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(San Francisco 49ers)   Virginia Republican lawmakers pull a "my bad" and vow to fix the unconsitutional law they passed in the spring   (content.hamptonroads.com) divider line 40
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1935 clicks; posted to Politics » on 23 Aug 2007 at 12:51 PM (7 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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Archived thread
 
2007-08-23 01:01:15 PM  
Not until the next regular session of the General Assembly in January, however.
 
2007-08-23 01:01:23 PM  
Chicks can use the Boobies as airbags! Let them drive poorly!

Fees FTL!!
 
2007-08-23 01:01:25 PM  
That was a stupid thing to enact anyway. I haven't gotten a ticket in a long time, but for speeding, $750 is stupid.
 
2007-08-23 01:02:12 PM  
Damn you wpmulligan, that would have been a highly annoying boobies and you had to ruin it for me.

Bah!
 
2007-08-23 01:03:43 PM  
Shaggy_C: Damn you wpmulligan, that would have been a highly annoying boobies and you had to ruin it for me.

You snooze, you lose.
 
2007-08-23 01:09:18 PM  
FlashLV: That was a stupid thing to enact anyway. I haven't gotten a ticket in a long time, but for speeding, $750 is stupid.

That isn't why the law is stooopid. The law is stooopid because Virginia legislators are mooooorans when it comes to reading the underlying legislation. In Virginia, today, if you don't use a turn signal, you can be charged with reckless driving. If you do a number of other rather inoccuous things, you can also be charged with reckless driving (hint, the officer can just "decide" you were driving recklessly). They also made these civil fines, so they don't have to apply to out of state drivers, but the WORST thing is that these fines would not apply to illegal aliens. Now, I realize that for the most part nobody is getting reckless driving tickets for failure to signal a turn, but the law is still on the books.

Finally, the law makes it so that there will be a very LARGE increase in unlicensed, and therefore uninsured drivers on the road because folks have to get to work and its the poor folks who generally get most of the tickets and they can't pay the fines.

All in all these was as poorly thought out as any legislative action ever - thanks, Republitards, including the replublitard in sheeps clothing Gov. Kaine.
 
2007-08-23 01:22:27 PM  
dhudd: Finally, the law makes it so that there will be a very LARGE increase in unlicensed, and therefore uninsured drivers on the road because folks have to get to work and its the poor folks who generally get most of the tickets and they can't pay the fines.

I agree with you for the most part (and about this being a bad law), but why would poor folks get the most tickets? Does being poor make you a worse driver? I would have assumed the opposite since richer people would be more likely to a) own a car, and b) not be deterred by traffic fines. Feel free to prove me wrong with actual evidence if you've got it; I'm just speculating here.
 
2007-08-23 01:27:05 PM  
Mnemia: dhudd:

I agree with you for the most part (and about this being a bad law), but why would poor folks get the most tickets? Does being poor make you a worse driver? I would have assumed the opposite since richer people would be more likely to a) own a car, and b) not be deterred by traffic fines. Feel free to prove me wrong with actual evidence if you've got it; I'm just speculating here.


I will assume you've never spent a day in traffic court in Virginia. If you had, you wouldn't have queried about the poor getting the most tickets.
 
2007-08-23 01:30:46 PM  
dhudd: I will assume you've never spent a day in traffic court in Virginia. If you had, you wouldn't have queried about the poor getting the most tickets.

Nope. I haven't gotten a ticket since I was 18 (though I do live in Virginia now). I'll take your word for it. Of course, it could also be that richer people are more likely to just pay the fine by mail and take the insurance hit rather than show up in court (because they can afford it more easily).
 
2007-08-23 01:34:22 PM  
dhudd: FlashLV: That was a stupid thing to enact anyway. I haven't gotten a ticket in a long time, but for speeding, $750 is stupid.

That isn't why the law is stooopid. The law is stooopid because Virginia legislators are mooooorans when it comes to reading the underlying legislation. In Virginia, today, if you don't use a turn signal, you can be charged with reckless driving. If you do a number of other rather inoccuous things, you can also be charged with reckless driving (hint, the officer can just "decide" you were driving recklessly). They also made these civil fines, so they don't have to apply to out of state drivers, but the WORST thing is that these fines would not apply to illegal aliens. Now, I realize that for the most part nobody is getting reckless driving tickets for failure to signal a turn, but the law is still on the books.

Finally, the law makes it so that there will be a very LARGE increase in unlicensed, and therefore uninsured drivers on the road because folks have to get to work and its the poor folks who generally get most of the tickets and they can't pay the fines.

All in all these was as poorly thought out as any legislative action ever - thanks, Republitards, including the replublitard in sheeps clothing Gov. Kaine.


See you seemed all rational until you spouted bullshiate at the end.

Now you look like a douche by doing that.

Also I do think cutting me off in traffic by not using your turn signal is a big issue and causes many accidents. It should be reckeless driving if you are 'too good' to use that signal, that or a lazy a-hole.
 
2007-08-23 01:34:50 PM  
Mnemia: dhudd: I will assume you've never spent a day in traffic court in Virginia. If you had, you wouldn't have queried about the poor getting the most tickets.

Nope. I haven't gotten a ticket since I was 18 (though I do live in Virginia now). I'll take your word for it. Of course, it could also be that richer people are more likely to just pay the fine by mail and take the insurance hit rather than show up in court (because they can afford it more easily).


That's possibly true but the law still affects the poor in a disproportinate way.

EVERY state that has passed these types of laws regrets it, including, GASP, Virginia. Unfortunately many of them are so used to the extra income now they can't repeal them and they have brazillians of unlicensed, uninsured drivers on their roads.
 
2007-08-23 01:37:16 PM  
I did that on purpose, just for you, because you are such a farkingretard.
 
2007-08-23 01:42:53 PM  
dhudd: That's possibly true but the law still affects the poor in a disproportinate way.

Any fixed fine will affect the poor in a disproportionate way, because it's a larger percentage of their income. I actually think it would be a good idea to index all fines to income, like some other countries do. That way it would be equally painful to someone who makes $1 million per year vs. someone who makes $20,000. So yes, I do think it's unfair to the poor in that sense.

I'm less sympathetic to the argument that it's unfair to the poor because they get more traffic tickets, unless it could be shown that there is something systematic going on. Examples of that might include poor people driving more on average, or a widespread pattern of police selectively targeting the poor when writing tickets. If they're just getting more tickets because they're more likely to drive badly, then I don't have a ton of sympathy.

Now all that being said, I do think these new fines are completely outrageous and unwarranted. I could see maybe having higher fines for people are habitual offenders, but not for a single incident where it could be something as dumb as forgetting to use a turn signal.
 
2007-08-23 01:45:42 PM  
I live in Md. but work in Va.

I had no problem with the law because it didn't affect me. Now the SOB's want to change that and of course, it's just wrong. Let the fools in Va. suffer, they voted the chumps in. But I was minding my own business, doing 95mph in the fast lane, and now this.

It's wrong.
 
2007-08-23 01:47:42 PM  
dhudd:

That's possibly true but the law still affects the poor in a disproportinate way.

EVERY state that has passed these types of laws regrets it, including, GASP, Virginia. Unfortunately many of them are so used to the extra income now they can't repeal them and they have brazillians of unlicensed, uninsured drivers on their roads.


How? Because they make less? Do you have stats of the income of people who get tickets?

People driving without insurance can suck my balls, they cost me $500 a year in insurance coverage!
 
2007-08-23 01:48:48 PM  
What a load of crap. This is not a "my bad", it's an EXPANSION of the fees to collect more money. How gullible can you be?

Link with more details (new window)
 
2007-08-23 01:49:44 PM  
dhudd, you can't put Kaine on us you rump ranger. Va had a surpluss until That Democrat came in. Now, they are hinting of drastic tax increases as well.

Richmond is in the same boat with good old Wilder.
 
2007-08-23 01:52:55 PM  
Hopefully the Republicans who passed the law and signed it into law will suffer at the ballot box.
 
2007-08-23 02:01:20 PM  
Nemo's Brother: dhudd, you can't put Kaine on us you rump ranger. Va had a surpluss until That Democrat came in. Now, they are hinting of drastic tax increases as well.

Richmond is in the same boat with good old Wilder.


Of course, you can't call this a 'Democrat' issue, as the previous governor (Mark Warner) was the most influentual person for getting that surplus in the first place (despite the massive clusterfark that was the Gilmore administration).
 
2007-08-23 02:01:35 PM  
Descartes: Hopefully the Republicans who passed the law and signed it into law will suffer at the ballot box.

Hopefully the Republicans and Democrats who passed the law and the Democratic governor who signed it into law will suffer at the ballot box.


/Fixed it myself!
//First version sounded overly partisan. And the governor turns out to be a Democrat.
 
2007-08-23 02:10:54 PM  
Nemo's Brother: dhudd, you can't put Kaine on us you rump ranger. Va had a surpluss until That Democrat came in. Now, they are hinting of drastic tax increases as well.

Richmond is in the same boat with good old Wilder.


You can't possibly be that stupid - nobody can. The last republitard Governor was Gilmore - what was the deficit under Gilmore? Warner had a surplus. The present shortfall is because the repblitards spent money they thought was coming in but didn't because of the real estate sales slowdown.

Go learn to read a farking book without getting tired lips.
 
2007-08-23 02:12:28 PM  
And nemoidiot - the law was introduced by a repbulitard, who is a lawyer, whose lawfirm specializes in traffic adjudications.
 
2007-08-23 02:19:31 PM  
To ease them?!?!

WTF?!?!

You farking asshats. I hate these stupid farks and their piss poor governance.
 
2007-08-23 02:25:42 PM  
dhudd:
All in all these was as poorly thought out as any legislative action ever - thanks, Republitards, including the replublitard in sheeps clothing Gov. Kaine.


This is more of the General Assembly as a whole being asshats rather than just the republicans. When voted on, the bill got overwhelming support from both sides, including the democratic Governor.

FTFA:

House Majority Leader Morgan Griffith, R-Salem, declined to discuss the particulars of the plan, but he said there is no desire among General Assembly leaders to call a special session to make the changes this summer.

Griffith said Republicans are committed to revising the legislation when they meet in Richmond for their regular annual session in January.


That's assuming these asshats are still going to be in office come January. I know that if they don't repeal this law by the time elections come around, I'll be voting against both the incumbents in my district (both my senator and delegate, democrats, voted for the bill). I'm not taking any "promises" as a solution. Either reconvene for a special session to repeal this bullshiat law, or I'll be finding myself at the ballot box this November doing my part to vote these bastards out.

Delegates who voted for the bill (new window)
It's trickier to find out who in the Senate voted for it, but you can find a voting history on the Virginia Assembly's website on HB3202
 
2007-08-23 02:27:23 PM  
dhudd: Now, I realize that for the most part nobody is getting reckless driving tickets for failure to signal a turn

Clearly you've never driven in VA with an out-of-state license plate.
 
2007-08-23 02:28:50 PM  
dhudd: And nemoidiot - the law was introduced by a repbulitard, who is a lawyer, whose lawfirm specializes in traffic adjudications.

Yeah, I hope that asshat Albo gets what's coming to him this November and is sent packing. This guy doesn't even want to change the law, nevermind repeal it. He has to be reminded that he serves the people, not himself.
 
2007-08-23 02:40:03 PM  
homebrew: This is more of the General Assembly as a whole being asshats rather than just the republicans.

No, it is mainly the republicans. Specifically, the group of hardcore, anti-tax Republicans in the House of Delegates who will not, under any circumstances, vote for anything they consider a tax. Because of them, and the fact that fines are constitutionally required to be put to specified uses, the General Assembly was forced to go the "fee" route to raise transportation funding. The problem with that is the DMV collects the fees and can't reach out-of-state drivers.

So this situation was caused by the asshattery of Republican Delegates compounded by the stupidity/poor reading comprehansion of the rest of the General Assembly.
 
2007-08-23 02:40:45 PM  
homebrew: Yeah, I hope that asshat Albo gets what's coming to him this November and is sent packing. This guy doesn't even want to change the law, nevermind repeal it. He has to be reminded that he serves the people, not himself.

I believe he is running unopposed.
 
2007-08-23 02:45:13 PM  
wpmulligan: homebrew: This is more of the General Assembly as a whole being asshats rather than just the republicans.

No, it is mainly the republicans. Specifically, the group of hardcore, anti-tax Republicans in the House of Delegates who will not, under any circumstances, vote for anything they consider a tax. Because of them, and the fact that fines are constitutionally required to be put to specified uses, the General Assembly was forced to go the "fee" route to raise transportation funding. The problem with that is the DMV collects the fees and can't reach out-of-state drivers.

So this situation was caused by the asshattery of Republican Delegates compounded by the stupidity/poor reading comprehansion of the rest of the General Assembly.


Perhaps, but how do you explain the fact that most democrats voted for this as well and a democrat governor signed it into law? You can blame the republicans all you want, but the democrats are just as responsible.

/generally votes democrat

I believe he is running unopposed.


That farking sucks. The democrats can't find anyone to run against this asshat? Surely he must have lost some popularity with this bill.
 
2007-08-23 02:49:49 PM  
homebrew: Perhaps, but how do you explain the fact that most democrats voted for this as well and a democrat governor signed it into law? You can blame the republicans all you want, but the democrats are just as responsible.

Agreed, the Democrats should get half a demerit on this one. But they saw it as the only possible way to get the transportation money in the face of the rabid, wild-eyed antics of Albo and his posse.
 
2007-08-23 02:54:07 PM  
wpmulligan - I like your profile, especially the Nats banner. Ever in Fredericksburg, a free beer is waiting for you.
 
2007-08-23 02:57:10 PM  
homebrew: That farking sucks. The democrats can't find anyone to run against this asshat? Surely he must have lost some popularity with this bill.

Nobody can run against anyone since the filing deadline passed long ago. The best you can do is a write-in campaign.

Albo isn't the only traffic lawyer pushing this. House Majority Leader's website
 
2007-08-23 03:30:10 PM  
Fark the commonwealth. They don't even try to hide the fact that his is about raising money, NOT enforcing the law or enhancing public safety. Imagine just how farked up everything would be if that was the primary motive for all legislation.
 
2007-08-23 04:36:08 PM  
I'm a Virginian, and I'm getting a kick out of these replies. We're the state with hefty moving violation fines fines and a ban on radar detectors to boot.

Google Maps, plot a course around VA!
 
2007-08-23 04:51:54 PM  
centrifugal bumblepuppy: I'm a Virginian, and I'm getting a kick out of these replies. We're the state with hefty moving violation fines fines and a ban on radar detectors to boot.

Well, if radar detectors were legal, how else would they raise revenue?

Step 1: Ban radar detectors
Step 2: Levy outrageous fines on speeders
Step 3: Profit!
 
2007-08-23 05:09:05 PM  
I'm thinking Thomas Jefferson is spinning in his grave today.
 
2007-08-23 05:23:10 PM  
dhudd: I'm thinking Thomas Jefferson is spinning in his grave today.

Better be careful. Were he to spin too fast, he might just get a ticket. . .


/too late to hang 'em all
//too early for the revolution
 
2007-08-23 07:05:58 PM  
Taxcheat: What a load of crap. This is not a "my bad", it's an EXPANSION of the fees to collect more money. How gullible can you be?



Exactly. They are not "pulling it" because of this whole "cruel and unusual", and "excessive fines" thingie, but they are actually expanding it to apply to out of staters, too.
 
2007-08-23 07:07:24 PM  
dhudd: And nemoidiot - the law was introduced by a repbulitard, who is a lawyer, whose lawfirm specializes in traffic adjudications.

Yeah, big surprise there.
 
2007-08-23 07:10:07 PM  
um, dumbarse, the Democrat governor is the one who put in the Unconstitutional part to the bill.
 
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