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(Discovery)   Evidence of Jesus' existence found   (dsc.discovery.com) divider line 567
    More: Unlikely  
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142 clicks; posted to Main » on 21 Oct 2002 at 2:50 PM (12 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2002-10-21 01:42:03 PM  
Santa Surrenders?
 
2002-10-21 02:26:22 PM  
The 20 Aramaic letters etched on a side of the newly revealed ossuary read "Ya'akov bar Yosef akhui di Yoshua," or "James, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus.
I'm no scholar, but it seems to me that a better translation would be, "Jacob, son of Joseph, brother of Joshua".
Jesus, Joseph and James were common names in biblical times, but according to experts, the statistical probability of their appearing in that combination is extremely slim.
So, they were common names, but it's unlikely to happen? Just like there're no other Steves who are sons of Bill with a brother named Bill. Riiiight...
"This ossuary could be compared to the Turin Shroud: a big key artifact for believers. I would be thrilled if it were true, but I believe it is a forgery. Several things cast suspicion: the line of custody is insecure, and the inscription is too perfect. They would have never written 'brother of Jesus' in the first century," Robert Eisenman, professor of biblical archaeology at California State University, Long Beach, and author of "James, Brother of Jesus," told Discovery News.
Wasn't the creation and selling of religious "relics" (no more holy than the bits of dog bone and hair from which they were forged) big business in the "Holy Land", especially during the Middle Ages?
 
2002-10-21 02:36:41 PM  
James the brother of Jesus? Hmmm ... Kevin Smith was right ...

Bethany: Jesus didn't have any brothers or sisters. Mary was a virgin.
Rufus: Mary gave birth to CHRIST without having known a man's touch, that's true. But she did have a husband. And do you really think he'd have stayed married to her all those years if he wasn't getting laid? The nature of God and the Virgin Mary, those are leaps of faith. But to believe a married couple never got down? Well, that's just plain gullibility.
 
2002-10-21 02:56:51 PM  
So?

I don't think athiests or pagans deny Jesus existed. The denial is of his divinity.

BFD
 
2002-10-21 02:57:09 PM  
Unlikely? Is the poster under the impression that Jesus never existed? I thought I had seen the dumbest of dumb but now here comes this.
 
2002-10-21 02:57:15 PM  
Jesus' lesser known brother, Jim of Nazareth.
 
2002-10-21 02:58:20 PM  
Uhh... I thought they already proved Jesus existed by looking at old Roman Census documents and such

I thought the REAL debate was whether he was some really nice guy, or some religious icon

(before you pull out your Anti-Religion guns on me, I am atheist, it's just I thought it was proved Jesus existed already... and he was a nice guy... and I'm going to keep rewriting this post cause I'm a moron)
 
2002-10-21 02:58:20 PM  
Jesus had a brother? Man, how much would that suck growing up in that shadow?

James, c'mon by the time your brother was 13 he could raise the dead and turn water into wine.
 
2002-10-21 02:58:20 PM  
Havent seen a good religious flamewar in a while.
 
2002-10-21 02:59:16 PM  
I hope this isn't off topic, but: why did Tony Orlando sing knock *three* times on the ceiling if you need him? Was two already reserved as a code for something else? Like "Turn down your TV" or "Stop playing Tony Orlando records" or something?
 
2002-10-21 02:59:18 PM  
"I'm no scholar, but it seems to me that a better translation would be, "Jacob, son of Joseph, brother of Joshua"."

You are right, no are no scholar. The hebrew for Jesus is "Yeshu" or "Yeshua", a similar name with Joshua or "Yoshua"
 
2002-10-21 02:59:18 PM  
Unlikely? Is the poster under the impression that Jesus never existed?

Read the article. It's doubtful that this artifact is real.
 
2002-10-21 03:00:34 PM  

Nothing is known of its history prior to the current ownership, but experts believe it was probably one of hundreds uncovered in the Holy City.

So I guess we just have to figure out which one of those hundreds uncovered with the same inscription is the right one.

 
2002-10-21 03:00:41 PM  
Great use of Unlikely tag, BUT, and there's always a big BUTT, PAY ATTENTION TO THIS!

I don't think ANYONE disputes a man named Jesus that once walked around. But what I think the TRUE controversy is, is whether or not this Jesus could WALK ON WATER, HEAL PEOPLE, CATCH LOTS OF FISH, DAMN FIG TREES, and GO TO HELL AND STEAL A SET OF KEYS.

I, personally, think it's all a load of bullshiat that sounds cool as a kid and makes you want to do good things. But now? HAHAHAHAHA!!!

Keep living in your fantasy world peoples!!!!

Flame war/
 
2002-10-21 03:01:13 PM  
I think Nightsweat has hit the proverbial nail on the head.

I can't think of anyone who said "Jesus never exsisted." But plenty who said "there is no God" or "Jesus wasn't the son of God."

Still and interesting find though, not that it completely proves it as Stevarooni pointed out though.
 
2002-10-21 03:01:18 PM  
Well, I don't know for you, but this is the first time ever I heard the mention of Jesus' brother, apart from "Dogma", of course. And I had religious instruction until I was 13.
 
2002-10-21 03:01:32 PM  
Hey, I'm an atheist, and even I believe that some hippie-man named Jesus lived - I just prefer to think he was not the son of "god" and there is no "god" anyway.

Sorry, Christians, but Mary couldn't have been a virgin then, or else it's Jesus' half-brother.

fark religion.
 
2002-10-21 03:01:54 PM  
the article Tag seems intentionally ignorant of the whole "Brother named James" thing...

kinda seems just as interesting, dont you think?
 
2002-10-21 03:02:27 PM  
10-21-02 02:56:51 PM Nightsweat
So?

I don't think athiests or pagans deny Jesus existed. The denial is of his divinity.

BFD


I think that just about sums it up.
 
2002-10-21 03:02:28 PM  
I don't think athiests or pagans deny Jesus existed. The denial is of his divinity.

Exactly. And I'm out of here before this thread reaches 900. Have fun people.
 
2002-10-21 03:02:57 PM  
Unlikely? Very few people will say Jesus never existed!
 
2002-10-21 03:03:08 PM  
The 20 Aramaic letters etched on a side of the newly revealed ossuary read "Ya'akov bar Yosef akhui di Yoshua," or "James, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus."

Man, how would you like to be the brother to the Son of God?
 
2002-10-21 03:03:15 PM  
"We never run out of wine when your brother is here!"
 
2002-10-21 03:03:36 PM  
Why ? Most scholars acknowledge Jesus existed.
 
2002-10-21 03:04:02 PM  
I thought the question was still more like "Did Jesus actually exist?" than "Was Jesus the son of God?" So, if Jesus did exist, are these stories about him a complete history of his life--or maybe parts of several mens' lives woven together? Or one person's life with some religious things thrown in? If the story is accurate, then did Jesus really perform miracles, but was not divine? Or if he is not divine, he couldn't perform miracles, could he?

Personally, I think it would be great if Jesus really existed, because I believed in him my whole childhood and talked to him and stuff. I kind of miss him now.
 
2002-10-21 03:04:13 PM  
We now know Jesus existed. Now we need to know if he was blonde like in those European paintings.
 
udo
2002-10-21 03:04:22 PM  
Good thing these people held onto this thing for 1,920 years before showing it to everybody.
 
2002-10-21 03:04:37 PM  
um...yeah unless you are a moron there is no doubt jesus lived on this earth, weather he was the son of god is for another flame war.
 
2002-10-21 03:04:53 PM  
I'm lost. All this is is an extrabiblical textual reference to the person of Jesus, and there are other extrabiblical (even Roman) references that mention Jesus of Nazareth. For that reason, Archaeological scholars have never disputed the historical existence of a person named Jesus from Nazareth and his cult following, the divinity of Jesus notwithstanding. I guess because this is carved in stone and can be considered original, in situ, and contemporary to the life of Christ. But really, the historical existence of Jesus was never in dispute.
 
2002-10-21 03:05:04 PM  
Boy_Plankton: according to my sources, Jacob is purportd to be Jesus's younger brother...i.e. once God had his way with Mary, she was free to go about her business.

But this still goes no further to proving Christ's divinity. Yeah this nomad couple had a kid that the woman's husband disowned, then another kid, who also died, without any proof of resurrection.

..."On the next Maury: You ain't my baby's daddy. God speaks out!!!"
 
2002-10-21 03:05:32 PM  
Im gonna jump in and jump out again real quick before the flame war starts, but the fact that Jesus existed has never really been in doubt. He lived. He died. What happened in between may be questioned till the end of time, but he is a real-life historical figure. Jeez
 
2002-10-21 03:05:42 PM  
What a time for a religious discovery that would almost certainly make it seem that a christianity driven society, or to an even lesser extent, judaism, should have rights to the holy land.....
 
2002-10-21 03:06:17 PM  
wouldn't that be Jesus' younger half brother?
 
2002-10-21 03:07:18 PM  
I agree with DrToast. The unlikely tag makes no sense. I'm an atheist.
 
2002-10-21 03:07:22 PM  
CreamyG

I agree.
 
2002-10-21 03:08:17 PM  
Since no one said it yet.

Nazis


/godwin
 
2002-10-21 03:08:17 PM  
jesus was a philosopher who called for the end of corruption in the temple/religion. the historical jesus was basicallly martin luther with a zealot following...oh wait.
 
2002-10-21 03:08:40 PM  
"Amazing as it may sound, a limestone bone box, called an ossuary, has surfaced in Israel that may once have contained the bones of James, the brother of Jesus," Andre Lemaire, professor of Hebrew and Aramaic philology and epigraphy at the Sorbonne University in Paris, wrote in the upcoming issue of Biblical Archaeology Review."

Sadly, the bones of his lesser known brothers Rick and Kevin are still missing.
 
2002-10-21 03:08:58 PM  
Oh for pete's sake.

Matthew 13:55 (NIV)

"Isn't this the carpenter's son? Isn't his mother's name Mary, and aren't his brothers James, Joseph, Simon and Judas? "


There. Jesus had four brothers. It's in the Bible.
 
2002-10-21 03:09:01 PM  
Udo
Good point
I wonder how many religious/historical artifacts that are crucial in determining certain events in history are sitting or held in private collections.
 
2002-10-21 03:09:02 PM  
Seriously... just to back up what everyone else has been saying...

No (educated person) argues whether or not JC existed. There is more documented proof that JC existed than Plato or Socrates did, and no one doubts them.

It's just whether or not you want to believe he lives in the sky that's got everyone all confused.
 
2002-10-21 03:09:02 PM  
so they found a box that belonged to some dude named James. Big deal. There's a guy I work with and I find his stuff all of the time.
 
Eli
2002-10-21 03:09:06 PM  
I'd like to see some of this so-called incontrovertible evidence for Jesus' existence, because my sources say his existence is doubtful.
 
43%
2002-10-21 03:09:14 PM  
Unlikely that jesus existed?

Bust out the tinfoil, i smell a conspiracy.

The Romans and Jews conspired to create a whole other religion based around an imaginary person that a third group of messianistic (sp?) Jews decided to worship.

Thus ensuring the fall of the Roman Empire and rise of Christianity, the Dark Ages and resulting preservation of Western thought by the Muslims who then fell into their own dark age where science societal advances were overshadowed by greedy rulers whose control of their subjects is funded by oil money supplied by George Bush and Dick Cheney who are trying to take your rights away because they don't like your nose ring and doc martins.

Damn you Dick Cheney and Pontius Pilate.
 
udo
2002-10-21 03:09:36 PM  
Dear Rossella Lorenzi, author of this article:

Please don't title your article "First Proof of Jesus Found?
" and mention in the article the shroud of Turin and the ossuary of Caiaphas. Either of those would be before this, and thus this NOT the first. Your instructor in ordinal numbers,

Farker Udo
 
2002-10-21 03:09:51 PM  
Jesus existed just like Santa existed (Saint Nicholas). But, just as Saint Nicholas didn't break in to people's houses at night leaving them cool shiat, Jesus wasn't the son of a deity.

God is just Santa Claus for adults.
 
2002-10-21 03:09:54 PM  
Isn't there some farker who's a big bible-thumper-jesus-freak who posts to tell people he's praying for their souls because they read FARK? Who does he weigh in on this? My brother is a born-again pain in the ass self-righteous Calvinist and he thinks all this stuff is REAL.

Religeon is wierd.
 
2002-10-21 03:09:57 PM  
I don't see how this could turn into a flame war when there is no controversy. I have never heard a scientist, scholar, cynic, atheist, whatever ... say Jesus was never a real historical person.

The flamewar headline would read "Video of Chirst's Resurrection Unearthed from Jerusalem tonb"
 
2002-10-21 03:09:57 PM  
Jesus existed.

He wasn't white, probably not light haired or light skinned, and you can flame on about whether or not he was the son of God.

But he was a real person.
 
2002-10-21 03:11:08 PM  
oOo

I had something I was going to type... can't remember now

oh yeah.... When I was a kid I was forced into a regilion (parents... Roman Catholic...), and they told us there Jesus did have a few brothers and sisters, something I heard LONG before I saw Dogma...

but... I stopped with the religion because the idea of a 'God' makes about as much sense as a giant what's-it-called sneezing out the universe (uhh... I hope you get what I'm attempting to reference off the top of my head)
 
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