Enjoy the new regime, America!

F42: Leave the internet, and never come back: You are trespassing.

You're not even trying.

tonesskin: Um, did you strike the right thing? If you struck what you meant to struck, then:

FAIL

If not, then carry on.

I DID strike the right write thing actually. Ever heard herd of rotsky?



/It is you who FAIL ROTSKY!
//3 day old cliche

Roswellite13: The sense of entitlement some people have is just amazing. This wasn't someone exercising their right to free speech, it was a moron abusing his right to free speech and he got what he deserved. If I ever resist and argue with the police like he did, I fully expect to get what what he got.

Hi, Big Brother. Who decides when it crosses the line from exercise to abuse? Did MLK abuse free speech? The KKK? Does Bush abuse free speech when he makes up words?

fawlty 2007-09-19 11:15:28 AM
The left at its best. Go out your way to be a douchebag and provoke a response, then get self-righteous and create a media circus about the response that you provoked. Stay classy, libs.

I feel a pang of shame reading that, out of fear that I could sound that stupid at times. You, sir, are a symptom of the disease that has destroyed this country. The disease is partisanship, and you came here to show the debilitating effect it has on one's ability to reason.

I'll have to go with the cops on this one

However

sceens like this Link (new window)- the Cop should be institutionalised for awhile and barred from law enforcement for life.

I found it to be a horrible abuse of police authority, and I would support tasers being banned, if only because cops don't seem capable of understanding what they're really for. They were meant to be a substitute for a weapon, for lethal force. Cops should look back at every time they used a taser, and think whether or not lethal force would have been appropriate at that time. If not, then they have no business carrying a taser -- it's not a cattle prod to push around people.

There are a series of reforms to the police system that need to happen:
1: Make it so that the police officer receives a reduced version of the shock whenever he administers one. Not enough to make the cop unable to do his job, but enough to keep him from tasing without abandon.
2: Administer shocks to potential cops multiple times during training and during the cop's police career, so he doesn't forget what he's actually doing to someone else.
4: Investigations into abuse should be done by an independent panel from the citizenry, not the police department.
3: When police are sued for abuse, don't take the money from the taxpayers. Split the money into sixths. Take 1/3 from the funding of the police department. Take 1/6 from the personal funds of the people who trained the cop or didn't check this abusive behavior. Finally, take 1/2 from the personal savings of the cop himself. Call me harsh, but when an officer, who has been entrusted by the people to serve the people, breaks that trust and goes against foundational principles of our society, that cop should be ruined.

tonesskin: And no, the police don't have the right to determine trespassing.

You're right. The University employed guards do though.

Tat'dGreaser: /I'm calling you out. You are ALL talk.

And you're not even that.

aphexcoil: Isuldirs: aphexcoil: Last I checked, the cops didn't own the auditorium -- the university did.

If you watch the video, a UNIVERSITY guard, asked him to leave first. She represents the University.

They don't have that kind of reciprocity. If I'm in the library getting naked and breaking a statue, they can arrest me and haul me off for processing, but they can't tell me to put my book down and leave the building and then consider it trespassing when I tell them to shove it up their ass.

I forgot to mention -- they can't tell me to leave if I am doing nothing wrong -- not if I'm naked reading a book. Sorry.

Our laws are farked. The kid shouldn't have been tasered; I'm not even sure University cops should have tasers or exist beyond the capacity to summon real police.

Conversely, if the kid is being carried out while struggling and gets hurt, he shouldn't have the oppurtunity to sue (unless he's been improperly detained). All this does is hinder police's ability to do their jobs properly.

Aexia

"Through" without beginning date means "the time prior to", but I'll give your post a B for successfully avoiding the question.

Regardless of if the cops had a right to stop me, I think my first reaction will always be to flail around and try to run away, just so I can make them guess if I'm trying to assault them or not.

Gadren: Finally, take 1/2 from the personal savings of the cop himself.

Problem... Police rely on their pensions for retirement, so most of them have jack and shiat in their personal savings, and they frequently don't even have the jack.

Isuldirs: You're right. The University employed guards do though.

They do? Strange. Well, I'll let my students know they are trespassing then. I don't want them in the classroom. After all, I'm a representative of the university.

saucydwarf: it was an open forum. he could have asked a thousand questions if he wanted to.

and i really cant see how he was disturbing the peace by asking questions during a Q&A.

you dont have to spell anything out. im a grown up. i make up my own mind.

Look at the entirety of the situation and THEN come to a decision. The suspect was not simply asking a question. There is much more to it than that.

In addition, the University has the property right to exclude anyone from the campus they wish - both the schools I attended and the school I teach at have "Persona Non Grata" lists. If you're asked to leave the premises and you do not, you are trespassing.

tonesskin What? Are you serious?

1) Those wouldn't be fighting words.

2) It also isn't obscenity (as in the unprotected speech obscenity) because there is no way it would satisfy all three prongs of the Miller test.

MoranMoron.
Sorry Pet Peeve

sterben: The guy was an asshat.

That said, I actually sort of respect him. Unlike 90% of the 'citizens' out there, this guy actually stood up for what he considered unlawful. Most of you sheep would have rolled over and let the cops scratch your belly.

We've gone from a country of patriots and independent thinking to a country of lemmings. It's pretty sad, really.

I've posted this before but I thought it quite relevant to this situation.

Good evening, London. Allow me first to apologize for this interruption. I do, like many of you, appreciate the comforts of every day routine- the security of the familiar, the tranquility of repetition. I enjoy them as much as any bloke. But in the spirit of commemoration, thereby those important events of the past usually associated with someone's death or the end of some awful bloody struggle, a celebration of a nice holiday, I thought we could mark this November the 5th, a day that is sadly no longer remembered, by taking some time out of our daily lives to sit down and have a little chat. There are of course those who do not want us to speak. I suspect even now, orders are being shouted into telephones, and men with guns will soon be on their way. Why? Because while the truncheon may be used in lieu of conversation, words will always retain their power. Words offer the means to meaning, and for those who will listen, the enunciation of truth. And the truth is, there is something terribly wrong with this country, isn't there? Cruelty and injustice, intolerance and oppression. And where once you had the freedom to object, to think and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillance coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission. How did this happen? Who's to blame? Well certainly there are those more responsible than others, and they will be held accountable, but again truth be told, if you're looking for the guilty, you need only look into a mirror. I know why you did it. I know you were afraid. Who wouldn't be? War, terror, disease. There were a myriad of problems which conspired to corrupt your reason and rob you of your common sense. Fear got the best of you, and in your panic you turned to the now high chancellor, Adam Sutler. He promised you order, he promised you peace, and all he demanded in return was your silent, obedient consent. Last night I sought to end that silence. Last night I destroyed the Old Bailey, to remind this country of what it has forgotten. More than four hundred years ago a great citizen wished to embed the fifth of November forever in our memory. His hope was to remind the world that fairness, justice, and freedom are more than words, they are perspectives. So if you've seen nothing, if the crimes of this government remain unknown to you then I would suggest you allow the fifth of November to pass unmarked. But if you see what I see, if you feel as I feel, and if you would seek as I seek, then I ask you to stand beside me one year from tonight, outside the gates of Parliament, and together we shall give them a fifth of November that shall never, ever be forgot.

This.

*insert Orson Wells slow clap gif here*

For the LAST time: the organizers of the event directed the cops to remove him. end of that farking argument.

aphexcoil: Tatsuma: By the way, I've got awesome tips for you if you don't want to be tasered by police officers:

*) If you are asked by police officers to leave a building, say "Yes, sir" and leave the building. No tasering for you.


If I'm not breaking any laws and a police officer asks me to shut up and leave a building, I'm going to tell him to go fark himself.

And you will be detained. Notice, I didn't say arrested, but detained. There are any number of legal reasons an officer can direct you to move or shut up and failure to comply gives him the right to remove you from the situation until it's "all clear" and the situation has been sorted out. If you resist with physical force you will be arrested and charged with a felony (at least in Florida) regardless of whether or not the officer was justified in detaining you to begin with.

I'm still utterly shocked that so much of the populace of Farkistan has no concept of police procedures and authority. The law doesn't care about whether you are right or wrong, just that you must subject yourself to the authority of the police in almost all circumstances. The second you disobey an order from them to either move from an area or be frisked and/or handcuffed or you fail to pull over for a patrol car is the second you become a danger to society. How can we assume you would comply with any other order, such as "drop the weapon"?

And as for the armchair lawyer who stated, "He has a right to know his crime under Habeas Corpus" as an excuse for not complying with the police while they are trying to detain/escort or arrest you...massive massive amounts of fail. A prime example of a little bit of legal knowledge being a dangerous thing.

Dramadairy: Baloney. Tasers kill people too. An arm bar, to my knowledge, has never killed anybody, and a chokehold is not particularly dangerous either unless it's not administered properly.

People have died from being restrained. And a chokehold not particularly dangerous? It's so easy to properly administer a chokehold when some dumbass is struggling/twisting/elbowing the whole time.

tonesskin: Well, I'll let my students know they are trespassing then. I don't want them in the classroom. After all, I'm a representative of the university.

So if one of your students is acting out of line, causing a major disturbance during one of your lectures, and you ask them to leave your class, they have the right to say no and continue to cause shiat?

This douche is a perfect example of why "New Age Parenting" is dead set wrong. Mommies precious little flower never experienced any discipline or order at home and feels he has free reign over everyone and everything.

When the totality of his actions (barging to the front of the line, etc.) are taken into account, he was well deserving of being removed from the building.

He didn't get tasered for asking a farkin question.

He was tasered for his erractic and provocative reaction.
How some of you naive farkers get through life is beyond me.

Screw a tasering, that large black officer should have put him in a chicken wing and snapped his shoulder out of place. I think you'll find the suspect is much more inclined to place his other hand behind his back after the initial experience.

Oh, but that would be brutality, a tasering it is!

CAADbury: For the LAST time: the organizers of the event directed the cops to remove him. end of that farking argument.

To so authoritatively state something as fact when very little is known about what happened seems kind of premature.

Do you have evidence that this is, indeed, the case?

mccallcl:
He was asked to leave by the sponsors of the event? He was asked to leave by the speaker?

No, he was asked to leave by the police, who do not OWN the campus, they PATROL the campus at the behest of the very student they tortured.

It is unbelievable that there are people still supporting the police's actions. Even the administration is hanging them out to dry.

They are University Police, as such, they are agents of the University and have the right to request the suspect leave the premises.

FAIL.

Has he pulled the "white card" yet.
It is obvious that this happened because he is white.

"Dipshiat got what was coming.'

I don't think they're decided how much they're going to pay him to settle yet. So, he hasn't got what's coming. Probably have to wait for the jury to decide how much he gets.

HunterNIU: /It is you who FAIL ROTSKY!

Excuse me, sir, but you seem to have some unfunny forced meme on your post.

Burning_Monk:

I would have prefered the cops to have some restraint and let the guy spend 1 1/2 minutes asking an informed question, instead of censoring him by cutting his mic and forcibly removing him. What happened with the officers was brought on by themselves, at no point was violence necessary.

Well, I wouldn't have let him talk at all after barging in line, that's disrespectful. But once Kerry agreed to let him talk, they should give him his 2 minutes (I agree with you). However I don't think the cops cut his mike, my guess would be the event staff did that. I would also guess that the event staff asked for him to be removed. I don't know.

However, all that is moot to me. As soon as he started jumping around and pushing back against the cops, he was over the line. To me he appeared unstable and possibly dangerous. The one female officer is about a foot shorter than this guy, if he had turned violent she could have gotten seriously hurt. And if he had injured someone at the Q&A, people would have blamed the cops. Even after they had him on the ground, a lucky kick could have broken ribs or a nose.

All I'm saying is that IMHO he appeared to be unstable, and posed a potential risk to the officers and bystanders in the room.

When we consider the nature and the theory of our institutions of government, the principles upon which they are supposed to rest, and review the history of their development, we are constrained to conclude that they do not mean to leave room for the play and action of purely personal and arbitrary power. Sovereignty itself is, of course, not subject to law, for it is the author and source of law; but in our system, while sovereign powers are delegated to the agencies of government, sovereignty itself remains with the people, by whom and for whom all government exists and acts. And the law is the definition and limitation of power. It is, indeed, quite true that there must always be lodged somewhere, and in some person or body, the authority of final decision; and in many cases of mere administration, the responsibility is purely political, no appeal lying except to the ultimate tribunal of the public judgment, exercised either in the pressure of opinion, or by means of the suffrage. But the fundamental rights to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, considered as individual possessions, are secured by those maxims of constitutional law which are the monuments showing the victorious progress of the race in securing to men the blessings of civilization under the reign of just and equal laws, so that, in the famous language of the Massachusetts bill of rights, the government of the commonwealth 'may be a government of laws and not of men.' For the very idea that one man may be compelled to hold his life, or the means of living, or any material right essential to the enjoyment of life, at the mere will of another, seems to be intolerable in any country where freedom prevails, as being the essence of slavery itself.

From the police report:

"Meyer was laughing and being lighthearted in the car, his demeanor completely changed once the cameras were not in sight. Meyer did ask, at one point, if the cameras were going to be at the jail."

Great, this nut job is associating Ron Paul with 9/11 conspiracies. Like religion, Ron Paul is a good candidate but some of his followers are idiots.

Gadren: I found it to be a horrible abuse of police authority, and I would support tasers being banned, if only because cops don't seem capable of understanding what they're really for. They were meant to be a substitute for a weapon, for lethal force. Cops should look back at every time they used a taser, and think whether or not lethal force would have been appropriate at that time. If not, then they have no business carrying a taser -- it's not a cattle prod to push around people.

There are a series of reforms to the police system that need to happen:
2: Administer shocks to potential cops multiple times during training and during the cop's police career, so he doesn't forget what he's actually doing to someone else.
3: Investigations into abuse should be done by an independent panel from the citizenry, not the police department.
4: When police are sued for abuse, don't take the money from the taxpayers. Split the money into sixths. Take 1/3 from the funding of the police department. Take 1/6 from the personal funds of the people who trained the cop or didn't check this abusive behavior. Finally, take 1/2 from the personal savings of the cop himself. Call me harsh, but when an officer, who has been entrusted by the people to serve the people, breaks that trust and goes against foundational principles of our society, that cop should be ruined.


i might tinker with the numbers and details a bit but these reforms seem rational to me

tonesskin: Are you THAT stupid? So I can go somewhere and just ask you to leave and if you don't you are trespassing? And no, the police don't have the right to determine trespassing. The police don't own the property.

Dude was asked to leave by a university official. That there constitutes trespassing.

/you are THAT stupid

So, I can be hit with 50,000 volts for talking too much?

No more Starbucks for me!

stiletto_the_wise: If you asked an unapproved question, or otherwise spoke illegal words, you wouldn't even have a chance to go willingly, as we saw in the video. You would have gotten an immediate drag-away and beatdown.

You are delusional. Get psychiatric help immediately, before you hurt someone.

This is sort of funny


http://www.donttasemebro.com/

trumanssparkin: He didn't get tasered for asking a farkin question.

No, he was assaulted and physically dragged off for asking a question, and was tasered for instinctively defending himself from what amounts to a gang attack.

Isuldirs: You're not even trying.

You were told to leave, which you consider reason enough to be guilty of trespass when you do not comply. So why are you making yourself guilty of trespass?

Leave now, or else by your own logic, you're committing a crime.

Isuldirs: tonesskin: Well, I'll let my students know they are trespassing then. I don't want them in the classroom. After all, I'm a representative of the university.

So if one of your students is acting out of line, causing a major disturbance during one of your lectures, and you ask them to leave your class, they have the right to say no and continue to cause shiat?

That's not trespassing anymore, so it's not relevant to what I said.

Pythagoras: Does it strike anyone as odd that NO ONE at the rally did anything and instead of opted to protest?

This just underlines that college students are all talk and no action.

I'm a college student. And I think other college students are smart enough to know that the moment you lay a finger on a police officer, you're interfering with police business. What could they do? Besides , for the bystanders, it was probably a very tense situation. What with the screaming and all. I doubt anyone would have jumped to the guy's aid because the air in the room would have been beyond awkward.

oldass31: Pythagoras: Does it strike anyone as odd that NO ONE at the rally did anything and instead of opted to protest?

This just underlines that college students are all talk and no action.

I'm a college student. And I think other college students are smart enough to know that the moment you lay a finger on a police officer, you're interfering with police business. What could they do? Besides , for the bystanders, it was probably a very tense situation. What with the screaming and all. I doubt anyone would have jumped to the guy's aid because the air in the room would have been beyond awkward.

The students DID do something.

They cheered.

Because they realized who was the asshat and who the heroes were.