I do miss the days of my 2 mile each way walk to work though, nothing like commuting and exercising at the same time. Traded that in for an area where we got a 5 bedroom house for under 300K rather than a 1 bedroom condo for over 500K. But housing prices are a whole 'nother thread.

When gas hits $3.50 a gallon, I'm just going to run my car on printer toner!

Pfffft... Not a chance. When I use to work at a gas station people would always complain about cigarette prices and claim "When they get up to $3 I'm gonna quit.", then "When they get up to $4 I'm going to quit.", etc. Same thing with gas. Sports car sales are up even with the rising gas prices. SUV sales are up. People aren't cutting back anytime soon.

jpbreon: The name calling was completely uncalled for, but I'll ignore it for the sake of conversation.

I don't know what the fuel prices in Europe are, so I assumed he was trying to ask what Europens would do if thier gas actually got more expensive.

my apologies, but you have to understand that we get similar news stories when petrol rises here and the papers love to throw in the US costs against the European countries - there is always a massive dip where the US price is and it angers people because you get a much better deal and then you whinge when you come close to paying half of what we pay

in answer to your question if it did get more expensive - it rises constantly, in Britain the government gets wary when it pushes over the £1 mark on average and we all start whinging and protesting, blockading etc - if it did rise significantly there is little few of us could do, train prices in Britain are extortionate, European trains are considerably fairer priced so they may result in more train use but for that you would need better public transport across europe - a lot of people live in rural and smaller urban areas and have little choice but to drive, there is no public transport where i live and no(or very expensive) parking at the train station, so unless you live in larger cities like London, Birmingham, Paris, Berlin etc there is little option so we'd have to lump it

*shrugs*

Maybe I'm one of those fringe cases, but I did stop driving (pretty much all together). I've got a bus pass, which works just fine for my commuting purposes.

/ Move to area in April
// Filled gas tank 3 times since then
/// suck that big oil
//// slashies!

See, I think what it all comes down to is how much you pay for gas PER MONTH.

I've trimmed my driving down to the bare minimum (driving to/from work, to/from the store (I'm not riding a bike with 10 heavy ass grocery bags), and occassional fun outings.

End result is, my monthly gas bill is actually lower than it was back when gas was $2.00 a gallon. Because when gas was $2.00 a gallon, it was always roadtrip time. I drove to my favorite resturants on a whim. Cruised up the pacific coast HWY just for the sake of cruising, etc etc.

And, as far as monthly costs go, gas for my car is one of the cheapest things ever. I pay about $120 a month for gas (fillup every 10 days, $40 a pop).

Compare that to the $300 a month that I spend on food.

Compare that to the ~900 that gets taken out of each paycheck for taxes.

Compare that to my $260 a month condo association fee.

And you will see why the price of gas, for the moment, is the least of my worries. (if I were driving a huge gas guzzler, or lived 50 miles away in temecula like some folks, then I'd worry a bit more)

/and, if the price continues to rise, then I'll either have a really good justification to my employer to let me work from home more often. Or I'll have a really good justification to ask for a salary increase.

h to the 'ojo: tarquinrainbowtrout: FarkinNortherner: To be fair, you've highlighted the two countries with the worst transport infrastructure and, in the case of London, an exceptional circumstance (post 7/7 ?). A daily commute into Copenhagen, for example, would be painless by public transport. (my bold)

You've clearly never been to Botswana, or Spain, or even Australia - the London underground is one of the best public transport systems in the world, it's old and overused unfortunately but it's by far the easiest way to travel in London - Germany and Hong Kong have lovely new transport systems which are awesome in fairness

He/She was talking about in Europe

This - and England in general, rather than London in particular, hence my commenting on the exceptional nature of the circumstances.

Hell, I have to drive to work...BART takes forever to go from Walnut Creek to Dublin because there are no BART tracks down 680. Sure, it's only 15 miles, but I'd LOVE to take public transportation.

On that note, I travel a lot for work, so it kind of balances out because I do fly pretty often and make sure I get a hotel close to where ever I'm going to be working.

Or, to put things into perspective.

The gas I use to go to work and get home in a day costs me $3.60.

I figure, people spend that much on coffee in the morning.

I, on the other hand, don't drink coffee.

/I also don't really drink a lot of liquor

/ but $300 a month is a lot of food for one person.

Started biking to work in April, 4.5 miles one way. Now I just use the Jeep on the weekends.

/should have done it along time ago
// in florida, humidity be damned

h to the 'ojo:
Well what are you doing about it?

Well speaking for my own self/job.

a) Move closer to the new job

At just a few years into buying a house, I seriously doubt it.

b) Organize other employees to persuade that the higher cost of living must be compensated for

Because organizing employees to demand higher pay AFTER the company makes a cost cutting move is oh so going to work.

c) Organize local residents and work with the city/state to establish a viable alternative

HAHAHA! That's rich. Our transit system IN the city is a disaster, and anythign going to the burbs gets stopped as soon as its started by suburbanite who are scared of city people coming into their neighborhoods.

d) Move to a country where all the major cities where you would work have a good public transit system

Cause changing countries is as easy as changing underware.

e) Bike to work and deal with bringing a change of clothes and showering at work

First, shower where? The bathroom sick? Second, work tends to send me to other places, lugging heavy things.

d) Whine and biatch

Or tell those idiot "don't own a car" people to fark off. I personally require the freedom to go where ever, when ever I want, and maybe take a friend along, or my dog, or be able to haul cargo. The world you live in must be aweful nice where all you need to do is go back and forth to work.

You have your choices so just embrace the one you have made.

I have, yet somehow despite the fact that I can gut any argument thrown at me there are still people who insist that I don't need a car. (Or truck in this case)

vernonFL: Yeah also I am kinda scared to ride my bike in traffic. I have a helmet and all but still it would be bad if I got hit or fell or something.

/Yeah car accidents/breakdowns are bad too.

Awww... poor baby is scarewed

As a cyclist I'd say if he wasn't he hasn't been cycling in a city. I'll vote for anyone that makes it legal for cyclists to carry guns and use them against the homocidally inconsiderate. My road too cager.

Shrapnel: Heh... I just happened to take my new bike on its first spin today. I still live in the 'hood, though, so at night it'll be the car. Oh, well.

What the flying fark will a thug want with a guy that bikes through the 'hood at night? If they're just waiting to rob someone it is easier and more lucrative to carjack someone.

Jebus have you ever even been NEAR a city??? One of the easiest things to steal and turn into cash is a bike you moran. Step 1: knock guy off bike, Step 2: Ride bike to pawn shop, Step 3: Profit.

FarkinNortherner

Fair enough, but i'd still disagree with saying that Ireland and Britain have the worst transport infrastructures in Europe - from personal experience i know that France, Spain, Portugal, Greece, Netherlands, Belgium all have bad transport infrastructure and i would presume much of eastern Europe is hardly better, and most good public transport links are in major cities, rather than the whole of the country

I probably wouldn't change my driving habits. I barely drive as is, to work and back. The grocery store is on the way, I shop for 90% of everything else online.

I'd actually wanted to move close enough to walk to work, but the apartments that close cost twice as much as mine. :(

*shrug*

It's already that price out here on the West Coast.

Je5tEr:

The problem isn't high gas prices or a lack of infra-structure. The problem is you and everyone like you

Sucks it does. I cut back driving during that last bullcrap surge in 05, and on again/off again have since depending where the price sat. I'm in KY so the prices aren't too horrid, got crap recently around $3.20, couple weeks ago saw 2.89. Sometime in this year I thin kit was down around $2.50 or less too. When it hits at that $3 level I just go to/from work, to get food, other necessity driving as it's needed...stay home otherwise or let someone else waste their cash on gas.

As it stands now though I feel I'm part of that articles trapped 19%. I live 12.5mi from work, and unless I start wanting to get up at 5am and buy a bike, I can't see saving much more as is. I've tested my VW out, seems to sip the least doing 70-75mph on a freeway, and just doing a moderate start from a stop elsewhere (not sluggish starts or fast ones.) I've coaxed what I can out of it, and due to climate here, biking isn't too good either as I can't go into work soaked 1-2x a week either in the office. I also can't move any closer either as that just isn't an option.

Just plain sucks.

Well, gas is $3.15 the last time I looked at the local pump. Biking to work (which is ~3-4 blocks away), and maybe filling the gas tank on my '91 Buick Riviera (32MPG) once every five weeks.

To be honest, for me personally, gas prices only are a concern when planning a trip to see family or when buying goods (food, alcohol, general house goods).

I personally never understood driving +2 hours one...or EACH way to work. I have no sympathy for someone living in a very large city or needs to commute more than 30 minutes to work. You can find someplace closer to live or to work (and it's asshats like you that probably would rather start WWIII before changing your living habits). Especially if you are driving an SUV or Truck.

tarquinrainbowtrout:
my apologies, but you have to understand that we get similar news stories when petrol rises here and the papers love to throw in the US costs against the European countries - there is always a massive dip where the US price is and it angers people because you get a much better deal and then you whinge when you come close to paying half of what we pay

in answer to your question if it did get more expensive - it rises constantly, in Britain the government gets wary when it pushes over the £1 mark on average and we all start whinging and protesting, blockading etc - if it did rise significantly there is little few of us could do, train prices in Britain are extortionate, European trains are considerably fairer priced so they may result in more train use but for that you would need better public transport across europe - a lot of people live in rural and smaller urban areas and have little choice but to drive, there is no public transport where i live and no(or very expensive) parking at the train station, so unless you live in larger cities like London, Birmingham, Paris, Berlin etc there is little option so we'd have to lump it

I admittedly don't know too much about European transportation other than people raving about Europe's train system. I'm at a loss to understand why the US, which attributes a lot of its prosperity to rail, doesn't invest more in trains and thier ability to transverse the country.

Bschott007: I have no sympathy for someone living in a very large city or needs to commute more than 30 minutes to work. You can find someplace closer to live or to work (and it's asshats like you that probably would rather start WWIII before changing your living habits).

An attitude that's really no longer just a luxury. The long-distance commuters are enough of a problem here in the Seattle Metro that there is actually talk on the table of charging a fee for highway use during rush hour.

Which sucks, really, because we already paid for those roads, why should we have to pay again? Especially those of us who DO bike to work and use our vehicles sparingly.

Yeah, i'm in LA too, and if prices went DOWN to 3.50, i'd probably take a road trip to Maine or some shiat.

soze: CruJones

I've done that walk. Carry your jacket, wear gym shoes. Everyone brings a case or bag or a manpurse to work anyway, put your dress shoes in there. You stop in the bathroom on the way in, freshen up, then head up to the office. I've also done it in -10°F and covered for people whose cars wouldn't start.

If my weird froofroo Root Boost will hold, so will your Vitalis. :)

My commute to work/classes has always been at least 8 or 10 miles one way out here in California and I couldn't tell you the last time I drove to work or classes. At work, it didn't matter much if I was a little ripe because I'm a pastry/rounds chef and even if it did matter, there's always the gym in the building---complete with showers. So I tend to carry a towel and a change of clothes or keep a set in my locker.

To the best of my knowledge, except for the prep guy(s) and the dishwasher(s) , not a single other person rides a bike to work. There may or may not be people in the office tower who ride to work--I don't know, but I doubt it because I'm guessing that for many of them, the price of gas would have to go up another 25-40% because they can easily afford to pay more for gas.

I ride nearly every day of the year and have ridden regularly in the snow (Burlington, Vermont) and in some rather hot weather out here in California where it does, at least occasionally, get up to 115-120F outside (and humid too). I don't see many people commuting on bikes and I still see the same traffic jams every morning---as I blow right on by the stopped traffic on my bike.

I'd like to see more people riding, but the end result of a bunch of n00bs on bikes would likely not be worth the effort....and many would end up giving up. A lot of people don't know how to ride properly and I don't like the thought of a bunch of n00bs riding around making the rest of us (however few we are) look like a bunch of jerkoffs.

The best things about riding to work regularly? Being in great shape and not spending so much damned money on stuff....though I did buy a set of wheels built up on a set of Phil Wood hubs (new window)

soze: Wuss

What she said.

Forty percent of Americans say they would curb their driving habits if gas prices hit $3.50 a gallon

You mean, again? if it hits $3.50 again.

Didn't change my habits last time. It should though.

h to the 'ojo: Je5tEr:

The problem isn't high gas prices or a lack of infra-structure. The problem is you and everyone like you

You are such a tool. Given your stance on things I can make the following assumptions:

All your family/friends/whoever you would like to see live within reasonable walking/cycling distance (mine are everywhere, at least one lives off a dirt road on a mountain)

You live in a safe neighborhood (dont be out alone after dark or you will be lucky if you only get mugged, yet somehow violent crime is down, go figure)

The weather there is pleasant year-round (105 to -5 here, hurricanes to blizzards)

You are completely dependant on societal structures like grocery stores and would never dream of hunting for food, fur, leather etc (Amazing what you can save on food and clothing, as well as selling leather stuff to folks)

Your lack of bad winters makes it unnecessary for you to ferry hospital workers to and from their jobs in snowstorms (ER's are glad I'm here)

You are not in the National Guard etc (They sortof like it when you can report for duty in a real short time)

You are not a volunteer firefighter (Kid brother is in a suburb)

You have a job that never changes the location where work is performed (Clients tend to be where ever you can get them)

You have no need to carry equipment for your job (Servers are heavy)

You have zero desire to see any place that isn't already paved over with "civilization" and I doubt you've ever been 10 miles from a bus stop (I like to explore, try getting lost once, or just saying 'drive thataway', and it makes doing volunteer work for DNR easier)

Your days are full of extra time that you can gladly give up to commute by public transport (5 minutes in a vehicle here equals 1 hour on a bus, honestly how can people put up with that?)


So all things considered? DIAF. Or if a volunteer fireman or EMS worker shows up to save your ignorant ass, explain to him/her why they don't need a vehicle.

Newsflash; Americans are full of shiat

I've learned most people are liars. They'll NOT curb driving when it hits $5/gallon.

Pumpsnatch: They'll NOT curb driving when it hits $5/gallon.

Ultimately? It's not up to the drivers, anyway.

It's up to EVERYONE to demand less cars, more public transportation, credits for biking to work, additional fees and taxes for businesses who refuse to reduce consumption...

Yadda yadda yadda.

h to the 'ojo: tarquinrainbowtrout: FarkinNortherner: To be fair, you've highlighted the two countries with the worst transport infrastructure and, in the case of London, an exceptional circumstance (post 7/7 ?). A daily commute into Copenhagen, for example, would be painless by public transport.

You've clearly never been to Botswana, or Spain, or even Australia - the London underground is one of the best public transport systems in the world, it's old and overused unfortunately but it's by far the easiest way to travel in London - Germany and Hong Kong have lovely new transport systems which are awesome in fairness

He/She was talking about in Europe

disregarding Australia, Botswana and HK, aren't Germany and Spain European?

I'm a field technician fixing copiers for a living. I like what I do and I do my damnedest to work my calls out so I have the least amount of miles per day as possible, and I still drive 50-70 miles per day. I have no choice but to fill up every other day for $45. Lets say my average is 60 mpd, so I drive 300 miles per week. I can only count 40 mpd because I can only count my miles from the shop to my account in the morning, and my last account to the shop in the evening. I get 33.5 cents per mile, which means I get reimbursed $67 for the week. It's time to find a new job, I think, or they better increase my reimbursement.

h to the 'ojo:
a) Move closer to the new job

You aren't married or live with a SO? I have to live in the middle, so that my wife has a decent commute and I have a decent commute. We both are forced to commute about 15 miles because of the layout of the Bay Area (she goes to Oakland, I go to Dublin).

b) Organize other employees to persuade that the higher cost of living must be compensated for

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA....oh, you're serious...Dude, tell me how your job hunt works out for you.

c) Organize local residents and work with the city/state to establish a viable alternative

Uh, have you seen the mess of public transportation in most cities? I'm looking at you Muni.

d) Move to a country where all the major cities where you would work have a good public transit system

Ya, cause getting a work visa and moving to another country is NO PROBLEM...good call.

e) Bike to work and deal with bringing a change of clothes and showering at work

Uh, I don't know where you work, but we don't have a shower at our office, nor have I EVER seen a shower at any office of any place I've been too...

d) Whine and biatch

Ya, that always works out well.

You have your choices so just embrace the one you have made.

Please tell me how

vernonFL: Yeah also I am kinda scared to ride my bike in traffic. I have a helmet and all but still it would be bad if I got hit or fell or something.

/Yeah car accidents/breakdowns are bad too.

Awww... poor baby is scarewed

Do you not live in a city? I worked with a lady that was hit by a car. The lady was hurt VERY badly and actually had to quit her job because she was in so much pain. She was wearing a helmet, but still had a broken jaw, broken arm, broken leg and broken foot. She also had several of her fingers broken. The worst part was she suffered from a serious concussion and kept getting very bad headaches...the kind that make you get physically ill.

So yes, it is scary as hell to ride your bike in the city.

They're lying.

Nobody I know who flipped out when gas hit $2 drives any less now than they did then.

Personally, I believe that our national debt is still more of a concern than gas prices. Hell, it's been piling up at the rate of $1.5 billion a day which is ~$15,400 per farking second. Straight out it's at $9 trillion dollars but include things like the long term un-funded obligations such as entitlements, bonds, bills, and military pensions our debt in America is closer to $12 trillion dollars.

I'm just waiting for some pissed off Global Bank to say "A full scale default on U.S. Treasuries appears imminent". Watch the Dollar end up valued as much as the Peso the very next day. I'm more worried about that than paying a little extra at the pump.

Beavosaurus Rex:

I'd like to see more people riding, but the end result of a bunch of n00bs on bikes would likely not be worth the effort....and many would end up giving up. A lot of people don't know how to ride properly and I don't like the thought of a bunch of n00bs riding around making the rest of us (however few we are) look like a bunch of jerkoffs.

Everyone has to start somewhere. More people on bikes ultimately makes us all safer. We'd be better off holding "how to bike commute" seminars rather than making fun of Walmart bikes.

The best things about riding to work regularly? Being in great shape and not spending so much damned money on stuff....though I did buy a set of wheels built up on a set of Phil Wood hubs (new window)

I like not having to worry about what I'm eating or how much beer I'm drinking, it comes right back off on the way to buy more beer. :)

Phil Woods are niiiiice. I'm rolling around on IRO/Formula hubs right now because I don't want to feel bad when I destroy them. They still spin cleanly after a year and a quarter here in Albany (I own studded snow tires for a reason!), so I'm pretty happy with my investment. Also, if one of my wheels get yanked, I'm out maybe $150-250. I refuse to take apart my bike to park it, though I suppose it helps that I run track bolts rather than quick releases.

Also, let's continue to laugh at people who think it's only okay to bicycle in sunny 72°F weather.

I have a 52 mile round trip in Michigan to get to work. If I could get away with a small sedan/hybred, I would certainly do *that*. But because I need the capability of going into 4wd low at times times to get up to my house, I actually need the vehicle option to be able to get there.

I dislike seeing others in a Jimmy, Tahoe, Suburban, Navigator, etc, that is on a daily basis squeaky clean (makes me think they have zero need for the capability).

But the point I am making is that there are some of us that actually need the capability.

Don't hate all of us, just those that don't have a good reason.

Completely off topic but I just walked down to the corner store and there was a woman with a trike baby stroller with carbon fiber wheel.

Seriously what the hell?

If you want to live in a certain spot that happens to be far from your place of employment, grocery stores, etc., you have to accept the fact that it's going to cost you money in transportation expenses.

If the money is a problem, STFU and move into the city.

This is what 50 years of white flight from cities has produced. I don't know why anyone's surprised.

I've curbed my driving. Of course, I've also left a job that was dead in the center of an urban hell and got one that's much closer. Even working part-time as opposed to full-time, I'm coming out like a farking bandit.

soze: Also, let's continue to laugh at people who think it's only okay to bicycle in sunny 72°F weather

Ya, because it's great to ride in 100 degree heat, get sun stroke, dehydrate and die or to ride when the wind is blowing at over 40mph (move the soutwest and you'll experience that) or when it's not only snowing, but the roads have iced over so a 2000 pound car can slide into you and kill you....real blast...

i'm selling my car anyways, but i plan on buying a diesel

that way i don't have to curb my driving habits

Gortex: If you want to live in a certain spot that happens to be far from your place of employment, grocery stores, etc., you have to accept the fact that it's going to cost you money in transportation expenses.

In a lot of parts of the country, there isn't much of a choice...either there is limited housing in the city or the city is so spread out, it doesn't matter where you live. Go to Albuquerque some time and tell me you can live within walking distance to a grocery, your work, etc...you can't...it's hard to find a place to live within biking distance of it all.

If the money is a problem, STFU and move into the city.

That would make the problem worse in many cases....It's EXPENSIVE to live in San Fransisco...I can't afford a 500 square foot apartment, but according to you it's cheaper.

This is what 50 years of white flight from cities has produced. I don't know why anyone's surprised.

Ya, that's the entire problem...everybody should just move back into the cities and all the problems of the world will be solved...

Gortex: If you want to live in a certain spot that happens to be far from your place of employment, grocery stores, etc., you have to accept the fact that it's going to cost you money in transportation expenses.

If the money is a problem, STFU and move into the city.

This is what 50 years of white flight from cities has produced. I don't know why anyone's surprised.


This is a fine theory until you adjust for the cost of housing in a city as opposed to the burbs/country.

soze:
Also, let's continue to laugh at people who think it's only okay to bicycle in sunny 72°F weather.

I'm a cyclist from California, so I'm really getting a kick out of this reply. I'll have you know that we draw the line at 70° and anything lower than cirrus clouds.


I've changed my driving habits, but mostly because I'm sick of sitting in traffic. And of course since this is Fark, I'll go ahead and shut my whore mouth.

We Americans are all talk and no action. We like to appear like we really care about things, such as saving the environment and supporting the troops, but if it is going to inconvenience us in the slightest then forget about it.

I'm sure Bush will just cut taxes even further so we can neglect the troops even more but still have enough money left in our pockets to make oil company CEOs even richer.

boot20:

Ya, because it's great to ride in 100 degree heat, get sun stroke, dehydrate and die or to ride when the wind is blowing at over 40mph (move the soutwest and you'll experience that) or when it's not only snowing, but the roads have iced over so a 2000 pound car can slide into you and kill you....real blast...

Yeah, I really ought to just stay stupid and flabby and drive everywhere further than a half block.

Bicycling through non-ideal weather makes you stronger because you actually have to overcome with adversity. If you've pedaled through -10°F with ice and snow, there's nothing in cube culture that could possibly come close to being difficult. Man up.

ilikestuff: I have an idea.

I'm going to open a gas station and sell gas by the liter.

At current prices that'd be like 80 cents a liter.

Why has nobody done this yet? Marketing genius I say!


It was tried in the 70's, but Americans can't make the conversion and it still costs the same.

soze: Yeah, I really ought to just stay stupid and flabby and drive everywhere further than a half block

I drive to work, and I'm not stupid (well, not every stupid) nor am I flabby.

I run regularly on the three mile track right outside our apartment, and I walk pretty much everywhere else.

It's not an either/or situation. It's not a choice between bicycling everywhere and not owning a car or owning a car and not walking but ten steps throughout the course of the day.

Riding a bicycle here in Houston is a serious safety concern. The drivers here are angry, inattentive, and spiteful. It's very dangerous here for cyclists.

soze:

Yeah, I really ought to just stay stupid and flabby and drive everywhere further than a half block.

There is a big difference between biking the 15 miles to work in a drizzle and biking that same 15 miles in a bad storm....Oh, I forgot, you are an internet tough guy.

Bicycling through non-ideal weather makes you stronger because you actually have to overcome with adversity.

No it makes you dead. Cars can't see you, people suck a driving in poor weather, and to top it all off, the weather can kill you...I want to be sitting on a metal frame when there's a huge lightening storm...good call.

If you've pedaled through -10°F with ice and snow, there's nothing in cube culture that could possibly come close to being difficult. Man up.

Uh, no. I'd rather they didn't find my frozen body that's been run over by a snow plow, that's all you.

Some of you who are saying that the bus is about $2.50-$3.00 each way should really consider getting bulk fare or passes. Most bulk fare (tickets, tokens, smartcards, etc) is about $2 per trip, and in many places unlimited passes are even cheaper if you ride it at least 10 times per week (Mon-Fri to work and back).

So, you're saying, you bike every day the weather's good then?

No??

Why not?