The parents blew this thing so far out of proportion that it not only made news, it made Fark!

/The worst thing that can happen to a kid, is the parenting
//The best thing too, but that is becoming increasingly rare, it seems

"Reading makes me sleepy"

"He was the only one who understood us," said Patrisha Ramirez, 15. "He would joke around. He would make English interesting, for once."

These words are what make teachers get their asses out of bed in the morning.

Loose_Cannon: But for the love of Hillary Clinton, it's a BOOK with a guy having sex with a corpse in it!

Is there some shortage of great, educationally-rewarding books out there that we have to expose our children to this kind of trash novel?!? I've read F-451, I've read Slaughterhouse, I've read Catcher, but this junk?

I am father to a 16 year-old and an 11-year-old, and call me old-fashioned but I wouldn't want them reading about bestiality, either!

Right. But murder is still ok, no? How about rape and incest, can your children still read The Color Purple?
Incidentally, those are things that actually hurt other people, unlike necrophilia and bestiality, gross though they may be.

/well, granted, bestiality may hurt the animal, depending on the size of the animal, your package

ElegantGoose

And what gets kids to pay attention, care, think, and learn.

I've yet to visit myself, but I've been told that Austin is the only decent region of the state.


How does one go about visiting oneself.

Every time I go to my house to visit myself there is never anyone home.

Samsaran:
Also 9th grade means 13 teen year olds? I had a car by the start of my sophmore year, meaning I was 15 in 9th grade.

Heh ... figures ... held back a year or just a late bloomer?

WTF? Most children in the US start kindergarten as 5 yr olds and turn 6 at some point during the year. Making 9th graders 14-15 on average.

Loose_Cannon:
Is there some shortage of great, educationally-rewarding books out there that we have to expose our children to this kind of trash novel?!? I've read F-451, I've read Slaughterhouse, I've read Catcher, but this junk?

You do realize those books were all considered junk when they came out too, right?

Loose_Cannon:
No one's saying this book shouldn't be read. No one's calling for it to be burned.

Unfortunately someone is calling for criminal charges on the teacher. I have no problem with saying "yk, maybe not this book." But suspending a teacher for passing out an approved reading list and going to the cops is called OVERKILL.

Man On Pink Corner: It's funny... I'll bet most of the "b...b...but it'll warp their fragile little minds" crowd in this thread would have no problem with their kid picking up the Bible.


No shiat.

Don't mess with Texas? Texas messes with itself.

Can I use this moment to laugh hysterically?
Not at the teacher, but at the whole idea.
and this happened on Earth eh?

Tonight at 11: Crimes of Literature.

Maybe we need to put ratings on books or just get rid of them outright.

also, ever notice that Censors always get the best reading material?


I encourage Texas to join us in the new Millenia.

Bill Frist: Cormac McCarthy is argueably the greatest american novelist still writing today.

Without a doubt.

Besides the author having a wonderful first name *cough*cough*....

I can safely say "The Road" was the best book I've read in about 15 years. It still sends a shiver down my spine thinking about it, I've told lots of friends to read it and every one who has has raved about it too.

Now, about having sex with corpses...

babysealclubber: WHAT HAPPENED TO THE NECROPHELIA PUNS?

They were dead boring anyway.

Heroin For Peace
Nothing will ever touch the wonder that is Exquisite Corpse. Nothing freaks you out more than the way Poppy Z. Brite makes you feel when you realize, about half way through the book, that all this fun with corpses sound farking hot.

Strangely enough, I was more freaked out by the ghey sex than the necrophilia.

Loose_Cannon
All I'm saying is maybe, perhaps, there is a line at which we should stop when trying to educate our children. That line for me just so happens to be necrophilia.

Call me old-fashion, but yeah, I think 14-15 year-olds are exposed to enough in our society already. We don't need to add 'Farking the Dead' to the list.


Very simple answer to this then.
The kid shouldnt be taking AP English classes.
AP English is for college credit and college courses have mature, adult content.
If the kids taking those classes its gonna have to be a given fact that the literature may have mature adult content in them, which can either be accepted as part of taking College equivalent classes, or not. You cant baby a kid in content and issues, and then give them adult credit in a class, it doesnt work like that.

Adult or child, its one or the other.

Anyone seen Visitor Q??

Loose_Cannon: Man On Pink Corner: It's funny... I'll bet most of the "b...b...but it'll warp their fragile little minds" crowd in this thread would have no problem with their kid picking up the Bible.


I'm calling BULLSHIAT.

Dude, it's NECROPHILIA. I'm 40 years old and it WARPS MY MIND just thinking about it, never mind reading a graphic depiction and possibly having a classroom discussion about it.

What is wrong with you people?

And just because we don't want the 'INS AND OUTS' of necrophilia taught in our schools, so to speak, doesn't equate us to bible thumping, right-wing fanaticism.

And have YOU noticed that those people who call it censorship refuse to discuss what's actually being censored? Somethings SHOULD be censored from being taught in our schools.

Look, if you want NECROPHILIA taught to your children so badly, get up with them before school and teach them yourselves.


I don't think the question is whether people want it or not - I think the question is whether it deserves criminal sanctions. There are many things that happen that are unwanted in our society, that doesn't mean all of them should be punished via the criminal system.

Loose_Cannon:

I think you'll find in John 5:18 and preceding, an admonition to be careful how we use the law. In this case, the law is being used as a vehicle to express outrage and disapproval--a use specifically proscribed by the parable.

There are plenty of legitimate avenues by which one can express these sentiments.

.

why is there no law about these loony parents? "treasonous attempts to undermine reason justice and the American government"

andrew131: High school students don't read anyway. I don't know why the parents are getting pissy.

I LOL'd

/The Road is better anyway.

babysealclubber: WHAT HAPPENED TO THE NECROPHELIA PUNS?


I killed a lot of em earlier in just one shot, the crazylady in my head with the ideas was dying to unearth those gems.
We cadaver keep going on with em, but after a while they'd just fall apart, getting more rank and rotten each time someone digs up another stinker.
Better just leaving things buried. You know leaving dead dogs lie.....or however the saying goes.
Of corpse some people will just keep nagging, beating that dead horse into the ground no matter what putrid.


God, now thats what you call a repungnant punitive play on words folks.


/Double-entendre and puns a plenty, take that
//Appreciation for this genius pun-tiform, of course not.
///Just a bunch of stiffs.

Taleri: In addition, how is this any worse than To Kill a Mockingbird (which uses the word B**ch) or any of Shakespeare's works (because that man had a very dirty mind)?

I read Titus Andronicus in 11th grade Brit Lit class; no one complained.

Still, I didn't eat pie for a month after reading that one.

Time Traveler: When I was in the 9th grade I was forced to read Ivanhoe - do you know how many words are in that book???

No, I don't. Do you understand that counting the words is not the point of reading the book?

Bill Frist: Wait, so this teacher didn't even PICK the book and he is in trouble?

Exactly. The teacher gave the kids options, one of which was this book. And that, according to the cops, makes him a horrible person that needs to be locked in jail. Librarians are going to be in big trouble - they offer even more options yet.

Cops are scared to go do their job. An alarm sounds? They tell you to check it your damn self, not their job, call if you catch a criminal. They don't want to show up - criminals might shoot at them. So instead they are arresting teachers. And they wonder why nobody respects them anymore.

muse44: oh, the report didn't mention this, but the complaining student's father is a local cop.

That would figure.

jackicey English is useless.

Wow. You may be the stupidest person to ever post on Fark. That says a lot.

Loose_Cannon No one's saying this book shouldn't be read. No one's calling for it to be burned.

Two words : Criminal. Charges.

If you can't see what is wrong with that, then you are part of the problem.

I'm trying to think of something involving the phrase "in dead earnest", but so far got nothing.

They shouldn't file criminal charges. They should treat it as if it was an honest mistake and move on, with a promise to vet the titles more carefully.

Teacher and school are idiots collectively for making a mistake like this, though.

There are many fallacious arguments, 'informal fallacies' perhaps, being forwarded here:

"You won't let a kid read a book about a serial killer who has sex with dead bodies and lives with them while they decompose, therefore you basically have to eliminate everything but kiddie books from the reading lists, and eliminate AP English"

Come on, folks. This book is not Catcher in the Rye or Heart of Darkness or any number of books with adult themes that don't contain serial killing necrophiliacs. Use those brain cells, they're in your head for a reason.

Texas Tailgate

Samsaran:
I read your profile... I like the way you roll.

Loose_Cannon
When did the barrel of acceptable, well-written, informative, and mildly mature reading material run so dry we need to scrape the barrel for books containing necrophilia?

I don't wish my children, who both take AP, BTW, to be reading Highlights or Dick and Jane, either. I do think we can come to some compromise that doesn't include necrophilia, though. Or Bestiality.


Your missing the point.
Firstly changing an adult credit class so it's "kid safe" completely negates it being an adult class. Your excluding issues and areas of discussion that would have been covered in an adult class, removing it from all consideration as a equivalent course.
As i said before its Adult or child, one or the other.
You can honestly tell me that giving a kid full credit in a class while he only covered the material in the course that was deemed "safe" for him, is somehow OK and right?

You cant, and it's not.

Additionally, it isnt the issue of what the specific "offensive material" may be, it's a matter of wanting or "having to" change and shield a child from adult issues. It impacts the spectrum of what may be covered. For example (and it is extreme) you couldnt justify excluding the study of certain parts of a body in Gross Human Anatomy (or changing whats taught in some similar manner) if there was a AP course in Anatomy being given, could you? Yes, its nasty and graphic stuff, but you cant go and only cover the "presentable" areas of the body, or for that matter go and replace a human with a chimp and say you'd learn the same thing. The totality of whats learned just wouldnt be comparable.

Its a simple matter of fact that in college there are extreme and uncomfortable issues that might be covered, and that must be accepted.
It's an adult education, and has got to be treated as such.


/There are other books, this isnt the only one.
//All that needs been done is to put one book down and pick a different one up.
///Parental issue and concern.....all gone.

Give the guy a break, he was just trying to make reading fun!

Cold Ethyl.

When I was in the 9th Grade I read lots of messed up Horror Novels, and of my own free will. What are these school officials aiming at when they try to control what people read and can't read. Those parents too, they need to shut the fark up, besides if their kid wants to read a book about murder and necrophilia I think they have other problems on their hands.

Pureplayaz99999,

I want to barf and masturbate at the same time. From the waist down I'd say "yes".

/slap
//fhep
///vomit

I think the real irony in all of this is, of course, the internet!
Anyone that can read and write these days has at least seen 3 of the following:

'animal porn sans humans'
'Rick Rolled'
'Saddam's hanging'
'Fark'
'Spear's shaved clam'
'animal porn avec humans'
'CNN'

so fark it... put the book on the list, take it off... don't matter one bit.

Remember:

This is a town of 700 people.

Chances are, they are all related, and the kids all look like they have the same daddy.

And with all that mother & brother & sister & daddy loving going on, do you really expect them to handle any information that didn't come straight out of the bible?

Rik01: When I was in high school, we had to read "Brave New World," where a faux religion pops up due to a charismatic fellow, (kinda like Scientology) and eventually turns out to promote the consuming of deceased loved ones bodies to keep them with them.

I read Aldous Huxley's Brave New World a long time ago, so I don't remember much, but THAT I definitely don't remember. Are you sure it was Brave New World?

I may just read the book again for old time's sake. It was interesting.

Animatronik
There are many fallacious arguments, 'informal fallacies' perhaps, being forwarded here:

"You won't let a kid read a book about a serial killer who has sex with dead bodies and lives with them while they decompose, therefore you basically have to eliminate everything but kiddie books from the reading lists, and eliminate AP English"


Well that would be a valid argument if someone made that comment, and to my knowledge no one did (Talk about a fallacious argument ;p).

What was said, is that if a child wants credit for adult classes, he is going to have to learn and be treated as an adult would, not as a child. Its either accept the good with the bad in the AP classes, OR not take the AP classes and stick to the curriculum designed for that age group.

AP classes are created specifically because its felt the persons taking it are mature enough to handle that level of learning. That level of maturity means both in content and education, and is the basis on which these courses designed and given.

I agree with jayday in that if its' an adult class there's no point making it "kid-safe". Bravo. Death to the Nanny-State.

skinink

Well, I just hope the parents don't rent Molly Parker's "Kissed" this weekend...

That was a surprisingly sweet film.

soupgoblin:
Chances are, they are all related, and the kids all look like they have the same daddy.

No, it's not that bad, they're not that tight of a community.

But this shiat is really sad for the town -- Abilene's about 120k, and Tuscola is about 16 miles south. The school district there caters to about 1100 people in about 5 towns around T'cola as well. Colt McCoy went to high school, there. The residents go to Abilene for the weekends. Abilene, with it's former world record for more churches per capita than any other place may be a reverse bad influence. As "good" as it is, it may be "too good" of a community to allow for any open-mindedness. The district that the high school's sports teams play in, imho, have quality education due to the fact that they are isolated for themselves (which means more growth opportunity for the students, less influence from bully towns like Abilene). I say bully town because Abilene is a "good ol boy" place -- I swear the council has been in place for a few decades. if they're not there anymore, it's their son or their best friend's son. Which is why I moved to Colorado. As conservative as I am, I'm not "closed off" to the off-the-beaten-path lifestyles other people choose. My two best friends are LDS and Catholic (someone get a rope, Imma get hanged for that one).

/But I read Child of God on my own in the 8th grade. Ballard was a freak but I believe the world he lived in made him that way. I see parallels to this whole thing with Coach T.

//Not that I know the school or the students or anything...I never did sports photos for them for 4 years. This doesn't hit home at all.

jayday Quote 2007-10-24 10:29:57 AM


Animatronik
There are many fallacious arguments, 'informal fallacies' perhaps, being forwarded here:

"You won't let a kid read a book about a serial killer who has sex with dead bodies and lives with them while they decompose, therefore you basically have to eliminate everything but kiddie books from the reading lists, and eliminate AP English"


Well that would be a valid argument if someone made that comment, and to my knowledge no one did (Talk about a fallacious argument ;p).

What was said, is that if a child wants credit for adult classes, he is going to have to learn and be treated as an adult would, not as a child. Its either accept the good with the bad in the AP classes, OR not take the AP classes and stick to the curriculum designed for that age group.

AP classes are created specifically because its felt the persons taking it are mature enough to handle that level of learning. That level of maturity means both in content and education, and is the basis on which these courses designed and given.


you did. You said "the kid shouldn't be taking AP English classes". Scroll up and read what you posted.

Basically, this thread is typical of the kind of argument my son makes. "Gee dad, you let me play rated T games, why can't I play rated M games?"

Let kids be kids and parents be parents. If some of the parents don't want their kids to read books with necrophiliac serial killers, why not just respect that, instead of producing an "all or nothing" scenario where your child's exposure to adult literature is threatened because there is some adult content unavailable to him. That's just a childish view of the world, where basic parenting = censorship. it would be funny if it weren't so stupid.