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(Daily News)   President Bush still very eager to put Social Security money into stocks   (nydailynews.com ) divider line
    More: Dumbass  
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3457 clicks; posted to Main » on 18 Jul 2002 at 4:04 PM (14 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



252 Comments     (+0 »)
 


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2002-07-18 10:28:49 AM  
Good to know that my Social Security money is going to be well managed...Especially since the stock market is doing so well right now...
 
2002-07-18 10:54:56 AM  
Hmmmm, yes, the market is up, and Bush touts putting Social Security money--a retirement safety net, not intended to be a sole source of retirement income--into the stock market. Dangerous but plausible idea.

The market is down, and Bush touts putting Social Security money into the stock market. Dangerous but idiotic idea.

George W. Bush is like a housefly: he doesn't seem to learn from experience. It's much easier to persist in the same policy advocacy than admit you're wrong or that your policy needs to be modified or discarded.
 
2002-07-18 10:57:56 AM  
Looks at Dow Jones chart...

Ponders next 35 years...

*faints*
 
2002-07-18 11:31:34 AM  
he's probably just hoping doing that would bring the market up.
 
2002-07-18 11:57:08 AM  
I don't think so, Rosalea. He's been advocating this for a couple years, long before the markets reached their current depths. Just like his tax cuts: he used 9/11 to argue for making the estate tax repeal permanent. Not that the elimination of taxes in 2010 and beyond would truly stimulate the economy or really have any effect on anyone's lives in 2001 and 2002, but hey, that very popular "war on terror" can be used to justify a whole melange of policies he's been touting for years.
 
2002-07-18 12:00:31 PM  
This is somewhat ironic. The US is so concerned about being destroyed by terrorists, it doesn't seem to notice it's slowly being destroyed by its own government.

*grabs popcorn*
 
2002-07-18 04:09:58 PM  
I'm guessing that none of you looked at the market over the period of 40-50 years? I'd rather have my money earning 8% than getting shoved in some "lock-box" where it can be replaced by an IOU.

This isn't a 2 year plan. The government isn't going to let you play Day-trader with your money. It'll be there for the long-haul. History shows, the market will grow over the long term.
 
2002-07-18 04:10:51 PM  
President Bush still very eager to put Social Security money into stocks...

... so he can embezzle it
 
2002-07-18 04:12:38 PM  
I think this is a great idea. Don't you guys think you can invest "your" money better than some bureaucrat can? I sure as heck do.
 
Bf+
2002-07-18 04:13:06 PM  
An addict will do anything to get more.
 
2002-07-18 04:14:11 PM  
I guess after the dot com bust that there is a shortage of stupid investors putting all they own into shill companies.
 
2002-07-18 04:14:56 PM  
Don't bother, BizB.

Public schools don't have mandatory economics classes, as I think they should. Most people just don't see it as we do.

On the surface, this seems like an ok idea, but, ultimately, I want the government to get out of the retirement business.

While they're at it, they should quit giving tax breaks for going into debt and allow interest earnings to be untaxed. That would make it seem like they actually WANT US citizens to get ahead.
 
2002-07-18 04:16:30 PM  
As bad an investment as the stock-market seems today, you are going to lose much bigger in your Social Security "investment," because they [Washington] have already spent it!
 
2002-07-18 04:17:34 PM  
07-18-02 04:12:38 PM HulaHead
I think this is a great idea. Don't you guys think you can invest "your" money better than some bureaucrat can? I sure as heck do.


Yeah, it's called a 401(k) plan.

3Horn
 
2002-07-18 04:17:34 PM  
Jesus, anyone besides moron liberals at Fark?
 
2002-07-18 04:17:34 PM  
It's a good idea... one big flaw - if you're getting
ready to retire and the markets take a turn for the worse
you're farked.
 
2002-07-18 04:19:12 PM  
Should read [image from img.fark.com too old to be available]

Do you really want your retirment money thrown around and wasted by government buerocrats because they dont know how to balance a budget?
 
2002-07-18 04:19:16 PM  
Wherever they put the money, they need to keep their damn hands off of it.

For those of you that think the stock market is a bad idea... take a look at where your social security is right now: "SPECIAL" GOVERNMENT BONDS.

Give me the stock-market any day. It's called buying long.
 
2002-07-18 04:19:31 PM  
Am I understanding this correctly? You can voluntarily invest your Social Security money? If so, I'm all for it. I don't like the idea of social security to begin with.
 
2002-07-18 04:20:47 PM  
Arggg,

I have to say, that so far, this thread has far more silly and stupid comments per square inch than just about all of the other flame war threads I have viewed. Come one guys, use your brains.
 
2002-07-18 04:20:47 PM  
07-18-02 04:09:58 PM BizB
"I'm guessing that none of you looked at the market over the period of 40-50 years? I'd rather have my money earning 8% than getting shoved in some "lock-box" where it can be replaced by an IOU. This isn't a 2 year plan. The government isn't going to let you play Day-trader with your money. It'll be there for the long-haul. History shows, the market will grow over the long term."

I feel the need to remind y'all....

There have been down periods in the market that lasted for decades and decades. Not to mention that inflation takes the steam out of those rosy market values. Not to mention that the claim about a gauranteed market value increase over time ignores the fact that these figures are distorted by the many companies that go tits up and fall of the indices and the myriad new companies that have joined the market. It is QUITE possible to put all your SS money into the market and then have the market tanks, companies that you invest in DISSAPPEAR, and you end up with shiat, and for this lackluster stock market performance to last you ENTIRE retirement life. Enjoy.
 
2002-07-18 04:20:47 PM  
You've got it all wrong -- this is Bush's plan to guarantee a comfortable retirement for future generations of corporate executives, not your average working stiff.

We get to put our retirement money into the stock market and insiders get to cash it out.
 
2002-07-18 04:21:31 PM  
Social Security is a necessary evil to take care of the idiots and less educated who don't plan for retirement.

The current retiring generation didn't plan. They depended on it. The current workers know that social security may not be around when we retire, and if it is, will not provide a good living.
 
2002-07-18 04:21:52 PM  
07-18-02 04:14:56 PM Scarneck

While they're at it, they should quit giving tax breaks for going into debt and allow interest earnings to be untaxed. That would make it seem like they actually WANT US citizens to get ahead.


How about actually requiring businesses to pay their share of taxes instead of letting them shift it to off-shore tax shelters? When a corporation that made billions of dollars last year pays less taxes than I did, there's a farking problem.

3Horn
 
2002-07-18 04:21:58 PM  
Good to know my Social Security money is being wasted on useless pork-barrel projects ... and bonds that barely return anything.

Let me out of the farking program! NOW! It's MY money!
 
2002-07-18 04:22:06 PM  
That does it... *gets out a whoopin stick to whomp Dumbya with* *whomps on Dumbya* What a farking IDIOT!
 
2002-07-18 04:22:17 PM  
Shuh: "... you're going to lose your money from soc sec."

Not true, worst case they deflate the currency printing
money for soc sec checks. They're not going to say, 'sorry
we aint got the money.'
 
2002-07-18 04:22:27 PM  
Investing in the stock market is a good idea. Period. For anybody. No other investment in the universe has consistently paid as high a return as the US stock market over the past century. You think the market is terrible now, but long term (social security is, after all, extremely long term for most of us) it's a wrinkle.

And HulaHead hit it on the head, so to speak.
 
2002-07-18 04:23:15 PM  
I'm glad that he is sticking with a good long term plan rather than trying to react to a market correction. During the 90's Alan Greenspan said that there was irrational exuberence in the market. We are now seeing a painful, yet necessary correction.
Give me control of my money, not Washington.
For all of you who feel Democrats and Republicans are the same, let me ask a simple question: Who wants to control all of your money from a central government and who wants you to control more of your own money?
This is all about power. Democrats feel that they should control everything. Most Republicans still feel that self-determination is still the American way. It scares me that so many people feel differently.
 
Bf+
2002-07-18 04:23:41 PM  
Oh, I'm sure he's looking out for the american people.
Wait, who?
 
2002-07-18 04:23:43 PM  
Would you invest your money in a financial insrument that went away like a fart in the wind when you died? Or acutally didn't even pay back the principal you invested?


This is what the current Social Security system promises.

If someone on Wall Street sold this investment they would be put in prison for fraud. But the U.S. Government thinks it is the best way to save for retirement. Bullsh*t!

I keep my ca$he in the mattress and proctect it with a unfed and pissed off pitbull.

./out
 
2002-07-18 04:23:47 PM  
He needs the influx of cash to prop up the market's value so his largest contributors will be billionaires again.
 
2002-07-18 04:24:11 PM  
ARMY
Do you really want your retirment money thrown around and wasted by government buerocrats because they dont know how to balance a budget?

Now that you've identified the problem, act on it.
 
2002-07-18 04:24:11 PM  
07-18-02 04:21:31 PM SimonMaduro
Social Security is a necessary evil to take care of the idiots and less educated who don't plan for retirement.


It's not my responsibility to take care of them! If they can't retire, keep on working! That's what they did before FDR introduced this albatross.
 
2002-07-18 04:24:44 PM  
Dumbass tag? I think that only a dumbass would think this is a bad idea. Under 30? You probably won't see Social Security money. Even though the stock market is volital right now, it has been shown to grow over time. Even investing a portion of your OWN Social Security dollars in a conservative utility package is a better plan than the current Social Security system. If you're in for the long haul...you WANT, yes WANT, the market to be down a bit...its bargain shopping!!!

I see there are some bleeding hearts in here...if you want to take your hard-earned money and give it away, be my guest but not I.
 
2002-07-18 04:24:50 PM  
Hehehehe... you all worried about your social security "investment?"

Social Security = 15% income tax. I proprose another 15% income tax under the name "Health Care."
 
2002-07-18 04:24:56 PM  
[image from photos.imageevent.com too old to be available]
 
2002-07-18 04:25:29 PM  
The real solution is to start managing the soc sec funds
better. Have the govt take the funds and manage them as a
mutual fund manager would. Don't throw out the baby with
the bath water.
 
2002-07-18 04:26:03 PM  
doesn't sound that stupid to me...
the market can't sink much more than it already has;
it would probably initiate a rise in the market;

but then, what do i know...?
 
2002-07-18 04:26:22 PM  
Sblafren:

Which decades are you referring to? I'd like you to show me a 20 or 30 year period where the market didn't beat inflation.
 
jbc [TotalFark]
2002-07-18 04:26:55 PM  
Let's take a stupid idea, Social Security, and make it even dumber my having the government manage TWO accounts for you.

It is your money. The right thing to do is end Social Security. Period. Everyone's take home pay goes up 7%. If you want to invest that in the stock market, that's your right. If you want to invest in in bonds, be my guest. If you want to spend it on your kids' education, or rent, or hookers and beer, have at it.
 
2002-07-18 04:27:23 PM  
Laughing...very good point!
 
2002-07-18 04:27:44 PM  
Can anyone think of a better time to get inot the market? I'm buying!
 
2002-07-18 04:28:02 PM  
Guess what? Our current Social Security system is doomed to failure. There are two options: Privatize it, or let it die. Well, I suppose we could also triple SS taxes, never mind.

The fact is, there is no 10 year period in American history where investing in a diversified stock portfolio did not beat out any other reasonable form of investment out there, including during the Great Depression, and certainly including 1992 to 2002. Social Security is a LONG TERM INVESTMENT. Right now, the government is taking a huge portion of your paycheck and wasting it by "investing" the SS surplus itself, creating the biggest farking IOU in world history. If at any time people who are retired now were allowed to invest even a portion of their SS taxes, they would be better off right now, and WE would be better off right now because the amount of investment in our economy would have been higher, as opposed to pure government consumption. This still holds true now. If Bush pulls this off, it will undo the damage of his farm bill and steel and textile tarriffs 100-fold.

And if all the other "loyal" Republicans jump off the privatization boat like scummy rats, guess who will be standing alone with Bush on this issue? Every conservative's favorite punching bag, John McCain. Hail to the Chief.
 
2002-07-18 04:28:24 PM  
Social Security is a pyramid scheme, not an insurance policy. Insurance companies invest their premiums. Every dollar going in for social security pays someone's current bills. In the long run, as retirees outweigh workers, that pyramid will collapse, and just flat out be a drag on the market if the money isn't invested, and allowed to circulate. It would have been nice to start putting away the money while we still have a surplus, but we've got to do something about it eventually.
 
2002-07-18 04:28:29 PM  
Thanks for the tip, 3Horn. I do have a 401(k) and I fund it to the maximum allowed. But that doesn't stop the government from taking away part of my income for Social Security! The two plans are not related.

P.S. Why is everyone so upset that the market is down right now? Are you all retiring within the next few years? Hello: BUY LOW!
 
2002-07-18 04:28:51 PM  
Does anyone from Generation X or Y really planning
on getting a Social Security Check?

I am not.
 
2002-07-18 04:29:21 PM  
Granted, over the course of 40 or 50 years, the market doubles. the whole market doubles. Individuals can make a killing or a hole in the dirt. And that's the problem with using the long term positive outlook for the market to justify this boneheaded maneuver. Social Security is supposed to be a saftey net for everyone, not just the folks who are intelligent enough to make their money work for them. If the Congress (Democrats and Republicans alike) would just keep their grubby paws off of it, then the lower average return wouldn't mean much.

916 more days of this bullshiat.

This is all Bush's Fault!!!

Let's put it this way: There is no such thing as a Social Security Surplus: The system is designed to pile up money in good times so it can weather the bad ones. If the money stays in it, it works. If the moneyu gets pulled out to pay for Mohair, or trained Hawaian Beagles, or Star Wars, or Jeb's reelection campaign, then it doesn't. It doesn't work if the money is pulled out to let people invest it by themselves. If we do it that way, we're right back where we started.

George Bush is such a shiathead! Can you imagine he kind of financial shenanigans that'd start up if that much money hit the stock market at once? Think stocks are overvalued now? Think that companies cook their books now? This is nothing. This would make Enron look like the "take a penny - leave a penny" box on the counter at Seven Eleven.

Our only hope is to stick this dickhead and his equally evil trolls with a Democratic congress in this election, and chuck him out on his pampered, usurping ass come 2004.
 
2002-07-18 04:29:44 PM  
If we went ahead with this then where would be the safety net for the safety net we just cut?
 
2002-07-18 04:29:47 PM  
If we have the option to drop out of the Socialism Security program, I would also like to manage my own welfare, medicare, and medicaid accounts.
 
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