckles and blunderbusses too.
 
2008-03-05 12:46:50 AM  
ManPanties!: need to stay strong for obama

And donate.
The best thing to do to spite Clintonites is to donate to Obama when ever Hillary wins, when ever they spread some stupid meme (like the Obama's a muslim), when ever they campaign on fear, when ever they sling mud (like the Rezko crap), when ever they do anything that would normally dispirit and discourage supporters of Obama... donate $5.01 to his campaign.

Spite them with his fund raising.
Spite them with our energy.
Spite them with our resilience.

And as they gnash their teeth in rage over our ebullience for Obama, simply smile at their cynical condemnations and say, "Yes, we can."
 
2008-03-05 12:46:53 AM  
RminusQ: Ohio's link is weird and got chucked out by the server. Here's another try: Ohio

/I really like Drew Carey and I'd love to see the Rock'n'Roll Hall of Fame.


get we get back to texas?

/nothing, obscure, fark
 
2008-03-05 12:47:01 AM  
I must sleep, but before I do, I will contribute one kitty.

img106.imageshack.us

Because I am glad my corgi pictures are appreciated.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:04 AM  
GreenPlastik: Gergen just said on CNN that if Obama wins the number states, the popular votes and the delegate count by the convention but the superdelegates give it to Hillary, there wont be riots a la Chicago in '68.

Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire


If Hillary figures out a way to win by seating her Michigan delegates when Obama wasn't even on the ballot, I'll be totally in favor of Detroit rioting. Hell, I'll donate to a fund to charter buses for Detroit residents to make their feelings known in Denver.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:10 AM  
arkansas: GreenPlastik: Who is he kidding? It wouldn't be riots. It would hell-fire

Not really. But Democrats could go Whig on us. Could end up with Green - 30%, Dem - 30%, Rep - 40% into the far future. Depending on how blatant they are about it and what actual numbers Obama has when they screw him.


This would be good for America.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:12 AM  
haha hillary took texas
 
2008-03-05 12:47:29 AM  
BALLS!

Texas primary to Clinton
 
2008-03-05 12:47:34 AM  
ejwaxx: Anyone care to comment on how in the hell CNN is reporting caucus results for Texas? Just got back from caucusing (if anyone asks you to chair a convention, say NO), and our results aren't even due at party headquarters until Friday.

/suburban Houston
// 73% Obama, 27% Clinton


Because they feel right and natural about lying to America.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:39 AM  
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
 
2008-03-05 12:47:39 AM  
Just because I'm a history nerd, I favor the creation of an independent 3rd party to challenge the Democratic party. Out of the ashes of the failed conventin of 2008 I give you....

Whig II

The scenario plays out like this: Hillary gets the nom, but the party is now deeply divided along ethnic/generational lines, and McCain wins the election easily. Obama goes back to his law practice senate seat in disillusionment and is drafted in 2012, goes on to become our greatest president.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:43 AM  
MSNBC calls Texas for Clinton.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:46 AM  
Ok, so I'm one of those crazy people that sees this primary as a way to energize the Democratic party. I do prefer Obama by a mile and I really can barely stand Hillary.

Here's my question: I think it's fairly obvious that Obama fans hate Hillary and feel emotionally upset when she wins. Is the same true for Hillary supporters? When Obama wins, do you feel a small part of you get crushed in a way that makes you feel upset with the political process and the media?
 
2008-03-05 12:47:46 AM  
MSNBC calls TX for HILL????? WHAT?
 
2008-03-05 12:47:48 AM  
Clinton wins Tejas. MSNBC calls.
 
2008-03-05 12:47:50 AM  
erm, fox news is calling texas for hillary, my bad
 
2008-03-05 12:48:02 AM  
MSNBC projects Hillary as being the winner in Texas!

Clintowned!
 
2008-03-05 12:48:07 AM  
ejwaxx: Anyone care to comment on how in the hell CNN is reporting caucus results for Texas?

Anyone care to comment on how Larry King just said something like, "Let's fantasize here. Is it possible that they'll just pick Al Gore to be the nominee?"

I keep trying to respect that guy and network, but then I don't.
 
2008-03-05 12:48:09 AM  
TX-Law: Daddakamabb: I for one believe we should bring the Whig party back.

Only if we bring back shoes with buckles and blunderbusses too.


The left?
 
2008-03-05 12:48:11 AM  
Say hello to President McCain.
 
2008-03-05 12:48:29 AM  
CNN just called TX
Ha ha
/Go McCain
 
2008-03-05 12:48:54 AM  
BLAST!
 
2008-03-05 12:49:14 AM  
All Apologies: Despite the impression you may get on Fark, a lot of people like the Clintons and think that Hillary will do a fine job.

It isn't just on fark... it's everyone I've spoken with from just about all walks of life. I have met a couple of people who were planning on voting for her, but not because they like her, but because they didn't want to vote for a black guy. Yeah, I realize how shiatty that is from various angles. But seriously, I haven't talked with a single person who has said, "I think she would make the best President for our country".

I'm not saying those people don't exist, I just don't find them... anywhere.
 
2008-03-05 12:49:14 AM  
Daddakamabb: TX-Law: Daddakamabb: I for one believe we should bring the Whig party back.

Only if we bring back shoes with buckles and blunderbusses too.

The left?


They*
 
2008-03-05 12:49:16 AM  
Oh, man, I hope Obama takes Texas. I actually think Hillary has all the right stuff to be Prez, but she's so polarizing that I don't think she can beat McCain -- she's never going to get the conservative swing voters. And let's face it, Obama is a rock star -- there hasn't been a candidate since Kennedy that's been so exciting.

And the real bummer is now that it's a close race it's going to be a total clusterfark with the party, and no candidate will truly have a "mandate."

All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

/that's all. Thanks for not reading this, I didn't read anything you posted either.
 
2008-03-05 12:49:17 AM  
Goddamn, Texas.
 
2008-03-05 12:49:21 AM  
vegaswench: CNN just called TX
Ha ha
/Go McCain


Dammit, it's MSNBC...the SO changed the channel on me. Oops, sorry.
 
2008-03-05 12:49:44 AM  
The CL Poster: haha hillary took texas

Going to suck for her when she loses Texas on delegates.
 
2008-03-05 12:49:47 AM  
The Obama strongholds in Texas are still not fully reported, one is at 70ish, the rest in the mid 50's, he still has a good shot at eeking out the primary, and either way, he's going to win the delegate count there. GO8ama!
 
2008-03-05 12:49:50 AM  
narmer65: My Mom is caucusing in Harris county and they haven't started yet!!! She said it's crazy.

Pissed. Pissed all the way around!!


I would be pissed too. We got to the caucus around 7, was there for 3 and a half hours. I overheard several of the Obama reps talking about problems with caucuses all over Houston. I think it's mainly that most Texans Democrats have never even participated in our admittedly farked up system.

I hope your mom brought something to read, might be a long night for her.
 
2008-03-05 12:49:58 AM  
Like I needed another reason to hate Texas....
 
2008-03-05 12:50:14 AM  
Current Primary returns from Texas
link

Obama 1,057,302 47.45% 61 Delegates
Clinton 1,128,405 50.64% 65 Delegates

CNN is calling it for Clinton
 
2008-03-05 12:50:23 AM  
Hillary wins Texas.

Hail to the new Chief, President McCain.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:25 AM  
ValisIV: The Obama strongholds in Texas are still not fully reported, one is at 70ish, the rest in the mid 50's, he still has a good shot at eeking out the primary, and either way, he's going to win the delegate count there. GO8ama!

I thought Democrats were all about the popular vote?
 
2008-03-05 12:50:25 AM  
Aw hell.

I did my part, people, I swear. *sigh* Maybe the gone-to-bed people have the right idea.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:25 AM  
Lawnchair: e

If Hillary figures out a way to win by seating her Michigan delegates when Obama wasn't even on the ballot, I'll be totally in favor of Detroit rioting. Hell, I'll donate to a fund to charter buses for Detroit residents to make their feelings known in Denver.


I think what happens is a Michigan and Florida do-over. They have to seat SOMEONE from those states at the convention.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:26 AM  
despite the fact that it's going to open up an even bigger gap for Obama at the end of it all (thanks to texas' caucuses), she technically won 3/4 which will be enough for her to stick around until the bitter end.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:31 AM  
Obscure: Oh, man, I hope Obama takes Texas. I actually think Hillary has all the right stuff to be Prez, but she's so polarizing that I don't think she can beat McCain -- she's never going to get the conservative swing voters. And let's face it, Obama is a rock star -- there hasn't been a candidate since Kennedy that's been so exciting.

And the real bummer is now that it's a close race it's going to be a total clusterfark with the party, and no candidate will truly have a "mandate."

All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

/that's all. Thanks for not reading this, I didn't read anything you posted either.


I think we basically just cross-posted the same sentiment. Sad thing. Just watch the youth vote and the minority vote dry right on up if Hillary wins the nomination.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:31 AM  
CNN calls Texas for Hillary.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:36 AM  
Damn...
 
2008-03-05 12:50:37 AM  
vegaswench: Dammit, it's MSNBC...the SO changed the channel on me. Oops, sorry.

CNN just called it for Clinton too.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:39 AM  
Obscure: All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

this.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:42 AM  
JohnnyC: What I want to know is... what the fark is wrong with people from Ohio and RI. I don't understand what it is they like about Clinton?

Rhode Island government is completely farked up. I don't think anyone is surprised that our primary would be up shiat creek as well...
 
2008-03-05 12:50:44 AM  
LOLWUT

The major cites don't have all their votes in yet lol.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:48 AM  
Ha, never mind...CNN just declared TX for Clinton. I was right the first time. Stupid remote control.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:48 AM  
CNN just called Texas for Clinton
 
2008-03-05 12:50:52 AM  
Lawnchair: quisqueyano: All right, so what's left it this plays out all the way?
Here's my gut calls (haven't checked polls, just going on gut)
North Carolina -- Obama
Mississippi -- Obama
Pennsylvania -- Edge: Clinton
Indiana -- Obama
S Dakota -- Haven't a clue
Kentucky -- Edge: Obama
Oregon -- Obama

Agree? Disagree?

Wyoming, Montana, and Oregon: big-time Obama wins

Mississippi: pretty likely for Obama, but not by much, particularly if there is GOP tactical voting for Hillary.

Indiana, Kentucky, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, W.Va: Ties for Obama at best. Could lose all by 5%. Maybe he takes NC due to Research Triangle area? But, I think Virginia was the outlier in the mid-Atlantic. Lower education levels seem to be key, so expect Hillary to do a lot of the same things she did in Ohio.

South Dakota: in the middle of a bunch of Obama states. The wild card is that a *big* chunk of the Democratic vote in SD are Native Americans, both on and off reservation. Not sure how they will tend, but suspect Obama takes the state.

Guam? Puerto Rico? No idea at all.

No way Clinton gains more than a 25 point spread in pledged delegates from here, and the rest of the primary season could well be exactly 50/50, so Obama's margin now is his margin in Denver.

Gore, Edwards, and Richardson? It's your baby now....


-----------------------------------------

North Carolina is a very solid win for Obama. Smack dab between SC and VA, which both went heavily his way. Large black population, especially in rural areas where Hillary would normally do well.

South Dakota, Obama solid. Midwest, his strength.

Kentucky, Clinton. It touches Ohio and therefore smells like Ohio's cooch.

Indiana, very close. Also touches Ohio, but also touches Illinois. Will be close. Fair amount of redneckery in the east near Ohio.

West Virginia, Clinton. Armpit of Ohio. Smells like Ohio's ass, and sleeps with its cousin Kentucky. We Virginians are glad they broke off.

Wyoming, Montana, and Oregon: Obama

Mississippi, Obama. Will follow the Alabama model, large black population, mostly rural. Still smells like smoke from burning crosses and church bombings, so the Klan factor may play in.
 
2008-03-05 12:50:54 AM  
Lawnchair: Alright... here's the question for the Democratic Party. This race has split the party almost exactly in half. The question is, do you want the half that is primarily people born before 1960? Or do you want the half born after 1960? Consider what that means in 2012. In 2016. In 2020. Also, consider how many life-long Democrats become Republicans right about the time they get their AARP card. Think about it. Come up with a good answer before Denver.

Not to let facts get in the way of good storytelling, but one of the big democratic strongholds is in the retired population. Democrats are the ones promising to keep Social Security up and running, Medicare, all of that good stuff.

What do we do in 2016, assuming Obama wins both the nomination and the general election, when we don't have a super-duper charismatic candidate? Your assumption is that the younger generation is going to stick with the party in a post-Obama world. Hell, your assumption is that they keep voting in a post-Obama world.

If I'm wrong, and this groundswell of younger voters is a new wave in politics, it won't matter. If the 18-24 age group is going to be involved, it can't just be "I like Obama", it has to be "I want to actually influence the national debate on a going-forward basis".

If you're right, that these are a new contingent of the Democratic Party, they'll rally behind whichever candidate gets the nomination. If I'm right, if Obama doesn't get it, they'll go back to the xbox and not care. If the former, they're real Democrats, and real citizens; if the latter, they're members of a cult of personality, and don't really care about the democratic issues.

/is in the age group in question
//also from Denver
 
2008-03-05 12:50:56 AM  
One of the most interesting exit poll statistics tonight is that for the first time in this race, Hillary has won last-minute voters by an overwhelming margin.

At the same time, exit poll respondents said by a wide margin they hate negative campaigning.

What does this mean? Once again, negative campaigning has worked no matter how much we say we hate it.

In this case, it was the red phone commercial.

In the past, it was the Willie Horton ad, or the Swift Boat attack.

Even though all four became despised as examples of dirty campaigning in the history books, in the moment all three won elections.

Food for thought....
 
2008-03-05 12:51:01 AM  
Add Texas to the nuke list

Bush, and now this?
 
2008-03-05 12:51:01 AM  
MSNBC.com has a big graphic up on the front page. Doesn't bother to show that Obama won Vermont. Old news?
 
2008-03-05 12:51:04 AM  
I would just like to say that my pre-election predictions are pretty much dead on.
 
2008-03-05 12:51:18 AM  
I wouldn't be surprised if this call doesn't come and bite them in the ass this morning. Too many people are too anxious to go get drunk. Olbermann, I'm looking at you.
 
2008-03-05 12:51:32 AM  
Foaming: vegaswench: Dammit, it's MSNBC...the SO changed the channel on me. Oops, sorry.

CNN just called it for Clinton too.


Thank you
 
2008-03-05 12:51:39 AM  
Flatulent_Flea: Obscure: All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

this.


Don't give up.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:10 AM  
JohnnyC: All Apologies: Despite the impression you may get on Fark, a lot of people like the Clintons and think that Hillary will do a fine job.

It isn't just on fark... it's everyone I've spoken with from just about all walks of life. I have met a couple of people who were planning on voting for her, but not because they like her, but because they didn't want to vote for a black guy. Yeah, I realize how shiatty that is from various angles. But seriously, I haven't talked with a single person who has said, "I think she would make the best President for our country".

I'm not saying those people don't exist, I just don't find them... anywhere.


I don't know if you've noticed or not, but the states Hillary has won are by far, the largest states.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:11 AM  
TEXAS = FAIL

/sigh
 
2008-03-05 12:52:15 AM  
First Gygax, now this.

A day that will either live in infamy, if that's the right word.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:21 AM  
doyner: Like I needed another reason to hate Texas....

If the results don't change she'll only close the gap by 4 delegates. It could be much worse.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:26 AM  
This is the worst day ever.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:29 AM  
Lawnchair
...Voted Dole, because Clinton was a lying scumbag against a decent honorable man.

Dole's legacy is 'hatchet man.' I sat at Bill Roy's kitchen table and talked with him about it.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:36 AM  
And since everyone else is posting this thing, here is what I scored (Yes I got both, mostly because I did 2 answers to one or two questions because I agreed with both answers):

1. Reality-Based Intellectualists, also known as the liberal elite-are proud members of what's known as the reality-based community, where science, reason, and non-Jesus-based thought reign supreme.

2. You are a Social Justice Crusader, also known as a rights activist. You believe in equality, fairness, and preventing neo-Confederate conservative troglodytes from rolling back fifty years of civil rights gains.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:44 AM  
If it comes down to it, I suppose a McCain Presidency with a strong Democratic majority in Congress will be ok. Hope it doesn't come down to that though.
 
2008-03-05 12:52:51 AM  
Flatulent_Flea: Obscure: All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

this.


QFT
 
2008-03-05 12:52:52 AM  
fark
 
2008-03-05 12:52:54 AM  
So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?
 
2008-03-05 12:53:01 AM  
GOD DAMMIT TEXAS.

GOD DAMMIT.

Say goodbye, Democrats, to a voter if you nominate Hillary. I'll be sitting it out. Trust me. Or I'll write myself in.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:12 AM  
oburt: doyner: Like I needed another reason to hate Texas....

If the results don't change she'll only close the gap by 4 delegates. It could be much worse.


And if he wins the caucuses he could still "win" Texas.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:29 AM  
Sen. Hillary Clinton wins the Texas primary, CNN projects; Texas caucus results yet to come.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:31 AM  
robsul82: BLAST!

It's the delegates that count. She's farked herself something good. He might beat her on net delegates and these were her farking firewall states.

The uninformed and incorrect public perception of what is happening tonight could shift the momentum back to Obama as the underdog candidate, from where he fights better anyway. He will still have the benefits of winning delegates with the better positioning to attack Hillary as the Establishment candidate and then McCain as well.

It's possible that Hillary could pull this off, but I doubt it.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:32 AM  
robsul82: BLAST!

Maybe. Networks don't decide, they just predict, and it's too close to call. There's a 3% margin in the primary votes right now, with the urban (Obama) areas still being counted.

For the Caucuses, no significant returns yet.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:36 AM  
My call for texas from yesterday:

Tomorrow is going to split 50/50. The race will continue to Pennsylavania, which she wins. Then it's a play to the Superdelegates - 'look at the momentum going into the convention - who cares that Obama won a bunch of states in February, he's on the way out now and I'm up-and-coming'. And the people will love her for it. And we'll biatch and moan because it seems unfair but that's the rules. Link (new window)

Looking like it might actually happen :(
 
2008-03-05 12:53:39 AM  
F*ck. The reasons keep piling up for me to move to northern Virginia.

Is the VA-Law handle available?
 
2008-03-05 12:53:41 AM  
The_Pink_Pimp: CNN just called Texas for Clinton

I believe that the networks are calling the PRIMARY for Hillary, but not yet the caucus or overall results. Eh?
 
2008-03-05 12:53:42 AM  
Since the delegates are distributed proportionately, is being the "winner" even relevant?
 
2008-03-05 12:53:49 AM  
The Caucus still gives out 60 or so votes...

Apparently many Obama ppl were going to both the primary and the caucus and the Clinton people were just going home... Guess that's what happens when you need your nap and prune juice.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:52 AM  
AgentONeal: GOD DAMMIT TEXAS.

Only 5% of the caucuses are reporting and Obama has the lead with 54%.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:55 AM  
Welp... looks like Hilldawg is gonna scrape by with a win in Texas. Obama could completely dominate in the caucuses (although there's a lot of whispers about shenigans afoot), but the media will completely ignore that.

It sucks, but the Obama campaign has to realize they weren't playing a fair game from the start. It's time to go on the attack once again. Not just attacking her, but "attack" in the sense of regaining traction in the eyes of the media. Apparently, going on SNL and TDS are major moves- time to do it. If Brokaw's right about this 50 superdelegates ready to commit, announce it in the most media-friendly way possible.

Get those damn tax returns out in the public like they should be. Hillary's biggest liability is herself- time to fully play this card in advertisements. Obama could win every primary left except Pennsylvania, and the MSM will still consider this thing "neck and neck." It's time to attack, attack, attack.
 
2008-03-05 12:53:58 AM  
Jamal Simmons on CNN is about to re-enact a Chappelle's Show "Keepin' It Real" skit momentarily. He's about ready to go off on everyone.
 
2008-03-05 12:54:05 AM  
I think Gary Gygax's ghost knows what happened with the primary today...

i168.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 12:54:12 AM  
Good thing I have a Canadian passport.

The fallout is a lot less up north...

Good night
 
2008-03-05 12:54:27 AM  
Jon Snow: robsul82: BLAST!

It's the delegates that count. She's farked herself something good. He might beat her on net delegates and these were her farking firewall states.

The uninformed and incorrect public perception of what is happening tonight could shift the momentum back to Obama as the underdog candidate, from where he fights better anyway. He will still have the benefits of winning delegates with the better positioning to attack Hillary as the Establishment candidate and then McCain as well.

It's possible that Hillary could pull this off, but I doubt it.


BuckTurgidson: robsul82: BLAST!

Maybe. Networks don't decide, they just predict, and it's too close to call. There's a 3% margin in the primary votes right now, with the urban (Obama) areas still being counted.

For the Caucuses, no significant returns yet.


Eh, I just don't like how I've been seeing the coverage go the past couple days, that's all.
 
2008-03-05 12:54:38 AM  
Never Trust Robots: oburt: doyner: Like I needed another reason to hate Texas....

If the results don't change she'll only close the gap by 4 delegates. It could be much worse.

And if he wins the caucuses he could still "win" Texas.


wow. Thank god.
 
2008-03-05 12:54:49 AM  
ejwaxx: Anyone care to comment on how in the hell CNN is reporting caucus results for Texas? Just got back from caucusing (if anyone asks you to chair a convention, say NO), and our results aren't even due at party headquarters until Friday.

/suburban Houston
// 73% Obama, 27% Clinton


According to the link I posted at 12:38:47, All Precinct Convention Results are unofficial until certified by the Credentials committee at the County or Senatorial District Convention on March 29th. However, in response to overwhelming interest from the public and the press, the Texas Democratic Party developed a reporting system that will allow the Chair of each Precinct Convention to call in results as soon as their meeting adjourns.

/about 13% reporting now
//Obama 53.9%, Clinton 46.0%.
///Corresponds to Obama +5
 
2008-03-05 12:54:54 AM  
Daddakamabb: The Caucus still gives out 60 or so votes*...

Apparently many Obama ppl were going to both the primary and the caucus and the Clinton people were just going home... Guess that's what happens when you need your nap and prune juice.


*delegates not votes
 
2008-03-05 12:54:54 AM  
Bhasayate: Flatulent_Flea: Obscure: All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

this.

Don't give up.


Yep... no reason to give up.
This will be a delegate tie in the end, which favors Obama as the leader.
 
2008-03-05 12:54:59 AM  
Korzine: So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?

Slim. Obama's still going to have a good lead on Hillary after today - heck, for delegates just today it's going to be really close. The doomsday talk in this thread isn't warranted.
 
2008-03-05 12:55:15 AM  
fark, fark, fark, fark, fark, fark, FARK.

This is annoying. He is going to win the most delgates tonight, but she'll get the headlines.

She can't win the general, or the nomination, and she'll bring the Democratic party's chances down in flames.
 
2008-03-05 12:55:31 AM  
I guess the Clinton campaign is smarter than I thought. Everyone really is buying their lowering the bar strategy
 
2008-03-05 12:55:34 AM  
Hillary can not beat McCain...

If Clinton gets it, EVERY single Republican will come out to vote against her. They hate her, like rabid dogs. Plus, a whole bunch of the left does not like her, nor wants to see Bill back in the White House. She can not beat McCain. Unless he was found with a dead boy or a live girl~

Obama on the other hand will not drag the right off their couches to vote against him. Plenty of them may/will choice to vote none of the above and stay home with their Budweiser Lite. Plus, he will not lose as many on the Left as she would. This gives him a serious edge over McCain.

Liberal, but voting for McCain if she gets it. NO MORE POLITICAL DYNASTIES IN THE WHITEHOUSE!!!1 =)'
 
2008-03-05 12:55:34 AM  
Clam Sandwich: Since the delegates are distributed proportionately, is being the "winner" even relevant?

It's an ego trip, that's all. Obama will likely come out with gains for the night despite relatively slim losses in Texas and Ohio.
 
2008-03-05 12:55:37 AM  
Outshined_One: Jamal Simmons on CNN is about to re-enact a Chappelle's Show "Keepin' It Real" skit momentarily. He's about ready to go off on everyone.

I would too if i was the only Obama supporter on a four man panel. With a smirking smileyface like Begala to endure, I'd lose my mind pretty quickly.
 
2008-03-05 12:55:46 AM  
the_cnidarian: AgentONeal: GOD DAMMIT TEXAS.

Only 5% of the caucuses are reporting and Obama has the lead with 54%.


Why are you trying to suppress the popular vote? ;)
 
2008-03-05 12:55:58 AM  
AgentONeal: GOD DAMMIT TEXAS.

GOD DAMMIT.

Say goodbye, Democrats, to a voter if you nominate Hillary. I'll be sitting it out. Trust me. Or I'll write myself in.


i decided i'm voting obama in nov. either i'll check a box or write his name, he's getting my vote both ways

/hoping to get a chance to vote again in june for obama, this time him instead of "uncommitted"
 
2008-03-05 12:56:02 AM  
cmartine: Republicans might just have a chance!

Seriously? "loose to McCain"?

/"loose" means not fastened, restrained, or contained; not taut, fixed, or rigid
//"lose" is the opposite of win, much like your picture
 
2008-03-05 12:56:05 AM  
I don't know why everyone's acting like Clinton got an upset. She was set to take Ohio and Texas by huge numbers.

She got Ohio and barely got Texas. Obama's still in the lead overall, he's winning over the Superdelagates, and there doesn't seem to be too many dumbass states left to give Hillary the win.
 
2008-03-05 12:56:06 AM  
Korzine: So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?

Pretty good, I'd say. And I hope they do because I hope it does lead to the creation of viable third parties. I'm sick of both parties, to be honest. Obama is different enough to basically be a third party president.
 
2008-03-05 12:56:19 AM  
It will be good for Obama to sweat. Let's see what he's like under pressure, because he ain't seen nothin' yet.
 
2008-03-05 12:56:31 AM  
Texas, you ignorant slut.


And here's my dichotomy from the political quizzes:

Your Conservative Breed: Anti-government Gunslinger
You are an Anti-government Gunslinger, also known as a libertarian conservative. You believe in smaller government, states' rights, gun rights, and that, as Reagan once said, "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'"


Your Liberal Breed: Social Justice Crusader
You are a Social Justice Crusader, also known as a rights activist. You believe in equality, fairness, and preventing neo-Confederate conservative troglodytes from rolling back fifty years of civil rights gains.
 
2008-03-05 12:56:46 AM  
USP .45: I thought Democrats were all about the popular vote?

He's still winning in that overall, too. If it were winner take all like some of the republican primaries, then this race would indeed be a different story.
 
2008-03-05 12:56:53 AM  
Wait, we're *positive* we can't get Kucinich's wife to run right?
 
2008-03-05 12:56:55 AM  
Number41: Korzine: So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?

Slim. Obama's still going to have a good lead on Hillary after today - heck, for delegates just today it's going to be really close. The doomsday talk in this thread isn't warranted.


That's good, I'm not a huge Obama fan, but he's better than Hillary. The thing is, they said that Hillary will be making a play to get super delegates on her side because she has won the "big" states.
 
2008-03-05 12:57:43 AM  
Mentat: If it comes down to it, I suppose a McCain Presidency with a strong Democratic majority in Congress will be ok. Hope it doesn't come down to that though.

I'm still hoping we can get out of this without a fifth Cli-Bush term...

/doesn't count Bush I in that term
 
2008-03-05 12:57:44 AM  
I'll be mailing my absentee ballot for McCain, from Canada, fark you all.
 
2008-03-05 12:57:53 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: March_Hare: This just in, guys:

TX (C) 5%
Obama 4%
Clinton 6%
Cute pictures of Corgis 90%

Which just goes to show that we can all agree on one thing.


/Yeah, cheap excuse to post a picture of my dog.


You are so lucky to own a cutie like that.

We just had to put down the dog I've had since I was 13, so it's been rough. The cute pictures of corgis helped me feel better about the lousy results and my puppy.
 
2008-03-05 12:57:55 AM  
All Clinton is accomplishing is hurting the party by dragging things out. She has a realistic shot at Pennsylvania, and maybe Kentucky but thats about it.
 
2008-03-05 12:58:06 AM  
Korzine: So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?

I'd say a good chance. They are going to sweat it out for a while, I'm sure, but ultimately Clinton has too big a hold on the Dem party through Bill and will "sway" them any way they need to. She's too close and too ruthless to let this get away from her.
 
2008-03-05 12:58:10 AM  
RminusQ: Yeah, I caught that link after my original post, and thanks.

But everyone, take the Texas caucus results with a grain of salt: gonna be a long hard slog before we sort all that out.

//by the way, "RminusQ," extraordinarily clever screenname.
 
2008-03-05 12:58:54 AM  
Tiber1: Hillary can not beat McCain...

If Clinton gets it, EVERY single Republican will come out to vote against her. They hate her, like rabid dogs. Plus, a whole bunch of the left does not like her, nor wants to see Bill back in the White House. She can not beat McCain. Unless he was found with a dead boy or a live girl~

Obama on the other hand will not drag the right off their couches to vote against him. Plenty of them may/will choice to vote none of the above and stay home with their Budweiser Lite. Plus, he will not lose as many on the Left as she would. This gives him a serious edge over McCain.

Liberal, but voting for McCain if she gets it. NO MORE POLITICAL DYNASTIES IN THE WHITEHOUSE!!!1 =)'


Oh please, Republicans are so disenchanted with their party they elected a candidate that none of the conservative establishment were willing to get behind initially. This is just an accusation that gets repeated over and over again. Conservative Republicans don't even like McCain.
 
2008-03-05 12:59:01 AM  
Clam Sandwich: Since the delegates are distributed proportionately, is being the "winner" even relevant?

NO!
 
2008-03-05 12:59:19 AM  
cmartine

I'm an obama supporter.

If he loses I plan to vote of hillary, I just prefer Obama because while him and hillary are 95% on their histories, I believe that he intends to reach out and actually work WITH the republican party, unlike her.
 
2008-03-05 12:59:25 AM  
Imagine how things would be if:

Al Gore won 2 terms... followed by Hillary Clinton...
 
2008-03-05 12:59:29 AM  
All Apologies: I don't know if you've noticed or not, but the states Hillary has won are by far, the largest states.

That's been her strategy. Fark off, little states. She mostly ignores them.

JohnnyC:
It isn't just on fark... it's everyone I've spoken with from just about all walks of life. I have met a couple of people who were planning on voting for her, but not because they like her, but because they didn't want to vote for a black guy. Yeah, I realize how shiatty that is from various angles. But seriously, I haven't talked with a single person who has said, "I think she would make the best President for our country".

I'm not saying those people don't exist, I just don't find them... anywhere.


You need to talk to middle aged women and old people in general.
 
2008-03-05 12:59:44 AM  
Someone drive a stake through that coont's heart/head/wherever.
 
2008-03-05 12:59:46 AM  
Tiber1: Liberal, but voting for McCain if she gets it. NO MORE POLITICAL DYNASTIES IN THE WHITEHOUSE!!!1 =)'

I'm nowhere near convinced that McCain wouldn't be the same as a third term for Dubya. I've lost a lot of respect for him in the past few years. Too bad...I would have proudly voted for him in 2000.
 
2008-03-05 12:59:47 AM  
Hillary is winning big states that the Dems need to win. I dont see obama taking the red states that he has won in the primaries. And with Michigan and Flordias delegates being out there I wouldnt be surprised if that went to court to have them counted.
 
2008-03-05 01:00:01 AM  
RminusQ: Clam Sandwich: Since the delegates are distributed proportionately, is being the "winner" even relevant?

NO!


only on a psychological level
 
2008-03-05 01:00:17 AM  
Bhasayate: Korzine: So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?

Pretty good, I'd say. And I hope they do because I hope it does lead to the creation of viable third parties. I'm sick of both parties, to be honest. Obama is different enough to basically be a third party president.


A third party might be good, but I'm not sure Obama would do it. He's still young enough to wait it out and run again in 2012 if he loses. I'm not sure he'd want to alienate himself against the democratic party.

I see Hillary going third party if she loses much more likely. Split the democratic vote and boom, Mccain takes office.
 
2008-03-05 01:00:21 AM  
SAvoodoo: /hoping to get a chance to vote again in june for obama, this time him instead of "uncommitted"

Yeah... I had to vote "uncommitted" as well. Wasn't very happy about that at all.
 
2008-03-05 01:00:26 AM  
So why does CNN want Clinton to win?
 
2008-03-05 01:00:26 AM  
USP .45: Why are you trying to suppress the popular vote? ;)

Obviously Limbaugh's army of clones is who gave Hillary the win.
 
2008-03-05 01:00:53 AM  
Kaybeck: I don't know why everyone's acting like Clinton got an upset. She was set to take Ohio and Texas by huge numbers.

She got Ohio and barely got Texas. Obama's still in the lead overall, he's winning over the Superdelagates, and there doesn't seem to be too many dumbass states left to give Hillary the win.


Because if she loses either one, she has to drop out. She was half-dead yesterday, now she's less dead. And Obama can't win the popular vote in two big states - that's a big deal in November.
 
2008-03-05 01:01:06 AM  
I'm more embarassed than usual to be a Texan tonight.
 
2008-03-05 01:01:09 AM  
quisqueyano: All right, so what's left it this plays out all the way?
Here's my gut calls (haven't checked polls, just going on gut)
North Carolina -- Obama
Mississippi -- Obama
Pennsylvania -- Edge: Clinton
Indiana -- Obama
S Dakota -- Haven't a clue
Kentucky -- Edge: Obama
Oregon -- Obama

Agree? Disagree?


Going off of Pollster.com, I'd go Pennsylvania solidly Clinton for the moment (46.7% to 36.9%) that could change as they campaign. North Carolina is more in play than I think you give credit for. Obama's ahead, but not by much, and there are a bunch of undecideds as of the last polling (38% to 32.5%). No one's polling in the later states yet (since they're almost two months off). It's still a horse race
 
2008-03-05 01:01:46 AM  
sweet jesus i hate mccain but still, i don't think i can fathom voting for hillary. Why? Because the idea of two families controlling the white house for several decades is more damaging to our democracy than McCain's lying ass.

Who gives a shiat about politics if you can't even get involved unless you are already born of the predetermined crotch?
 
2008-03-05 01:01:52 AM  
Well, shiat. I'm disheartened by the news, I thought Texas would be a win by a much wider margin for Obama. In fact, I owe my buddy a beer now. But there's plenty of fight left in this dog. It sucks that Hillary will be turning this into a reason to continue running and dividing the party even more, but that's the breaks.

Obama supporters are much more active than Hill-dogs. We donate, we volunteer, we caucus, we show up. If we keep doing these things, we'll have a real change in January.

As for me, does anyone know how expensive housing is in the Hampton Roads area of VA?
 
2008-03-05 01:02:02 AM  
the_cnidarian: Obviously Limbaugh's army of clones is who gave Hillary the win.

Crush Limbaugh? He's too busy crushing pills to build an army of clones.
 
2008-03-05 01:02:25 AM  
patrick767: All Apologies: I don't know if you've noticed or not, but the states Hillary has won are by far, the largest states.

That's been her strategy. Fark off, little states. She mostly ignores them.


The majority of people in the most populous blue states are voting for Clinton, she is getting the important votes in the needed states from a huge number of people. There is another angle to this that hasn't been getting any attention.
 
2008-03-05 01:02:30 AM  
the_cnidarian: Obviously Limbaugh's army of clones is who gave Hillary the win.

Despite the fact that she had been leading up until a few days ago.

But hey, at least your not blaming the Jews.
 
2008-03-05 01:02:49 AM  
Sad. Obama has to get out on the ground tomorrow, saying his delegate lead is more important, that her victories were wonderful but right now, more democrats want him. Don't be dismissive of either Ohio or Texas, just go out in a few days, take Wyoming, and then work over those super delegates. Release 'em a few at a time over the next two weeks. Drop in a big name release - Gore, Biden, Richardson, ect one at a time and let 'em stack. Show that the real core of the democratic party belongs to Obama.
 
2008-03-05 01:02:53 AM  
threefeetoffun: Hillary is winning big states that the Dems need to win. I dont see obama taking the red states that he has won in the primaries. And with Michigan and Flordias delegates being out there I wouldnt be surprised if that went to court to have them counted.

The SO and I were talking about that and he brought up Michigan and Florida. I agree with that assessment. It will get more confusing the further this goes. This will make the Florida chad fiasco look quaint.
 
2008-03-05 01:02:54 AM  
sjbiars: Imagine how things would be if:

Al Gore won 2 terms... followed by Hillary Clinton...


It's called France.
 
2008-03-05 01:02:59 AM  
I never thought I'd say thank God for Texas...but I can say it tonight.

I am so happy that Barack Obama was rejected. The man is a phony. He is completely unsuited for the presidency. And once the media stop giving him a free pass, he'll be exposed for what he really is. If he's the Democratic nominee, McCain will crush him.

And, to be honest, if Obama is the Democratic nominee, I'll vote for McCain. It'll be the first time I've ever voted for a Republican for president. But them's the breaks. I just can't in good conscience vote for Mr. Obama.
 
2008-03-05 01:03:06 AM  
Some of you Obama farkers are very emo. Don't kill yourself yet, he's probably still leading.
 
2008-03-05 01:03:06 AM  
So Clinton gains delegates tonight, but now what does she need the rest of the way, 70%? Obama should drop the S-bomb Tom Brokaw kept mentioning sometime Thursday, and that'll put an end to this momentum bullshiat.

ejwaxx: //by the way, "RminusQ," extraordinarily clever screenname.

Well hold on, what do you read it as meaning?
 
2008-03-05 01:03:19 AM  
Sigh. I'm embarrassed for my state. Although I take comfort that if the Democrats end up voting somebody as unelectable as Hillary, I can confidently vote for McCain simply on the basis that one party shouldn't control the White House and Congress. But my god are the democratic voters idiots.
 
2008-03-05 01:03:22 AM  
RminusQ: Clam Sandwich: Since the delegates are distributed proportionately, is being the "winner" even relevant?

NO!


Exactly, as an added bonus if the results from Texas stay the same they will split the delegates straight down the middle
 
2008-03-05 01:03:27 AM  
This could be the best thing to ever happen to the Democratic Party. Folks may disagree, possibly violently, but keeping our candidates in the news completely overshadows any message McCain can put out to the general population as long as this goes on. Especially those who get their info from the MSM. The longer this drags out, the better for the party. The big 'if' is if folks who are supporting Obama or Clinton decide to give their support to the one who wins the nomination. Let's face it: both Hillary and Barack have similar views on the issues. Though I'll give my support to the eventual nominee, I'm glad Hillary lives to fight another day. It keeps the party's messages on the front pages.

/more Dems are voting now than total in previous Presidential elections
//Democracy finally!
 
2008-03-05 01:03:29 AM  
tendervittles: I don't know if it's been said yet, but I think sometimes quoting Ichiro is the best thing to do.

"To tell the truth, I'm not excited to go to Cleveland, but we have to," Ichiro said through an interpreter. "If I ever saw myself saying I'm excited going to Cleveland, I'd punch myself in the face, because I'm lying."


Totally forgot about that quote.

Ichiro for Obama 08!!?
 
2008-03-05 01:03:33 AM  
BolshevikMuppet:

/is in the age group in question

Your post made my point that Clinton supporters are largely the party over principle types quite nicely, thanks so much.

/the "real Democrats" thing was a nice touch
 
2008-03-05 01:03:33 AM  
Whether Obama or Clinton wins will (assuming all things are the same then) whether I vote for Obama or McCain in the general election. I really hate that too because after Bush I swore to myself I would not, could not vote Republican in this election no matter what.


...and now Clinton is here and I find myself wanting to go back on that if she's the democratic nominee.

/damn you, Clinton!
 
2008-03-05 01:03:33 AM  
Oh snap... Well... looks like this one's going on and on and into the convention.
 
2008-03-05 01:03:46 AM  
USP .45: But hey, at least your not blaming the Jews.

Well they do own the media, and are therefore Rush's puppet masters.
 
2008-03-05 01:04:08 AM  
ghettoblaster: sjbiars: Imagine how things would be if:

Al Gore won 2 terms... followed by Hillary Clinton...

It's called France.


ROFL.
 
2008-03-05 01:04:10 AM  
TEXAS: We can has fail. We can.
 
2008-03-05 01:04:19 AM  
JohnnyC: SAvoodoo: /hoping to get a chance to vote again in june for obama, this time him instead of "uncommitted"

Yeah... I had to vote "uncommitted" as well. Wasn't very happy about that at all.


They had a sheet for uncommitted voters this evening. I didn't see any names on it. All I could think was that if anybody was willing to wait in the cold + stiff wind for three hours so they could cram themselves into a standing room only elementary school gym so they could potentially wait hours more -- well, they'd have to be awfully committed to being uncommitted.
 
2008-03-05 01:04:20 AM  
All Apologies: The majority of people in the most populous blue states are voting for Clinton, she is getting the important votes in the needed states from a huge number of people. There is another angle to this that hasn't been getting any attention.

Odd... Seems like every single major city is going for Obama. Can you name one that didn't?

Hillary is getting by with more rural votes (mostly by name recognition is my guess).
 
2008-03-05 01:04:21 AM  
So much doom and gloom, keep those chins up (as in each of your singular chin, I'm not saying you're fat!), Obama supporters! She's not making any dent in the delegate lead, and that just makes her have to win all the upcoming primaries by larger and larger amounts, like 65%.

Especially with her talk about the next primary being PA, which is untrue, she's counting out the small states, and that's where Obama put it to her on Super-Uber-Spectacular-Tuesday the first time, it's where he won 11 straight, and it's where he'll keep going before PA. The Guiliani strategy she's laying out will fail, as will her dirty politics. She threw everything she could think of at Obama for 2 weeks, and he's still going to win in delegates tonight.

Keep fighting the good fight, and keep it classy, every Clinton supporter we ostracize with nasty remarks is one less supporter against McCain.
 
2008-03-05 01:04:28 AM  
RminusQ: As a math joke. Am I overthinking something?
 
2008-03-05 01:04:53 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: Tiber1: Liberal, but voting for McCain if she gets it. NO MORE POLITICAL DYNASTIES IN THE WHITEHOUSE!!!1 =)'

I'm nowhere near convinced that McCain wouldn't be the same as a third term for Dubya. I've lost a lot of respect for him in the past few years. Too bad...I would have proudly voted for him in 2000.


Just curious... in 2000, would you have proudly voted for (not yet Senator) Hillary Clinton?
 
2008-03-05 01:05:18 AM  
PocketfullaSass: I'm more embarassed than usual to be a Texan tonight.

All I saw was barassed Texan...so here's a window into my head right now...

www.ugo.com

/Obama should've brought 'em on the campaign trail - that would've gotten the male vote out more.
 
2008-03-05 01:05:25 AM  
eraser8: I am so happy that Barack Obama was rejected. The man is a phony.

Good thing we have an authentic New Yorker like Hillary running...
 
2008-03-05 01:05:28 AM  
NOBAMA
 
2008-03-05 01:05:44 AM  
krunvisaurus: I'll be mailing my absentee ballot for McCain, from Canada, fark you all.

Don't let the door hit you in the ass on the way out.
 
2008-03-05 01:05:57 AM  
BTW, this isn't over yet in Texas. Some of Obama's strongest areas in the crowded population centers haven't been fully counted yet.

Probably not enough to put him over the top in the popular vote, but the popular vote doesn't count for anything other than the weight the media chooses to give it.
 
2008-03-05 01:06:26 AM  
No way!!!! This is crap. Thanks, fellow Texans.
 
2008-03-05 01:06:28 AM  
Lando Lincoln: Oh crap, now the Irony Goons are going to be all over me.

What I saw in my twisted mind:

i4.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 01:06:31 AM  
i214.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 01:06:32 AM  
TX-Law: As for me, does anyone know how expensive housing is in the Hampton Roads area of VA?

I've got a decent place for no dollars a month. At Dam Neck barracks, that is.
 
2008-03-05 01:07:10 AM  
JohnnyC: All Apologies: The majority of people in the most populous blue states are voting for Clinton, she is getting the important votes in the needed states from a huge number of people. There is another angle to this that hasn't been getting any attention.

Odd... Seems like every single major city is going for Obama. Can you name one that didn't?

Hillary is getting by with more rural votes (mostly by name recognition is my guess).


I don't care so much that I'm going to argue with you for hours on end.

But, Clinton has plenty of support.
 
2008-03-05 01:07:35 AM  
eraser8: I never thought I'd say thank God for Texas...but I can say it tonight.

I am so happy that Barack Obama was rejected. The man is a phony. He is completely unsuited for the presidency. And once the media stop giving him a free pass, he'll be exposed for what he really is. If he's the Democratic nominee, McCain will crush him.

And, to be honest, if Obama is the Democratic nominee, I'll vote for McCain. It'll be the first time I've ever voted for a Republican for president. But them's the breaks. I just can't in good conscience vote for Mr. Obama.


Please inform us as to what you think he really is and, specifically what makes him a phony.

/you mean like a phony that takes "Yes we can" and turns it into "Yes she will"?
 
2008-03-05 01:07:37 AM  
Dear God, USP .45 just mopped up in this thread. All he said was US blue collar protectionism isn't such a great thing in the long term. One doesn't have to be a staunch laissez-faire proponent to make this observation.

It's threads like these that inspire me to read more market theory to capitalize on ignorant folks that think they know the D/L about CHINER©2008 and dem outsourcin' Folkz™ in INdra. Seriously, the retorts amounted to:

* you're an evil capitalist who hates America
* more money for US blue collar works = a better America = overpaid workers = less buying power for blue coll -- wait what?!?
* the lovable non sequitur remark of "don't put all your eggs in one basket." I'm still WTF'ing about that one. That has down syndrome written all over it.
 
2008-03-05 01:07:52 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: JohnnyC: SAvoodoo: /hoping to get a chance to vote again in june for obama, this time him instead of "uncommitted"

Yeah... I had to vote "uncommitted" as well. Wasn't very happy about that at all.

They had a sheet for uncommitted voters this evening. I didn't see any names on it. All I could think was that if anybody was willing to wait in the cold + stiff wind for three hours so they could cram themselves into a standing room only elementary school gym so they could potentially wait hours more -- well, they'd have to be awfully committed to being uncommitted.


that's not all that surprising this late in the race. considering I voted in MI (as did Johnny I assume) there wasn't much of a choice
 
2008-03-05 01:07:54 AM  
BuckTurgidson: Just curious... in 2000, would you have proudly voted for (not yet Senator) Hillary Clinton?

Back then, it would have depended on her competition. In 2000, I was still of the "George W Bush? Hrumph, how bad could he possibly fark up?" mentality. :D
 
2008-03-05 01:07:55 AM  
I don't know if it's good strategy or not, but now that Clinton has laid claim to Florida, I'd like to see Obama show up in Miami tomorrow to give a surprise speech.
 
2008-03-05 01:07:58 AM  
IXI Jim IXI writes: Good thing we have an authentic New Yorker like Hillary running...

Yes. It is.
 
2008-03-05 01:08:03 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: eraser8: I am so happy that Barack Obama was rejected. The man is a phony.

Good thing we have an authentic New Yorker like Hillary running...


No, but we have an authentic Democrats, a true Democrat's Democrat, back to when being a member of the Democratic party was a four-letter word to Republicans. I'll be glad to the sort of crazy partisanship of the next Clinton presidency. The Republicans deserve to watch all their ideas get rejected one-by-one.
 
2008-03-05 01:08:12 AM  
Prospero424: BTW, this isn't over yet in Texas. Some of Obama's strongest areas in the crowded population centers haven't been fully counted yet.

Probably not enough to put him over the top in the popular vote, but the popular vote doesn't count for anything other than the weight the media chooses to give it.


I noticed the same thing. 50% unreported in Houston with a 50K vote difference in favor of Obama already? Seems early to call IMO
 
2008-03-05 01:08:29 AM  
Curt Blizzah: This could be the best thing to ever happen to the Democratic Party. Folks may disagree, possibly violently, but keeping our candidates in the news completely overshadows any message McCain can put out to the general population as long as this goes on.

I have heard that argument, and other different circumstances I might agree. But Hillary has proven herself willing to do anything to win... even poison the well so that no Democrat can win in November as long as she can get the nomination.

No... this needs to end, and it needs to end soon.
 
2008-03-05 01:08:34 AM  
BlippityBleep - Aristocracy? I think not.

Plutocracy, perhaps even mediocracy, but not aristocracy.
 
2008-03-05 01:08:48 AM  
Well if it's Hillary vs. McCain, we can always write in Arnold Schwarzenegger.
 
2008-03-05 01:08:57 AM  
Well, it goes to show that negative ads continue to work in this country.

The Clinton's will do anything to get elected. I refuse to apologize for wanting a candidate that doesn't see the need to follow suit.
 
2008-03-05 01:09:11 AM  
I humbly offer my poem to all TheBamaBots again (this is so much fun):

Boom boom bam !
goes the bama
beaten by a coont
like a cuban cigar
out of havana !

Boom boom bam !
goes the bama
plenty of time now
to catch a show
or sing rosh hasanna.
 
2008-03-05 01:09:18 AM  
sjbiars: All Clinton is accomplishing is hurting the party by dragging things out.

Agreed. I don't even think she'd be such a terrible President, but there's so much out-of-control hate for her that she needs to step aside. The Obama fans now won't be bothered to come out, vote and prevent GOP control of the White House if Hillary gets the nod, even if she managed to pull it off transparently and legitimately.
 
2008-03-05 01:09:20 AM  
All Apologies: I don't care so much that I'm going to argue with you for hours on end.

So your answer is "No... I have zero evidence to support my claims".

But, Clinton has plenty of support.

Oh... well I suppose we should just take your well laid out opinions on that. ;) haha
 
2008-03-05 01:09:34 AM  
 
2008-03-05 01:09:39 AM  
Korzine: So, whats the chance that the super delegates elect Hillary over Obama?

Little to none.
 
2008-03-05 01:09:52 AM  
Does anybody have a clue how the heck a revote in FL and MI would work?

I'd swing by the Supervisor of Elections tomorrow and switch my registration if there was any chance I'd get to vote in a revote, but I'd assume that since I already voted in the Republican primary I wouldn't get to. Does anybody know?

/Sucks because if it had counted, I probably would have switched the first go round
//Why does Florida have to fark things up all the time?
 
2008-03-05 01:10:04 AM  
i31.tinypic.com
 
2008-03-05 01:10:06 AM  
shift_DAWG: BlippityBleep - Aristocracy? I think not.

Plutocracy, perhaps even mediocracy, but not aristocracy.


You're right. Still, this country has gone straight down the shiatter since these clowns began this crap. I want America back.
 
2008-03-05 01:10:12 AM  
You guys should all chill. The media would rather look wrong than lose ratings. We won't know the true tally is till next week.
 
2008-03-05 01:10:14 AM  
PocketfullaSass: I'm more embarassed than usual to be a Texan tonight.

Remember the happy days before 2001 when it was actually fun to declare yourself a Texan?
 
2008-03-05 01:10:20 AM  
botsects: Dear God, USP .45 just mopped up in this thread. All he said was US blue collar protectionism isn't such a great thing in the long term. One doesn't have to be a staunch laissez-faire proponent to make this observation.

It's threads like these that inspire me to read more market theory to capitalize on ignorant folks that think they know the D/L about CHINER©2008 and dem outsourcin' Folkz™ in INdra. Seriously, the retorts amounted to:

* you're an evil capitalist who hates America
* more money for US blue collar works = a better America = overpaid workers = less buying power for blue coll -- wait what?!?
* the lovable non sequitur remark of "don't put all your eggs in one basket." I'm still WTF'ing about that one. That has down syndrome written all over it.


No, but it's a great short-term solution to our problems. Plus, it's ensure loyal votes, so I'm always for anything that gets more Democrats in power.

// party over principle always
/// Hillary to the White House
 
2008-03-05 01:10:28 AM  
And Olbermann invokes the milkshake.
 
2008-03-05 01:10:29 AM  
Your Liberal Breed: Social Justice Crusadereraser8: I am so happy that Barack Obama was rejected. The man is a phony. He is completely unsuited for the presidency. And once the media stop giving him a free pass, he'll be exposed for what he really is. If he's the Democratic nominee, McCain will crush him.


Not necessarily. Many conservatives prefer Obama to McCain, because they feel that although Obama is a liberal they can trust him. They've lost trust in McCain.

And I'd strongly consider McCain over Clinton in the vooting booth. As would a whole shiatload of the country. She won't get the win.
 
2008-03-05 01:10:59 AM  
MSNBC dude just said "I can drink your milkshake." Will it ever end?
 
2008-03-05 01:11:04 AM  
"I can drink your milkshake."

Awesome.
 
2008-03-05 01:11:04 AM  
I really hope Hillary wins. You know why? Because MAYBE THIS TIME the dumb americans will farking wake up to understand the FACT that both parties are double teaming THEM and it's time for a revolution.
 
2008-03-05 01:11:07 AM  
Remove all Republicans: No, but we have an authentic Democrats, a true Democrat's Democrat, back to when being a member of the Democratic party was a four-letter word to Republicans. I'll be glad to the sort of crazy partisanship of the next Clinton presidency. The Republicans deserve to watch all their ideas get rejected one-by-one.

I just don't see her being as successful at pulling that off as Bill was.

Looks like I'll be voting for gridlock again...
 
2008-03-05 01:11:08 AM  
d976 writes: Please inform us as to what you think he really is and, specifically what makes him a phony.

I'll just cut and paste what I wrote earlier tonight:
For one thing, Obama has been talking about change. But he's the major candidate with the least change-worthy platform. He talks about Americans wanting hard answers to tough questions. But he's the major candidate who's been least willing to give real answers about where he wants to lead the country. He's crowed about his initial opposition to the Iraq war, characterizing that decision as something courageous and wise. But at the time he made that decision, he represented an electorate the was OVERWHELMINGLY opposed to the invasion. He's claimed in Audacity that an Illinois legislator has to make "yes" or "no" decisions and live with the consequences. But his record clearly indicates that, time and again, he voted "present" on politically sensitive votes. He claims (just as Bush did in 2000) that he can bridge the political divide. But he has been one of the most consistently partisan members of the 109th and 100th Congresses (at least Bush actually had a record of bipartisanship in Texas when he made the claim of being a uniter).
 
2008-03-05 01:11:22 AM  
sjbiars: the_cnidarian: Obviously Limbaugh's army of clones is who gave Hillary the win.

Crush Limbaugh? He's too busy crushing pills to build an army of clones.


i258.photobucket.com

/my ms paint skillz
//let me show you them
 
2008-03-05 01:11:28 AM  
SAvoodoo: ThisIsNotSubtle: JohnnyC: SAvoodoo: /hoping to get a chance to vote again in june for obama, this time him instead of "uncommitted"

Yeah... I had to vote "uncommitted" as well. Wasn't very happy about that at all.

They had a sheet for uncommitted voters this evening. I didn't see any names on it. All I could think was that if anybody was willing to wait in the cold + stiff wind for three hours so they could cram themselves into a standing room only elementary school gym so they could potentially wait hours more -- well, they'd have to be awfully committed to being uncommitted.

that's not all that surprising this late in the race. considering I voted in MI (as did Johnny I assume) there wasn't much of a choice


Yeah, I was guessing something along those lines. It was just kind of comic at the time, listening to this woman repeatedly trying to be sure that everyone present was aware that if they were uncommitted, she was the one to talk to. She seemed utterly bewildered that she didn't have any takers.

After a while, they had her signing Obama supporters instead.
 
2008-03-05 01:11:35 AM  
IT'S NOT OVER TILL IT'S OVER
 
2008-03-05 01:11:39 AM  
Blues_X: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.


It's "lose", like your girlfriend to lesbianism.

It's "loose", like yo mamma.

Let's get this straight, folks.

+1""


// it make a person stop & consider somthing...
politicians pull boners sometimes to increase publicity. because an early boner or 3 will be forgotten in 9 mo..
or maybe, a baby
 
2008-03-05 01:12:12 AM  
insomniac8400: Well if it's Hillary vs. McCain, we can always write in Arnold Schwarzenegger.

You. Newsletter. Get printing!
 
2008-03-05 01:12:13 AM  
Ok, why was some chick from California in a Podunk Texas town farking with the Democratic caucaus tonight? She seemed to be working for Obama, but ended up getting escorted out of the building by cops.

The thing is she was trying to tell the caucaus chair how to divide up the delegats. Now this is a stunt I would expect from Clinton, not from Obama.

Weird huh? BTW I will be submiting the story if it makes it to the news tomorrow, I am hoping that there arn't too many of these events. Also, the chick was on the phone about the time things went south for her, don't know with who.
 
2008-03-05 01:12:31 AM  
lolmao666: I really hope Hillary wins. You know why? Because MAYBE THIS TIME the dumb americans will farking wake up to understand the FACT that both parties are double teaming THEM and it's time for a revolution.

You really should take your crazy self to some other forum, like DailyKos or something. Or did they already kick you out of there too?
 
2008-03-05 01:12:34 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: Back then, it would have depended on her competition. In 2000, I was still of the "George W Bush? Hrumph, how bad could he possibly fark up?" mentality. :D

Hah, me too.
 
2008-03-05 01:12:45 AM  
Blues_X

And I'd strongly consider McCain over Clinton in the vooting booth. As would a whole shiatload of the country. She won't get the win.

I'd venture to say that this is the opinion of about 75% of moderate Democrats.
 
2008-03-05 01:13:03 AM  
wsupfoo

True, I think they haven't finished Harris County, Travis County and Dallas County. Which are the biggest metropolitan areas in TX. Basically Houston, Austin, and of course, Dallas. Guess I shouldn't give up yet!
 
2008-03-05 01:13:09 AM  
Did Soledad O'Brien knit that sweater herself?
 
2008-03-05 01:13:10 AM  
PocketfullaSass: I'm more embarassed than usual to be a Texan tonight.

Uh you weren't embarrassed to be a Texan when you elected GWB as your governor? Were you not paying attention to the way he handled the Rangers? Any business? His alcohol?
 
2008-03-05 01:13:26 AM  
lolmao666: I really hope Hillary wins. You know why? Because MAYBE THIS TIME the dumb americans will farking wake up to understand the FACT that both parties are double teaming THEM and it's time for a revolution.
BudTheSpud: lolmao666: I really hope Hillary wins. You know why? Because MAYBE THIS TIME the dumb americans will farking wake up to understand the FACT that both parties are double teaming THEM and it's time for a revolution.

You really should take your crazy self to some other forum, like DailyKos or something. Or did they already kick you out of there too?


Although I should add that I agree with the revolution part.
 
2008-03-05 01:13:31 AM  
One thing I noticed watching Hillary and Obama speak tonight...She's begun to mock/copy him with "Yes, we will" but he has now pretty much dropped it. He still asked the questions, but let the crowd add the response. I also perceived Obama shifting the rhetoric to a new level.
 
2008-03-05 01:13:39 AM  
NBC just called Texas for the hil-dog.

/Get used to saying 'President McCain'
 
2008-03-05 01:13:41 AM  
Hmmm. Why are big states important....

United States Electoral College
Clinton so far....
New Hampshire-4
Michigan-17
Nevada-5
Florida-27
Arizona-10
Arkansas-6
California-55
Massachusetts-12
New Jersey-10
New Mexico-5
New York-31
Oklahoma-7
Tennessee-11
Ohio-20
Rhode Island-4
Texas-34
Total....258 (269 to win)

/just a thought.
 
2008-03-05 01:13:45 AM  
I am just enjoying the irony of Democrats placing so much hope on events in Texas.
 
2008-03-05 01:14:02 AM  
eraser8: d976 writes: Please inform us as to what you think he really is and, specifically what makes him a phony.

I'll just cut and paste what I wrote earlier tonight:
For one thing, Obama has been talking about change. But he's the major candidate with the least change-worthy platform. He talks about Americans wanting hard answers to tough questions. But he's the major candidate who's been least willing to give real answers about where he wants to lead the country. He's crowed about his initial opposition to the Iraq war, characterizing that decision as something courageous and wise. But at the time he made that decision, he represented an electorate the was OVERWHELMINGLY opposed to the invasion. He's claimed in Audacity that an Illinois legislator has to make "yes" or "no" decisions and live with the consequences. But his record clearly indicates that, time and again, he voted "present" on politically sensitive votes. He claims (just as Bush did in 2000) that he can bridge the political divide. But he has been one of the most consistently partisan members of the 109th and 100th Congresses (at least Bush actually had a record of bipartisanship in Texas when he made the claim of being a uniter).


Wow. That's one of the biggest piles of steaming, made up crap I've ever seen. Even on Fark.
 
2008-03-05 01:14:07 AM  
wsupfoo: Prospero424: BTW, this isn't over yet in Texas. Some of Obama's strongest areas in the crowded population centers haven't been fully counted yet.

Probably not enough to put him over the top in the popular vote, but the popular vote doesn't count for anything other than the weight the media chooses to give it.

I noticed the same thing. 50% unreported in Houston with a 50K vote difference in favor of Obama already? Seems early to call IMO


A lot of the Metroplex is also still unreported along with all of Bell County (Fort Hood)
 
2008-03-05 01:14:44 AM  
Gwendolyn: Uh you weren't embarrassed to be a Texan when you elected GWB as your governor? Were you not paying attention to the way he handled the Rangers? Any business? His alcohol?

He did his part to help the Columbian economy...
 
2008-03-05 01:14:45 AM  
patrick767:
What planet are you from? You're saying the exact opposite of what all the polling data is telling us and that's this: McCain has a far better chance of beating Clinton than he does of beating Obama. Look it up for once.

Clinton comes with a large built in negative. Too many people just plain hate her, whether that's justified or not. You want to alienate more independents and as an added bonus, energize the demoralized GOP voters? Then nominate Hillary.


THIS. (From thread III.)

Why else would Repubs avoid the GOP primaries and vote for Clinton in the Dem primaries? So that they can use their playbook, developed over the last several years, to defeat her. And it'll work, too. They know this.

They also know that Clinton has used up pretty much all of the available attacks against Obama, and they just don't work (except maybe on doltish Ohioans.)
 
2008-03-05 01:15:03 AM  
rynthetyn: Does anybody have a clue how the heck a revote in FL and MI would work?

Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

The Democrats should count all the delegates. Then they can blast the Republicans for not counting 1/2 of the delegates. Then, you can complain all day that McCain is their true candidate and the Republicans are working to disenfranchising African-Americans and other groups, like they have throughout the history of that party.

If anyone know about disenfranchised votes, it's the Democratic party.
 
2008-03-05 01:15:12 AM  
franjime: Michigan-17

You can't count Michigan... sorry.
 
2008-03-05 01:15:15 AM  
wsupfoo: I noticed the same thing. 50% unreported in Houston with a 50K vote difference in favor of Obama already? Seems early to call IMO

While I'm sure he'll make up some ground, look at El Paso. Hillary won bigtime there. I'm guessing the numbers there had something to do with the networks calling it for her....pretty ugly.
 
2008-03-05 01:15:15 AM  
Tiber1: Obama on the other hand will not drag the right off their couches to vote against him. Plenty of them may/will choice to vote none of the above and stay home with their Budweiser Lite. Plus, he will not lose as many on the Left as she would. This gives him a serious edge over McCain.

Liberal, but voting for McCain if she gets it. NO MORE POLITICAL DYNASTIES IN THE WHITEHOUSE!!!1 =)'


This is so bizarre. I'm a Republican...if Hillary gets it you and I are voting for the same candidate. If Obama gets it you and I are voting for the same candidate. How bizarre is that for both of us.
 
2008-03-05 01:15:22 AM  
Blues_X writes: Not necessarily. Many conservatives prefer Obama to McCain...

NOW they do. TODAY they do.

Don't expect that to hold as the media finally take a good, solid look at Mr. Obama.

Keep in mind that at this point in the 1992 campaign, Bill Clinton was in THIRD place in the polls (behind both Bush and Perot). Don't make the mistake of simply extrapolating today's state of affairs. Elections don't work like that.

And I'd strongly consider McCain over Clinton in the vooting booth.

I'd certainly consider McCain over Clinton. But I'd probably choose Clinton. If it's McCain v. Obama, it's a much easier choice for me: McCain.
 
2008-03-05 01:15:41 AM  
eraser8: I'll just cut and paste what I wrote earlier tonight:

Of course you will.
 
2008-03-05 01:15:49 AM  
InferiousX: Blues_X

And I'd strongly consider McCain over Clinton in the vooting booth. As would a whole shiatload of the country. She won't get the win.

I'd venture to say that this is the opinion of about 75% of moderate Democrats.


My brother and my sister in law are staunch Democrats. The helped put up signs and donated time and money to Kerry/Edwards. They HATE Hillary. I think people are underestimating how many Democrats hate Hillary just as much as they typically hate Republicans.
 
2008-03-05 01:16:07 AM  
Flatulent_Flea: One thing I noticed watching Hillary and Obama speak tonight...She's begun to mock/copy him with "Yes, we will" but he has now pretty much dropped it. He still asked the questions, but let the crowd add the response. I also perceived Obama shifting the rhetoric to a new level.

If you listen to the Hillary crowd, they are chanting, "Yes She Will"...
 
2008-03-05 01:16:39 AM  
baby_hewey: Ok, why was some chick from California in a Podunk Texas town farking with the Democratic caucaus tonight? She seemed to be working for Obama, but ended up getting escorted out of the building by cops.

The thing is she was trying to tell the caucaus chair how to divide up the delegats. Now this is a stunt I would expect from Clinton, not from Obama.

Weird huh? BTW I will be submiting the story if it makes it to the news tomorrow, I am hoping that there arn't too many of these events. Also, the chick was on the phone about the time things went south for her, don't know with who.



wtf are you talking about? there's no room dividing at a caucus in TX, I just got back from one a few hours ago. You just sign in with a vote. Stop making up stories based on what you heard about how an Iowa causus works.
 
2008-03-05 01:16:43 AM  
GreenPlastik: Flatulent_Flea: Obscure: All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

this.

QFT


So help me God, I am going to smack you sissies straight to hell and back.

She is NOT going to win the nomination of the Democratic Party. IF she wins the nomination through superdelegates over-riding the popular vote OR if she sues to get the MI and FL votes counted, then the Democratic Party will cease to exist as a cohesive political structure. And then we'll all vote for Obama as an independent and dance on the grave of the DNC when we win.

So stop with the crying, emo kids, and get back to reality.

A week from now Obama will have two more victories under his belt and his delegate lead will be larger.
 
2008-03-05 01:16:51 AM  
Wolfmanjames: I am just enjoying the irony of Democrats placing so much hope on events in Texas.

Do you understand that these events are primaries and not Democrat vs. Republican. The irony is that Texas was all Democrat all the time until the mid 80s.
 
2008-03-05 01:16:51 AM  
JohnnyC: franjime: Michigan-17

You can't count Michigan... sorry.


Damn. Forgot Poland, too.


/Do-over time for MI and FL
 
2008-03-05 01:16:56 AM  
dramaticpause: They also know that Clinton has used up pretty much all of the available attacks against Obama, and they just don't work

How long until someone mentions a black baby?
 
2008-03-05 01:17:03 AM  
eraser8: If it's McCain v. Obama, it's a much easier choice for me: McCain.

That's because you're a retarded jerkoff.
 
2008-03-05 01:17:14 AM  
Blues_X: Not necessarily. Many conservatives prefer Obama to McCain, because they feel that although Obama is a liberal they can trust him. They've lost trust in McCain.

I'm a conservative who was going to vote for McCain until his votes on the torture bill and the wiretap bill. I was OK with him until then--heck, I voted for him in Florida's primary--but that flip flop lost me. I'm not going to vote for a guy who'll flip flop on torture, it means I can't trust him to do the right thing when push comes to shove.

In other words, I'm voting for Obama if he gets the nomination

/Donated to Obama's campaign too
//Had to resign from my county Republican Executive Committee to do it
 
2008-03-05 01:17:35 AM  
Gwendolyn

Uh you weren't embarrassed to be a Texan when you elected GWB as your governor? Were you not paying attention to the way he handled the Rangers? Any business? His alcohol?

I didn't vote for that farktard. I was horrified when he became governor and president. In all honesty, being born and raised here, I don't know that I've ever been proud to be a Texan.
 
2008-03-05 01:17:38 AM  
Remove all Republicans: The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION

so clinton gets hers...and uncommitted gets some...how many does obama get? can't give him all the uncommitted because edwards was also in on that. and that's ignoring the bias that comes with only having one name on the ballot
 
2008-03-05 01:17:41 AM  
Flatulent_Flea: One thing I noticed watching Hillary and Obama speak tonight...She's begun to mock/copy him with "Yes, we will" but he has now pretty much dropped it.

That tells me she's winning. Now, she'll up the attack machine and see if she can derail him.

Blood in the water, blood in the water.
 
2008-03-05 01:17:54 AM  
Goryus writes: That's one of the biggest piles of steaming, made up crap I've ever seen.

And what, exactly, is made up about what I've written?

You should remember that not everybody has the blind crush on Obama that you do. Some of us have actually looked at the guy dispassionately and discovered that while he talks the talk, he does not walk the walk.
 
2008-03-05 01:18:02 AM  
franjime: /Do-over time for MI and FL

Florida. Wonderful. Nothing better than putting your faith in where America goes to die...
 
2008-03-05 01:18:12 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

The Democrats should count all the delegates. Then they can blast the Republicans for not counting 1/2 of the delegates. Then, you can complain all day that McCain is their true candidate and the Republicans are working to disenfranchising African-Americans and other groups, like they have throughout the history of that party.

If anyone know about disenfranchised votes, it's the Democratic party.


It's simply not equitable to use those results as they stand. If you do seat the delegates as is, you're disenfranchising all the Obama voters in Michigan who couldn't vote for their candidate. You're disenfranchising all the voters in both states who stayed home because they were told their state wouldn't count. Don't pretend that that that "solution" is the most fair...especially if it throws the nomination to Hillary.
 
2008-03-05 01:18:27 AM  
eraser8: If it's McCain v. Obama, it's a much easier choice for me: McCain.

So you prefer duplicitous flip-floppers. Good to know.

i108.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 01:18:29 AM  
franjime: Hmmm. Why are big states important....

United States Electoral College
Clinton so far....
New Hampshire-4
Michigan-17
Nevada-5
Florida-27
Arizona-10
Arkansas-6
California-55
Massachusetts-12
New Jersey-10
New Mexico-5
New York-31
Oklahoma-7
Tennessee-11
Ohio-20
Rhode Island-4
Texas-34
Total....258 (269 to win)

/just a thought.


I never thought of that. California was talking about splitting its electoral votes though.
 
2008-03-05 01:18:32 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people.

We, the people of Michigan, would be disenfranchised by them using the results of the vote where we weren't allowed to vote for the candidate we wanted and instead had to vote for "uncommitted" because Hillary decided to say, "Screw the rules we agreed to".

A re-vote here in Michigan with both Obama and Clinton on the ballot would yield an entirely different result, I think.
 
2008-03-05 01:18:41 AM  
bdub77 writes: That's because you're a retarded jerkoff.

Uh huh.

Fark off.
 
2008-03-05 01:18:48 AM  
Stop posting the same pictures in every thread. It's not like it does anything. They weren't even funny when this started months ago.
 
2008-03-05 01:18:49 AM  
eraser8: I'd certainly consider McCain over Clinton. But I'd probably choose Clinton. If it's McCain v. Obama, it's a much easier choice for me: McCain.

Damn, man. I can understand someone who's espoused the position you have over the years on Fark preferring Hillary over Obama, but McCain?

What possible reason could you have to hate Obama that much? I feel like we're missing part of the story, here. Did he kick your dog or something?
 
2008-03-05 01:19:01 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

It's not disenfranchising people to have a revote when the original vote was known beforehand not to count, and most of the candidates withdrew their names from the ballots.

Let them try again, so their vote counts and the candidates start on more or less equal standing. Hell, Edwards, Richardson, Biden, Dodd, Kucinich could get involved if they want.

Mike Gravel should get free airtime too. He's a hoot.
 
2008-03-05 01:19:17 AM  
BudTheSpud: You really should take your crazy self to some other forum, like DailyKos or something. Or did they already kick you out of there too?

DailyKos is a site for partisan Democrats. He's off in 9/11 truther land.
 
2008-03-05 01:19:33 AM  
rynthetyn: I'm not going to vote for a guy who'll flip flop on torture, it means I can't trust him to do the right thing when push comes to shove.

If you can't be strong on torture when you yourself have been tortured, what do you have?
 
2008-03-05 01:19:34 AM  
Remove all Republicans: That tells me she's winning. Now, she'll up the attack machine and see if she can derail him.

Blood in the water, blood in the water.


Mind explaining that? Because by my math right now she is not gaining many delegates (and may actually be losing some delegates depending on how the Texas caucus goes).
 
2008-03-05 01:19:38 AM  
eraser8: If it's McCain v. Obama, it's a much easier choice for me: McCain.

www.msu.edu

Has anyone mentioned the goat-blowing in this thread yet?
 
2008-03-05 01:19:43 AM  
bdub77: eraser8: If it's McCain v. Obama, it's a much easier choice for me: McCain.

That's because you're a retarded jerkoff.


Political season: A time for intelligent discourse and meaningful debate.
 
2008-03-05 01:20:04 AM  
dramaticpause writes: So you prefer duplicitous flip-floppers.

Well, I did vote for Kerry in 2004.
 
2008-03-05 01:20:31 AM  
SAvoodoo: Remove all Republicans: The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION

so clinton gets hers...and uncommitted gets some...how many does obama get? can't give him all the uncommitted because edwards was also in on that. and that's ignoring the bias that comes with only having one name on the ballot


Them's the stakes in politics. Politics isn't for the weak or the fools who remove themselves from the ballot. Play to win, play to win. Hillary gets a bunch because she's willing to go the extra mile. We're going to need them in the general against the Republicans.
 
2008-03-05 01:20:40 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: If you can't be strong on torture when you yourself have been tortured, what do you have?

Your tendons cut?
 
2008-03-05 01:20:53 AM  
The TX caucuses are coming in. Suck it, Hillary.
 
2008-03-05 01:21:14 AM  
wsupfoo 2008-03-05 01:16:39 AM
baby_hewey
: Ok, why was some chick from California in a Podunk Texas town farking with the Democratic caucaus tonight? She seemed to be working for Obama, but ended up getting escorted out of the building by cops.

The thing is she was trying to tell the caucaus chair how to divide up the delegats. Now this is a stunt I would expect from Clinton, not from Obama.

Weird huh? BTW I will be submiting the story if it makes it to the news tomorrow, I am hoping that there arn't too many of these events. Also, the chick was on the phone about the time things went south for her, don't know with who.


wtf are you talking about? there's no room dividing at a caucus in TX, I just got back from one a few hours ago. You just sign in with a vote. Stop making up stories based on what you heard about how an Iowa causus works.


What the hell did you read? It wasn't my post. I was at the voting site in Texas, I was elected to the county Convention for the Republicans. There is no wall or room for the different parties, it was in the farking public libary. Lady in Red coat was causing crap and was escorted out by cops. She was working for Obama. Those are what I saw or was told by Democrate Caucaus attendees. DOn't talk crap about shiat you know nothing about.
 
2008-03-05 01:21:24 AM  
I am so glad I stopped giving a damn about politics after Bush was re-elected. You Americans deserve all the Shiat you get. I might even vote for McCain just to see how freaking horrible this country can get. Let ride this mother into the ground. If Clintron is elected we get at least 4 more years of Republican vs Democrat, Sean Hannity style politics. Elect McCain and even more American lives will be pissed away in that sand trap. What a disgrace.
 
2008-03-05 01:21:38 AM  
Remove all Republicans: rynthetyn: Does anybody have a clue how the heck a revote in FL and MI would work?

Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

The Democrats should count all the delegates. Then they can blast the Republicans for not counting 1/2 of the delegates. Then, you can complain all day that McCain is their true candidate and the Republicans are working to disenfranchising African-Americans and other groups, like they have throughout the history of that party.

If anyone know about disenfranchised votes, it's the Democratic party.


Once again, an election where one candidate is the only candidate on the ballot is utterly bogus. She's the one disenfranchising voters by trying to seat delegates when the voters didn't have any other option.

/Can some non-moran answer my logistics question about re-votes, plz?
 
2008-03-05 01:21:42 AM  
eraser8:

I'll just cut and paste what I wrote earlier tonight

Usually people learn not to post metric amounts of stupid after the first time. I don't know who you are, but I want the informed and logical eraser8 back, you bastard.
 
2008-03-05 01:21:42 AM  
13% for the Caucus

Obama 54%
Clinton 46%
 
2008-03-05 01:22:03 AM  
My precinct still hasn't reported. Not that I'm exactly surprised, considering how long primary voting was still going on -- but dangitt, part of me doesn't want to go to bed until my vote is up with the other numbers.

How sad is that?
 
2008-03-05 01:22:04 AM  
Somacandra: Your tendons cut?

BESIDE THAT, dammit!

/sorry
//this is the kind of shiat that killed Gary Gygax
 
2008-03-05 01:22:12 AM  
Obama could use an Edwards/Gore endorsement right about now. Honestly, the fact that Hillary's core voters consist of Hispanics who voted for Bush in 2004 and selfish old boomers who want more free pills is farking pathetic. Hillary Clinton is Bush with ovaries, and instead of being in bed with defense contractors she'll be in bed with the drug companies. We'll still be Israel's lapdog, we'll still have the same blundering foreign policy (the Hillster doesn't like it when people disagree with her), we'll still be screwed. If Barack Obama wins more delegates than Clinton then loses because of some BS brokering, I will not vote for any Democrat for any office, ever.

/fark Hillary, fark HER
//Obama has held elected office longer than Hillary, and Bush II before he became president.
 
2008-03-05 01:22:27 AM  
Just remember: this wasn't a win for Hillary in any practical sense.

It's life support; it served to keep her in the race. Obama's still on top.
 
2008-03-05 01:22:39 AM  
ejwaxx: RminusQ: As a math joke. Am I overthinking something?

Nope. It's just me asserting my irrationality. :)

I'm currently tabulating delegate counts for Texas and Ohio. Texas primary looks to be Clinton +4 +-2 or so. Haven't gotten to Ohio yet.
 
2008-03-05 01:22:43 AM  
eraser8: Goryus writes: That's one of the biggest piles of steaming, made up crap I've ever seen.

And what, exactly, is made up about what I've written?

You should remember that not everybody has the blind crush on Obama that you do. Some of us have actually looked at the guy dispassionately and discovered that while he talks the talk, he does not walk the walk.


You should remember that reality is backed by actual facts.

It's hard, I know, and you'd much rather just make untrue blanket statements with no support, and then declare yourself correct. But you still have to be farkin' stupid to think that kind of thing is going to actually change anyone's opinions.
 
2008-03-05 01:22:46 AM  
dramaticpause: The TX caucuses are coming in. Suck it, Hillary.

At best she'll break even in delegates

/G08bama
 
2008-03-05 01:22:46 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Hillary gets a bunch because she's willing to go the extra mile lie and cheat to try and win.
 
2008-03-05 01:22:53 AM  
eraser8:
Well, I did vote for Kerry in 2004.


A perfect answer. McCain's reversal is indefensible anyway, and it avoids you having to discuss anything substantively. Well done.
 
2008-03-05 01:22:58 AM  
dramaticpause: The TX caucuses are coming in. Suck it, Hillary.

I am SHOCKED that they have been so close - I was expecting this to be a total landslide for Obama, but I am looking at 54-46 right now?

/Buyer's remorse
 
2008-03-05 01:23:00 AM  
Get used to saying President Clinton again, folks.

/damn
 
2008-03-05 01:23:12 AM  
Curt Blizzah: This could be the best thing to ever happen to the Democratic Party. Folks may disagree, possibly violently, but keeping our candidates in the news completely overshadows any message McCain can put out to the general population as long as this goes on. Especially those who get their info from the MSM. The longer this drags out, the better for the party. The big 'if' is if folks who are supporting Obama or Clinton decide to give their support to the one who wins the nomination. Let's face it: both Hillary and Barack have similar views on the issues. Though I'll give my support to the eventual nominee, I'm glad Hillary lives to fight another day. It keeps the party's messages on the front pages.

/more Dems are voting now than total in previous Presidential elections
//Democracy finally!


Yay! THIS. I can go to bed now :)
 
2008-03-05 01:23:16 AM  
Remove all Republicans: SAvoodoo: Remove all Republicans: The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION

so clinton gets hers...and uncommitted gets some...how many does obama get? can't give him all the uncommitted because edwards was also in on that. and that's ignoring the bias that comes with only having one name on the ballot

Them's the stakes in politics. Politics isn't for the weak or the fools who remove themselves from the ballot. Play to win, play to win. Hillary gets a bunch because she's willing to go the extra mile. We're going to need them in the general against the Republicans.


maybe i'm naive, but i don't want someone who wastes time something that isn't supposed to count, nor someone who ignores the rules to get ahead

/you are right on about it being how politics works...sigh
 
2008-03-05 01:23:27 AM  
franjime: Hmmm. Why are big states important....

Apples and oranges. New York and California will go for any Democrat, as will a number of the other states on that list.
 
2008-03-05 01:23:31 AM  
Blues_X:Not necessarily. Many conservatives prefer Obama to McCain, because they feel that although Obama is a liberal they can trust him. They've lost trust in McCain.

I don't know that I can trust Obama. But I KNOW that I can't trust McCain and I KNOW that I can't trust Hillary. I KNOW that they are both lobbyist loving brown bag money party hacks and 100% pure distilled politico. Obama MAY be that. So as a Republican I gotta choose between IS and MAY BE. I don't seem to have much choice but to go for the risky unknown liberal and hope he develops into the Bobby Kennedy mold and not the Ted Kennedy mold. The devil you don't know is better than the two you do.
 
2008-03-05 01:23:32 AM  
March_Hare: Cute pictures of Corgis 90%

www.msu.edu
 
2008-03-05 01:23:46 AM  
Prospero424: Obama's still on top.

Obama's on top of Hillary?

THERE'S the mental image I wanted to drift off to sleep with...
 
2008-03-05 01:23:50 AM  
Murkanen: eraser8:

I'll just cut and paste what I wrote earlier tonight

Usually people learn not to post metric amounts of stupid after the first time. I don't know who you are, but I want the informed and logical eraser8 back, you bastard.


Meh put him on ignore... I did it a long time ago... and my life has been bliss... Only him and skookum have enough stupid in their posts to make me do such a thing but again... it's a much better world here.
 
2008-03-05 01:23:54 AM  
Code_Archeologist: Remove all Republicans: That tells me she's winning. Now, she'll up the attack machine and see if she can derail him.

Blood in the water, blood in the water.

Mind explaining that? Because by my math right now she is not gaining many delegates (and may actually be losing some delegates depending on how the Texas caucus goes).


Not the math, the politics. She's making him change his style. That means she's winning the political attack battle. Now that she's seen he'll change, she'll keep it up. What she wants is a brokered convention where she's done by own a few delegates (with the unpledged being the difference) and having attacked the shiate out of him, she can claim that she'll be the better candidate. If he's actually weak enough to let her dictate the primary, she'll get the nomination at the convention.
 
2008-03-05 01:24:23 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

Uhm... there needs to be a revote because none of the candidates campaigned in either state. One of the candidates wasn't even on the ballot in one of the states. And no state has a right to have its votes counted by the party... this question has been settled in the court before that the national party may choose their nominee how ever they hell they want to because of the 1st amendment right to free association.

Only the actual election of the president (not the nominees) is enumerated in any way in the Constitution.
 
2008-03-05 01:24:41 AM  
No matter what the outcome tonight, even under the best case scenarios for Clinton down the line, it will be virtually impossible for her to catch Obama in delegates[1][2].
 
2008-03-05 01:25:06 AM  
harryjr: I am so glad I stopped giving a damn about politics after Bush was re-elected. You Americans deserve all the Shiat you get. I might even vote for McCain just to see how freaking horrible this country can get. Let ride this mother into the ground. If Clintron is elected we get at least 4 more years of Republican vs Democrat, Sean Hannity style politics. Elect McCain and even more American lives will be pissed away in that sand trap. What a disgrace.

What the fark are you talking about? You Americans? If you plan on voting for McCain that makes you one too. Hannity style politics if Clinton gets elected? That doesn't even make sense.
 
2008-03-05 01:25:13 AM  
Can we vote for the Corgis?
 
2008-03-05 01:25:27 AM  
insomniac8400: Well if it's Hillary vs. McCain, we can always write in Arnold Schwarzenegger.
i17.photobucket.com
 
2008-03-05 01:25:34 AM  
You all do know that there is not Constitutional right to Vote, right? It doesn't exist, look it up.
 
2008-03-05 01:26:03 AM  
I can vomit now. Freely. Biatch made me sick.
She's Bush all over again, and sadly, we shall pay either way in November.
/tired of stupid people and their breeding
//deciding if George Carlin should run
///nah
 
2008-03-05 01:26:07 AM  
Number41: franjime: Hmmm. Why are big states important....

Apples and oranges. New York and California will go for any Democrat, as will a number of the other states on that list.


Suggest you go review the '00 and '04 elections and ponder the importance of Florida and Ohio.
 
2008-03-05 01:26:13 AM  
img151.imageshack.us
 
2008-03-05 01:26:32 AM  
If you really believe in the policies and platform of the Democratic Party, it shouldn't matter that much to you which one of them wins, as compared to voting for McCain.

OTOH, there is a view that says "meh," all three of them suck.
 
2008-03-05 01:26:38 AM  
Ganymede_Elegy: Kinetocracy: It's lose not loose you illiterate morans.

People Pooples who can't read or write wrtie8 shouldn't be allowed analed to express extrude their (worthless) opinions oponions knockers.

/pet peeve


you missed some
 
2008-03-05 01:26:39 AM  
franjime: I am SHOCKED that they have been so close - I was expecting this to be a total landslide for Obama, but I am looking at 54-46 right now?

You're shocked that there's only been a 9 point swing from the primary to the caucus percentage? Didn't you have to vote in the primary to vote in the caucus?
 
2008-03-05 01:26:41 AM  
Jon Snow: No matter what the outcome tonight, even under the best case scenarios for Clinton down the line, it will be virtually impossible for her to catch Obama in delegates

She will be able to rip the shiat out of the process in the meantime.

You know, I'm looking forward to a McCain vs. Obama race. It might even be half honorable.
 
2008-03-05 01:26:44 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: Can we vote for the Corgis?

Can we have the Marines throw Hillary off a cliff and here her go "ACK ACK ACK" and then "thud."

/too soon?
 
2008-03-05 01:26:45 AM  
Why the 'Hillary wins big states/blue states" argument is busted:

You're assuming that in the fall, Democratic voters who voted for Clinton in the spring won't vote for Obama, and vice-versa. Who are they going to vote for, McCain? Why? After 8 years of a Republican president, Democrats are salivating at the chance of getting into the White House. In the end, Obama and Clinton both will more than likely get the full support of Democrats in the general election. So why does it matter which one wins a Democratic primary in a big state? Why does it matter which state it is at all? It doesn't.

If we can assume that 95% of the current Democratic voters will vote Democrat in the fall (and I think that's a reasonable assumption), then you have to either hope that'll be enough to counter the number of Republicans against you, OR, you have to get some votes from other places. That means you have to turn to independents and moderate Republicans. And who is better at attracting these at a 2-to-1 margin? Obama.

So in the end, it doesn't matter who wins in these primaries. That's not a good indicator of how the general election will go (since most hardcore blue states won by Clinton are going to go blue anyway, even if Zombie Stephen Douglas runs). What *is* a good indicator, however, is the number of independents and moderates the Democratic candidate can steal away from the Republican candidate. Assuming a united Democratic base, that will make all the difference. The question then becomes who can win those crucial voters.
 
2008-03-05 01:26:48 AM  
Hillary wins Ohio and Texas.

"On December 16, 1916 a group of nobles lead by Prince Felix Yusupov and Grand Duke Dmitri Pavlovich assassinated Grigori Rasputin. According to legend, Rasputin was poisoned, shot, clubbed, and ultimately thrown into an icy river where he finally succumbed to death.

The conspirators, having decided that Rasputin's influence over Tsaritsa Alexandra (wife of Tsar Nicholas II) was too dangerous a threat to the empire, first poisoned Rasputin with "enough cyanide to kill seven men".

When unaffected by the poison, Yusupov shot Rasputin in the back with a revolver. Yusupov then left the body to consult with the others. When they returned to the body, Rasputin grabbed Yusupov by the throat and whispered, "You bad boy" into his ear before hurling him across the room and running out.

As he ran out, he was shot three more times. The group followed him out and found him still struggling to carry on. They then clubbed him into submission, wrapped him in a sheet, and threw him into the Neva River.

Three days later, the body was pulled from the river and autopsied. The cause of death was found to be hypothermia and his arms were found in an upright position as if he had tried to claw his way through the ice."
 
2008-03-05 01:27:06 AM  
baby_hewey: You all do know that there is not Constitutional right to Vote, right? It doesn't exist, look it up.

We have the right to petition... which is close enough to be considered voting.
 
2008-03-05 01:27:07 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: Can we vote for the Corgis?

Entropy, my 'CORGI 2012' poster-puppy would make a fine write-in candidate if necessary. After all, voting for Entropy is not that much different from voting for many politicians.
 
2008-03-05 01:27:07 AM  
baby_hewey: You all do know that there is not Constitutional right to Vote, right? It doesn't exist, look it up.

Mr. Bush, we're sorry, but it's not going to work. Start packing for Crawford.
 
2008-03-05 01:27:10 AM  
My mother has two Welsh Corgis.

I love those dogs. But then, I don't have to clean her white carpets after they constantly drag their low-slung bodies through. Heh.
 
2008-03-05 01:27:13 AM  
daveydave: What the fark are you talking about? You Americans?

Maybe he's a member of PNAC?
 
2008-03-05 01:27:18 AM  
Prospero424 writes: What possible reason could you have to hate Obama that much?

I don't hate Obama. I just don't trust him. I think he's sleazy. Obama talks about taking courageous positions (without actually having taken a single position that's truly courageous). But McCain has actually taken positions that were politically risky. He has been a real force for campaign reform while Obama's only talked about it (while, at the same time, offering private relief bills to campaign contributors).

On immigration, McCain refused to be taken in by the GOP anti-immigrant fever. He proposed a policy in Iraq that seems to be working (while Obama's only solution to the war seems to be his woulda-coulda-shoulda strategy; he's produced nothing concrete about going forward).

I'm not thrilled by John McCain. But I have confidence in his ability to govern. I have no confidence whatever in Obama...mainly because there is such a massive gap between his pronouncements and his performance.
 
2008-03-05 01:27:33 AM  
JohnnyC: Remove all Republicans: Hillary gets a bunch because she's willing to go the extra mile lie and cheat to try and win.

Good enough for me. Politics isn't for the weak and stupid. Lie, cheat, whatever you have to do to win. Notice how Hillary literally will lie so blatently against herself and the press won't even bother to question it anymore? Her spin's that good. Obama has a slight nuance and the press'll wonder about him. That's what you get when you try to be honest, you get crapped on. The trick is to lie, lie, lie, and spin, spin, spin. The better it's done, the more you win.
 
2008-03-05 01:27:41 AM  
i26.tinypic.com
 
2008-03-05 01:27:57 AM  
Prospero424: Obama's still on top.

That's the main thrust, his caucuses will soon explode his delegate lead all over hers, to end this climax of a night.
 
2008-03-05 01:28:06 AM  
Groundhog day, Texas style.

Obama saw his shadow, 6 more weeks of Hillary
 
2008-03-05 01:28:36 AM  
dramaticpause 2008-03-05 01:27:07 AM
baby_hewey
: You all do know that there is not Constitutional right to Vote, right? It doesn't exist, look it up.

Mr. Bush, we're sorry, but it's not going to work. Start packing for Crawford.


I'm still right, sad thing is your not smart enough to argue the point with a guy that can't spell. Sad really.
 
2008-03-05 01:29:01 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: Entropy, my 'CORGI 2012' poster-puppy would make a fine write-in candidate if necessary. After all, voting for Entropy is not that much different from voting for many politicians.

At least if the Corgi shiats on the Constitution, we can figure it's probably accidental.
 
2008-03-05 01:29:02 AM  
Murkanen:

Your post made my point that Clinton supporters are largely the party over principle types quite nicely, thanks so much.

/the "real Democrats" thing was a nice touch


That wasn't my point, and the only way you get to that is by selectively reading what I actually wrote. Clinton supporters are party over individual types, and future over present types. Obama supporters are (from the youth movement) those who have rarely participated before, and I suspect will likely never participate again. They aren't supporting Obama because they agree with his stances, but because he's a rockstar.

The "real democrat" comment was followed up with an admonition of them not caring about "democrat issues". If they really want to see the democrat issues (like health care, Social Security, protection of a woman's right to choose, etc.) move forward they'll vote for Hillary if she wins. I'm betting that if Obama isn't the nominee, they go back to xbox. That indicates to me that they didn't care about "issues" or "principle" but about how much Obama rocks so hard.

/voting on principle isn't the same as voting for someone because he "gives you hope"
//cares enough about the actual issues to vote for whichever democrat gets the nod
 
2008-03-05 01:29:43 AM  
FishingWithFredo: Hillary wins Ohio and Texas.

"On December 16, 1916 a group of nobles lead by Prince Felix Yusupov and Grand Duke Dmitri Pavlovich assassinated Grigori Rasputin. According to legend, Rasputin was poisoned, shot, clubbed, and ultimately thrown into an icy river where he finally succumbed to death.

The conspirators, having decided that Rasputin's influence over Tsaritsa Alexandra (wife of Tsar Nicholas II) was too dangerous a threat to the empire, first poisoned Rasputin with "enough cyanide to kill seven men".

When unaffected by the poison, Yusupov shot Rasputin in the back with a revolver. Yusupov then left the body to consult with the others. When they returned to the body, Rasputin grabbed Yusupov by the throat and whispered, "You bad boy" into his ear before hurling him across the room and running out.

As he ran out, he was shot three more times. The group followed him out and found him still struggling to carry on. They then clubbed him into submission, wrapped him in a sheet, and threw him into the Neva River.

Three days later, the body was pulled from the river and autopsied. The cause of death was found to be hypothermia and his arms were found in an upright position as if he had tried to claw his way through the ice."


So, who's your Rasputin? Rove's gone now so the Republicans have lost theirs. You saying Mark Penn is the guy?
 
2008-03-05 01:29:52 AM  
succotash: Groundhog day, Texas style.

Obama saw his shadow, 6 more weeks of Hillary


good 1!
 
2008-03-05 01:29:54 AM  
franjime: Suggest you go review the '00 and '04 elections and ponder the importance of Florida and Ohio.

Well, then why didn't you put up a list of battleground states instead?

And really, Florida? The state where no one campaigned? If you haven't noticed, Hillary always starts with a lead, Obama starts campaigning, and the gap closes.
 
2008-03-05 01:30:09 AM  
Bhasayate: Can we have the Marines throw Hillary off a cliff and here her go "ACK ACK ACK" and then "thud."

I'd donate to see that.
 
2008-03-05 01:30:13 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Good enough for me. Politics isn't for the weak and stupid. Lie, cheat, whatever you have to do to win.

That is a symptom of what is wrong with our country and we need to change it. I'm sorry that you're a cheerleader for an America run by dishonest people, but I am not. I think we can still make the great experiment work. But we won't do it with your view of things.
 
2008-03-05 01:30:21 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: ThisIsNotSubtle: Entropy, my 'CORGI 2012' poster-puppy would make a fine write-in candidate if necessary. After all, voting for Entropy is not that much different from voting for many politicians.

At least if the Corgi shiats on the Constitution, we can figure it's probably accidental.


And hell, he's pretty smart. With some coaching, I bet he could even growl out the word 'nuclear' correctly.
 
2008-03-05 01:30:30 AM  
Number41: franjime: I am SHOCKED that they have been so close - I was expecting this to be a total landslide for Obama, but I am looking at 54-46 right now?

You're shocked that there's only been a 9 point swing from the primary to the caucus percentage? Didn't you have to vote in the primary to vote in the caucus?


Yes, it's been well documented that Obama has been running away with the caucus votes - I would have thought something on the order of 65-35 considering the result from other state's caucuses.
 
2008-03-05 01:30:53 AM  
i22.tinypic.com
i25.tinypic.com
 
2008-03-05 01:31:08 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: ThisIsNotSubtle: Entropy, my 'CORGI 2012' poster-puppy would make a fine write-in candidate if necessary. After all, voting for Entropy is not that much different from voting for many politicians.

At least if the Corgi shiats on the Constitution, we can figure it's probably accidental.


And we can rub the Corgis nose in it.
 
2008-03-05 01:31:43 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Good enough for me. Politics isn't for the weak and stupid. Lie, cheat, whatever you have to do to win.

If they'll gladly fark each other what's to keep them from farking you when they do win?
 
2008-03-05 01:32:17 AM  
baby_hewey: dramaticpause 2008-03-05 01:27:07 AM
baby_hewey: You all do know that there is not Constitutional right to Vote, right? It doesn't exist, look it up.

Mr. Bush, we're sorry, but it's not going to work. Start packing for Crawford.

I'm still right, sad thing is your not smart enough to argue the point with a guy that can't spell. Sad really.


It wasn't an argument, it was a joke. It's not really even worth arguing, since I kinda doubt you're going to get people to stop voting with your wizened legal prowess.
 
2008-03-05 01:32:29 AM  
Lando Lincoln: GreenPlastik: Flatulent_Flea: Obscure: All my dreams of a new optimistic political era ended tonight, sigh.

this.

QFT

So help me God, I am going to smack you sissies straight to hell and back. (new window)

She is NOT going to win the nomination of the Democratic Party. IF she wins the nomination through superdelegates over-riding the popular vote OR if she sues to get the MI and FL votes counted, then the Democratic Party will cease to exist as a cohesive political structure. And then we'll all vote for Obama as an independent and dance on the grave of the DNC when we win.

So stop with the crying, emo kids, and get back to reality.

A week from now Obama will have two more victories under his belt and his delegate lead will be larger.


To ^this^, allow me to add:

i14.photobucket.com
(Link goes to superdelegate history tracker.)

Over the past week or more, you can see Democratic superdelegates endorsing Obama over Clinton 10-to-1.

For fun, go to the endorsement notes, and do a [Ctrl]-F for "from Clinton". Then do a [Ctrl]-F "from Obama".
 
2008-03-05 01:32:44 AM  
With the exception of an almost insurgent campaign by Bill Clinton in '92, wresting the nomination away from the Democratic power structure, here's who Democrats have chosen to be their leader, their champion, their nominee for the highest office in the land, over the past 32 years:

Jimmy Carter
Walter Mondale
Michael Dukakis
Al Gore (when he was made of wood)
John Kerry
Probably Hillary Clinton.

Are you farking kidding me? And some of you deign intellectual superiority over non-Dems?

You could tap a Democrat on the shoulder at random in flyover country and come up with a better selection than that ridiculous lot.

/President McCain
//coming if Hillary's the nominee
///I'm a'ight with that
 
2008-03-05 01:33:01 AM  
LandoLincoln rules. Enough with you stupid emo-kids getting sissyish and wanting to capitulate.

/slap, slap

This b*tch won't go down without a fight, so do more than just sit and whine, and run back to your downer-conversations. Get off your asses and donate, get involved in the campaign, write letters to the editor, fight, fight, and claw, biatches.

The Republicans just nominated a guy who's gonna get Bush's endorsement tomorrow. It doesn't get more easier than that. We got an opportunity to kick two kinds of asses: Clinton's and the Republicans. I was all for Bill's revival until they revealed how far they'd go to take down another Dem. *uck 'em, they're going down. Republicans have been trying to scratch off that bulls-eye they've been painting themselves for 7 years. *uck 'em, they're going down (and they'll actually like it, if ya know whadya mean, and I think you do).

Time for Obama to slam the door shut. Now anybody who wants to be a doer, get up and be a part of something. Late.
 
2008-03-05 01:33:52 AM  
Aarontology: IXI Jim IXI: ThisIsNotSubtle: Entropy, my 'CORGI 2012' poster-puppy would make a fine write-in candidate if necessary. After all, voting for Entropy is not that much different from voting for many politicians.

At least if the Corgi shiats on the Constitution, we can figure it's probably accidental.

And we can rub the Corgis nose in it.


The water bottle. Can't you just see it? Somebody going after the current administration with one of those spray bottles, yelling, "No! Bad politician! No! No!"
 
2008-03-05 01:33:58 AM  
baby_hewey: dramaticpause 2008-03-05 01:27:07 AM
baby_hewey: You all do know that there is not Constitutional right to Vote, right? It doesn't exist, look it up.

Mr. Bush, we're sorry, but it's not going to work. Start packing for Crawford.

I'm still right, sad thing is your not smart enough to argue the point with a guy that can't spell. Sad really.


Also the right to vote in enacted under many state Constitutions.

If we didn't have voting then legally we couldn't have representatives being a Democratic Republic.

And Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

So if a state delegates it then it's a right.

/Suck it.
 
2008-03-05 01:34:31 AM  
eraser8: NOW they do. TODAY they do.

Don't expect that to hold as the media finally take a good, solid look at Mr. Obama.

Keep in mind that at this point in the 1992 campaign, Bill Clinton was in THIRD place in the polls (behind both Bush and Perot). Don't make the mistake of simply extrapolating today's state of affairs. Elections don't work like that.


I've learned that the more I know about McCain the less I like him.

The more I learn about Obama the more I like him.
 
2008-03-05 01:34:34 AM  
Murkanen writes: I don't know who you are, but I want the informed and logical eraser8 back...

I'm the exact same eraser8 that I've always been. I'm using precisely the same degree of logic that I've always used. The difference today is that you disagree with my judgment.

But I'm used to being the odd man out here. In 2002 and 2003, when Fark was largely in favor of the Iraq war, my analysis of the situation was appraised most viciously. I was called batshiat crazy and a dumbass for not supporting the invasion, for refusing to "admit" that Iraq was an arsenal of illegal weapons. But I still stuck to my guns. And looking back, I'm glad I did. I wouldn't change a word of what I wrote about Iraq. And, in five years time, I doubt that I'll be any more regretful about what I've written about Obama.
 
2008-03-05 01:34:48 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Not the math, the politics. She's making him change his style. That means she's winning the political attack battle. Now that she's seen he'll change, she'll keep it up.

Hmmm... that is kind of a weak argument. He has changed the style of his speeches and campaign a couple of times. Once after New Hampshire he switched up the tone with great success. Then again after Super Tuesday he changed things up to set the pace. And most recently for this primary day to organize for keeping the lead. Honestly he doesn't have to win every state after this.

And you may be surprised later this week, there was a leak yesterday that Obama has 50 super delegates waiting on his signal to publicly endorse him.

In another thread this was described as the Shotgun to Face or 50 Stab Wound tactic. He has a choice to either have them all show up at a press conference at once and endorse him (thus nullifying any gains she made today). Or he can have one or two of them endorse him every day for the next seven weeks, sucking all of the oxygen out of the room and robbing Hillary of the chance to get any "comeback" momentum of her own.

Sorry, but I think you are not seeing the whole picture here, and you are underestimating the Obama campaign. Do you think it was an accident that Jack Ryan's divorce records got unsealed when they did? Obama has frankly been taking it easy on Hillary.
 
2008-03-05 01:35:19 AM  
Code_Archeologist: Remove all Republicans: Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

Uhm... there needs to be a revote because none of the candidates campaigned in either state. One of the candidates wasn't even on the ballot in one of the states.


Again, that's politics. Tough luck to the guys. Hillary keep her name on the ballot in Michigan, and she actively campaigned in Florida. That got her votes, the publicity, and perhaps the delegates. Your guy needs to get down in the mud and join in. Nice guys finish last.

// loves the election season
/// thinking about getting into politics after school
 
2008-03-05 01:35:47 AM  
Daddakamabb:

Meh put him on ignore...

I'm a liter, a broke liter at that, so I have no ignore list.
 
2008-03-05 01:35:56 AM  
Well, at least I already despised Texas and disliked Ohio. Rhode Island? I'm not even sure that's a real state.
 
2008-03-05 01:36:34 AM  
Tonight's threads will be worth saving, to reread after Obama gets williehortoned/whitewatered/swiftboated and you all hate his ass.

I'm shaking my head over how many of you kids have been brainwashed by the right for the past 14 years. Not that there's anything wrong with Obama, and the coattail effect will be great. But there are good reasons why Liberals who have seen a lot of elections are favoring Clinton.

How many of you can compare Obama and Clinton without wedging in some Republican canard du jour? Be honest with yourself.
 
2008-03-05 01:37:24 AM  
franjime: Yes, it's been well documented that Obama has been running away with the caucus votes - I would have thought something on the order of 65-35 considering the result from other state's caucuses.

These are the same people voting in the primary as in the caucus. Why would the votes change over the course of a day? Suggesting a 30 point swing is about as Hillary-shill-expectation-lowering as you can be.
 
2008-03-05 01:37:46 AM  
Goryus writes: You should remember that reality is backed by actual facts.

Yeah. And where are your facts to substantiate your claim? Again, I'm forced to ask: what, exactly, did I make up?

But you still have to be farkin' stupid to think that kind of thing is going to actually change anyone's opinions.

I wasn't trying to change anyone's opinion. And, FYI, the name calling against Hillary Clinton and her supporters isn't going to change any opinions either.
 
2008-03-05 01:38:12 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Code_Archeologist: Remove all Republicans: Why do we need a revote? The people in those states have already decided. BRING THEIR DELEGATES TO THE CONVENTION. There is no reason why the Democratic party should be disenfranchising people. That's for the Republicans to do.

Uhm... there needs to be a revote because none of the candidates campaigned in either state. One of the candidates wasn't even on the ballot in one of the states.

Again, that's politics. Tough luck to the guys. Hillary keep her name on the ballot in Michigan, and she actively campaigned in Florida. That got her votes, the publicity, and perhaps the delegates. Your guy needs to get down in the mud and join in. Nice guys finish last.

// loves the election season
/// thinking about getting into politics after school


so, after you learn about what democracy is supposed to be? because from your posts, i don't think you have any clue about what it is.
 
2008-03-05 01:38:32 AM  
http://www.fightliberals.com/ created 10-feb-2005 - copyright Daniel Kurtzman, 2007

http://www.fightconservatives.com/ created 10-feb-2005 - copyright Daniel Kurtzman, 2007


Now THAT I find funny :)
 
2008-03-05 01:38:33 AM  
Remove all Republicans: That got her votes, the publicity, and perhaps the delegates. Your guy needs to get down in the mud and join in. Nice guys finish last.

// loves the election season
/// thinking about getting into politics after school


If this is your idea of good, please stay far away from politics.

/or just go back under your bridge
 
2008-03-05 01:39:02 AM  
dramaticpause 2008-03-05 01:32:17 AM
It wasn't an argument, it was a joke. It's not really even worth arguing, since I kinda doubt you're going to get people to stop voting with your wizened legal prowess.

Oh, you misunderstand my intentions. I want people to pissed off that there is not Right to vote in this country and to have it changed. I have never diswaded anyone to vote, I encourge even when I disagree with their canidate. I want everyone to vote. Hell, here in Texas the saying is vote early, vote often. 80% of the time the County clerks don't stamp the books during early voting and you can vote a second time on Tuesday, not that I would recomend it as that is illegal. Then again in this county the dead vote on off years.

/You ever wonder why the vote counts can be a couple hundred more in the local races than the presidential race?
//Those are the dead votes, because if they voted for Pres it's a Federal offense!
 
2008-03-05 01:39:06 AM  
eraser8: Prospero424 writes: What possible reason could you have to hate Obama that much?

I don't hate Obama. I just don't trust him. I think he's sleazy. Obama talks about taking courageous positions (without actually having taken a single position that's truly courageous). But McCain has actually taken positions that were politically risky. He has been a real force for campaign reform while Obama's only talked about it (while, at the same time, offering private relief bills to campaign contributors).


You are woefully uninformed.

Obama ran AGAINST the War while he was running for office. That was a politically risky move.

He's attempting a clean campaign against Hillary Clinton.
That's suicidal.

On immigration, McCain refused to be taken in by the GOP anti-immigrant fever. He proposed a policy in Iraq that seems to be working (while Obama's only solution to the war seems to be his woulda-coulda-shoulda strategy; he's produced nothing concrete about going forward).

I'm not thrilled by John McCain. But I have confidence in his ability to govern. I have no confidence whatever in Obama...mainly because there is such a massive gap between his pronouncements and his performance.
 
2008-03-05 01:39:21 AM  
Looking at the Ohio primary results Obama is ahead pretty much where there is actually civilization but Clinton won big time out in the sticks. His lead is 23% in Cincinnati, 13% in Columbus, and thanks to the ice storm of the century the figures for Cleveland aren't reliable yet because only ~2/3rds are in but it's currently 5%. Btw the storm created the worst driving conditions I have ever been out in, a solid sheet of black ice over everything covered by almost frozen rain covered by a half inch of sleet aka ice ball bearings.
 
2008-03-05 01:39:26 AM  
ThisIsNotSubtle: The water bottle. Can't you just see it? Somebody going after the current administration with one of those spray bottles, yelling, "No! Bad politician! No! No!"

Being that person should be decided by contests of valor, strength, and wisdom. In a steel cage.
 
2008-03-05 01:39:32 AM  
Number41: franjime: Yes, it's been well documented that Obama has been running away with the caucus votes - I would have thought something on the order of 65-35 considering the result from other state's caucuses.

These are the same people voting in the primary as in the caucus. Why would the votes change over the course of a day? Suggesting a 30 point swing is about as Hillary-shill-expectation-lowering as you can be.


It's been reported that many Clinton people have went home after they voted in the primary... Again I suspect it's so they can get their prune juice and take a nap.
 
2008-03-05 01:40:14 AM  
Wonderful.

The Democrats are no closer to having a nominee on the night the Republicans achieve theirs. The only certainty on the Democrat side to come out of tonight is the fact their nominee's chances of winning in November are slowly sliding away.

7 weeks until Pennsylvania.

7 weeks of the two Democrat candidates tearing each other apart.

7 weeks of them handing the Republicans more and more ammunition to use in the General Election.

7 weeks of McCain solidifying his base, raising money, and 'looking Presidential.'

And the day after Pennsylvania? The Dems will still be no closer to the nomination.

This farking thing is going to the convention, and the end result is the Democrats are going to lose another Presidential election that should have been a slam dunk.

President McCain. Get used to it. And thank Hillary and her poorly educated and old supporters who helped make it happen.
 
2008-03-05 01:40:50 AM  
Code_Archeologist: Obama has frankly been taking it easy on Hillary.

Yep. VERY easy. If he wanted to drag her through the mud, he could. She's downright dirty, and everyone knows it (except for her supporters, apparently). There's no question that Hillary has enough skeletons in her closet to provide fodder for months of smear tactics. And there is no question that should she become the nominee the Republicans will not hesitate to play that card. I think her supporters underestimate this.
 
2008-03-05 01:41:26 AM  
Murkanen writes: I'm a liter, a broke liter at that, so I have no ignore list.

The last time somebody made that suggestion to me, I asked that the person making the suggestion to add me to his ignore list. I think it's pretty sad when a person has such a low tolerance for contrary ideas that he tries to filter them out of his world.
 
2008-03-05 01:42:25 AM  
Mnemia: Code_Archeologist: Obama has frankly been taking it easy on Hillary.

Yep. VERY easy. If he wanted to drag her through the mud, he could. She's downright dirty, and everyone knows it (except for her supporters, apparently). There's no question that Hillary has enough skeletons in her closet to provide fodder for months of smear tactics. And there is no question that should she become the nominee the Republicans will not hesitate to play that card. I think her supporters underestimate this.


Heh I wonder if Obama is going to try for the 'come back kid' angle again?
 
2008-03-05 01:42:25 AM  
Shadow Blasko: Blame the rest of the state ignorant hicks who live outside our major cities. We did our part. Except for Toledo and Akron.

/ftfy
 
2008-03-05 01:42:49 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Code_Archeologist: Remove all Republicans: That tells me she's winning. Now, she'll up the attack machine and see if she can derail him.

Blood in the water, blood in the water.

Mind explaining that? Because by my math right now she is not gaining many delegates (and may actually be losing some delegates depending on how the Texas caucus goes).

Not the math, the politics. She's making him change his style. That means she's winning the political attack battle. Now that she's seen he'll change, she'll keep it up. What she wants is a brokered convention where she's done by own a few delegates (with the unpledged being the difference) and having attacked the shiate out of him, she can claim that she'll be the better candidate. If he's actually weak enough to let her dictate the primary, she'll get the nomination at the convention.


Normally I think you are full of shiat. But in this case, I gotta agree with your statement.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:11 AM  
Shrugging Atlas: The Democrats are no closer to having a nominee on the night the Republicans achieve theirs. The only certainty on the Democrat side to come out of tonight is the fact their nominee's chances of winning in November are slowly sliding away.

Look at it this way - which party has been getting more press leading up to today, the Democrats or the Republicans? McCain can't look presidential if he's not in the news. Now that Huck's out, expect even less coverage.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:12 AM  
eraser8: Yeah. And where are your facts to substantiate your claim? Again, I'm forced to ask: what, exactly, did I make up?

All I can say is, he's running on an anti-lobby, pro-govt. transparency theme, which he's backed up through his donations and fundraising records, and his senate bills. Maybe this doesn't qualify to you as change, but it does to me, especially given Clinton as his opponent.

I wasn't trying to change anyone's opinion. And, FYI, the name calling against Hillary Clinton and her supporters isn't going to change any opinions either.

This is absolutely true.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:21 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Again, that's politics. Tough luck to the guys. Hillary keep her name on the ballot in Michigan, and she actively campaigned in Florida. That got her votes, the publicity, and perhaps the delegates. Your guy needs to get down in the mud and join in. Nice guys finish last.

See now that is part of the problem, not the solution. You want to get into politics? Don't do it just because you desire the conquest of it. While you might be a successful at getting elected you would be disastrous for your constituents and the country.

Getting elected simply for the purpose of getting elected is not reason enough for a political career. It is the reason why I am not voting for Hillary Clinton, because blind partisanship is destroying the country. Fighting somebody simply because they have an R after their name may be fun, but it gets fark all done.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:49 AM  
I don't see Clinton really closing the gap much tonight, and with MS, and NC both polling heavily in Obama's favor, she needs alot more delegates tonight to really be a contender.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:50 AM  
JohnnyC: Remove all Republicans: Good enough for me. Politics isn't for the weak and stupid. Lie, cheat, whatever you have to do to win.

That is a symptom of what is wrong with our country and we need to change it. I'm sorry that you're a cheerleader for an America run by dishonest people, but I am not. I think we can still make the great experiment work. But we won't do it with your view of things.


You say that. Watch your guy Obama walk in and get himself destroyed by the right-wing smear machine. They went after the Clintons and Gore like nothing we've ever seen. Now, they've got their money resting on Iraq and if you think they're going to let a black man run their country, you got another thing coming to you.

Great Metal Jesus: Remove all Republicans: Good enough for me. Politics isn't for the weak and stupid. Lie, cheat, whatever you have to do to win.

If they'll gladly fark each other what's to keep them from farking you when they do win?


Because I'm voting for a Democrat, not some selfish, right-wing Republican. The Democrats have been the party of the minorities, of the poor, of the helpless for their entire history. Besides, I'm interested in getting in on the action and it'll be like being a member of the Politburo for the old Soviets. It's good to be a leader.

Code_Archeologist: Sorry, but I think you are not seeing the whole picture here, and you are underestimating the Obama campaign. Do you think it was an accident that Jack Ryan's divorce records got unsealed when they did? Obama has frankly been taking it easy on Hillary.

No underestimating the Obama campaign. I'm just waiting for him to bring out the mud. I love the "oh, he's above that" routine. Before Ryan, there was the other Democratic senate nominee who also mysteriously had his divorce records unsealed. Similar stuff happened to get Obama's state senate seat. Come on, the man is from Chicago, after all.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:52 AM  
So, now that the media is going to act like Hillary's the frontrunner again, can they please, please, pretty please start pressing her to release her tax returns? Now, not April, now. As in, tomorrow, preferably.
 
2008-03-05 01:43:55 AM  
Daddakamabb 2008-03-05 01:33:58 AM
Also the right to vote in enacted under many state Constitutions.

If we didn't have voting then legally we couldn't have representatives being a Democratic Republic.

And Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

So if a state delegates it then it's a right.

/Suck it.


Well you start strong, yes some States have voting rights laws, then you move to the fail. We are not a Democratic Republic, we are a Representitive Republic( strike one). Amendment X, well you get it right, but it doesn't have crap to do with voting. Look a little farther down and you will find one that does have something to do with voting, it list the stuff that you can not use to denigh someone thier vote, but it still does not give you the Right to vote(strike two). Please go for three!
 
2008-03-05 01:47:04 AM  
Remove all Republicans:
/// thinking about getting into politics after school

After reading this thread for the better part of two hours, I think you might get AT MOST 4% of any given election if you were to run with the kind of message you have been repeating over and over again. No republican is going to vote for a guy named "Remove all Republicans" and no democrat is going to vote for a guy so absolutely deprived of any sense of common decency or morality. Just saying.

/It kind of scares the heck out of me that you are in school somewhere, hope it isn't here.
//Scans the computer lab for the kid who looks like a nutcase.
 
2008-03-05 01:47:25 AM  
IXI Jim IXI: Tiber1: Liberal, but voting for McCain if she gets it. NO MORE POLITICAL DYNASTIES IN THE WHITEHOUSE!!!1 =)'

I'm nowhere near convinced that McCain wouldn't be the same as a third term for Dubya. I've lost a lot of respect for him in the past few years. Too bad...I would have proudly voted for him in 2000.


Not going to disagree with you at all on this one, but I can't go for another dynasty. Hillary could be the best candidate in a hundred years and I'd stil have to have very serious reservations about her. It says a lot of very bad things about a country when you see the same family names over and over in their leader's rolls.

I think Bill being back in the White House as First Man would be at least a moral violation of the 22rd amendment. Plus, she seems to have acted since he left the White House like it was her natual right to get it too... Nothing gets my goat like someone thinking they have a 'right' to rule over me.

I don't like McCain, but if it comes down to her or him, I think he is less of a danger to our country long term, then allowing her to claim 'her' office. What's next? Do we give the White House back to Jeb Bush in 2016? Chelsea gets it in 2024?

As a student of History, political dynasties are a early deathknell for any society. We have over 300 million people, can't we find someone who ISN'T related to a former president to chose?
 
2008-03-05 01:47:52 AM  
BuckTurgidson: To ^this^, allow me to add:

Thank you for the video reinforcement of my feelings on the subject.

Boorring: This b*tch won't go down without a fight, so do more than just sit and whine, and run back to your downer-conversations. Get off your asses and donate, get involved in the campaign, write letters to the editor, fight, fight, and claw, biatches.

The Republicans just nominated a guy who's gonna get Bush's endorsement tomorrow. It doesn't get more easier than that. We got an opportunity to kick two kinds of asses: Clinton's and the Republicans. I was all for Bill's revival until they revealed how far they'd go to take down another Dem. *uck 'em, they're going down. Republicans have been trying to scratch off that bulls-eye they've been painting themselves for 7 years. *uck 'em, they're going down (and they'll actually like it, if ya know whadya mean, and I think you do).

Time for Obama to slam the door shut. Now anybody who wants to be a doer, get up and be a part of something.


Yeah! Get off of your asses, people! Donate if you have the cash! Contribute your time if you're broke! Donate AND contribute your time if you care about this country!

I just donated $60.20 via Keith Gabryelski's Obama donation drive. He and his co-sponsors match your contribution, so Obama gets twice the amount of money. How cool is that?

Keith's donation page via my.barackobama.com (new window)

Here's a link to Obama's phone banking. Too poor to donate? Then donate your time and get on the phone and start calling people.
 
2008-03-05 01:47:52 AM  
Darth_Lukecash: Remove all Republicans: Code_Archeologist: Remove all Republicans: That tells me she's winning. Now, she'll up the attack machine and see if she can derail him.

Blood in the water, blood in the water.

Mind explaining that? Because by my math right now she is not gaining many delegates (and may actually be losing some delegates depending on how the Texas caucus goes).

Not the math, the politics. She's making him change his style. That means she's winning the political attack battle. Now that she's seen he'll change, she'll keep it up. What she wants is a brokered convention where she's done by own a few delegates (with the unpledged being the difference) and having attacked the shiate out of him, she can claim that she'll be the better candidate. If he's actually weak enough to let her dictate the primary, she'll get the nomination at the convention.

Normally I think you are full of shiat. But in this case, I gotta agree with your statement.


Hell, I might be screwing around talking shiat, but believe me, I know what I'm talking about. People may gravitate towards the honest candidate but idiots still vote in large numbers and they only remember the last negative thing.
 
2008-03-05 01:47:59 AM  
eraser8: I don't hate Obama. I just don't trust him. I think he's sleazy.

Again, I understand why you might disagree with his policies or his record, but he's done nothing I'm aware of that could be considered "sleazy", especially in comparison with Clinton.

It just seems to me that, at best, you're filling in the blanks with the worst possible assumptions about him, and I wonder why that is.

eraser8: Obama talks about taking courageous positions (without actually having taken a single position that's truly courageous).

Okay, let's look at this. Let's look at Obama's record in the Senate vs. Hillary's:

Obama:

Took the same stance that McCain did on immigration, which you called "courageous".

Passed the Coburn-Obama Transparency Act, which established USAspending.gov that lists all organizations receiving federal funding and even breaks it down by individual agency and purpose. If there's one thing that takes courage in Washington, it's going against the establishment to make government and congressional spending in particular more open.

Passed the Honest Leadership and Open Government Act with Feingold, which eliminated lobbyist-funded travel and requires disclosure of bundled campaign contributions. Again, in Washington, very little requires more courage than going against Big Money.

Clinton:

Voted for the Patriot Act in 2001. That is the opposite of courageous, as far as I'm concerned.

Voted for the Iraq War. Not courageous.

Voted for forcing the FTC to investigate Grand Theft Auto. Yes, the video game. Introduced the Family Entertainment Protection Act promoting government censorship of video games.

She voted for the Bankruptcy bill in 2001, making it harder for middle class families to get out from under debt and was seen as a giveaway to the banking industry.

The rest of her record are general funding bills, pork for New York, and naming post offices and government buildings after people she liked.

Supported NAFTA when it was popular, then claims to be against it when it's not.

Supported the war when it was popular, then claims to be against it when it's not.

Supports policies for the working class in general only when they're popular, than votes against them when the cameras are off.


The list goes on. I just see you as having the facts completely and totally backwards.

eraser8: I have no confidence whatever in Obama...mainly because there is such a massive gap between his pronouncements and his performance.

Then I'm sure you can name a junior Senator from the past quarter century with a better record in the same time frame. I'll wait...
 
2008-03-05 01:48:27 AM  
Remove all Republicans

People who lie, cheat and steal will continue to lie, cheat and steal. I don't care what letter's stamped next to their name on the nightly news.

The Democrats have been the party of the minorities, of the poor, of the helpless for their entire history

Have you taken a history class or are you just farking with us now?
 
2008-03-05 01:48:50 AM  
Dear Jerk: But there are good reasons why Liberals who have seen a lot of elections are favoring Clinton.

Why? Because she is more conservative and history has shown you that liberal nominees do not win?

Because you think Hillary's negatives are as high as they are gonna get?

There are times when the old guard can get blinded by past history.

This situation is much like Carter/Reagan. Pundits were shocked that there were "Reagan Democrats" because Reagan was way to the right. But the Reagan Democrats voted for Reagan because he offered confident hope in a troubled time. Those Democratic voters put aside their nervousness about Reagan and took the risk on him because the confidence of "morning again in America" he espoused.

Sometimes the kids are right and the old hands are wrong.

You should also consider that the oldsters preference is also who Rush Limbaugh wants Republicans to cross over and vote for. If you can't see what the kids are saying....you should at least probably seriously think about how your strategy and Limbaugh's are hand in hand.
 
2008-03-05 01:49:41 AM  
After adding up the unofficial numbers (excluding the Texas Caucuses), Hillary will gain 24 delegates over Obama today

Hillary will take this as a Major victory and probably keep going until the convention.
 
2008-03-05 01:49:46 AM  
baby_hewey: Daddakamabb 2008-03-05 01:33:58 AM
Also the right to vote in enacted under many state Constitutions.

If we didn't have voting then legally we couldn't have representatives being a Democratic Republic.

And Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

So if a state delegates it then it's a right.

/Suck it.

Well you start strong, yes some States have voting rights laws, then you move to the fail. We are not a Democratic Republic, we are a Representitive Republic( strike one). Amendment X, well you get it right, but it doesn't have crap to do with voting. Look a little farther down and you will find one that does have something to do with voting, it list the stuff that you can not use to denigh someone thier vote, but it still does not give you the Right to vote(strike two). Please go for three!


Please see This
And look for the section that says "Current Democratic Republics"

Most states give you the right to vote. The Tenth Amendment to the constitution says that The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

I'm sorry I couldn't hear you over your
www.ericdsnider.com
 
2008-03-05 01:50:12 AM  
Darth_Lukecash writes: Obama ran AGAINST the War while he was running for office. That was a politically risky move.

Actually, he didn't. Obama was running for reelection to Springfield in 2002. His district was OVERWHELMINGLY opposed to the Iraq war. If he had come out in favor of the conflict -- or even remained silent -- he would have faced difficulty in that election. And that would have put a monkey wrench into his ambitions for higher office.

It doesn't take a heckuva lot of courage to make an argument that you know the voters you have to deal with in the next election passionately agree with.

When he had a chance to really be against the war in 2004, he didn't take it. The speech that he points today with such pride was even scrubbed from his website. Only when the war really began to go south did he gin up that line again.

He's attempting a clean campaign against Hillary Clinton.

By telling Ohioans one thing and Canadians another?
 
2008-03-05 01:50:44 AM  
rynthetyn: So, now that the media is going to act like Hillary's the frontrunner again, can they please, please, pretty please start pressing her to release her tax returns? Now, not April, now. As in, tomorrow, preferably.

Yeah, I think we've got a right to know what's on there. Clearly there's something that looks bad, or she would have done it long ago. Again, do people think the Republicans won't bring this up? I'm definitely interested in how much her and Bill's net worth has changed over the last 7 years, and from what sources their income came from.
 
2008-03-05 01:51:14 AM  
Daddakamabb:

Heh I wonder if Obama is going to try for the 'come back kid' angle again?

Come back from what? Hillary only gained, at most, 15 delegates tonight (not counting the Texas caucus). With supers, Obama is still 80-90 delegates ahead.

The math is fuzzier than what some of the other guys here could give you, but I don't see anyone here saying Hillary is winning the delegate count.
 
2008-03-05 01:52:13 AM  
eraser8:

The difference today is that you disagree with my judgment.

It isn't just your judgement, but your entire thought process in regards to how you are attacking him. In the past you'd do research to find out if your points were worth a damn, or at the very least rational. However, anytime you discuss Obama you bring up non-points like the fact he voted "Present" while in the Illinois Senate (which is part of how they do things in that state's legislature) as if it's the silver bullet Clinton supporters need to end obama's momentum. You make the same nonsense claim that he doesn't discuss policy, but he has discussed policy more than either Clinton or McCain have this primary season. Pretty much everything that wasn't pure opinion is factually wrong or misleading, and that isn't like the eraser8 that I remember from 6+ months ago.
 
2008-03-05 01:52:14 AM  
ChopSueyKS: Remove all Republicans:
/// thinking about getting into politics after school

After reading this thread for the better part of two hours, I think you might get AT MOST 4% of any given election if you were to run with the kind of message you have been repeating over and over again. No republican is going to vote for a guy named "Remove all Republicans" and no democrat is going to vote for a guy so absolutely deprived of any sense of common decency or morality. Just saying.

/It kind of scares the heck out of me that you are in school somewhere, hope it isn't here.
//Scans the computer lab for the kid who looks like a nutcase.


Ha. At UCLA. My last alt was less subtle (let's just say I wanted to recall them before), and people had no problem with that. Hey, I was in elections in high school. The smear machine works, and if you think people are really looking for decency or morality, you might be well be voting for Senator Craig in the bathroom over there. You should know that the worst guys are the "morality" dirtbags out there. I'd vote for a Larry Flynt who you absolutely know where he's coming from over a high and mighty morality ass like Craig.
 
2008-03-05 01:52:56 AM  
Remove all Republicans: The Democrats have been the party of the minorities, of the poor, of the helpless for their entire history.

HAHAHAHAHA, Abe Lincoln (R-Illinois) laughs at this one. Laughs, and laughs, and laughs. Try again.
 
2008-03-05 01:53:28 AM  
oburt: After adding up the unofficial numbers (excluding the Texas Caucuses), Hillary will gain 24 delegates over Obama today

What method did you use to determine that number? Because the delegates are not awarded in a straight statewide proportional fashion.
 
2008-03-05 01:53:53 AM  
eraser8: By telling Ohioans one thing and Canadians another?

Again: you're just taking the Hillary spin on this as gospel. Everybody involved insists now that the characterization of the conversation being used by Clinton is false.
 
2008-03-05 01:54:02 AM  
Remove all Republicans: The Democrats have been the party of the minorities, of the poor, of the helpless for their entire history.

Welcome to my ignore list.
 
2008-03-05 01:54:41 AM  
So quick and dirty...

images.icanhascheezburger.com
 
2008-03-05 01:54:41 AM  
ValisIV writes: he's running on an anti-lobby, pro-govt. transparency theme

Which is fraudulent. USAToday recently reported that "Sen. Barack Obama's presidential campaign has accepted $54,350 from members of a law firm that in 2006 lobbied him to introduce a tax provision for a Japanese drug company with operations in Illinois, according to public records and interviews. The government estimates the provision, which became law in December 2006, will cost the treasury $800,000."

The same article noted that "John McCain, the likely Republican nominee, does not introduce tariff suspension bills under 'a longstanding policy - no private relief bills or any bills for one person,'"

It's hard to take Barack Obama seriously when he's doing favors, working to pass private bills, for his campaign contributors. That isn't transparency. That's politics as usual.
 
2008-03-05 01:55:50 AM  
Basically, Obama's record resembles Feingold's, while Hillary's record mirrors people like Biden.

I think that anyone honestly looking at both Hillary and Obama's records in the Senate from a progressive viewpoint would have to admit that Obama's is better.
 
2008-03-05 01:56:20 AM  
ChopSueyKS: Daddakamabb:

Heh I wonder if Obama is going to try for the 'come back kid' angle again?

Come back from what? Hillary only gained, at most, 15 delegates tonight (not counting the Texas caucus). With supers, Obama is still 80-90 delegates ahead.

The math is fuzzier than what some of the other guys here could give you, but I don't see anyone here saying Hillary is winning the delegate count.


If the MSM acts like Hillary has came back from an almost amazing defeat (which they will because they hype up everything) then when Obama wins the the next few states it will look like he came back from a defeat that he never lost. Which will motivate people to vote for him again because he is the only one who will 'give hope to the people'. I could be wrong but it could be a play. I support Obama but he is no dummy... he would never out right attack Hillary but he could make it look like he's the underdog... and EVERYONE loves an underdog. But yeah it could just be an assumption. I know I could be wrong but meh he could do it.
 
2008-03-05 01:56:36 AM  
I'm going to log an offical prediction that no significant amount of Farkers who complained about the electoral college when it gave Bush the presidency will complain about the system in Texas if it gives the state to Obama.

\The only unfair fight, etc.
 
2008-03-05 01:56:45 AM  
Remove all Republicans: No underestimating the Obama campaign. I'm just waiting for him to bring out the mud. I love the "oh, he's above that" routine.

But that is not the way you win against Hillary Clinton. Attacking Hillary energizes her base (middle aged white feminists), the way you beat Hillary is by being twice as organized and twice as inspirational than she is. She is not a good campaigner, her organizational abilities are her own worst enemy. She is not a good speaker, to most people she comes off as shrill and demanding.

If you can beat her in those two arenas, you can beat her. Also Hillary has been running on a flawed strategy, concentrating only in the large states and mostly ignoring the small states. This is the reason why Obama scored a virtual tie in delegates on Super Tuesday. Obama is running a 50-state grass roots strategy, and forcing Hillary to campaign for every single delegate... and she is running out of money because of that. Obama has had volunteer teams in place in all fifty states since December, Hillary is having to come in late to each state after Super Tuesday throw tons of cash around to get her organization up and running when Obama's organization already has an infrastructure set and ready to go.

Obama doesn't have to get dirty. He just has to run a more efficient, and more inspirational campaign than she does. And he will win.
 
2008-03-05 01:56:57 AM  
Remove all Republicans: CThe smear machine works, and if you think people are really looking for decency or morality, you might be well be voting for Senator Craig in the bathroom over there. You should know that the worst guys are the "morality" dirtbags out there.

I think that a) highschool is much like this, not so much the real world, and b) this exact reason is why Obama does so well amongst the higher educated, they want decency back in politics and America as a whole. I know it's one of a few major reasons why I'm all about his campaign even though I disagree on a lot of his social policy stances.
 
2008-03-05 01:57:23 AM  
lrosu79: Remove all Republicans: The Democrats have been the party of the minorities, of the poor, of the helpless for their entire history.

Welcome to my ignore list.


Took long enough. Now, I'm done for the night. Thanks for the laughs, all!
 
2008-03-05 01:57:41 AM  
Prospero424 writes: Let's look at Obama's record in the Senate vs. Hillary's

Yes. Let's do that. During the time both Clinton and Obama were senators, how have his votes differed from hers?
 
2008-03-05 01:58:08 AM  
Mnemia: oburt: After adding up the unofficial numbers (excluding the Texas Caucuses), Hillary will gain 24 delegates over Obama today

What method did you use to determine that number? Because the delegates are not awarded in a straight statewide proportional fashion.


Umm not to be a jerk but you might want to take a look at this thread...

I'm not saying he didn't support them but he only did it for political reasons...
 
2008-03-05 01:58:21 AM  
Delegates!

First the easy states.
Vermont:
McCain easily picks up this winner-take-all state.McCain 17.
The hippies haven't finished counting, but it's highly unlikely it will change from Obama 9, Clinton 6.

Rhode Island:
McCain picks up the majority, but Huckabee gets some. McCain 13, Huckabee 4.
Clinton picks up a larger win than expected. Clinton 13, Obama 8.

Ohio
:
Still 20% or so reporting, but McCain won every district. Thus he takes everything. McCain 85.
There is a slight margin-of-error based on the uncounted vote, but the numbers I'm coming up with now are Clinton 75, Obama 66.

Texas:
RONPAUL's home. Where he failed to finish in the top two in any district, well behind McCain and Huckabee even in his home district. Huckabee won a single district and prevented a majority in several more. If McCain has a majority statewide he gets 41 at-large, otherwise Huckabee gets a fraction of them. As of now, McCain is over 50.0%, so McCain 123, Huckabee 14.
Oh the fun stuff. Still plenty of votes that can change the current count, but right now the expected result appears to have occured. On the primary side, Clinton wins by a moderate percentage, but a minimal delegate margin. On the caucus side, Obama takes it down. Net result as I approximate it: Obama 98, Clinton 95.

Total result:
McCain 238, Huckabee 18. My numbers are somewhat behind, so I don't have McCain quite clinched yet, but it's all but certain.
Clinton 189, Obama 181. And yet the talking heads will say this is a bigger win than farking Yorktown.
 
2008-03-05 01:58:32 AM  
Remove all Republicans:

Ha. At UCLA. My last alt was less subtle (let's just say I wanted to recall them before), and people had no problem with that. Hey, I was in elections in high school. The smear machine works, and if you think people are really looking for decency or morality, you might be well be voting for Senator Craig in the bathroom over there. You should know that the worst guys are the "morality" dirtbags out there. I'd vote for a Larry Flynt who you absolutely know where he's coming from over a high and mighty morality ass like Craig.


Yet even if your candidate wins...you still elected a dirt bag. As a Democrat, I'd rather have an honest Republican than a corrupt anything else. By endorsing dirty campaigns, you ensure that only the worst of both parties run, leaving the country even worse off. Besides, if you are saying clean campaigns don't work...I'd suggest you take a quick recap on Obama's lead in the delegate count.

/GWU
//East coast'ish school represent
 
2008-03-05 01:59:08 AM  
shrapnil77: I'm going to log an offical prediction that no significant amount of Farkers who complained about the electoral college when it gave Bush the presidency will complain about the system in Texas if it gives the state to Obama.

For the record, I never complained about the Electoral College. Also for the record, the Supreme Court had more to do with Bush's victory than the EC.
 
2008-03-05 01:59:21 AM  
Remove all Republicans: Republicans are working to disenfranchising African-Americans and other groups, like they have throughout the history of that party.

Abe Lincoln finds this one hilarious also. You should stop trying to pass this stuff off on the unaware because almost nobody is THAT unaware of US political history. On the off chance you really think this is true you have some reading to do. I suggest starting with the formation of the Republican Party and the state of the Democratic Party at that moment and their relation to your statements.
 
2008-03-05 02:00:45 AM  
eraser8: It's hard to take Barack Obama seriously when he's doing favors, working to pass private bills, for his campaign contributors. That isn't transparency. That's politics as usual.

So instead you're supporting a candidate who not only takes money from lobbyists at massively greater rate, but employs eight times their number in her campaign that Obama does? And McCain employs even more lobbyists than she does!

What the hell, man!?

You might not think Obama is more credible on the anti-corruption issue, but every single objective metric we have shows him to be far better on these issues than McCain or Clinton are.

Yet you're again assuming the opposite of what the objective data says. And again, I have to wonder why that is.
 
2008-03-05 02:01:01 AM  
robodog: Looking at the Ohio primary results Obama is ahead pretty much where there is actually civilization but Clinton won big time out in the sticks. His lead is 23% in Cincinnati, 13% in Columbus, and thanks to the ice storm of the century the figures for Cleveland aren't reliable yet because only ~2/3rds are in but it's currently 5%. Btw the storm created the worst driving conditions I have ever been out in, a solid sheet of black ice over everything covered by almost frozen rain covered by a half inch of sleet aka ice ball bearings.

Hmm, CNN had Cuyahoga County at 61% reporting but has now lowered it to 44%, there's something weird going on! The Cuyahoga County Board of Election site shows that less than 50% of the precincts have reported, not sure how the remaining ones compare to the already reported ones population wise but their new figures seem more plausible.
 
2008-03-05 02:01:27 AM  
eraser8:

The last time somebody made that suggestion to me, I asked that the person making the suggestion to add me to his ignore list. I think it's pretty sad when a person has such a low tolerance for contrary ideas that he tries to filter them out of his world.

You really know how