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(AZCentral)   Nickelodeon scores record ratings with same sex parents special   ( divider line
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3464 clicks; posted to Main » on 20 Jun 2002 at 8:13 PM (15 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

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2002-06-20 09:37:12 PM  
What's the point in percentages? 1% is a LOT of people. One can get to know all sorts and types and creeds and colors and flavors of people. It's like saying "Isn't the fireman population less than 2% of the NORMAL population?" And I'm sure there's been an afterschool special on firemen at some point.
2002-06-20 09:39:15 PM  
Agent Orange:
But, I know many straight men who can attest to having sex only once with better than half of their partners.
2002-06-20 09:39:51 PM  
Ediacara With the exception of blind adherence to a religious faith, there are no compelling reasons to disapprove of consenting homosexual relationships based soley on their being homosexual.

Agreed. I am a vigorous supporter of people being able to do whatever they please with whomever consents to having it done to them.

One issue here isn't homosexuality per se, but whether it's appropriate for gays or lesbians raising families and any negative effects on their children. My reaction is that, in most cases, the "effect" is highly positive, since any home that the true love and parenting is far better than a life of foster care or other wardship. I've known many gay and lesbian couples who could be -- or in some cases, have been -- better parents than many M/F pairings out there.

But I think it's a mistake if we fail to acknowledge an added degree of complexity involved with raising children in that environment, ranging from issues of biology, to the reaction of their friends, to their own feelings as they grow older and mature sexually.

Parenting is difficult -- not that I know first-hand yet. But I do recognize certain issues that I will have to struggle with to raise my children, as any parent -- gay, straight, or otherwise -- must.

Shiat, did I type that?
2002-06-20 09:39:54 PM  
Both sides are just the same people with different arguments
2002-06-20 09:41:38 PM  
BTW, does anyone remember that children's book, "Fb- Has Two Mommies"?
2002-06-20 09:42:15 PM  
Agent Orange:
Actually, now that I peruse your post again, I can see many similarities between these behavior patterns and some of the sorostitutes I have known.
2002-06-20 09:42:56 PM  
Ok, I'm surprised at how many people are not bothered by this. Nickeloden is channel that the youngest of young kids watch, most of whom have probably never even thought about sex let alone homosexuality, let alone same sex couples raising kids. Why must Nickeloden be showing specials about this and exposing kids to this material that most normal parents would not want their kids to see. Unfortunately now parents can't even let their children watch Nick anymore without first finding what is coming on. God I doubt anyone here would have wanted to be raised by same sex parent's, so it's fair to let an innocent kid be forced into a situation like that. Use common sense people, no matter what the view this kinda topic shouldn't be a channel where the viewers hardly know anything about it in the first place. bah whatever im mad.
2002-06-20 09:43:57 PM  
Liberals pushing agendas on our children: 1
Innocent Children watching harmless cartoons and entertainment: 0

I don't care if it's homosexuals, scientology, or whether the earth is flat or round, childrens cartoon networks should not be running shows about sex in any form (homo or hetero). They can have a special channel dedicated to homosexual rights issues for all I care, just don't do it where parents least expect it!

Liberals wonder why "right wing" parents are turning off their TVs altogether! There's no such thing as "entertainment" anymore, it's all shock, propaganda and agenda-pushing.
2002-06-20 09:46:10 PM  
Yeah, i remember that one.

I couldn't agree more, while being gay brings an added degree of difficulty to raising kids, most gays and lesbians are particularly adept at weathering hardship. Seeing as how they have had to put up with ridicule and suck their entire lives.
2002-06-20 09:50:13 PM  
Sex with animals is forbiddin, does that make it appealing?
Some things are just wrong.
2002-06-20 09:50:55 PM  
Was this special about sex? I thought it was about same-sex parents. I don't think that sex was ever mentioned. And as to the innocence of children, if you don't want them to know about sex, them just lock them in the closet because, god knows, it is everywhere. I personaly cannot go anywhere without seeing a gay or lesbian couple. All of the young children that I know don't really seem to care one way or another. They just seem to accept that these people love each other. Would that we were all like that.
2002-06-20 09:51:20 PM  
Is it me, or did NO ONE else notice that piece in that big, long article thing above that a bunch of gay people in a survey ingested fecal material? Since when does that have to do with being gay? Damn!


2002-06-20 09:53:10 PM  
Alexandra writes:
"Question here: Why are people who don't condone homosexuality automatically labeled as "fundies"?"

Becuase, with the exception of blind adherence to a religious faith, there are no compelling reasons to disapprove of consenting homosexual relationships based soley on their being homosexual. (You may of course have individual reasons why you may disapprove of a particular homosexual relationship.)

So what you're saying is, the fact that I believe in God and believe what God says makes me a fundie.

I don't follow blindly. Proof: I don't go to church. Organized religion is brainwashing. THAT is following blindly.

I always thought that fundamentalists took things to extremes. I try not to. I see nothing wrong with playing poker, for example. Nothing wrong with drinking beer (but getting drunk is another story). Or dancing. Or women wearing pants (some people take the dressing like the opposite sex thing too literally--how you dress generally depends on what the mores are in your society). Or makeup. I know they'll tell about Jezebel, but just because she "painted her eyes" and crap doesn't mean I can't put on makeup at all. I just don't look like a whore.

You don't see me doing gay-bashing, for example. That's what fundies do.
2002-06-20 09:55:46 PM  
If it is constantly harped on, yeah. BTW, I work with a bunch of rednecks and it would not supprise me if a few of them have tried it. I suppose that the people who I work with have jaded me, but I don't put it that far outside the realm of human endeavor. Occasionally while surfing for pron (or killing kittens, if you prefer) I will run across adds for beastiality sites. In fact it is a little too often for my comfort. It seems like there are waaaaaaaayyy too many of these sites out there.
2002-06-20 09:57:56 PM  
Alexandra- I'm assuming you aren't generalizing /all/ churches as brainwashers. Not that I disagree, but the fact that just about all of them are doesn't mean that they can't be. Presume, for example, a church full of people with the same morals and ideals as you.

Just had to get that out.
2002-06-20 09:58:24 PM  

If I'd known you were into right-wing propaganda porn, Agent Orange, I wouldn't have bothered. You guys are way kinkier than us.

To Merick888: If the kids who DO need this information don't find it in a place where their conservative overseers don't expect it, where ARE they going to find it?

I grew up gay, in the south, in the Reagan 80s. I grew up in a world where homosexuality DID NOT EXIST (emphasis theirs), and I literally thought I was the only one on earth until I reached age 16 or so and spotted ads for porno mags up here in Atlanta around 1981.

Conservatives deride gays for their attitudes towards sex, but then they pass legislation to make sure that the ONLY place gay kids will learn about sex is from porn. Keep it outta the schools, the churches, the families... make sure they only hear about sex as DIRTY, DIRTY, BACK-ROOM, DIRTY.

If gays decide to hitch up, buy homes together, have kids, run for office, whatnot, the conservatives start screaming that by taking care of our kids, we are somehow attacking their families. If we want to make sure that one of us doesn't lose his home if his partner dies, we are "attacking families."

Pardon my outburst... sometimes it just sucks having to spend my entire life in somebody else's narrow-minded world. :P

2002-06-20 10:00:03 PM  
"Throughout history, the major civilizations [and] major religions condemned homosexuality.

Not quite so. One of the daddies of great civilizations, and really the starting point of all western civilization, is ancient Greece. Homosexuality was considered a normal and healthy practice, and was often encouraged between warriors.
2002-06-20 10:01:28 PM  
AvoidingWork- I heard somewhere that in Greece/Rome, male homosexuality was regarded higher than heterosexuality. Then again, this is from the same place where it was not taboo to pay to see people have sex.
2002-06-20 10:05:25 PM  
Evade - the show was not aimed at the youngest children, it was actually aimed at 12-17 year olds. And it was moved to a later time slot that is usually reserved for reruns of old black and white sitcoms - 9 pm. I think any sane parent would monitor what a 5 year old is watching on television at 9 pm - typically past bedtime for the youngest children anyway.
2002-06-20 10:05:45 PM  
Well, so much for the fundies pushing to get rid of PBS insisting kids can just watch Nick instead. Guess there's always the Disney channel *snicker*
2002-06-20 10:06:42 PM  
TheBigBigEye wrote:

And the Nickelodeon program is doing what...?

I don't care if a person is homosexual, but it is so hypocritical to sit there a say "fundies are trying to tell us what to believe." What the hell was that Nick show about homosexuality trying to do? Linda Ellerbee is as politically balanced as Rush Limbaugh. The liberal left says they are for free choice and freedom of belief. Alexandra asked a simple question, and it turned into how the "fundies" are suppressing people. Should we ostracize someone for not approving of the homosexual lifestyle, is that more fair than people ostracizing homosexuals?

My problem with the special is that kids don't need to know about sexuality from a TV show. I'm pretty damn sure that kids who live with same sex partners, pretty much know all about this as do their friends. Why do I have to explain to a 9 or 10 year old child what a homosexual is? What next describe how homosexuals have sex?

I have you damn liberal commies on one side, and right wing fundamentals on the other. You both are just alike.

You both talk about free speech just as long as people think like you. You both are idiots.
Damn thought police. You both are idiots
2002-06-20 10:08:51 PM  
*hands Plank a Valium*
2002-06-20 10:11:28 PM  
"We have discussed AIDS without discussing sex," Ellerbee adds, referring to her controversial 1991 special with basketball star Magic Johnson.

Not true. Not true at all. I watched this very special, and I distinctly remember them talking about condoms and what's to be done with them.
2002-06-20 10:11:33 PM  
Thank you steelwelder, I feel gooood now.
2002-06-20 10:11:48 PM  
>Becuase, with the exception of blind adherence to a >religious faith, there are no compelling reasons to >disapprove of consenting homosexual relationships based >soley on their being homosexual. (You may of course have >individual reasons why you may disapprove of a particular >homosexual relationship.)

Okay - here's the deal.. I may or may not believe in god, but I DO believe in Darwin. And for that reason, I thinnk one COULD make a non-relisious compelling argument against homosexuality.

See, if you take natural selection as a given, the ultimate aim of a species must be propigation. Breeding like rabbits. A.k.a. Irish-catholicism... but I digress.

Okay, taking THAT as a given, then anything that works against propigation threatens a species' survival and thus is not in the interest of a species. I.E., homosexuality.

I think people are born straight or they are born gay. It's a genetic thing. But I also think homosexuality is a naturally occuring abnormality. (And I don't use the word in any perjorative sense) Like near-sightedness. Neither benefits the species. But hey, it happens. Chill, baby.

I'm not saying I'm actually arguing against it, I'm just saying one COULD make a non-religious argumnent against it.

Not that there's anything wrong with it....
2002-06-20 10:13:02 PM  
And do kids NEED Gap clothing ads or Britney cd's or Pokemon or anything corporate America throws at them? No. It was an informational show, entertainment even. If you have a problem with it, don't watch it. You just can't censor it because it doesn't agree with your particular morals. THAT'S where I have a problem with the fundies.
2002-06-20 10:14:10 PM  
In that case:

Reasoning Individuals: 1
Communists: .5
McCarthyism: 2

And stay tuned for another round of "Fundie-Battles" here on Comedy Central!
2002-06-20 10:16:23 PM  
Bisifiniti: Very few people believe the same as I do. My husband is one of them.

I've had experiences where the church I was attending was teaching stuff contradictory to the Bible. I pointed it out, asked them to look at it, and all I get was BS like "here's stuff proving we're right." And naturally they twisted things around.

It would be great if there was a church with the same ideals and stuff. It would be greater yet if they were open to correction if necessary, like the Bereans.
2002-06-20 10:18:28 PM  
God damn! It's getting so you can't leave your kids in front of the electric babysitter for more than 8 or 9 hours without something coming up that you might have to discuss with them. What the hell is this world coming to?
2002-06-20 10:20:56 PM  
This shiat always drives me crazy. Here's my take on things, and this fits with just about every fark debate i've come across: Anything going on with consenting adults that understand the possible consequences (i.e. take drugs=fark up your brain, act on homosexuality=face God's possible wrath) is OK by me. If its not harming others, why is it regulated by law? So, based on my views, homosexuality is fine, bestiality is not (no way to determine if animal is, in fact, consenting). If you don't want your kids exposed to this stuff, keep track of your kids - something you should be doing anyway. work here is done.
2002-06-20 10:22:29 PM  
The world is just going to hell in a handbasket. the day has come when homosexuality is discussed as a legitimate lifestyle on a children's network. Of course they don't care about the protests, they are all owned by mtv, thus by viacom and basically you have 2/3 guys in charge of the media and they don't give a rat's ass

I've said it before and I'll say it again, one man screwing another man in the butt is disgusting to the point of perversity. You can act like this show was all innocent, but the very next step is for kids to start asking about homosexuality and you're gonna have to tell 'em what makes a person a homosexual: anal ramming. Enjoy son!
2002-06-20 10:24:10 PM  
Avoiding Work:
Dammed skippee!

If we are going to go the Christian route, Jesus gave us two commandments. They are as follows:
1. Love thy God.
2. Love thy neighbor as thyself.

Infer what you will.
2002-06-20 10:24:15 PM  
Alexandra- Same here, essentially. I've been to a church that said God purposed for sin to come into the world so he could show us his mercy by redeeming it from us. Like saving somebody from burning to death, but then torching their arm off so they can realize what they just missed, but in the process, defeating the purpose. As well as faithless churches that give so many arguments as to why God's not healing you instead of finding out that their doctrines are stopping the healing.

Well, to err is human, dammit.
2002-06-20 10:26:30 PM  
Yes, in the classical era, it was not odd for male warriors to fall in love with eachother. It really makes you wonder...
Also, who hasn't heard of the massive Roman orgies?
2002-06-20 10:27:01 PM  
There is no great sin or small sin, it's all sin. So my take is, regardless of homosexuality being a sin, if you steal staples from the office, you have absolutely no justification on calling people on it. If you saw a woman's cleavage and thought about something adulterous for a split-second, you aren't justified on calling somebody's sin. We Christians should start setting examples and following our own rules first. If homosexuality's so horrible, why not offer a better alternative?
2002-06-20 10:27:42 PM  
But Nick can show what they want. This is a free society and everyone, no matter what your political or sexual inclination, would be better if they just turned off the damn t.v. for at least a few hours a day....when is this internet revolution gonna actually take place because I'm tired of all this corporate run monoculture bullshiat.
2002-06-20 10:28:25 PM  
If kids learning about gays and lesbians will, be itself, turn them "queer", then just talking to Mormons or JWs at your door will turn you into Mormons or JW's, depending on which group knocks on your door first.

People who attack gays and lesbians may well be closet homosexuals who do not want to admit it.
2002-06-20 10:38:24 PM  
Bisifiniti: A better alternative? Like heterosexuality?

Akachibi: Cheap man's way to avoid acutally discussing the issue. Oh you don't like gays so you must secretly want to be one, what kind of 7-year-old I know you are but what am I nonsense is that? No just watching a show won't turn kids queer but why do kids need to be exposed to that? I knew well enough as a kid to treat people as I wanted to be treated, I didn't need some PC docudrama telling why specifically people who like to have anal sex need my sympathy. Sure I like you, I'll treat you as a friend. But I think what you do (and are proud of doing) is perverse. And I only talk about what I don't like about homosexuality not in social settings, where I'm just hanging out and some folks I'm with may be gay. I only get irate when it put out in our culture as something being a perfectly normal lifestyle. constantly we see it on t.v., movies, literature. there is a serious effort by many who think that if you show more and more and more of the gay lifestyle people will eventually accept -- and by and large it has worked.'s time for me to go have a beer. I always rant the most when it comes to homosexuality for some reason, I guess I just view it as the epitome of the "culture wars" constantly happening in this country. Of course conservatives are usually on the losing end -- but I'll go down shouting! ...oh my, I just said "go down". who can make a joke out of that? ...ok, enough. game over. going home in 15 minutes.
2002-06-20 10:47:03 PM  
I remember Anal Ramming! I saw them open for GG Allin in Newburgh back in '89!
2002-06-20 10:50:59 PM  
:) peace (even for gays!)
2002-06-20 10:53:01 PM  
Robsul: Gay or not, anyone who read AgentOrange's post was injesting fecal matter.
2002-06-20 10:55:28 PM  
what makes a person a homosexual: anal ramming

So when a man farks a woman in the ass, does that make him a homosexual? Or is she a homosexual? Or do you mean they're both homosexual? I'm so confused.
2002-06-20 10:57:24 PM  
"They don't come to see how crayons are made or to watch 'SpongeBob.'"

The segment where they show how crayons are made was one of the coolest things ever on sesame street. or maybe it was mr. rogers, i don't remember. that and when they showed how saxophones are made with an atonal jazz soundtrack.
2002-06-20 11:00:56 PM  
Point taken, Courtney. Hey, I'm totally accepting towards gays, I take the "I didn't decide to like girls, they didn't decide to like guys" (since I'm a guy, same goes for women) approach. It was just...since WHEN did gay people do that? Exceedingly bizarre.


2002-06-20 11:05:39 PM  
2002-06-20 11:05:51 PM  
I think it was a bad move by Nick.

Now I'm not saying this because I hate gays, or because I am anti-tolerance, or because I'm brainwashed (/glare), or whatever. Spare me. The thing I have a problem with though is that trying to teach lessons like this on a television just illuminate a deeper problem within the family unit. Instead of teaching and educating children through parents, we slap messages like this on the tv and hope it sinks in. How many times have I said it, the tv is not the babysitter.
Is making kids aware of same sex families wrong? No, of course not. But using the tv as the prime medium to present to young, impressionable youths just sets them up for disaster... it gives us a bigger excuse to keep turning to media as a social savior. I'm not saying that all messages from stations like this should be frowned upon, Nickelodeon has most definitly presented some good shows and whatnot for kids. But a cultural question mark that's as touchy as this particular subject shouldn't be handled in this brand of medium. Just my thoughts.

Off topic, but an applicable concern nontheless.
2002-06-20 11:12:11 PM  

Should we ostracize someone for not approving of the homosexual lifestyle


is that more fair than people ostracizing homosexuals?


I am a more conservative than liberal. But you're 100% moron.

There are certain things that are NOT partisan beliefs. Racism, sexism and the this crap.

Of course everyone should be entitled to free speech, but to pretend like such an opinion is "valid" is nuts.

The problem is gay-bashers are an embarrassment to people who are both intelligent and conservative (i fully admit this is a rarity)

I would love to hear someone actually try to defend an anti-homosexual stance based on a secular, tangible argument. just once.
2002-06-20 11:12:25 PM  
Scofield99- I'm saying, if Christians want homosexuals to stop being homosexual, they should provide an alternative more desirable than homosexuality. Otherwise, what's the motivation? Justify your anti-gay crusade or don't do it.
2002-06-20 11:17:02 PM  
Yikes! So much idiocy, but others can do more eloquent job rebutting it than I--not that it's worth too much energy, I really don't think anyone reading this thread is going to be changing their opinions either way.

Quick point I can't resist addressing:

KazamaSmokers: I think you're probably sincere and trying to be thoughtful about the non-religious arguments against homosexuality, but your ideas on the subject don't hold any water. Evolution is about perpetuating the *species*, not the individual. Just wanted to flick a light switch, there's plenty of info out there on evolutionary justification for homosexual orientations if ya do a little research. And besides... is there really such an underpopulation problem that gays should be vilified on these grounds? Again, I think you're probably open-minded so I'm not trying to personally attack you.

One other thing that the LOUD MOUTHS that haven't ever seen this show don't seem to compute:

THE SHOW WAS NOT "ABOUT HOMOSEXUALITY". It was about different families, a small proportion of which (even in terms of the representatoin of famliies on the show) happen to be gay. The show wasn't even all about gay families. They even had Jerry Falwell on the show for 'balance'.

If you're going to argue, at least get know the basic FACTS first.

Flame on, people (no pun intended)
2002-06-20 11:17:28 PM  

Using your argument, then TV teching things like history, drugs, or anything else would be just as "bad" of a "move" because kids should learn this from their parents

i dont disagree with your statement that TV shouldnt be the prime source of learning for kids. Of course.

but if you truly are not anti-homosexual (which i do not believe), then how is this any different? Should we not tell kids that shooting up heroin is bad because it will, what, open some of them up to wanting to experiment?

why is it different? its just part of life. That, or take the stance that TV shouldnt exist, or TV shouldnt teach anything
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