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(Reuters)   Words stung, rifles were un-slung, shots rung, hands were wrung while lawyers flung dung from their tongues, and now the Hmong had better watch his bung   (today.reuters.com) divider line 276
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9840 clicks; posted to Main » on 17 Sep 2005 at 5:49 AM (8 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2005-09-17 03:59:51 AM
The issue is whether or not that confrontation was potentially deadly.
Deadly for Vang, or deadly for the others?
Nobody denies that Vang shot the other guys, but was it justifiable?
Does our own prejudice stand in the way?


I think the prejudice of all of the involved parties helped to create the scenario. And of course we judge the case based on our own ingrained prejudices.

Regardless, what happened wasn't civilized. It was instinct and fight-or-flight wrapped up into an encounter with guns.

It's a shame that people had to die, and a shame that people had to be imprisoned.

Night. Must sleep.
 
2005-09-17 04:01:05 AM
Immaculate_Misconception: With that said, it just wouldn't be in the guy's nature to start such a fight without deeming it to be 'his only chance'. I'm not saying he didn't want a fight. I'm saying that no experienced soldier would 'pick' this fight on these terms.


Agreed.

/sleep
 
2005-09-17 04:03:54 AM
Immaculate_Misconception:

I'm not saying he didn't want a fight. I'm saying that no experienced soldier would 'pick' this fight on these terms.

The media spin on this whole thing is horrific. The Minneapolis media is painting Vang as the next Hannibal Lector.

Did you see the D.A. trying to display Vang's rifle as a "Military weapon"? Of course it was a military weapon, where else would he have gotten it? Ostensibly, EVERY weapon is a "Military Weapon".

Sick of the whole thing.
/grrrrrr
 
2005-09-17 04:08:42 AM
Sphinx16: Sick of the whole thing.

OMG, when I was reading about the story earlier I found a freeper discussion about the story. The level of racism that exists in our nation is truly sickening. There were many people posting from the area where this happened, you should have heard the hatred and ignorance.

And people wonder how a situation like this could evolve.

/I don't wonder
//saw the same thing in Bosnia
///going to bed now, the garage isn't going to clean itself tomorrow
 
2005-09-17 04:08:45 AM
Immaculate_Misconception
I would assume that someone must have fired a shot at him, and here's why:

NO COMBAT VETERAN I KNOW OF would willingly start a firefight with an armed force of superior numbers at such close range unless he felt his life were in immediate danger and he had no other choice but to stop and fight.


First of all he is is not a combat veteran. According to the article he said that he served in the National Guard in California.

Secondly he did not face an armed force of superior numbers. One of the eight people he shot was armed. 6 of those died. 4 were shot in the back. He did not stop and fight. He chased down and executed his victims.

He is nothing more than an enraged mass murderer.
 
2005-09-17 04:13:31 AM
kolacky:

First of all he is is not a combat veteran. According to the article he said that he served in the National Guard in California.

From what the media is saying, Vang did serve in the Laos War. I/they could be wrong, but it does lend a certain versimiltude to the whole episode, doesn't it?
 
2005-09-17 04:19:53 AM
Sphinx16

He's only 36 years old and immigrated to the US at 11 when he was 11. If what I read in another article is true. I don't know, this is just horrible.
 
2005-09-17 04:20:28 AM
kolacky:

First of all he is is not a combat veteran. According to the article he said that he served in the National Guard in California.

I never said that he was a combat veteran. I did say that he was a trained soldier, which he was. Someone else said that he was a veteran of combat.

Secondly he did not face an armed force of superior numbers. One of the eight people he shot was armed. 6 of those died. 4 were shot in the back. He did not stop and fight. He chased down and executed his victims.
Were you there?

I'm only going by the version of the story that I've read. There have been stories written about this incident from every angle. Truth be told, either one of us could be right or wrong, you should think about that before you start correcting people.

He is nothing more than an enraged mass murderer.

Again, were you there? I can't agree on the "enraged" part, but I'll agree with the fact that he's a mass murderer. Especially since the subject of the thread is the fact that he was found guilty of multiple murders and all.

More than anything I was pointing out the things that made his legal defense weak. Were his version of events absolutely true, he still did not meet the burden of proving self-defense.

If you'd like to debate opinions about facts which neither of us can ultimately prove, you'll have to do that alone. If you'd like to debate the legal aspects of the case, I'm glad to do so after some sleep.
 
2005-09-17 04:20:57 AM
immigrated to the US when he was 11...
 
2005-09-17 04:26:37 AM
Immaculate_Misconception
If you'd like to debate opinions about facts which neither of us can ultimately prove, you'll have to do that alone. If you'd like to debate the legal aspects of the case, I'm glad to do so after some sleep.

Do I want to debate this? Not really.

Did I want to shake my fist at this guy and hope for his execution? Yes.
 
2005-09-17 04:33:55 AM
kolacky:

Do I want to debate this? Not really.

Did I want to shake my fist at this guy and hope for his execution? Yes.



Agreed.
 
2005-09-17 05:46:33 AM
Everybody Wang Chung tonight
 
2005-09-17 05:54:58 AM
...after the all-white jury found him guilty...
A jury of his peers.
/flame on!
 
2005-09-17 06:08:12 AM
Nice headline!!

We need pics of Bugs Bunny and Daffy Duck doing the rabbit season, duck season....no it's Elmer season bit.


/gonna wang chung now
//lmao
 
2005-09-17 06:09:19 AM
Are these the same guys that we are all secretly hoping will defend America if China ever invades? You know, the well-armed militia of citizens?

6-0? This can't be good.
 
2005-09-17 06:11:36 AM
Submitter worked waaay too hard for an utterly non-rappable headline.

/imagines R. Kelly will try anyway
//that's my Robert, always peeing on someone
 
2005-09-17 06:18:00 AM
farking crackers deserved it. This guy did the right thing. They were probably farking Christians too which makes them even more deserving of death.
 
2005-09-17 06:21:32 AM
young fung rung tounge fung bung jung wrung what?
 
2005-09-17 06:22:32 AM
not like others wil read this but....

I don't beleive the family's story. 8 people out hunting and only one gun? or maybe two?

and a family of hunters, I live in the hicksville area that these "family" hunters hunt in, in fact, I believe I am only an hours drive from the incident.

most likely he was up in their tree stand, and that many racial epithets were told at him.

most likeley threats of shooting him were offered, along with taunts about how his life was not worth investigating after death.

coloboration of stories were most likely agreed upon by the hunting "family"

I can also bet that most of those epithets were directed at the victim while at gunpoint.

If I was in his place? I might have done the same thing. on the other hand, i would not have been on others property in the first place....
 
2005-09-17 06:26:56 AM
Racism. Pure Racism.
I'm sure if a white man had killed only six Hmong, he would have gotten away with it.

/sarcasm off
 
2005-09-17 06:29:17 AM
The ocean?
http://www.wvah.com/programs/kingofthehill/billdauterive.jpg
 
2005-09-17 06:29:45 AM
h0m0z0ne

Troll else where. Perhaps you would perfer some kimchi with that load of crap you are dishing out. Just shut your pie hole and be thankful that America was nice enough to lend your country no interestest loans to rebuild after the war. Shesh. Kids?? Go make a microwave or something and leave the conversation to the grown ups.
 
2005-09-17 06:30:37 AM
How anyone can feel sorry for is beyond me once you realize that if you RTFA it states that Vang routinely trespassed on private property to hunt.

This wasn't a case of taking a wrong turn at Alberque and finding yourself unarmed with a bunch of sheet wearing klansmen.

He KNEW what he was doing was wrong and didn't care. The guy was even ticketed before and that did not stop him.

Since this guy wasn't the most honest guy to begin with I am taking his testimony with a grain of salt. No one really knows what happened in those woods except Vang and THE MURDERED. It would be easy for him to say that the hunters called him racist names and shot at them. I mean, who is going to argue?

But being namecalled no matter how horrible it is, isn't reason for MURDER. I am sure everyone here has been called a name, whether racist or not (I've had my share; cracker, white devil, mick, spic, wetback, biatch and the ever lovely c*nt. Heck, once I had a African American woman come up to me after I walked out of the rain and sniff me, I mean, put her nose in my hair and sniffed me because she heard that "white people smell like wet dogs when they are wet." What the devil?) But that doesn't give me grounds to get a gun and shoot people. It never will.

So, I have no pity for Vang. I will never have pity for Vang. He is a murderer, short and simple. He knew he wasn't allowed there. The property owners got mad. He should have just walked away and stayed off THEIR PRIVATE PROPERTY but he didn't. He knew what he was doing when he shot them and felt no remorse. Vang is nothing short of a MURDERER.
 
2005-09-17 06:31:05 AM
Simple. Stay the hell of private property.

/rocket science pop quiz
 
2005-09-17 06:34:26 AM
hey mekki

Don't call me a c*nt. I am much more then a Coin.. C*nt. Well I never...
 
2005-09-17 06:36:52 AM
I'm American and white...
 
2005-09-17 06:38:58 AM
this guy should be publicly humiliated and then neutered to prevent his seed from spreading into america
 
2005-09-17 06:49:15 AM
What a great headline! I dare anybody to gripe about submitting the story with a better one
 
2005-09-17 06:54:03 AM
What's up with all the racism in Fark lately. Is it the freepers?
 
2005-09-17 06:58:40 AM
Oh, submitter...

Headline would work so much better if Hmong actually rhymed with any of those other rhyming words. (Hint: it rhymes with "bong" or "song", not "rung" or any of those others.)
 
2005-09-17 07:04:33 AM
I thought an armed society was a polite society?
 
2005-09-17 07:05:50 AM
What's up with all the racism in Fark lately. Is it the freepers?




Try again troll. You get one more guess.
 
2005-09-17 07:14:48 AM
2005-09-17 07:05:50 AM Flipper the Dolphin



/funny answer
//it's not racism to say killing six people is wrong
 
2005-09-17 07:16:25 AM
Your randomly generated graph is compelling evidence
 
2005-09-17 07:19:25 AM
PWNED!!11!!!1!

Note: The B Felony counts are for the Attempted homicides.


Charge(s)
Count No. Statute Description

1 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony B

2 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A

3 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A

4 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony B

5 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A

6 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A

7 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A

8 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony A

9 940.01(1)(a) 1st-Degree Intentional Homicide Felony B
 
2005-09-17 07:19:30 AM
I submitted this with a....... ok, no I didn't.
 
2005-09-17 07:26:23 AM
Were I on the jury, Vang's own testimony would have tipped the scales from self-defense to murder.

When asked whether any of those people he shot deserved to die, he identified three of them that, in his mind, did... because they threatened him using racial slurs.

This attitude of superiority that allowed him to sit in judgment over the very lives of his victims, even having been given months in which to develop *some* sense of remorse, contributed to his conviction more than anything else.
 
2005-09-17 07:38:03 AM
Shooting people in the back is not cool. I suppose it's sometimes necessary. In fact enjoyable. But, always plan your escape and concealment of the evidence. Or at least your excuse, preferably not an excuse of being called a bad name.

We just had a guy here in VA aquitted of the murder of a man wielding a stick. Not a bat, gun, knife, or even a numchuck- a stick. And apparently not a "Really Big Stick" tm. Maybe even a twig.

Whooee, self defence lives! in the Commonwealth.
 
2005-09-17 07:56:36 AM
Immaculate_Misconception

Try and shoot sometime. A 4" group, at 100 yards, offhand, is pretty damn respectable.

/500m is waaay out there for a point target.
//1000m? Forget about it.
 
2005-09-17 07:57:11 AM
I have nothing to add to the present discussion, I'm only here on account of the strength of the headline.
 
2005-09-17 08:07:00 AM
Hmong Ass?

/btw, fark is more red than blue, at least where it counts.
 
2005-09-17 08:12:27 AM
You could do 1000m with a tripod, high-velocity ammunition, and a good scope with wind correction, could you not?

/has only ever fired handguns
 
2005-09-17 08:17:20 AM
That entire article tries to portray the shooter as the victim. The real issue is that the left wing controlled media wants you to believe that all immigrants, illegal or not are victims, and that everyone else is a racist. That man shot and killed 6 people, there is no excuse for that, even if he was called names. You see, these people didn't have property rights in Cambodia, which ment they could hunt where ever they wanted for how ever much game they wanted. Then they think they can come over here and do the same thing. I think this is just the tip of the iceberg on this story. There is a lot more to this group of "immigrants" than is being reported and will be reported. The libral media will not report on this, that's not how they see the world.
 
2005-09-17 08:19:52 AM
eyedvmtech: not everyone wants Bambi eating their crops


Or on the front end of their car.
 
2005-09-17 08:20:26 AM
Standing "O" to submitter. Should be strong candidate for "headline of the year"

/ Did not RTFA
 
2005-09-17 08:29:14 AM
kr0m0z0ne: My longest shots are @ 650m with a .223. Not easy to place a tight group with open sights, but it's an acquired skill. Methinks it's easier with a heavier bullet. Mr Hmong supposedly used a .30 cal or 7.62. His kill distance, with skill, would have been nearly 900m. His kill distance with a .50 cal would have increased exponentially, but at least he used a deer rifle so as not to scare Henry Waxman.
 
2005-09-17 08:41:20 AM
I'm from and live in Wisconsin. I have lived in central Wisconsin near my whole life. My town had a great Hmong immigration during the mid-late eighties. The immigrations are a thing of culture shock because where they came from, you could fish anywhere. Here you can fish, only with a license, only certain #s of certain sizes of certain kinds. They had different kinds of freedoms than what we do - and vice versa. We -owe- the hmong refugees homes in the US. More of them died during the Vietnam war than did Americans and MANY could not live in their own country after we left.

That being said, this case has very little to do, if anything - with race determining guilt. A trained Military person does know you wouldn't need to hunt people down, there is a thing called a retreat. Wisconsin is not backwards. This is a painfull case of several families, including Mr. Vang's.

Minnesota folk who think Wiconsin is backwards

It is Minnesota that rewards teaching Intelligent Design in -SCIENCE CLASS-. An untestable(by definition then, NOT SCIENCE) theory.
 
2005-09-17 08:49:43 AM
Oh dear.

Wrong on so many fronts.

And so it goes on in Fark...
 
2005-09-17 09:04:02 AM
Y'know I hate to say that this guy might've gotten a bum deal, but I think he may have gotten a bum deal.

No, he got lucky that Wisconsin has no death penalty. He is also lucky that one of others was not combat/police trained and carrying (and had faster reflexes).

I don't beleive the family's story. 8 people out hunting and only one gun? or maybe two?

Well as a member of Wisconsin's hunting family community, we normally only carry one or two for our group. You see, when we're checking stands, blinds, et al. We aren't out to shoot anything.

In the end Mr. Vang probably ends up with what he deserved, or maybe a little less.
 
2005-09-17 09:11:39 AM
I wonder if the driver of this truck is a member of PETA

 
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