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(Fox News)   The kid might be right. Maybe it is about free speech. But he's still a dumbass   (foxnews.com) divider line 384
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45866 clicks; posted to Main » on 03 Oct 2007 at 3:59 PM (7 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2007-10-03 04:10:25 PM  
pwhp_67: Says who? My taxes fund that place and my kid will dress however I see fit - it's not your place or the school's to tell me how my kid should or shouldn't dress...

Why is it not the school's place? The school administration is hired with your tax money to make these rules and decisions. And as a taxpayer you are more than welcome to attend the meetings where these decisions are made and voted on, or send letters to the administrators, or call them. Or would that make too much sense?
 
2007-10-03 04:10:39 PM  
"The dress code gives us the tools to make a decision on what is right and what isn't."

Not. Your. Job.
 
2007-10-03 04:10:42 PM  
After watching "Jaywalking" on the Tonight Show, I've decided that we should keep as many people as possible out of the political process.
 
2007-10-03 04:11:02 PM  
wyltoknow: Schools have the right to have a dress code as relaxed or restricted as they like.

They do? Since when?

Last time I checked, school district policies don't have a higher value than the Constitution.

"It was an opportunity for us to continue to try and maintain a safe and orderly environment. The dress code gives us the tools to make a decision on what is right and what isn't," said Thomas J. Collins, Waxahachie Independent School District superintendent.

Reminds me of another quote from Benjamin Franklin:

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"
 
2007-10-03 04:11:04 PM  
School policy says you can't wear politikin' tee shirts... it hasn't got shiat to do with free speech.


/quit leeching money from our grossly underfunded schools to fund your liberal tree fist fark fest... goddamn idiot shiathead farks. The schools don't have the farking money to fight over stupid shiat like this. Nobody is being oppressed,

//Edwards is an asshat anyway.
 
2007-10-03 04:11:06 PM  
The_Sponge , mybabysmomma

almost a righteous simulpost
 
2007-10-03 04:11:10 PM  
Great Janitor: "the bill of rights don't apply to you until you turn 18."


Nice troll... 8/10
 
2007-10-03 04:11:23 PM  
I thought I told you to trim those sideburns!
 
2007-10-03 04:11:33 PM  
wyltoknow: If the students want to be part of the political process in school then just start a club. The school bans any logos that aren't school-related, I don't see the big deal.

For what?

No. Why the hell should someone have to go through the trouble of creating or joining an in-school political club (In Texas, no less, which isn't exactly going to jibe with this kid's political stripe) in order to have an opinion on politics in school?

nmathew01: Such as laws barring them from voting until they are 18?

(Eyeball roll)

Fine. From DEMONSTRATING INTEREST IN THE POLITICAL PROCESS. At some point, assuming that Palmer isn't already 18, he will vote. We're already at a point where it's a high-water mark to get 6 out of 10 people in your country to bother showing up to the polls.

And they throw the book at this kid for showing political interest?

Stupid.
 
2007-10-03 04:12:22 PM  
How many times did he wear it? Reasonably, a parent would be allowed to bring in attire that conforms to dress code, or they'd give the student a warning, or, at the very most, give the student detention for not wearing appropriate attire. It's going overboard to kick him out on the first offense.

Then again, this is a state that has an express lane to the electric chair. There's a good chance that more than three people witnessed him wearing the shirt.
 
2007-10-03 04:12:44 PM  

FOR THE LAST farkING TIME!

YOU HAVE NO FREE SPEECH RIGHT EVEN IN PUBLIC SCHOOL

The supreme court has rulled on this on more than one occasion. The school day is far more important than your spawn's "right" to free speech. Someone in school, even public has few constitutional rights at all. The school said no politically sloganed shirts - not no liberal shirts. The kid is probably up shiat creek for not knowing how to farking read his own student conduct manual.
 
2007-10-03 04:12:56 PM  
Fellows: They do? Since when?

Last time I checked, school district policies don't have a higher value than the Constitution.


Last time I checked, school dress codes weren't struck down by the Supreme Court as being unconstitutional.
 
2007-10-03 04:12:59 PM  
This really isn't hard.

Since he broke the dress code, he broke the dress code. The kid loses.

If he didn't break the dress code, then the school would have no case, and the school would lose.
 
2007-10-03 04:13:13 PM  
aimtastic:

If not for Skid Row t-shirts, half my graduating class would have gone to school shirtless.

Same for me, but Doobie Brothers. Get off my lawn.
 
2007-10-03 04:13:35 PM  
UpstateMonkey: Something less dramatic could even be a girl showing up in a high rise mini skirt and skin tight shirt.....you tell me that's not going to disrupt teenage boys?


I think that if you want a dress code you should send your kids to private school. They have some dandy dress codes. If it's a public school then STFU. When I went to school the "dress code" was simple: No obscenities, no mini skirts, and no muscle shirts. That's it. I saw one girl come in with skin-tight pants that looked like they were painted on. It was a distraction, it was not a disruption - there was no rioting in the halls...
 
2007-10-03 04:13:38 PM  
Great Janitor: Eh, he broke the dress code. A rather restrictive dress code, but he knew about it and still has to follow it.

And about the freedom of speech part, it was explained to me as a teenager that the bill of rights don't apply to you until you turn 18.


Who the hell taught you that? Hitler? Don't they teach the Tinker black band SCOTUS case in civics 101 anymore?
 
2007-10-03 04:14:12 PM  
pwhp_67: Says who? My taxes fund that place and my kid will dress however I see fit - it's not your place or the school's to tell me how my kid should or shouldn't dress...


Obviously, this has been a problem of some sort for the school at some point in time, and probably from someone who had the same attitude you have jsut displayed. It sucks, but there's always someone ruining it for every one else. There is a reason that there are different rules for kids; becuase (like some adults) they don't fully grasp the idea and the responsibility that comes with "freedom of speech". As far as "how you see fit", does that mean that you are going to make a political statement out of your kid by proxy? I don't think that's a very good idea. Next thing you know, every fundie in the world will be sending their kid to school with "God hates fags", or somesuch.
 
2007-10-03 04:14:19 PM  
wyltoknow: meetings where these decisions are made and voted on


No such thing...
 
2007-10-03 04:14:31 PM  
heh...schools here in Indiana are suspending and threatening to "find an alternate school" for (i.e. expel) students whose clothing is the wrong *shade* - dark pink instead of red, etc - according to the dress code. This kid's got nothing to complain about. Besides, it's Texas - they were probably just afraid the poor kid would get lynched.
 
2007-10-03 04:14:54 PM  
miseducated: Why the hell should someone have to go through the trouble of creating or joining an in-school political club (In Texas, no less, which isn't exactly going to jibe with this kid's political stripe) in order to have an opinion on politics in school?

They can have whatever opinions they want. They're just forbidden to wear any political logos because they are not school-related logos. Just as they are forbidden from wearing Marilyn Manson shirts and "Boys are dumb throw rocks at them" shirts. Their political opinions are in no way being trampled on. Now if the rule was specifically "No political-related clothing is allowed" then I might agree with you.
 
2007-10-03 04:14:57 PM  
Desmo: All you mis-guided liberal dolts: It's not a 1st amendment issue. The kid can't vote, therefore his t-shirt is not a political statement.

You couldn't be more wrong if you tried.
 
2007-10-03 04:15:27 PM  
impaler

That is not necessarily the case. The school's dress code is so restrictive it's doubtful it is enforced to the letter. There is a good chance it is being selectively enforced here.

Even if it were not, the kid has a good chance to win thanks to the first amendment and the SCOTUS case referenced above.
 
2007-10-03 04:15:30 PM  
Desmo: All you mis-guided liberal dolts: It's not a 1st amendment issue. The kid can't vote, therefore his t-shirt is not a political statement.

Show me in the Bill of Rights where it says that the First Amendment only applies to 18+ year olds.

His shirt is a statement, period. It doesn't have to be a political statement to be covered by the Bill of Rights.

You fail at civics.
 
2007-10-03 04:15:33 PM  
KennyG: FOR THE LAST farkING TIME!
YOU HAVE NO FREE SPEECH RIGHT EVEN IN PUBLIC SCHOOL


hillbillypharmacist: In Tinker v Des Moines (393 US 503 [1969]), the Supreme Court ruled that students wearing black arm bands to protest the Vietnam War could not be forced to remove the arm bands by school officials. "It can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate."

One of us has failed. I'm pretty sure it's not me.
 
2007-10-03 04:15:33 PM  
Why do retarded parents agree with school dress codes when signing their clam nuggets up, but then kick and cry and scream when their future retail-drone gets in trouble for violating those very same rules?

Jesus people, suck it up. You agreed to the code when you sent him. This code is in place specifically to prevent this kind of crap.

Next time you feel like complaining about public schools cutting music programs or girls sports think about this douchenozzle and about how the school district's funding went into fighting and/or losing a lawsuit over a T-shirt that the kid already knew violated the rules.
 
2007-10-03 04:15:56 PM  
SchlingFo: crunchyfist: that reminds me of this shirt I designed as a gag gift for my brother's birthday:

Do you have that picture template saved on some website?? Please, for the love of God, tell me you do.

I want that shirt. Badly.


Not saved on any particular website but I've still got the original artwork for it - I had to add the text on the Tshirt website itself. You people are tempting me to open up a cafepress store.
 
2007-10-03 04:16:00 PM  
T-shirts, other than WISD clubs, organizations, sports, or spirit t-shirts, college or university t-shirts or solid-colored t-shirts, are prohibited

And that's why the school is going to lose if he fights this. It's pretty much all or nothing (with some limits on indecency/obscenity) in these situations.

Also, someone is going to realise that part of this is to fund the school's t-shirt drive.
 
2007-10-03 04:16:24 PM  
Kyndig: Besides, it's Texas - they were probably just afraid the poor kid would get lynched.

?? He's white.....it's not Jena
 
2007-10-03 04:16:24 PM  
hillbillypharmacist: Guy Innagorillasuit: You have no right to free speech in school. You never have and you never will. Why do people forget this?

I hope you're joking. But in case you're not:

In Tinker v Des Moines (393 US 503 [1969]), the Supreme Court ruled that students wearing black arm bands to protest the Vietnam War could not be forced to remove the arm bands by school officials. "It can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate."

There have been two decisions since then in the SCOTUS that have carved out exceptions:

1. Bethel School v Fraser, wherein a student used crude language in a political speech (which was surprising)

2. Morse v. Frederick (bong hits 4 jesus), wherein a student supposedly incited people to use illegal drugs.



THIS. You do have free speech in schools, although seemingly somewhat limited. Just because noone has challenged a specific rule yet, doesn't mean it's legal.
 
2007-10-03 04:16:26 PM  
Waxahachie Waxahoochie
 
2007-10-03 04:17:49 PM  
elpepe55: Something tells me that if this kid had on a "Remember 9-11" t-shirt he would never have been booted from campus.

Face it, right-wingers, isn't it possible he was ejected from school because he was wearing a shirt supporting a progressive populist down in good ol' Texas -- GWB-lovin', brown-people hatin', freedom-fry eatin' Texas?


Nice try, but you need to work on it a little more.
 
2007-10-03 04:17:57 PM  
crunchyfist: Not saved on any particular website but I've still got the original artwork for it - I had to add the text on the Tshirt website itself. You people are tempting me to open up a cafepress store.

Put it on a cafepress store, and I'll buy it. Today.
 
2007-10-03 04:18:24 PM  

If not for Skid Row t-shirts, half my graduating class would have gone to school shirtless


Same for me, but with "Spaceballs" t-shirts
 
2007-10-03 04:18:27 PM  
A person doesn't MAGICALLY THROUGH THE POWER OF JESUS decide what political party they want to vote for the day they hit 18. It's a progressive process they learn from childhood.

The practice of politics for our children should be ENCOURAGED, so that when they do turn 18th they can make a well reasoned decision on who they should have as their elected official
 
2007-10-03 04:18:36 PM  
What the fark? I wore a Vote for Perot shirt in high school in 1992 and got laughs, strange looks, and thumbs up from teachers and faculty but suspension was never even an issue. Pussification just gets stronger.
 
2007-10-03 04:18:39 PM  
hillbillypharmacist: I hope you're joking. But in case you're not:

In Tinker v Des Moines (393 US 503 [1969]), the Supreme Court ruled that students wearing black arm bands to protest the Vietnam War could not be forced to remove the arm bands by school officials. "It can hardly be argued that either students or teachers shed their constitutional rights to freedom of speech or expression at the schoolhouse gate."

There have been two decisions since then in the SCOTUS that have carved out exceptions:

1. Bethel School v Fraser, wherein a student used crude language in a political speech (which was surprising)

2. Morse v. Frederick (bong hits 4 jesus), wherein a student supposedly incited people to use illegal drugs.


Thanks. I knew it's not black and white like that, perhaps what I should have said was that your rights to free speech in school are abridged.
 
2007-10-03 04:19:01 PM  
hillbillypharmacist

You're correct in that free speach is protected in public schools. However I'm willing to bet the courts would side with the school in this particular case.
 
2007-10-03 04:19:34 PM  
pwhp_67: UpstateMonkey: Something less dramatic could even be a girl showing up in a high rise mini skirt and skin tight shirt.....you tell me that's not going to disrupt teenage boys?


I think that if you want a dress code you should send your kids to private school. They have some dandy dress codes. If it's a public school then STFU. When I went to school the "dress code" was simple: No obscenities, no mini skirts, and no muscle shirts. That's it. I saw one girl come in with skin-tight pants that looked like they were painted on. It was a distraction, it was not a disruption - there was no rioting in the halls...


Regardless, dress codes are everywhere, whether they are implied or written. And, it's only preparing them for the real word....if I showed up to my office in shorts and flip-flops they'd kick me out of the building.
 
2007-10-03 04:19:40 PM  
subby

The kid might be right. Maybe it is about free speech. But he's still a dumbass

You follow the press from the Faux News room. The dumbass, it seems, is only you.
 
2007-10-03 04:19:47 PM  
 
2007-10-03 04:19:49 PM  
Tom_Slick: Blues_X: Yeah, it'd be a shame if our nation's youth became involved in politics.

Kids should be kept out of politics unless you pay income taxes you shouldn't be allowed to vote.


So in other words, you want all of the poor kept from voting since they don't have jobs in many cases. Nice.

If this is a public school (rtfa but didn't notice whether it was or not) they have no leg to stand on. Unless a student wears something that is offensive/involve weapons or drugs or sex a public school is governed by the first amendment as well.
 
2007-10-03 04:20:02 PM  
This kid will not take his case to the Supreme Court. But if he did, and they heard it, he would win.

Any other questions?
 
2007-10-03 04:20:36 PM  
www.4president.org
 
2007-10-03 04:20:53 PM  
Kyndig: You're correct in that free speach is protected in public schools. However I'm willing to bet the courts would side with the school in this particular case.

If that's the case, the kid needs to wear a shirt with a picture of Jesus hugging the WTC towers that says, "If you won't allow me to wear this shirt, you hate America."

The defense for that just writes itself: "Why do you hate Jesus, WTC, and America??"
 
2007-10-03 04:21:00 PM  
Desmo: All you mis-guided liberal dolts: It's not a 1st amendment issue. The kid can't vote, therefore his t-shirt is not a political statement.

I'm sure a great number of small government social libertarian conservatives would take umbrage with you saying that everyone that supports this is a liberal dolt. Where are Shaggy C and Go Go Chinchilla when they are needed?
 
2007-10-03 04:21:05 PM  
wyltoknow: Why? Schools have the right to have a dress code as relaxed or restricted as they like. This kid broke the rules, he got sent home. Case closed.

Case closed? I don't think so. It looks like a judge is going to have to make THAT determination. School administrators have set themselves up as the supreme rulers of their little fiefdoms and feel that nobody can challenge the laws that they send down. WRONG! As long as they accept tax dollars (their paychecks and budgets) they are subject to the will of the taxpayers. They are also subject to ALL laws, local, state and federal as well as what is left of the constitution.
 
2007-10-03 04:21:06 PM  
pwhp_67 If your school tries to ban attire that is not political, such as the Goth look, but not disruptive, then you have the right to sue your school for violating your Fourteen Amendment right to express your individuality. (p)

Who determines what is disruptive?
 
2007-10-03 04:21:13 PM  
FTA: "T-shirts, other than WISD clubs, organizations, sports, or spirit t-shirts, college or university t-shirts or solid-colored t-shirts, are prohibited," according to the policy."


So tie-dye is ok.
 
2007-10-03 04:21:15 PM  
Ok. Anyone who participated in the "girl wants to wear her Jesus Tshirt to a school that banned Tshirts" thread, or "Girl wants to wear her chastity ring to a school that banned jewlery" thread and has changed their opinions on this is an ass.

You know who you are. You KNOW you think it's different because this whiny little attention whore is closer to your political leanings.

STFU, thoses people. Don't make me go dig through the archives.
 
2007-10-03 04:21:24 PM  
If you don't like the dress code, go to a new school.
 
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