FARK.com: (1894394) Problem: If credit card holders pay in full each month, the bank can't charge late fees. Solution: Bring forward the payment date if they regularly pay on time

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		Problem: If credit card holders pay in full each month, the bank can't charge late fees. Solution: Bring forward the payment date if they regularly pay on time (news.bbc.co.uk)		157
		More: Asinine

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24255 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Feb 2006 at 6:05 PM | Favorite | share:

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Gig103		2006-02-04 04:16:35 PM

Solution: Cancel your Barclaycard right now.

Tekdude		2006-02-04 04:18:04 PM

Wow... and they're so open about it... just... wow...

7of7		2006-02-04 04:21:18 PM

Solution

I know there are some times when it's unavoidable to use a credit card, but in the past a lot of that was because you just didn't have enough money in your wallet to buy a washing machine. With the advent of debit cards, there are not a whole lot of reasons to use a credit card unless you're a fiscally unstable person. I've got one, but it has a -$2 balance on it. Damn credit card companies refuse to pay interest on negative balances.

Barry		2006-02-04 04:24:39 PM

Well 7,

A credit card still holds a lot more protections then a debit card. When an unauthorized purchase is made w/ credit card you can simply contest it and not pay. When you use a debit card you have to fight just to get your own money back.

rhiannon		2006-02-04 04:25:56 PM

"there are not a whole lot of reasons to use a credit card unless you're a fiscally unstable person."

Do you travel much? It's a little difficult booking a hotel room in the States from Canada using a debit card.

TheChaz		2006-02-04 04:29:35 PM

rhiannon: It's a little difficult booking a hotel room in the States from Canada using a debit card.

Odd I had no problem booking a hotel room in Canada with my American debit card.

7of7		2006-02-04 04:31:42 PM

I dunno about you guys, but my debit card guarantees 0 liabilty. I even canceled payment on a BMG charge when I forgot to cancel my account with them after I got my 12 CDs free. The money is put right back into the account ASAP. It's pretty sweet. As for making purchases overseas my debit card was gladly taken in London, Germany, Italy, Austria, and everywhere in between.

rhiannon		2006-02-04 04:34:19 PM

Maybe it has to do with most Cdn businesses accepting American currency, whereas a lot of American businesses won't accept Cdn. I honestly don't know.

rhiannon		2006-02-04 04:36:04 PM

Hell, car rental agencies won't rent you a car in Ontario without a credit card. Some used to accept a deposit, but not anymore.

Barry		2006-02-04 04:40:49 PM

7 of 7,

Note that it still had to "put" it "back" into your account and the credit card doesn't have to.

Also, does your debit card providec cash back? Does it double your warranty on electronics purchases?

cruci fiction		2006-02-04 04:45:22 PM

The wise use of credit is very helpful, credit cards are not evil and utilizing them to maximize your current available cash is good practice. The only problem with them is that CC companies give them to everyone and most people are idiots.

7of7		2006-02-04 04:48:29 PM

If your credit card provides all sorts of rewards and whatnot, I have no problem with you having it. The thing that gets me is when people spend more money than they have or could possibly make, and go into horrible debt. It bugs me that the credit card is such an easy way for stupid people to make stupid decisions. Oh well, c'est la vie. For me credit cards are just too risky.

Barry		2006-02-04 04:50:51 PM

Sorry,

I just got out of a forum of Dave Ramsey heads and now I pick fights when someone goes on about the evils of credit cards.... You do have some good point though 7...

Matrix Flavored Wasabi		2006-02-04 05:16:03 PM

rhiannon: Maybe it has to do with most Cdn businesses accepting American currency, whereas a lot of American businesses won't accept Cdn. I honestly don't know.

The equivalent amount of the native currency is taken from your account (at least, that's how it works when I order things from Japanese retailers with my debit card).

ZAZ		2006-02-04 05:52:51 PM

Renting a car is hard with a debit card; some places insist on taking hundreds of dollars out of your account up front.

GizmoToy		2006-02-04 06:03:52 PM

7of7: The thing that gets me is when people spend more money than they have or could possibly make, and go into horrible debt. It bugs me that the credit card is such an easy way for stupid people to make stupid decisions. Oh well, c'est la vie. For me credit cards are just too risky.

I mean this as inoffensively as possible... but... you seem to have just said that you're a stupid person and a credit card would allow you to make stupid decisions. Otherwise, the credit card poses no risk to you, personally.

AngryTeacher		2006-02-04 06:15:28 PM

Didn't RTFA, but MBNA pulled this with me. For the last 7 years, I paid in full every month. I always had a 29 - 32 day billing cycle. About three months ago, I had a 12 day billing cycle. I paid in full, then cancelled the card. But, that is probably exactly what they wanted me to do.

RockIsDead		2006-02-04 06:15:32 PM

HAHA!

Some points I brought up in the last credit card company shenanigan thread. Maybe it's more believable now.

theeagle		2006-02-04 06:16:42 PM

I have had a couple of bills that come in the mail at the payment date or not enough time for the payment to make it through the mail to get to them to be processed...But they knew the problem and never attempted to charge any late fee...And good for that...
But the occational one gets notified very quickly if they try.

I would go back to using all cash if I had it....Saves all that bloody tracking they do of you...That also goes for those supermarket customer price cut on purchace cards....

Stephenm508		2006-02-04 06:16:53 PM

My debit card has a Visa logo.

doodler		2006-02-04 06:17:56 PM

30 days until I'm done with the only unsecured debt I have left.

Then those motherfarkers can rot in hell and die.

/American Express, don't leave home without it. Alot cheaper than anything else in a pinch.

olddinosaur		2006-02-04 06:18:22 PM

So, all the more reason to not have a credit card. "Pay cash or do without it; not only does compound interest eat up your mone, awareness of debt eats up your peace of mind."
----------- ROBERT A. HEINLEIN

---No red ink on the books since 1986 for me.
\gloat.
\\gloat.
\\\gloat some more.

pSPAZz		2006-02-04 06:19:06 PM

I think you americans are refering to debit-credit cards, like the Visa Cheque cards? Here in canada we have a debit card system tied directly to our bank account, but it doesn't use the Visa/MC type transactions to get things done.

onomatopoetic		2006-02-04 06:19:45 PM

I almost wish I had a barcalycard so I could cancel it.

7of7		2006-02-04 06:20:04 PM

Otherwise, the credit card poses no risk to you, personally.

I'm definitely a stupid person, all people are stupid in some ways. Howver, I have never felt that credit cards pose a risk to me personally except in that credit card compaines always pull this type of shennanigan to try and screw people who are careful to pay their bills in time. I personally just don't like delaying payment for things until the end of the month.

dervish16108		2006-02-04 06:21:51 PM

Barclay is the same bank that made money off the slave trade. No surprise here.

Klintor		2006-02-04 06:22:12 PM

And here come the "I pay my credit card off every month I AM ELITE" crew

L.Darte		2006-02-04 06:22:16 PM

MBNA has got to be the worst credit card agency on the planet. They've been caught doing all sorts of nasty tricks to get penalties added to the cardholder's bill. The trick that got me to shred their card was one in which they would let your payment checks sit around (up to 14 days in my case) until the due date expired and then postmarking them and socking you with a late fee. They got in trouble with the feds for this.

Other tricks include making the payment due before 6:00AM on the due day.

ChickenOnaStick		2006-02-04 06:22:20 PM

You know, I'm as capitalist and conservative as they come when it comes to the free market economy, BUT THIS BLOWS. I don't know who Barclaycard is, but to hell with them. Burn the embassies.

elchip		2006-02-04 06:23:35 PM

Solution: Don't pay your credit card in full each month.
Result: Hot hot 15% interest rate

Fark Me To Tears		2006-02-04 06:23:51 PM

Duh!

Chase bank does this to me on a Visa card. I use the card primarily for gasoline purchases, so I pay it off every month. Every so often, they will put an obscure little notice (in fine print) somewhere on the bill indicating that my due date might be changed on future statements. Then over the next few months, they move the due date around every month, like they're trying to shake me off. It doesn't matter. I actually read my statements when I get them, and I make sure that I pay them on time, regardless of the due date.

Credit card companies use the term "deadbeat" for a cardmember who always pay his bills in full and on time every month. The logic is that they don't make any money off of these customers -- THAT IS NOT TRUE! Don't ever believe this lie. CREDIT CARD COMPANIES MAKE MONEY OFF OF EVERY SINGLE TRANSACTION. I used to process credit cards as part of my job -- Mastercard, Visa, and American Express -- and even though the bank cards (MC, Visa) are handled differently than Amex, they ALL get some type of fee from every transaction. Amex charged us a discount rate of 4.3% for their transactions. The bank card discounts were charged back to us through our corporate bank account after the card slips were deposited. That was typically somewhere between 1 and 2 percent.

bigforearms		2006-02-04 06:24:17 PM

There's nothing wrong with using credit cards if you're responsible. It's good to have one for emergencies so you can spend more than your bank account allows in a pinch (like a transmission going out on your only car that you need for work).

They also let you get everything, effectively, a month before you pay for it. If you earn money on your checking account, you're at least making some cash off of that float. Okay, so it's not a lot... but still.

Additionally, they give you a bunch of purchase protections, as others have said.

I put everything on my credit card and pay it off at the end of every month so I can rack up bonuses. It costs me nothing and I get free shiat for doing something I was already going to be doing.

SheepPr0n		2006-02-04 06:24:27 PM

And this is yet another reason why I don't have a Credit Card.

Action		2006-02-04 06:25:32 PM

He said Barclaycard was "having to face up to the fact that clearly we are not making as much money out of customers that pay their bill in full as we are out of those that borrow", he said.

He added that the company was "quite open about it... if you pay your bill in full every month you may get a few days less to pay...

"That is the fact of it and we are not going to shy away from that."

This is the crux of it. An open admission to expecting late charge fee moneys to be factored into the business model. It doesn't work? Change the rules? They aren't to be held to a date certain of debt due? WHAT!?

This will only fly if apathy prevails, hell it even violates the rule of admirality. Send lawyers, guns and money? Lawyers?, check. Guns? NO. Money? It's on the wrong side.

Guns and money should fix this.

doodler		2006-02-04 06:25:39 PM

Credit Card Companies are "The House" in a cassino.

The only way to win is to not play.

/they are all ass raping turd monkeys, it's just a matter of the degree

Peaceman		2006-02-04 06:26:03 PM

pSPAZz

Yep. Debit cards never took off in the US until the launch of the Visa Check Card and Debit Mastercard. Main reason being usability. Pretty much all businesses have a merchant account, allowing them to take credit/charge cards or debit cards based on that network. A debit card system like that would require a bit of a change to the system to have businesses accept another card.

meekychuppet		2006-02-04 06:26:16 PM

I just wish the banks would say:

"We don't give a shiat about you stupid little customers and your scummy little accounts so fark off"

/Don't believe them, don't trust them, don't ask for anything, don't give them anything.

mathmonkey		2006-02-04 06:26:45 PM

I teach basic amortization to college freshmen. They just sit there slack-jawed when I explain how interest compounding can screw them over. I do advise them all to get one card, though, and put like $10 a month on credit at the campus bookstore/coffee shop, and pay it off every month to build up credit so they're in good shape to buy a house one day. I also tell them to have the bill sent home to dad. That sort of accountability will keep you straight. It's amazing how much, at least in the US, our college kids are in debt for buying just crap.

enigmafan		2006-02-04 06:28:01 PM

Don't these CC people watch politics? Why haven't they come up with a reason why this is actually 'good for you'(tm)?

nein		2006-02-04 06:28:55 PM

A simple way to avoid the risk of any late payment charge was, Mr Barber said: "to set a direct debit payment up on the account.

"It is universally good advice to set up a direct debit for at least the minimum amount.

Oh yeah, brilliant solution. So avoid the late fee, and instead get hit with finance charges to avoid your sneaky tactics. That'll ease the concerns of consumer advocacy groups.

primordial_soup_dragon		2006-02-04 06:28:56 PM

olddinosaur: So, all the more reason to not have a credit card. "Pay cash or do without it; not only does compound interest eat up your mone, awareness of debt eats up your peace of mind."

Trouble with this new approach by the banks is that it's penalising credit card users who only use them when they have the cash to back it up by making them cough up sooner.

In over 15 years of having a credit card, only twice have I used it to make a purchase of greater value than I had money in the bank. It was done knowingly both times. I generally use my credit card every month but pay it off before the due date.

Now it feels like banks are going to try and trick me into paying a late fee.

jeffy		2006-02-04 06:29:58 PM

credit card companies are decidedly evil. i totally support a free market and laissez faire ideals, but man, credit card companies violate everything there is about a free market, so i can hate them.

they make 2.2 to 2.5% per transaction made with a credit card, yet they still need more money in late fees and interest charges? unabashed greed and market dominanace is letting them get away with that shiat.

advice on not missing a payment:
i have an MBNA card and i almost got caught for a late payment. i DID have to pay $10 to "expedite" the payment (which is bullshiat) but atleast not $35 because it was late. honestly, i think they screwed with my due dates but i don't know. MBNA has an auto pay feature that can withdraw from my checking account, so i setup a $100 monthly auto transaction to go along with my manual payments, that way im never caught with a missed payment.

SewerUrchin99		2006-02-04 06:31:56 PM

I used to work for Citi...it was a rotten job. Credit cards are a huge rip-off. I had to talk to people every day who were pissed off because the company had randomly moved their statement due date foward. It was a lame attempt to get a few more late fees...the companies position was that it was allowed by the terms of service.

Meatschool		2006-02-04 06:34:23 PM

Fark Me To Tears: THAT IS NOT TRUE! Don't ever believe this lie. CREDIT CARD COMPANIES MAKE MONEY OFF OF EVERY SINGLE TRANSACTION.

He's right. I worked in the processing end too, and though they may not make money off the cardholder that pays their full balance each month, they make PLENTY off of the merchant that takes the card.

GizmoToy		2006-02-04 06:34:35 PM

7of7: Howver, I have never felt that credit cards pose a risk to me personally except in that credit card compaines always pull this type of shennanigan to try and screw people who are careful to pay their bills in time. I personally just don't like delaying payment for things until the end of the month.

I see, I see. Understandable. This is a pretty underhanded trick they're pulling.

ornithopter		2006-02-04 06:35:19 PM

7of7 While I normally use my debit card (which acts as a Visa) for practically everything, sometimes it does make sense to use my credit card. And yeah, if my debit card was like the Canadians' seem to be, I'd use a credit card all the time (and make sure the minimum payment automatically went on my debit card) - I don't like carrying too much cash, I like being able to track my spending, and checks are a pain in the neck.

Besides, if you occasionally use a credit card and pay it off on time, it helps your credit rating. Which matters even if you never go into any sort of debt whatsoever; your credit score affects your auto and home/renter's insurance rates.

Tommy Moo		2006-02-04 06:39:07 PM

"Barclaycard denies it is trying to rake in late penalties..."

Why else would it be moving the due date back? Getting the money owed to them a few days sooner wouldn't be any better for their bottom line unless it causes people to have to pay late fees.

I pay my balance off in full every month, AND have a cash back bonus program. I've never paid a cent in interest, and next month Citi Bank is going to have to cut me a $50 check! Nice doing business with you, boys.

Telos		2006-02-04 06:39:43 PM

This isn't particularly new. A couple years ago I made a payment a couple of weeks early early, and the next payment on time. (Actually it arrived like 2 days before the due date.) The credit card company decided that payment was late, because it arrived more than thirty days after the previous payment even though it was before the actual due date.

Fun huh?

castufari		2006-02-04 06:44:56 PM

I pay my cards online, they have no excuse. MBNA once tried to say "my payment never left the bank" so I showed them their record of payment and my record from my bank. They biatched but gave me my money back after I threatened to call the AGs office on them. Paid that off and never used 'em again.

I can see Wachovia getting in on this action soon.