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(Some Guy)   Under deal to bring Iran before the UN Sec. Council, Israel is going to be forced to give up the nuclear weapons that they don't have   (debka.com) divider line 565
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14232 clicks; posted to Main » on 04 Feb 2006 at 5:59 PM (8 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2006-02-04 10:13:33 PM
Tatsuma: Also, there has never been such a thing as palestinians.


Well, you had better tell that to your friends at Israeli Forum, because they say "There hasn't been a Palestinian since 1948"
 
2006-02-04 10:14:50 PM
gameshowhost: /why does *anyone* want to live there?

Because it's better than dying in Germany or Russia?
 
2006-02-04 10:15:41 PM
if we all say over and over that a group of people isn't a legitimate nation, we can solve all problems of nationality.
 
2006-02-04 10:16:26 PM
The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan.


- Palestine Liberation Organization executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, March '77

Palestine has always constituted a single geographical, political and demographic unit with Greater Syria and Egypt. On its soil the civilizations of Mesopotamia and Egypt intermingled. Palestine also witnessed, as a land bridge linking Asia, Africa, and Europe, several movements and waves of conquerors who dominated it for different periods of time and left behind varying degrees of influence.


- By Abdul Jawad Saleh, in Transformation of Palestine, printed in Challenge, February 1995, published on the WWW by the Center for Research and Documentation of Palestinian Society, Bir Zeit University, the West Bank


"We consider Palestine as part of Arab Syria, as it has never been separated from it at any time. We are connected with it by national, religious, linguistic, natural, economic and geographical bonds."

- Resolution adopted by the First Congress of Muslim-Christian Associations in Jerusalem in February 1919

"There is no such country [as Palestine]! 'Palestine' is a term the Zionists invented! There is no Palestine in the Bible. Our country was for centuries part of Syria."

- Auni Bey Abdul-Hadi, a local Arab leader, to the Peel Commission, 1937

"Palestine was part of the Province of Syria...
...politically, the Arabs of Palestine were not independent in the sense of forming a separate political entity."


- The representative of the Arab Higher Committee to the United Nations submitted this in a statement to the General Assembly in May 1947

"It is common knowledge that Palestine is nothing but southern Syria."


- Ahmed Shuqeiri, later the chairman of the PLO, to the UN Security Council
 
2006-02-04 10:18:06 PM
ZipBeep: Well, you had better tell that to your friends at Israeli Forum, because they say "There hasn't been a Palestinian since 1948"

Same thing - Palestine was divided into Jordan and Israel. Jordanians and Israelis are Palestinians. Those blokes blowing themselves up are Israeli Arabic separatists. You can call them Confederates, if you want.
 
2006-02-04 10:19:06 PM
ZipBeep: Did he post something in another thread?

Yeah, she said that in a few threads
 
2006-02-04 10:20:16 PM
ZipBeep:

Well, you had better tell that to your friends at Israeli Forum, because they say "There hasn't been a Palestinian since 1948"

Well, it's a shame that these people don't know better, because palestine was a part of egypt and jordan back in 1948.
 
2006-02-04 10:22:13 PM
You left off the best quote, Tatsuma.

"This Organization does not exercise any territorial sovereignty over the West Bank in the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan, on the Gaza Strip or in the Himmah Area." -PLO Charter (Article 24)
 
2006-02-04 10:25:57 PM
dowhat:

Would you fight?
If you did you would be a terrorist.
But the Palestinians had no choice.
Our tax money makes this possible !!!


Funny, this man never even biatchslapped someone and he did far, far more progress for his country in one major demonstration than the palestinians did 1,000 dead israelis later.

www.hippiemuseum.org

Sloth_DC:

"This Organization does not exercise any territorial sovereignty over the West Bank in the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan, on the Gaza Strip or in the Himmah Area." -PLO Charter (Article 24)

Crap, you're right.
 
2006-02-04 10:39:32 PM
oren0: Israel is one of America's loyal allies. In addition to the fact that many Americans are Jewish or otherwise pro-Israel, the US has always supported its allies.

Until they invade Kuwait, at least.
 
2006-02-04 10:42:38 PM
Israel is one of America's loyal allies. In addition to the fact that many Americans are Jewish or otherwise pro-Israel, the US has always supported its allies.

Sum Dum Gai:Until they invade Kuwait, at least.

We were supporting our ally Saudi Arabia.
 
2006-02-04 10:47:22 PM
Sum Dum Gai: Until they invade Kuwait, at least.

Once an ally, always an ally, no matter what? Is that the logic that you are employing here?
 
2006-02-04 10:49:22 PM
meridian:

I'm not sure how the lifecycle of a pimple is really pertinent to this thread.
 
2006-02-04 10:49:53 PM
Sum Dum Gai [tOtAlFaRk]
Until they invade Kuwait, at least.


huh?
 
2006-02-04 10:53:08 PM
the US has only recently supported Israel, recent as in starting with Nixon. And some rocky episodes in between. The Oslo accords which gives Israel 3 billion and Egypt 2 has basically been the only real "supporting" except for a few loans here and there, and some military sales
 
2006-02-04 11:00:20 PM
Israel should NOT exist, plain and simple.

Sorry Jews, but you're a minority in world affairs on this one.

The United States does NOT need to support the creation of a "Jewish" country smack-dab in the middle of Islamic population centers. It was the DUMBEST IDEA EVER.

Yes, if Israel did not exist, 9-11 would NOT have happened. Bin Laden has stated that 9-11 occurred because of America's support of Israel, and existence of US troops in Saudi Arabia.

Actually, the existence of US Troops in Saudi Arabia could be traced back to Israel:

1. US Supports Israel
2. Pisses of Muslims
3. Iran undergoes Islamic Revolution because everyone there pissed off at US
4. US gives money & wepons to Iraq to kill Iranians
5. Iraq gets too powerful and invades Kuwait
6. US Invades Iraq from Saudi Arabia

It ALL comes down to Israel.

I say let Israel die. It is a country that NO ONE, especially AMERICANS, should have ANYTHING to do with. We might as well create an apartheid South Africa. That would be the moral equivalent.

You right-wingbats are going to have to accept that Israel's days have been limited. It's a Zionist idea, and the last I checked, America was proclaiming to be a secular nation. (Or is that false and we're actually a theocracy?) If you love Israel so much, why don't you move there??

NO ONE needs to believe in a "god". Using TAXPAYER MONEY to establish such a "god" is an even worse of an idea.

So yes, if America didn't support Israel, 9-11 would NOT have happened, and America would no have a billion people pissed off at us because of our crazy batshiat deity worship, and we'd be worried about Native American terrorists instead of Islamic ones.

Blame the right-wingers for 9-11, and the deaths of 3,000 innocent american lives from it.

Sux to be a Republican these days.

Do NOT support the troops.

Do NOT pledge allegiance to the flag.

Work to REMOVE the United States of America.

Let the 50 states be their own independent nations.

You do NOT need America.
 
2006-02-04 11:00:25 PM
Big Al:

the US has only recently supported Israel, recent as in starting with Nixon. And some rocky episodes in between. The Oslo accords which gives Israel 3 billion and Egypt 2 has basically been the only real "supporting" except for a few loans here and there, and some military sales

Real support from the american public only started in the early 90s, because of Seinfeld, too
 
2006-02-04 11:03:21 PM
Churnin Urn of Burnin Funk: Once an ally, always an ally, no matter what? Is that the logic that you are employing here

Nah, I'm just making a point that alliances need to always be considered carefully and that we should choose to maintain or break an alliance based on whether it's beneficial. Saddam was our ally when we found him convenient, we turned on him a few years later without a second thought when he became a poor ally. Similarly we should weigh in the benegfits versus the costs of our other alliances.
 
2006-02-04 11:03:57 PM
Tatsuma: Why do you hate democracy?

Israel, France, Norway, and just about every country in the world except for the US and Canada are not democracies. They're nominal democracies that grant equality so long as their ethnic countrymen constitute a majority of the population.

Also, there has never been such a thing as palestinians.

What would you call a Jew or Arab living in the land that is now Israel and Jordan prior to 1948?
 
2006-02-04 11:05:40 PM
vfunct: It is a country that NO ONE, especially AMERICANS, should have ANYTHING to do with.

---

This is the only part where you made perfect sense.

The rest was a diametrically opposite load of BS.
 
2006-02-04 11:06:48 PM
Oh boy, here we go for another round of madness

vfunct:

Israel should NOT exist, plain and simple.

Maybe, maybe not, but 60 years later, it's too late to say "Take your ball and go home, boys". Israel exists, and she's not going anywhere.

Sorry Jews, but you're a minority in world affairs on this one.

I'm sorry, but what does being a minority has to do with this?

The United States does NOT need to support the creation of a "Jewish" country smack-dab in the middle of Islamic population centers. It was the DUMBEST IDEA EVER.

After 6 million dead jews in europe, it was actually a pretty smart idea

Yes, if Israel did not exist, 9-11 would NOT have happened. Bin Laden has stated that 9-11 occurred because of America's support of Israel, and existence of US troops in Saudi Arabia.

Liar liar, pants on fire. Support of Israel was never mentionned in connection to 9/11.

Actually, the existence of US Troops in Saudi Arabia could be traced back to Israel:

Can you pass the crack pipe, please?

1. US Supports Israel
2. Pisses of Muslims
3. Iran undergoes Islamic Revolution because everyone there pissed off at US
4. US gives money & wepons to Iraq to kill Iranians
5. Iraq gets too powerful and invades Kuwait
6. US Invades Iraq from Saudi Arabia

It ALL comes down to Israel.


Stop hoarding that crack pipe, man, I want some!

I say let Israel die. It is a country that NO ONE, especially AMERICANS, should have ANYTHING to do with. We might as well create an apartheid South Africa. That would be the moral equivalent.

No, no it's not. There's no apartheid in Israel and all citizens have the equal same rights

You right-wingbats are going to have to accept that Israel's days have been limited. It's a Zionist idea, and the last I checked, America was proclaiming to be a secular nation. (Or is that false and we're actually a theocracy?) If you love Israel so much, why don't you move there??

Modern zionism is a secular idea. My ex-girlfriend was a secular zionist. They just want a jewish homeland.

NO ONE needs to believe in a "god". Using TAXPAYER MONEY to establish such a "god" is an even worse of an idea.

What's the point of bringing G-d in this?

So yes, if America didn't support Israel, 9-11 would NOT have happened, and America would no have a billion people pissed off at us because of our crazy batshiat deity worship, and we'd be worried about Native American terrorists instead of Islamic ones.

Yes, it would have happened, there's also only 600M of people in the middle east and they're not all pissed at us and native american terrorists? what are you smoking and can I have some?

Blame the right-wingers for 9-11, and the deaths of 3,000 innocent american lives from it.

Sux to be a Republican these days.
Do NOT support the troops.
Do NOT pledge allegiance to the flag.
Work to REMOVE the United States of America.
Let the 50 states be their own independent nations.
You do NOT need America.


Basically, you're an anti-semite, anti-american traitor who wants the destruction of american and doesn't support the troop?

This has got to be a troll
 
2006-02-04 11:07:25 PM
Big Al: the US has only recently supported Israel, recent as in starting with Nixon. And some rocky episodes in between. The Oslo accords which gives Israel 3 billion and Egypt 2 has basically been the only real "supporting" except for a few loans here and there, and some military sales

---

You say that like 3 billion and 2 billion aren't ridiculously large sums of money, especially for what they go towards.
 
2006-02-04 11:08:37 PM
Tatsuma -

Why do you hate reality?
 
2006-02-04 11:09:48 PM
Yankees Team Gynecologist:

Israel, France, Norway, and just about every country in the world except for the US and Canada are not democracies. They're nominal democracies that grant equality so long as their ethnic countrymen constitute a majority of the population.

US is a republic.

What would you call a Jew or Arab living in the land that is now Israel and Jordan prior to 1948?

A jew living in Israel prior to 1948? A Jew!

The romans changed the name of the jewish homeland to Palestine as an attempt to remove the jewish character out of it and make the diaspora even stronger!

An arab living in Israel prior to 1948? An arab living in the land now known as Israel prior to 1948.

Or a syrian.
 
2006-02-04 11:10:51 PM
gameshowhost: Why do you hate reality?

Hey, I know Fark isn't too big on facts, but I don't think that being a realist here = hating reality
 
2006-02-04 11:15:02 PM
This has got to be a troll

No, that's more or less what he posts in every thread. And stuck around for a loooooong time in a flamewar involving said viewpoint. That's his honest-to-Deity-Of-Choice point of view.
 
2006-02-04 11:20:28 PM
Gosling:

No, that's more or less what he posts in every thread. And stuck around for a loooooong time in a flamewar involving said viewpoint. That's his honest-to-Deity-Of-Choice point of view.

Well, it makes baby moses cry into the sinai. Why does he hate baby moses?
 
2006-02-04 11:24:33 PM
For those that don't think 9-11 happened because of Israel, well, why dontchya ask Mr. Bin Laden himself?
---
As Reported by USATODAY.com on Sunday, October 7, 2001 - Updated 05:29 PM EDT
Associated Press
Text of Osama bin Laden's taped remarks, aired on an Arab television station after the U.S. and British strikes
Sunday. The remarks, which refer to the Sept. 11 terror attacks on New York and Washington, appear to have
been made before Sunday's strikes. The text is translated from the Arabic. - USATODAY.com

I bear witness that there is no God but Allah and that Mohammad is his messenger.

There is America, hit by God in one of its softest spots. Its greatest buildings were destroyed, thank God for that. There is America, full of fear from its north to its south, from its west to its east. Thank God for that.

What America is tasting now is something insignificant compared to what we have tasted for scores of years. Our nation (the Islamic world) has been tasting this humiliation and this degradation for more than 80 years. Its sons are killed, its blood is shed, its sanctuaries are attacked, and no one hears and no one heeds.

When God blessed one of the groups of Islam, vanguards of Islam, they destroyed America. I pray to God to elevate their status and bless them.

Millions of innocent children are being killed as I speak. They are being killed in Iraq without committing any sins, and we don't hear condemnation or a fatwa (religious decree) from the rulers. In these days, Israeli tanks infest Palestine in Jenin, Ramallah, Rafah, Beit Jalla, and other places in the land of Islam, and we don't hear anyone raising his voice or moving a limb.

When the sword comes down (on America), after 80 years, hypocrisy rears its ugly head. They deplore and they lament for those killers, who have abused the blood, honor and sanctuaries of Muslims. The least that can be said about those people is that they are debauched. They have followed injustice. They supported the butcher over the victim, the oppressor over the innocent child. May God show them His wrath and give them what they deserve.

I say that the situation is clear and obvious. After this event, after the senior officials have spoken in America, starting with the head of infidels worldwide, Bush, and those with him. They have come out in force with their men and have turned even the countries that belong to Islam to this treachery, and they want to wag their tail at God, to fight Islam, to suppress people in the name of terrorism.

When people at the ends of the earth, Japan, were killed by their hundreds of thousands, young and old, it was not considered a war crime, it is something that has justification. Millions of children in Iraq is something that has justification. But when they lose dozens of people in Nairobi and Dar es Salaam (capitals of Kenya and Tanzania, where U.S. embassies were bombed in 1998), Iraq was struck and Afghanistan was struck.

Hypocrisy stood in force behind the head of infidels worldwide, behind the cowards of this age, America and those who are with it.

These events have divided the whole world into two sides. The side of believers and the side of infidels, may God keep you away from them. Every Muslim has to rush to make his religion victorious. The winds of faith have come. The winds of change have come to eradicate oppression from the island of Muhammad, peace be upon him.

To America, I say only a few words to it and its people. I swear by God, who has elevated the skies without pillars, neither America nor the people who live in it will dream of security before we live it in Palestine, and not before all the infidel armies leave the land of Muhammad, peace be upon him.

God is great, may pride be with Islam. May peace and God's mercy be upon you.

---

Like I said, Bin Laden is straight-up leftist. He isn't interested in "invading" christian countries and establishing Islamic law. The only thing he's after is defense of his Muslim people. Hence, attacking the US, for basically killing MILLIONS of innocent Islamic people (Iraqi sanction, invasions, Israel).

Again, America seriously needs to BUTT OUT of the affairs of all these people. STOP TRYING TO ESTABLISH AN EMPIRE. It's a policy that's going to result in failure, and is generally a waste of taxpayer money.

That $500 billion annual military budget could have been used to create 1000 rail-stations throughout the east coast, removing the absolute dependence on foreign oil, for example. And that's just ONE YEAR.

But, first things first: STOP BELIEVING IN YOUR GOD. That's the farked-up-shiat that's basically at the heart of all this. There's actually NO rational reason to support Isreal, the only people that DO support Israel are a) Jews and b) Fundamentalist Christian. Had those people STOPPED BELIEVING IN A GOD, then we wouldn't be in this farked up situation.

America should disappear. It's been coopted by these religous freaks, resulting in countless deaths and trillions of tax dollars being pissed away.

Republicans need to leave this country, and move to Israel or Iraq, since they're absolutely NOT interested in America.
 
2006-02-04 11:24:54 PM
Tatsuma: US is a republic.

Way to sidestep the point on a technicality.

By "a democracy" I meant "democratic." As in, equal rights and representation for all, no matter what the demographics are. I highly doubt France would keep that up if 60% of its population was Arabic. Israel DEFINITELY wouldn't, otherwise it defeats its own purpose.

Sorry for the "confusion."

A jew living in Israel prior to 1948? A Jew!

Again, nice sidestep there.

How would you distinguish between a Jew living in America and a Jew living in that region?

The romans changed the name of the jewish homeland to Palestine as an attempt to remove the jewish character out of it and make the diaspora even stronger!

An arab living in Israel prior to 1948? An arab living in the land now known as Israel prior to 1948.

Or a syrian.


So what?

Didn't the Jews change the name of the land when they made it theirs?

Do you call people living in America "non-indigenous foreigners living in the land that once was the home of the Cherokee/Commanche/Sioux/etc."? Or "Americans"?
 
2006-02-04 11:28:35 PM
This has got to be a troll

No, that's more or less what he posts in every thread. And stuck around for a loooooong time in a flamewar involving said viewpoint. That's his honest-to-Deity-Of-Choice point of view.

He probably assumed everyone in the country was straight up in love with the US Government, supported the troops, went to church, and volunteered for military duty on weekends. hehehe. "WHAT?! You mean the United States ISN'T the greatest country in the world?!?! HOW DARE YOU HAVE AN OPIONION THAT ISN'T ALLOWED BY THE GOVERNMENT! IF IT WASN'T FOR THE USA YOU'D BE SPEAKING GERMAN/RUSSIAN/APACHE NOW!!"

poor guy.

/death to America.
//states first.
 
2006-02-04 11:32:13 PM
vfunct: Actually, the existence of US Troops in Saudi Arabia could be traced back to Israel:

1. US Supports Israel
2. Pisses of Muslims
3. Iran undergoes Islamic Revolution because everyone there pissed off at US


...unrelated to Israel. They were pissed because the Western nations kept farking with their leadership.

4. US gives money & wepons to Iraq to kill Iranians

We also gave money to Iran to kill Iraqis. Sounds like good policy to me, really.

5. Iraq gets too powerful and invades Kuwait
6. US Invades Iraq from Saudi Arabia


Sorry, you failed to tie this back to Israel.

Can someone please get vfunct some new meds?
 
2006-02-04 11:35:25 PM
vfunct: Israel should NOT exist, plain and simple.

says you?

Sorry Jews, but you're a minority in world affairs on this one.

and this matters... because?

The United States does NOT need to support the creation of a "Jewish" country smack-dab in the middle of Islamic population centers. It was the DUMBEST IDEA EVER.

No it wasn't. the dumbest idea ever was allowing you to speak

Yes, if Israel did not exist, 9-11 would NOT have happened. Bin Laden has stated that 9-11 occurred because of America's support of Israel, and existence of US troops in Saudi Arabia.

bullshiat, learn history

Actually, the existence of US Troops in Saudi Arabia could be traced back to Israel:

youve GOT to be farking kidding

it has nothing to do with israel and everything to do with

O-I-L

The Us just gives Israel some cash so they dont upset their arab oil neighboors that the US is in bed with.

Osama doesnt care about Israel. osama uses the terror excuse to get rich by donations from wealthy arab individuals.

you are a tool, and you need to learn history

//states first.

//we tried that already, it didnt work
 
2006-02-04 11:35:31 PM
vfunct: When the sword comes down (on America), after 80 years, hypocrisy rears its ugly head.

WTF happened in 1921?
 
2006-02-04 11:36:20 PM
vfunct: Bin Laden is straight-up leftist.

no true leftist uses violence to further their cause. MLK? Ghandi? Mother Theresa?
 
2006-02-04 11:36:22 PM
Yankees Team Gynecologist: By "a democracy" I meant "democratic." As in, equal rights and representation for all, no matter what the demographics are.

Actually, that's Constitutional, which is in many respects the opposite of democratic.
 
2006-02-04 11:37:15 PM
bin laden is a right wing religious fundamentalist
 
2006-02-04 11:37:21 PM
vfunct:

For those that don't think 9-11 happened because of Israel, well, why dontchya ask Mr. Bin Laden himself?

Maybe you should read what you posted. He said that people are getting killed by Israelis, but he never said that they were a reason for Al Qaeda to attack 9/11.

I mean, what the hell is your problem anyway, siding with that murderer?

Like I said, Bin Laden is straight-up leftist. He isn't interested in "invading" christian countries and establishing Islamic law. The only thing he's after is defense of his Muslim people. Hence, attacking the US, for basically killing MILLIONS of innocent Islamic people (Iraqi sanction, invasions, Israel).

Are... are you crazy? Seriously?

The guy is a right-winger, pro-theocracy who wants to establish a caliphate from spain to indonesia under the muslim banner. The guy backs Islamic revolution, which wants to convert the whole world. He's attacking civilians, not military targets. Are you just completely farking crazy?

Again, America seriously needs to BUTT OUT of the affairs of all these people. STOP TRYING TO ESTABLISH AN EMPIRE. It's a policy that's going to result in failure, and is generally a waste of taxpayer money.

That $500 billion annual military budget could have been used to create 1000 rail-stations throughout the east coast, removing the absolute dependence on foreign oil, for example. And that's just ONE YEAR.


Yeah, rail-stations will be really useful if we get bombed/need to defend our allies oversea.

But, first things first: STOP BELIEVING IN YOUR GOD. That's the farked-up-shiat that's basically at the heart of all this. There's actually NO rational reason to support Isreal, the only people that DO support Israel are a) Jews and b) Fundamentalist Christian. Had those people STOPPED BELIEVING IN A GOD, then we wouldn't be in this farked up situation.

America should disappear. It's been coopted by these religous freaks, resulting in countless deaths and trillions of tax dollars being pissed away.

Republicans need to leave this country, and move to Israel or Iraq, since they're absolutely NOT interested in America.


someone is off his meds

He probably assumed everyone in the country was straight up in love with the US Government, supported the troops, went to church, and volunteered for military duty on weekends. hehehe. "WHAT?! You mean the United States ISN'T the greatest country in the world?!?! HOW DARE YOU HAVE AN OPIONION THAT ISN'T ALLOWED BY THE GOVERNMENT! IF IT WASN'T FOR THE USA YOU'D BE SPEAKING GERMAN/RUSSIAN/APACHE NOW!!"

poor guy.


Uh, that's really not me.

/death to America.

Thanks for giving fodder to the right-wingers who love to paint leftists as traitors who hate america, dumbass
 
2006-02-04 11:37:54 PM
Iran = barbarians
Israel = civilized

case closed.
 
2006-02-04 11:39:15 PM
Big Al: no true leftist uses violence to further their cause.

ELF.
SLA.
Red Brigades.
Bader-Meinhof.
Guevera.

I could go on, if you wish.
 
2006-02-04 11:40:14 PM
Yankees Team Gynecologist:

Again, nice sidestep there.

How would you distinguish between a Jew living in America and a Jew living in that region?


I wrote a jew? Sorry, I meant "a palestinian" because that's how jews called themselves prior to 1948, palestinians

PLO arabs took that name back around the 60s.

Oh, and Arafat was from Tunis.

Sloth_DC: Can someone please get vfunct some new meds?

I concur
 
2006-02-04 11:42:29 PM
Sloth_DC: Actually, that's Constitutional, which is in many respects the opposite of democratic.

---

Let's look at this definition of "democracy":

"Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives"

Compare that to other "democracies" like Israel, which are more like:

"Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives, so long as 'the people' consists mostly of a certain ethnicity"

See the difference?
 
2006-02-04 11:44:04 PM
Sloth_DC: ELF.

ELF isn't a leftist group, because it's not a group. They are people using an ideology (eart first) and doing various terrorist acts in it's name, but there's no core, no cells, nothing. The ELF, as an organization, doesn't exist.

Also, there are extreme left-wingers that are doing acts for the ELF, but some extreme right-wingers..

/just sayin'

But I agree, that's what I was gonna post, starting with Bader-Meinhof.
 
2006-02-04 11:44:57 PM
Ad Hominem has got to be the lamest form of argument - right after special pleading.
 
2006-02-04 11:45:59 PM
osama uses the terror excuse to get rich by donations from wealthy arab individuals.

Wait.. wait.. are you saying Osama bin laden wants to get rich? Are you seriously saying that he's risking his life so he can go buy a Ferrari and a couple of Plasma TVs and farking Granite countertops?

If not, then what exactly are you saying??

//states first.

//we tried that already, it didnt work

Didn't work according to who? To the average citizen, or the ultra-capitalistic slave-owners?

The United States is the perfect system for the ultra-capitalistic slave-owners, for it is a system designed to subjugate labor rights so someone can make an additional 2 cents per share in profit. It turns people, like yourself, into tools. "WORK! WORK! WORK!"

That's supposed to be a system that works, right?

/Monarchy under Englands King was better than this shiat-hole government
//North Koreans have more freedom than Americans because of the millions of laws that Americans must obey.
 
2006-02-04 11:46:34 PM
Yankees Team Gynecologist:

"Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives, so long as 'the people' consists mostly of a certain ethnicity"

See the difference?


The only thing I see here is your lack of knowledge about Israeli politics.

Arab Israelis have the same rights as everyone, they have elected representatives, there might even be the first worldwide muslim women party (veiled and all) getting one or two representative in the next elections.

In fact, they even let guys like vfcoont get elected there.

Do you think a guy like him, calling for the death of america, even if he was elected, would be autorized to act the way he does?

Well, in Israel, he could
 
2006-02-04 11:47:15 PM
Yankees Team Gynecologist: Let's look at this definition of "democracy":

"Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives"

Compare that to other "democracies" like Israel, which are more like:

"Government by the people, exercised either directly or through elected representatives, so long as 'the people' consists mostly of a certain ethnicity"


There are over a million Arabic Israelis. And that's beside the point - democracy is when the Germans kill the Jews because most Germans aren't Jewish; Constitutionalism is when there are limits placed on the authority of the public such that they cannot trample on the rights of minorities.

See the difference?

Do you?
 
2006-02-04 11:48:06 PM
Sloth_DC: ELF.
SLA.
Red Brigades.
Bader-Meinhof.
Guevera.

I could go on, if you wish.


sorry they are not liberal. they may preach liberal ideology but their violence makes them right wing
 
2006-02-04 11:48:50 PM
Party Boy: Ad Hominem has got to be the lamest form of argument - right after special pleading.

It's a form of argument?

vfunct:

/Monarchy under Englands King was better than this shiat-hole government
//North Koreans have more freedom than Americans because of the millions of laws that Americans must obey.


wow. I'm... really speechless. I don't know what to say. Ad hominem might be the lowest form of arguments, but you're off your med.
 
2006-02-04 11:49:55 PM
Big Al:

sorry they are not liberal. they may preach liberal ideology but their violence makes them right wing

you said leftist. Liberals, the real liberals, are closer to the center than true left-wingers.
 
2006-02-04 11:50:23 PM
Tatsuma
fallacious argument - better rhetorical/logical fallacy
 
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