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(San Bernardino Sun)   California school district considers teaching classes in Ebonics so that children will not have to learn that pesky English   ( divider line
    More: Asinine  
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16673 clicks; posted to Main » on 19 Jul 2005 at 3:38 AM (12 years ago)   |   Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»

488 Comments     (+0 »)

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2005-07-18 04:09:34 PM  
"Excuse me stewardess, I speak jive"
2005-07-18 04:12:53 PM  
See how much that benefits them in the work place.
2005-07-18 04:14:29 PM  

(things like this worry me)
2005-07-18 04:14:55 PM  
And how to you say "Do you want fries with that?" in ebonics?
2005-07-18 04:15:42 PM  
Len Cooper, who is coordinating the pilot program at the two city schools, said San Bernardino district officials do not plan to incorporate Ebonics into the program.

"Because Ebonics can have a negative stigma, we're not focusing on that,' Cooper said. "We are affirming and recognizing Ebonics through supplemental reading books (for students).'

Submitter didn't really read the article, did s/he? Also, this is so 8 years ago.
2005-07-18 04:16:25 PM  
Man, I really hope that article was satire...
2005-07-18 04:17:52 PM  
Great. Wonderful idea. When are the state-sponsored classes in Klingon?
2005-07-18 04:17:52 PM  
This is one of the most incredibly farking stupid things I've ever heard of.
2005-07-18 04:17:52 PM  
I prefer Hebonics.
2005-07-18 04:18:02 PM  
2005-07-18 04:18:16 PM  
Do you know what Coolio uses to keep his whites nice and bright?

2005-07-18 04:18:48 PM  
5000_gallons_of_toothpaste: And how to you say "Do you want fries with that?" in ebonics?

"You be having fries, yo?"

/interestingly, very similar to Newfie
2005-07-18 04:23:40 PM  
Wouldn't this fall under ESL, rather than teaching a 'separate language'? If this segment of the population can't properly speak English, as the article states, and therefore can't properly understand English, shouldn't they be tutored in English? Not catered to by using their own 'language' in textbooks and classrooms?

/treat it like spanish speaking households, or korean speaking households, or german speaking households- English as a Second Language.
2005-07-18 04:26:32 PM  
Dammit, did any of you read the article (or at least my post in which I quoted the relevant parts of the article)?
2005-07-18 04:28:01 PM  
SurgeonDryHog: Dammit, did any of you read the article

Yes. They're not actually doing it, but a socioligist wants them to.

Still an incredibly stupid idea.
2005-07-18 04:28:52 PM  
SurgeonDryHog: Dammit, did any of you read the article

No. Why?
2005-07-18 04:33:34 PM  
JPJ007: Yes. They're not actually doing it, but a socioligist wants them to.

As far as I could tell, it said that a sociologist would like to see Ebonics included in a supplemental program on black history. And then it seemed that the school board said no, but it will include books in the supplemental program that include ebonics. Big f*cking deal!
2005-07-18 04:34:39 PM  
Wait, fark has articles?
2005-07-18 04:36:01 PM  
SurgeonDryHog: it will include books in the supplemental program that include ebonics.

I mean to say that it will include books in the supplemental program that are written (to some extent) in ebonics. Although the article isn't really clear on that. Anyway, this isn't anything worthy of controversy, if you ask me.

peck: No. Why?

Well, you don't have to read it, since you weren't one of the people outraged at the article.
2005-07-18 04:43:00 PM  
SurgeonDryHog: Anyway, this isn't anything worthy of controversy

Nope. But the idea of doing the whole thing in ebonics, like the sociologist biatch wnated, is incredibly stipid. As that seemed to be a major part of the article, the heckling and other negative comments are well deserved.

...besides, since when does anybody RTFA?
2005-07-18 04:57:47 PM  
JPJ007: besides, since when does anybody RTFA?

2005-07-18 05:24:08 PM  
"Ebonics" is a supremely retarded name.

The preferred nomenclature is African American Vernacular English.

Is it a good thing to tell kids that the way they think (remember, you think in your primary language) is "stupid" and "wrong"? The kids need to learn standard English, no question, but can it be done without belittling them for speaking the language they were born with?

(Put another way, do you tell a Hispanic kid that his Spanish is stupid and wrong because it ain't standard English?)
2005-07-18 05:48:56 PM  
They were BORN with Ebonics? GIve me a break. Force-fed maybe. Perhaps we should sanction klingon too. Or how about Arkansas hillbilly? Does anyone else think that language is COMMUNICATION, NOT politics, NOT racial pride, NOT black identity rationalization, NOT a way to prove equality. COMMUNICATION! As in being able to talk to each other. EBONICS helps this right? DUMB! I'm a cajun from southeastern Louisiana. I'm proud of my heritage and the language that goes with it - but I won't ever demand it be taught in public schools. What a CROK!
2005-07-18 05:49:05 PM  
I am unable to formulate an opinion on this matter without the guidance of comic legend Bill Cosby.
2005-07-18 05:53:48 PM  
This is the stupidest thing that I have ever heard and if the parents of the students have one lick of sense about them they will march to Sacramento and demand school choice.

Jeebus farking keerist.
2005-07-18 08:30:14 PM  
GorgeousOrifice: The preferred nomenclature is African American Vernacular English

"African American Vernacular English"...bwahahahahahahah
2005-07-18 10:17:24 PM  
So your going to teach Ebonics?

What are the basic rules for sentence structure?

Can you imagine the syllabus?

Or, the Principal saying," Mrs. Jones, how's that ebonics class going? You know we put in a lot of hours getting ready for this course.
2005-07-18 10:35:37 PM  
Great African-American newsmen have learned to hide their ebonic tribespeak.

/when you can't think of anything to say, quote Cartman
2005-07-18 11:10:51 PM  
Language is a virus from outer space.
2005-07-18 11:42:13 PM  
Phil Herup: What are the basic rules for sentence structure?

I remember back when "Ebonics" was coined, some language nerds actually defined the rules for Black English. I'm too lazy to Google for it though.
2005-07-19 12:32:54 AM  

I just want to publically say "Thanks."

2005-07-19 12:34:40 AM  
Well... maybe I should spell "publicaly" correctly.
2005-07-19 12:35:50 AM  
pshaw: "publicaly"

Crap. I blame ebonics.
2005-07-19 01:23:47 AM  
[image from too old to be available]
2005-07-19 01:54:52 AM  


2005-07-19 03:45:37 AM  
2+2 before
2005-07-19 03:47:04 AM  
It's sort of inevitable when you think about it. Throughout history, languages tend to diverge. Latin split off Romanian, French, Italian, and, in turn, was one of the languages split off from Indo-European....

It's also why Esperanto and other "global" languages never took off. Something in the human psyche wants to have unique languages for everyone.

/Doesn't mean I'm going to take Ebonics lessons to accomodate 'em, though.
2005-07-19 03:48:56 AM  
Len Cooper, who is coordinating the pilot program at the two city schools, said San Bernardino district officials do not plan to incorporate Ebonics into the program.

It goes on to say simply that teachers will get some training on black culture and customs.

Do submitters or greenlighters actually *READ* any of these articles?
2005-07-19 03:50:17 AM  
I just can't keep up with the fashions these days. Is the recognition of "Ebonics" a way of acknowledging that Different People Speak in Different Ways(tm), or is it a way of keepin' the black man down by implying that he can't learn to speak properly?

The fashion seems to change on a monthly--nay, weekly--basis. It's like trying to remember what to call people who have learning disabilities/learning difficulties/learning differences/whatever. I never know which to say; I just know that someone will act condescending no matter which term I choose. It's as though there's a bulletin of PC terms that's issued every day, and I'm carefully kept off the list.
2005-07-19 03:53:53 AM  
Teaching the teachers how to understand Ebonics so that they may correct children to speak in standard English is an excellent idea...

Other than that this idea is sucks (no homo).

2005-07-19 03:57:04 AM  
Four score an' seven years ago our fathers brought forth on dis here continent uh new nation, conceived in Liberty, an' dedicated ta da proposition dat all men iz created equal. Now we's iz engaged in uh great civil war, tes'in whether dat nation or any nation so conceived an' so dedicated, can long endure.

We iz met on uh great battle-field o' dat war. We gots come ta dedicate uh portion o' dat field, as uh final resting place fo' those who here gave they lives dat that nation might live. It iz altogether fitting an' proper dat we's should do dis here. But, in uh larger sense, we's can not dedicate, we's can not consecrate, we's can not hallow, dis here ground. The brave men, living an' dead, who struggled here, gots consecrated it, far above our poor power ta add or detract. The world will little note, nor long remember what we's say here, but it can never forget what dey did here.

It iz fo' us da living, rather, ta be dedicated here ta da unfinished werk which dey who fought here gots thus far so nobly advanced. It iz rather fo' us ta be here dedicated ta da great task remaining 'bfoe us dat from deez honored dead we's take increased devotion ta dat cause fo' which dey gave da last full measure o' devotion dat we's here highly resolve dat deez dead shall not gots died in vain dat dis here nation, under God, shall gots uh new birth o' freedom an' dat da system o' da peeps, by da peeps, fo' da peeps, shall not perish from da earth. brace yourself foo'!

Ebonics translator (Clicky pops)
2005-07-19 03:57:24 AM  
Time for Fred Williamson to biatchslap the school district.
2005-07-19 04:01:35 AM  

Dammit, did any of you read the article (or at least my post in which I quoted the relevant parts of the article)?

Who has time to read articles? If the headline can't give us all the pertinent info we need for a full out flame war, then it's not worth commenting on.
2005-07-19 04:04:42 AM  
NikolaiFarkoff wins.
2005-07-19 04:06:02 AM  
2005-07-19 04:06:13 AM  
Ebonics will be a valid language only when you can show me a printed translation of Harry Potter.

/there, now everyone can hate me
2005-07-19 04:06:54 AM  
It's also why Esperanto and other "global" languages never took off.

Actually Esperanto never took off because it was inane, was chock full of "Latino" jingoism, and incorporated all of the really asinine and stupid rules from all the languages and threw out any parts that were good, .
I mean, c'mon, they kept gendered noun forms! Holy Mother of Chaos, why? If I was building a language from the ground up, the first thing that I would do is stike a stake in the heart of that idea and bury it really deep do that it could never plague the world again. Dumb idea, *BAD* for transliteration in so many, many ways.

Esperanto was a pure abortion from the outset. I read through Esperanto texts several times, and nearly fell over with laughter at the pure ineptitude of it.
2005-07-19 04:07:40 AM  
This is it. The Apocalypse has begun.
2005-07-19 04:10:19 AM  
Wow, total lack of people reading the article. I'll jump in merely for sport.

First of all, cut through the crap about your white sensibilities being offended and whatever. It's boring. The more interesting question would be - does it work?

Being a college educator, it is a bit of a pinch. On the one hand, if students don't learn "High English" or whatever you want to call it, then they are banished to the economic and social fringes, further isolating them, impovershing them and making them more prone to end up in jail or shot to death. That and, last I checked, in the South they do not teach the Southern vernacular in schools to help out poor white kids, which is as close as Americans get to a really separate dialect (and which is the basis for African-American vernacular, by the way). Having seen my share of bad writing, if students can't get basic skills in high school, they're doomed once they get to college. If a black student wrote a history essay in AA Vernacular, they'd get as bad a grade as a student who wrote in Southern drawl.

On the other hand, if students stuck to school until they could get a diploma, and if AA Vernacular was used as a tool to teaching professional English, is it really that bad? I certainly don't see the harm in using more black authors and historical figures. To make another comparison with the South, the Civil War is usually skipped in history lessons because it offends regional sensibilities. Regional and ethnic considerations have been a part of American education since it began and I don't see anything wrong with using it if it raises graduation rates. Of course, everyone ought to know who Abe Lincoln was, but it would probably be helpful if everyone knew who Thorogood Marshall was as well.
2005-07-19 04:11:44 AM  

What's wrong with gendered nouns? I always thought it was a good idea [ in Latin, anyway ] as a means of keeping the pronouns with their appropriate antecedents.
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