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(Yahoo)   Rosie O'Donnell thinks 9/11 was an inside job, which means she thinks the Holocaust didn't happen, which means she weighs as much as a duck, and therefore is made of wood and is a witch. Burn her   ( news.yahoo.com) divider line
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22272 clicks; posted to Main » on 11 Apr 2007 at 1:07 PM (10 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2007-04-11 03:01:42 PM  
epoc_tnac: Again, follow the motives, follow the money; who stands to gain? Who stands to lose?

Cum hoc ergo propter hoc fallacy.

/+1 because it sounds dirty.
 
2007-04-11 03:01:47 PM  
... waiting on crypto to provide evidence of acts of war committed against the U.S. by Noriega.

/Dude, if the only defense you have for your buddy KSM is that he wasn't treated like Noriega, it's not even apples and oranges. . . it's apples and deinonychus your comparing.
 
2007-04-11 03:01:59 PM  
We'll never truly know exactly what happened on 9/11. I don't buy the official story and I don't really buy into the conspiracy theories. Both sides have reasons to lie and distort their story of what happened.

But you gotta figure... if Rove, Rumsfeld, and Cheney knew that the attacks were going to occur (and I'm nearly positive they knew), why wouldn't they just let them happen? We're not really talking about the most moral people on Earth here. These are politicians and regardless of party affiliation, I can't put it past any politician to do this. Balancing out the loss of lives that with the political gains they'd recieve, they'd surely take advantage of it. They would take advantage of it because they know that the people they answer to could make billions if only they had a reason to start a military campaign in the Middle East. Sorry if I'm being a little too cynical, but I don't put it past the industrialist scumfarks and politicians running this country to sacrifice 3,000 Americans in order to reap the rewards afterwards.
 
2007-04-11 03:02:15 PM  
mikaloyd: !ALL HAIL FAETHE!

Shhhh! Now Rosie O'Donnell is going to off me!
 
2007-04-11 03:02:33 PM  
Again, follow the motives, follow the money; who stands to gain? Who stands to lose?

OBL--he struck at the US, the enemy of muslims, and gained converts, supporters, financing and huge prestige.

as for teh US, 9/11 wrecked our economy, putting it into a recession, lost money for investors and pensioners, killed thousands of our fellow citizens, etc. were are the positive gains for the bush administration? you assume the administration even needed a reason to go to war.
 
2007-04-11 03:02:43 PM  
Untrustworthy : There is so much stupid in this statement I don't even know where to start.

Wow man, thats a convincing argument. Well, now I believe everything in the official report. God bless the government! Except for everything else they do, which is all lies. But this time they were honest.

CURIOSITY WILL NOT BE TOLERATED. EAT YOUR TRUTH, CITIZEN.
 
2007-04-11 03:02:53 PM  
MMatix,
beam-cut photo is photoshopped!
 
2007-04-11 03:02:53 PM  
FritzyVonFritz: "attention CTers...what evidence, specifically, would it take to convince you there was no conspiracy?"

According to the government, THERE WAS A CONSPIRACY.

Have you read the 9-11 commission report, wiseguy? There was an alleged conspiracy of Saudi and other Middle Eastern persons to attack the US.
 
2007-04-11 03:03:05 PM  
Headso: that isn't really true, the warnings reached unprecedented levels in the summer of 2001, there were specific warnings of imminent terrorist attacks...

They weren't specific.
 
2007-04-11 03:03:26 PM  
no, jet fuel does not burn hot enough to melt the beams, but the beams would have lost atleast half their strength at the temperature the fuel would have burned, and that doesn't even factor in the force of impact from a large jet, or that the buildings are designed to "implode" or fall upon themselves to reduce collateral damage.

Considering how many people would have had to been in on this scheme to pull it off i seriously doubt it would not have come out by now. I mean, a president can't even get a bj or do a little cigar fellatio without the whole world finding out.

so in conclusion I think everyone needs to relax and remove their aluminum hats (or just stop buying in to every conspiracy theory they hear).
 
2007-04-11 03:03:44 PM  
2007-04-11 02:55:52 PM albo


But, the government knew about it and let it happen, because it furthered their agenda.

for this to be true, it assumes that everybody in the US government who knew about the plan were willing to let terrorists possibly kill 50,000+ of their fellow citizens and wreck the US economy. just to justify an invasion of afghanistan. and no one had an attack of conscience and blabbed.

total nonsense

===================================================

They allowed hundreds of thousands of Iraqis to die. They've allowed 3,000 soldiers to die. So, why not?

Oh, and it's amazing to me that if you believe terrorist did this on their own, then it's fine to assume that the people in place to stop it were incompetent or confused. But, if you believe Bush & Co. did it, then you MUST believe that there were hundreds of other government personnel in on the plan as well.
 
2007-04-11 03:03:46 PM  
Uh...

i92.photobucket.com
 
2007-04-11 03:04:17 PM  
Wonder if anyone will explain to epoc_tnac that, based on previous experience with the U.S., Al Qaeda had the most to gain.
 
2007-04-11 03:04:20 PM  
Boojum2k

... waiting on crypto to provide evidence of acts of war committed against the U.S. by Noriega.

Does appearing on TV or in public with that Acne count? He need some of Jessica Simpson and Puff Daddy's help! THAT was a crime...at least a little foundation DAMN
 
2007-04-11 03:04:23 PM  
epoc_tnac:

Kind of funny, that is the attitude the truthers take with their baseless accusations..

Be a good sheep and believe every note written on a bathroom wall like the conspiracy theorists.
 
2007-04-11 03:04:33 PM  
Wraithbane and that when umpteen zillion tons of crap hits something, it's going to move right now

Clearly, this is why all of us should keep our distance from Rosie O'Donnell!!!!
 
2007-04-11 03:04:52 PM  
Sorry if I'm being a little too cynical, but I don't put it past the industrialist scumfarks and politicians running this country to sacrifice 3,000 Americans in order to reap the rewards afterwards.

50,000 dead. that's how many worked in the towers. plus thousands on the ground.

you have to assume the US officials who were comfortable with al-qaeda attacking would have been comfortable with the worst-case scenario and the most people killed.
 
2007-04-11 03:05:17 PM  
But, the government knew about it and let it happen, because it furthered their agenda.

for this to be true, it assumes that everybody in the US government who knew about the plan were willing to let terrorists possibly kill 50,000+ of their fellow citizens and wreck the US economy. just to justify an invasion of afghanistan. and no one had an attack of conscience and blabbed.

total nonsense


It's exactly what happened with Pearl Harbour. So no, it is not total nonsense. I don't understand how people can so adamantly and immediately label claims as impossible, when those claims have recent precedence. It was only 60 years ago that the United States government knowingly and willfully allowed an enemy to breach our border and attack our citizens. And now people want to label others as bat-shiat crazy for suggesting it could ever happen again. It's that apathetic dismissal that WILL allow, and did allow, it to happen again.
 
2007-04-11 03:06:14 PM  
Great pictures of how they stored the rover at:

http://www.hq.nasa.gov/office/pao/History/SP-4204/ch23-3.html

Nothing to look at here folks. Move along.
 
2007-04-11 03:06:16 PM  
there are a lot of unanswered questions out there. for an event of this magnitude, i would like to see a few more of the loose ends tied up.
but, this is america 2007, no one fails, no one pays!
 
2007-04-11 03:06:27 PM  
Yamagoo: What the hell? Specific? You mean there was intell that said that bat SHiat fanatics were going to fly planes in to the WTC on (/11 cause that right there is "specific"

Yes. There was. Read the 9/11 commission report.

Step one: INS was a clusterfark.

Step two: Issue student Visas to Muslim fundementalist twat heads wanted by Interpol

Step Three: Six years later negotiate a 40 million dollar contract with a national TV network by saying step one and two are irrelevant = profit.
 
2007-04-11 03:06:40 PM  
epoc_tnac: Again, follow the motives, follow the money; who stands to gain? Who stands to lose?

So, racial violence against black people in the first half of the century must have been carried out by other black people, because black people were the ones who gained sympathy?

The Soviets engineered Operation Barbarossa because Hitler was the one who came out defeated? The Americans engineered the Pearl Harbor bombing because the Japanese never had a hope of conquering the United States?
 
2007-04-11 03:06:47 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND

No need to thank me for my tone, though it's appreciated. You aren't advocating anything hateful or being a dick. I don't see a reason to light into you. I am curious though as to who the guilt is falling on here. Is there a link between Silverstein and the administration? Plenty of people profited on the destruction of the trade center and the subsequent war. If you can tie Silverstein to the Carlyle group or Bush, I could give some credence to some form of acquiescence to the attacks if not actual culpability.

Faethe


It amazes me that so many people think the military always had the right to pretty much do whatever the fark it wanted inside civilian airspace. They aren't even allowed to farking FLY in civilian airspaces with out first getting clearence from the state and municipality.


There were two F15s parked in New York airspace minutes after the first attack. I'm pretty sure the military occasionally oversteps it's bounds in dire circumstances. The military stays the hell out of civilian territory to the same extent that the CIA does.
 
2007-04-11 03:07:00 PM  
I subscribe to a small but growing contingent of people called not 'truthors' but 'philosophors'. We believe that things that are true are true regardless of whether or not there is evidence that they are true.

We believe that the conspiracy goes back further than anyone suspects. The truth is that the towers never existed at all!

That's right. It is brilliance to the ultimate degree. You just start adding these buildings into postcards, movies, and TV shows. You have King Kong climb them and put them in snowglobes. Soon, the whole world believes that these so called 'Twin Towers' actually exist.

Then, when it is most effective, you claim someone blew them up!

You may doubt our claim but I challenge anyone to PROVE that the towers ever really existed.
 
2007-04-11 03:07:01 PM  
Boojum2K: Were you born yesterday? The US attacked Panama and brought Noriega for trial.

Try cracking a history book occasionally.
 
2007-04-11 03:07:24 PM  
It's exactly what happened with Pearl Harbour

Bwahahahahahhahahhaa. No seriously, this is you being laughed at. Not with, but at.
 
2007-04-11 03:07:39 PM  
But, if you believe Bush & Co. did it, then you MUST believe that there were hundreds of other government personnel in on the plan as well.

okay, so only a few people were involved in the conspiracy.

then bush and cheney and rove planted the demolition charges personally?

or they personally sat in the intercept vans out in the field or at NSA and copied down the conversations of OBL discussing the plan and then let it happen?
 
2007-04-11 03:07:48 PM  
retrosteve

So aside from one stupid "go read the 9-11 report", has anyone answered Picador's point yet? I've read the report and I still think it's a good question.

"So is anyone bothered by the fact that although the Pentagon billed us trillions of dollars to provide for our defense, they failed utterly to defend us on 9/11? Apparently they were so incompetent that even when the whole world knew that we were under attack via hijacked aircraft, the Air Force couldn't be bothered to defend the airspace over the Capitol and left their own home base wide open to attack. Isn't it just a trifle bothersome that no one was ever held accountable for this egregious failure?

Who the hell planned the training exercises that were apparently so all-encompassing as to leave the entire nation defenseless? What are the odds that such an exercise would take place the very day the hijackers struck and how come the Pentagon couldn't call off the war games within two minutes of the second plane'shiatting the Towers? It would be another half an hour before a third plane struck the Pentagon and yet we're supposed to believe that it was unavoidable because the USAF was caught totally unawares."


2 things come to mind when I thought about answering this. One is on 9/10, we were a different people whose only concern was the typical mindless hollywood bullshiat. The average Joe could never dream of such a thing or even imagine the type of mindset necessary for this kind of attack. In fact it is still unbelievable to me which is where I think some of this tin-foil stuff at its root comes from.

The second thing is how these very same tin-foilers can imagine a mission impossible like hollywood style efficiency from the govt, yet at the same time call that very same govt --- useless.
 
2007-04-11 03:08:04 PM  
DriveBy


One thing I've learned in this thread: steel really sucks as a building material.

The only material that is suitable for protecting skyscrapers from jetliners is tinfoil reinforced conjecture
 
2007-04-11 03:08:31 PM  
untrustworthy: They weren't specific.

They seem that way now....


The intel and crap that was coming in from europe being used as toilet paper by our glorious alphabet agencies
 
2007-04-11 03:08:45 PM  
Faethe

The US is a BIG place...I dont want to scare you but it's like WAAAAAY bigger than your moms back yard, or even Rosies ass.

Specific means WHO,WHAT,WHERE,WHEN,HOW

What the Fark!
 
2007-04-11 03:09:27 PM  
2007-04-11 03:01:30 PM Yamagoo


Headso

What the hell? Specific? You mean there was intell that said that bat SHiat fanatics were going to fly planes in to the WTC on (/11 cause that right there is "specific"

If you mean some bad people want to hurt us and they're planning something Here's you complimentary subscription to Vague Magazine

===================================================

Ashcroft knew. You should be pissed that you were left to die.

On July 26, 2001, cbsnews.com reported that John Ashcroft had stopped flying on commercial airlines.

Ashcroft used to fly commercial, just as Janet Reno did. So why, two months before Sept. 11, did he start taking chartered government planes?

CBS News correspondent Jim Stewart asked the Justice Department.

Because of a "threat assessment" by the FBI, he was told. But "neither the FBI nor the Justice Department ... would identify what the threat was, when it was detected or who made it," CBS News reported.

The FBI did advise Ashcroft to stay off commercial aircraft. The rest of us just had to take our chances.
 
2007-04-11 03:09:30 PM  
This, of course, means that Rosie is actually a terrorist. She's attempting to draw attention to conspiracy theories so that she and her flying monkeys can try to get the ruby slippers from Dorothy.

Boy, I'd pay to see a house fall on her.
 
2007-04-11 03:09:47 PM  
Crypozoophiliac-

apologies for not being more clear, allow me to restate the question:


attention CTers...what evidence, specifically, would it take to convince you this was not a preplanned, inside job by the US government?
 
2007-04-11 03:10:14 PM  
It's exactly what happened with Pearl Harbour.

from wiki (default for quick search):

"Battleship Row presented an attractive concentration of targets.U.S. civil and military intelligence had, amongst them, good information suggesting additional Japanese aggression throughout the summer and fall before the attack. None of it then specifically indicated an attack against Pearl Harbor, nor has any been identified since. "

granted, this is not a primary source, but where are you getting the source for the US knowing about pearl harbor ahead of time?
 
2007-04-11 03:10:56 PM  
BackAssward

The evidence does not support a plane hitting the building, airplane grade steel would not vaporize from a crash (there are many crashed on public file and it never has).


ORLY. This video shows what happens when "airplane grade steel" hits a solid concrete wall.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/5667/plane_crashes_into_concrete/
 
2007-04-11 03:11:01 PM  
Her is the link to the NIST investigation into the collapse of the towers

http://wtc.nist.gov/

it seems more scientific then anything the conspiracy folks put forward

/No HTML skills
 
2007-04-11 03:11:07 PM  
untrustworthy: Headso: that isn't really true, the warnings reached unprecedented levels in the summer of 2001, there were specific warnings of imminent terrorist attacks...

They weren't specific.


bad choice of words on my part, there were warnings coming from everywhere that suggested something was going to happen in the near future and judging from the response they were obviously ignored.
 
2007-04-11 03:11:09 PM  
elchip
Nowhere in the Bible does it say that Jesus wasn't a raptor.

Now THAT would be awesome!
 
2007-04-11 03:11:15 PM  

2007-04-11 03:07:24 PM Boojum2k

It's exactly what happened with Pearl Harbour

Bwahahahahahhahahhaa. No seriously, this is you being laughed at. Not with, but at.


Laugh all you want. The government's pre-knowledge of Pearl Harbour isn't speculation, it's established fact.
 
2007-04-11 03:11:47 PM  
There's a huge difference between melting steel in a furnace or cutting it with an oxy-acetylene torch than in allegedly weakening it to the point of failure via an open-air fire. My BBQ example is relevant. It doesn't matter how much hotter kerosene (jet fuel) burns than butane (lighter fluid). Both burn up rapidly. Once the jet fuel caught fire it was only a matter of minutes before every last drop of it burned away forever. Even thousands of gallons of jet fuel are no match for thousands of tons of steel.

Plunging a thick steel beam into a pool of burning jet fuel for five minutes is not going to weaken the beam to the point of failure. It would take hours for the temp of the steel to equal that of the jet fuel. The fuel will burn itself up long before that happens.
 
2007-04-11 03:12:09 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND: Ashcroft knew. You should be pissed that you were left to die.

The fact that Ashcroft avoided commercial airplanes before 9/11 points far away from the "The government was behind 9/11" argument and firmly towards "The government knew it was coming and did not enough/nothing" territory. If the government was behind it, you'd think they would be able to keep Ashcroft off of the planes that they used to fly into the buildings.

/Just saying
 
2007-04-11 03:13:00 PM  
BackAsswardYou do know that strength doesn't scale directly with volume, yes? Strength of a beam is based on a it's thickness (2d cross section). so if the model was 1/100th the size, it's strength would be not 1/100th, but rather 1/10th.

Get off my bridge!
/Clearly trolling.
//Though if one attempted the above example, that would be hilarious
 
2007-04-11 03:13:26 PM  
stonicus: Laugh all you want. The government's pre-knowledge of Pearl Harbour isn't speculation, it's established fact.

I'm pretty sure their near-simultaneous invasion of the Philippines, Malaya, and Hong Kong would have been enough to bring us to war anyway...
 
2007-04-11 03:13:35 PM  
crypto

I was apparently born well before you, because I understand plain sentences, and I am far better read than you. Except maybe for the Tinfoil Weekly, I'm sure you're up to date on that one.

What. Act of War. Did. Noriega. Commit.

We deposed him, for our own good reasons, but they did not involve a physical attack on the U.S. Khalid Sheik Mohammed was linked through overwhelming evidence to 9/11 long before he confessed.
 
2007-04-11 03:13:37 PM  
albo OBL--he struck at the US, the enemy of muslims, and gained converts, supporters, financing and huge prestige.

as for teh US, 9/11 wrecked our economy, putting it into a recession, lost money for investors and pensioners, killed thousands of our fellow citizens, etc. were are the positive gains for the bush administration? you assume the administration even needed a reason to go to war.


I'd have to dispute nearly all of that. OBL drew the Americans into Afghanistan where they gave the taliban quite a spanking for a while (although Al-Q seem to have gotten away completely). The US economy was wrecked by 9/11? Sorry, i think the economy goes up and down by itself, maybe the markets fluctuated for a while.

Where are the positive gains for the Bush admin.? Well, if you wanted to go off on a phoney war (remember, they did try their best to make up shiat to get into the war) and wanted to pass draconian laws to help along those baby steps to a totalitarian state, then you need an all encompassing boogieman label that you can apply to people who disagree with you. The word terrorism is so overused these days in the media that you would think that the sky was about to fall on our heads. The meme has been effectively passed to a large minority of people that all muslims hate America for its freedoms (good one) and want all Americans dead and if you don't support the government of the land of the Free World, then you are a traitor.

The ground is prepared, the seeds have been sown... and it was all possible due to a hardcore brainwashing session in early fall of 2001.
 
2007-04-11 03:13:52 PM  
If thermite was used on the base, the bottom of WTC would have given out first,
blowing out the base of the structure frist.
WTC1&2 fell down from the top, it didn't collapse from the base
just as EVERY SINGLE VIDEO CLIP SHOWS that was recorded from the ground level.
/andthesepeoplevotetoo
 
2007-04-11 03:13:58 PM  
DROxINxTHExWIND

Ashcroft? The guy who hung a hanky on a nude statue? THAT Ashcroft? If any of us saw half the raw intel that pours in to Federal agencies we'd be curled up in a fetal position in our basements. The problem is sorting the SHiat from the Possible and then the possible from the probable....
You think Ashcroft knew more than PLANES are at RISK?

Tell me have you never heard of hijacking cause I was aware of the risk Waaaaay before 9/11

Then again I am not, wasnt nor will I ever be Attorney General of the US so I dont take additional precautions like that
 
2007-04-11 03:14:08 PM  
Tatsuma: Ok, ok, you got us, truthers. We admit it. It was us, the Jews. We destroyed the Towers.

What do you expect? We killed Jesus, after all. And we'd do it again.


I knew it was the JOOOOS!!!!!

Hee hee hee.
 
2007-04-11 03:14:09 PM  
Mr.Churka: There were two F15s parked in New York airspace minutes after the first attack. I'm pretty sure the military occasionally oversteps it's bounds in dire circumstances. The military stays the hell out of civilian territory to the same extent that the CIA does.

AFAIK that's true. Did you watch it? I watched this stuff on like two cable channels - me and my husband. I don't know if you remember, but it was a clusterfark trying to get clearence for anything to get up off the ground. I mean, military aircraft.

A lot of people overlook the fact that this had never happened before. There was no protocol in place. Military aircraft were NOT allowed to fly in civilian airspace, period. You had a decision making chain involved in this, that at that time, was essentially freaking out. You drop a civilian aircraft, you kill the people in it, possibly the people on the ground. That's just the first hurdle. The second is you farking well need to justify yourself to the state you did this in, to the secretary of Defense, everyone.

Plus no one was even SURE how many planes were hijacked. I remember at one time Dianne Sawyer said there were eight.
 
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