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(PalmBeachPost.com)   Church members beat, hog-tie burglary suspect   (palmbeachpost.com) divider line 143
    More: Florida  
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3996 clicks; posted to Main » on 24 Mar 2006 at 3:29 PM (8 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2006-03-24 05:06:18 PM
Nabob: As already mentioned, churches have computers and printers to run the day-to-day business of the church, AV equipment for services and classes, etc. Do you really expect a church to be without any assets at all?

Yes, yes, computers, that is what the thiefs have been after when they have broken into churches since the middle ages, alot of churches spend their money on extravagant things and that is what people are stealing.
 
2006-03-24 05:08:33 PM
Dude, if you're poor, you'll break into a toolshed looking for a sammich.

/just sayin
 
2006-03-24 05:08:35 PM
Rhodekyll: This includes TVs, speaker systems, LCD projectors, computers, sound boards, wiring, chairs, stages, etc. Some churches are very large and wouldn't function well without these.


wow, who knew you needed all those gagets to worship.
 
2006-03-24 05:09:35 PM
jst3p

Yeah, lots of churches are businesses. The good thing is that businessmen know how to grow an organization efficiently. The bad thing is that many of them lose sight of the original purpose and think that the point of it all is the business.
 
2006-03-24 05:12:27 PM
Headso: wow, who knew you needed all those gagets to worship.

In fact, for a church of several hundred or reaching in the thousands, you do. Let me explain this:

People sing and talk onstage, and they use microphones, soundboards, wiring and speakers so people can hear them. During hymns, you can show the lyrics on the LCD projector so everyone can see them.

You obviously have some issues because you're arguing against churches having the right to possess this equipment. That's like me arguing against your right to have a farking toaster; get off it already. If you can buy it, and you can use it, then buy it and stop knocking everyone else for buying what they want.
 
2006-03-24 05:12:52 PM
img142.imageshack.us
 
2006-03-24 05:14:31 PM
Headso
"Yes, yes, computers, that is what the thiefs have been after when they have broken into churches since the middle ages, alot of churches spend their money on extravagant things and that is what people are stealing."

You must have read a different article than I did. I didn't see that this Nazarene church had the actual Holy Grail for the Communion cup! In fact, the article I read just mentioned a string of thefts and didn't elaborate on what was stolen.

Seriously, though, if you had the choice between a TV set, projector, or brass communion cup which would you steal?
 
2006-03-24 05:17:09 PM
Quitting time. If you have additional points to address to me please do so to my email addy in profile.
 
2006-03-24 05:18:00 PM
Headso's just beating the crap out of a strawman.

When Christianity supposedly teaches people not to be greedy and snobby with their possessions, he interprets this as meaning that Christians can't buy nice things with their own money. I don't know much about Christianity, but I know enough about his argument to see that he's just got a thing against Christians and will readily resort to strawman arguments to prove his point.
 
2006-03-24 05:18:47 PM
Rhodekyll: People sing and talk onstage, and they use microphones, soundboards, wiring and speakers so people can hear them. During hymns, you can show the lyrics on the LCD projector so everyone can see them.

how on earth did those people worship before the days of LCD screens and teleprompters they must have been all lost souls.

That's like me arguing against your right to have a farking toaster; get off it already.

One of the ten commandments is, loosely translated, don't worship false idols, what do you think all that gold and silver and expensive paintings are? A true Christian needs only god.
 
2006-03-24 05:19:28 PM
Hero Tag broken?
 
2006-03-24 05:27:16 PM
Rhodekyll: he interprets this as meaning that Christians can't buy nice things with their own money

Not individual Christians, the house of the lord, it shouldn't be filled with valuable ornaments.

regarding individual Christians, it is fine to buy expensive things but they should not devote their lives to attaining them. that would fall under the whole false idol thing.
 
2006-03-24 05:39:30 PM
The IRONIC tag would also apply, but this having happened in Florida...
 
2006-03-24 05:43:10 PM
Nabob: Seriously, though, if you had the choice between a TV set, projector, or brass communion cup which would you steal?


the cup ofcourse, then I could carry it around like little jon.

/OKAAAYYY!
 
2006-03-24 05:43:47 PM
or lil jon, whatever
 
2006-03-24 05:48:10 PM
Rhodekyll

Good one, WayToBlue.

Thanks but I reserve the right to beat the crap out of anyone who intrudes into my house. This is not actually pre-emptive strike, if the person is already in my home. This is self-defense.


It is a preemptive strike to hit someone from behind who is not attacking you, you are hitting them before they (ostensibly) they hit you. It can also be self-defense if you have good reason to believe they really are going to be coming after you, the two are not mutually exclusive.

And also, I'm agnostic.
I never meant to imply otherwise. You seemed to be projecting your actions as a comparison for theirs, so I commented on how those actions would have reflected on them. I am also agnostic, apparently one of the few in this country (and on this site) who actually knows what that means.
 
2006-03-24 05:59:51 PM

When Christianity supposedly teaches people not to be greedy and snobby with their possessions, he interprets this as meaning that Christians can't buy nice things with their own money. I don't know much about Christianity, but I know enough about his argument to see that he's just got a thing against Christians and will readily resort to strawman arguments to prove his point.


The Bible never says Christians can not have nice things, but it frequently warns that the wealthy will have a harder time staying on the right path. Ant it outright says that you need to be careful because wealth leads to idolotry very frequently.
 
2006-03-24 06:07:34 PM
lol, when the fundies stop sending missionaries overseas to destroy other cultures (which they call converting, how very pc) and stops trying to turn the usa into a theocracy and putting I.D in schools, I WILL CONSIDER stopping my ridicule of them.
 
2006-03-24 06:17:15 PM
Headso: Not individual Christians, the house of the lord, it shouldn't be filled with valuable ornaments.


I haven't been to to many churches, but the ones I did go to weren't filled with gold and diamonds; instead they had technology that was useful and helped in worship. Your other argument (they must've been lost souls) assumes that I said worship was impossible without these tools, which is yet another strawman on your part. I simply said that this technology helps facilitate the ease of worship to large groups.

jst3p: wealth leads to idolotry very frequently.

Maybe true, but I don't view these things as just 'nice things;' they are tools to help in worship. Gold and nice windows and hardwood benches would be another story (go figure), but I'm not even talking about those.

There's no reason churches shouldn't have speakers and a decent sound system so they can have Christian bands play. There's also no reason they shouldn't have a projector up to put hymn lyrics up. These things aren't just things, they are tools. I'm pretty sure most of these churches probably considered these things when buying the stuff. I can't say that all churches use their wealth in good ways and don't buy extravagant, useless things.. but you can't speak for all churches and say that all their technology is useless as well. We live in the 21st century; there is technology all around us. People of all faiths have the right to join in and use that technology to their advantage, and I will trust a church to make its own decisions based on what it thinks is best in regards to its religion.
 
2006-03-24 06:19:55 PM
And if you must have it your way, WayToBlue, then fine: When someone breaks into my house, I will kick their ass, rather than ask them what they're up to first. I believe that to be my right, and I think anyone who breaks into someone's house probably isn't looking to cuddle with fluffy bunnies and sip hot chocolate, if you know what I mean. And don't extend this argument to the church--I stated already that I'm just talking about me.
 
2006-03-24 06:20:47 PM
"He who is without sin may cast the first stone"

- Jesus H. Christ

/all seriousness, the farker got what he deserved
//Hero tag more appropriate
 
2006-03-24 06:23:39 PM
That is, [pre-emptively] kick their ass, filter ate it.

Also, I assumed you meant I must be a Christian. I refrained from taking any sort of offense from that, and simply stated that I am Agnostic, for me meaning that I don't follow a God, but I also don't outright deny that there may be one. Anyways, I don't care because I choose not to make religion a part of my life.
 
2006-03-24 06:23:57 PM
Part of the fun is letting the burglar get into your home first and then beating them to death. If you kill someone outside your home you might be charged...once inside you can claim all sorts of self defense things.

Make sure to kill the burglar though...dead men tell no tales and the cops aren't gonna bring in CSI to investigate the dead guy with the criminal record found dead on your living room floor.
 
2006-03-24 06:28:57 PM
asmodeus224: Make sure to kill the burglar though

hah. Okay, maybe I should clarify. I don't really mean I would actively beat the guy into a pulp, just that I would use violence if necessary to subdue him, such as punching him in the face until he drops. Then you hogtie 'em and call the cops. I don't think killing someone is going to get you anywhere though; I've heard a couple stories about people shooting burglars to death inside homes and getting charged with murder.
 
2006-03-24 06:34:43 PM
Rhodekyll

. . . simply stated that I am Agnostic, for me meaning that I don't follow a God, but I also don't outright deny that there may be one.

Then you are not agnostic, please don't use the term, it only adds to the confusion the general public already has on the topic. You are apathetic/indifferent/uninterested toward religion, whichever of those you like, and any and all of which I have no problem with (so don't mistake this as a slam on your beliefs, it isn't meant as one). But please, don't be another person misusing the term agnostic.
 
2006-03-24 06:36:22 PM
Rhodekyll

When someone breaks into my house, I will kick their ass, rather than ask them what they're up to first. I believe that to be my right, and I think anyone who breaks into someone's house probably isn't looking to cuddle with fluffy bunnies and sip hot chocolate, if you know what I mean.

It absolutely is your right, and I never meant to imply otherwise. I apologize if I contributed to any confusion on the issue.
 
2006-03-24 06:36:58 PM
Would you mind enlightening me then? I just looked it up on Wiki, and maybe they've got it wrong..? Maybe I read it wrong? Cause it seems to be pretty close to what I think..
 
2006-03-24 06:42:23 PM
Rhodekyll

Agnostic has various forms, but the basic underlying tenet is that it is impossible to know whether there is a god(s) or not. It does not mean "I don't know," it means "No one knows," and that any discussion on the topic is academic at best as no one can possible know.

It is "unknowable," which was a common agnostic buzzword before it became the fodder of political satire.
 
2006-03-24 06:46:07 PM
Well, I guess I didn't elaborate enough. The reason I don't deny the existence of a higher deity is because, like proving that there is a 'god,' I also don't believe it can be proved that there isn't a god. It's not just because I don't give a crap.

(For the record, I really don't give a crap, but that's only because I've arrived at my conclusion that god, existant or nonexistant, is unprovable, and so I don't have much more thought on the matter.)
 
2006-03-24 06:50:12 PM
I guess I'm kind of from the 'nothing is impossible' school of thought; not necessarily optimism but ... the word fails me.
 
2006-03-24 06:56:41 PM
Congregeatiowned!
 
2006-03-24 06:59:52 PM
Scientists spend $2.5 million studying placebo effect--no one complains.

Scientists spend $2.5 million studying prayer effects--OHHHHHHHHH NOOOOOOOOO!

Religious groups beat the shiat out of stupid intruder--OHHHHHHH NOOOOOOOOOO!

Some other group beats the shiat out of stupid intruder--served him right.

My moral code, which has nothing to do with religion, says not to beat random people up. But in the heat of the moment with an intruder, who knows what I would do.

I can't say that I've ever been harmed by "Christians." But from the vigor in these threads it must suck! I leave them alone and ignore them if they get in my way. Take them out of making laws and you would still have some other idiots making laws that were just as stupid.
 
2006-03-24 07:04:03 PM
tonesskin
How dare you speak with reasonable thought. This is Fark darn it!
 
2006-03-24 07:23:27 PM
Oh boy! It's time to play "Let's make outlandish assertions about the detail-deprived article in order to reinforce our own misguided stereotypes"!

1) The article says nothing about the economic status of the burglar. Therefore, he must've been a poor man with starving kids who just needed a sandwich to get through the night!
2) The article says nothing about how severely the man was beaten, so those vengeful Christians must have pummeled him to within inches of his life!
3) The article says nothing about what was in the church that was being stolen, so obviously it was gaudy, gold-plated idols and diamond studded pews, showing off the greed and hypocrisy of every Christian who ever lived!
 
2006-03-24 07:32:14 PM
What I don't like about christianity is the christians.

I don't know who said that, but I like it.
 
2006-03-24 07:46:11 PM
What I don't like about christianity is the christians.

I thought it was "the reason for atheism is christians" or something like that?

How dare you speak with reasonable thought. This is Fark darn it!

Good point, you Christian poopoo head!
 
2006-03-24 07:58:41 PM
The power of Christ compelled them..
 
2006-03-24 08:18:50 PM
I'll go ahead and come out against you sissie agnostics as well. Sure, you can't prove that there is not a god. But then you can't prove that we're all not being controlled telepathetically by a burn mark on the tortilla of a great invisible burrito buried beneath Detroit, either. That's not an excuse to give credence to a historically violent and socially repressive way of explaining humans being here on earth with precious little to actually do. Other than fark, of course. I just hope someday, not too too many generations from now, we as a species will look at people still praising jesus (or whomever) and say, "Aw, honey. Look at the sweet little religous guy. Do you think some of them still really believe in angels and demons? That's so cute"
 
2006-03-24 08:27:38 PM
looks like the captain pushed Mr Brown off the poop deck.
 
2006-03-24 09:36:07 PM
I don't get it. Why couldn't they have called the police? Did they not have a phone??
 
2006-03-25 01:56:40 PM
My church really doesn't care if atheist etc. like us or not. If the burglar came in our's he would still be there...somewhere. Who care's who likes it.

I want to know which atheistic Farker still has duct tape residue on his wrists...own up!
 
2006-03-25 02:58:25 PM
They should have shot his ass. Very Christian of them to spare his life.
 
2006-03-25 03:16:51 PM
Wow, a religious flamewar, who would have thought?

Alot of people seem to think that the backlash is a almost imprinted response to the word "christians". I think it's more like this: People get pissed because SOME christians don't like to live by thier own self-appointed high standards, yet, those same christians will try to get the non-christian folks to follow thier rules (i.e: creationism, homosexuality, marriage in general.. etc.. etc..).

So, when they show themselves to be hypocrites, they get this backlash. Personally, I blame the aggressive christians for this attitude. If they weren't so steadfast in trying to get everyone in step with thier belief system, I'd be willing to bet that there wouldn't be so much contempt for thier religion.

/Too early for rants.
//Need Coffee.
///And slashies.
 
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