Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Wired)   Proponents claim that Linux is now ready for the desktop. In other news, Linux recently lost a popular pro-desktop kernel developer regarding Linux's pro-server, anti-desktop development stance   (wired.com) divider line 34
    More: Unlikely  
•       •       •

944 clicks; posted to Geek » on 26 Jul 2007 at 6:22 PM (8 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



34 Comments   (+0 »)
   

Archived thread
 
2007-07-26 05:15:15 PM  
People can't even grasp Dos and Macs have cornered the retard sector. How the fark are they going to use Linux? Forget about it nerds.
 
2007-07-26 05:41:04 PM  
I'm not a major geek and I have Ubuntu as my desktop.

Installation is pretty much as automated as a Windows installation.

There are a few things I can't yet figure out on it, but they're relatively minor things and I imagine I'll learn them eventually.
 
2007-07-26 06:20:50 PM  
I put Ubuntu on my old laptop a few weeks ago. It runs better than Windows on the same machine. The only thing I can't get to work is the sound, and I'm making progress on that. It's not ready for the mainstream idiot computer user yet. But it is far more useable than it used to be back in the day.
 
2007-07-26 06:24:41 PM  
Fark is not slashdot.

Repeat.
 
2007-07-26 06:42:36 PM  
Most users can get it running without ever having to type text commands into a shell terminal, a rarity among Linux distributions

I put Mandrake, I think, on my computer back in 2001 or 2002, and never had to type any text into a shell terminal.
 
2007-07-26 06:51:40 PM  
picturescrazy: Most users can get it running without ever having to type text commands into a shell terminal, a rarity among Linux distributions

I put Mandrake, I think, on my computer back in 2001 or 2002, and never had to type any text into a shell terminal.


SUSE is the same way. You can upgrade and install things without the command line.
 
2007-07-26 06:52:46 PM  
Actually, since I'm not very knowledgeable about Linux, can anyone recommend a good distro for an old K6-2 450 machine with maybe 128MB of RAM? I want to get it up and running for my girlfriend and put gnucash on it for her, but I've long since lost my windows product key and installation CD. I see Ubuntu requires 256MB of RAM as a minimum and I don't really feel like putting any money into that machine.
 
2007-07-26 06:54:47 PM  
Work at a computer related telephone help desk for about a month and then try to tell me linux is ready for the desktop.

It has nothing to do with linux really. All it has to do with is windows and mac. You see, these people are only smart enough to half-function with a single OS. Notice that they only half function with that.
They wouldn't be able to use windows either except someone forced it on them and held their hand every single click for a week until they got to the point where they could remember how to go to AOL and check their email.
Yeah, they're really that stupid.

I have people who I walk though a standard ping test and ipconfig several times a week. Every week.
Windows = yes? ok then...
Ping: Click start, click run, type "cmd" press enter, type "ipconfig" press enter, type "ping" followed by a space and whatever ipconfig listed as your default gateway, press enter, type "ping 66.94.234.13" press enter, type "ping yahoo.com" press enter. Did all of those return 4 replies no lost? If not, which one or ones timed out?

Three times a week for one lady... I swear.
I still have to spell "cmd" for her. "C M D. That's Charlie Michael Delta." "And then?" "See the black command window?" "no" "Press enter" "Ok now I see it" *throws something*

So unless you make it look exactly like XP and work exactly like XP they're not going to be able to handle it. Unless you shove it down their throats every single day and force them to learn the order they click in to get their two or three programs that they use to work.
Even Vista is farking with people because they're too stupid to figure out how to get to farking quickbooks anymore. "My quickbooks is gone!" "No it's not, see that icon at the bottom of the screen that looks like the quickbooks symbol?" "Yeah" "Click it a few times" "OMG you fixed it!" *Throws something again*
 
2007-07-26 06:56:46 PM  
picturescrazy

Do a search for Damn Small Linux.
It's tiny, light, has a window manager and will run gnucash just fine.
 
2007-07-26 07:06:29 PM  
Oh yeah and: What's so hard about making a windows wrapper for a virtual machine that runs ubuntu?
 
2007-07-26 07:12:43 PM  
Ya, the considering the Linux desktop is years ahead of the Windows desktop...it couldn't be because people have put a ton of work into it...

/ Compiz and Beryl are cooler than Aero
// Why doesn't MS have more than one desktop?
/// Changing window managers ftw
 
2007-07-26 07:14:28 PM  
Aevum: So unless you make it look exactly like XP and work exactly like XP they're not going to be able to handle it.

Done and done
 
wee
2007-07-26 07:32:11 PM  
I've been using linux as a desktop OS for nearly ten years now. And most of the folks at work use it as a desktop OS. In fact, seeing a windows GUI is pretty rare.

I'd say it's been ready.
 
2007-07-26 07:39:05 PM  
This seems old news. Ubuntu is great - I use it quite nearly hassle-free - but it isn't the only desktop game in town. It seems to me the failure of Linux's to penetrate the desktop space more than it has is an artifact of the open-source model: it doesn't have a call center.

Yeah, Ubuntu is free and easier to install (and use securely) than Windows, is no less easy to use than Mac (and doesn't lock you into a proprietary hardware/software prison), but doesn't have a slick advertising campaign or call center hand-holding number.

The home user/computer retard market may shift somewhat to Mac, but the business world is not likely to find much motivation to switch to Linux on the desktop, no matter how easy to use it becomes. Even though there's no licensing fee, the cost of training employees on a new system (regardless of how easy it is to use) would likely not be worth it.

So, while Linux may make some desktop inroads, it's likely to always be a marginal player. At least for the next several years.

I have spoken.
 
2007-07-26 07:55:47 PM  
Aevum

I have people who I walk though a standard ping test and ipconfig several times a week. Every week.
Windows = yes? ok then...
Ping: Click start, click run, type "cmd" press enter, type "ipconfig" press enter, type "ping" followed by a space and whatever ipconfig listed as your default gateway, press enter, type "ping 66.94.234.13" press enter, type "ping yahoo.com" press enter. Did all of those return 4 replies no lost? If not, which one or ones timed out?

Three times a week for one lady... I swear.
I still have to spell "cmd" for her. "C M D. That's Charlie Michael Delta." "And then?" "See the black command window?" "no" "Press enter" "Ok now I see it" *throws something*


Just farking use tracert yahoo.com .

I don't even know what you hope to accomplish by getting computer illiterate people to do this.

/*throws something*
 
2007-07-26 07:56:44 PM  
Thanks Aevum, that should be perfect for what I'm looking for.
 
2007-07-26 09:24:49 PM  
Microsoft and Apple have only made about eleventy-hundred-zillion dollars between the time I first heard some stoner $-head breathlessly exclaim, "LINUX IS READY TO RULE THE DESKTOP," and today's same dizzy claim.

Here's wisdom; when - and only when - every computer gizmo sold at Best Buy comes with a Linux Install CD that really works (and without typing "make [something]," or diddly-farking with "CUPS"...) then Linux will be at Step One on the road to significance on the end-user desktop.

Step ONE. Of about 1,000.
 
2007-07-26 09:55:45 PM  
Aevum: All it has to do with is windows and mac. You see, these people are only smart enough to half-function with a single OS. Notice that they only half function with that.
They wouldn't be able to use windows either except someone forced it on them and held their hand every single click for a week until they got to the point where they could remember how to go to AOL and check their email.

Aaaaaand this is where you lost me...

people are too stupid to know what OS they're running, and they're too stupid for Linux at the same time?

My best example is a lady I deal with at work. We switched her to Ubuntu, and she's the only one out of 20 in the room. She probably doesn't even realize it. She just knows how to open her web browser (Firefox) and check her email (Evolution)... and it's all she needs...

There are still a few places where Linux totally fails, but for the average "idiot" desktop user, it won't be an issue and they won't notice anyway.
 
2007-07-26 10:26:14 PM  
FloridaAsshat: it has is an artifact of the open-source model: it doesn't have a call center.

Sure it does. Red Hat has a great support center. You just need to pay $50 and you get a year of support as a single user.
 
2007-07-26 10:29:16 PM  
picturescrazy: Actually, since I'm not very knowledgeable about Linux, can anyone recommend a good distro for an old K6-2 450 machine with maybe 128MB of RAM? I want to get it up and running for my girlfriend and put gnucash on it for her, but I've long since lost my windows product key and installation CD. I see Ubuntu requires 256MB of RAM as a minimum and I don't really feel like putting any money into that machine

try puppy linux, or damnsmall linux. Xubuntu will run fine too, but you will need to use the alternate cd so that it doesn't need that much memory. They are good at running on the older machines. I have run puppy on a P2 366 laptop and although it wasn't lightning fast, it ran well. You don't even have to install it. you can run it from the cd and just save settings on a jump drive.

gibsonhand: Install CD that really works (and without typing "make [something]," or diddly-farking with "CUPS"...) then Linux will be at Step One on the road to significance on the end-user desktop.

Step ONE. Of about 1,000


Try the latest ubuntu install. it does all of that with ease on most machines. I have installed it on about 2 dozen different machines with only a few hickups. About the same as the windows percentages.

It isn't for everyone. There are some that NEED to pay for an os to consider it worthy. This isn't for them. Every version gets better. I can't say that for windows.

rppp01a: SUSE is the same way. You can upgrade and install things without the command line

yeah, Suse is nice, but it took too long to install. It does have some nice features, but I really like the whole ubuntu idea better. Suse was the first one I got to fully work with my turd of an amd card. Since then, every distro has improved a bunch.
 
2007-07-26 11:04:11 PM  
FloridaAsshat: Even though there's no licensing fee, the cost of training employees on a new system (regardless of how easy it is to use) would likely not be worth it.

I think that's a very small part of it. There are a lot of business applications built on stuff like .NET, C#, or - and please feel free to laugh because this is painfully true where I work - Visual Basic. Even if you, as a business, are smart enough to own the source code to that it's still a major pain in the neck to port.

Then there's stuff you're locked into. We use a product by a company that is a business partner with Microsoft. You can see this with the fun little "red herring" error messages it gives (e.g. "Out of memory. Please install more RAM" = you forgot to give the user power user privileges) reminiscent of the joys of WinME. Ugh, and EVERYTHING has to be done by a GUI, making automation of routine operations very difficult..*throws something*

Er, anyways, I once brought this subject up with one of my former managers after a few beers. His reply? Microsoft ubiquity. The MIS department likes the fact that in a pinch they can pick up half a dozen consultants for real cheap at the drop of a hat whereas *nix consultants are much rarer (i.e. not cheap and harder to find)
 
2007-07-26 11:36:16 PM  
Though nobody will likely read this, this is a very interesting case. This man is no master of knowledge regarding Linux; instead, he's simply an individual who noticed things he didn't like about how computers worked and moved to fix them. In doing so, he gathered great respect from the community at large, but little from the population of developers who hold more sway. His arguments bear true against every operating system in use today, and the only difference between Linux and the other two big guys was that he could actually Fix Things on Linux.
 
2007-07-27 12:27:51 AM  
I really think "ready for the desktop" has to be qualifed. I think moderately-skilled users would have no problem getting something like Ubuntu set up, and that even a very novice user would have no problem using it for a few basic functions.

That said, I don't think I could recommend it to your run-of-the-mill user; the type who doesn't understand the differences between things like the "operating system," the "internet," and "RAM." I've been using Ubuntu for about four months on my Dell laptop and though I think it's far superior in most ways to Windows, it's not the kind of thing I'd recommend my mother try and install herself.

I had to spend more than a week trying to get my wireless card working, had to edit a config file to get a widescreen resolution to work, and most recently had a bizarre GRUB error which prevent me from booting my system. (I fixed it with a Super-GRUB CD, but I'm still not really sure what the problem was. As soon as I booted it, it continued to boot like normal. I have a feeling it had something to do with a conflict with Dell's MediaDirect button, but who knows). Now, though I'm not a pro by any means, I'm competent enough to do a bit of searching and find work-arounds to these problems. I doubt my mother would even know to look for an answer if the "screen resolution" window didn't show her the resolution that she wanted. Imagine trying to walk her through a complicated ndswrapper setup.

Windows, of course, isn't 100% user friendly either. But it's still a few generations ahead of Linux. I'd imagine the real emerging marking right now is business and governments/institutions that have basic computer need and want to cut costs, or specialize their environments. I've no doubt, however, that this growth will translate into more work being done on demystifying it for the "home" (read: idiot) user.
 
2007-07-27 03:54:43 AM  
I remember hearing this about 10 years ago. Seriously.
 
2007-07-27 07:16:40 AM  
immrlizard: gibsonhand: Install CD that really works (and without typing "make [something]," or diddly-farking with "CUPS"...) then Linux will be at Step One on the road to significance on the end-user desktop.

Step ONE. Of about 1,000

Try the latest ubuntu install. it does all of that with ease on most machines. I have installed it on about 2 dozen different machines with only a few hickups. About the same as the windows percentages.


Try reading the post again. I'm not talking about a Linux install CD, I'm pointing out that Linux is going nowhere until every glittering consumer device they sell at Circuit City comes with a CD to install that device in Linux.
 
2007-07-27 10:21:59 AM  
gibsonhand: immrlizard: gibsonhand: Install CD that really works (and without typing "make [something]," or diddly-farking with "CUPS"...) then Linux will be at Step One on the road to significance on the end-user desktop.

Step ONE. Of about 1,000

Try the latest ubuntu install. it does all of that with ease on most machines. I have installed it on about 2 dozen different machines with only a few hickups. About the same as the windows percentages.

Try reading the post again. I'm not talking about a Linux install CD, I'm pointing out that Linux is going nowhere until every glittering consumer device they sell at Circuit City comes with a CD to install that device in Linux.


Please, Mr. Great Businessman -- just how the hell is that going to happen if these companies are under direct threat from Microsoft not to support Linux or else they risk massive lawsuits?

It seems to me that the problem hasn't anything to do with Linux here.
 
2007-07-27 11:22:59 AM  
 
zez
2007-07-27 11:26:00 AM  
picturescrazy: Actually, since I'm not very knowledgeable about Linux, can anyone recommend a good distro for an old K6-2 450 machine with maybe 128MB of RAM? I want to get it up and running for my girlfriend and put gnucash on it for her, but I've long since lost my windows product key and installation CD. I see Ubuntu requires 256MB of RAM as a minimum and I don't really feel like putting any money into that machine.

Try the alternate ubuntu install cd and then install fluxbox (new window) as the window manager. It will seem weird at first, but its a great lightweight desktop.

/Installed it the other day on a AMD K-6 300 w/64MB ram.
//a bit slow, but useable
 
zez
2007-07-27 11:35:12 AM  
A friend just showed me a new compizfusion (new window) video.

Pretty cool!
 
2007-07-27 12:41:05 PM  
I've been using Ubuntu for almost a year now; wish I had tried it sooner but I got burned after attempts with Mandrake and Red Hat over the past decade. Ubuntu is excellent for me.

I think that with Dell now selling laptops and desktops with Ubuntu preinstalled, the visibility of easy to use Linux may increase; though I don't know what sort of marketing has been done to raise awareness of this to folks who don't already use Linux.
 
2007-07-27 12:41:10 PM  
no habla Vista
 
2007-07-27 03:44:25 PM  
Another Ubuntu user here. Had a wee bit of trouble installing Nvidia driver at first (some idiot made a typo in the install script or something, caused X to crash upon boot), had to fix it via command line. A graphical "safe mode" would be a nice addition. But I managed it with a little research (glad I kept the XP install on a seperate drive!)

I booted into Ubuntu on occasion, but used XP for most of my stuff because I'd gotten all my programs JUST the way I wanted them and didn't know enough to put down similar roots in Ubuntu. That and I was a wee bit afraid that I'd try something that XP handles painlessly, only to have some obscure glitch render the OS unbootable. AGAIN.

Then the other day, XP decided that it was gonna start farking with Port 80. Web pages wouldn't load. I could use IM programs, Bittorrent (which is how I got Ubuntu in the first place... ZOMG A LEGAL USE FOR BITTORRENT EVERYBODY PANIC!) and other stuff that used different ports. Port 80 was shot. There was no indication of ANYTHING that wasn't supposed to be there, and all troubleshooting steps came up empty as to the cause. After hours of this, I'd had enough. So I booted into Ubuntu and forced myself to learn how to make this OS my biatch. Doing well so far. Got a great deal of stuff up and running, got most of my favorite Firefox extensions, and things are starting to settle into the comfort zone of "Yeah, I know what I'm doing now." I've only rebooted into Windows to grab stuff from inside programs to bring over to Ubuntu. Damn, I'm glad I never formatted for NTFS (used to run Win98 on this drive for older games, wanted access to my stuff if XP shiat itself).

I still intend to keep XP around for running those games I can't get running in Ubuntu. But that's likely to be my only use for it. I like NOT having to pay $80 (minimum) every couple of years just to run the latest version of a word processor (another $80). I like how the open-source nature of the Linux community makes viruses extremely unlikely (if someone finds a security flaw in Linux, they're more likely to patch it themselves rather than exploit it), and Ubuntu's community in particular is very Linux Newbie-friendly. I imagine I'll be having WAY too much with the sheer power of the theme customization (I'm thinking steampunk). I just need to re-arrange my data in a way that makes sense for Linux use, rather than Windows. My computer has become new and interesting once again, and it's fun to discover all the OS tricks... all over again.

My name is Saborlas, and I'm a Linux User.

/and not a douchenozzle about it, either
 
2007-07-27 04:07:55 PM  
It's close, very close. I've been using Linux on the desktop since 1999 (RedHat, SuSE, Mandrake and now Kubuntu) and it's made incredibly advances in that time.

I recently tried out Kubuntu 7.04 and was rather disappointed because two peripherals no longer worked: my webcam (no big deal really) and my scanner (a very big deal). I did some Googling and found that the scanner problem affects a number of different brands of scanners (I have a Canon LiDE 30) as well as cameras. The root of the problem is that a change was made in libusb so that laptops could hibernate correctly. The developer who tried to defend his position that hibernation was more important than not breaking support of "some scanners" got flamed quite thoroughly.

The wonderful thing about Linux though is that this problem (and others) is being addressed right now and may even be fixed already. If this was a Microsoft OS it would never be fixed, instead I would be told to discard a perfectly working piece of hardware and go purchase a newer, more expensive, replacement.
 
2007-07-29 01:01:50 AM  
SUSE 10.1 is the only linux distro that i could successfully get my tv out working with my nvidia drivers installed.
and no matter what distro i used i always had to manually edit a file or drop the runlevel down to 3 (black screen , no x server running).
Ubuntu makes it really hard to install nvidia drivers because even in runlevel 3 the x server is still running, therefore i think Linux is years away from the average joe using it for desktop use.
 
Displayed 34 of 34 comments



This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
Advertisement
On Twitter






In Other Media


  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.

Report