Do you have adblock enabled?
If you can read this, either the style sheet didn't load or you have an older browser that doesn't support style sheets. Try clearing your browser cache and refreshing the page.

(Reuters)   Germany now blames the U.S. for high oil prices, supplying the world with urine-like beer   ( divider line
    More: Strange  
•       •       •

13744 clicks; posted to Main » on 31 Aug 2005 at 9:47 PM (11 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

271 Comments     (+0 »)

Oldest | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | » | Newest | Show all

2005-08-31 10:10:16 PM  
I actually heard reports from some people in my hometown that a couple gas stations were actually selling at over $5/gallon and even they were selling out... It's getting crazy over here. I'm currently in Clemson at university and even here it is $3/gallon... This sucks.
2005-08-31 10:11:47 PM  
Maybe there should have been a "And" in that headline.

Right now, off the top of my head, I can think of the two things I miss the most about living in Germany. 1) The autobahn 2) The beer.

Other than the microbrews, all American beers really lack something. Methinks it's quality. Why cant Australia start exporting some of the good stuff they have been keeping for themselves?
2005-08-31 10:11:50 PM  

My wife yelled at me for cleaning up and taking a picture before I drove to the hospital. I guess she was right becuase the shakes set in when I was halfway there.
2005-08-31 10:11:52 PM  

Actually guys, I dunno if this is a South Carolina only thing but the gas prices shot up to over $3/gallon today and gas stations here are running out of gas like crazy. Is anyone else elswhere experiencing this?

It's happening all over. Katrina knocked out a bunch of oil refineries down south, there were 8 out of commission as of a few hours ago when I first watched the news and saw how horrific katrina really was to, uh, a lot of stuff down south. Also messed up interstate pipelines, severely reducing movement of said substance.

Dunno if everyone is running out but it's certainly taking it's toll.

I blame all the car manufacturers, and by that, I mean I blame all the people who relentlessly persue bigger, stronger and therefore more gas-consuming vehicles.

I recently saw an ad in Newsweek, of all mags, touting some Dodge truck as being 'bigger, stronger, faster,' and then they say 19c/9h.

Cars that get single-digit mpg (miles per gallon, not mpeg video codec) should be be moved right from the drawing board to the trash can. Trucks do not need to be fast.

If you want a fast vehicle...don't buy a truck.
2005-08-31 10:11:53 PM  
One minute, they want us to reduce our CO2 emmisions, the next minute they critizise us for not building enough refineries.

I'm so confused.
2005-08-31 10:11:58 PM  
More refineries?

Not in my backyard!
Not off my coast!
Not in my nature preserve!

Berlin it is.
2005-08-31 10:12:25 PM  
BHShaman wins the thread.
2005-08-31 10:12:43 PM  
The higher the price goes the better. Maybe we'll finally start looking into bio-diesel instead of relying on the fascist states in the ME for our energy.
2005-08-31 10:13:45 PM  
er i had my stat backwards, should have been 9c/19h.
2005-08-31 10:14:30 PM  
He's ABSOLUTELY right though. Problem is it takes over 100 US agencies to approve a refinery, and he has not exactly been 'for' us building them before.

He's just using this to leverage his country's support. Not that our presidents here do that, but ya know...
2005-08-31 10:14:50 PM  

"At least we didn't supply the world with HITLER!


Hitler was born in Austria.
2005-08-31 10:14:55 PM  
Wow . . . where does that dude get his facts? Our lack of refining capacity has nothing to do with either Europe's oil or "petrol". You don't put refined gasoline, heating oil or natural gas in a tanker. You refine it at the same place you put it on the truck.

Dancin_In_Ancin: facts are facts
Sure, but those facts have nothing to do with Schoeder's pseudo-economics. Not only that, but god forbid that people exercise their property rights, and simultaneously make a product that produces externalities more accurately priced. Capitalism BAD? Property rights BAD? If people don't want refineries in their yard, then yeah . . . refined gas should be more expensive. That's America, baby.
2005-08-31 10:15:10 PM  
This is so like those bloody euro-socialists, sure when Asia gets hit with a disaster they send their condolences and aid and whine about how more needs to be done, but when the U.S. gets hit with its biggest natural disaster ever all they can do is criticize us about our oil policy...

Dear European Socialist Beaurocracy,

F*ck you.

With Disdain,
Average American
2005-08-31 10:16:05 PM  
article is 100% correct.

Our refinery capacity and condition are inexcusably deplorable - an embarrassing laughingstock.

Hedge fund speculation is distorting markets and driving up prices unneccessarily.

Oil companies are experiencing RECORD PROFITS! HELLO! Oil-man president - coincidence?

We are getting SO REAMED!
2005-08-31 10:16:12 PM  
sat0shi, I'm in Charleston. My dad just spoke with a neighbor who filled up his Suburban (go figure) plus two gas cans, and he said that the gas station attendant said that they would probably run out of gas tonight. The neighbor had spoken with a relative in Charlotte, who said that they were running out of gas there as well.

I'm beginning to get very worried about this situation.

And today on the national news it said that Greenville, SC, had the cheapest gas in the nation, at about $2.30 or $2.40 a gallon.
2005-08-31 10:16:29 PM  
It's fairly typical of socialist cesspools like Germany (and France, for that matter) to blame the US for all the evils of the world. Easier than admitting that their own socio-political systems are failures.
2005-08-31 10:17:14 PM  
Not sure what the submitter was thinking...but if he's accusing a country of making urine-like beer, he should give up on the Coors.
2005-08-31 10:17:26 PM  
Funny thing about 89 octane is that the refineries don't "refine" 89 octane. 89 is just a mix of the 87 and the 91.

(87+91)/2 = 89, voila.

Also here in KC, regular is pushing 3 bucks a gallon.


This is bass-ackwards. If we had MORE refining capacity, our refineries would use more oil...higher demand=higher price.

With a bunch of refineries off-line, refining capacity is lower, lower US demand is lower = lower price.

your ignorance amazes me. Supply and demand?
2005-08-31 10:17:39 PM  
fark Germany. We just got hit with a huge natural disaster, and rather than send any kind of aid, or so much as a kind word, they take this opportunity to criticize us for making their oil more expensive. fark 'em.
2005-08-31 10:17:49 PM  
Didn't the USA supply like 75% of the oil used to defeat hitler?
2005-08-31 10:18:43 PM  
Yeah I'm getting worried too. Luckily I'm living on campus right now so I don't have to drive so much but things are getting crazy. Who knows what might happen...
2005-08-31 10:19:07 PM  
/ Nazi Brew
2005-08-31 10:20:27 PM  
Actually, the text you cite is 100% accurate. Our lack of refining capacity is a subsidy (believe it or not) for European oil. If we had greater refinery capacity, we would have fewer gas shortages (happens ever couple years in California) and consume more oil in the aggregate.

Petekill right. You and Schoeder wrong. Supply and demand indeed.
2005-08-31 10:20:28 PM  
nytmare: We can consternate those infidel Germans! Henceforth our dogs shall be called "Freedom Shepherds"

Don't diss the Shepherds. She doesn't like that shiat.
[image from too old to be available]
While born in Germany, she speaks enough english so only I can give her commands
2005-08-31 10:20:32 PM  
I am SOO HOPING Bush gets owned over this, and people FINALLY wake up...
2005-08-31 10:20:32 PM  
Why does the submitter hate Red Stripe and Fosters so much?
2005-08-31 10:21:01 PM  

No, YOU'VE got it bass-ackwards. The ultimate demand is from the end user - the consumer. The gas stations supply that demand, but in turn make demands to the distributors. The distributors supply that demand, but then... ultimately making it up to the refineries. The refineries have a demand for refined petroleum products that is not dependent on the amount of oil available to them to refine - it is dependent on you, me and everybody else in this world who is the end user of refined petroleum products. If there was no demand for gasoline, that ripples all the way up to the refiners.

The US feds did do one smart thing today - they gave blanket permission to refiners to stop producing all the boutique blends of gasoline to meet all the special environental needs of certain political areas. 87 octane can now have the same composition or blend for everybody, not one blend for CA, one for NJ, one for NY or IL or even special blends for various counties of those and other states. Cause guess what? When they are making that blend for one place they ain't making it for you or anybody else!! That's where the refining capacity has hit a brick wall. Besides our increased demand, we are asking the same capacity we have had for decades to produce many new products, all on the same production line. Petro engineers and environentalists - don't take me to task on details. I don't know all of them and most of us don't care if you do. Bottom line is lack of refining capacity and taxing that capacity to do what it wasn't designed to do put us in this mess. Katrina only exposed it rather dramatically.
2005-08-31 10:21:17 PM

I'm sure you will all enjoy this article on Salon, in which the German newspapers claim that if Bush had signed the Kyoto Protocol then the hurricane wouldn't have been so bad.

"In an article blasting Trittin, Der Spiegel writes, "The worst of it is that Trittin isn't alone with his cold, malicious tenor. The coverage from much of the German media tends in the same direction: If Bush had only listened to Uncle Trittin and signed the Kyoto Protocol, then this never would have happened."

Now, I consider myself to be an environmentalist, and I certainly have no love for Bush, but the conclusion above is just stupid.
2005-08-31 10:21:17 PM  
Who gives a damn anyway.

The world loves to find any reason they can to rag on the US, as they all wish they had the freedoms, land mass, market conditions, and the genuine opportunity to better yourself (if you so desire) that we have, have always had, and always will have.

Not to mention our massive gold plated titanium balls.

And don't forget the chip on the shoulder of the worlds countries, for all the times we have pulled their dumb asses out of the fire.

Piss on em. They are a tangled web of jealousy and incompetence.

And they also wish they had one ounce of our massive gold plated titanium balls.

America will go on, LA, et. al. will be rebuilt in some fashion, in some location, and it will be better, stronger, and more enjoyable then it ever was before.

And people will help other people to recover from this catastrophe, and this is true regardless of how many trillions are dumped into Iraq, Afghanistan, or elsewhere; as we don't need the money the US gov't has squandered around the world.

In the end, Americans are Americans, and we look after our own.

As if anything Germany says is worth two shiats anyway. They are simply using our bad fortune to get their pathetic name in the press again anyway.

Also, they never quite got over the who Hitler thing either, so fark em.

In other words: Germany who?


As I said in another thread - if you either are, or know someone who has been left homeless as a result of this hurricane - email me.

Im in KC, but I have room for up to 4 people to crash at my place until LA is inhabitable again. I'll need help with your food $$, but everything else is gratis.
2005-08-31 10:21:21 PM  
To be honest, if our gubment would come forward and admit the real truth about the illegality of hemp, then they could start endorsing vehicles that run on hemp oil. But that would only hurt

the cotton industry
pharmosutical companies
the alcohol/liquor industries
the tobacco industries
synthetic fabrics industries
the plastics industry
the pesticide industry
the prison industry (yes, it's an industry)

and i'm sure there are more. Those companies would be severely crippled if hemp were ever legalized, and that's why hemp is illegal. Every one of those industries, and more, were threatened by it and therefore lobbied to make hemp illegal.
2005-08-31 10:23:25 PM  

I see your freedom shepards, and raise you one freedom chocolate cake

[image from too old to be available]
2005-08-31 10:23:49 PM  
moltov Yeah, MAAAAAAAAAAAAAN. If we just had hemp, we'd have more . . .. uuhhhh .. . mmmmmmmm . . . YEAH, MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAN.
2005-08-31 10:24:10 PM  
it's all the liberals' fault.
2005-08-31 10:24:15 PM  
Rootus, I had heard that Germany and Mexico were some of the few countries who had already pledge to help us with disaster relief. I can't find anything through Google News that backs that up, but I wouldn't be so quick to condemn.

sat0shi, guess you guys just started classes. I would imagine most of you will stay put until gas prices and supply stablize (probably not for a while).

Interestingly enough, I'm leaving for Germany on Friday (day after tomorrow). I'm doing a foreign study program, and I'll be living with a German family until December.

It's going to be interesting to see what they ask me about Katrina and everything else over here, particularly with the German economic minster blasting us.

I'm actually glad I'm going now, because I've got my own car that I would otherwise have to fill up with gas. I think things are going to get really bad in terms of gas over the next few weeks (shortages, huge price spikes, and other nasties), and I'd rather not be here for that.
2005-08-31 10:25:43 PM  
it will go up even more if Nigeria doesnt do something about an impending oilstrike.

here in Denmark the price has gone up by 5% since katrina hit, compared to 10% the past 8 months. roughly 7,30$/gallon now.

/doesnt own car, doesnt need one
2005-08-31 10:26:50 PM  


/end vent
2005-08-31 10:27:25 PM  
You have instability in the middle east, you get higher gas prices. When you have problems with the supply you get higher gas prices. When you have problems with refineries you get higher gas prices. When you elect someone who's family makes money from oil you get higher gas prices.

Oil refineries deserve some of the blame, but when you invade a country in the middle east this is one of the biproducts. All you midwest republicans who punched Bush Cheney on you ballot boxes, wake up and thank you for your idiotacy. Now we are in a period of reaction to a crisis, when we could have addressed this problem over the course of 5 years effectively. Bush has no foresight, but this will take the focus off the Iraq problem for a few days. It makes me sick...
2005-08-31 10:28:26 PM  
Darn tootin', those Krauts are right! We need more refineries. When the enlightened population of Europe starts slamming us for not having enough refineries, we might want to listen to them over the greenies.
2005-08-31 10:28:32 PM  
There's a really simple answer that solves all problems related to gasoline: use less of it. Then you don't have to build more refineries and you can concentrate on making the ones that you have safer and more efficient. Reducing gasoline consumption doesn't seem to be on the conservative agenda, for some reason. Thrift is no longer a conservative virtue. Waste is.

Leaving that aside, given the shortage in refinery capacity that is supposedly an important factor in gasoline pricing, doesn't it seem rather unwise to leave the nation's main petroleum processing port unprotected against severe weather? To ignore the advice of engineers that the existing levee system requires maintenance and improvement and, against their heated objections, to reduce the funds five years in a row?

For an eye-opening review of the actual history, see Did New Orleans Catastrophe Have to Happen? 'Times-Picayune' Had Repeatedly Raised Federal Spending Issues [pops]

Here's a quick summary: The problems with the flood control systems go back to the '60s, but the program to correct them was begun under Clinton in direct response to the flaws revealed by the May 1995 flood in which six people died. It's called the Southeast Louisiana Urban Flood Control.

The White House began gutting this program in 2001, against the advice of almost everyone who understood the consequences. So the contrast is rather clear. Clinton started the fix; Bush crippled it.

If an auto mechanic looks at your car and says that the tires are wearing thin, and you decide not to replace them, who do you blame when you have a blow-out?

The White House was warned on multiple occasions that the Port of New Orleans required intensive maintenance because it would not withstand a major hurricane. They chose to reject this very wise advice. Now the blow-out has occurred. The lame answer is that, well, maybe it wouldn't have worked anyway, and besides, we need more refineries and more drilling and a war in Iraq and more tax cuts for the rich, so we can't afford to perform the recommended maintenance.

A very astute science historian once told me that the reason that engineers are so much more successful than theoretical scientists is that if they make a mistake in building a bridge it falls down on them. They also are subject to losing their licenses when they commit grave errors and may even be prosecuted and sent to prison. Therefore, he said, they rely on traditional rules of thumb to modify their theoretical calculations with a very substantial safety factor.

As we have seen, the current administration has a habit of substituting its own very precarious theoretical calculations for the very prudent advice of seasoned operational experts. This is not their first failure. Why should they be allowed to skip past it? How many bridges have to fall on our heads before these people are dismissed?
2005-08-31 10:28:47 PM  
China's demand is twice ours... the actual usage just hasn't surpassed it yet.

You wait... China's inefficiencies with petro will REALLY fark our prices over.
2005-08-31 10:29:21 PM  
Another thing--I personally think the German Economic Minister needs to simply STFU. The world in which we live is based on a free market (at least at the international level)--those people who sell oil are free to take America on as customers or not.

If America is willing to pay more for oil than Germany is, then tough shiat. It doesn't matter whether it's European oil or from the Middle East; if we pay more, we get it under the economic system we use.
2005-08-31 10:29:50 PM  
Disposable Rob -- "Blame China."

The U.S. consumes 20.5 million barrels of oil per day.
China consumes 6.5 million barrels daily (6.7 mil according to your link).

"Facts are facts"
2005-08-31 10:30:18 PM  
Oh I love that one - it's CHINA's fault for being the SECOND biggest consumer, not our fault for being the biggest. Damn China. Can't trust em, what with being full of all those Chinamen.
2005-08-31 10:31:16 PM  
It takes about a year start to finish to put up an ethanol plant. I watched it happen. So if petrol refineries are so long and expensive facilities don't build them, build more ethanol plants and force the auto industry to only sell flex fuel vehicles.
Gas is up to $7 per gallon in Atlanta per CNN just now.

Wasn't a hit on the gulf coast part of the peak oil theory?
2005-08-31 10:31:50 PM  
Your post is simply too thoughtful and insightful. I'm afraid you'll have to leave.
2005-08-31 10:31:52 PM  
Is it just in Gemany's interests to try creating a new World War every 50 or so farking years or something?
2005-08-31 10:33:03 PM  
Lot of slysdexics in the audience tonight... Re-read that headline guys, it's the Americans producing the shiatty beer :P
2005-08-31 10:34:01 PM  
I love the guy in the one article. Says supply is about topped off as to what refineries can handle. In other words their tanks are filled. Yet after mentioning a correction says oil won't go below $60 a barrel. So he's right about one thing, and his memory doesn't go back more than a couple weeks on the other. With full tanks there's no reason for refineries to pay $60 a barrel. They can sit for a couple weeks. And let market fundamentals take over the market again.

Funny though has gasoline futures trading was halted yesterday after an initial spike of a few percent at market open. Yet the oil traders will gladly pilfer people's pockets.
2005-08-31 10:39:25 PM  
Read this,and this,* and get educated.

*I'm mirroring these pages on my site because keeps timing out on me, and maybe on you. If not, copy the link into your browser.
2005-08-31 10:39:36 PM  
Germany is very correct in their assertion of us being at Refinery capacity for a very long time. Any break downs or events such as Katrina only cause production capacity to go down. NIMBY tree humpers have also contributed to our inability to build a new refinery in over 20 years.

While existing refineries have been refitted with new equipment and are bit more efficient, it still means we need more refining capacity, and we have needed it for years.
Displayed 50 of 271 comments

Oldest | « | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | 6 | » | Newest | Show all

This thread is archived, and closed to new comments.

Continue Farking
Submit a Link »
On Twitter

Top Commented
Javascript is required to view headlines in widget.

In Other Media
  1. Links are submitted by members of the Fark community.

  2. When community members submit a link, they also write a custom headline for the story.

  3. Other Farkers comment on the links. This is the number of comments. Click here to read them.

  4. Click here to submit a link.