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(Some Guy)   Grade 13 students in Ontario launch class action lawsuit over illegal fees charged for computers and libraries   (news1130.com) divider line 60
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7728 clicks; posted to Main » on 06 Jun 2007 at 11:25 PM (7 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2007-06-06 11:26:59 PM
They have a 13th now? Those silly Canadians.
 
2007-06-06 11:27:14 PM
Grade 13 still exists in Ontario?

I thought that ended with the Double Cohort(TM)?
 
2007-06-06 11:28:21 PM
No, grade 13 does not exist. It is a joke about community college. And it is funny.
 
2007-06-06 11:29:06 PM
Damn. Too slow with the 'Derrrr why do they have grade 13 up in Cannnnaddaaaaaaa' post hmm?
Oh well.

/Incidently, grade 13 is what we stupid ass Americans call someone's first year in community college
 
2007-06-06 11:29:57 PM
www.cbc.ca

Whats wrong with Thirteenth grade, eh?
 
2007-06-06 11:30:21 PM
GavinTheAlmighty: It is a joke about community college.

Oh. Well there's that then.

And it is funny.

I'll take your word for it.
Freaking Sens. I miss hockey already!
 
2007-06-06 11:30:50 PM
13th grade? Is that something like 13th step in AA?
 
2007-06-06 11:31:47 PM
www.myconfinedspace.com
 
2007-06-06 11:31:52 PM
addendum: the
 
2007-06-06 11:32:29 PM
I thought Grade 13 was like a normal phenomenon in Canada, while in the US it's just a derogatory term used towards people who go to CC.
 
2007-06-06 11:33:27 PM
As a recent community college graduate in Ontario, I can assure that our colleges are NOTHING like a grade 13, unless maybe you took the hardest courses offered in grade 12.

Also, I do not remember paying for any library or computer lab fees, it was all included with my student card. However, if I get some money out of this, I will not be complaining.

/Seneca graduate
//program sucked balls, will be lucky if I ever get any real job out of it
 
2007-06-06 11:33:29 PM
Bankrupting your already struggling community college is a great way to further your education.

It's the sort of strategy you'd expect from the average community college student.
 
2007-06-06 11:34:07 PM
Registration is in Smarch.

/lousy smarch weather
 
2007-06-06 11:35:05 PM
Is this were I tell the joke about two college administrators fighting over a penny?

/thieving bastiches
 
2007-06-06 11:37:05 PM
"What kind of message does it send to students when we are told that we will fail if we cheat on an assignment, but at the same time we catch our college administrators cheating on our fees?"

The message is life isn't fair.

You'll get over it
 
2007-06-06 11:40:06 PM
flyinmonky: do go on.
 
2007-06-06 11:41:53 PM
Grade 13 only ever existed in Ontario. The rest of us Canadians thought it was weird.
 
2007-06-06 11:43:45 PM
It makes me happy, genuinely warms my heart whenever i hear about a school, or a school administrator being sued. God bless those kids.
 
2007-06-06 11:44:29 PM
Bankrupting your already struggling community college is a great way to further your education.

It's the sort of strategy you'd expect from the average community college student.


Thank you.
 
2007-06-06 11:48:29 PM
I thought Grade 13 was like a normal phenomenon in Canada, while in the US it's just a derogatory term used towards people who go to CC.

Eh, not really. At least in Ontario, what was commonly known as "grade 13" was actually OAC. It was technically post-secondary, but in practice always taught by high schools. It was a sort of in-between grade for high schools to universities; you were considered to have graduated high school upon completing the 12th grade, but could stick around for OAC, which helped with university.
 
2007-06-06 11:48:44 PM
How do I do that snazzy italic thing? Damn. Fark!!
 
2007-06-06 11:50:08 PM
As much as I sneer at these kids for being whiney idiots, I do wish the colleges (my own included) would just raise tuition that couple hundred bucks instead of getting it through fees and ridiculously expensive parking permits/tickets. Then at least it would be eligible for financial aid. Not to mention the rage induced by the "oh, now that you're here...pay this". It's like buying a damn car.

/I guess that makes me a whiney idiot...
 
2007-06-06 11:51:18 PM
Jimbo-slam: How do I do that snazzy italic thing?

You have to go to college for that.
 
2007-06-06 11:57:12 PM
They're asshats. The lot of em'...the students, the schools...

They should simply compell the schools to cease the illegal fees and make amends by reducing tuition for those students still enrolled.

Filing a suit will endanger the community college system, create an adversarial situation and cause overwhelming alienation between students and teachers. Then, all you'll end up with is a bunch of angry, half-educated ex-students.

Oh wait....ummmm nevermind.
 
2007-06-06 11:57:54 PM
deevo
I thought Grade 13 was like a normal phenomenon in Canada, while in the US it's just a derogatory term used towards people who go to CC.

Here in SoCal we just called it: "high school with ashtrays"

Good 'ol Pierce College - or "Moo U" to the locals.
 
2007-06-06 11:58:37 PM
GavinTheAlmighty: No, grade 13 does not exist. It is a joke about community college. And it is funny.

Thank you. I was hoping someone would get it.

/ How do you get accepted into SLC?
// You found the front door
 
2007-06-07 12:00:38 AM
Dr. Mojo PhD: Eh, not really. At least in Ontario, what was commonly known as "grade 13" was actually OAC. It was technically post-secondary, but in practice always taught by high schools. It was a sort of in-between grade for high schools to universities; you were considered to have graduated high school upon completing the 12th grade, but could stick around for OAC, which helped with university.

Yep... OAC courses were always highly specialized - calculus, algebra, chemistry, law, accounting, business administration, etc. which prepared you for university. When they dropped OAC, they noticed that they had to add courses in at university to make up for the lack of the OAC year (especially in technical subjects such as math). Now, the three year degree has pretty much vanished.
 
2007-06-07 12:02:26 AM
here in raleigh, NC we have St. Mary's School. This is an all female school. And it is the last two years of high school, and the first two years of college. No joke.
 
2007-06-07 12:04:56 AM
I heard the 12th man on the football field was pissed too.
 
2007-06-07 12:14:48 AM
www.cbc.ca

Julian is actin' all smart 'cause he's already got his grade 10.
 
2007-06-07 12:17:51 AM
Jimbo-slam How do I do that snazzy italic thing?

http://www.w3schools.com/html/tryit.asp?filename=tryhtml_formattingch

\give a man a fish, teach man a fish yada yada
 
2007-06-07 12:29:34 AM
Peekoo
Grade 13 only ever existed in Ontario. The rest of us Canadians thought it was weird.

Yes, well, the rest of Canada...oh hell, let's just say I'm from Toronto, and the stereotypical opinions fit.

/Didn't go to high school in Ontario
//Quack
///Quack
 
2007-06-07 12:34:04 AM
Peekoo: Grade 13 only ever existed in Ontario. The rest of us Canadians thought it was weird.

Those of us here thought it was weird that you people went straight from elementary school onto work on fishing boats, mines, drill rigs and Zellers, too. Don't feel bad.
 
2007-06-07 12:51:12 AM
Hectropolis
"Bubs...we, ahh, need your shed for the hydroponics."

BOTTLE KIDS! DUCK!

(Absolutely LOVE Trailer Park Boys)

Pssst: All five seasons for free at www.youtvpc.com

/I loves teh tubes.
 
2007-06-07 12:57:27 AM
bsuhorndog: I do wish the colleges (my own included) would just raise tuition that couple hundred bucks instead of getting it through fees and ridiculously expensive parking permits/tickets. Then at least it would be eligible for financial aid.

You do realize that when you're in school that cost of transportation (it's no stretch to include parking permits as a transportation cost, especially when you live in a rural area and need a car to get back and forth from home and college) is considered an educational expense, which is coverable by financial aid, don't you? Of course, this doesn't mean that the school sends you the check to cover your indirect costs before you need to spend money out of your own pocket.

Educational Costs:

Direct Costs: Tuition and any fees that are on your bill (if living on-campus, this most likely includes room and board).

Indirect Costs: Books (too bad most colleges don't send your left-over financial aid until after you have to buy your books, but they are technically supposed to be allowed to be covered by financial aid), Rent and food if living off campus, and transportation.

There may be more, but that's what I could think of.

Electrify: Also, I do not remember paying for any library or computer lab fees, it was all included with my student card. However, if I get some money out of this, I will not be complaining.

If your college was like the ones in the United States (specifically the State University of New York system), they probably hid those fees in a "Comprehensive Service" Fee, and you probably didn't even use 90% of these so-called services.
 
2007-06-07 12:58:10 AM
Wow, I wish they had the same law here. My fees are the same as my tuition, and keep going up.
 
2007-06-07 01:07:32 AM
Haha. Hidden Fees. ..

I always suspected something was shifty about some of the things we had to pay for as an undergraduate -- when I started grad school and began teaching, one of the first things they mentioned was how the intro lab manuals cost 32.00 a piece to buy.. obviously, Central Printing (in-house for the university) doesn't pay nearly that much, but we never realized what kind of markup went into them. See, NY state schools are forbidden to charge 'lab fees' on top of tuition; the department receives a set amount of funding (which isn't enough, not by a long shot).

Because the university refuses to properly fund the undergrad labs, the cost of the manual is inflated and the funds used to pay for lab materials. It wouldn't be so bad (it's like a 8x markup), but the Dean's office refused to allow any of this to take place unless he got a kickback from the fund... which seems to happen without any oversight whatsoever.


Take home lesson: Realize that higher education is a money-maker -- just like everything else. Someone is lining their pockets at your expense, and they could care less about whether or not you come out ahead.
 
2007-06-07 01:13:11 AM
Jimbo-slam: Bankrupting your already struggling community college is a great way to further your education.

It's the sort of strategy you'd expect from the average community college student.


FTW!
 
2007-06-07 01:32:17 AM
What's all the fussing aboot? Everybody is doing it.
 
2007-06-07 01:35:05 AM
C1ofUnknown: If your college was like the ones in the United States (specifically the State University of New York system), they probably hid those fees in a "Comprehensive Service" Fee, and you probably didn't even use 90% of these so-called services.

So true. Wish we had that. It's like lubricant on the administrative dick that goes up our asses.
All I see on my statement are fees, fees, fees.
 
2007-06-07 01:36:47 AM
Hosebag: When they dropped OAC, they noticed that they had to add courses in at university to make up for the lack of the OAC year.

I went back to college this past year as a mature student.

Math and English were obnoxious. Got A+ in 'em both, though.
 
2007-06-07 01:55:03 AM
cephalien

The difference is that, legally, you can write off the cost of the lab manual on your taxes (assuming you need the manual, and there is only one place to buy it).

The problem with the fees is they are quasi-required, and in most cases are taxable if covered by grants. That is what I hate: getting a full scholarship and then being (what amounts to) taxed for "technology" and "student services" and "recreation".
 
2007-06-07 01:56:39 AM
... did i mention fees were horse$hiite?
 
2007-06-07 02:06:52 AM
I don't get the headline, so I'll assume that is a stupid Ontario joke.

/grade 13 pluzzleee
//nice to see you finally joined the rest of Canada
 
2007-06-07 02:08:46 AM
Ed Finnerty: Hectropolis
"Bubs...we, ahh, need your shed for the hydroponics."

BOTTLE KIDS! DUCK!

(Absolutely LOVE Trailer Park Boys)

Pssst: All five seasons for free at www.youtvpc.com

/I loves teh tubes.


They are on season 7 episode 9 last I saw. I'm not sure how long this season is going to be. Those who don't know of the show should check it out on Netflix. How this gets no press in the states is a shame. If you watched it on BBC America do yourself a favor and see the real deal on DVD.
 
2007-06-07 02:17:02 AM
Being an Ontario high-school student in the year of the 'Double Cohort' (the year they canned grade 13), and having friends in both years, I can tell you the whole 5-year thing was pointless. Ontario was backwards for adopting it; they teach the same things in 4 years as 5 years, although it is slightly more rigid and compacted. I was unaware of this technically graduating after grade 12 stuff Dr. Mojo, and I'm too lazy to look into it, but I never noticed any difference while in school. The last 13s and the first group of graduating 12s were taking the same courses in the end.

But about TFA, I thought everyone who enrolled in University/College knew that they ram you with fees. It's got to be expected, since tuition increases can cause riots and no one really raises a fuss when every other incidental fee is upped. Post-secondary education is a business, and people will pay a lot for those services (I'm one of them).

\Botanist
\\Best choice I've made in life
 
2007-06-07 02:24:15 AM
I graduated from grade 13 in Ontario and I'm getting a kick out of both the headline and these replies.

/true
 
2007-06-07 07:17:01 AM
Dr. Mojo PhD
Eh, not really. At least in Ontario, what was commonly known as "grade 13" was actually OAC. It was technically post-secondary, but in practice always taught by high schools. It was a sort of in-between grade for high schools to universities; you were considered to have graduated high school upon completing the 12th grade, but could stick around for OAC, which helped with university.

That is not entirely correct. Before the idea of OAC ever originated there actually was a Grade 13 in high school that had to be completed before you graduated and were handed a high school diploma. That was later changed to OAC which allowed you to get out after completing Grade 12 but if you wanted to go to university you had to do OAC credits.
 
2007-06-07 07:27:30 AM
Grade 13 supposedly went with the "Common Sense Revolution"....
 
2007-06-07 07:56:27 AM
Asplenium- fellow double cohort here.. also the first of this "new curriculum". I see the same thing. No difference between the two in high school. No difference in University.

The University I went to had what I consider to be fairly reasonable fees... but it doesn't stop people from complaining. it never will. if they get rid of fees, they'll just add it to tuition, and then people will complain about accountability and higher tuition.

A better joke than grade 13, is the literacy test they gave us in grade 10. They were disappointed 2/3rds failed the test, but what do you expect when you tell us the test doesn't count? What do you expect when you ask the question "Who cut the cheese?"

//Who didn't cut the cheese?
 
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