blah, blah, blah, destabalization, blah, blah, USSR, blah, advantage, blah...

Ukraine is destined to play a not very attractive role too, despite the advantages that it has with the USA: a stable or an unstable buffer in the US-led game to restrain Russia.

I'm no Condoleeza Rice, but this article doesn't make much sense.

Russian trifecta 2/3 complete.

good, while we're at it, let's hold back india and china, so they stop using all that oil, and gas proces can go down.

Pravda articles rarely make sense

What a commie crock of crap. There is no reason for the US to have any problems with an independant, free and strong Russia. The growing economic bonds between us grow daily to the advantage to both sides.

Sounds like an old-line grouch looking at the new Russia from the outside and pining for the past.

WHAT A COUNTRY!

yea, even though russia is an ornery bastard...they're one of the good guys now.

any thoughts?

awww, forgot about the in s-o-v-i-e-t -ru-ss-ia filter

Just a note: Russian Journalism has a tendency to be a lot like the tabloids. At least where the papers are concerned.

Economicly speaking, Russia is in the shiat house. They can't maintain a working military because the government can't pay the people a sufficient sum of money. Many police offers (though not all) are quite corrupt. Younger Russian citizens are busy flocking to the tourist areas in an effort to find a good job. Or, they leave.

The idea of anyone 'holding back Russia' economicly speaking is sadly laughable.

This article makes as much sense as Pravda's regular UFO bits. Russia has the capability to become one of the major world economies, but then Italy is one of the major world economies as well. (And it would be some time before Russia hit even today's Italian economic size.) Not exactly a nation in need of restraint, by anyone.

2005-04-09 09:26:44 AM atomheart

Sounds like an old-line grouch looking at the new Russia from the outside and pining for the past.

Pining for the what now?

America can't stop itself from sinking into global economic ignominy after fighting a half assed broken country that didn't even put up a fight. The elephant in the room that no one wants to address is that america is following britain in the great struggle that is the balance of power. Napoleon said that an army marches on its stomach but a purer form of that is that an army fights on its wallet and further, it projects power from its economy. America is a debtor nation and is sinking farther into that than at any other time. The criminal missteps by the government have just insured that the US is going to have some hard reckoning in the future. Live in the past or create the future. Your leaders have already chosen for you.

Pining for the past?

My parents spent almost three years on Sakhalin Island, a Russian Island north of Japan. People who aren't in the cities of Moscow, St. Petersburg, or other 'touristy' places have it incredibly rough.

Rough enough that vodka is used as a bartering tool, and rotten food is what is eaten. Many Russians, young and old alike do wish for a communist regime (though not of ol) predominantly because at least there was food on their tables.

In a country where there are places that see Snow practically year round? Food wins, hands down.

If Russia becomes prosperous then where is the Intarweb going to get its crop of waifish bony nude models?

cool

sal-paradise
Who wants to listen to the same old America hate? You're from Canada for fark sake, you've got nothing to boast about.

KnickKnolte

What if the American hate is coming from an American in Canada? *shifty-eyed*

Admittedly, I don't hate my country. I do however, hate decisions made by an unfairly elected administration.

I'm going to see Gorbachev speak in a week.

Forget World War III..
Cold War II is what's it all about, baby!

KnickKnolte

fella, just post "/got nothing" like a good little boy. Why respond at all? If you don't have anything to postulate then why post and show everyone that?

Switching to a full-scale free market was the stupidest thing Russia ever did.

That said, I can't blame the US for not liking Russia. It's far from democratic, fighting a brutal war in Chechenya, and Putin's on the verge of crowning himself Tsar.

But right now it's not strong, and the EU's doing an excellent job of containing them, all we need to do is support the revolution of the month. It's China we need to worry about, and that means giving serious support to India.

Putin used to head up the KGB didn't he?

It makes me miss Gorbie. O.o

Why is your food rotting if it snows all year? Isn't that like a free refrigerator?

I'll second the sentiment that a lot of Russians, young and old alike really do wish for a new Socialist/Communist regime. Mind you, not the Stalinist-type Communism (which really wasn't communism at all).

Sure they have "democracy" and a "free market", but that doesn't help the average Russian when they can't find a job or have any food to eat.

For all the wrongs done by the former USSR, the people had jobs and food. A common feeling in Russia right now is "What use is deomcracy when it doesn't provide people with jobs to put food on their table?"

Looks like old guard commentary to me. Damn filthy Americans spreading the disease of democracy all over the place over there.

/needs more poison on election day

/Obligatory

2005-04-09 10:12:44 AM
birdboy2000
Switching to a full-scale free market was the stupidest thing Russia ever did.

BS. If you really believe that, you need to study world economics. Russia doesn't have a problem with their market reforms, they have a problem with their privatization attempt. There was too much entanglement between enterprise and the supporting government bureaucracy, making it difficult to establish a private sector. They had waiting lines (shortage) and budget problems BEFORE 1990 - it was one of the reasons for the collapse. If you really want to get into it, research the incentive of public enterrprise to overreport production in the USSR versus the incentive to underreport in modern Russia - you'll find out that the picture was far from rosy.

Countries from the former bloc that were able to establish market reform and privatization quickly (ie, Poland, Hungary, Czech Rep, Slovakia) recovered from the transition within a couple of years, and now have higher growth than before. The problem with Russia was that the Communist government intentionally made it difficult to disentangle enterprise from the public sector. If they could get a handle on their economic structure and actually tax all of the items currently being sold on the black market, they'd be doing okay.

And by the way, Russia doesn't have a full-scale free market. They are classified as a "partial-free market" (along with Ukraine and the Baltics) - something like 40% of their businesses are still government-owned or subsidized in some way.

/The more you know ...

Reading this line: Ukraine is destined to play a not very attractive role too, despite the advantages that it has with the USA: a stable or an unstable buffer in the US-led game to restrain Russia., I was reminded of this:

"Ha ha, the Ukraine. Do you know what the Ukraine is? It's a sitting duck. A road apple, Newman. The Ukraine is weak. It's feeble. I think it's time to put the hurt on the Ukraine."

/Kramer

Can't really blame Russia.

We're the ones meddling in the affairs of other countries, then cry foul when they object to it.

And remember...Bushco isn't spreading democracy. They just call it that. Bushco is spreading imperialistic economic control.

dpr
For all the wrongs done by the former USSR, the people had jobs and food. A common feeling in Russia right now is "What use is deomcracy when it doesn't provide people with jobs to put food on their table?"

Great point! But try it like this For all the wrongs done by the Nazi's, the people had jobs and food.

Go throw away your Che t-shirt and read a book. Try "The Big Black Book of Communism". It's easy to have a job when it entails spying on everyone else.

Gee, Russian journalism looks to be exactly the same type of propoganda bullshiate as all journalism.
Except for the Daily Show, of course.

Pravda....lol.

Hyernel

Just curious, which world leaders in the past 5 years were poisoned by the US government?

Looks more like a version of the NY Times or Washington Post.

Steve French

Do you mean in their negitive view of America?

No, I mean in their negative view of the truth.
Just like American newspapers.
Imagine that?

2005-04-09 11:47:47 AM Steve French


Gee, Russian journalism looks to be exactly the same type of propoganda bullshiate as all journalism.
Except for the Daily Show, of course.


aaahhahahhhahahahahaha

/pounding table

//falls out of chair

TesserAct:

Don't be a dumbass. The point was that, for the average Russian joe, they see no tangible benefit from the recent free-market. The only difference a Russian farmer sees between the two systems is that he used to be guaranteed an income, and now if there's a blight, he goes hungry. If most of you flag-wavin' American types were living in Russia, more than a few would be nostalgic for the old system, which, flaws or not, functioned better.

/Is American
//Born, raised in Illinois

Catherine the Great once said that expanding Russia's borders was the only way to defend them. I think that this has remained in the Russian subconscious, and that's why this wholesale rolling back of their sphere of influence is really setting their nerves on edge. Nobody wants to live under Kremlin appointees though, so tough luck Ivan.

Lenin, Stalin, Brezhnev, Gorbachev, and Yeltsin were on a train trip from Moscow to Vladivostok. The train came to a stop in the middle of a great snowstorm, and the conductor entered the car holding the leaders. "Comrades, we can go no further, as we have run out of track."

Lenin pondered this and said, "Comrades, let us explain to the other passengers that the imperialists have prevented us from our destination, and in their zeal they will get out and build new track ahead of the train."

Stalin said, "No, what we shall do is take the passengers outside and shoot half of them. The other half, in their fear, will lay new track ahead of the train."

Brezhnev leapt up and started batting Stalin about the head with his shoe. "No, no, no! That is utterly barbaric, and we are a progressive enlightened people! We shall have the passengers tear up the track behind the train and lay it down again in front of the train!"

Gorbachev said, "Comrades, none of that will work. We should simply return to Moscow and rethink the entire rail system." And that is what they did.

Yeltsin was passed out drunk the whole time.

</Communist russia's economic history in a nutshell>

As the Germans used to say, "Rusland bleibt Rusland", Russia will remain Russia. Putin finds himself with the same dilemmas that the commies and the Czars had before him.

1) Russia is schizophrenic. It is half European and half Asiatic. It vacillates between the two, and is uncomfortable with either. They dart West for a few years then become neurotic and pan-Slavic again. It is also said that when a Russian tries to act like a European, he is lying to you.

2) Russia is idealistic. And in the pursuit of the ideal, Russians make no mistakes but the very worst. Usually resulting in many square miles of environmental devastation.

3) Russia is optimistic. Just like Americans, Russians tend to hope for the best, unlike Europeans, who prefer to fear for the worst. This means that Russians don't like the movie "Betty Blue" any more than we did.

4) Russians have tastes much like Kid Rock and Pamela Anderson. P-W-T. Tabloid news. Scatalogical humor. Something else we share with them. There will someday be NASCAR and Giant Truck Rallies in Russia.

Which leads to the most important point. Since everybody is assuming that the North Pole will melt a bunch in the near to mid future, this will mean that Russians and Americans will be able to easily take a boat back and forth. If you can imagine a DOUBLING of the P-W-T population, you will know what to expect.

Senescent Dawn
Did he channel his response through you?

Have you ever spent any time in the East Block? Do you really think thay cared about the people? This is not about flag-waving, numbskull, stop dropping that card everytime you hear something that is critical of the Soviet system.

Russian farmers were forced by the state to grow and turn over their crops to the state for redistribution. They were serfs of the state. If they didn't go hungary in times of blight, it was only through their "illegal" actions of hiding the food they grew themselves. Sure they see no tangible benefits of the current reforms; maybe it has something to do with state corruption.

If most of you flag-burning American types were living in Russia, more than a few would be nostalgic for the US/Canada/UK/France/West Germany. My guess is that you wouldn't even make it a week in the Gulag you were sent to for critizing the state.

/Is American
//Lived in Chicago
///Lived in Beijing
////Live in Budapest