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(Some Jesus Camp Counselor)   Valedictorian doesn't understand why lengthy, unapproved graduation speech telling audience to find Jesus or suffer the consequences is drawing criticism   (news4jax.com ) divider line
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14200 clicks; posted to Main » on 30 May 2007 at 1:00 PM (9 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2007-05-30 02:08:59 PM  
Mohammed, Ra, Sitthartha, Shiva, Zoroaster, Bahaula, The Great Tortise....

How many of them do YOU accept?
 
2007-05-30 02:10:33 PM  
Take one sexually-repressed young woman, add alcohol, subtract constant parental supervision, and you've got the next featured performer on a Girls Gone Wild video.

The only thing easier than religious freshmen girls are theater majors.

/gawds, I miss college.
 
2007-05-30 02:10:33 PM  
Never mind WHAT she talked about for twenty minutes, my problem is THAT she talked for twenty minutes. Seriously, how many people can you think of who are remotely interesting and witty enough to listen to for 20 solid minutes? At some point, the orchestra should've "played her off" like they do at the Oscars when those speeches go long.

I bet the admins never bothered to mention a time limit because most people don't want to stand and talk in front of a crowd for even ONE minute, much less 20. I bet they'll have some strict guidelines for next year...
 
2007-05-30 02:11:06 PM  
You cannot force Anti-theism down someone's throat. All you can do is keep it out of the schools. It's that simple.

Forcing it down my throat is like handing out bibles to all the students in the first grade.

This actually happened to me in my school. A couple of the Jewish kids had a pricelees, puzzled look on their faces. I just smiled and accepted it, because if I were to spout my real thoughts on the matter, I would have been a paraih in my own town.

And, yes, I knew at age six.
 
2007-05-30 02:11:15 PM  
Did I mention atheism?
 
2007-05-30 02:11:48 PM  
mytylerjr

so Jesus discovered the New World?

/scratches head
 
2007-05-30 02:11:57 PM  
Wait -- she was the only valedictorian? Around here, every high school graduating class has half a dozen valedictorii (?), one of each available color and gender. They give speeches of about 90 seconds each. And, this being south Louisiana, they're ALL Christians, believe me. . . .
 
2007-05-30 02:11:58 PM  
DistendedPendulusFrenulum

Imagine--people just getting along with one another.


Holy. Farking. Shaite.

If you call that getting along, you are batshiate insane.
 
2007-05-30 02:13:36 PM  
xebeche_tzu
Mohammed, Ra, Sitthartha, Shiva, Zoroaster, Bahaula, The Great Tortise....

How many of them do YOU accept?


Those are people, not beliefs. Maybe you should itemize their specific doctrines if you want an inventory of what we "accept".
 
2007-05-30 02:14:22 PM  
Why is there never a cream pie around when you need it?
 
2007-05-30 02:15:09 PM  
meh, so she went on a rant. If I had that chance I would go on a pinko anti-American rant. Your giving a smart person the stage to say whatever the fudge she wants. If she feels like proving smart and Christian are not mutually exclusive properties, let it be.
 
2007-05-30 02:15:52 PM  
So, our lone Jew gets up and walks out of the assembly. Magic! Since we all used to tolerate one another before the Liberal Bashing Industry told us that Intolerance is next to Godliness, the administrators let him out, along with a few other people who didn't feel like being browbeat by a revivalist.

They apparently all went to the cafeteria and just hung out during the rest of the presentation.

Imagine--people just getting along with one another.


No, I believe it's called segregation.

How do you think those kids felt. How did the other kids feel about them? Why would you force some kid into that situation?
 
2007-05-30 02:16:29 PM  
DistendedPendulusFrenulum

Some guy gets on the stage, strums a guitar chord, and hollers "everybody that don't love Jesus is a sweathog!"..... Imagine--people just getting along with one another.

It would seem that one part of your post does not fit with the other. A few people decided not to listen to someone who right off the bat insulted everyone who doesn't share his beliefs. Does that mean that everyone is getting along? No, it means that his message is endorsed by school administrators as well as everyone who would stick around to listen to his BS. Were I that Jew, I would be happy to know that my true friends at the school would be limited to those who joined me in the cafeteria, since everyone else obviously thinks I'm a sweathog. I don't know exactly what that is but it sounds unpleasant.
 
2007-05-30 02:16:45 PM  
mtylerjr

Sooo, John Smith was just chanelling Jesus?
 
2007-05-30 02:16:53 PM  
xebeche_tzu

Accept all of the religions they were associated with and put them on the shelf next to Christ. All of them are associated with myth.

/And don't leave out Finn McCool.
 
2007-05-30 02:18:27 PM  
bresin
mytylerjr

so Jesus discovered the New World?


What? Are you implying that Columbus made up the existence of existing humans in North America?

Im completely baffled by your question.
 
2007-05-30 02:18:59 PM  
everybody that don't love Jesus is a sweathog

Sure, I can see Horshack and Epstein, but Vinnie Barbarino was a good Italian Catholic boy!
 
2007-05-30 02:20:48 PM  
mtylerjr

Those are people, not beliefs


Ra, Shiva, and The Great Tortise are people? Really? Are you saying you acknowledge their existence, then? Just checking because the bible forbids you to do that.
 
2007-05-30 02:21:50 PM  
RandomFeature Ethics requires a code of beliefs, and while it may be unethical in *your* viewpoint, it wasn't according to hers and she was certainly not hypocritical in doing so.

That said, I'm not sure it did any good, but I am certain it didn't hurt anyone either.


Fair enough but, as you said, she did break mans rules and therefore should be punished for it.

As for not hurting anyone, well personally I find being forced to listen to stupidity and ignorance very painful.

I fully support your right to believe anything you want but when you foist that crap on me I am going to let you know what I believe.

/and then you shout "Help! Help! I'm being oppressed."
 
2007-05-30 02:22:13 PM  
RandomFeature: The Bible clearly states two things

And here I thought it clearly said "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live" and "He who sacrificeth unto any god, save unto the Lord only, he shall be utterly destroyed."
 
2007-05-30 02:23:33 PM  
mytylerjr

you wrote:

Jesus' ministry in North America was just after the ressurrection, approximately 34AD, not the 1800s. Those that he visited in 34AD were the "other sheep" that he mentioned in John 10:16

So, I asked:

So, Jesus discovered the New World?

And, who said anything about Columbus? He was a bit late.
 
2007-05-30 02:25:32 PM  
mtylerjr
Wasn't Jesus in the Middle East? How did he get to America?
 
2007-05-30 02:27:27 PM  
mtylerjr

id believe you if i could just look at those gold plates for a bit...
 
2007-05-30 02:27:39 PM  
Too many of you farkers are calling her a liar and unethical! Jeez, can't you farking people read?

FTFA: The principal of Wolfson told Channel 4 he was not sure from where Sundstrom [district admin making such a fuss] got his information, but said that he would not characterize Spaulding as acting dishonorable or deceitful.

The man who gave her the assignment said that the admin asshat does not have his facts correct. The admin asshat is just trying to cover his ass by calling her deceitful and dishonorable because the asshat is fielding complaints about the speech. Said asshat is saying, "not our fault, we tried to screen the speech, but she lied to us." That's a disgraceful lie according to the principal of her school.

That said, she's an idiot anyway.
 
2007-05-30 02:28:01 PM  
I went to Catholic school, and our valedictorian had to have his speech reviewed by the principal. Believe it or not, he was allowed to say "God to me does not yet exist," which is a quote by George Bernard Shaw (?)

As for this valedictorian being surprised that she offended people, either she's incredibly ignorant or she doesn't care.

I say bravo to her. I am not a Christian and I don't like preaching, but she earned the right to go up there and say whatever she wanted. Way to make use of a captive audience.
 
2007-05-30 02:28:01 PM  
xebeche_tzu

I was parsing your question as "do you accept what they teach", rather than "do you accept that they existed".

Since you mixed a few actual humans with a few "deities", it was an awkward question. But if you are just asking if I accept that they existed:

Zoraster existed, yes. Siddhartha Gautama existed, yes. Mohommed existed, yes. Ra, No. Shiva, No. Scott Bakula, Yes.
 
2007-05-30 02:29:49 PM  
The world needs delusional bubble heads.

Someone's gotta do anal!
 
2007-05-30 02:30:32 PM  
Diogenes: hillbillypharmacist: Or kids in Fred Phelps' clan! But they're all home schooled. :-(

No they are not. At least the generation including the odious Shirley weren't. Fred sent them public school deliberately so that they would feel alienated from the real world. He wanted them to be hated a despised and bullied every day so they would feel no desire to leave his evil little cult of hatred for the outside world.
 
2007-05-30 02:31:20 PM  
I had a guy I knew who was Valedictorian in 99, a couple of years ahead of me. He was a nerd, a geek, a band dude, and extraordinarily intelligent. In fact he was picked on quite a bit because he was smarter than most if not all of the students of that school. He got up on stage, delivered his address, and ended it with a Latin phrase that left all of us stumped. All of us save my buddy who was sitting next to me and translated what he said.

"And you can kiss my gothic white ass."

I shiat you not, he said that. It was beautiful. A couple years down the road another friend of mine was getting ready to give his valedictorian speech. The principal took him aside (as he knew the guy who gave the original speech) and asked him if he'd made any additional changes to his speech. Comedy gold, I swear. Gods I hated that school.
 
2007-05-30 02:31:51 PM  
This story just comes back to the idea that the world would be a much better place if we came to a few collective realizations:

- There is no god
- All religions are wrong, and serve only to factionalize
- It is a round world and we are all stuck on it together
 
2007-05-30 02:32:08 PM  
Hey it beats the crap the valedictorians usually spew such as analogies about life and it being a box, a painting or anything else they can find pre written on the internet.
 
2007-05-30 02:32:45 PM  
johnpseudo
mtylerjr
Wasn't Jesus in the Middle East? How did he get to America?


Are you serious?
 
2007-05-30 02:34:03 PM  
mtylerjr

Zoraster existed, yes. Siddhartha Gautama existed, yes. Mohommed existed, yes. Ra, No. Shiva, No. Scott Bakula, Yes.


So you dismiss as nonsense gods that other people believe in, which makes you (and every other religious person) a non-theist, or atheist.

That was my original point. Most religions demand the rejection of all other religions, so the devout are all actually atheists themselves, which makes them hypocrites for bagging on other atheists.
 
2007-05-30 02:34:43 PM  
The biatch should just DIAF. She can have all the jesus she wants, hell she can blow him for a class project, but I sure don't want to hear about it.
 
2007-05-30 02:35:53 PM  
As a valedictorian who pushes their beliefs on others, I'm really getting a kick out of these replies!
 
2007-05-30 02:36:01 PM  
bresin
And, who said anything about Columbus?

Well, Who said anything about Jesus discovering the new world?

I was just confused where your question came from. The answer is obvsiously "no"
 
2007-05-30 02:37:20 PM  
xebeche_tzu, you know, that little argument that religious people are the same as atheists, but with one more god is just as illogical and disingenuous as the argument that atheism is a religion. It doesn't move the discussion any because it's just "I know you are, but what am I?"
 
2007-05-30 02:38:15 PM  
She's a religious attention whore, no different from the people that protest at military funerals or the crackpots that try to get Harry Potter books banned.

The fact that we're reading a story about her means that she got exactly what she wanted.
 
2007-05-30 02:40:12 PM  
LamOtter: surprised that she offended people

From her point, she probably was surprised. Fundies tend to be incredibly insular, and think that everyone in their general vicinity shares their beliefs. These "jews", "moslems" and "atheists" they hear about are some rare exotic creatures who only live in strange, far-off lands (like Africa or New York City). It often comes as a complete shock to them to discover that decent white people living in their very own neighborhoods *don't* accept Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and Savior.

Besides, to a true fundie, if you don't share their beliefs, you're not really a PERSON... anyone who doesn't love the Jeebus must be some kind of subhuman atheist / pagan / heathen / infidel / godless liberal pinko commie.
 
2007-05-30 02:43:03 PM  
mtylerjr
Im completely baffled by your question.

You say that a lot , don't you.

Jesus' ministry in North America was just after the ressurrection, approximately 34AD, not the 1800s. Those that he visited in 34AD were the "other sheep" that he mentioned in John 10:16

,,,mmmkay

At least you do know that thunder and lighting are atmospheric phenomena,,,right? right?

/see folks, progress
 
2007-05-30 02:43:09 PM  
hetheeme: No seriously if this person made his speech on the wonders of how science has shown that there is no God and that we should all accept that she would be championed as a genius and progressive thinker.

This might be the stupidest thing I have ever read. SHE (RTFA) would have been crucified (heh) for comments like those above, and you damn well know that.
 
2007-05-30 02:44:52 PM  
mtylerjr

once again

YOU WROTE:

Jesus' ministry in North America was just after the ressurrection, approximately 34AD, not the 1800s. Those that he visited in 34AD were the "other sheep" that he mentioned in John 10:16

So this time I'll ask this:

How did Jesus' ministry get to North America in 34AD?
 
2007-05-30 02:45:00 PM  
xebeche_tzu
So you dismiss as nonsense gods that other people believe in, which makes you (and every other religious person) a non-theist, or atheist.

That was my original point. Most religions demand the rejection of all other religions, so the devout are all actually atheists themselves, which makes them hypocrites for bagging on other atheists.


Well, you might be surprised to know that some religions, including Mormons, believe that most other religions have some degree of truth. It's not a matter of "accepting" or "rejecting" every other religion - it is a matter of realizing that the amount of revealed truth varies from religion to religion, for various reasons.

So, your characterization breaks down at least when applied to LDS. We may believe that we have a greater amount of truth revealed than, say, Zorasterians. But we can also understand that they have a degree of truth, and it would only be specific tenets or doctrines that we might reject.

I have no problem at all, for example, believing that Zoraster (to use one of your exampels) was in fact a prophet of God. Many of his teachings have probably been corrupted over time, but there is still quite possibly a lot of truth there.
 
2007-05-30 02:46:28 PM  
GilRuiz1

...illogical and disingenuous...


If you reject 1431 religions (you know, other people's Gods?), and I reject 1432, I say we are more alike than not. The devout freely and easily dismiss all other religions as nonsense.

How is that not logical?
 
2007-05-30 02:47:05 PM  
but with one more god is just as illogical and disingenuous as the argument that atheism is a religion. It doesn't move the discussion any because it's just "I know you are, but what am I?"

Here's how it moves the discussion.

Gods have come and gone. From the earliest primatives who needed answers to life's questions, right through the latest incarnations of cults and scisms in the Holy Roman church.

Time and again, people have rejected them one after the other. At what point are we going to reject (enter your belief system here)?
 
2007-05-30 02:47:15 PM  
Wasn't Jesus in the Middle East? How did he get to America? El Al?

Even though all faith is nonsense, usually one has to use logic and reason to disprove their fundamental tenets. To show that Joseph Smith was a liar, all you have to do is submit DNA tests. Indians aren't the descendants of the Lamanites; they came over the Bering landbridge during the last Ice Age. We know this because DNA test of Native Americans show that their closest genetic relatives live in Siberia, not Israel.

In addition, the languages spoken in the New World have no relation to Semitic languages, and the archeological record shows that there were no Jewish empires in the Americas, ever. No scimitars (or "cimiters"), no chariots, no steel or iron weapons

The events and people described in the BOM are wholly fictional.

Sorry, Mormons, but Joseph Smith should have kept to preaching theology instead of making clearly falsifiable claims.

And this chick should have known that preaching is for church, not for graduation.
 
2007-05-30 02:49:43 PM  
xebeche_tzu: If you reject 1431 religions (you know, other people's Gods?), and I reject 1432, I say we are more alike than not. The devout freely and easily dismiss all other religions as nonsense. How is that not logical?

Hey, if you want to believe in your religion of atheism, that's fine. Go ahead and have your set of faith-based doctrines about God, the afterlife and the supernatural.

How is this not logical?

/see how it doesn't get us anywhere?
 
2007-05-30 02:51:34 PM  
Bresin

I said Christ visited the Americas in 34Ad. That wouldnt make him the "Discoverer" as there were obviously already people there, as everyone on the planet readily admits. Thats why your question was just nonsensical/bizarre.

How did he get there? Who knows. How did he raise the dead? How did he walk on water? There are, frankly, greater purported miracles to explain that very fast travelling, if you want to start down that road of "if thats true, how did he do that"

Your question was just inexplicable, given that Jesus was -visiting- people, not touring/discovering an empty continent.
 
2007-05-30 02:53:21 PM  
Hey, if you want to believe in your religion of atheism, that's fine. Go ahead and have your set of faith-based doctrines about God, the afterlife and the supernatural

Here we go, calling a lack of faith a religious belief.

Is your lack of belief in the tooth fairy a "faith-based doctrine?"
 
2007-05-30 02:54:25 PM  
xebeche_tzu

You make the perfect Christian because you know how to perfectly mangle reason. The rejection of 1431 religions compared to the rejection of ALL religion is what you should think of. Not to remove only your faith, and say we all think alike. The fact is that you believe your life is controlled by a diety, whereas Atheists don't believe in deities. How tough is that to understand?
 
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