Not much love for the show, but the pinball game rocked!

One thing I always wondered about this show is how did they clean the holodeck? I mean they were basically in the space navy and there were probably a lot of lonely dudes on that ship. I mean if you can make a hologram of a person and make them do whatever you want there had to be some dirty stuff going on in there. Now who was the poor bastard who had to clean it up when it was over?

Better first time, yes?

Drunken Scotty approves of this thread

20 years later, and still on 4 times a day.

i love me some TNG. makes me feel old, knowing that the show started when i was in 4th grade, but i still watch it. and love it.

TNG for Win.

Those ear worm things from Wrath of Kahn creeped me out as a kid.

mechgreg
One thing I always wondered about this show is how did they clean the holodeck?

Actually I read an article on that subject. Essentially the treknology for the holodeck works by using forcefields etc. However, when someone has food or drink for instance it is replicated on the spot by the system using the ships store of usable biomass (wrong word for it but you get the picture) The same system supposedly cleanes up any remaining organic matter (leftovers etc) and recycles it back into the biomass storage for later use. Thus any other organic matter left in the holodeck after a session would simply be recycled as well. Of course in a ship that is recycling nearly every consumable that shouldn't bother any member of the crew as they would take it for granted or like most wouldn't even spare it a thought. Unless they actually worked in waste reclamation.

/Ok, enough geeking about trek.
//Voyager never happened.
///Neither did enterprise, they were alternate universes and they both sucked with the force of a black hole.

Just Drawn That Way: OK, here is my claim to fame.

I own ONE PIECE of this costume. Yes, the original...

/And have worn it in a show!
//Thank you Ebay!

My closet bows to your superior acquisition.
/costume geek all the way

Suck it, Voyager haters.

Top 10 reasons:

1) A Vulcan again
2) The Doc... he doesn't feign not having emotions, and along with 7 of 9, pulls off the "finding humanity" thing much better than Data.
3) completely new universe to play around in
4) The sense that they are the underdog, not in an all-powerful federation. They're ship actually gets in real danger, and farked up good.
5) Janeway can command me any day.
6) Less soap-opera, more morality play like TNG, but more real conflict with their own principles.
7) Continuous story line.
8) Hotter women, by far.
9) A real ending to the series.
10) Borg who are more than evil zombie boogie men.

That being said, I enjoy all of them:

VOY
TNG
DS9
TOS
ENT

Might as well join the festival...

Let it be known:
- "Yesterday's Enterprise" was the best episode of the show
- "Measure of a Man" was probably the best science fiction episode

I've heard from other show commentaries that Marina Sirtis (while indeed bangable back in the day) is a prima donna/biatch on set.

And now I have to go get some kids off my lawn.

Clever Neologism: Suck it, Voyager haters.

Top 10 reasons:

1) A Vulcan again
2) The Doc... he doesn't feign not having emotions, and along with 7 of 9, pulls off the "finding humanity" thing much better than Data.
3) completely new universe to play around in
4) The sense that they are the underdog, not in an all-powerful federation. They're ship actually gets in real danger, and farked up good.
5) Janeway can command me any day.
6) Less soap-opera, more morality play like TNG, but more real conflict with their own principles.
7) Continuous story line.
8) Hotter women, by far.
9) A real ending to the series.
10) Borg who are more than evil zombie boogie men.

This. Especially #8, #5 and #4

Clever Neologism: can command me any day.
6) Less soap-opera, more morality play like TNG, but more real conflict with their own principles.
7) Continuous story line.
8) Hotter women, by far.
9) A real ending to the series.
10) Borg who are more than evil zombie boogie men.

Yawn... got sooooo tired of the bad guy being yet another space anomaly...

xtrustx
And to think 38 minutes ago ended my *3rd birthday - to think it's been 20 years - damn I felt good to go and ready to take on the world at 1* ... sure doesn't seem that long ago really ... I thought Denise Crosby was hawt ... then again I was 1* ... (simple puzzle for all that even want to care, enjoy)

You were born on February 29th. Next.

EvilElecBlanket: Can I get a little bit of love for Vash?

yes

this.

omg

teh unF

This show ruled.

Our listeners think I'm the Geordi LaForge of our radio station's airstaff. I think that's a good thing?

Clever Neologism: Suck it, Voyager haters.

Top 10 reasons:

1) A Vulcan again
2) The Doc... he doesn't feign not having emotions, and along with 7 of 9, pulls off the "finding humanity" thing much better than Data.
3) completely new universe to play around in
4) The sense that they are the underdog, not in an all-powerful federation. They're ship actually gets in real danger, and farked up good.
5) Janeway can command me any day.
6) Less soap-opera, more morality play like TNG, but more real conflict with their own principles.
7) Continuous story line.
8) Hotter women, by far.
9) A real ending to the series.
10) Borg who are more than evil zombie boogie men.

I'm sorry buddy, but Voyager was the worst of them all:

1: Episode plots consisted of writers throwing a dart:
A)Crew trapped in the Holodeck with the safeties off and power to the Holodeck cannot be shut off (you'd think that after 7 years the crew would have developed an emergency off switch).
B)The Borg and/or 7 of 9
C)The Doctor being under appreciated or there's something wrong with his program
D) Recycle TNG episode.

2. Characters were the most one dimensional:
Chakotay: Despite being a terrorist, he's a "Goody Two-shoes."
Tom Paris: The cool fly boy who is never able to fully conform to being an officer.
Harry Kim: Another "Goody Two-shoes."
B'Elanna Torres: Angry little girl.
Tuvok: An asshole.
Neelix: The stupid but good intentioned alien.
Kess: More worthless than Troy.

3. Major Continuity Problems:
-Since they cannot refuel at space stations often, power is limited and thus they can only occasionally use the replicators to replicate food, yet, there's enough power to replicate technology and let the Holodecks run 24/7.
-Crew members get killed all the time, but they always manage to maintain a total crew of about 140.
-They'll jump 20,000 light years and still run into alien species from 20,000 light years ago even though the aliens do not posses special warp technology that would allow them to travel that distance.
-In TNG it's established that it takes a fleet of star ships to defeat a single Borg ship (which is why the Borg were only on TNG like 5 times), but Voyager is able to go head to head with the multiple Borg ships.
-Warp 9.9 is supposed to be the fastest speed you can travel, but there is now other technology that lets ships travel hundreds and even thousands of light years in a single day. And what really doesn't make sense, is that the crew successfully steals Borg warp technology to skim 20k light years off their journey, yet they never do it again.
-The doctor is as weak as anyone, but in theory, he should be quite strong.

I was 11, hunh? Wow. I still remember watching that show.

Wil was my first "Tigerbeat" pin-up. He broke my innocence and kick-started me into puberty.


I saw him at PAX a few weeks ago, but I didn't have the nerve to stand in line to thank him in person.

So if you're reading, Will... thanks for the good dreams.

thornhill: Clever Neologism: Suck it, Voyager haters.

Top 10 reasons:

1) A Vulcan again
2) The Doc... he doesn't feign not having emotions, and along with 7 of 9, pulls off the "finding humanity" thing much better than Data.
3) completely new universe to play around in
4) The sense that they are the underdog, not in an all-powerful federation. They're ship actually gets in real danger, and farked up good.
5) Janeway can command me any day.
6) Less soap-opera, more morality play like TNG, but more real conflict with their own principles.
7) Continuous story line.
8) Hotter women, by far.
9) A real ending to the series.
10) Borg who are more than evil zombie boogie men.

I'm sorry buddy, but Voyager was the worst of them all:

1: Episode plots consisted of writers throwing a dart:
A)Crew trapped in the Holodeck with the safeties off and power to the Holodeck cannot be shut off (you'd think that after 7 years the crew would have developed an emergency off switch).
B)The Borg and/or 7 of 9
C)The Doctor being under appreciated or there's something wrong with his program
D) Recycle TNG episode.

2. Characters were the most one dimensional:
Chakotay: Despite being a terrorist, he's a "Goody Two-shoes."
Tom Paris: The cool fly boy who is never able to fully conform to being an officer.
Harry Kim: Another "Goody Two-shoes."
B'Elanna Torres: Angry little girl.
Tuvok: An asshole.
Neelix: The stupid but good intentioned alien.
Kess: More worthless than Troy.

3. Major Continuity Problems:
-Since they cannot refuel at space stations often, power is limited and thus they can only occasionally use the replicators to replicate food, yet, there's enough power to replicate technology and let the Holodecks run 24/7.
-Crew members get killed all the time, but they always manage to maintain a total crew of about 140.
-They'll jump 20,000 light years and still run into alien species from 20,000 light years ago even though the aliens do not posses special warp technology that would allow them to travel that distance.
-In TNG it's established that it takes a fleet of star ships to defeat a single Borg ship (which is why the Borg were only on TNG like 5 times), but Voyager is able to go head to head with the multiple Borg ships.
-Warp 9.9 is supposed to be the fastest speed you can travel, but there is now other technology that lets ships travel hundreds and even thousands of light years in a single day. And what really doesn't make sense, is that the crew successfully steals Borg warp technology to skim 20k light years off their journey, yet they never do it again.
-The doctor is as weak as anyone, but in theory, he should be quite strong.

This, plus you forgot to add:

FAR too much reliance on deus ex-machina (new window).

That's why, IMHO, it never deserved the honor of having "Star Trek" in its title.

Wow! Sorry about that. Stupid slashie.

kb7rky:

FAR too much reliance on deus ex-machina (new window).

That's why, IMHO, it never deserved the honor of having "Star Trek" in its title.

You are complaining about Voyager having a deus ex machina? TNG was the king of that.

thornhill:

3. Major Continuity Problems:
-Since they cannot refuel at space stations often, power is limited and thus they can only occasionally use the replicators to replicate food, yet, there's enough power to replicate technology and let the Holodecks run 24/7.


Holodecks use less power than replicators and transporters. It's just light and forcefields, with not very much matter. Plus, it it is rationed, just like replicators, and everyone gets replicator rations. They use them often, just not all the time.


-Crew members get killed all the time, but they always manage to maintain a total crew of about 140.


Where do you see that count?


-They'll jump 20,000 light years and still run into alien species from 20,000 light years ago even though the aliens do not posses special warp technology that would allow them to travel that distance.


I only see this with the Borg, and it's to be expected: they travel all over the place very quickly... see below. Any other examples?


-In TNG it's established that it takes a fleet of star ships to defeat a single Borg ship (which is why the Borg were only on TNG like 5 times), but Voyager is able to go head to head with the multiple Borg ships.


Better technology (Voyager was the first of it's kind, and was constantly getting new technology from other races), help from 7 of 9 herself, and extenuating circumstances.


-Warp 9.9 is supposed to be the fastest speed you can travel, but there is now other technology that lets ships travel hundreds and even thousands of light years in a single day. And what really doesn't make sense, is that the crew successfully steals Borg warp technology to skim 20k light years off their journey, yet they never do it again.


They had a special opportunity. Warp 9.9 is not the top speed you can travel. Voyager's specs themselves say it can go 9.975. They also use different modes of travel. It's established in TNG Borg cubes can travel much much faster, as in a few years they get from the Delta Quadrant to attack the Federation.


-The doctor is as weak as anyone, but in theory, he should be quite strong.

Keeps the storyline interesting. Data had that capability too, but they didn't use it very often, because there had to be a challenge. Plus, the Doc would only be as strong as the holoemitters being used, and his mobile one is constantly farking up, and fairly fragile.

/NERD FIGHT!

I've been rewatching some Voyager episodes, and Thornhill hits on a lot of Voyager's problems. Especially the cardboard nature of the secondary characters, despite having 7 years to develop backstories. There are some standout episodes (I particularly enjoyed watching "Timeless" a couple days ago, the one where Kim and Chakotay tinker with time to save Voyager, which was lost with all hands when it crashed into an ice planet).

My pet peeve is the ship itself. It's lost in space, alone, with no support, and it looks as shiny and new when it gets home as the day it left. There are no consequences in Voyager. The reset button is pretty much hit episode to episode.

Then look how they do it in Battlestar Galactica. In four seasons, the ship has gone from a hulking, baseship to something that looks like it's being held together with Chief Tyrol's spit.

Cue the "NERRRRRRRRRRRRDS!!" pic in 3...2...

Oh, and another thing. Voyager had some of the thickest forests of techno-babble than any Star Trek show.

I still have the original airing of "Encounter At Farpoint" I recorded on VHS on my family's first VCR, complete with the 1987-era commercials.

My favorite of them is the Pepsi commercial with the two fighter jets. Anyone remember that one? The pilot yanks a handle in the cockpit and a glass bottle of Pepsi pops out. Then he pours it into his cup by flipping the plane upside-down.

Clever Neologism:

You are complaining about Voyager having a deus ex machina? TNG was the king of that.

True. But DS9 got us away from the episode being resolved by using the main deflector to do some technical mumbo-jumbo, and "Voyager" brought it back with a force.

-They'll jump 20,000 light years and still run into alien species from 20,000 light years ago even though the aliens do not posses special warp technology that would allow them to travel that distance.

I only see this with the Borg, and it's to be expected: they travel all over the place very quickly... see below. Any other examples?

The run into both the Hirogen and Malon after jumping 20k light years.

Better technology (Voyager was the first of it's kind, and was constantly getting new technology from other races), help from 7 of 9 herself, and extenuating circumstances.

Oh come one, do you really believe this? Even in "First Contact," which came out after Voyager, it still takes a fleet and Picard's inside knowledge to defeat a single Borg ship.

-Crew members get killed all the time, but they always manage to maintain a total crew of about 140.

Where do you see that count?

There are a few episodes in the first two seasons, and one specifically in the 6th or 7th where Neelix tells Janeway about her responsibility to the 140 crew members (it was just on Spike).



They had a special opportunity. Warp 9.9 is not the top speed you can travel. Voyager's specs themselves say it can go 9.975. They also use different modes of travel. It's established in TNG Borg cubes can travel much much faster, as in a few years they get from the Delta Quadrant to attack the Federation.

The problem, is that the show is about how at maximum warp, it will take them at first 70 years, then 60, then 30 to get home, yet everyone around them can travel those distances in no time flat. Also, in the TNG episode, wasn't it a subspace conduit, essentially a man made wormhole, that allowed the Borg to travel huge distances, and in Voyager, it off an on became a transwarp coils, which was a method of propulsion. And what really didn't make sense in Voyager was that episode with the other federation ship where those aliens converted into fuel would allow the ship to travel 30k light years in a month.

"Star Trek" was a successful sci-fi franchise because it was very good at sticking to its own rules about the universe it existed in. While the ability to travel faster than light was possible, ships could not jump halfway across the galaxy. Voyager threw a lot of that out.

NoDitchDigging: The pilot yanks a handle in the cockpit and a glass bottle of Pepsi pops out. Then he pours it into his cup by flipping the plane upside-down.

Oh hells yeah! It was such a Top Gun rip-off.
/off to YouTube

I would just like to say that I will soon be getting off of all of your lawns. I had just turned 7 when this first aired, but I most certainly did not watch it. I was into sports. I was probably watching the Tigers in the playoffs while doing math on my Tandy 2000. I still have never seen an episode of TNG and hadn't seen TOS until recently. It's good stuff.

So after my Voyager rant, I have to say that DS9 was by far the best series, though TNG had the best individual episodes.

What was great about DS9 was:

1) It was episodic. The reset button was not hit at the end of an episode. Things were allowed to evolve at a slow and realistic pace. For instance, Bashir and O'Brien only became friends in season 3, where as in Voyager, Paris and Kim were made BFF after one episode.
2) The writers realized who the most interesting characters were and gave them the most screen time, such as Quark and Garak.
3) Episodes were not resolved through the deus ex-machina of technology.
4) Darker tone.
5) No stupid aliens (Rom started off dumb, but it was eventually spun into self-esteem issues).
6) Good villains, something which Trek always lacked.
7) Recognition of how stupid aspects of the Federation were (a great moment is when Jake gives the same speech Picard gave about not needing money, and then Nog asks him, "well why do you need my money then.")
8) Only one trapped in the Holodeck episode (O'Brien makes a great joke that they only thing which didn't work on the Enterprise were the Holodecks).
9) Very large cast of recurring characters -- I always hated how on TNG, there were supposed to be a thousand or so people on the Enterprise, but all you ever saw were a dozen of the crew members.

swarms909: I would just like to say that I will soon be getting off of all of your lawns. I had just turned 7 when this first aired, but I most certainly did not watch it. I was into sports. I was probably watching the Tigers in the playoffs while doing math on my Tandy 2000. I still have never seen an episode of TNG and hadn't seen TOS until recently. It's good stuff.

You *will* be assimilated...

Hot hot hot.

EvilElecBlanket: NoDitchDigging: The pilot yanks a handle in the cockpit and a glass bottle of Pepsi pops out. Then he pours it into his cup by flipping the plane upside-down.

Oh hells yeah! It was such a Top Gun rip-off.
/off to YouTube

I have an original VHS copy of Top Gun, which has that ad before the movie.

markie_farkie: (snip)My all-time favorite was the one where Picard lived an entire life on a long-extinct planet, thanks to a probe's mind-control beam thingie..

'The Inner Light' FTW!

Po[r]n Farr[k]!

Link (new window)

Not mine & NSFW

Top 10 Best (Worst) Ways to Kill Wesley Crusher
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
10: After slugging down six Shirley Temple's in 10-forward, Wes
stumbles to the holodeck, which he commands to "take me to hell."
His broken body is later found on the empty holodeck in a pool of
vomit.

9: Wesley gets gang-raped by a group of female Klingons.

8: Riker gets carried away executing an order from Picard to "knock the little snot around a bit."

7: Data catches him tossing off. Uncomprehending, he requires a detailed explanation from Wesley, who dies of embarrassment.

6: Extensive lab analysis of a green slime found on one of the control panels uncovers the fact that our favorite ensign has, once again, been picking his nose. He is summarily fired and commits suicide.

5: Wes gets gang-raped by a group of male Klingons.

4: On an earlier episode, Wes got to kiss a girl who turned into a Chewbacca-like creature. Here, she returns, and they once again get involved. (Un)fortunately, once she gets really heated, she mutates back into a wookie and forces Wesley to be her cringing sex slave. She then tears him limb from limb and eats him.

3: In a rare episode involving characters from both ST and ST:TNG, Spock attempts a Vulcan mind-meld with Wesley. Wesley's head explodes. Spock barely survives, spending the next several days scratching himself and whining.

2: Worf notices a Romulan ship on the scanners, and sends Wesley down to clean out the photon tubes. Later, someone makes a comment about the needs of the many having outweighed the needs of the few.

1: Wes gets involved in a deviant sexual practice known as "tribble stuffing," not realizing that tribbles multiply _anywhere_. Even an emergency laser enema by Dr. Crusher fails to save him.

t3knomanser
You mean Borg that aren't scary any more. The Borg were supposed to be creepy technological zombies. They were meant to show up a handful of times and be so damn powerful that each time it was a near thing. There should have never been a Borg queen- the very idea (a Borg who is an individual?) is contrary to the entire thing that makes them scary. They are the Borg Collective.

THIS. In one episode (Scorpion, I think), Janeway actually bargains with the Borg. I thought, "What bullshiat! The Borg don't negotiate. They'll take what they want. You will be assimilated." I mean, here's a new supervillian in Species 8472 that is absolutely killing the Borg, the archenemy of the Federation, and then Janeway and crew come up with a way to beat them in one episode!? Not only that, they then give that to the Borg for a Borg assurance of safe passage through the Northwest Passage? Absolute bullshiat.

God, it's been 20 years.. I was 10. My dad taped each one for me on VHS since I didn't get to watch TV at my mom's. I'd go over to his place on the weekend for my daily dose of Trek. I'd have a root beer and he'd have a beer and we'd watch it together and he'd complain about not having Scotty made it not Star Trek.

/Favorite is "Inner Light" but I also enjoyed "Rascals" Picard throws a temper tantrum and Relics. Scotty ruled.

0x1a4: Holy crap, by far the hottest star trek chic:

holy ICK! Maybe if you chopped off her head!

now in episode 132 , 'true Q', Olivia D'abo kicks ass!

Easily the most overlooked TNG episode is "Devil's Due" which is a delightfully cynical attack on religion and faith.

"Inner Light" is clearly the best episode, while "Cause and Effect" is among the most entertaining hours of TV ever.

Hottest Star Trek babe?

Lee Merriwether from the episode "That which survives" of TOS.

By far.


\I come for you James Kirk

Hot Trek babes and still no mention of:

This universe:



Was more fun.