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(Reuters)   Radio host Jerry Klein staged a hoax on the air and suggested that all Muslims in the United States should be identified with a crescent-shape tattoo or a distinctive arm band. Many xenophobes called in and actually agreed with his statement   (today.reuters.com) divider line 572
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9584 clicks; posted to Main » on 02 Dec 2006 at 5:57 PM (7 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2006-12-03 01:41:58 AM
O RLY?

Whaa, more people have died on the streets of my city in the past five years from traffic accidents than terrorism.

Ooo, scary!

Big deal. It was a criminal, terrorist act. It was nothing to send America into a panic.
 
2006-12-03 01:43:42 AM
What's wrong, submitter? Was the img.fark.com busy or something?

/This comment is probably late
//Sorry if it is
///But gimme a break...I'm horny
 
2006-12-03 01:44:18 AM
"Mohammed decided it was important to put into writing."

Actually, this is untrue, you see, the Koran originally wasn't put into word, nor did Mohammed come up with all these teachings at the same time. At first, Mohammed brought forth his teachings orally, and his devote servants would memorize those words perfectly and spread them to the masses, this continued for years as Mohammed was given further instruction from Allah to give to the people. Up until Mohammed's death, the people realized that there needed to be a better way to preserve the teachings he gave, so all the men that had memorized his sayings came together and thus put it all to paper, and the Koran was born.

"Majority-Islam theology was preaching religious tolerance and acceptance of other faiths...which it continues to do today."

This is actually accurate, and the best example would be the Ottoman Empire that ruled the Arab world from the 13th century until after World War I. The Ottoman Turks did treat Christians and Jews as people, not "infidels" in fact, its described in the Koran that you should treat "The People of the Book" with respect, (As large portions of the Koran are not only Mohammed's teachings, but the Old and New Testament, as well as Christian Texts that didn't make it into the Bible. The Koran mentions the Virgin Mary more times than the Bible does, for example.) and Christians and Jews played a major role in Empire's Administrative Structure. Not only that, but Jews and Christians lived in their own communities, governed themselves, made their own laws, and made their own taxes (with the Turks getting a portion.) Hell, one Sultan of the Ottomans eventually took a christian wife, and no, he didn't force her to convert, and paid respect to her beliefs.

The Turkish Empire was very liberal and forward thinking towards its subjects up until the early 1600's, when the Ottomans failed to take Vienna for a second time. The failed invasion would mark a steady decline of the Empire for the next 3 centuries, made only worse that its Economy tanked thanks to discovery of the New World and the riches it brought the European Powers. As the empire's power waned, brought by lack of advance in technology, huge unemployment, and a myriad of other woes (it's nickname by the West was "The Old Infirm Man of Europe) you began to see a rise in fundamentalism, as people who lost everything, turned to the one thing that was thought stable, Islam. Many people believed that they had fallen away from Allah's teachings and were being punished for it, thus you see strict adherence to the Koran.
 
2006-12-03 01:45:22 AM
ThrobblefootSpectre, your troll-fu is not strong.
 
2006-12-03 02:07:56 AM
Cocheeze
We each have our boogeyman.

But that's the thing, we don't. Climate change is a reality, the evidence for it is undeniable and there is essentially no scientific debate about its existence. The effects, perhaps, but there is even rather universal agreement on that, at least the effects we're likely to see in the near future if we continue pumping greenhouse gasses out apace. That is not a boogeyman, that is a recognition of simple cause and effect with potentially devastating consequences.

In comparison, calling Al Qaeda a "threat to mankind" is obvious hyperbole. What are they capable of? Not very much. What are their aims? Decidedly not global destruction. During the time in which they enjoyed open allies among the world's governments, what is the best they could do? Hijack some planes and knock down a couple of buildings. A single World War II era B52 could do inordinately more damage.

beoweasel: Deliciously informative post.
 
2006-12-03 02:22:56 AM
All callers were Republicans
 
2006-12-03 02:28:51 AM
SchlingFo: People in large groups get very dumb and very dangerous when they get scared.

I keep getting this vision of Islamic fundies taunting a dynamite monkey. (Which doesn't say much for the intelligence of either side.)

I reckon Tatsuma's right when he says that Europe is the place to watch; small countries with a large degree of autonomy = more chance for extremism. Hopefully the EU will do its job and keep things in check.
 
2006-12-03 02:29:12 AM
Weaver95

The Pope even pointed it out to them, and the politically correct slammed him for being 'intolerant'.

I'm sorry, are you implying that angry working-class religious fundamentalists make up the "politically correct"?????

Cuz last I heard, most people within the US understood the context of those comments.
 
2006-12-03 02:46:37 AM
Somehow I can recognize them:

i13.tinypic.com
 
2006-12-03 02:49:10 AM
mrexcess Meh, climate change: it's been happening since before humans inhabited the Earth.
 
2006-12-03 02:54:04 AM
Cerebral Ballsy writes: climate change: it's been happening since before humans inhabited the Earth.

And you figure this is relevant how?

Forest fires have been happening before humans inhabited the earth too. Does that mean that people can't start forest fires?
 
2006-12-03 02:58:21 AM
Also for all of you who seem to be very open minded toward Islam:

1. There are women in Africa who suffer genital mutilation in the name of Islam.
2. There are women in Saudi Arabia who cannot drive or hold jobs because of strict Islamic law.
3. There are girls in Afganistan who are being terrorized because they are not allowed to attend school.
4. There are Christians in jail in Iran for practicing their religion against Islamic law.
5. There are women in the United States and England who are held under very tight rule in these "free" countries by their Muslim parents. One of my former bosses told me he does not allow his daughter to date unsupervised. Later I found out she is 25 years old! A friend from England ran away from her family. As a midget, she was abused by her Muslim mother for being different, and although she is 30 years old, was imprisoned in her home. She no longer contacts them.


Islam is a very scary religion.
 
2006-12-03 03:04:19 AM
eraser8 no, it just means we haven't had as much impact as people like to think. The Earth has been going through climate changes for eons. No one blames the Ice Age on humans, do they?

I've also seen numbers of greenhouse gases released by the ocean dwarfing the amount of gases released by humans. There are two sides (or more) to every story. I haven't seen Mr. Gore's movie, but I'm betting it's a little overdramatic.
 
2006-12-03 03:05:55 AM
eraser8 Humans start a very small percentage of forest fires as well. Most are started by lightning.
 
2006-12-03 03:08:29 AM
Before everyone jumps on me: The muslims I know are very nice people, it's the religion I find scary.

Scarier than christianity, I mean. Which already scares me enough.
 
2006-12-03 03:11:46 AM
Cerebral Ballsy writes: Humans start a very small percentage of forest fires as well.

Thank you for pointing out the essence of my argument...and the reason your rationalization is so ridiculous.

Forest fires don't need a man or matches. They can start quite naturally.

But the fact that many fires are natural doesn't mean that man-made forest fires can't be disastrously destructive. Likewise, the fact that climate changes have occurred without human input doesn't meant that man-made climate changes can't be disastrously destructive.
 
2006-12-03 03:20:09 AM
eraser8 So what's your point? All I said was meh. MEH. I don't care about climate change, it's been happening for eons, and it will continue long after the human race goes extinct. So f*cking meh!

And meh on forest fires as well. Who cares? I'm not worrying about it. I'm not protesting in the street over it. I'm not sending any soldiers to combat it. That's my point!
 
2006-12-03 03:33:19 AM
Cerebral Ballsy asks: So what's your point?

My point is that your argument is ridiculous.

The fact that climate change has happened before and will happen again makes NO DIFFERENCE to the fact that humans are currently affecting the earth's climate. It makes no difference to the fact that these human-induced climate changes may be disastrous.

If your point were at all valid, we should expect arsonists charged with murder to get off unpunished. In fact, we should expect the law to ignore human arsonists altogether on the basis that forest fires have "been happening for eons, and...will continue long after the human race goes extinct."

Raymond Lee Oyler might appreciate your point of view. But I think Mark Loutzenhiser, Jason McKay, Jess McLean, Daniel Hoover-Najera, Pablo Cerda and all their friends and families might disagree.
 
2006-12-03 04:07:56 AM
capecodcarl: The issue is that Islam is roughly 700 years behind Christianity on the evolutionary scale of religions.

I love the idea that religions have an evolutionary scale.
 
2006-12-03 04:10:34 AM
I think the 3 words are: Don't trust arabs.
/Especially the ones running the cash register at the liquor store.
 
2006-12-03 04:15:53 AM
eraser8 My point is: the human impact is minimal at best. And there's very little that can be done.

The fact that the earth has gone through climate change before we were here ought to be a clue to you, but I guess it was not.

So: meh. And it makes very little difference in the world. People are still living, starving, screwing, eating, reproducing, and they will continue to do so no matter how many liberals scream about the climate change. Sure I'll recycle, sure I'll move closer to work and use less gas. But for every conscious American family, there's a factory in some third world country pumping out toxins and they don't give a crap about it.
 
2006-12-03 04:17:00 AM
eraser8
If your point were at all valid, we should expect arsonists charged with murder to get off unpunished. In fact, we should expect the law to ignore human arsonists altogether on the basis that forest fires have "been happening for eons, and...will continue long after the human race goes extinct."

Fantastic point made fantastically, I was trying to come up with a way to say exactly that. The whole argument makes no sense: certain forms of climate change do happen naturally, therefor all climate change is natural and out of the influence of humans? Huh?!? Even if the current climate change had purely natural causes (and scientists agree that it doesn't -- our greenhouse gas pollution is trapping heat), that wouldn't mean it wasn't a danger to be addressed anyway, not when the potential consequences are so high. Viruses are natural phenomena, but when they threaten our lives and livelihoods, we'd best start coming up with solutions anyway.
 
2006-12-03 04:21:37 AM
Yes. The sky is falling.
 
2006-12-03 04:25:36 AM
Cerebral Ballsy
The fact that the earth has gone through climate change before we were here ought to be a clue to you

A clue about what? Not all climate change is natural, and even some that is natural can be dangerous. We need to mitigate the risks from those kinds of dangers, regardless of where they come from.

And as for humanity surviving "anything"...it ought to be pretty obvious that we can't. We need specific conditions in which to live and thrive, and if you think your existence is independent of that of Russian farmers or London bankers, you are mistaken. A global economy means an economy vulnerable to disturbance anywhere on that globe. And if climate change worsens living conditions, especially in powerful industrialized nations, the consequences of the ensuing desperation could very well be the kind of wars over resources that by themselves put humanity in great peril.

People are still living, starving, screwing, eating, reproducing, and they will continue to do so no matter how many liberals scream about the climate change.

The danger isn't from liberal screaming, it is from mass starvation, homelessness, and wrecked cities and infrastructure that could easily result from climate change in the short term. The long term effects are harder to fathom, but certainly no prettier.

But for every conscious American family, there's a factory in some third world country pumping out toxins and they don't give a crap about it.

So? Just throw up our hands and say the hell with it, regardless of the potential consequences to the entire planet? I think that would be rather unwise of us, especially when we essentially began the industrialization cycle that's responsible for the effects. Burying your head in the sand or throwing your hands up in defeat isn't going to do a damn thing to stop the ice caps from melting. We need global cooperation to follow the global spread of our technology, or we really are headed for disaster.
 
2006-12-03 04:26:55 AM
I'm not saying *we* should ignore arsonists, only that *I* don't give a sh*t. Because it's not my job. I'm not a cop. I'm an artist, and I've got things to do besides worry about forest fires. There's nothing I can do to prevent them because: 1. I don't start them(!) 2. I'm not there when they start otherwise.

So once again, MEH. Who cares?
 
2006-12-03 04:27:43 AM
Cerebral Ballsy
Yes. The sky is falling.

I've said it before: real satire is more than a strawman said with a smirk. Nobody is saying the sky is falling...what the experts are telling us is that the world is getting hotter, it's because of our greenhouse gas levels, and there will be wide-ranging global consequences if nothing is done about the situation.
 
2006-12-03 04:28:59 AM
Cerebral Ballsy writes: the human impact is minimal at best. And there's very little that can be done.

First, what are you basing that on?

Second, there are lots of areas in which human impact is minimal (in terms of percentages) but is substantial (in terms of how changes in the system impact ultimate functionality and health). A finely balanced bank vault door weighs several tons. Because of that, one wouldn't think that a few pounds added or subtracted would make a difference in the hang of the door...but one would be wrong. Because there is equilibrium, a slight change in weight translates into substantial change in operation.

The fact that the earth has gone through climate change before we were here ought to be a clue to you...

What ought to be a clue to you is that your argument has NO MERIT! I ask again: does the fact that forest fires have occurred throughout the earth's history, without human influence, change the fact that humans can set off rather significant and spectacularly destructive fires themselves?

The fact that you continue to run back to the same ridiculous and outrageously inept argument doesn't speak favorably on your ability to deal with the issue logically.

it makes very little difference in the world.

Again, I have to ask the basis for this judgment. And, again, I have to caution that the existence of prior natural variations is NOT a reasonable or rational answer to my question.

for every conscious American family, there's a factory in some third world country...

What's your point? How do you figure that's relevant?
 
2006-12-03 04:30:22 AM
Cerebral Ballsy
Because it's not my job. I'm not a cop.

But you ARE a resident of the same planet where this problem is occuring, and moreover you are a citizen of a democratic nation. So the comparison is not apt, you do not have the responsibilities of a police officer, but you do have responsibilities as a citizen of the US and the world. One of which, it would seem to me, would be ensuring that threats to the US and the world receive the attention they are due.

You're an artist, not a DHS employee, but you still worry about terrorists, right?
 
2006-12-03 04:30:40 AM
mr excess There's not a goddamn thing you can do to stop the polar ice caps from melting. Sorry.

I mean, what are your plans? March on Washington? Eat less styrofoam-packaged food? Ride your bike? What?

Are you serious?


I sure hope I'm wrong. Maybe someday we will change the world and make it rainbow-land. Let me know when we overcome religion. I can't wait for that scourge to be ended.
 
2006-12-03 04:34:04 AM
No, I don't worry about terrorists. There was a short time after 9-11 that I did but I no longer do.

My second post listed the things about Islam that worry me; and they have nothing to do with terrorism. We're much more likely to die in a car accident; do you worry about that day-to-day? No... then why would you worry about terrorism?

There are enough things to stress me out in my daily life to worry about things that have not yet come to pass, or things that may never come to pass.
 
2006-12-03 04:37:30 AM
Cerebral Ballsy
There's not a goddamn thing you can do to stop the polar ice caps from melting. Sorry.

With that attitude of defeatism, certainly not.

I mean, what are your plans?

Advocating policy reform, increased regulation of greenhouse gas emissions, and worldwide pollution standards backed by funding from the world's industrialized governments to ensure that even poor nations have access to the best tools and technologies available to help us avert such a disaster. Fighting the deliberate disinformation campaigns being mounted in the arena of public opinion by polluters like the oil companies, who have a vested interest in keeping the populace ignorant of the threat. I have every confidence that a mobilized public will find solutions to melting polar ice caps. The polluters know it too, that's why they spend so much money on disinformation and lobbying to ensure we never acquire that knowledge.

Maybe someday we will change the world and make it rainbow-land.

Rainbow land would be nice, but I'll settle for a world where folks are informed and able to make sound decisions...I think if you clear that hurdle, you've already gone at least half way in solving the climate change problem. And solving that problem is itself a potential bridge to further, deeper cooperation between cultures that currently find themselves at odds.
 
2006-12-03 04:39:08 AM
Cerebral Ballsy, one more point you seem to have missed:

The central point of your argument is also one of its greatest weaknesses.

Of course there have been variations in climate throughout earth's history. But, as you point out, for many of these changes, humanity was absent. That means those changes didn't threaten an existing human civilization.

We're not absent now. We're here. And we're in danger. And we can do something about it. "Knowing these realities, America must not ignore the threat gathering against us. Facing clear evidence of peril, we cannot wait for the final proof -- the smoking gun -- that could come in the form" of a mass famine or mass flooding or extinction of vulnerable species.
 
2006-12-03 04:41:33 AM
Cerebral Ballsy
No, I don't worry about terrorists.

Maybe I got confused, what with all the talk from you about them being a "threat to all of mankind" and the like. Heh.

We're much more likely to die in a car accident; do you worry about that day-to-day?

When it's prudent, sure I do. That's why I use my mirrors and turn signals, drive defensively, keep situational awareness at all times on the road, etcetera. I certainly don't get in my car and feel invulnerable, or just as bad, helpless. I recognize that there's a real threat and I take every step that seems prudent to mitigate the risk. That's precisely what I'm advocating we do about terrorism, and about climate change.
 
2006-12-03 04:47:32 AM
mrexcess

Here's what I've noticed about the world in my short time here:

1. Politicians talk much, do little.
2. The money is not in cleaning up (the fallacy of recycling).
3. Corporations will wait till your back is turned, then sweep things under the rug. (i.e. drums of waste dumped in the woods).
4. There is no corporate or political motivation or money to force poor countries to abide by clean emissions standards. When the liberal hubbub dies down, these conservative corporate guys will go back to business as usual.
5. The world has been on the brink of social and environmental disaster for thousands of years. There is no end to the people shouting about it.
6. Given the choice between informed decisions and blissful ignorance, most people will choose ignorance.
7. I get grumpy when I'm tired.
 
2006-12-03 04:50:43 AM
Cerebral Ballsy: A lot of your observations are accurate. I question 5, and to some degree 6, but the rest I think are pretty accurate.

However, I don't think you're carrying these things to their logical conclusion, due to a nasty infection of defeatism. Politicians do talk much and do little, when nobody is paying attention. But there is a solution to that, it isn't a hopelessly incurable plague, it isn't simply "the human condition"! And the same goes for all the rest. You've gone half-way, you've identified problems. Now comes phase 2: devise solutions.
 
2006-12-03 04:50:45 AM
On the topic of Christian bashing v. Muslim bashing, talked about earlier in the thread-

Most atheists on the site (and for the record, I'm making a conjecture here; I'm Christian myself) think Christians are stupid for believing in a god.

Said atheists would also think Muslims are stupid for believing in a god.

Said atheists would not think Muslims are inherently evil, or are all terrorists. Just as they don't think all Christians will attack abortion clinics.

This story is scary, though- this would essentially be like 39% of Democrats saying that Republicans should be forced to wear red sweaters, identifying them as "evil liberal-haters". I would hope that Americans wouldn't be that stupid. And stories like this show me that I'm clearly wrong.
 
2006-12-03 04:51:33 AM
when nobody is paying attention

Or, perhaps more accurately, when they are paying attention to the wrong things.
 
2006-12-03 04:52:14 AM
Mrexcess I said "threat to all mankind?".. scanning.. nope. I never said that..
 
2006-12-03 04:53:43 AM
ral315: I would hope that Americans wouldn't be that stupid.

I've learned -- sometimes the hard way -- not to underestimate human stupidity.

It seems like you're learning the same lessons.
 
2006-12-03 04:55:03 AM
I said Islam is a scary religion and I listed the reasons why it's scary. And *not* on the list: terrorism.
 
2006-12-03 05:00:09 AM
Did this turn into a global warming thread for a little bit? Arsonists, forest fires... As you were...
 
2006-12-03 05:09:24 AM
mrexcess Devise solutions! I told you, I moved only a few miles from work!

Any more solution-devising would tax my lil' artist brain.

Ok ok. Here's a solution: we buy out poor countries one at a time. Instead of letting American corporations use them as slave mills and waste dumping grounds, we develop them! We invest in them, completely. We pour millions into the education and care for them, and in one generation when they pump out educated, healthy, productive adults, we get our money back via taxes. It's large-scale renewal!

Here's another: How about we stop treating other countries as small businesses ready for hostile takeover? How about we make mutually beneficial agreements that serve us both in the long run instead of them in the short run and us in the long run?

Here's another: How about we reign in the power that corporations have usurped from the American voter? How about we prosecute them for corruption and bribery to government officials? This one's important.. this is the biggest problem facing America today. It's an underlying issue that is stopping us from moving forward to fix so many other problems.
 
2006-12-03 05:34:09 AM
Verm:
The threat of radical Islam? What a sack of utter shiate your story was.

How many Carrier groups does radical Islam have?
How many Armored divisions does radical Islam have?
How many Squadrons of airplanes does radical Islam have?
How many Airbourne Divisions does radical Islam have?
How many nukes does radical Islam have?

How does "Radical Islams" arms spending compare with the Wests arms Spending?

lets take a look
China$65 billion
Russia$50 billion
France$46.5 billion
Japan$44.7 billion
Germany$38.8 billion
United Kingdom$31.7 billion
Korea, South$20.82 billion
Italy$20.2 billion
Saudi Arabia$18.3 billion
India$17.38 billion
Brazil$13.408 billion
Iran$9.7 billion
Australia$9.3 billion
Israel$8.97 billion
Spain$8.6 billion
Taiwan$8,041.2 million
Turkey$8.1 billion
Canada$7,860.5 million
Netherlands$6.5 billion
Greece$6.12 billion

That list is leaving out he US which sends more that the combined total of the others.
 
2006-12-03 08:27:47 AM
This thread sucks.

For all the people claiming that this is is not a step on the road to facism, just compare the political climate today with that of 6 years ago... America and europe have come A LONG WAY towards a situation that would enable facism and still people are sitting back and finding ways to argue instead of finding solutions.

The media bombards us with divisive issues, designed to fark up the fabric of society... with right wing nutcases demanding that the jews, oops, i mean muslims be imprisoned and left wing nutcases demanding that they be protected... before you know it, there is a 3 way war going on between the american left, american right and the poor muslim contingent who probably just want to be left alone.

The leaders of this world WANT us to fight amongst ourselves, so that we don't turn our attention on how *they are shafting all of us*, white or black, muslim or christian or jew or atheist. This is exactly what they want, DIVIDE AND CONQUER.

Stupid humans fall for it every time.
 
2006-12-03 09:47:20 AM
capecodcarl: Europe in the Middle Ages looked much like the Middle East does today


Actuall, it looked much worse.

Come to think of it, Europe in 1944 looked much worse.

Uh, OK, 1996 in the Balkans looked much worse too.
 
2006-12-03 09:53:54 AM
2006-12-03 08:27:47 AM epoc_tnac

...
The leaders of this world WANT us to fight amongst ourselves, so that we don't turn our attention on how *they are shafting all of us*, white or black, muslim or christian or jew or atheist. This is exactly what they want, DIVIDE AND CONQUER.



Great another person who does not understand power and success. Powerful people do not cooperate with all the other powerful people. Why? 'Cause they are powerful and don't have to. So your blaming some global conspiracy is just making an excuse for a real problem.

/One of the joys of success is saying no. No I don't have to do what my current boss says. No I don't have to lie for someone else. No I don't have to cooperate with the system because I am powerful enough to ignore it or work around it.

//Personally I see it as just another way of progressives blaming it all on society. They have a problem with individuals acting independently. And last I checked the "powerful leaders" of the world are pretty much individuals.
 
2006-12-03 10:15:57 AM
Lard_Baron: How many Carrier groups does radical Islam have?
0

How many Armored divisions does radical Islam have?

4 armored, six mechanized, 2 commando brigade, 1 airborne brigade, and then there is the Iranian Hiaballah in Khuzestan, and the Lebanese Hizballah in Lebanon. about a division and a brigade each, respectfully.

In addition Basij has some 11,000,000 personnel. But those are basically thugs repressing thir own citizenry, rather than poeple who can actually fight.

How many Squadrons of airplanes does radical Islam have?

5


How many Airbourne Divisions does radical Islam have?

1 brigade

How many nukes does radical Islam have?

With Russia's help, probably 5 fissile devices within 5 years.
 
2006-12-03 12:02:40 PM
Holy crap, I can't beleave people support this. This is a dangerous road, when yous tart singling out your citizens based on religion. And counter productive. And unconstitutional.

czarangelus, I know you think the issue in Israel is socioeconomic, and thats a part of it but you fail to understand the nature of ethnic conflict. Ethnic conflict goes beyond socioeconomic factors. If you want an example look at Sarajevo. Sarajevo is a perfect example of ethnic conflict. Surrounding a city for 3 years and shelling and sniping it's citizens has jack shiat to do with money. It was about killing Bosnians.

Israel was afraid, due to the rhetoric, that Israel would wind up like that, because they understand ethnic conflict.

And the first wars could not have been economically motivated, since the Arabs had far bigger standing armies and much more funds.

They were ethnically motivated.

And whatever political cover they use is just that, political cover.

This conflict is older then the economic disparages. It's ethnically motivated.
 
2006-12-03 12:25:49 PM
Lionel Mandrake [TotalFark]

OK, fine. It is my own belief, however, that very little of any actual consequence is being done to stop future attacks. What we have here, mostly, are attempts to appear to be doing something.

True enough, but that mainly because what would have to be done to actually prevent any future attacks would be unconstitutional as hell. In fact permanent visible identification of all muslims would be a good start. See what I mean? The cure is worse than the disease.

Thats the problem, actually making us safer is impossible but a politician cant ignore a concern so they have to make up things that sound good, like the silly color coded warning system we have.
 
2006-12-03 12:36:36 PM
I just hope that once Belgium or the Netherlands become majority Muslim (due to their birth-rate being 5 times the average Belgian or Dutch woman) and they impose sharia law across the country, that the U.S. has time to learn from their mistake......
 
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