Because we refuse to allow new refineries to be built?Hmm?

That's like saying "grain production is dropping because we have no new bakeries". Think about how absurd that is.

As for the refineries issue, you should be aware that US refining capacity (which is all that matters) has been increasing at the rate of the equivalent of one medium-sized refinery per year for a couple decades now.

This "we need more refineries" crap is a canard.

Nice job, submitter. Berke Breathed would be proud.

canyoneer
"...rubes..."

I love that word.

canyoneer:

Listen, nimrod. You're making assumptions about my position. I was simply relaying data and presenting a link to the report. You have suddenly assumed I am an SUV-driving Ohioan who is ignorant of all things natural. You have no idea what my position on energy is. In fact, your assessment is quite inaccurate. Screw you, and everyone like you.

It could have been ours.

Stupid Treaty of Guadalupe-Hidalgo

2006-03-15 12:44:29 PM RanDomino

Those are some really good ideas. I find your ideas intriguing and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter. (No, really).

I'd like to humbly add to your list an extremely high tax on gasoline, natural gas, and related items. Certainly enough to push the price of power significantly higher than it would require for renewable energy to be competitive.

/Power prices should be at least double what they are now
//Gas prices too, probably triple, maybe more
///Don't like it? You'll like it less when civilization collapses.

canyoneer
what's with the abuse of Ohio man? Don't make me come over there and hurt...
your feelings.

FeFiFoFark:

I'm not from anywhere near Ohio. canyoneer pulled that (along with everything else he's said) out of his ass.

MickCollins: You think oil comes from refineries? I guess you think water comes from the tap, and food from the grocery store, too.

I live in Broke Dick, Ohio.

So I am really getting a kick out of most of these replies...

RanDomino, I'd like to add:

Seriously explore the feasability of non-breeding fast-neutron nuclear reactors using on-site pyrometallurgical processed waste from slow reactors for fuel.

I'm a big fan of wind and solar, but existing slow-neutron reactors has only extracted 5% of the usable energy from their spent fuel and have created a huge storage problem.

IC_Weener:

Do you think I should have waited until it was dead?

information_entropy: /Damm, PartyGirl is cute.
//I wonder what her mom looks like.
///Yea, I that old.

I had Jury Duty yesterday and sat next to a woman who looks exactly like you PartyGirl

Freaky

And yea.. definately cute. Both you and the girl I sat next too.

FeFiFoFark: what's with the abuse of Ohio man? Don't make me come over there and hurt...
your feelings.

People make fun of Ohio when they need a break from bashing Indiana.

We're like retarded brothers IN and OH.

I'm not as familiar with nuclear waste reprocessing as I wish I was. If it works out thermodynamically, go for it, especially if it gets rid of all this waste (hopefully the process spits out lead, which, while being toxic, is useable and preferable to radioactive waste). It's not sustainable since there exists very little fissible material on this planet, but it could provide a little boost.

jph
i wasn't talking (so to speak) to you.

Personally, I'm a big proponent for Population Reduction. As unpopular as it is to say, I think the world could stand to lose AT LEAST half of its population. If we lost 65% of the world's population, it would only set the world's population back 50 years. Certainly having less mouths to feed would lower the ever increasing demand for resources, be it water, oil, energy, or arable land. Unfortunately, to even propose letting this many people die labels me a monster.

YEAR WORLD POPULATION (in millions, estimated)

1650 500
1700 600
1750 700
1800 900
1850 1300
1900 1700
1950 2500
1976 4000
2000 7000

Or, if you want a more in depth study: check this out

I don't have anything against Ohio. I just have a problem with the widespread attitude that whenever it's time to bury a lot of glow-in-the-dark poison, test new weapons, bulldoze entire mountain ranges for "oil shale," or build "spaceports" for tittering upperclass twits, it should be done "out West." Most clown Americans say this reflexively. No thought. Something big, dirty, and unpleasant "needs" to be done? "Put it out West!"

Well, fark that. I say if a bunch of flatlanders need a new poison pit or bombing range, put it back East! Keep your damned trash.

Canyoneer - try this - google methane hydrate. Some folks just can't get their brains to think out of the little box they have created for themselves.

Spindle
MONSTER!!

Sparhawk.
Oh, great, another abiotic oil lunatic. If oil is abiotic and basically infinite and Peak Oil is all a hoax, why does US oil production keep dropping year after year?

Laziness?

canyoneer
why don't you check out how much out of state garbage is shipped to and burried in Ohio - then get back to me.


/I love the western US.

FeFiFoFark
Oh great, now I'm going to have this song in my head for the rest of the day:

There's a monster in my pants
And it does a nasty dance
When it moves in and out
Everybody starts to shout

Monster, aaaah monster, aaaah
Get outta here monster!
Monster! Monster!
Get outta here monster!

There's a monster in my pants
And It does a nasty dance
When it sees the light of day
You can here the people say

Oh no, a monster! Oh no, a monster!
Oh no, oh no, oh no a giant monster
Monster! Monster!
Oh no, a giant monster!

Shut the window, bolt the door!
Don't wanna see that monster no more!

There's a monster in my pants
And it does a modern dance
When it comes into a room
People hit it with a broom

Take that monster! Take that monster!
Take it! Take it! Take that you awful thing!
Take that aaah! Take that aaah!
Take it! Take it! Take that you naughty thing!

And they don't wear pants on the other side of France
But they do wear fleece to protect them from the beasts

Monster! Monster! Oh gee, a great big monster

There's a monster on the run and it wants to have have some fun
When it flies hup in the air, all the people stop and stare
The guys give a yell and the girls start to shriek
When they see its giant claws and it razor sharp beak

Gosh would you look at that thing
And I thought dinosaurs were extinct

I for one welcome our new Mexican oil overlords.

/DRTFA

jph

Name calling and ass shoving aside, it's still expensive as fark to get marketable oil out of the shale. It doesn't even become economically feasible until you hit $40 a barrel. On the lighter side, we're averaging over $60 and out of the 1.6 trillion potential barrels of shale oil in the world, 1.2 trillion are in the U.S.

/god bless america, biatches

I-C-Weener
Ohio Presidents = 8

Harrison (x2)
Harding
Hayes
Garfield
Grant
McKinley
Taft

hahaha flatlanders

I can just see you now, weed stalk hangin out of your mouth, cup-o-moonshine for breakfast, index-pecking away at your trs-80. "them dadgum flatlanders out there in hollywierd aint gonna dump their poison in my yard. Zeke! Get me my scattergun!"

Spindle:
YEAR WORLD POPULATION (in millions, estimated)
...
1950 2500
1976 4000
2000 7000

1950 2556
1976 4157
2000 6081
2006 6525

http://www.census.gov/ipc/www/worldpop.html

To put this in perspective, this field - if it's as big as claimed - amounts to about 4 months of world usage.

(I know i forgot to cite who said it, but several did)

This statement is true, kinda. But only about half of the oil in any given well is economically feasible to recover (meaning the rest takes more money to get than it earns). So in practice, only about two months. Not to mention that world demand will be in all likelyhood greater in the decade it actually takes to develop the field, so by then it will last an even shorter amount of time.

/oil shale? are you retarded?
//abiogenic? *sigh*

Its my belief that there is no oil shortage...
just demand and supply games by oil execs and more...

they cut back on the refineries to rais demand and prices...

too lazy to spell or grammer check... nazi's...

Well, so much for doing anything about the illegal aliens.
/Mexican oil means more illegals for us!
//Hurray!

jph

That's nice. There are 600 billion barrels in Colorado.

Yep, with a ROEI of ~ 2. Really worthless with current tech.

And this Mexican find is deep water (3000 + ft down), which kills the ROEI. It will take years to come on line (and with Mexico declining @ 45%/yr, it will barely keep up current production).

Its not like shootin' at some food then up from the ground comes a bubblin' crude.

\still long on oil

Am I the first one in the thread to mention that there's an active debate about drilling in deep water off of Florida's northern coast?

Ah, well. I'll save that for another thread.

Rialto Honky:

"There is science, logic, reason; there is thought verified by experience. And then there is California."

- Edward Abbey

RanDomino, well written, though unrealistic in practice.

So, here's what we need to do to save civilization:
First and foremost, guarantee a good education to everyone in the world send all your fine women to Clay to breed, creating a superior race.

All your gas station are belong to us!

WTF is with all of the energy consumption in the East, anyway? You can't throw a rock in MA without it landing in the next town. But MA uses more petroleum than AZ for transport. The whole farking state is smaller than any county in AZ. What? Are people just driving around in circles? Build some trains, ferchrissakes.

Icy Weener
I don't consider G W Bush a president. Too ignorant about Hayes, McKinley and the 2 Harrisons to speculate.

also, is Ohio the older or younger retarded brother?

I'm all for high oil prices. It's the only way we'll ever get around to finding something better.

2006-03-15 01:20:24 PM canyoneer

WTF is with all of the energy consumption in the East, anyway? You can't throw a rock in MA without it landing in the next town. But MA uses more petroleum than AZ for transport. The whole farking state is smaller than any county in AZ. What? Are people just driving around in circles? Build some trains, ferchrissakes.

The MBTA is actually an excellent* train system. I use it to get to work every day. There are also many commuter lines.

* Excellent by today's standards. Paltry and inadequate by any reasonable standards.

Oh, but I keep reading how we are running out of oil.

Well, maybe next century, then.

SVenus: Am I the first one in the thread to mention that there's an active debate about drilling in deep water off of Florida's northern coast? ....

Maybe by then the mysterious disappearance of Alabama and Georgia will be solved.
Florida's northern coast?

/;-)

I can just see you now, weed stalk hangin out of your mouth, cup-o-moonshine for breakfast, index-pecking away at your trs-80. "them dadgum flatlanders out there in hollywierd aint gonna dump their poison in my yard. Zeke! Get me my scattergun!"

Wow... are you lookin' in my window? Except that's a P4-2.8ghz dell, not a TRS-80. I never was a fan of 68xx series processors. I did implement a few in embedded stuff, but for that I preferred TI70xx series parts. Most of it was encryption related so the 7020 was a natural choice. I'm doing a bit of brushing up on 68xx series code, but I don't care for this cross assembler I got for free off the web. I figure I can write as good a code for my LT1 as any GM engineer.

And my scattergun doesn't scatter a lot, except every other shot. It's a remington riot pump with a slug every other round.

Icy Weener
Hey..explain this:
A grandson of President William Henry Harrison and great-grandson of Benjamin Harrison V, Benjamin was born at 8:57 pm, on Tuesday August 20, 1833 in North Bend, Hamilton County, Ohio to John Scott Harrison (later a U.S. Congressman from Ohio) and Elizabeth Ramsey Irwin. He attended Miami University, Oxford, Ohio, where he was a member of the fraternity Phi Delta Theta, (later in life, he joined a legal fraternity that would become Delta Chi) and graduated in 1852. He studied law in Cincinnati then moved to Indianapolis in 1854. He was admitted to the bar and became reporter of the decisions of the state supreme court.

The whole farking state is smaller than any county in AZ.

Each town has more people in it than the entire state of AZ. Most of them can read, too.

/lives in Boston
//takes the T to work
///move the car to avoid street cleaning more often than to go anywhere
////lived in a tent in AZ for 3 months a while ago