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(timesonline.co.uk)		Italian judge orders priest to prove that Jesus exists (timesonline.co.uk)		841
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Chester Fields		2006-01-03 10:56:33 AM

I was going to rant, but then I changed my mind.

This is retarded.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 10:58:30 AM

Inane illogical argument

Look at the Santa Claus Myth

Lives at the North Poll (Disproven)
Has limited powers to do limited things none of which include stealth and the ability to go non detected.

God/Yaweh

Creator of the Universe resides in heaven both omniscent and omnipotent within the universe he created comitted not to interven in free will. No way to disprove until you die of course even then who knows

Overman		2006-01-03 11:00:14 AM

BrotherAlpha: Two points:

1.) If the universe needs a creator, than the universe's creator needs a creator. In other words, who created the god(s)? If the god(s) don't need a creator, then neither does the universe.

2.) Sub attomic particles are created spontaneously all of the time.

Ergo, sub attomic particles created the universe. And I am their prophet, in the holy ring-church of particle acceleration.

:P

themessenjah		2006-01-03 11:01:23 AM

The reason why people have such a hard time believing in God is because they have no faith. Even the Son of God came to earth and repaired the gap between God and humanity and you don't believe. Some of you say, "I won't believe it until I see it". Well my friends, when you see it... most likely its too late to do anything about it.

HippieKiller666		2006-01-03 11:02:34 AM

HERO

deSelby		2006-01-03 11:03:45 AM

themessenjah: "Some of you say, "I won't believe it until I see it". Well my friends, when you see it... most likely its too late to do anything about it."

Then God really farked up how this works.

Sloth_DC		2006-01-03 11:03:56 AM

SwingingJohnson: This thread is DARKSIDED!!!

That's annoying as whalesnot, dude. Could ya not do that retarded shiat in every thread?

omegaquila		2006-01-03 11:06:51 AM

Long post goes here.

/It was good, but it's too early to be a nerd like this
//I even used terms like "altruistic ascetist"
///LOL bevets LOL

Vet_Curm		2006-01-03 11:07:02 AM

whorehopper
There's about four million people here in Georgia who don't believe in Jesus anymore, after the "Dawgs" lost in the Sygar Bowl last night. I actually heard a Dawgs fan say, in line for coffee this morning, that God is testing their faith - by making their team lose a football game.

There's an old joke that goes like:

There's a reason why Jesus wasn't born in Athens(Georgia).

(wait for it...)

They couldn't find three wise men, and a virgin.

BrotherAlpha		2006-01-03 11:10:08 AM

Stryyder:
The bible and organized religion in general has as always as its weakest link the perspective of man. Taking the bible literally is a great mistake and something you generally only see either atheist/agnostics trying to prove there point or overly devout morons mistakenly trying to prove theres.

About a third of the US believes in Bible Inerrancy.

Click me, I pop.

So unless you want to call a third of the United States devout morons, then you might want to rethink your postion.

Sloth_DC		2006-01-03 11:10:09 AM

themessenjah: Even the Son of God came to earth and repaired the gap between God and humanity and you don't believe.

You mean Hercules, Osiris, or Mithras?

Theobold Holsopple		2006-01-03 11:10:36 AM

Of all the questions that we formulate in our mortal minds, foremost in mine is not "Is there a God" or "What happens to my consciousness when I die?" but "Why did I GIS whale snot?".

turbothy		2006-01-03 11:11:09 AM

Stryyder: Inane illogical argument

Oh noes!!!1!

What about the Pink Unicorn, then?

Look at the Santa Claus Myth

Lives at the North Poll (Disproven)
Has limited powers to do limited things none of which include stealth and the ability to go non detected.

There are different dogma in the Church of Claus. Some orthodox Clausians hold that He lives on the North pole, just on the bottom of the sea. Many North American Clausians believe Him to reside somewhere in Canada, while some Finnish Clausians insist he lives in Lapland.

Besides, where does it say that Santa Claus' powers are limited?

Sloth_DC		2006-01-03 11:11:20 AM

BrotherAlpha: So unless you want to call a third of the United States devout morons, then you might want to rethink your postion.

No, I'm willing to call a third of the US devout morons. How can something be inerrant when it isn't even internally consistent?

gnosis301		2006-01-03 11:13:21 AM

BrotherAlpha

It looks as though 1/3 of the citizens in the United States are devout morons.

Ramen		2006-01-03 11:14:30 AM

Stryyder
Heinlein had it right. All of you should read JOB a comedy of justice by Heinlen and get his take on both organized religion and the atheist. It is an interesting satire that both sides should enjoy.

I second that motion! I'm a life-long agnostic (with a firm disbelief in the Christian notion of God) but if I needed to believe in something, I could easily buy into the teachings of this book.

B A		2006-01-03 11:15:47 AM

Having grown up in the church, and having seen all the self-serving crap its various preachers, deacons, and other so-called "religious" members pulled; I find the teachings of religions to be mostly bullshiat. Jesus may have existed but immaculate conception sounds like a hell of a sales-job by a cheating wife, and Jesus being the son of an all-powerful being is unlikely. Arisen from the dead sounds like someone either wasn't dead, when stuck in a cave, or had a twin brother who continued his con. The idea that all religions are wrong EXCEPT the one professed by - take your pick - Baptists, Catholics, Jews, Methodists, Etc-ad-nauseum -- makes me nauseous. NOTHING on this planet has caused the Hatred, Cruelty, Visciousness, Callous behaviour, War & Death that religion has caused. Presidents have declared war for religion (Civil War), Kings have had the bible rewritten for their purposes (King James version), Tyrants have executed tens of thousands (Hitler was a Methodist) in their hatred of opposing religious views, Dictators, self appointed Kings, and so-called religious leders are still executing people for believing in a diferent religion (remember Saddam?), and having their countrys women sexually mutilated to prevent orgasm so those women will "remain faithful" to their husbands as required by their religion. Assholes get on television in Armani suits, wearing Gucci shoes, Rolex watches, & sporting $100.00 haircuts while demanding that poor people tithe to extremes to support said televangelists churches and give to support the poor while the evangelist buys his wife another Mercedes & a custom made set of earrings to match her $500,000.00 diamond wedding ring. I grew up around a fella who drag-raced down public streets, drank beer with his fellow racers, smoked weed & balled every woman he could reach then "got religion" and got rich on television. You people who believe in the church need to wake up & smell the shiat in the air.

HyperX		2006-01-03 11:17:03 AM

Humans are stupid. We chose to only believe in history that suits us. How soon before we say the holocaust didnt exist? Oh wait, liberal's favorite son, and president of Iran, Mohammad Khatami, already is saying this.

gnosis301		2006-01-03 11:20:18 AM

liberal's favorite son, and president of Iran, Mohammad Khatami

where did you hear this?

SwingingJohnson		2006-01-03 11:20:31 AM

Sloth_DC [TotalFark]

SwingingJohnson: This thread is DARKSIDED!!!

That's annoying as whalesnot, dude. Could ya not do that retarded shiat in every thread?

OK...I'll retire Margeritte. (I only used it in 1 other thread)

Never knew whalesnot to be that annoying tho.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:21:17 AM

Turthboy

1)How many people believe in Santa Claus over the age of 10 it is an accepted myth

2)God/Yaweh has 2000+years of eyewitness sightings writings, gospels, history even up to modern times, the miracle of Fatima being an excellent case of a documented miracle with multiple eyewitnesses.

3)Purple Unicorn's Pink elephants hoary tarts chucking scimitars from ponds or anything else you make up to continue this argument has none of the items contained in point 2 making said argument uncomparable to God/Yaweh argument this is why it is inane.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:25:00 AM

B A

Calling Hitler a Methodist is interesting. He did not practice he restricted all religions and was heavily involved in the occult.

Hitler was the victim of a racist bigoted abusive father this was his religion and he in turn became a bully and a bigoted demented abuser himself.

ceejayoz		2006-01-03 11:25:12 AM

From an earlier religion thread...

This morning there was a knock at my door. When I answered the door I found a well groomed, nicely dressed couple.

The man spoke first: "Hi! I'm John, and this is Mary."

Mary: "Hi! We're here to invite you to come kiss Hank's ass with us."

Me: "Pardon me?! What are you talking about? Who's Hank, and why would I want to kiss his ass?"

John: "If you kiss Hank's ass, he'll give you a million dollars; and if you don't, he'll kick the shiat out of you."

Me: "What? Is this some sort of bizarre mob shake-down?"

John: "Hank is a billionaire philanthropist. Hank built this town. Hank owns this town. He can do what ever he wants, and what he wants is to give you a million dollars, but he can't until you kiss his ass."

Me: "That doesn't make any sense. Why..."

Mary: "Who are you to question Hank's gift? Don't you want a million dollars? Isn't it worth a little kiss on the ass?"

Me: "Well maybe, if it's legit, but..."

John: "Then come kiss Hank's ass with us."

Me: "Do you kiss Hank's ass often?"

Mary: "Oh yes, all the time..."

Me: "And has he given you a million dollars?"

John: "Well no, you don't actually get the money until you leave town."

Me: "So why don't you just leave town now?"

Mary: "You can't leave until Hank tells you to, or you don't get the money, and he kicks the shiat out of you."

Me: "Do you know anyone who kissed Hank's ass, left town, and got the million dollars?"

John: "My mother kissed Hank's ass for years. She left town last year, and I'm sure she got the money."

Me: "Haven't you talked to her since then?"

John: "Of course not, Hank doesn't allow it."

Me: "So what makes you think he'll actually give you the money if you've never talked to anyone who got the money?"

Mary: "Well, he gives you a little bit before you leave. Maybe you'll get a raise; maybe you'll win a small lotto; maybe you'll just find a twenty dollar bill on the street."

Me: "What's that got to do with Hank?"

John: "Hank has certain connections."

Me: "I'm sorry, but this sounds like some sort of bizarre con game."

John: "But it's a million dollars, can you really take the chance? And remember, if you don't kiss Hank's ass he'll kick the shiat of you."

Me: "Maybe if I could see Hank, talk to him, get the details straight from him..."

Mary: "No one sees Hank, no one talks to Hank."

Me: "Then how do you kiss his ass?"

John: "Sometimes we just blow him a kiss, and think of his ass. Other times we kiss Karl's ass, and he passes it on."

Me: "Who's Karl?"

Mary: "A friend of ours. He's the one who taught us all about kissing Hank's ass. All we had to do was take him out to dinner a few times."

Me: "And you just took his word for it when he said there was a Hank, that Hank wanted you to kiss his ass, and that Hank would reward you?"

John: "Oh no! Karl's got a letter Hank sent him years ago explaining the whole thing. Here's a copy; see for yourself."

John handed me a photocopy of a handwritten memo on "From the desk of Karl" letterhead. There were eleven items listed:

1. Kiss Hank's ass and he'll give you a million dollars when you leave town.
2. Use alcohol in moderation.
3. Kick the shiat out of people who aren't like you.
4. Eat right.
5. Hank dictated this list himself.
6. The moon is made of green cheese.
7. Everything Hank says is right.
8. Wash your hands after going to the bathroom.
9. Don't drink.
10. Eat your wieners on buns, no condiments.
11. Kiss Hank's ass or he'll kick the shiat out of you.

Me: "This would appear to be written on Karl's letterhead."

Mary: "Hank didn't have any paper."

Me: "I have a hunch that if we checked we'd find this is Karl's handwriting."

John: "Of course, Hank dictated it."

Me: "I thought you said no one gets to see Hank?"

Mary: "Not now, but years ago he would talk to some people."

Me: "I thought you said he was a philanthropist. What sort of philanthropist kicks the shiat out of people just because they're different?"

Mary: "It's what Hank wants, and Hank's always right."

Me: "How do you figure that?"

Mary: "Item 7 says Everything Hanks says is right.' That's good enough for me!"

Me: "Maybe your friend Karl just made the whole thing up."

John: "No way! Item 5 says 'Hank dictated this list himself.' Besides, item 2 says 'Use alcohol in moderation,' item 4 says 'Eat right,' and item 8 says 'Wash your hands after going to the bathroom.' Everyone knows those things are right, so the rest must be true, too."

Me: "But #9 says 'Don't Drink,' which doesn't quite go with #2. And #6 says 'The moon is made of green cheese,' which is just plain wrong."

John: "There's no contradiction between 9 and 2; 9 just clarifies 2. As to 6, you've never been to the moon, so you can't say for sure."

Me: "Scientists have pretty firmly established that the moon is made of rock..."

Mary: "But they don't know if the rock came from the Earth, or from out of space, so it could just as easily be green cheese."

Me: "I'm not really an expert, but I think the theory that the Moon came from the Earth has been discounted. Besides, not knowing where the rock came from doesn't make it cheese."

John: "Aha! You just admitted that scientists make mistakes, but we know Hank is always right!"

Me: "We do?"

Mary: "Of course we do, Item 5 says so."

Me: "You're saying Hank's always right because the list says so, the list is right because Hank dictated it, and we know that Hank dictated it because the list says so. That's circular logic, no different than saying 'Hank's right because he says he's right.'"

John: "Now you're getting it! It's so rewarding to see someone come around to Hank's way of thinking."

Me: "But...oh, never mind. What's the deal with wieners?"

Mary blushes. John says: "Wieners, in buns, no condiments. It's Hank's way. Anything else is wrong."

Me: "What if I don't have a bun?"

John: "No bun, no wiener. A wiener without a bun is wrong."

Me: "No relish? No Mustard?"

Mary looks positively stricken. John shouts: "There's no need for such language! Condiments of any kind are wrong!"

Me: "So a big pile of sauerkraut with some wieners chopped up in it would be out of the question?"

Mary sticks her fingers in her ears: "I am not listening to this. La la la, la la, la la la."

John: "That's disgusting. Only some sort of evil deviant would eat that..."

Me: "It's good! I eat it all the time."

Mary faints. John catches her: "Well, if I'd known you where one of those I wouldn't have wasted my time. When Hank kicks the shiat out of you I'll be there, counting my money and laughing. I'll kiss Hank's ass for you, you bunless cut-wienered kraut-eater."

With this, John dragged Mary to their waiting car, and sped off.

Razorwolf		2006-01-03 11:25:43 AM

Here's some christian bar trivia to snack on. This is purely for entertainment:

Why is the birth of Christ celebrated on December 25th when the Bible clearly states he was born in March?

Why are celestial figures depicted with halos?

Why do saints get buried or otherwise laid to rest facing east?

Those all have a similar answer. It's interesting stuff.

deSelby		2006-01-03 11:26:52 AM

HyperX: "How soon before we say the holocaust didnt exist? Oh wait, liberal's favorite son, and president of Iran, Mohammad Khatami, already is saying this."

A liberal killed my dog. And for no good reason--he just wanted to see him die. :_(

I hear that liberals secretly cause tornadoes because they think trees and picket fences are phallic symbols of oppression.

Sloth_DC		2006-01-03 11:27:54 AM

Stryyder: 2)God/Yaweh has 2000+years of eyewitness sightings writings, gospels, history even up to modern times, the miracle of Fatima being an excellent case of a documented miracle with multiple eyewitnesses.

Why does God hate amputees?

3)Purple Unicorn's Pink elephants hoary tarts chucking scimitars from ponds or anything else you make up to continue this argument has none of the items contained in point 2 making said argument uncomparable to God/Yaweh argument this is why it is inane.

Prayers to the Invisible Pink Unicorns have exactly the same success rate as prayers to Jehovah. And, hell, there's a lot of writings and sightings of the Greek gods - Zeus even begat sons by virgin mortal women long before Mary.

Phlux		2006-01-03 11:28:46 AM

I have no real problem with atheism, and no real problem with belief in higher powers. I do have some problems with organized religion, but I do respect many of them for their attempts at good works. I consider myself an agnostic. There's just not enough either way to convince me. I don't think a person can ever really know.

I have a deal for the christian right, out there. I'll be fine with the occasional 10 commandments in a courthouse, or the congress passing laws that ask americans to pray for something or another (happens more often than you think). But in return, you have to stop censoring "naughty words" and nudity. It's only fair...and a boobie never hurt anyone.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:30:13 AM

The first one is like all Religion Christianity adapted to absorb earlier pagan beliefs I think Saturnalia. Christmas is a combination of the Sun God and Christ Child. I think the prevailing continuity in your points is sun worship?

SwingingJohnson		2006-01-03 11:32:27 AM

Stryyder

1)How many people believe in Santa Claus over the age of 10 it is an accepted myth

2)God/Yaweh has 2000+years of eyewitness sightings writings, gospels, history even up to modern times, the miracle of Fatima being an excellent case of a documented miracle with multiple eyewitnesses.

3)Purple Unicorn's Pink elephants hoary tarts chucking scimitars from ponds or anything else you make up to continue this argument has none of the items contained in point 2 making said argument uncomparable to God/Yaweh argument this is why it is inane.

____________________________________________________________

Christianity has 1 thing going for it to keep the followers. FEAR. The fear of burning in hell forever.

Any other religions have such a harsh penalty for not believing in it's doctrine?

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:33:28 AM

Sloth,

Actually as to prayer medical studies show that people who pray inside a belief structure have a significantly higher/fster cure rate than people who do not. I suppose that somebody actually believed in the purple unicorn and prayed to it may actually heal faster as well. AS to that I don't see your point because it does detract from the possiblity that god exsists/doesnt exist and just shows the positive effect of faith something an atheist would detest.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:35:02 AM

I am a Catholic and have never ever been preached to in a way that said I would burn for my sins. The preach to seek forgiveness and absolution in order to achieve peace. Some of you need to be acquainted with the teachings of the modern Church.

Johnny Golgotha		2006-01-03 11:35:47 AM

Bevets Quote #1: Everyone must begin with an assumption and then find evidence to support their assumption.

Bevets Quote #2: Christians start with a QUESTION, "Does God exist?" and examine the issue using their own reasoning and critical thinking skills

What a douchebag. It's a wonder the weight of his own irrationality doesn't cause him to collapse into a singularity of stupidity.

Sloth_DC		2006-01-03 11:37:15 AM

Stryyder: Actually as to prayer medical studies show that people who pray inside a belief structure have a significantly higher/fster cure rate than people who do not. I suppose that somebody actually believed in the purple unicorn and prayed to it may actually heal faster as well. AS to that I don't see your point because it does detract from the possiblity that god exsists/doesnt exist and just shows the positive effect of faith something an atheist would detest.

Sure, there's a postive effect to hope. However, I'll make you a deal. If we pray every day from Lance Armstrong's missing nut to regrow, and convince everyone we know to do the same, how soon do you expect his nut to regenerate? All prayers are granted - it's one of the clearest, most unambiguous statements in the New Testament. So let's pray for Lance's nut to regenerate. We can do it!

Theobold Holsopple		2006-01-03 11:38:00 AM

HyperX

Humans are stupid. We chose to only believe in history that suits us.

You appear to be all too human.

Ramen		2006-01-03 11:38:54 AM

gnosis301
It looks as though 1/3 of the citizens in the United States are devout morons.

From where I'm sitting, it's closer to 51%.

I keed! I keed. Well, sorta.

I do like these arguements, though:
1) The bible not the literal word of God? But umpteen brazilian amuricans believe it and how could they all be wrong?
2) Christians are a minority in the world population? Well, see, we're God's chosen people and isn't it sad that all those Communist babies in China have never even heard of Jesus? Let us pray.

Seriously though, who examines the evidence and makes a conscious decision regarding the existance of god? You either believe (i.e. have faith) or you don't.

The biggest difference between Jesus and Santa is that the people who taught you about Santa didn't believe he existed.

I_C_Weener		2006-01-03 11:39:52 AM

Christianity has 1 thing going for it to keep the followers. FEAR. The fear of burning in hell forever.

Well, I believe in Santa Claus because of the lump of coal.

FarkmeBlind		2006-01-03 11:42:30 AM

B A

embarrassingly large block of unrelieved text that no one will read

Just looking at that lack of whitespace made me want to listen to "Folk Song" by Bongwater.

I met an anarchist in Tompkins Square Park, he was an angry men, singing words so dark....[nine minute funny stream of consciousness screed that rhymes and includes an acid trip and Berlin Alexanderplatz]...because Jesus is the way...

SwingingJohnson		2006-01-03 11:44:01 AM

People usually pray for something that has some reasonable chance to happen. Maybe a slim chance, but a chance non-the-less.

When it does happen, the PRAYING gets all the credit.

Sorry to post something so obvious.

I_C_Weener		2006-01-03 11:44:44 AM

Stryyder
I am a Catholic and have never ever been preached to in a way that said I would burn for my sins. The preach to seek forgiveness and absolution in order to achieve peace. Some of you need to be acquainted with the teachings of the modern Church.

Shhh. There was an inquisition, ergo, all organized religion is bad. Same for the Crusades. Gay Marriage. And abortion, right to life, etc... If its politically inconvenient, and supported by the church, or ever was, then the church is bad under any circumstances.

Most farker atheists got their religious information from Jim and Tammy Faye Bakker, and television, not exposure. Some got it from exposure to nuts. Either way, they paint with a broad brush.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:46:24 AM

Sloth_DC

Typical inane post never said that prayer can cause Lance Armstrongs nut to regenerate but there are countless cases of inoperable tumors being reduced, people coming back from deaths door unexplained etc. Was it a miracle or simply unkown capabilites of the body to heal reawakened by the power of human will? I don't know and either do you.

You stating that prayer can't accomplish one simple thing proves or disproves nothing. Nor does my argument do anything than say other than we don't know what we don't know which is my point. I challenge no ones belief but I do believe the heart of atheisim is hypocritical.

Mnementh2230		2006-01-03 11:47:58 AM

Bevets
Theists enjoy an unfair advantage over atheists in that we begin with an assumption that coincides with Reality.

Um... you're referring to ALL theists? You're giving all religions the same amount of credibility, including Pastafarianism, Hinduism, etc...

You begin with the assumption that 'God does not exist' and this leads you to assume evolutionism (the theory that creation happened without God) is true and that the Word of God is 'fictional'

Wrong again. I started from agnosticism, having been raised in a house where my parents decided to let me make up my own mind on theological concerns, and went from there. In essence, I started out with NO assumptions, examined the evidence, and came to the conclusion that most of the world believes in things which cannot be conclusivly proven - Magic, the supernatural, God, the FSM (no offence Pastafarians), etc...

As for the "word of god", don't you have any skepticism? I swear, I should be like Ron Hubbard (sp?) and start my own religion, lead thousands of people on for a few years, make millions of dollars as a "religious" leader, and then make an announcement that the whole thing is bunk, just to prove my point that simply because someone said it's true, and it's written somewhere, doesn't indeed make something true. The International Church of Bob, it'll be called. I'll take the bible, find/replace "God" with "Bob", and go from there (kind of like what the IDers did with their suggested reading, changing "Creationism" into "Intelligent Design"). The only difference is that we'd only meet once a month, because I'd rather spend my sundays doing something other than hanging out with a bunch of gullible sheep, even if they would pay me out the nose for their "salvation".

As for a theory of origins, I don't have one. Frankly, that's where faith comes in. As I have none, I don't really care where the universe came from, but the "Big Bang" is just as credible as "God did it". Perhaps it has always been? I don't know - there are thousands of creation myths, so why should yours be any more valid than any of the others?

goodcall		2006-01-03 11:48:36 AM

Christianity has 1 thing going for it to keep the followers. FEAR. The fear of burning in hell forever

There is fear yes. But mostly faith in Christ offers hope to the Christians I know. I can say its this hope that drives me anyway. If you believe in Jesus, then you know we are forgiven anyway for our sins and you begin eventually to want to live better. Not out of fear, but out of hope.....

SwingingJohnson		2006-01-03 11:50:46 AM

Prayer's Power to Heal Strangers Is Examined
Cardiac Patients in New Study Fared No Better With Spiritual Intercession

By Rob Stein
Washington Post Staff Writer
Friday, July 15, 2005; Page A08

Praying for sick strangers does not improve their prospects of recovering, according to a large, carefully designed study that casts doubt on the widely held belief that being prayed for can help a person heal.

The study of more than 700 heart patients.....

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/07/14/AR200507140169 5.html

Sloth_DC		2006-01-03 11:51:10 AM

Stryyder: Typical inane post never said that prayer can cause Lance Armstrongs nut to regenerate but there are countless cases of inoperable tumors being reduced, people coming back from deaths door unexplained etc. Was it a miracle or simply unkown capabilites of the body to heal reawakened by the power of human will? I don't know and either do you.

You stating that prayer can't accomplish one simple thing proves or disproves nothing. Nor does my argument do anything than say other than we don't know what we don't know which is my point. I challenge no ones belief but I do believe the heart of atheisim is hypocritical.

Mark 11:24 - Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours.

So come on, man, let's pray for Lance's nut to regenerate. All prayers are granted. Clearly the only reason God has never granted a prayer for regeneration of a lost limb is because no true Christian has ever prayed for such a thing.

jayessell		2006-01-03 11:52:06 AM

Here's a question for the religious experts here:

I remember in the bible (somewhere) there was a 'miracle-off' where in a stadium (or in front of lots of people) there were two unlit bonfires.
The goal was to see which preists could pray the firewood to ignite first.

One set of preists boasts they could pray ignite wet firewood and poured water on theirs.
Shortly thereafter, their wood bursts into flame.

When I heard/read this I immediatly thought accellerant.

Look that up for me.

I_C_Weener		2006-01-03 11:54:33 AM

Sloth_DC I defy you to come up with an explanation of how and why the Boston Red Sox won teh World series, if not because of prayer.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:55:43 AM

A review of 17 past studies of ''distant healing," published in 2003 by a British researcher, found no significant effect for prayer or other healing methods.

The largest studies have focused on cardiac care. In one study of 990 cardiac patients conducted at Saint Luke's Hospital in Kansas City, Mo., and published in 1999, researchers found prayer did not affect hospital length of stay, but did improve health based on a composite score of measures that the researchers created for the study. A study of 799 patients at Mayo Clinic in Rochester, Minn., published in 2001, found prayer made no difference in the outcomes of patients after discharge from the cardiac care unit. The study looked at the number of deaths, cardiac arrests, and repeat hospitalizations, among other outcomes.

But Susan Misselbeck is sure that prayer helped her daughter Courtney Ridd, when she underwent a liver transplant 10 years ago after battling a rare liver disease. Misselbeck, who is now assistant to the executive director at Temple Israel, said her Jewish friends said prayers in their synagogues. People of different faiths across the country -- many of whom Misselbeck did not know -- heard about Courtney's illness and took up her cause in their prayer groups. Courtney, now 28, is doing fine.

''Did it help her to get better? Absolutely," said Misselbeck. ''Would she have died? How are you going to test something like that?

''All that powerful energy gave us a sense of peace. It felt like a nice warm blanket, wrapping us in it, saying it's going to be OK."

Alice Dembner can be reached at Dembner

ebolg

com.

gnosis301		2006-01-03 11:56:06 AM

I_C_Weener

Satanic Interference.

Mnementh2230		2006-01-03 11:57:26 AM

Stryyder
...but I do believe the heart of atheisim is hypocritical.

How is it hypocritical? As an athiest, if you're happy with your beliefs, I think that's fine and dandy. Just don't force them on me, or subject me to the DAILY (I can handle it on the money, but the billboards saying "JESUS!" are wearing thin)

What's hypocritical about saying "I don't believe in your god, or any"? I'm normally not millitant or anything about it, discussions with Bevets to the contrary.

Stryyder		2006-01-03 11:57:41 AM

Sloth

Did you forget my Boobies where I specifically stated that the only people that quote the bible literally are either atheists or devout theists trying to prove a point?

I am neither and thanks for proving my point.

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