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(Some Editorial)   "Intellectual poverty is the most striking quality of the Bush administration's new National Security Strategy statement, issued on Thursday." And it gets better from there   (iht.com) divider line 353
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19130 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Mar 2006 at 11:57 AM (8 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2006-03-19 02:12:08 PM
ZipBeep: Can we get Ross Perot to lead? I miss him. He was a funny fark and the most fun in politics maybe ever.

Kucinich was almost as good (bringing charts and graphs to a radio debate), and, like Perot, appeared to have some Gnome in his gene pool.
 
2006-03-19 02:12:24 PM
For ZipBeep

www.thenation.com
 
2006-03-19 02:12:31 PM
Lebowski
arguing over this is pointless.... how often do you think people minds are changed by others opinion? very little.
i see these 'discussions' on fark all the time and while i must say i do agree with a certain side of the argument, the way in which these arguments take place is very unorganized and therefore very meaningless. if someone unfamiliar with fark username and personalities looked at this they wouldnt have a clue as too what was going on. unfortuneatly this is the weakness of forums...random discourse with nothing to take from it..


Couldn't you have just said "fark it" I mean, isn't that your answer for everything?

/your revolution is OVER!
//condolences
 
2006-03-19 02:13:17 PM
Weaver95

Water under the bride tho

Cleanup on Aisle 1!

/got nothin
 
2006-03-19 02:14:28 PM
Water under the bride

See, that's where a good midwife can come in handy-
 
2006-03-19 02:14:46 PM
corn-bread

Seeing that my comment was posted well before yours, what makes you think it was in response to yours?

It was acutally directed at comments like; "From 1992 to 2000, the national deficit went from $4.06 trillion to $5.67 trillion"
 
2006-03-19 02:14:53 PM
ZipBeep:

Did Ross Perot like beer and boobies? He did like funny charts and graphics...and nothing is better than a kooky old man with big ears.

Of course bbbbut Clinton liked boobies...albeit "fatties"...

Ol' Bush just seems to get a hard-on from war, doublespeak, and strawman arguements.
 
2006-03-19 02:15:01 PM
Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: so who owns these little pieces of paper?

China's making a big push to pick a lot of them up. But don't let that worry a single hair on your pretty little head. Nothing can possibly go wrong because of that.
 
2006-03-19 02:15:07 PM
so who owns these little pieces of paper?

About 44% is owned by foreign interests with 2/3rd of that number being held by central banks (Japan and China are the biggest holders in that category). The rest is owned by financial insitutions and individuals in the US (through ownership in Treasury Bonds).
 
2006-03-19 02:15:15 PM
the United States has "the ultimate goal of ending tyranny in our world."

The Tao of Bush

To truly conquer evil you must become best at it.
Freedom of Speech means to say the right things.
Stay where you belong.
Consume.
 
2006-03-19 02:17:30 PM
Weaver95: I'm wondering why the international green groups aren't cracking down hard on China these days.

Just Google "green China protests pollution" for lots of interesting stuff. Apparently the Chinese are getting pissed off, as communist functionaries become laissez faire capitalists, thus preserving the staus quo at the top.
 
2006-03-19 02:17:49 PM
Duke Phillips' Singing Bears

hold on a sec - I have NO econ background, so I'm slow on this - you mean that big fat ugly number (our debt) is actually represented in paper certificates that somebody else owns?

(i told you i was slow at this, bear with me, please)

so who owns these little pieces of paper?



U.S. citizens (through savings bonds), state and local governments, and foreign entities (governments and others).

Russia, Japan, and South Korea own a large amount as they use it to save money for pension funds. And in recent years, China has been buying it a few hundred million at a time.

Here's an older link, but you get the point:
Linky.
 
2006-03-19 02:18:04 PM
gomachan: How many posts will it take until those who are trying to set the record straight figure out the difference between debt and deficit?

My bad.
 
2006-03-19 02:18:49 PM
I_Hate_Iowa

So, everything's okay because my head is purty?

Thank god!

I'm gonna go shampoo and condition my hair just to be sure.
I'm doing my part! How about you?
 
2006-03-19 02:19:25 PM
Well, damn, I already knew about the intellectual poverty of this administration. What strikes me is now people get it? Ah well, there was a silver lining to him getting re-elected, after all.
 
2006-03-19 02:19:31 PM
Weaver95

You can still use the waste to create a 'dirty' bomb. Not efficent, ugly and small yield - but given the nature of warfare in that area of the world, it'd get the job done. You could use something like that to fark up japanese port facilities for years.

Why in God's name would they do that? There would be no benefit at all to China using a "dirty nuke" on Japan at this point. That's paranoid and delusional. You make it sound like the Chinese would use what is essentially a terrorist tactic (not to mention completely de-stabilizing the region economically) just to wipe out a few Japanese. The Chinese don't need such tactics with their current military and booming economy.
 
2006-03-19 02:20:30 PM
sonnyboy11

He was talking about North Korea.
 
2006-03-19 02:20:53 PM
gomachan

Seeing that my comment was posted well before yours, what makes you think it was in response to yours?

It was acutally directed at comments like; "From 1992 to 2000, the national deficit went from $4.06 trillion to $5.67 trillion"


I was just wondering where you were going on that.

Periodically in discussions like these, we'll get some real tools who will open with comments like that, just before they go on to explain "our deficit is only 5 percent of GNP, so it's not a big deal."

Wasn't attacking or anything, just curious what you were getting at.
 
2006-03-19 02:21:28 PM
sonnyboy11: Why in God's name would they do that? There would be no benefit at all to China using a "dirty nuke" on Japan at this point

I believe he meant North Korea using a weapon on Japan. But I might be wrong.
 
2006-03-19 02:21:42 PM
spelunking_defenestrator

Dingdingding! I win teh intarspeednetz!

/said "spelunking"
//said "defenestrator"
///mind the gap
 
2006-03-19 02:25:20 PM
I much the prefer the detailed alternative plan that was offered.
 
2006-03-19 02:28:12 PM
Can someone please post the text from Pages 3 and 4?
 
2006-03-19 02:28:43 PM
i47.photobucket.com
 
2006-03-19 02:31:55 PM
Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: I'm gonna go shampoo and condition my hair just to be sure.
I'm doing my part! How about you?



i48.photobucket.com
 
2006-03-19 02:33:11 PM
Oye Vay.

I didn't even invest in Haliburton.
Jan. 2002? $9.

Today? Right around $80.
 
2006-03-19 02:33:13 PM
"So the Dem response is to nominate a candidate who - according to the academic records he finally released (as promised - if late) - got worse grades & scores?

We had a President who was almost always the smartest person in the room. Carter. Even most Dems admit his tenure wasn't all that great. In 2008 we may get Hillary. Even if she is as smart as she (and the Mr.) thinks she is, I expect a Hillary tenure to be just as much of a galloping mediocracy - based upon her past "successes" at running things and influencing people. The old joke is that the Senate is a room full of 100 people who all know they would be a better President than whoever the current one is - but sadly I think being one of a hundred prima-donas translates poorly into being THE prima-dona.

As to Bush being an idiot - I have to side with the Libertarians - all politicians are idiots. To some degree. But between Bush/Gore and Bush/Kerry I still suspect we got the lesser of two idiots both times....."

I would like to thank you for proving me right and failing to address the real issue entirely. "You feel" is not even a remotely valid arguement.
 
2006-03-19 02:34:09 PM
Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: so who owns these little pieces of paper?

I couldn't seem to find, specifically, which countries own our debts, but this link is helpful:

http://www.publicdebt.treas.gov/opd/opd.htm#history (pops)

On it's own, debt is not necessarily a bad thing. It's called leverage when you're a corporation. However, how quickly that debt rises and what the carrying rate is compared to GNP is important.

Here's a nice concise list of where we stand (by percentage) in a world full of debtors. You'll be happy to know that Fance has a little more debt (again, by percentages) than we do:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_public_debt (pops)
 
2006-03-19 02:41:50 PM
The Billdozer: WashingtonJeffersonHamiltonBush: The Billdozer: That doesn't meake you a sound fiscal president or some kind of freaking economics guru, it makes you someone that had taxes higher than what was needed to support the goverment.

So, collecting less in taxes than is needed to run the government does make you a sound fiscal President? Seriously, are you twelve?

Guess you missed where I said I disliked Bush's spending policies.




And here I thought you were talking about taxes, not spending.
 
2006-03-19 02:46:06 PM
Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: hold on a sec - I have NO econ background, so I'm slow on this - you mean that big fat ugly number (our debt) is actually represented in paper certificates that somebody else owns?

(i told you i was slow at this, bear with me, please)

so who owns these little pieces of paper?


There are a couple of different kinds of public debt.

Bill, Bonds, Notes, and TIPS.

They vary in terms of rate, terms of payment, and liquidity.

The single largest owner of Treasury Debt Instruments is the U.S. itself. Businesses, private individuals, etc.

If you have a 401(k)/403(b), an annuity, guaranteed it's got some in public debt.

Currently about 44% of debt is held overseas, and 66% is held here.

People scream chicken little, but we do have options.

1. First is lower foreign aid, and demand payment on debt we are already owed that we don't really expect payment on.

2. Stop spending so much damn money. People are quick to blame defense. It's a cop-out though. If you lumped all social programs into one group and called it "Poor People" it would dwarf defense. (Army, Navy, Coast Guard, Nat'l. Guard)

As a side note, people expenditures (ie non expensive toys) spent on Defense has a high payout. It's etimated that for every dollar spent on the G.I. Bill, we get $8 back.

Unfortunately, we've reduced troop sized in favor of toys.

3. Collect actual taxes owed. Our defecit would go to Zero if we actually collected what is cheated on taxes.

BUT, the higher tax rates encourage cheating. It's like Canadians crossing to fill up for gas. There is a magic price where cheating is a more viable option and revenue lowers.
 
2006-03-19 03:01:20 PM
thanks for the good answers to my questions, y'all.

still, it makes me a titchy bit worried that a good portion of our debt is owned by foreign interests. Of course, I don't really have a concrete reason for that, it just doesn't, you know, feel right to me.

I guess I needs to do me some studying

/im so glad i got an english degree
//you want fries with that?
 
2006-03-19 03:06:05 PM
The Billdozer:
When it comes down to it, liberals go on the attack because they don't have anything of substance or importance to say and if they do, it gets drowned out.

physician, heal thyself.
 
2006-03-19 03:09:17 PM
Duke Phillips' Singing Bears: still, it makes me a titchy bit worried that a good portion of our debt is owned by foreign interests.


Don't worry. If Japan forecloses on us, we'll just give them Rhode Island.
 
2006-03-19 03:19:22 PM
"44% of debt is held overseas, and 66%"

I had no idea we were 110% in debt. Was that one of the Bush campaign promises?
 
2006-03-19 03:21:54 PM
Weaver95: Don't look at me - as far as I'm concerned the Dubai port deal was the last straw. Have at 'em man, I'm done with them.

My head just asploded.
 
2006-03-19 03:26:07 PM
Abagadro

sonnyboy11

He was talking about North Korea.


I stand corrected. Sry
 
2006-03-19 03:29:28 PM
"Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul."

You know, though this was used in the movie Billy Madison, I can easily imagine an 18th Century English editorialist saying that about James Madison.

Isn't it funny how editorialists can be so critical of things they neither understand, appreciate or comprehend? I guess it's why they write editorials instead of rule the world.
 
2006-03-19 03:37:38 PM
whammer: Isn't it funny how editorialists can be so critical of things they neither understand, appreciate or comprehend?

I assume the 18th Century English/American editorialist would have been writing about the events leading up to the War of 1812, in which President Madison spent more time and money drumming up support for the war than he spent building up the army, navy, forts or state militias.

Sound familiar?
 
2006-03-19 03:45:42 PM
But they're rich and stuff...
 
2006-03-19 03:57:35 PM
PARIS Intellectual poverty is the most striking quality of the Bush administration's new National Security Strategy statement, issued on Thursday.

I stopped reading at "Paris".

Seriously, does anyone take French political commentary seriously these days? These people couldn't handle the Algerians, let alone a global Islamist threat.
 
2006-03-19 04:01:03 PM
"A few days earlier, Rice and President George W. Bush were in India on the same mission, making a "historic" gesture that conferred on India a nuclear partnership with America and authorized it to keep its nuclear weapons."

That's very good of you, I'm sure. Since when did America gain the right to "authorise" a sovereign nation's weapons?
 
2006-03-19 04:01:05 PM
Mouser: Seriously, does anyone take French political commentary seriously these days? These people couldn't handle the Algerians, let alone a global Islamist threat.

Yeah they never conquered a large chunk of the known world or anything. Damn french and their centuries of rich history and culture!!
 
2006-03-19 04:06:09 PM
Mouser: Seriously, does anyone take French political commentary seriously these days? These people couldn't handle the Algerians, let alone a global Islamist threat.


Seriously, are you an idiot? They did about as well with Algeria as we did with Vietnam. And we don't seem to be doing too well against "a global Islamist threat."

Besides, did you happen to notice the name of the newspaper?


whammer: Isn't it funny how editorialists can be so critical of things they neither understand, appreciate or comprehend?

Isn't it funny how some editorialist in Paris can sound a lot smarter than our Commander in Chief? No? Not funny?
 
2006-03-19 04:06:56 PM
How can anyone still support Bush after all that he's done?

Doesn't anyone care about the constitution anymore? How about your money? Your kid's lives?

This country is going to shiat. It has been for a while under both Dem. and Repub. admins, but now its just speeding up.

And anyone arguing between conservatives and liberals are idiots. Who the hell cares what word you use as an umbrella over your head to save you the trouble of coming up with your own opinions. Democrat/Republican, Liberal/Conservative, none of these terms even matter. The two parties aren't really any different from one another. About as different as two side of the same coin.

"Oh, and this country would be better under Kerry?"
"OMFG, Kerry is better than Bush!"

USELESS

IT DOESN'T FARKING MATTER WHO SITS IN THE CHAIR!

These aren't important issues. Gay people getting married, evolution vs creationism, avian flu, these are all just bullshiat arguments spoon-fed to you idiots through your TV.

Here is the problem! Choose your side and argue like its important. And remember, your opinion is the only one that matters!

Its a waste of time and a waste of energy, just to distract everyone and make them feel like they hold opinions on important things in this country.

How about the real problems at hand?

We're fighting a war on the other side of the planet based on lies. How the hell are we going to get out of there before more lives are lost?

What are we going to do if and when the oil runs out?

Why does the government want my google searches?!

Its a scary world out there, and watching the idiotic rhetoric that goes on from both sides just makes it scarier...
 
2006-03-19 04:08:30 PM
What a surprise another whiney pile of dung from the liberals. How about an alternative? How about some ideas for once? It would do us conservatives some good if you brought something to the table other than, "I hate Bush".
I will give you a free one. FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY!!!! Seriously, can someone from my state please run with the promise of FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY? Democrat or republican I would vote for that person if they promised to balance the budget.
\REPUBLICAN
\\Would vote for Democrats if they got their $hit together
\\\slash
\\\\We are in Iraq, the debate is over. Lets work on a strategy to win.
 
2006-03-19 04:19:29 PM
SofaKingSweet: We are in Iraq, the debate is over. Lets work on a strategy to win.

i'm open to suggestion.

feel free to make a mental assocation of 'he doesn't see an answer' all the way to 'he must be liberal, thus dung filled!', if ya like, but i just don't see it.

there are a pile of options on the table, and they all look like taking different bites out of the same shiat sammich to me.
 
2006-03-19 04:24:12 PM
If Bush had cured AIDS and cancer, billdozer, rather than what he has done, I would have a very different opinion of him. Don't try to pull that doublespeak BS in here, it'll... well, it'll usually work, but it's still BS.
 
2006-03-19 04:25:01 PM
SofaKingSweet: \\\\We are in Iraq, the debate is over. Lets work on a strategy to win.

I agree with your last slashie, but I think it's important to find out exactly how we got to this point, so hopefully it won't happen again - while at the same time working on a solution. I don't believe the two to be mutually exclusive.

I also agree that the Democrats need to get it together, but so do the Republicans - now more than ever. If you thought the last election, from a Democratic perspective, was "anybody but Bush", just wait until November. I bet the Republicans are going to start separating themselves even more from Bush. I think pretty soon both sides are going to start pronouncing that you're either with them, or you're with Bush.
 
2006-03-19 04:28:00 PM
3 step plan for fixing iraq.
1. Garrison Bagdad..Done
2. Train some of the citizens to be entertainers.
3. Swich our government to communism, theres too much corruption and waste in Bagdad when washington DC is on the other side of the world.
 
2006-03-19 04:28:05 PM
http://www.perfectpeople.net/biopage.php3/cid=1296

did you know that chuck norris is half mexican!
 
2006-03-19 04:32:32 PM
jookey22: 2. Train some of the citizens to be entertainers.


Is there anything that can't be learned from Civilization?
I think not.
 
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