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(NewsMax)   Student leaders at a California college have banned the Pledge of Allegiance at their meetings, saying they see no reason to publicly swear loyalty to God and the U.S. government   (newsmax.com) divider line 642
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7161 clicks; posted to Main » on 10 Nov 2006 at 8:00 AM (7 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2006-11-10 10:30:27 AM
Tyee: Ask them, they were so committed they were willing to give their lives. Spend a little time with WWII vets while you still have a chance to find some.

I only asked what made these troops MORE loyal and aligned with their country. The Nazis fought and died voluntarily for their nation too. You directly asserted that Americans were MORE loyal than Nazis were, and I asked you to back that up.
 
2006-11-10 10:30:32 AM
Mekongcola is getting a lot of mileage outo fthe nazi sports graphics today.
 
2006-11-10 10:31:13 AM
They're college students, the perfect age for rebellion. If it is that goddamn important to them to recite the Pledge of Allegiance then they should do it and let the chips fall where they may. It would be a perfect way to piss off the "establishment".
 
2006-11-10 10:31:35 AM
Finnley Wren: Isn't morality the very basis for all law?

Tatsuma: No, the Golden Rule is.

Finnley Wren: My head asplode.

Because you're farking retarded.

/yeah, I'm a little late.
//you're still retarded.
///and I still lack tact.
 
2006-11-10 10:31:40 AM
Tatsuma: Don't enforce it, don't ban it. People want to spontaneously pray? Let them. People who want to pray will. People who don't, won't.

Pray quietly yes.

Just don't make it official and don't ban it either. Not everyone has the same beliefs and conforms to your ideas, wankers.

Nope they shouldn't. Of course the other side wants all of us on our knees praying. For some strange these are the same people whom react violently when you them "in god we trust" wasn't always on our money.

Welcome to the 1% of f***ing wackjobs drives everyone nuts. For some strange a$$ reason, the wackjobs on both sides can't just live and let live.
 
2006-11-10 10:32:24 AM
The Homer Tax: My bad, I interpreted the "mutually exclusive" thing incorrectly.

Yeah, as soon as I posted I was unhappy with that phrase. Oxymoronic wouldda been a better choice.

We can agree to disagree on the value of having schoolchildren continue to say the pledge.
 
2006-11-10 10:32:25 AM
inglixthemad: the wackjobs on both sides can't just live and let live.

Can't they just give up and learn to live and let die?
 
2006-11-10 10:33:23 AM
KattBon: Because you're farking retarded.

School out early on accounta the holiday?
 
2006-11-10 10:34:21 AM
DaShredda
Do you not understand?
If they weren't loyal and committed to their own country they never would have fought and their governments never would have asked them to.
 
2006-11-10 10:34:47 AM
Tatsuma

People want to spontaneously pray? Let them. People who want to pray will. People who don't, won't.

Despite people saying you are logical, you do realize that there is no law against spontaneous prayer, right? As long as it isn't lead by someone in authority, then people CAN pray in school or anywhere else. It just can't be SCHOOL-SPONSORED. And that makes perfect sense. I don't want some authority figure telling kids to pray THIS prayer. But spontaneous prayer is ok, and is fought for by the ACLU.
 
2006-11-10 10:35:57 AM
It doesn't seem to me you're pledging loyalty to God when you say the POA, you're just describing the country. I mean, you could say "one nation, in the northern hemisphere..." and you wouldn't be pledging to the northern hemisphere, now would you?

But you should not say the POA anyway. Allegiance to a FLAG?
 
2006-11-10 10:36:42 AM
OHH NO! One group of little asshat students is doing... Something... rebllious.

Jesus. THIS is worth the bandwidth?

People. Kids do and say stupid things. Get the fark over it and get back to work you lazy yuppies.
 
2006-11-10 10:37:31 AM
Tyee
DaShredda
Do you not understand?
If they weren't loyal and committed to their own country they never would have fought and their governments never would have asked them to.


Loyalty to a government or a god has nothing to do with uniting with other countries to stop a common evil.

I'm not loyal to strangers, but if they needed help, I'd help them.

I don't need to be force fed anthems. So please don't try it.
 
2006-11-10 10:37:40 AM
jman11jman: You only have to look at what happened when that guy tried to start an Aussie pledge. It's a different culture.

img226.imageshack.us

This here's the wattle,
the emblem of our land.
You can stick it in a bottle,
you can hold it in your hand.

'Stralya
'Stralya
'Stralya
'Stralya
We Love You!
Amen
 
2006-11-10 10:37:53 AM
You directly asserted that Americans were MORE loyal than Nazis were,
This seems obvious to me. When in a struggle for survival the one who wants it more survives and wins.
 
2006-11-10 10:39:37 AM
Tyee: Do you not understand?
If they weren't loyal and committed to their own country they never would have fought and their governments never would have asked them to.



Do you not understand? He never said that the allied Soldiers were *not* loyal to their country. In your original statement, you said that the Allied soldiers were indeed *more* loyal to their country than the Nazi/Axis soldiers. You were then asked to describe in what way they were *more* loyal than the soldiers they were fighting against. You have now failed multiple times to deliver on this request...

Which part, exactly, is confusing to you?
 
2006-11-10 10:40:06 AM
It's News....TO THE MAX DUDE!!!!
 
2006-11-10 10:40:31 AM
Tyee
You directly asserted that Americans were MORE loyal than Nazis were,
This seems obvious to me. When in a struggle for survival the one who wants it more survives and wins.


Loyalty has nothing to do with survival.

When you start thinking for yourself, let me know. Then we'll discuss this further.

True loyalty would be communism. Are you a communist?
 
2006-11-10 10:40:42 AM
So you're a socialist, little boy? And an atheist you say? Okay, well when you get bigger you can converse with the adults. Jebus! Socialist?! It's because socialism works so well! These children need to check some history and read a paper once in a while. SOCIALISM DOESN'T WORK! Don't say the pledge, but I'll be damned if you tell me I can't!
/Paging Mr McCarthy
//Mr. McCarthy, please pick up the white courtesy phone
///Socialism close cousin to communism
 
2006-11-10 10:40:52 AM
The Homer Tax
Requiring Community service removes the meaning from community service much like requiring a loyalty oath.

I see what you did there. Nice.
 
2006-11-10 10:41:01 AM
Loyalty to a government or a god has nothing to do with uniting with other countries to stop a common evil.

What made them believe it was a common evil then? Why didn't they just join the Nazis if they weren't loyal to thier own country?
 
2006-11-10 10:41:08 AM
Tyee: This seems obvious to me. When in a struggle for survival the one who wants it more survives and wins.

Are we talking about nations or football teams here? Because if you think that cliche has any relevance when it comes to which nation wins in a war, that's pretty sad.
 
2006-11-10 10:41:18 AM
That's called little dweebs trying to be rebellious against their parents. They'll get over it when they mature a bit.
 
2006-11-10 10:41:23 AM
A California college = Big farking surprise.

Drop in the ocean and Die biatches..
 
2006-11-10 10:41:39 AM
LordVger: It doesn't seem to me you're pledging loyalty to God when you say the POA, you're just describing the country.

The phrase "under God" is a phrase of subordination. I can think of a great many unflattering things to say about a country that fought against mortal tyranny only to submit in word to divine tyranny.
 
2006-11-10 10:42:01 AM
Tyee: When in a struggle for survival the one who wants it more survives and wins.

No, the one whose manufacturing base is out of range of enemy bombers wins.
 
2006-11-10 10:42:48 AM
Tyee: This seems obvious to me. When in a struggle for survival the one who wants it more survives and wins.

Interesting. See, I always thought wars were won by armies who had better equipment, better training, better leadership, and better tactics...

Who knew that it really all boiled down to who was more Loyal! Man, I've learned two things today...and now I've got a little bone to pick with a few uppity histpry teachers I've had over the years.
 
2006-11-10 10:43:20 AM
MWeather: No, the one whose manufacturing base is out of range of enemy bombers wins.

Not the mention the one who doesn't have an occult-obsessed psychotic for a leader.
 
2006-11-10 10:44:47 AM
hoo-wee-baby

"Socialism doesn't work"

Obviously, you have no idea who to thank for the 40-hour work week, overtime pay, worker's comp, and trade unions. But, you're right, everyone should learn the history of socialism - starting with you.
 
2006-11-10 10:44:56 AM
DaShredda

Thank you for not wasting too much of my time. Please feel free to carry on your meaningless existence.
 
2006-11-10 10:45:05 AM
Tyee: What made them believe it was a common evil then? Why didn't they just join the Nazis if they weren't loyal to thier own country?


Dude, you should probably cut-and-run now...we're all way more loyal against your asinine argument than you are loyal for it.
 
2006-11-10 10:46:40 AM
I'm British, and I never swore loyalty to anything in my life, outside of my wedding vows! I will not pledge allegiance to the Crown or the State, and certainly not to the Union flag.
I find the whole idea rather disturbing. I find the fact that certain groups think it would be a good thing to introduce this in the UK even more disturbing.


The only time the National Anthem should be played before an event is if the monarch (or head of state) is present, or if the nation is being represented in international competition. Even then, we need our own national anthem for England, rather than sharing 'God save the Queen' with the UK.

/Flanders and Swann wrote a pretty good one...
//the Germans are German, the Russians are red
/// the Greeks and Italians eat garlic in bed
 
2006-11-10 10:47:39 AM
Programmer Cat

HAHHAHA your "You humans" made me think of the head geek in the movie Grandmas Boy.
LOL i neede that.
 
2006-11-10 10:47:42 AM
rogue79: Obviously, you have no idea who to thank for the 40-hour work week, overtime pay, worker's comp, and trade unions.

I'm on salary. The only reason I have a 40 hour workweek is that my employer knows that I will refuse and throw the fact that I am salaried in his face. Sure, he can fire me, but then he will have to spend time and money finding somebody stupid enough to take my place. So, what exactly has socialism done for me lately?
 
2006-11-10 10:47:58 AM
Tyee

I guess Native Americans didn't love America as much as the white man.

That's why we won. We were loyal.

Let me call up the Department of Defense. We can save billions by manufacturing loyalty instead of munitions!
 
2006-11-10 10:48:40 AM
Ha, ha, the facist have their panties all twisted. Unless college student leaders make the special blah-blah at their meetings then everything the soldiers have fought for is suddenly nullified. Think of the soldiers! They did not die for a country where meetings of college student leaders skip the mindless, psycho flag cult routine in favor of relevant content.
 
2006-11-10 10:48:58 AM
See, I always thought wars were won by armies who had better equipment, better training, better leadership, and better tactics...

Why go through all that trouble w/o some degree of loyalty? Surrender would be a much quicker and more efficient way to end the war, especially w/o any sense of loyalty it would be easy.
 
2006-11-10 10:49:02 AM
rogue79: "Socialism doesn't work"

Obviously, you have no idea who to thank for the 40-hour work week, overtime pay, worker's comp, and trade unions. But, you're right, everyone should learn the history of socialism - starting with you.


Is that socialism at work or just effective organization? If enough Mormons got together, demanded and got the same concessions, would that vindicate Mormonism?

If so, then Pay Lay Ale.
 
2006-11-10 10:49:05 AM
IM ON UR STUDENT COUNCIL

BANNING UR RIGHTS
 
2006-11-10 10:49:53 AM
Tyee
DaShredda

Thank you for not wasting too much of my time. Please feel free to carry on your meaningless existence.


You do realise you are arguing with strangers on the internet, right?
 
2006-11-10 10:51:34 AM
hoo-wee-baby: "So you're a socialist, little boy? And an atheist you say? Okay, well when you get bigger you can converse with the adults. Jebus! Socialist?! It's because socialism works so well! These children need to check some history and read a paper once in a while. SOCIALISM DOESN'T WORK! Don't say the pledge, but I'll be damned if you tell me I can't!"

Wait, atheists can't be adults? You mean it's more mature to believe in a sky-man?

As for socialism not working, you're right, no one pure "ism" works. Pure capitalism doesn't work either. At least the guy's trying on a political theory for size. I respect that more than a college student who doesn't put much thought into the matter, going along with the status quo structure of society.

As for your statement, "Don't say the pledge, but I'll be damned if you tell me I can't!", who exactly is telling you that you can't say the pledge?
 
2006-11-10 10:51:37 AM
Tyee: Surrender would be a much quicker and more efficient way to end the war, especially w/o any sense of loyalty it would be easy.

Then why did we have to fight them down to a handful of little boys defending Berlin? I'd think without loyalty Dresden would have been plenty enough incentive to surrender.
 
2006-11-10 10:51:52 AM
18 Yearolds are idiots.
Especially ones who aspire to student government. You are the hugest losers in your school. Here's a 40 oz. Go play with the normal kids.
 
2006-11-10 10:52:19 AM
Tyee: Surrender would be a much quicker and more efficient way to end the war, especially w/o any sense of loyalty it would be easy.

So would assassinating the politicians on both sides. After all, it's the farking politicians who start the damned wars, and then expect their subjects to kill and die in their name.
 
2006-11-10 10:52:36 AM
"Socialism doesn't work"

rogue79: Obviously, you have no idea who to thank for the 40-hour work week

Rising prosperity.


overtime pay

The concept of overtime pay long predates socialism, but it was the labor movement that made it standard.

worker's comp

*blink* Come back when you understand what worker's comp is, and who pays for it.

and trade unions.

Trade unions are medieval in concept, and are decidedly *non*socialist in nature.

But, you're right, everyone should learn the history of socialism - starting with you.

Why is it that the most ignorant are also generally the most cocksure?
 
2006-11-10 10:53:01 AM
this thread is a mess. Can we get back to the 'empowered' SOCAL pretentious teens?
 
2006-11-10 10:53:41 AM
neonrisk: Can we get back to sodomizing the 'empowered' SOCAL pretentious teens?

Dude, nobody's stopping you.
 
2006-11-10 10:54:01 AM
Seriously. shut up about the socialism. Read the FARQ about threadjacks. punx.
 
2006-11-10 10:54:04 AM
I'm not arguing, I'm stating a view w/o any animosity. I do feel some frustration and sadness but the pride I feel overwhelms that.

Good luck with your life.
 
2006-11-10 10:54:26 AM
Tyee: Why go through all that trouble w/o some degree of loyalty? Surrender would be a much quicker and more efficient way to end the war, especially w/o any sense of loyalty it would be easy.

Who's saying that the allied soldiers didn't have any degree of loyalty? We're all just questioning your assertion that they were *more* loyal than the enemy soldiers...something that to this point you have only backed up with the rediculous assertion that they were "more loyal because they won."
 
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