He's going to crack under pressure. You can read it in him. It's just like when he choked against Tennessee in 2001 when they were one win away from the SEC title game and a shot at the national title. He lost the Heisman, lost the SEC East, and Spurrier quit Florida.

Rex will have to be as perfect as he can be, as well the Bears defense has to step up.

They had an exciting game last week, not a great game. That defense is going to have to step it up. Seattle's run, quarterbacking, and all-around offense is barely half of what New Orleans' is.

If they play like last week, there will be no overtime. Hell, if they play like last week, Drew Brees will be resting in the 4th quarter.

/Moved from Chicago to NOLA
//Bears and Saints fan
///I know, that's cheating

nuts to that
GEAUX SAINTS

2007-01-18 10:18:55 AM generaltimmy


When did the 10-6 Saints become the 80's 49ers?

Last week actually. These playoffs have featured 5 supposedly "premier" running backs (LT, Addai, Larry Johnson, Duece Mcallister and Reggie Bush)

Only two have actually performed as expected, McAllister and Bush; and only one, Bush literally took my breath away watching him run.

Did you see that game? Did you See the Nigh-supernnatural escapes he made? The plays where he got 9 yards even though all his holes collapsed?

You cannot beat a team with a marquee running back playing at the top of his game. Simple as that. If you want to stop him you have to stuff the box, which opens up the deep routes for the recivers. If you don't try to stop him, he'll grind out touchdown after touchdown 4.5 yards at a time.

Good to know he's not too distracted for this game. I'm glad he's paying attention.

SacriliciousBeerSwiller, YOU STOLE MY THUNDER.

I will, however, add that Bush is getting better as the season goes on, as well, so we're still waiting for him to get to his full potential.

and in the playoff games, Benson + Jones = 33 carries for 109 yards, for a 3.3 YPC average (against a Seattle defense that was not only missing its CBs to make it easier to pass, but also missing it's best run defender)

McAlister + Bush = 33 carries for 195 yards and a 5.9 YPC average. That's not even including the receiving yards (NO backs over CHI backs 42-30)

but now that the crappy sod has been brought up, wtf at that crap, both Sunday games were made worse by the shiatty field conditions due to new sod.

/btw, the Bears did a great job stopping the 75-80% Shaun Alexander. over 100 yards and 2 TD's, that's fantastic against a guy who ran for less than 70 yards on a similar amount of carries AT HOME against the Cowboys.

holy christ, you're seriously going to argue that Benson and Jones are better than McAlister and Bush, aren't you?

from SacriliciousBeerSwiller:
"So, just for rushing:
Deuce-Bush: 1622 yds
Jones-Benson: 1634 yds"

Hey, I'm on your side, but don't forget about the playoffs.
Bush/McAlister, over the whole season, average 4.21 YPC. Benson and Jones average 4.05 YPC (about 150 more overall yards). That's WITHOUT receiving yards being added to this information.

"And I also see you neglected the dreaded "fumbles" statistic."

oh noes, two more (lost) fumbles over 17 games! That means that they're horrible! Frank Gore had more fumbles than all of the RBs in question combined. And he won the rushing title, so he's not particularly horrible.

btw, and since Bush is a rookie, I feel that it's necessary to point out that all of his best games are within the last 6 games. the only bad one was the one against washington (the game against carolina doesn't count, 5 touches for a game is not going to result in a lot of yards)

Just counting his stats over the most recent six games, his numbers improve to: 4.54 yards per rush and 12.33 yards per reception, with 0 lost fumbles and 8 TDs. He's a lot better than his overall numbers.

/wait, maybe you're Charley Casserly...do you still wanna draft Mario Williams number one overall?
//seriously, he was the GM on TV getting interviewed about what he thought teams should do? who the hell thought up this one?

"Is it really backpeddling by asking you to keep the stats to what they did on the ground? Is it not honestly disingenuous to add stats for the pass when Benson is not on the field for pass down, let alone lining up as a receiver?"

Yes, it is perfectly fair if you're going to say that you'd rather have Benson/Jones as a RB combo than McAlister/Bush. And even at that, they're still not better. That would be like saying that you'd rather have some mediocre but slightly better cornerback than Hester on your team, completely ignoring the other things that Hester does to help your team win.

Besides, the only argument the Bears RBs win is fumbles. they lose yards per carry, they lose TDs, they lose when you throw in receiving...what else are they supposed to argue? name me an honest person who would actually prefer to have Thomas Jones and Cedric Benson over Deuce McAlister and Reggie Bush, and I'll show you a moron who would be fired from his GM job in a day.

/unless he were Matt Millen, wtf

"You're right, the Bears RBs have less fumbles. 5 to 1. "

well the only ones that really matter are LOST fumbles, so the number is 3 to 1.

And SBS, I know you were agreeing with me, I was just using your statistics and telling you that you should throw in the postseason yardage too.


"Who even cares about this game? The Super Bowl starts a little after 6 on Sunday.

I guess one of you will get a banner, so that will be nice to hang at home."

Just like the ALCS was the World Series and the Western Conference Finals were the NBA Championship Series? ;)

"oh noes, two more (lost) fumbles over 17 games! That means that they're horrible! Frank Gore had more fumbles than all of the RBs in question combined. And he won the rushing title, so he's not particularly horrible."

To correct myself: Frank Gore obviously did not win the rushing title. He had the most in the NFC. I forgot when I was looking at the page that I had it set to NFC instead of NFL. BTW, as for the 'fumbleitis' Bush has, he's not even in the top 50 for most fumbles this year. (although the 100% recovery rate by the opposing team during the regular season means he's tied for 12th in lost fumbles, which could be the reason it seems like he loses a lot of them)

Hey Aquig, does the station you're at have any online streams? I'd like to check out your show.

/Scottsdale

murp0837:
Look at the stats. Benson and Jones are clearly better. They're tougher, stronger, and more durable.


Since I started this pissing match I'm jumping back in to state that that assertion is flat out absurd. Statistics are a meaningless way to measure the greatness of a running back, because they are too heavily dependent on the quality of the O-Line and the Playcalling of the offesnsive coordinator.

IF statistics mean anything you'd have to believe that Denver just happened to have signed three of the all time great running backs, one after another in the 90's. You'd also believe that Timmy Smith (who I'll lay money you've never heard of ) was one of the best RB's of all time because he holds the NFL record for Rushing yards in a Superbowl at 204. In fact, he was merely the back du Jour that happened to be behind an O line that should have been inducted into the Hall of fame en masse (the 1987 Hogs)


The only way judge true greatness in a running back is to watch them move; watch them make something out of nothing, to find holes even the Camera can't see. By that standard Walter Payton is still the greatest of all time , with Barry Sanders getting second place because he wimped out and walked away. Also by that standard Reggie Bush is something very special. More than once in the Eagles game I saw the Eagles defenders perfectly read NO's running play and put their defenders in exactly the right place to drop him for a loss. However because of Bush's vision, decision-making ,and footspeed he turned -3 yards into +5.


THAT is greatness in an RB and That wins championship games.


/oh and RB did LITERALLY take my breath away as I was drinking a beer when he busted a move that made me gasp and therefore inhale my lager. It was quite a few minutes before I could stop coughing and breathe normally again....so there

"Now, we recognize that they play near identical roles out of the backfield and don't have better numbers. Still, no one talks about them. We even have someone coming into the thread to talk about how much greater Mc/Bush is, although the carry stats don't really tell that story (especially when you figure that he thinks 4.05 > 4.09). Hmm... that sounds like the very definition of "underrated.""

except it's 4.25 to 4.09 and that's without factoring in the receiving/punt returning.

this is in response to the idiocy of the statements: "Finally, I will take the Jones/Benson duo over the McAllister/Bush duo any day. Chicago will shut McBush down this week.". and "I live in Baton Rouge, LA and grew up in Buffalo. How am I a homer? Look at the stats. Benson and Jones are clearly better. They're tougher, stronger, and more durable."

Not yours, that the Chicago two are underrated. They're solid but not spectacular at anything. So of course no one's going to pay attention to them. They're not really a game-changing force the way Grossman is, since he goes from fantastic to complete shiat.

"And between the Bears and Saints, who had more wins over teams with WINNING records this year? Oh that's right. "Feel good story" so no one wants to talk about that."

Just so you know...the answer to your question is neither. The Bears beat only the Seahawks and Jets, while the Saints beat only the Eagles and Cowboys.

/for the record, I hope the Bears lose but Grossman does well so they can't blame everything on him.

The Jones/Benson combo carried the ball nearly 500 times during the regular season and fumbled once. Up until Jones fumbled the ball, he had the longest active streak of carries without a fumble for the entire NFL. This is also ignoring Peterson. All three of the Bears' RBs have had 100-yard, 1-TD games. Jones is an excellent pass-blocker, and he doesn't make stupid mistakes. Did everyone see his 4th quarter save to prevent the interception last week against the Seahawks? Now think of how many times Reggie Bush has nearly cost hist team the game by getting a case of the fumblerooskies. Hell, do you even remember when he fumbled the ball all by himself because he tard-arms that shiat?. Bush also doesn't fare too well on the grass. Jones and Benson are the better backs because of their physical play and they way they complement each other. When they put Benson in, they're assuming run because he's not a very good pass-blocker. This gives Grossman some more opportunities. And, like someone said earlier, we haven't even brought up Peterson. Reggie Bush won't be able to do those crazy reverse runs because of the Bears' linebackers. They're too fast. I also someone mentioning that the coldest game the Saints played this year was 52 degrees. It will be below freezing on Sunday, with wind and possible snow.

Everyone wants to talk about how great their team is, but nobody wants to talk about the matchup (where, when, why, and how). In this matchup, I think the Bears have a slight edge, and take it in overtime.

/this is not talking smack, and I haven't seen The NaSkAr here so stop biatching about it.

07-01-18 02:26:37 PM halfof33


The only thing that is absurd is comparing the stats of two positions to one position. Are seriously think you Saints fanboys do not know the first farking thing about football.

sorry Hoss, I'm a Redskins fan and have bled Burgundy and Gold since the cradle. I rather enjoyed the fact that one of RB"s few bad games game at the hands of my boys. As to Sundays game, if anything I have a slight soft spot for Chicago as I lived there for three years not too long ago.

That said, I know what I saw last Sunday, and Bush is good and barring injuries he will be a legend in this league. 5 years from now the Chi-town duo will be just one more set of "pretty good" backs that only hometown fans wil be able to pick out of line up.

Magorn: 5 years from now the Chi-town duo will be just one more set of "pretty good" backs that only hometown fans wil be able to pick out of line up.

I don't know about that. Jones might be traded away in a few years, but Benson was the 4th overall pick two years ago. In the last few games he has looked like a different running back. He's always been good outside, but lately he has been bruising it up the middle and getting 3, 4, 5 or more yards after initial contact. If he starts blocking then in one or two years he might be in the pro bowl with Reggie Bush someday.

GimpyNip: Face it, after Sunday, it is NFC-U-Later!

Pretty confident considering that the two AFC teams playing this Sunday got to where they were by facing opponents last week who played the worst games of their season (McNair for the Ravens, and Marty for the Chargers). If Brady throws three picks against the Bears or the Saints in the Superbowl, the Patriots will lose. Same goes for Manning and the Colts.

GimpyNip: Fark It

The Chargers & Ravens played bad football because the teams they were playing made them look bad. It is the playoffs. Excuses are for losers

Are you trying to tell me that Tom Brady or Peyton Manning didn't have bad games? You're right, excuses are for losers, but the Chargers should have won that game. They were beating the Pats until the 4th quarter. And don't get me started on Manning, he has one TD and 5 INTs this postseaston, and his defense is bailing him out. When you look at what the Pats and Colts have done in the postseason, you can't say that they are clearly the favorite for the Superbowl.

Pats > Bears

The Pats did not roll the Bears. The Bears forced New England into five turnovers at Foxboro, including a fumble in the closing minutes to set up a game-winning drive, which Grossman promptly threw away by airing it out downfield into the hands of a Patriots' DB.

GimpyNip: Tom Brady & Manning are not their entire teams. They should have lost? How should they have lost? What does that even mean? Does it mean that every football play matters? I like how you make the same excuse for the Bears losing to the Pats, "Grossman threw it away". What a bunch of what ifs. Start planning more for Feb. 4th...that is, if you can beat the Saints.

Well, Grossman did throw it away. The offense produced five turnovers (missed a FG too) and New England, at home, only scored 17 points. It was a winnable game, you can't say New England dominated the Bears or "rolled" them. As for the Chargers game, Coach Marty did his best to throw that game. The early try for 4th and 11, the retarded challenge late in the game that cost his team a timeout, the retarded 15-yard penalty, the retarded decision to intercept a pass on 4th down and then fumble it to give New England a 1st down.

The Chargers and Bears played like shiat against New England, and New England barely won.

GimpyNip: Fark It The Chargers and Bears played like shiat against New England, and New England barely won.

Just use you last argument and justify your win against the Seahawks with it. Umm kay.

The Bears didn't commit 5 turnovers. Hasselbeck didn't juke Brian Urlacher to set up the game winner. Rex Grossman didn't blow a chance to win the game. The Seahawks played a better game of football than the Patriots did, and the Bears won this time. Gould also made his two field goals, instead of missing them.

GimpyNip: As if any selfrespecting Asian woman would bed a man like that.

GimpyNip: Fark It

Huh? So you are saying that because Brady "juked" your overrated Paris Hilton farking LB that the Pats didn't exactly earn their victory?

I apologize. I was under the impression that you knew something about the game of football.

/Quit sniffing Joe Namath's depends, it's farking with your brain.

"The Jones/Benson combo carried the ball nearly 500 times during the regular season and fumbled once. Up until Jones fumbled the ball, he had the longest active streak of carries without a fumble for the entire NFL. This is also ignoring Peterson. All three of the Bears' RBs have had 100-yard, 1-TD games. Jones is an excellent pass-blocker, and he doesn't make stupid mistakes. Did everyone see his 4th quarter save to prevent the interception last week against the Seahawks? Now think of how many times Reggie Bush has nearly cost hist team the game by getting a case of the fumblerooskies. Hell, do you even remember when he fumbled the ball all by himself because he tard-arms that shiat?. Bush also doesn't fare too well on the grass. Jones and Benson are the better backs because of their physical play and they way they complement each other. When they put Benson in, they're assuming run because he's not a very good pass-blocker. This gives Grossman some more opportunities. And, like someone said earlier, we haven't even brought up Peterson. Reggie Bush won't be able to do those crazy reverse runs because of the Bears' linebackers. They're too fast. I also someone mentioning that the coldest game the Saints played this year was 52 degrees. It will be below freezing on Sunday, with wind and possible snow. "

Yup, professional athletes suddenly lose their skills when it's cold out!

and chicago has two mediocre running backs and a third less than mediocre one. the Saints have one fantastic one who is coming back from an injury this year, and another fantastic one who is on the rise. the Saints, by far, have a better backfield.

The Bears, I would say, have the better overall team, though. But I want the Saints to win.

oh, and let's not call two former top 10 picks 'underrated'. Jones has to earn his rating back for sucking for so many years and Benson has to earn some rating for crying when he was drafted then holding out to the point that the Bears actually held onto Jones.

IAmRight: Yup, professional athletes suddenly lose their skills when it's cold out!

Look at the numbers. Reggie Bush doesn't do as well on the grass as he does on turf. He also fumbles. Saying Reggie Bush won't have as good of a game against the Bears as he would normally in a dome /= Reggie Bush has no skills.

and chicago has two mediocre running backs

You don't get it do you? The Bears running backs fit very well into their offensive scheme, and do what they need to do. Thomas Jones is the best pass-blocking running back in the league, and Cedric Benson is quickly starting to get respect in Chicago after whining like a biatch in training camp. You call them mediocre because the Bears are a good enough team to not need their backs to carry them to victories. The defense and special teams gave the Bears a lot of short fields, in addition to points. Don't believe me? Look at Jones' numbers against the Seahawks. He had less than 70 yards, but 2 touchdowns. There were few games this season where the Bears needed a Tiki Barber-esque performance from their backs in order to win.

They are not mediocre, and they're well-rested.

another Bears greenlight, I am king.

"Thomas Jones is the best pass-blocking running back in the league"

which is a completely subjective opinion based on nothing but your love for the Bears.

"Reggie Bush doesn't do as well on the grass as he does on turf. He also fumbles. Saying Reggie Bush won't have as good of a game against the Bears as he would normally in a dome /= Reggie Bush has no skills."

True, but taking numbers from earlier in the season doesn't really translate for a guy who has most of his production for the season taking place in the past six games. And fumbling 3 times in a season is not exactly butterfingers. There is no real evidence to support your claim that he would do better in a dome.

"He had less than 70 yards, but 2 touchdowns."

so 3 yards a carry is more than mediocre? I remember a game where Bettis had 5 rushes for 1 yard and 3 TDs. Doesn't mean he was a good RB that game. goal line carries usually = TD's. Benson and Jones are adequate and fit their system but are mediocre backs. If you want to say that they're being held back because the Bears don't need them to make big runs, please refer to Thomas Jones' pre-Bears career.

IAmRight: so 3 yards a carry is more than mediocre? I remember a game where Bettis had 5 rushes for 1 yard and 3 TDs. Doesn't mean he was a good RB that game. goal line carries usually = TD's. Benson and Jones are adequate and fit their system but are mediocre backs. If you want to say that they're being held back because the Bears don't need them to make big runs, please refer to Thomas Jones' pre-Bears career.

Except they weren't goal line carries. His two touchdowns were from 7 and 9 yards. They used Jones to establish early, and again in the second quarter when they got close. Maybe calling him the best pass-blocking RB is a stretch, but he's pretty good, and his blocking is one of the reasons the Bears held onto him.

ESPN experts - unanimously predict the Saints (1 vote outstanding)

ESPN computer - Bears

/their predictions blew last week, as I recall, particularly on the Chargers-Patriots game

"/their predictions blew last week, as I recall, particularly on the Chargers-Patriots game"

Then again, didn't they get both the NFC games right?

"They are not mediocre, and they're well-rested. "

And they had more carries than the Saints' RBs. They had an equal number of carries in the games last week. So don't act like the Saints had more yards because they had more carries, because Jones had the exact same amount as McAllister and Benson had the exact same amount as Bush.

"Maybe folks here are pissed off at the Bears about all the hype they received early in the season. Why aren't you now pissed off at the Saints for all the hype they get now? They have become the new "It" team the media talking heads hype. Bears fans aren't hyping their team now. As someone wrote earlier, most Bears fans are hopeful, but expecting disaster."

I don't hate the Bears, I'm just pointing out that the Bears RBs are not "underrated", they're merely "adequate" and at this point are disappointments because they were both top 10 picks. I already said I think the Bears have the overall better team.

And I also have to deal with two people who are Bears fans and will annoy the hell out of me if they win: My best friend, who will kind of annoy me, but not that much; and someone that I really don't like at work for other reasons, but is another obnoxious Bears fan. So I really don't want them to win...although if it's them against the Patriots I'm going for the Bears.