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(MLive.com)   India is running out of I.T. workers, intends to outsource   (mlive.com) divider line 85
    More: Ironic  
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13201 clicks; posted to Main » on 08 Jun 2005 at 4:33 AM (9 years ago)   |  Favorite    |   share:  Share on Twitter share via Email Share on Facebook   more»



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2005-06-07 05:35:25 PM
They could always take their cab drivers back.
 
2005-06-07 05:51:07 PM
I just started reading Thomas Friedman's "The World is Flat" which discusses how there are classes in India which teach specific dialects of English in order to better suite the needs of companies from any part of the English speaking world. This problem of not having enough Indians who speak other European languages sounds like organizational problem. If India can conquer English, they can conquer any other language. Outsourcing will be a temporary solution to their problem.

From the article:
English-speaking language skills could also be in short supply. At an offshore conference in New Delhi back in April, Dan Sandhu, CEO India and head of offshore business at United Utilities' business process outsourcing arm Vertex, warned that only a small percentage of the two million English-speaking graduates per year turned out by Indian universities actually have good enough English to work in customer-facing offshore operations.

In my field, there are many Indians, and their English skills vary drastically from person to person. Some speak like they were born in America, and others are still in need of help. But they are all computer experts. Langauge is their only stumbling block.... for now.

The IT outsourcing explosion is only about 5 or 6 years old, and which means that in about 10 years, most of the youth in India will have grown up in the outsourcing culture and will have adapted to these needs.

If you are an America, I suggest that you hit the books and do well in school. India is modernizing to meet the needs of the next generation, and they certainly will if we do not.
 
2005-06-07 06:05:57 PM
pshaw: But they are all computer experts.

You've had a much different experience than I have. In my short career I've dealt with the aftermath of three large software projects that were outsourced to India. All three had similar qualities: disorganized and virtually unmaintainable code, unscalable solutions that quickly bog down with moderate usage, and NO comments in the source.

As long as there are development managers that used to code themselves, I'm not worried about India taking my job anytime soon.
 
2005-06-08 04:36:48 AM
BWAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!
 
2005-06-08 04:42:01 AM
meh, they can have my job *throws the stinking pile at them*

Here, some contact numbers for the shiatty IT contractors I use as well, AHAHAH!

*flees to construction to make more and never get outsourced*

What's that? Union dues...argh! *dies*
 
2005-06-08 04:43:59 AM
As long as there are development managers that used to code themselves, I'm not worried about India taking my job anytime soon.

I heard THAT before....

Try UAW, 1970. After all, japan can't build anything.

There will be a time, when development managers will be just that... managers. And you can put your job in an overseas carriers envelop, and wave good-by.
 
2005-06-08 04:47:43 AM
I hear Japan has untapped labor...
 
2005-06-08 04:47:54 AM
I'd rather make $40k in India than $80k in the U.S, you could be living large. Although, I don't like the body odor stench of Indians... hmm..
 
2005-06-08 04:58:43 AM
of course this was buried...
Instances of data theft and defrauding of bank customers by call center employees have been reported. In April, police in the western city of Pune arrested three former employees of an Indian call center firm and nine of their associates on charges they misused financial data and illegally withdrew money from the accounts of New York-based customers of Citibank, the banking arm of Citigroup Inc.
 
2005-06-08 05:12:54 AM
Um, can I please have one of those jobs? I've been looking for work for months and found nothing. I could really, really, REALLY use some work right now. Not even WalMart is hiring. I could also use maybe some food or some Wendy's gift certificates or something. I'm very hungry.
 
2005-06-08 05:13:44 AM
Thank god! I can now start using my Rickshaw full of replacement PC parts again without offending Abbu in accounting.
 
2005-06-08 05:17:15 AM
Amazing that the thread got this far without 'irony nazis'... of course, since this irony is real, that may make sense.
 
2005-06-08 05:18:11 AM
They were replacing American workers then they ran out of workers

How ironic.
 
2005-06-08 05:20:10 AM
do the math. $5.2 billion revenue using 3,48,000 people = less than 15k a year per employee. Average salary for bottom of the pyramid less than 5k. Looking for a job?
 
2005-06-08 05:23:51 AM
What the hell kind of number is 3,48,000?
 
2005-06-08 05:25:47 AM
I'm planning to outsource my job to an Indian and pay him a third of my salary. This will free me up to take another job, then do the same thing again, ad nauseam.

P.S. Why do these officials keep saying 'Tuesday'?
 
2005-06-08 05:29:37 AM
Too funny.

I've dealt with some of those workers and have had great success. They have understood me and I understood them (only a faint accent) and they were knowledgable. Problem taken care of.

I have also had major problems with them being uninformed and have way to heavy of an accent to get the problem solved. If I have to call the phone company, for instance, I'm already pretty p!ssed. Having a communication problem tis the clincher.

With those companies, I change service whenever possible.
 
2005-06-08 05:31:43 AM
Only a fraction of the 3 million graduates produced by India each year are ready to be employed in the outsourcing industry, with others needing several months of training.

In America it's called "exploring our options," which consists of watching reruns of "Three's Company" while eating a box of Triscuits your parents left lying around.

Recent CS grad here. I know too much about this lifestyle. Help.
 
2005-06-08 05:35:36 AM
Scorpions!! Scorpions!!
 
2005-06-08 05:37:50 AM
Won't be long before Americans are learning specific languages and dialects of India to be able to properly speak to their supervisors.

/Kidding
//Good post Pshaw
///Knows a IIT graduate in the IT field, dude is scary intelligent.
 
2005-06-08 05:40:27 AM
Water flows downhill, and globalism is the dynamite that's blowing the American dam. Get used to it, because the very rich who most frequently appeal to nationalistic urges in order to get consent and body count for their wars will of course be the last to actually act on that nationalism by actually electing to hold this [artificial?] dam called "country" in place at the expense of profit...
 
2005-06-08 05:45:33 AM
Jesda
Is it prime? I dunno. I give up.
 
2005-06-08 05:46:54 AM
RamblingKey:

Won't be long before Americans are learning specific languages and dialects of India to be able to properly speak to their supervisors.

That may not be a joke. I'm trying to find an easy way to learn Chinese so I can welcome our future overlords.

America does not have a monopoly on leading edge technology but we do seem to be close. We have some pretty cool toys that most of the rest of the world wants. Why is that? Is it our resources? Our form of governemt? Something else?

I know a boat load of people that prove we are no smarter than anybody else.

/To paraphrase Matt and Trey, "America, Fark yea".
 
2005-06-08 05:55:39 AM
Le Petomane: and globalism is the dynamite that's blowing the American dam

Sorry to disagree but I'm wondering if globalization is what is making our country as strong as it is.

I like my cheap Japanese stereo. If I liked the French, I would probably like Perrier (I hope I spelled that correctly). The were the founders of over priced fizzy tap water.

I also like the fact that, with the exception of a little competition from Japan, If you want a super-computer, you better ask Uncle Sugar nicely and we may let you have one.
 
2005-06-08 06:01:57 AM
Throwing books at people doesn't change the fact they have serious social issues to work out. I work with many paki's and indians, they waste just as much time shiatting on eachother and treating women poorly as my american cohorts waste on sports.
 
2005-06-08 06:11:29 AM
so NOW when i call my credit card company to complain about bad service, i wont get someone who speaks terrible english, and cannot answer clearly? NOW i will get someone who was HIRED by someone who speaks terrible english?

/yes im frustrated and bitter
//yes, i lost out on jobs becasue i was not bilingual in MY country
//i checked....yep....still bitter....
 
2005-06-08 06:19:25 AM
offers1999:

What is it that you don't like about the french? I see alot of people with comments like yours, but yet to see something constructive.

Just jumping on the hate-france band wagon? Conformity gives one such a nice warm feeling inside don't you think? Or perhaps you don't like them because they didn't want to go to war in Iraq with you?
 
2005-06-08 06:59:32 AM
I love France, the French lifestyle, French cheese, French wine, French pate, French bread. France just kicks ass in general. I don't like French cars, had a bad experience with one when I was younger, although maybe they've improved. I really don't understand where all of the racism towards the French comes from though. Media brain-washing I guess.
 
2005-06-08 07:17:01 AM
Hubby works in IT as a test manager. He had to "try" to manage some projects that were being outsourced to India. Said all he got was sloppy work and incomplete crap. I think it'll be awhile before they really have the whole IT business covered.
 
2005-06-08 07:41:39 AM
kr0m0z0ne: French pate

All except Rodent Pate (There is such a thing)
 
2005-06-08 07:49:43 AM
How about we just ship the US banks directly to India and China? Keep worshipping at the altar of free trade, people.
 
2005-06-08 07:54:57 AM
Hey, Maybe they can take the liberal tech whiners on slashdot that didnt like the outcome of the election, and were going to leave the country if Bush won.

That said, India can suck my balls. Their code is crap, and I hate working with anyone who cant speak this language, let alone code in it.


/wow that's a sentance
/Indians, yes that kind, comment your code
 
2005-06-08 07:55:13 AM
Go here and click the "Tech Support" cartoon with the little Indian man's face. If you haven't seen it yet, you should.


http://www.illwillpress.com/vault.html
 
2005-06-08 08:05:07 AM
They are outsourcing out outsourcers?


Reminds of an article in "The Onion" that was headlined:


India's Top Physicists Develop Plan To Get The Hell Out Of India

or something like that.
 
2005-06-08 08:06:42 AM
Indian Tech Support and Foamy the Squirrel

Cute little animated cartoon about Indian Tech Support.
 
2005-06-08 08:07:49 AM
Oh haha! Perfidia had the same idea!
High5
 
2005-06-08 08:09:54 AM
Squirrely Wrath
 
2005-06-08 08:31:31 AM
Why do they all have to be engineers, software programmers, and doctors?

You know what India? Why don't you TRY EDUCATING a whole bunch of people IN A WIDE VARIETY OF FIELDS, fields that EXSIST in your COUNTRY, and then you and EVERY OTHER THIRD WORLD NATION could try to ADVANCE YOUR NATION with a VALUABLE WORK FORCE FOR YOURSELF instead of EXPORTING YOUR BEST AND BRIGHTEST, and SUCKING OFF ALL THE CASH from somewhere else and have instead of a DEPENDENT NATION, a REAL NATION that might INVENT SOMETHING USEFUL, or at the least, IMPROVE THE COMMON CONDITIONS so that the next generation doesn't have to LEARN ENGLISH and TRAVEL ACROSS THE WORLD to get a DECENT JOB.

By the way, if you think that fat white guy corporations are going to help your people across the globe, my suggestion is that you look at the track record and get a grip. The United States has already suffered innumerably with the punishment of megacorporations. Good luck to you, we already know the ultimate outcome of this, it will only be faster because when they're white they will feel no attachment to you around the water cooler.

East Timor baby, then after that, the Sudan.
 
2005-06-08 08:43:17 AM
2005-06-08 08:31:31 AM El_Camino_SS

..Because using uppercase always makes you look more intelligent.
 
2005-06-08 08:46:21 AM
Zarya

it is hot, like cow on fire.
 
2005-06-08 08:48:53 AM
offers1999:

If I liked the French, I would probably like Perrier (I hope I spelled that correctly). The were the founders of over priced fizzy tap water.

More likely if you liked French cheese but not as much when the side of your mouth is sort of pasty.
 
2005-06-08 08:50:39 AM
Outsourcing because you are running out of workers is NOT IRONIC... (rest of rant will not be posted)

/mmmmmmmmmm pancake topped bunnies, now that is good eating!
 
2005-06-08 08:51:30 AM
supichoo:

Throwing books at people doesn't change the fact they have serious social issues to work out. I work with many paki's and indians, they waste just as much time shiatting on eachother and treating women poorly as my american cohorts waste on sports.

Are you an American or do you know who bad using 'Paki' is? (not slagging Americans, just more of a Canada/UK thing is, couldn't believe Dubya!)

They watch tons of cricket- I think the deeper issue is the skills to success are far more competative there and it interferes in some ways with teambuilding.
 
2005-06-08 08:56:02 AM
El_Camino_SS:

...fields that EXSIST in your COUNTRY, and then you and EVERY OTHER THIRD WORLD NATION could try to ADVANCE YOUR NATION with a VALUABLE WORK FORCE FOR YOURSELF instead of EXPORTING YOUR BEST AND BRIGHTEST,..

2 Points. Capital has real issues in India and is in short supply at the best of times. Being 3rd world also means having poor local markets for your goods.

As well, if the government loses its top publicly-funded graduates to the US etc patterns show that they will earn USD and travel home, send money to take care of parents, etc to far more the justify the cost of those that don't join the outsourcing. The resulting development of expertise and local ability is gravy.
 
2005-06-08 08:59:46 AM
Bwhahah! I am vindicated, looked at the demographics four years ago and said that this would happen. We have a 700 Billion dollar IT industry, India can only handle 6 Billion of it for us. The shame of it is going not going to be that India is takeing those Billions of dollars from the US, but that they can't handle more. We have a looming crises, as the boomers retire the US does not have enough skilled workers to replace them.
 
2005-06-08 09:13:20 AM
Good use of the ironic tag.
 
2005-06-08 09:15:44 AM
At least if they outsource work to India they won't come to the states...

\doesn't like Indians
\\HATES french as well
\\\Hates Canadians almost as much as French

\\\\puts on asbestos suit and runs away
 
2005-06-08 09:19:41 AM
he rama!
 
2005-06-08 09:22:54 AM
"If you are an America, I suggest that you hit the books and do well in school. India is modernizing to meet the needs of the next generation, and they certainly will if we do not."

Ok, Uhm, so America fails, GE shuts down, who does India have now?

India in the IT world, small potatoes, only good ones I have ever met live in the U.S. anyways.

/not worried
 
2005-06-08 09:25:24 AM
BigTuna:

You've had a much different experience than I have. In my short career I've dealt with the aftermath of three large software projects that were outsourced to India. All three had similar qualities: disorganized and virtually unmaintainable code, unscalable solutions that quickly bog down with moderate usage, and NO comments in the source.

The outsourcing bubble has definately burst.

Another big problem with outsourcing to India is turnover. These IT workers are treated like commodities not only by th e US companies sending work there, but also by the contract agencies that employ them. Competition for warm bodies is intense. IT engineers switch companies constantly and some collect signing bonuses each time. Its hard to sustain any development when nobody stays for more than a couple weeks.

The result is that fewer projects are being sent to India and those that do get sent there are totally sustaining, debugging type work. All the new, cutting edge stuff is still being done in the states. It just doesn't make sense to give any ownership to Indian or other outsourced IT folks. In my experience, it always ends badly.
 
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