How many California legislators does it take to change a lightbulb?

2012?

God damn, that is stupid. A tiny fraction of a household's power usage goes to lighting. It's the TV's, computers, refrigerators, washers, dryers, and whatever other appliances that suck up the juice.

Leave it to California politicians to come up with a solution to a nonexistant problem, then make it mandatory. Those ugly flourescent bulbs probably don't save that much power.

The bulbs aren't just ugly. I wouldn't want that unnatural florescent office-type shade of light anywhere in my living space. ugh.

// hates it even more when the bulbs are buzzing

LordPistachio: A tiny fraction of a household's power usage goes to lighting.

FTA: About a fifth of the average U.S. home's electricity costs pays for lighting

* Population of Cali: 33,871,648
* Avg household power usage in Cali: 6.5 MWh annually

Start doing some math and that "tiny fraction" starts adding up, even if you take into account that most households include more than one person.


/over half of my lights use CFL
//rest use either compact halogen or low wattage (25W or 40W) bulbs

Fluorescent lights give me a headache.

Thats it California is off my x-mas card list.....

LordPistachio: A tiny fraction of a household's power usage goes to lighting.

actually, in california, lighting is up there for the household energy budget.

at least in years that aren't one heatwave after another.

it would be nice if the compacts were cheaper though. They never last as long as they claim.

Well they just farked hollywood and any theatre in cali. Guess what all the lamps are in studios, and there is no feasible way to replace them.

Sorry, I'm a california resident, and I think this bill makes sense.

But I think a different approach is needed. Don't outlaw the bulbs. Outlaw *selling* the bulbs. If all that's available are the CFL, then that's what most people will use. If you really want incandescent bulbs, order them online.

This way you're not screwing with personal choice, you're just amking sure people will actually have to make the effort to waste energy.

Pie4Weeble: households are the target of the legislation. I'm certain in applications that require incadescents they will have the appropriate exemption

o nos! this is scary! a state legislature tries to take the lead in protecting the planet and reducing our nation's enslavement to foreign sources of energy... everybody panic!

I plan to start off my next abode with high-efficiency lighting. I may not be a perfect environmentalist, but too many people give up halfway because almost noone can afford to be one.

But every time I convince my friends to take one car instead of three, recycle my junk, and use a better lightbulb, I'm at least doing something rather than just complaining about the problem.

While banning incandescent bulbs is pretty stupid, I actually like the fluorescent bulbs, and yes, they do save power and last longer.

From my cold, dead fingers.

various governments at various levels have tried the carrot approach for years. funding research, offering incentives, it just hasn't made much dent.

I guess I can understand them deciding they want to use the stick now. not sure it will work.

kurtwhitener:

All us Californians are just stupid liberals, and whenever we do something that actually makes sense, all of the right-tards come out and scream about us taking away personal liberty and making a welfare state.

Of course, they don't care that smog has gotten better because of an emphasis on public transit and sensible emissions policies, people here are just as happy and sad as anywhere else, and apparently us pansy-assed liberals aren't all that good on being soft on crime, because our prison system is way way overstuffed.

But... lib-e-RALS...

I have started slowly converting my home over to these CFLs to reduce energy usage (especially for times when I have to switch to generator power). However, I do have a question for the enviroexperts out there. I understand that the CFL bulbs use less energy. However do they require more energy in order to be produced? Do they cause more of a dent in the environment when disposed? I honestly don't know much about them and I am just curious if they are truly more enviro-friendly OVERALL...

Q: How many republicans does it take to change a light bulb?
A: Republicans don't know what a light bulb is.

This is like spending money to install a bigger bilge pump in your boat instead of plugging the hole in the hull.

CFL's don't need the governments help to become more popular. They are becoming more popular on their own because of the energy savings and not having to change bulbs so often already offsets the increased cost. This moron is just trying to look good without actualy doing anything usefull.

Fluorescent light also cause Migraines for some people. Are they going to need a perscription to get an incandescent light?

CFL's don't work too well in high vibration/shock applications like trouble lights, garage door openers, etc. They also have trouble working at low temperatures. (Tried one in an outdoor fixture that was supposed to work at low temperatures. Didn't work properly when it got cold so I switched it back to an incandescent.)

Why are lawmakers in California so freaking stupid. (Better yet, why do people elect them?) The only solution they have to any problem that may or may not exist is to ban something.

Why not make CFL's exempt from sales tax for 5 years? That would do alot more to encourage the use of CFL's than banning incandescent bulbs. If you buy 10 bulbs for $50 to use in your house that would be $3.75 less you would have to pay. Sure not alot of money, but it is an additional encouragement on top of CFL's other economic benifits that are making them more popular.

/Use the sunlight CFL bulbs, more spendy, but worth it IMHO.

I use about a dozen CFLs at home.

Several lights I want to go on immediately without warmup-time, though.
Several others I need more natural lighting so colors are correct.
I've got a couple bulb-outlets (basement) that for some ungodly reason eat
CFL bulbs like popcorn, instead of "13x longer" think "1/4 as long" at ten times the price.

This is a bad idea.

Barnacles!:

You know, that's a very good example of how Californians are perceived by the rest of the country... and in my experience, it's entirely wrong.

I drive through Malibu every morning and afternoon on my way to and from work... and I work in a building that celebrities tend to go back and forth through (there's a talent agency on the fourth floor). In fact, apparently I once ran into Robert Downey Jr. (Almost literally, my friend actually got bumped). And I never even noticed. Malibu is just a slightly rinky-dink beach town. The whole area is way overrated.

Us Californians are just like everyone else. We just tend to have better weather and are a little spoiled by it.

(I don't mean Britney, Paris, or Nicole. They're on their own!)

FTFA: A 20-watt CFL gives as much light as a 75-watt conventional bulb

BULLSHAIT!!! I've tested dozens of these things over the years and I can state categorically that THIS IS NOT TRUE IN REAL-WORLD TESTS! A 40 or 60-watt CFL comes closer, but you CANNOT read comfortably with a 20-watt CFL.

Plus, the color-temperature of some of these can really throw your color-perception off.

duskglow2000, Fark will never change. The Bone-To-Brain Ratio (BBR) is always at peak levels here. This place is filled with people who seem to think Enron was good, blackouts were Grey Davis' fault and no one else's, Bush is a great steward of the environment and any regulation is, by definition, liberal commie bullshiat.

None, they will just hire an illegal to do it for them at taxpayers expense.

A lot of older dimmer systems won't work properly with flurosencet bulbs, and I'm sure there a number of other similar problems. Why don't they just over-tax the standard bulbs (or subsidize the fluros) so that they cost 5 times as much as the fluros?

DJLunchBox

The bulbs aren't just ugly. I wouldn't want that unnatural florescent office-type shade of light anywhere in my living space. ugh.

Yeah, for like, reals! Like you wouldn't want them to mess with the shadowing on your "No Doubt" poster, srsly! Those NATURAL incandescent bulbs are, like, the only way to highlight Gwen's face!

kurtwhitener:

I know, I was a TFer for a year or so. I cancelled it recently. Guesses as to why?

The free market surrenders.

/Get the government out of my light socket

duskglow2000: But I think a different approach is needed. Don't outlaw the bulbs. Outlaw *selling* the bulbs. If all that's available are the CFL, then that's what most people will use. If you really want incandescent bulbs, order them online.

Very good point, with that I got nuffin else to say....

CFBs do save quite a bit, but there are several issues, including the fact that they don't work with dimmers, and they don't produce the right kind of light in many situations. I have replaced most (but not all) of the light bulbs in our house with CFBs.

Regardless, legislating this is absurd (I'd love to see what happens when their artist and movie friends have this start to impact their work, and ask for an exemption). If it's such a wonderful idea, there is no need to force people to do it. Simply stop subsidizing energy use, make people pay the true costs. If people are concerned, they'll find their own ways to reduce that cost.

I love it how politicians will give a speech biatching about excessive energy use on one day, then give another speech the next day biatching about how terrible high energy prices are. Can't have it both ways, folks. Just like anything else, if something is cheap you're not going to get people to use less of it.

I dunno. I've never seen a fluorescent bulb last 11+ years, as some bulbs in my home are currently doing. But the fluorescent bulbs are all right, I suppose.

eraser8, shhh, he bought the cheap wal-mart brand, don't tell him to buy the ones that are energy rated.

LEDs are going to change the whole idea too when they can get them to be more natural like.

******

Lights are 1/4 of my annual energy usage


I recently calculated this for a wind power course. In July I changed all 48 of my lightbulbs with compact fluorescents (CFs). Annually at $.04-.06 per kWhr my house uses between $377-$515

This is 1/4 of my total annual bill.

Thats quite a bit, and would be a lot more if they are incandescents

/not crazy
//energy conscious

Calvin Collidge:

Good point. People should be able to buy any light bulb they want, without interference from the government.

And all drugs should be legal too. Even heroin. After all, government regulation is EVIL.

And let's sell military grade machine guns to everyone with no waiting period! And bazookas! Hey, it's free market!

/Free market is an ideal. But it's not best for everything. Sometimes government has an interest in sticking its nose into things. This is one of those times.

I didn't think you could even use fluorescent bulbs with dimmer switches.

BTW, there are ones that work with dimmers, just have to make sure you buy the ones labeled as such.

I thought this was the one about banning electicity sales from out of state coal plants. Was hoping the commerce clause would finally be used for something close to the intention.

hint: jailing someone for 2 backyard marijuana plants that are neither "interstate" nor "commerce" is NOT the concern of the commerce clause.

Enforecment policy please?

How about they just give tax refunds or something for folks who buy them? Or better yet, just publicize them with PSA announcements?

And before anyone goes off on me, no I'm not equating incandescent light bulbs with heroin. I'm pointing out that the savings in energy, and therefore the reduction in electricity demand and greenhouse gasses, is a legitimate state interest, just like banning the really nasty drugs.

/legalize pot. Banning pot is just stupid.

God damn, that is stupid. A tiny fraction of a household's power usage goes to lighting. It's the TV's, computers, refrigerators, washers, dryers, and whatever other appliances that suck up the juice.

Sure, but replacing your fridge with a low-energy one is expensive. Putting in a CF bulb actually saves you money even if you weren't using less energy. Not to mention, saves your time spent replacing bulbs and going to the store for more. Every time an incandescent bulb burns out at my place, I replace it with a 7-year CF. Soon I'll have a house full of bulbs that I don't have to change for another 6-7 years.

The bulbs aren't just ugly. I wouldn't want that unnatural florescent office-type shade of light anywhere in my living space. ugh.

// hates it even more when the bulbs are buzzing

Uh, if you like the yellow-brown incandescent glow then you've just become accustomed to them. Fluorescent light is whiter, and actually closer to sunlight. Try turning on an outdoor incandescent during daytime and comparing it to a nice CF (not the cheapo Walmart ones). You'll see that the fluorescent is closer to daylight.

And no CF should buzz. Again, don't get the $1 one from Walmart. Home Depot is a great place to get quality ones.

None! They all have lighters!

/rehashed 'how many stoners...' joke
//off to rtfa

""KRSESQ writes: BULLSHAIT!!! I've tested dozens of these things over the years...

I call bullshiat on you. Many of the CFLs in my home are 26W. They are as bright as 100W incandescents. Maybe even a tad brighter. And the color is indistinguishable from incandescents.""

-----

Sorry, dude. I stand by my statement. In this very room I tried out a 40-watt CFI and the brightness and overall light quality were terrible. Switched back to a 75-watt incandescent and the room was brighter and the color warmer and generally more comfortable and pleasing to the eye.

CFIs have their place, certainly. But to mandate their use without regard to the environmental conditions is stupid and shortsighted.

I do have to say that living in a colder climate, I notice some differences between standard bulbs and CFBs. It usually takes an extra coupla seconds to get the CFB to come to FULL light. Often the color is a little whacked for the first minute. I put one in my porch light and noticed that when it got below 40degrees, it barely puts out any light....

rackrent
They do make a CFL in that shape and size, kinda pricey though.